Every Entry Level Mill at IMTS

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Audacity Micro

Audacity Micro

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 285
@dadandsonsworkshop
@dadandsonsworkshop 3 ай бұрын
You missed out on the DN Solutions SVM4100, they are like $59k, 12k spindle, Fanuc Oi Plus, TSC and TSA, auto greaser, 30 tool and its a 30x20 machine.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I did miss that! I didn't think they had anything that qualified, my bad!
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I'll pin this comment so other people can see it.
@dadandsonsworkshop
@dadandsonsworkshop 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro I didn't think they did until I hit up my salesman to see if he had something that compared to the Smart mini. You can get a chip conveyor for like $6k more.
@sksmith903
@sksmith903 3 ай бұрын
Are they running a special or something? I priced an SVM4100 roughly 10 months ago at closer to $75K. It does look like a heck of a machine, but I'd put it at or slightly above a VF2SS similarly optioned. Ended up going with a DNM4500S though for another ~$15K more plus a few options.
@dadandsonsworkshop
@dadandsonsworkshop 3 ай бұрын
@@sksmith903 that wasn't a special, but each dealer is different on prices. That's just what my dealer told me for a price. Some dealers might be cheaper or higher though.
@lawerencecohen8287
@lawerencecohen8287 3 ай бұрын
The KAAST using non proprietary parts is a bonus when it comes to support.
@yelims20
@yelims20 3 ай бұрын
thank you for saving me the trouble that is Chicago and walking the miles that is IMTS LOL
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Glad I could help 🫡
@Bergvomit
@Bergvomit 2 ай бұрын
The Smart Mini machine is the best deal. It has the most features built into the machine with a great support staff behind the machine. Good video!
@kenrobertson8239
@kenrobertson8239 3 ай бұрын
My dad got 2 of the Smart machines last year, their drill/tap ones rather than the Mini, and he has been pretty happy with them.
@whatever1663
@whatever1663 3 ай бұрын
THIS is the the video the world needs right now.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I tried my best 🫡
@daboyakasha101
@daboyakasha101 3 ай бұрын
I love the dynapath guy, gets in close like he's telling you a secret, says the lathe is expensive, "it is what it is"
@braddfwtx
@braddfwtx Ай бұрын
Nice video!! IMTS was a whirlwind yet again! I love the show! Nice to see many familiar companies and friends in your video! Ebony at KAAST is awesome!! The SMART machines….well, they have a game changer!! Full disclosure: they are a FANTASTIC customer and friends!!
@Steve-pk9ok
@Steve-pk9ok 2 ай бұрын
When I was an apprentice, we started with NC machines that you programmed with a typewriter punch tape programmer. The machine would see light coming thru holes of the tape and that told it what to do. We have come a long way since then (1983) and now not only are CNC's way more advanced, but the pricing is VASTLY more affordable.
@AlphaEngineer2022
@AlphaEngineer2022 3 ай бұрын
good to see my buddies at hurco, they have the best value machines in the business!
@adammiller4879
@adammiller4879 2 ай бұрын
Yes they do
@gtscientific_and_manufacturing
@gtscientific_and_manufacturing 2 ай бұрын
Love my VM10Ui. Hope my next is a Hurco.
@saturnmedia1
@saturnmedia1 Ай бұрын
2:31 A dryer outlet is NOT THREE PHASE! You need a special converter or 3 phase wired into your space. 220v comes in different forms!
@chadmaurer4002
@chadmaurer4002 3 ай бұрын
That SMART machine is very interesting. Great travels and spindle for the price.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
100% agree, I didn't try optioning one out, to see where the "real" price lands, but it's still gotta be cheaper than a optioned out mini-mill
@Eric-vq9nq
@Eric-vq9nq 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro We were just getting some numbers for some larger Smart machines last week. Pricing is really good. They don't seem to nickel and dime you for every option like Haas does.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
That's good to know!
@chadmaurer4002
@chadmaurer4002 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro I would certainly look at one for my next machine
@rickstephaniefrye6882
@rickstephaniefrye6882 3 ай бұрын
I own 3 smart machines, and have had great experience with them as a company. I do not own the machine you shot, but i do have an sv-2, which happens to be right next to it. In 6 years of owning their machines, i have had to replace 1 coolant pump on 1 machine, which is pretty good in my opinion. I started just as some others mentioned, buying used, but quickly got tired of fixing the machines, and the slow feedrates and rapids, and no memory.
@johnkirisits6380
@johnkirisits6380 3 ай бұрын
the KAAST, double check the voltage requirement. She said 220v 3 ph, then said it would hook to a dryer plug. MOST dryer plugs are 220 single phase. Very nice machine.
@midlifecars
@midlifecars 2 ай бұрын
I noticed that but she said 20amp. No way I can see regular 220 would support 10hp on a 20amp unfortunately 😢
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
She obviously got tongue tied a little, since she forgot to mention needing a phase converter. But generally most dryer outlets are 40-50 amps. At least in older houses. Maybe newer ones expect more energy efficient dryers, but 50 amps is more than enough to run a small mill. Heck, my (very small) Haas runs on 20a of 240 single phase.
@midlifecars
@midlifecars 2 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro ah, understood! But to note that a dryer outlet is standard at 30amp. In house wiring it’s used with a #10 romex. The only 50amp circuits are generally a 5 ton ac and the oven/stove combo. Thanks for the reply, one day I would love to get one of these and that gives me a lot of hope!
@FlipLoLz
@FlipLoLz Ай бұрын
​@@AudacityMicro This is incorrect. If you're running a single phase 240v* 10hp motor, you're going to need at minimum a 55amp breaker. If you're using a converter, you're going to need even better. She's clearly correctly stating it's a three phase, though I have my doubts if the 20amp breaker is correct, given the spec sheet. Definitely being loose with regard to it matching a dryer plug, but maybe she wasn't speak in terms of the specific receptical.
@dbugman1
@dbugman1 Ай бұрын
I have a 10hp air compressor single phase and it's on a 50 amp breaker
@Lwimmermastermetalart
@Lwimmermastermetalart 3 ай бұрын
Really enjoy your videos. I always loved going to IMTS but now with videos like this it’s the next best thing to being there. What amazes me the most is just how many manufactures there are out there. Not only the amount of companies but just how many different machines they make. Sort of makes you wonder how so many can survive and where do all these machines end up. I’ve been in this business since 1976 when I started my shop. Simply amazing how far we’ve come. Good video young man 👍🏼👍🏼
@benjaminengel3738
@benjaminengel3738 3 ай бұрын
I'm a huge fan of Hurco. I have been running them for years and they are very capable. I have been able to chase sub 0.001" tolerances on them
@RiadKhan801
@RiadKhan801 Ай бұрын
Excellent Video, you buddy is a champion for stepping up !
@joecnc3341
@joecnc3341 3 ай бұрын
Nice Video! Thank You for sharing. I haven't been to this show in a long time. Also - glad you are still KZbin-ing.
@Bu5H84
@Bu5H84 3 ай бұрын
Awesome to see a South African giving a helping hand with the Optimill
@dieterrosch4154
@dieterrosch4154 3 ай бұрын
Came here just to comment the same 🤣
@cskovach
@cskovach 3 ай бұрын
Smart mini would be my choice if it had been out at the same time I was buying my X7. I don’t know if they discussed it but Smart has has $10M of spare parts sitting in a warehouse in Wisconsin waiting to ship to you if they’re needed. That’s huge for a machine like this.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Yeah, it's really hard to argue with the Smart, as long as it fits inside your shop. Good to know about the spare parts, that is a HUGE benefit
@cskovach
@cskovach 3 ай бұрын
@@____________________ok S Korea
@Rimrock300
@Rimrock300 3 ай бұрын
But have you had issues with yourSyil X7, needed to wait for spare parts? Is it a real issue?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
All things mechanical eventually break down, and will need spare parts.
@cskovach
@cskovach 3 ай бұрын
@@Rimrock300whether I have or not (I haven’t) is irrelevant. Things happen and if you’re depending on a machine to pay your bills then you need to be able to fix it quickly. Having to wait around 2-4 weeks for your parts to show up from China assuming you can still get them would absolutely suck. Obviously if you’re just buying a machine to dick around with in your garage as a hobby then it doesn’t matter.
@stevec6977
@stevec6977 3 ай бұрын
On the Kaast machine she said it ran on 230 3 phase and then said you could plug right into your drier outlet. Does anyone here in the states actually have 3 phase power to there driers?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Speaking on camera is hard. I would give her the benefit of the doubt, and assume she meant with a phase converter
@stevec6977
@stevec6977 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro gotcha
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 3 ай бұрын
It could be that it's 220/230 single phase, or with a converter maybe? But some places have dryers and such setup for 3-phase as well. Usually apartments.
@OpenMFGco
@OpenMFGco 3 ай бұрын
She could have meant that you could use a drier plug to power it, so it doesnt need to be hardwired. Although an oven plug is probably a better idea, and that you can run with 3 phase. I actually use an oven plug (NEMA14-50p) on my citizen swiss lathe
@marclevitt8191
@marclevitt8191 3 ай бұрын
I like that this company sells that mill made in Taiwan. Kaast reminds me of what Precision Matthew’s does: sell Chinese and Taiwanese versions of their mills and lathes. I went for the Taiwanese models, a PM-1640TL and a PM-949TV. Precision Matthews says the Taiwanese machines have better quality control, but there are undoubtedly very well-manufactured Chinese machines for sale. Kaast seems to be selling rebadged Bodor laser systems. I very recently purchased two Bodor machines: a 6KW P3 Sheet cutter, which is the 4020 or 4 m x 2 m worktable size with shuffling tables. I also bought a Bodor K230 6KW tube cutter, which is the twenty-foot long version, with Bodor’s Ttrans automation system, which automatically loads tubes. I wonder how much Kaast’s version of the Bodor laser machines cost.
@nocturnalwelding5166
@nocturnalwelding5166 3 ай бұрын
Being there live with you while filming was pretty cool. My favorite machine in this video was bye far the Kaast. In real life it was a cool little machine! love her fruit comment about Haas avocados lol.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I so didn't get the fruit joke 🤣
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 3 ай бұрын
@@nocturnalwelding5166 so that's what she was on? I thought it was something like Orange Vise, lol
@jero37
@jero37 3 ай бұрын
I thought she was charming and I definitely wanted a closer look at the machine.
@lexugax
@lexugax 3 ай бұрын
Thanks for making these videos to help the small/starting manufacturers. That Smart Mini looked awesome for the price. I wonder where they are made. I could not find the info in their website.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Some are made in South Korea, some are made in Taiwan. Not sure where this specific one is made
@2SMPerformance
@2SMPerformance 3 ай бұрын
They told me India but they use German and Japanese components.
@Eggsr2bcrushed
@Eggsr2bcrushed 3 ай бұрын
I believe they are built by Cosmos in India.
@dbugman1
@dbugman1 Ай бұрын
What was the price on the SMART mini ? I didn't hear them say the price ?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro Ай бұрын
Starts at $40K
@jim5148
@jim5148 3 ай бұрын
My 220 dryer outlet is just single phase, but it's a neat machine.
@danh9002
@danh9002 3 күн бұрын
Great video! Thank you. I'm looking to purchase a small CNC machine.
@ybd.
@ybd. 2 ай бұрын
Great video! Wished I took the time to visit. In the moment its always so hard to make time but I consistently regret not going lol
@tiotube7578
@tiotube7578 3 ай бұрын
Kaast basically imports cheap Chinese mills puts a sticker on there gives some warranty and calls it a day
@2SMPerformance
@2SMPerformance 3 ай бұрын
The SMART Mini Mill was definitely my favorite of the show but they told me that it is not 4th axis or probe capable.. was a big bummer.
@cbk0485
@cbk0485 3 ай бұрын
Walked by Kaast multiple times. Never knew they were close by to me.
@movax20h
@movax20h Ай бұрын
Cool. It is amazing to see how industry progressed in last dead or two, where entry machines are more capable, and half the price from the past. That Smart Machines is really cool. The price is almost too good to be true. But possible.
@philipgooch676
@philipgooch676 Ай бұрын
Hey im in Indianapolis. Id like to reach out and talk to you, where can i do that ?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro Ай бұрын
Hi! Shoot me an email. aj@audacitymicro.com
@taylorcurtis6187
@taylorcurtis6187 2 ай бұрын
i absolutely hate when i get overwhelmed by the access of more than 12 tools
@brianwaayenberg3099
@brianwaayenberg3099 3 ай бұрын
The smart mini sounds like a great pretty good deal. Fanuc control, 24 tool smtc, good weight and travels for 40k. I wonder what the options list costs.. Smtc may be a pita getting in a garage tho. Had to remove my vf2 smtc to slip it under the door. Was a pain to remount with little clearance for rigging under the low roof.
@hawkprecision7878
@hawkprecision7878 3 ай бұрын
Great video for those starting out in a shed/garage. Can the Hurco VM 0ne run on single phase? I bought a Hurco VM10i late July and it was installed last month into my small shed beside my house here in Perth, Australia. Hurco Singapore are extremely good to deal with. Machine seems capable from my use so far.
@AlexWiseman-ENGR
@AlexWiseman-ENGR 3 ай бұрын
The VM One can run off of single phase. Other machines may have the ability to use a single to three phase converter.
@AlexWiseman-ENGR
@AlexWiseman-ENGR 3 ай бұрын
The VM One can run off of single phase without a phase converter. Other Hurco machines may also have the ability to run off of a phase converter, but I don't know if this is the case for all of Hurco's machines.
@hawkprecision7878
@hawkprecision7878 3 ай бұрын
@@AlexWiseman-ENGR Thanks for the answer
@scudzuki
@scudzuki 2 ай бұрын
Clothes driers are not 3 phase. The Syil X7 is a lot of machine for the money and also uses industry standard compnents. The Smart machine looks pretty nice, too.
@nathanellinger7077
@nathanellinger7077 3 ай бұрын
Good information. Thanks for sharing.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Glad it was helpful!
@mcrotbot
@mcrotbot 21 күн бұрын
KASS looks sweet!!!
@jasonvanhalle
@jasonvanhalle 2 ай бұрын
Decent roundup of solid entry level equipment, but to be fair, I think Haas killed the Mini Mill themselves when they started to jack up prices and stop supporting a lot of their not-so-old stuff. I didn't go to IMTS this year (I'm usually on the Rep side) but was Syil not there at all?
@rugger302
@rugger302 3 ай бұрын
Did you miss the TRAK booth?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
They refused to talk to me
@mechanicalworldMW
@mechanicalworldMW 3 ай бұрын
I'm glad to see trak putting out some more modern machines, but I feel like the market is still leaving them behind. Their machines are priced much higher than the competition, and they seem to still be focused on tool room products instead of full vmcs or turning centers.
@shocwav3
@shocwav3 3 ай бұрын
@@mechanicalworldMW The SI machines are priced higher for sure, but the TMC's are very competitive, VMC2/TC2 is a great value.
@martinsnider3998
@martinsnider3998 3 ай бұрын
Home dryer outlet is Single Phase 220. She said dryer outlet 3-phase 220. Most homes do not have that. You would need a phase converter to get 3-phase.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Speaking on camera is hard, especially when you are out on the spot. I'm sure that's what she meant, but just forgot to say it.
@jamess9420
@jamess9420 2 ай бұрын
I dont think Syil was at IMTS but thats one to consider too, the X5 or X7. Bought mine in January and been very impressed with it.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
100% agree. I said that right at the end of the video. It's really a bummer they weren't there, I feel like they spent the last two years gaining momentum, only to blow it at the last minute with IMTS.
@dehermannen2419
@dehermannen2419 Ай бұрын
I have an X5 since summer. working very well. I'm a happy customer.
@LoneWolfPrecisionLLC
@LoneWolfPrecisionLLC 3 ай бұрын
Kass is an interesting competitor. Smart is super competitive especially with how they are running in steel
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
the the kaast one was super cool. really nice and compact. The Smart seams like a steal at that price too. But too tall for most garages I think.
@LoneWolfPrecisionLLC
@LoneWolfPrecisionLLC 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro absolutely If you can fit its definitely got more grunt than anything else in that category. Wish doosan pushed their dem more as it's very similar
@gerot201
@gerot201 3 ай бұрын
yay more entry machines
@piccilos
@piccilos 3 ай бұрын
The DynaPatch ATC looks cool but I feel bad so much engineering went into 4 tool slots. No Trak love? Are they over the price limit?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
They refused to be on video 🤷‍♂️
@Genesislights
@Genesislights 3 күн бұрын
On Kaast What Dryer has 220V 3 Ph? what??
@formekinetics691
@formekinetics691 3 ай бұрын
First machine: KAAST - Confused at the 20 amp 220 3 phase but can plug into a dryer outlet. When did dryer outlets become 3 phase?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
She just got ahead of herself, and forgot to mention that you are plugging a phase converter into the dryer outlet
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Not the machine directly
@formekinetics691
@formekinetics691 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro single to 3 phase converter will change the torque curve... dramatically.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
No? For a few reasons. 1) modern phase converters just don't do that. 2) all machines these days have a VFD, so regardless of your phases, it becomes DC before being turned back into three phases. As long as you can supply enough clean power, the machine doesn't care where it's coming down.
@Echo7Kyle
@Echo7Kyle 3 ай бұрын
Does Smart Mini have coolant?looks awesome
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
The one at the show did, I don't know if it's an option or not?
@JohnSmith-dp2jd
@JohnSmith-dp2jd 3 ай бұрын
Maybe they've worked out the kinks a bit, but I've had bad experiences with Haas' APLs. A place I used to work had one of the new style ST-20s with the gantry loader and the loader was just the biggest POS. There was a table the blanks sit on that moves back and forth under the rail and it just wouldn't move in a consistent way. Factory techs came out to work on it half a dozen times, never fixed it. Every 4 or 5 parts it would come down wrong, hit the edge of the part, and get the stock wedged between the gripper and table and have to get powered down and jogged all the way back up at snail speed. Decent lathe, garbage loader, just pay someone to do it by hand since it can't run lights out anyway.
@andrewh2341
@andrewh2341 3 ай бұрын
Man, I got so turned around when I was there I only found Smart. All the other booths you showed I never saw (obviously you couldn’t miss haas at the entrance to the hall). Couple questions, did you get a website from optimill, and which of these companies appears the most attractive to you?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I think this is them: www.stuermer-machines.com/brands/optimum/
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
And in terms of what is most attractive to me, I just responded to someone else on that, you can go find the full response there. But TLDR: they all look great for different applications, but If I had to start over, I would still buy a used Haas.
@andrewh2341
@andrewh2341 3 ай бұрын
@@____________________ok many of these are rebranded imports. Methods’ house brand is a Taiwanese company contracting to build what Methods asks. The question is what is the original company
@bltventure
@bltventure 3 ай бұрын
Hey, sorry I missed you at the Tormach meet up. would have been cool. I liked the 1500, only thing was depth of the machine with auger was a lot for a small shop but that was it. So your opinion if height was not a problem but all other constraints what would you seriously consider? Support, learning curves, travels with smaller footprint...
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I think it's mostly dependent on your application. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer here. 100% tormach for someone with power limits, or who are new to machining. The kaast looks great for someone with a small space, who is doing big/real production work. I probably wouldn't ever recommend one of the knee mills. The Smart looks fantastic for a jobshop, but it's big for a garage. Personally, I don't think I would change up the route i've gone, and I would find a lightly used Haas. I think that is the best bang for the buck right now.
@Mattias-mc1rm
@Mattias-mc1rm 14 күн бұрын
KAAST did the right thing with the spare parts... not being aftermarket goblins that charge insane prices .. like haas ..
@shocwav3
@shocwav3 3 ай бұрын
TRAK VMC2 has more travel than a mini mill, conversational built in and is less expensive than all the selections in your video, worth a look.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I tried. They asked to not be in the video 🤷‍♂️
@shocwav3
@shocwav3 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro well thats a shame.
@AMakerDad
@AMakerDad 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro I really don't get the stance of these companies. I was at a trade show (MD&M West) years ago, just taking pictures of stuff on display, and a really aggressive guy blocked my camera from taking a picture of his display of abrasives. Some people don't seem to understand why they are at a trade show.
@TheEpistemicOne
@TheEpistemicOne 2 ай бұрын
Awesome! I missed seeing Kaast when I was there. Looks like nice setup. Taking notes there Haas????
@nikhook1114
@nikhook1114 3 ай бұрын
From the machines decsribed, the smart machine looked like the best. Fanuc controller, Arm tool changer is by far better than the others, bigger travels and 12,000rpm 20 hp.
@QurttoRco
@QurttoRco 3 ай бұрын
Parts and service availability ? How well is the control integrated ? What do they offer over minimill? Problem with haas killers is that for alltheir faults Haas genuinly makes product that offers what you need at the price point that you need it at
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I am not a smart sales person, you will have to talk to them about that. Sounds like it's fairly comparable to a mini-mill, but comes standard with a lot of things that are options on the Haas equivalent (High speed machining is an option, really haas?). Nothing in the US beats the Haas service and support network, but unlike some other machines in this price point (I'm looking at you syil), it does seem to actually exist. I went with my Haas for a reason, but if this existed at the time, I would have seriously seriously considered it.
@250smacks
@250smacks 3 ай бұрын
I didn’t know you were in Indiana, pretty cool. I’m in nw Indiana and been watching your stuff for a while. I’m a truck driver by trade but want to change careers, been doing cad and 3d printing for about 3 years now and studying cnc and saving money for a machine.
@isellmachines
@isellmachines 3 ай бұрын
Nice video!
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Thank you!
@mattfuchs7626
@mattfuchs7626 3 ай бұрын
Anyone know how to spell that last machine brand he mentioned, siles?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Syil Their X7 and X5 machines are popular right now, and start around $30K
@LikeFactoryMade
@LikeFactoryMade 3 ай бұрын
No Syil X7 on the IMTS?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Syil didn't make an appearance 🤷‍♂️
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 3 ай бұрын
Im curious why the Hass guy showed off the Mini Mill vs the TM-0P. That seems like a better machine these days for the compact entry level space. I wish there was an "entry level" large format toolroom type mill like the TM2 that wasnt Hass. Maybe they have the market cornered on that but, having some travel is real important for some types of work, even at the entry level. Something that didnt have quite as much footprint as the TM2 does, more tailored for garages and able to go up against a wall, with front or side access cabinets and coolant, would absolutely rip.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I think the real reason is that the guy we convinced to come on camera was responsible for showing off/operating the Minimill at the show. He didn't know as much about the DC or TM series, so he just talked about what he knew. This wasn't exactly a video that we planned and coordinated with all of the machine tool builders.
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro interesting that they have people specifically for each machine like that, both a good thing in that you're getting folks with in depth knowledge on that hardware but maybe not getting as much of the whole gamut.
@tsclly2377
@tsclly2377 13 күн бұрын
Humm, DynaPath is an old player in the CNC market.. and a true machine, SMART being IOS is really questionable, also a very bulky and power hungry machine (might just want to get you own gen-set for this one).. KAAST was my favorite. If I was go go big(ger), probably HASS (they have a Wisconsin base of operations also). Thanks for the oversight, I'm still at the bottom hobby level.
@ReiniGrauer
@ReiniGrauer 3 ай бұрын
No way that smart mini draws 35kw, it's listed as a 10/15hp spindle on the website so I'm guessing it's more like 30-35 amps. The 9k weight is also a little suspicious but I guess it could just be absolutely overbuilt.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Machine tool builders LOVE to over-rate their machines in terms of power consumption. They don't want customers undersizing the wiring/breakers, and then blaming them, so EVERYONE over-specs power requirements. It was however, certainly over-built.
@ReiniGrauer
@ReiniGrauer 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro Oh I'm fully aware, I have a DMG with a 25/35hp spindle that apparently demands a 120 amp circuit, and that machine doesn't even have a bunch of high HP pumps and stuff. Meanwhile the VF2 has a "20hp" spindle and only needs a more realistic 40 amps. I highly doubt the DMG uses 3x the power but who knows. Might be worth putting an ammeter on to see what they're actually doing.
@Steelcrafted
@Steelcrafted 3 ай бұрын
That's the wet weight with 55gal of coolant lol.....and full chip tray capacity 🤣
@estebanpaintballer3
@estebanpaintballer3 3 ай бұрын
The g84 till she m8’s shirt is awesome!
@jduenes88
@jduenes88 2 ай бұрын
Have you never heard of a Syil X7?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
I have several videos talking about the X7. This was "every entry level mill AT IMTS". Syil didn't come to IMTS. I mention that at the end of the video
@innominatum9906
@innominatum9906 3 ай бұрын
The 20 tools is MASSIVE compared to 12. While I personally prefer paying a fair bit extra and go for a Mazak - that Smart Mill is surprisingly capable for that price. I always have strong doubts about these entry mills and would probably rather get a used instead but... the Smart Mill wouldnt be too bad a choice. It would depend heavily on how their support is in Scandinavia. Nobody beats Mazak at that though 🙃
@blacklabel6223
@blacklabel6223 3 ай бұрын
Did you have good mazak support? We had a 250msy that went through 3 sub spindles in 5 years, 300 hours on each before they burned up. Took them months to get the replacement scheduled, and they loved sending out a tech to say “yup it’s busted but I didn’t bring any parts so I’ll order some and come back again” multiple times per spindle before they turned a wrench. Usually 3-4 visits before anything actually happened, which took multiple months.
@innominatum9906
@innominatum9906 3 ай бұрын
@@blacklabel6223 They usually make sure all the parts they need are sent to us before the technician arrives here. Its just a waste of everyones time if not so I can see why youre frustrated. Not only with the way they operate in your area but 300 hours? Thats not much. Due to my location there isnt really any technicians living close by. So when a new machine is coming in and they have to run a setup - most of them will overnight in nearby hotels etc. A few years ago one of their technicians decided he wanted to drive and sleep back at his home every night... which was a 3 hour drive each direction. Which meant 3 hours at our workshop before his workday "ended". That went on for about a week before we called Mazak and told them about the deadline for when the machine was agreed to be up and running. New tech showed up and made sure the deadline was reached =)
@kw2519
@kw2519 2 ай бұрын
@@blacklabel6223we had Mazak come out to fix our 250msy and he had to order a controller of some kind, it showed up having a crushed connector plug directly from mazak lol
@viliusr6974
@viliusr6974 3 ай бұрын
For 50k is a used robodrill for me, no questions asked. All those entry machines are just a bunch of compromises, costing more money long term. And once you try something like robodrill, you find it surprising when some what's considered basic functionality is not available on these compromise machines.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I mean, compromise is sort of the name of the game for anything entry level. If you go used you are trading the risk of a lemon machine for the cheaper price. You don't get the warranty, parts might be harder to find, etc... It might be the best route for some people, but not for others.
@dpsilver1
@dpsilver1 3 ай бұрын
for the first machine KAAST did she mean that it runs on 220V single phase? I cant imagine that many 3 phase dryers running around
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I think she meant that you could plug a phase converter into a dryer outlet.
@dpsilver1
@dpsilver1 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro hmmm that would make sense too now that i think about it since i have a 10hp one now and that can go up to 32A so a 20A breaker wont cut it
@louis-philippedesjardins6819
@louis-philippedesjardins6819 6 күн бұрын
could you mill stainless steel in those machine?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 6 күн бұрын
You can mill stainless on a desktop sherline. Any of these machines would be perfectly fine for stainless.
@zacharykarr
@zacharykarr 3 ай бұрын
I wish there was an easy reference list of different machines based on their 'garage door height' rating.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
That would be very handy 😅
@kgcrystal3662
@kgcrystal3662 3 ай бұрын
My boss has been looking at some smart machines since we went, Their horizontal prices are kinda nuts
@mrechbreger
@mrechbreger 3 ай бұрын
Did Tormach lower their prices by 50% over the years?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
The 1100mx got a little cheaper when the released the 1500mx, but no, they did not
@shaunybonny688
@shaunybonny688 3 ай бұрын
Under $60k is entry level?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I suppose there's a lot of different possible definitions of "entry level". But in my book it's someone taking their first step from a hobby machine, to their first truly industrial machine. Presumably a person taking that step can afford ~$1000/month on machine payments.
@georgeowen2316
@georgeowen2316 3 ай бұрын
If you have a dryer outlet thats 3 phase i want to see it.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Speaking on camera is hard, especially when you don't have time to prepare. I think she forgot to mention that you could plug a phase converter into a dryer outlet, and then the machine into that.
@dannirr
@dannirr 3 ай бұрын
Why do you use thew Tormach as your base?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
Mostly because the 1100MX is a SUPER common machine, and up until a few years ago, it was the best option for a cheap, but capable machine. I made a living off one for two years, so I'm familiar with it, and I think there are a lot of people in the same boat.
@dannirr
@dannirr 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro Appreciate your response. I have an `1100MX (I'm a hobby guy) but I'm thinking of a better machine. 1500MX is attractive as my learning curve will be zero, but perhaps its not a real upgrade...
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I have two really comprehensive videos on the 1500, and one on the way to my shop (a 1500mx I mean) It's a massive upgrade over the 1100mx, and in the same class as all of these machines here.
@dannirr
@dannirr 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro I'll look for those videos - thank you. It's still only 4hp though....and if I'm gonna spend 50-60k, I dont want to regret it :)
@TKN0099
@TKN0099 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro Tormach sending you a sample to play with for a while?
@Mack_Dingo
@Mack_Dingo 2 ай бұрын
Most house garages don't have 3-phase. 'Dryer outlets' are single phase 240V. 4500W. Not sure what she is talking about.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
She meant you could plug a phase converter into a dryer outlet
@DesignBuildTDE
@DesignBuildTDE Ай бұрын
Do these machines do metric? I wish the USA would adopt this as their standard. I know you have to be smarter to use imperial, but it isn't as pragmatic.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 29 күн бұрын
At this point most machines just have a software switch to make them metric. Really, most of these machines are probably metric by default, and have to be switched to imperial.
@randon4cnc460
@randon4cnc460 3 ай бұрын
Should have stopped by the TRAK machine tool booth, TRAK has amazing entry level machines with there easy to run RX control. They had the VMC2 at the show.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I did, they asked to not be included in the video 🤷‍♂️
@boopfer387
@boopfer387 2 ай бұрын
summery of prices on each would be great Kaast $49,995 Tormach $31,995 Milltronics Hurco Haas ??? Smart $39,995
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
The milltronics was about $35K. Hurco is about $60K. The Haas starts at $40ish, but with options is closer to a minimum of $55
@TheMurrut
@TheMurrut 3 ай бұрын
Do all tool experts say RPMs? Do they not know it's redundant? Revolutions Per Minute, it's already plural. Regardless, RPM is a description of rate which is singular. Even Titans use it. Am i wrong?
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I think it just rolls of the tongue easier. When you say it 1000x a day, you tend to lean to the easier option, even if it isn't literally correct
@TheMoody876
@TheMoody876 2 ай бұрын
Syil x7 starts at $30k the x9 starts at 50k with alot more travel in xyz
@dylanritter5726
@dylanritter5726 2 ай бұрын
Holy smokes you are literally my doppelgänger
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
I'm so sorry 🤣
@dylanritter5726
@dylanritter5726 2 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicromy dad sent me this and I opened it up genuinely thinking it was me for a hot minute!! Craziest thing I’ve seen dude
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
I think you need to send me a picture on Instagram now 🤣
@dylanritter5726
@dylanritter5726 2 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro I can’t find the ig handle
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
@dylanritter5726 I'm @Audacity_micro
@danielkemp4860
@danielkemp4860 3 ай бұрын
God Bless South Africans 🇿🇦💪
@jasonalper7898
@jasonalper7898 3 ай бұрын
Haas, says the magic word, Single Phase
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
To my knowledge, Haas and tormach were the only options here with single phase. Syil has one too.
@AlexWiseman-ENGR
@AlexWiseman-ENGR 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro The Hurco VM One can run off of single phase without a phase converter as well.
@evilsjg
@evilsjg 3 ай бұрын
​@@AudacityMicro happy to help with the single phase equation. I work at Phase Technologies and have helped countless people get machine tools spinning in their home or small shop with our Phase Perfect Enterprise line.
@raindeergames6104
@raindeergames6104 3 ай бұрын
If the Jamie isn't South African I'm a chopper pilot.
@hinz1
@hinz1 3 ай бұрын
Best entry mill is 30-40year old japanese iron, that people don't want anymore, for various reasons. Usually build like a tank, unlike these toys.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
That is a great route for a hobbyist, or someone who isn't interested in growing a business. Though I do agree that going with a slightly used machine is probably a better route. Something like a 2014 Speedio would be really hard to beat in the value department.
@scottwatrous
@scottwatrous 3 ай бұрын
When you are starting out, the machine probably should just work so you can focus on cutting chips. Spending months getting 40 year old machine to run will be educational but it won't get parts out the door. And at the end of that process you're still probably missing useful features that actually help day-to-day productivity with modern CAM. Taking lighter cuts is fine. When starting out no-one is going straight into all-day production of hundreds of parts. You'll spend a lot of the time working on CAM, setup, problem solving, and so the difference between a 20 minute cycle and a 40 minute cycle for a few parts is still relatively insignificant. And in time even with a 'toy' machine the cycle times can come down to something reasonable. I went straight from a DIY hobby mill to a VF2. At the time I didn't want to be 'stuck' with a toolroom type mill or a mini-mill. But at the end of the day for the first few years any of those machines would have done 95% of the work I had to do 90% as fast as the VF. And most would call a VF-2 a "Toy" anyway, it's no beefier than that SMART VMC at the end, for example.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
100% agree
@excitedbox5705
@excitedbox5705 3 ай бұрын
It depends on what you are doing (1 of or mass production) and how much profit difference will it make? If you can finance a machine and finish 2-3 times as much work because of it or take job you couldn't otherwise it will quickly COST you more to use the older machine. Not to mention learning curve (per machine when mix/matching a whole shop), scalability, downtime etc. People often think companies overpay for products/services and they do for what they are getting, but it is often the cheaper option in the end. I upgraded to a new laptop which allowed me to work 2x as fast and therefore paid for itself in less than 1 month. Saving just 1-2 second per screen adds up quickly. If you can save just 1 minute per hour that is over 100 hours a year in productivity. If a new machine costs $60k and you can run 3-4 of them, you save about $50k per employee just on TRAINING using 1 brand instead of mixing 4. Each employee you don't need you save $100k a year. This is all assuming you can find 40 year old NON manual machines to run lights out. Otherwise running 3 shifts will require 9 employees more for 4 machines costing almost $1 million per year.
@thinker4life482
@thinker4life482 3 ай бұрын
Miktronics is the way to go!!!
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
This specific machine isn't the right machine for me, but I'm sure it has a time and place for someone else!
@WellSpokenRedNeck
@WellSpokenRedNeck 2 ай бұрын
Tell Jamie to come back to Joburg ;)
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
I thought he did 😅
@trollingdirty8910
@trollingdirty8910 Ай бұрын
The KAAST, 220 3 phase? Eh ...
@messiii.007
@messiii.007 3 ай бұрын
I would go with hurco .
@lephtovermeet
@lephtovermeet 3 ай бұрын
Just throwing it out that I love tormach. They're super affordable, even their tools, accessories, and replacement parts. We get it they're not HAAS or Keller, but they're pretty amazing for the price.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
I am a huge tormach fan! I've owned a few through out the years! I have done a few videos about the 1500MX at this point, and I am totally sold on it! There *might* be one destined for my shop soon.
@salvadorebertolone
@salvadorebertolone 3 ай бұрын
the smart is a ton of machine for the price
@brocktechnology
@brocktechnology 3 ай бұрын
I've got my eye on one of Littlemachineshop's midrange offerings but this was still interesting.
@mikeperry2561
@mikeperry2561 2 ай бұрын
Amazing what you can get these days for a reasonable amount of money.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 2 ай бұрын
Agreed, even three years ago, the entry level market was Sooooo much more limited
@ManuelRamcanny
@ManuelRamcanny 3 ай бұрын
You should be called Audacity Awesome.
@pawelpirog5812
@pawelpirog5812 3 ай бұрын
Sorry but with the first machine the math ain’t mathing. 20A @ 208V won’t give you 10HP, and that’d be just the spindle, without all axis motors.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
240V three phase. By my math that gives you ~20% headroom over the 10hp, and I'm sure the hp rating is "peak" and therefore not expected to be sustained for more than a few seconds So napkin math says it's close, but they definitely didn't include nearly as much headroom as some other machine tool builders so.
@pawelpirog5812
@pawelpirog5812 3 ай бұрын
@@AudacityMicro that is 100% correct, I just went with an assumption that it’d be a single phase 208 or 240.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
She said three-phase, and then started talking about dryer outlets, which I think confused people. I think she meant you could plug in a phase converter to a dryer outlet
@fredbecker607
@fredbecker607 3 ай бұрын
Entry level for a full time business maybe. Not entry level for a hobby or even hobby business.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro 3 ай бұрын
That is correct, I did not do a good enough job at explaining that in the video
@wolfhobbies
@wolfhobbies Ай бұрын
Don't have a non technical woman doing technical sales. 3 phase 220 so you can plug it into any dryer outlet? While this is true, it is also BS because a 3 phase unit isn't going to run on split phase. Is she trying to say it will run on single or 3 phase? The only reason why i don't have a Machining center in my garage is the power issue. Phase converters are too dirty or too expensive.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro Ай бұрын
She was plenty "technical" she just misspoke because she got put on the spot on camera. Most people absolutely freeze when that happens to them, she did way better than most people. She of course meant using a phase converter. And not sure what you mean by dirty, but if you are doing work for money, then the cost of a phase converter is peanuts. If you are doing it as a hobby, then you can get something like a Tormach that runs on single phase. Or even split the difference and go with something like one of the single phase Haas machines
@wolfhobbies
@wolfhobbies Ай бұрын
Didn't "misspeak" dryer outlet is not a slip of the tongue. It is misinformation. Public speaking is hard. Get someone who can do it right or don't do it. Hate to think that someone would shell out $50K to find out that they were misinformed.
@AudacityMicro
@AudacityMicro Ай бұрын
She just didn't mention that it had an optional phase converter. And she wasn't supposed to be doing public speaking, it's not like she got a chance to rehearse, I just walked up to her with a camera. She did fantastic.
@erikaguirre7638
@erikaguirre7638 24 күн бұрын
Yo.. that shirt. G84 till she M8s.
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