Defeat Fights First in Warhammer 40k!

[@ATimm117]

Your breakdowns are perfect dude. Best 40k content out there.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Cheers my man! That is very high praise! I greatly appreciate your support

[@andresu83]

The TTS demostration is amazing! Helps alot to understand better.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

excellent! I am so glad

[@kevinishki]

You said closest unit multiple times when referring to pile in. Each model piles into the closest enemy model. Pretty genius ways deal with fights first and raises the skill ceiling for dealing with them

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

closest model* ;)

[@PT84]

I thought I knew melee and I still learned something from this video. Great stuff!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Heck yeah! Happy to hear it!

[@Chaplain_Dazzler]

Just getting back into 40k after a long break and your content is spot on. Just need to get a few games under my belt. Thanks and keep it up 👊

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Heck yeah man! Welcome back, 10th edition is awesome

[@DavidBis]

I saw like 5 or 6 videos before and this is the only I understood about why Fight First doesn't activate on enemy! (At 15:00 )

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

glad you got it!

[@mortenbrandtjensen6470]

Great vid. I thought I could only pile onto units I had charged, and/or were engaged with. Lesson learned.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Hold over from 9th :) Glad i could help

[@discourses3]

the engage another unit then consolidate into main target also works vs. the vanguard task force move-on-charge strat too.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

You got it!

[@galling2052]

sharing this and the followup vid released today around now that GW throatpunched melee again by buffing custards... 1 step forward 2 steps back 🤦. This is quickly turning into my favorite rules channel!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

cheers bud

[@somanythings9074]

Brilliant video 🙌

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@sundownwargames]

10:00 Can your opp not beat this by using Heroic Intervention on the initial charge?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

of course, there are counters to every counter in the game

[@sundownwargames]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 heard that, just checking

[@robertlosacco139]

thank you for the help

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

my pleasure buddy

[@Pikrock]

Awsome content!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Thank you! I am super glad you like it!

[@paulclifton9488]

These are excellent tips. Thank you!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

My pleasure!

[@sgthunt118]

Awesome breakdown. I just wish I could explain as good as you do to my opponent during a game in a way that doesn't take me 20+ min to do so... I have honestly just quit bringing Fights first type units in general because it's so unknown/understood and the advantage vs time constraints has had me just using different units in general and I let them bring in their fights first units and then when I counter the enemy unit during their turn, it eats up their time reading the rules and not mine :D

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

haha cheers, i recommend just practicing a bit, once you explain it 2 to 3 times in the mirror (perhaps with me in the background guiding you) itll be super easy to do so in game!

[@sgthunt118]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 perhaps one day

[@yusie8306]

Another great video as per usual! Any tips on playing orks into death guard?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Tough matchup, BUT this video is critical to your success, you HAVE to be able to play around the plague marine squad with fights first!

[@yusie8306]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 thank you! Also may be a dumb question, but where can I find your discord server? I swear I've looked everywhere but where it actually is 😂

[@withershadow3904]

Brilliant tips, thanks!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Cheers homie

[@braden459]

Thanks for the tips !

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

cheers my man

[@massbroffect572]

My blood angels are getting some cover art love nice! If only my sanguinary guard were worth playing at the moment then I could really get stoked lol

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

soooooon. The guard will fly again!

[@homeskillet4131]

Great tips. Well done, sir!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Cheers holmes! Glad it was useful for you! Thank you for the support

[@felixmichael2904]

One question -> What happens if you try to lure the enemy unit into your chaff unit like the gretchins (14:00) and the enemy cannot keep coherency? can he just pile into your nobs?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

you always have the option of not piling in, if piling in would take him out of coherency, then no, he cannot do it

[@felixmichael2904]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 thanks for the clarification!

[@DuelTubeChannel]

14.08 i see what you mean i'vee just one question, in that situation what deefine the closest enemy model? Its definee by that fact yu have more gretching than orks near the custodes or the way the custodes were on the battleground?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

distance between the base's! So the physically closest enemy model

[@ryanq7230]

Was playing a friend last night on TTS. Custodes v Necrons. He watched this video and was so sure to avoid Trajann. Unfortunately... he forgot that Trajann could heroicly intervene and then activate his fight first. I felt bad... kinda.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

yeah haha that is a thing to keep in mind :P

[@kevinchristensen534]

learned a ton as always!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Heck yeah! Glad this was good for you, let me know what other subject people are struggling with!

[@personpeoplehime]

I dunno how im gonna be able to pull off the Fight on Death thing avoiding stratagems without sounding like a rules lawyer lol this is some good info though

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

I believe in you!

[@chengken000]

Awesome tips!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Right on! YOU are an Awesome person!

[@evilmattn]

great tutorial. thank you!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

My pleasure homie! Glad you enjoyed it

[@bifman22]

Holy shit this is so useful! Big thanks Warboss!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

My pleasure buddy! Thanks for your support

[@goodmorningandgoodluck8613]

Happy Thanksgiving dude!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Hey man! Happy thanksgiving to you!

[@U2HAT]

Great chat 👍

[@lucagoffredo8193]

In the pile in method: Do I fight first the unit I piled in because I charged and they cannot activate their fight first ability? I'm a little confused...

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

yes, "fighting" starts with the pile in. You are not elligible to fight unless you have charged or are ALREADY in engagement range.

[@lucagoffredo8193]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 so in that example how does it work? I charge a unit, fight it first because I charged, then pile in against the "fight first" unit. The fight phase starts, do I fight first the "fight first" unit now? I'm still a bit confused

[@maxfoum437]

So if my units(leapers fight first) are in combat from a previews turn get charge by a other unit with the charge fight fisrt, would the leapers still go first and attack the charging unit or they have to attack the unit they were already in combat with and fight first?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

you would select your targets as always, fight whatever is within in engagement range.

[@hasanuddinamiruddin6732]

Can models attack and use their ability while doing fight on death attacks? Like -1cp or lethal hits or sus or reroll.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

depends on the wording of the ability, when do you select the unit to use it, is it a strat... etc....

[@risejaenu]

awesome and helpfull video as always!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Right on! Let me know what else people are struggling with!

[@shihido186]

In the second scenario. where the nobs charge into the custodes, will they be able to preform a heroic intervention to counteract this fight advantage. I get that they would have to spend a CP to do it, but just wanna know

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Yes they could, and should! The orks should then counter by fighting on death! But remember when you use heroic intervention, you dont get the fight first bonus, so trajann would still have to use his once per game ability here!

[@greg_skn]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 the custodian player after your charge and at the begin of the fight phase, can decid to use his stratagem fight first anyway ? (Before your pile in of course) Because the stratagem say at the start of combat an unit on an objectiv ? Or he can not ? Of course after you can decid to not pile in on him and he lost 2cp but he can ? Ok never mind in understand you activate before pile in so he can’t interrupt your activation and you fight and he can fight back after

[@JamesEarlCash]

Question: At the end of the tag trap you say that Mozrag is able to kill the whole unit. But I don't get how he can actually kill the models that are outside of his engagement range. As I understand it - he could have killed those 3 KB's that were in his engagement range but MoE + the other two KB's were too far? Sorry, I'm a newbie and I'm not sure if I understand the rules correctly in this case. IS it becuase those models are in base to base contact? What If MoE wasn't in base to base contact with those two KB's and outside of 1" from Mozrag?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

No stress buddy, you make your attacks against the UNIT in engagement, not just the Models :)

[@JamesEarlCash]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 oh, cool! So basicly: If I have only 2 models in the engagement range/touching base of lets say 3 out of 10 enemy models, only those two models make their attacks, but those attacks go into full unit?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

correct!

[@EthanMiller-x8l]

Does counter-offensive disregard the fights first ability?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

it effectively gives your unit fights first

[@acrpetard]

Some players says that : If an unit with fight first charges an unit with fight first, the charging unit had the priority. Is that true ?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

no it is not. Units with fights first alternate activations starting with the non active player

[@madsurfr728]

How would you modify this for something like Chaos Knights that don’t have access to the pile-in or fight on death things, besides the obvious shoot first. Nurglings are typically action monkeys so I could switch their purpose but that seems like giving up unnecessary points

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

You got it, I use Gretchen, you would use the nurglings!

[@madsurfr728]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 doesn’t that mean you can’t use them for deployment or the like

[@leanderschuster3196]

I'm not sure I agree with the interpretation of "fights back does not count as slecting a target", even if it may be possible RAW

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

I mean it is RAW, so interpretation is kind of irrelevant haha, but i would be happy to see a FAQ come out for it

[@chrisb8595]

​@Happykrumpinwargaming007 How is it RAW? The fight on death states they they get to fight. When you make attacks as part of fighting you have to select a target. As soon as you do that you can use truesilver Armour (GK AOC).

[@thelockzrockz]

absolute tactic chad

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

my man!

[@wolfbattalion8745]

As those knobs were piling into the Custodes, it looks like they were moving away from the sisters of silence. The Pile in move doesn't require the models to move closer to the target they charged then? Just the closest enemy unit? Appreciate the clarification as I do like the melee tricks

[@madmagecrafting]

The Pile In rule only requires: "Each time a model makes a Pile-in move, it must end that move closer to the closest enemy model." So, if you do the set up with your charge move it should work. Charging does require your models to move closer to the selected unit but doesn't say how they move. So the point HKW is making is that you can move closer on the charge but, using move blocking, you can set up a pile in move toward an undeclared FF unit to avoid them fighting first.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Pile in requires you to move closer to the closest enemy model!

[@alnilam8933]

It's to the nearest, watching that part back I think one model's move was kinda questionable, but the rest seemed fine.

[@labancz8038]

@@alnilam8933 Yeah, I think one of them was off too, you need to be pretty careful with this. However with play by intent, it should be more than fine. Also I think one of the gretchins would move through an enemy in another examples (looked like more than a 12 inch move and -there- it actually did block a 'toad from piling in), and unless you fly/have a rule to do that, I am quite sure they couldn't do so. That one was also a bit more eh, I do think here normal move+charge is the way to got, because otherwise you could be in trouble, if it is a low advance roll. If suddenly you were planning to block 4 and block two, and planned accordingly...risky. Also, if you position the orkz a bit differently, they might get hit *through* a gretchin, as their base is smol. Neither really changes the point of the video, but yeah, not foolproof and needs attention.

[@petervansan1054]

Why would knobs shred the unit if they are only base 2 base to one model? At most you kill that one model, no?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

No, please re read the fights phase. After the pile in every model that is eligible to fight will fight, that is any model that is either within 1 inch of the enemy unit AND any model that is base to base with a model that is base to base with the enemy.

[@beans6001]

When did they change being able to pile into a unit you didnt charge?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

10th edition!

[@alnilam8933]

In 10th it doesn't say you cannot pile into other units, however your pile in move does need to end closer to the nearest enemy model, and you cannot do a pile in move if in base to base contact with an enemy model.

[@2ClutchGamers]

A problem I ran into with Fight on Death was that it is super unclear whether or not they get the leader's bonuses.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

It reads as if they do, but I agree, I would like GW to clarify this

[@Xn3v3rX]

How I see it in my head is that CSM can take Dark Pacts in Overwatch so why wouldn't they be allowed access to everything else they can do while fighting on death. Overwatch falls under the out of phase, so I've been juicing my lords at the beginning of combat, and declaring dark pacts before I roll my fight on death 4+s. I always have not had a TO in any major rule against me being able to use the free strat if it is available.

[@jaydeeg3240]

You’re piling into Trajan but it’s still the fight phase and he would still be able to activate fights first. Idk how this is working little confused

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Once you have piled in you have already started your activation. The first part of a unit "fighting" is the pile in. Fights first, "activates" your unit first, but if trajann is not in engagment range, he cannot activate, so when you pile in you will finish your activation which includes fighting before he can activate. Check out the fight phase rules again! I know it can be confusing at times!

[@ericpaz4171]

in the second demonstration, when you charge a non fight first unit and pile into the fight first unit. Are you saying the reason Trajann does not have fight first is because he couldnt activate it? To be clear, charge non fight first and pile into fight first would not work against DG and foul blightspawn right? Thanks!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

You got it on the first try, it totally works on the foul blightspawns unit as well

[@alnilam8933]

Yes, Trajann's unit cannot activate in the "Fights First" phase, as he isn't within engagement range of anything. You then activate First and then do your pile in and fight, hopefully killing the unit, or at least doing significant damage so the clap back (as he can now activate) isn't so bad.

[@ericpaz4171]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 I’m not understanding why it works on the foul blightspawn. Blightspawn passively gives fights first ability to the unit It doesn’t require an activation for it to enable the fight first ability to the unit like with Trajann Are you saying pile-in happens after when fight first would happen, therefore not happening? Since the fight first unit doesn’t have anything to pile into, it misses its opportunity to swing first?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Fights first simply lets you activate first. But if your unit activate before the blightspawn is engagment, then you have already activated. you dont pause your activation to allow the foul blightspawn to go@@ericpaz4171

[@ericpaz4171]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 ok, so as the DG player or custodies player in this case would not want to have a screening unit within 3 inches that could pile in Keep fight first units 3.1 inches from friendly units to not let this happen correct? (Unless they have a 6” pile in of course)

[@emilsaeternes]

I was under the impression that units that fight on death does in fact NOT get to pile in, they just attack where they are

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

the phrasing for most of the strat/abilities is the model fights. The fight phase is divided into pile in, attacks, consolidate. So you always pile in first!

[@LZUTTV]

I dont that master of executions has fight first in 10th, i play chaos and orks and it doesnt say he has the ability. Unless i am missing something?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

World eaters master of executions :)

[@heckinmemes6430]

I feel like I have just advanced from Bunga Brain to Bunga Brain+.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

:P thats a big step!

[@heckinmemes6430]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 For me it is! Now I can bunga into melee but I can be kunnin about it

[@varchilde]

In the Nobs vs. Custodes pile in scenario, what happens if Trajan's squad heroically intervenes into the Nobs? He's then eligible to activate fight first I think?

[@varchilde]

Fight on death. Last option! should have watched to the end before commenting!

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Correct!

[@alnilam8933]

He would be able to, but that's making them spend a lot of CP and use Trajann's once a game ability.

[@mikestrickler4299]

Sneaky, Iz Likez it! I have a player to plays World eaters...

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Krump

[@piotrjeske4599]

Hmm my army doesn't have chaff or cheap vehicles. My dudes cost too much to pull of two unit charges, plus two 9" charges will almost always end with one failed. Which l guess leaves me with wishing that GW gives more fight on death to GK terminators.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Honestly grey knights just obliterate people with mortals and never engage with melee threats

[@Teutonicredneck]

I thought the World Eaters MoE only gets fights first when leading a unit

[@Dutchninja95]

I assume he means a WE MoE with his berserkers bois, but yes the WE MoE only has fights first while in a unit.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

Yes you got it, the example I showed on this video had him attached to his unit. I believe that was halfway through :)

[@Neokigali]

Always run your characters in the back

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

generally the way to go! But people wil ALWAYS screw this up!

[@ccshi332]

The first example , would the master of execution be able to still fight Moz? Because of precision only needs line of sight ?

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

no sir, because he is not in engagement range! so he cannot attack moz at all

[@brailleeulogy120]

The beating fight first by piling in isn’t accurate. Or I might be misunderstanding What you’re saying, I think, that is if you end a charge not base to base then pile in, you get to fight first. That’s not accurate. But hopefully I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

I think you misunderstood the point

[@alnilam8933]

That isn't what he's saying. An enemy unit can only "activate" if something is within engagement range. After charging, nothing is in engagement range of Trajann's unit, so that player cannot use his once a game fight first and activate his unit. So the Orks activate first, and then do their pile in move into Trajann's squad and then fight straightaway. Trajann's squad could still fight after, as now something IS in engagement range, but you would hopefully have done significant damage, and weakened the unit, if not wiped them entirely.

[@brailleeulogy120]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 so after some research and reading comments and watching a video again - it seems you are claiming that you can charge a unit then pile into another unit and are claiming this action negates fight first. So the trajon unit must be positioned correctly and must be the “closest” unit to the model piling in. You HAVE to pile into the closest enemy unit. Which typically means the unit you’re already in base to base contact with. So let’s assume that’s all fine - my issue is the fight phase is broken into three parts “pile in, fight, consolidate” - once you enter the “fight” step of these three steps, you are first to identify who has fight first (at this point if two units have fight first then you determine who rolls first based on whose turn it is not). You’re saying that by piling into a unit that is not in engagement, you negate their fight first rules. I have not found any rules or rulings that state this is the case. I have found rules that broke the phase into the three steps I mentioned earlier. Which would mean trajon would still fight first. What are your thoughts on this or can you provide rules or rulings from commentary that confirm this?

[@brailleeulogy120]

@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 okay so I found some additional rulings that confirm your statement. Thank you! GW will have rules commentary upon commentary and it’s not all together. And I never go to a GT without having solid rules backing any obscure fight phase shenanigans. I feel GW shouldn’t even mention the 3 steps that break down the fight phase without including this tidbit in the same area.

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

I got you boo :)@@brailleeulogy120

[@jeenskappa]

[@joshuaelliott9044]

As a world eaters player please stop posting these Im scared

[@Happykrumpingwargaming007]

hahaha, it is bad for my custodes too, this is not targeted i promise!