Deep Dive: Amp Modeling with VoiceLive 3 and 3 Extreme (VL3/VL3X)

David Hilderman dives deep into Amp Modeling on TC Helicon's Voicelive 3 Extreme. Enjoy this 20-minute detail-oriented video about amp modeling and amp modeling parameters within VL3X.
Still have questions? Let us know what else you'd like to learn about in the comments.
Looking for something specific? Check out this annotated list of topics below to jump to any part of the video!
00:00
Intro
01:19
Amp Modeling Screen
01:24
Amp Model Sample
02:14
All Parameters
02:29
Architecture of the virtual amp
03:12
Pre-Gain / Post-Gain
04:21
Speaker Simulation
06:48
Equalizer Demo
14:10
Speaker Bandwidth
14:51
Amp Sag
15:48
Drive Gain
16:52
Reverb
17:42
Custom Tone - EQ, TUBE MODEL, SPEAKER SIMULATION
18:51
Post EQ
21:12
Final Tone
22:17
Tube vs Transistor Modeling
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[@aymarx1]

Keep the VL3 videos coming. Excellent.

[@macheldomingos-ex8673]

Thank you very much for your time David. Please Please keep on posting VL3/VL3X Informational videos(i watch all of them).This unit is packed with so much stuff and there is very little info around. I have a very hard time getting a great tone for the guitar. Keep the videos coming :) Cheers

[@tchelicon]

Thanks for your response, Machel! David should be making more! Did you have anything specific you wanted him to cover?

[@jeremyjamesmusic]

TC HELICON How about more on the acoustic direction?

[@GaryWaight]

@@tchelicon Yes...how to get smoother guitar tones...Santana style

[@enternamehere5498]

@@tchelicon - Its been a couple of yesrs, but I'd love to see something on how this could be used for keys/synth.

[@Dr.Jekyll]

Dear TC Helicon: we need more information about quality of connections and effects. Is this input similar to the latest iteration of the G-System? Would this replace a G-system or work with it?

[@larrylehman751]

The best thing about this demo is when he changed a button you could see it on the unit I learned a lot on this video

[@JohnMcGFrance]

Good to see the unit is still being supported. Interesting video. Lots of options to explore. More please.

[@tchelicon]

More will be coming. Is there anything you're hoping we cover?

[@joelpavan]

@@tchelicon please setup a "easy" mode of edit, with cabinets (12" and 10") and mic positions for quick adjustment of sound.

[@joe_casinoacoustic1773]

How do I get a good clean boost for my acoustic?

[@johnmorrell]

I kid you not, I was just about to sell this due to my frustration about setting it up with pure acoustic guitar and vocals, and had returned to using my Play Acoustic live So, I decided to give it one more go after watching this video - and it really helped me understand what to do., and what all those parameters actually affect. I know two people who resold this unit because the amp section way way to complicated to use in this format and layout. But I tweaked this all day, and finally got the great sound I wanted from my Godin Multiac. Thanks again ( please do an in depth, dedicated guide for acoustic guitarists ) Thanks again, this video should be linked to in the manual. Ta.

[@topsecret519]

Yee haw...i just bought one....comming next week. I'll look forward to the complications.

[@dancassidy7471]

I have a Godin XTSA also bewildered by guitar basic stuff like even the volume

[@johnmorrell]

@@dancassidy7471 I sat with two different recording engineers and they both were completely baffled as to why this has been build to confuse rather than assist the artist. Kudos to TC Helicon for making this unit - if it works for you, great, but I have struggled continually with this unit. The vocal section is second to none. It's first class for live performance. But the guitar section is a real pain. Lately I have started using the T-Rex Soulmate Acoustic for my acoustic guitar, coming out of a Play Acoustic for body-rez and all Vocals/ harmonies. It's a way simpler setup. The Voicelive 3 just feels like its trying to put too much in one box, when they could have made a new Play Acoustic with midi sync, and more individual controls for Acoustic guitar and Vocalists. And keep the two tier approach - simple and advanced editing. This video really helps with the VL3 though.

[@dancassidy7471]

@@johnmorrell thanks very much .I think I'll run my guitar thru into my tube amp. If I don't get the sound I want.

[@MatONeill]

Only yesterday I was thinking about how the amp models could use a little more eplanation, and as if by magic, along comes your video. Thanks a million guys, things are a little clearer now! By the way, how good does that direct, unmodelled stratocaster sound!?! Amazing!

[@goober6687]

Hello Dave! This video was exactly what I was trying to find out....how to EQ my guitar sound. I purchased a VL3 three years ago mostly for vocal harmonizing. However, I confess it was too complicated for me to learn the rest of what it can do. But now I'm "Covid-Home" and pulled out of the closet the this unit. I needed an EQ unit for acoustic guitar, Ovation 1984 limited series, that I also pulled out of the closet. I took the time to learn my VL3 and using it now for harmonies and guitar EQ. This video was quite helpful !

[@samsonmasih2220]

Wonderful David I have really enjoyed this video, also it gave chance to learn something new. Stay blessed Regards Samson Masih

[@luischi5136]

Hi David, wondering if you could do a deep dive on guitar effects. I’m struggling with music tribe support because no one can explain how the efects’ chain happens when you turn on multiple effects. On a traditional guitar pedal board all the effects are in serial on VL3X i don’t know and neither know if the order of the chain can be changed. Thanks

[@thomasdzida557]

I love the unit for its vocal processing and I thank you for your work. But in my opinion the guitar sound is way behind the vocal capabilities. The amp "models" sound just like different EQ-Settings, but the character always seems to be the same.

[@brianbartleson1498]

Is it possible to switch between amps in the same preset? I use a Godin Multiac and I'd like to map the Hit button to work like this: Hit button off = Bodyrez 5, Hit button on= Little Champion. Thanks!

[@nstewart111]

Thanks for the video. One tends to forget about the guitar side on the 3 Extreme and you've shown there's loads of options to get the sound you're after. Personally, I want big clean acoustic and clean electric sounds for jazz / folk etc and a few nice overdriven sounds for blues and rock n' roll numbers. So great idea to offer some standard settings. A very clear explanation of each option would, of course, be great but way too time consuming - I guess. Using a A B swich box mentioned in another video recently is a great idea for making the use of acoustic and electric on stage together simple. Thanks for the video and keeping the VL3x family alive and kicking. It's still the Rolls Royce of effects units for one man/woman shows. I use my VL3 Ext for streaming and live one man shows, so maybe a video on the set up side of things and the various options for stereo, dual mono, mono, balancing backing tracks, guitar, vocals etc would be great? Again, so many options under the hood but not well understood.

[@davidhilderman]

I switch between electric an acoustic all the time. I engage the tuner to mute the guitar then swap instruments.

[@nstewart111]

I had a play with this last night. Very impressive. Love the compressors. One thing I found was that when I set up the fx button to do wah, octaver or chopper. Sometimes the settings stayed after I changed the choice. At no point did I save anything. Any ideas? Am I correct in thinking the drive is just gain or boost? No distortion option as such but done in the amp simulations? From memory that's different from the Nova (which I also have).

[@joe_casinoacoustic1773]

How do I get a good clean boost volume sound for my acoustic?

[@GaryWaight]

Could you cover how to set it pu to get smoother sounding tones...like a Santana style tone?

[@MrJetplanemusic]

So am I right in saying that the BW is "Bandwidth" (or "Q" in other applications) that expands and shrinks the range of the curve around the frequency specified?

[@tonyderosa5921]

Would it ever be possible to change the button map of the looper section? I’d much prefer to have vertically aligned A, B and C sections. (Or even just A and B if you still have to swap between B and C.) To have my start and stop buttons above and below each other instead of side by side would be my preference. If it’s possible to do so and I’m missing it please lmk. Thanks. As far as the amp modeling it’d be nice having the gate as a pedal instead of a master control and I’ve also always wondered about the possibility of signal chain of effects. The ability to put fx in order like an actual pedal board should be standard issue parameter control. Easier said than done I suppose. Thank you for making this deep dive. I’ve only come to understand the amp modeling thru a lot of time spent tweaking. This video would’ve been helpful years ago. You made a powerful tool that’s widely misunderstood and can still be improved. Please keep up the good work!

[@ryanjohnson4566]

When you turn that 40db gain on there is a lot of static when guitar is quiet. How can that be eliminated, or is that even possible? Thanks

[@davidhilderman]

In the setup menu you can set the noise gate to cut this out

[@joe_casinoacoustic1773]

How do I get a lot of distortion I’ve turned my pre gain right up. And not enough distortion for solos

[@ed.t.hansen6499]

amp modeling setup is a good example to save each as preset and one foot button to get to each as you play- live; leaving all the other effects setup as they are. One more foot sw. button to scroll thru the preset amps needed.

[@christothegreat1]

Would it be possible for a firmware update to add impulse modeling of amps, speakers and mics, same as AxeFX / Kemper?

[@adrianreyes4702]

Great ! Much appreciated! I just received my Voicelive 3 Extreme a week ago, and I am beyond elated. It is a Guitarist's dream come true, who dabbles with singing on occasion, and goes solo, or with a band. I've had the TC helicon Acoustic Play for about 4 years, and this just took a Lightyear leap! I love it, and I have barely skimmed the surface! One request. How would you model tweak the settings for that Guitar Intro Tremolo effect on the song "How Soon is Now"? With the Boss ME-70 it is a click, but I know for sure this VoiceLive3 Extreme can do just as good a job, probably better. Thank you in advance!

[@Zhorellski]

Which Amp modeler this unit sound similar with? Amp model tone-wise. ?

[@davidstewart4149]

One thing I discovered: The amp models are simply combinations of all the settings available in the Amp tab. If you take, e.g., the “chicken picking” model’s settings and reproduce them with any other named amp model, the sound will be identical. That’s not actually amp modeling as any other company does it.

[@evilevon]

What would be a good setting to use my VL3X as more of a stomp box into the effects loop of my tube amp. When I've tried previously the signal sounds garbled.

[@scotthenderson8577]

Turn off the amp model speaker sim settings. Just use the effects into your tube amp. It made my life much easier. My two cents.

[@evilevon]

@@scotthenderson8577 I already tried that... Still sounds garbled

[@scotthenderson8577]

@@evilevon Might want to try going through the front of the amp. I use a Fender DR and go through the front of the amp. Good Luck

[@petervanede3639]

Can you do something like this for acoustic guitars

[@cliffordsolomon3884]

Understand what John saying I ordered the Extreme and after seeing the manual reading it on internet I thought how to really get the sounds I want for My red Tele and white HSS Strat thanks to You and this KZbin video I know now how to set get idea how to get sound I want but I use My play Acustic on two channel on mixer and next two wi use for My new Voice Live Play EXTREEM multi function peddel I'll be receiving from sweetwater this next week .Thank You for the info on this.I also be ordering from SweetWater Sound a nother MP 75 mic for EXTREEM multi peddel.so don't need to keep changing mics have asst.change My mics I'll have two MP 75 mic.s this way no reason to change mics.fantastic out of this world multi peddel I can tell all ready and not received Mine yet .pS I use a AC 3 peddel with My TC Helecom Play Acustic it sounds great with my red Tele and My Boulder Creek Solitaire acustic guitar.

[@ed.t.hansen6499]

off the subject of amp modeling but Different sounds;- none the less. Many new effects coming out with many effects boxes; Many boxes have many effects but not available by foot control for live performance i.e no control unless your an octopus. This box can do it with foot control and pre-programming ! Is there a octave up/dn for 3 octaves ? So many boxes need the expression pedal for certain effects that this does not have. if I have harmony and pitch shifting; How can i control with expression and on/off - for each ?

[@MonteThompsonAuthor]

So simple. What else do you need?

[@_left_eye]

A really interesting way to dig an electric Guitar tone out Of an acoustic amp model

[@fabianvasquezjr8852]

I could never get a good hi gain tone for guitar out of my VL3 and I never tried, to many variables to tweak and gave up and just got a Helix Rack for guitar to bad I can't bring in the helix tones into the looper, I've connected every which way to try. Works great for my acoustic guitars and vox, to bad they didn't work on their guitar modeling on the VL3 extreme.

[@tadbeavers539]

Sounds like you aren't very familiar with the device. Check out some of our lengthy tutorials if you ever get a chance.

[@thelolguy007]

You could never get a good hi gain tone and you never tried? 🤦‍♂️

[@MickeyAndBlueDoTheWorld]

Why has the VL3X been discontinued, and what’s next and when please?

[@RBruceStewart]

He is doing a lot of dialing around a single sound out of the modellor. I would like to hear the range of sounds that the moder can make. Can it sound like a marshal or an orange or a fender or a Mesa?

[@Guerrerosmusic]

i miss to use the TC Dark Matter with amp sim at same time...

[@joelpavan]

It´s a awesome tool. But the navigation is not friendly in live situations. Please add a "live mode", with four or eight parameters in initial display!

[@DennnisDubeau]

You really have to preset it... This is not designed to be fiddled with in a live context.. unless you know this unit very well and have it mounted on a stand near you.. even then!!

[@arnewiddingnielsen6483]

Do you mean the 200 presets or the function to literally save any of this to any preset? Which it does along with a 1000 other things. You can even set up a whole song with a step sequencer.

[@ryanjohnson4566]

What is the difference between lo post , lo f post , and lo bw post?

[@davidhilderman]

Lo refers to the band so it is the low band. Post refers to where the eq band is in the signal chain. Post means that it is after the non-linear (distorting) tube or transistor simulation. Lo f is the frequency the band is dealing with.

[@davidhilderman]

Lo bw post is how big of a swath of frequencies the eq band with effect the bigger the number the more the area that will be effected

[@ryanjohnson4566]

Ahh yes, thanks, bw = bandwidth.. so much to learn and experiment with.

[@jeremyjamesmusic]

Is somebody eating cereal in the background or something? Lol. I hear a spoon keep hitting a bowl...

[@RBruceStewart]

It sounds like the same amp and set up to me for 20 minutes. I know my fractal is more expensive but there’s a very Wide spectrum of sounds.

[@Artattaxe]

The video is excellent but highlights my frustration with the VL3X Awesomely simple for vocals but way too complicated for guitar. I don't need to have as much adjustment as has been given. My tube amp has Lo, Mid, pre- gain and post gain, and presence knobs, and 2 channels. Took me all of 50 minutes to find all the tones I wanted for use live. I need knobs not a long list of parameters, all of which need tweaking to get something I like. I want to play, not be a sound engineer. I now find myself having a Headrush alongside my VL3x as its super intuitive, and just a few knobs to get me where I want to be. That said it has all the eq settings the VL has, but I don't have to use them to get a great sound!

[@andym7333]

hello good night need to know why the setup ,pika, hits red but the setup nopikaaa doesent and i think they are exactly the same..what is the diffrence beetween both set ups cant spot it can you tell me please everything looks to be the same what is difrent beetween both setups in link? we.tl/t-tnGBi97OWh

[@MrPinkStrat]

What about a DEEP DIVE INTO CUSTOM vocal & Harmony Set ups ? ie EQ ..Harmony Balance .. TONE ETC ?

[@johnmarcojara9898]

I want it to be just like a normal amp/pedal with only few knobs to tweak. This one have toooo many and most of the time I don't hear much difference in the sound. Please update the firmware!!! I suggest to have a toggle for basic and advance option. Personally I don't like the idea of "pre" and "post"

[@ReAmpHeaven]

I have option anxiety ;)

[@manost72]

We have a «voice live» pedal and we keep getting tutorials about supporting guitars with it. More tutorials for singers is what we don't have. Support us with more tutorials please.

[@tchelicon]

Thanks for the feedback Manos! We will focus on some new singer tutorials!

[@manost72]

@@tchelicon thanks, sounds great! That's a beautiful piece you got there for singers!

[@paulsutman]

@@tchelicon Can we get some feedback on a possible firmware update or VL4 coming soon? It has been really quiet on the MusicTribe-forums.

[@tchelicon]

@@paulsutman Did you see our post last month asking for feedback and suggestions on the next Voicelive?

[@paulsutman]

TC HELICON No I haven't, where have you posted this? Does this mean you are still in the development-phase? Thanks for the reply!

[@chrisgatland3177]

What are we actually hearing here? Sounds like it’s going through a speaker in the room and then into the camera mic. A direct recording would be a lot more useful...

[@ljgates977]

Do you see what the problem is here? It's great that the user can tweak to an insane degree, BUT, you just spent over 20 minutes creating what I'd call an "OK" sound. The models needed to be a lot more accurate on this pedal in the first place. Always been my biggest complaint with this. Don't get me wrong, the VL3ex is my main live tool, I rely on much of it's capabilities. I just think for the price, the amp models and effects could've been substantially better without having to tweak the crap out of them.

[@rwrp]

I would say this has two models tube and transistor, the different amps are just presets. I own one, but I also have other modelers that do things differently. Boss, Fractal, etc.

[@kuviercruz5300]

Amigoos por favor realicen un video en Español para la comunidad latina. Espero respuesta

[@dainthomassida]

"a perfectly clean signal" LOOOOL

[@ArminBollig]

Completely outdated concept. Pity Which guitarist wants to step through so many parameters? The VoiceLive3 is in principle such a great part, but in the details (especially the guitar amp section, as well as the looper) it is almost unusable. What hours have I spent on the device so far? Until I didn't feel like making music anymore. What a shame. And unfortunately promised updates never came ...

[@mickhill4082]

How not to make a Determination Video!!!

[@bizyobee4001]

It would be clear if you can use a visual aide (frequency graphic) to illustrate those parameters, not just keep turning those dials and leave them to your ears.

[@DennnisDubeau]

Wayyy too much reverb!! Sounds like it's been played in a huge cave!!! Otherwise, a very useful video. Thanks!