Destiny: Angel 5x08 Reaction

[@blackkatt777]

This is my absolute favorite episode in the whole series. This is where I feel my theory about William/Spike being an empath is proven. This episode and Lies my Mother told me, on Buffy. His gentle nature stayed in tact even after his soul left his body, and the demon took over. It was the teachings of Angelus and a twisted Dru (also Angelus's doing) plus the resentment for how William was once treated...that made him the secondary vile vamp behind Angelus. I loved this arc for him, especially after he proved he was different than Angel because he wanted to be a better man and get his soul back, in spite of being a soulless demon. He is an empath. Thank you for this reaction.

[@mparantha]

This is in my top 10 of the whole buffy verse. always loved this ep.

[@McCrispyTaco]

Lindsey coming back made this season for me, it’s so good seeing original characters come back like that.

[@adamcashin4021]

When this episode aired the reveal broke 'Television without Pity' (a TV fandom site, that heavily featured the Buffy-verse); along with a few other fan site forums. A lot of the Angel-Spike dialogue felt like it had been directly lifted from the fandom arguments; specifically the arguments between the Bangles and the Spuffy shippers over whether Angel and Spike had saved the world more. A lot of which boils down to how much a role each of them played in Buffy's various apocalypses and whether the big bad really constituted an apocalypses level event; and not helped by the Zeppo, Doomed and Happy Anniversary all being technical apocalypses averted. Wes was missing from the episode as actor Alexis Denisof was marrying Alyson Hannigan (Willow).

[@cherdiane]

I still miss TWOP 😢

[@ace360]

Favorite Episode of Angel, I get chills and adrenaline rush every James delivery those lines "Everytime you look at me!" Spike Victory! The final Origin of from William to Spike👏 Awesome backstory behind the scenes of this one James and David became friends haha I will send you the clip Phenomenal Acting and Episode! Stay awesome Dakara 🤘

[@SutraRein-xy4qr]

Love this one! The choreography is excellent!

[@theadamabrams]

Fun fact: this is the first episode of the entire show with *both Fred and Lindsey.* He left in 2x18, and her first appearance (in Cordy's vision) was in 2x19.

[@TheNoybusiness]

Yes, it's a bit funny since both are iconically Angel characters but until this season they never overlap.

[@DudeLongcouch]

That's wild, but also makes a lot of sense. They both feel like they represent two different eras of the show.

[@SilentBob731]

The combination of Epic and Hilarious in this episode is right up there with the best of the BuffyVerse (and the WhedonVerse in general). Also, love Christian Kane as Lindsey, glad to see him back in the mix. 10:58 To quote Worf: "It was a good day to die". And to quote Kansas "Carry On my Wayward Son".

[@ebutuoy6055]

Wesley wasn't there because Alexis was getting married.

[@haroldcruz8550]

Wesley is getting hitched to Willow

[@BenChanNYC]

While Spike had a point about fighting to get his soul, he overlooked the chip. The chip that was forced upon him and made him incapable of hurting people was his "curse," allowing his more human side (or remnants of William that were imprinted on the demon inside him - however you define vampirism in this universe) to come out enough to even want a soul.

[@adamcashin4021]

He overlooked it because it weakened his argument. But his argument is fairly strong. Un-souled Spike was capable of love, Angelus was not. Spike's love made him jealous and that jealousy lead to him siding with Buffy in S2 against Angelus, and saving the world. If Angelus had been chipped he would not have fallen in love with Buffy, he would have sided with Glory in S5. Liam (Angelus) killed his father when he became a vampire, William (Spike) sired his mother so she could live for ever when he became a vampire (then killed her as the demon changed her). Angel felt the need to atone for Angelus' sins for a century(ish), Spike was over it pretty quick, even with the First's exploitation. Angelus changed his name to Angel, Spike remained as Spike. This doesn't make Angelus or Spike particularly unique, or more evil or good than one another. But they retained different parts of their humanity on being vamped and had different personalities; and Spike's personality meant he could fall in love, and the chip neutered him to the point that he could not only love a Slayer, but get close enough to her to form attachments and seek self improvement. (If we believe Drusilla in Fool for love, Spike was already in love with Buffy before the chip).

[@BenChanNYC]

@@adamcashin4021 It's one of the most debated issues about vampire lore in this show - can vampires love? Just because a vampire says they love, doesn't make it true. I think Spike's "love" wasn't real love - Spike retained William's propensity to fixate on the woman in his life to give him meaning. But that's not love - it's selfish.(as the bathroom scene demonstrated) I think Spike's behavior once he gets his soul is what shows how he couldn't really love when he didn't have one. (just my interpretation)

[@MrLorenzovanmatterho]

Oh your face when you see Lindsey!

[@iheartloganecholls]

Possibly my favorite episode of ATS :)

[@JuneJaneb4]

The whole Idea about the destiny and the prophecy is that they basically created this series on it, writing every episode around it and then suddenly another character appeared, naturally, without adapting the entire plot of the series to suit him and he just fits into the context by himself. And I find it very funny. Everything went against their plan when it came to Spike. Again. And that's how prophecies should work. When everything falls into place naturally and you suddenly see the whole picture.

[@fabianknaudt2214]

Angel its not the chosen one, otherwise he would pick the friggin helicopter!

[@marclewis5505]

16:14 I was so looking forward to your reaction to Eve being with Lindsay Dakara.😃

[@nedzed3663]

Hey, look, Lindsey's back!!!! Remember that guy? That was so long ago with everything that's been happening with this show

[@samanthas8340]

I feel like commenting about this because im thinking about it differently this go around: While I whole heartly believe Angel cares more about the average human and I tend to believe he is the more morally intact character (hes also had more time to practice and exercise this). However, there is a good case for the prophecy being about Spike or "worthy" of it. For one, we know he values happy meals on legs, soul or no soul. As for reason number two, he technically did work for his soul, and perhaps by extension his humanity. Normally, I'd say he only did thay for Buffy, however, the prophecy states (according to Wesley) becoming human is a "reward." A reward for fighting many battles and apocalypses. Spike not only faught many battles and apocalypses with buffy, he also faught for the trials and gave up his life. Perhaps motive doesn't matter. With Angel, not only am I doubtful or at least hesitant to say he stopped an apocalypse (Jasmine...maybe) But he's also cursed. The only version of angel that really exists is a cursed version of himself. Can a cursed being qualify for a reward? Especially one like this with no prestidence. Maybe. We saw in the casino that even without a destiny Angel could still fight for his friends futures. Web also know that Angel felt called to the prophecy much like Buffy and Faith with the scythe. Although I dont really have an answer i think all this should be considered.

[@TheNakorius]

one thing they could do is a origin story of angel and spike..maybe with new actors but narration of the og actors..like the new dexter series. It would scratch the itch people have for anne rice novels...

[@rfresa]

I actually think the Shanshu prophecy was already fulfilled, in I Will Remember You. All the requirements were filled in Buffy season 2-3, minus the fake stuff that Eve and W&H made up. That's why Angel didn't want it as much as Spike. He already had it and gave it up, and deep down he knows that he would make the same choice if he had another chance. There would inevitably be another threat he couldn't fight as a human, and he would either die fighting it or try to get his vampire powers back again somehow while keeping his soul. He could never be content to just live a normal human life.

[@ZonycOrder]

So sad that Cordelia won't come back now that we got Lindsey back. Their interaction would be glorious to see.

[@КирилЛитвинов-в1п]

Корделию вернули 12 Серий 5 Сезона и у брали навсегда а знаешь почему там не у кого будущего уже не было всё там война начилась с Адом.

[@luckyrobinshomestead]

It's been so long, I'd genuinely forgotten about Lindsey and Eve.

[@Buffy8Fan]

Best fight scene in the whole Buffyverse.

[@ShadowDogProduction]

I was drinking Mt Dew as I watched this. I win?

[@itsreeeshaaa7560]

I was drinking Mt Dew too. Do we fight? Lol

[@ShadowDogProduction]

@itsreeeshaaa7560 uh oh ...

[@adamcashin4021]

This was the first time I heard of Mountain Dew, I had no idea what it was when I first watched this episode. I don't think we had it in Britain in 2004

[@rexracer3221]

I like that Spike won the fight, and he should have because he's not conflicted like Angel is. Spike fought for his soul, where as Angel was cursed with his. That makes Spike the more noble champion, at least on paper.

[@arc7375]

With the whole Shanshu prophecy, I personally like to headcanon that Spike indeed fulfilled it and became human. But to reward Angel for his heroism, his soul becomes permanent…and neither get Buffy, who settles into a healthy and happy relationship with Faith.

[@arc7375]

Seeing Lindsay again is delightful. But I miss Lilah far more.

[@TenebrousFilms]

I don't think Buffy or Willow would just mail it in... but now you know. A reminder: the *demon* went to get the soul back, and it's been regretting it ever since. If it didn't have William's *character,* things would've gone very differently. I'm not sure it's the win he claims it to be.

[@robertmckenna3994]

Angelus:”Well, you're new, and a little dim. So let me explain to you how things are now. There's no belonging or deserving anymore. You can take what you want, have what you want, but nothing is yours. Not even her.” Such a nihilistic narcissist. Angelus has no problem sharing his toys, just so long as they’re “his”. I think what really annoyed Angelus was Spike making a name for himself without him. Spike always called him a primadonna and a drama queen.

[@odkres]

Oh no, I'm now picturing Spike as a scouser. James Masters trying to be all charming and cool with a thick accent and ending up sounding like a Harry Enfield sketch. Oh no.

[@davidgorman994]

A really fun episode though I wish we got a Dru appearance in the current time too.

[@alexh8613]

So why didn't Angel take his helicopter???

[@pixy-onewing]

❤🧡💛💚💙💜🤎🖤🤍

[@killianlpc]

I know I was sounding like a broken down record regarding S5, but I think the writing in the final Season is superb. What a brilliant follow up to the fantastic Lineage, again we have the Angel/Spike rivalry reignited, with Spike back to carporeal form, and just revelling in his solid state. when he walks into the door it's pure belly laugh slapstick. Once back in this form Angel and Spike's centuries old resentment comes back with Eve leading them on over Shanshu prophecy. Sirk tells them of The Cup Of Perpetual torment, and the feud goes into overdrive with a brilliant fight scene, fuelled to by the flashbacks of Spike seeing Drusilla and Angel having sex. Even though Spike is victorious, it us a hollow victory as the Cup was a fake and Sirk gone. A brilliant ending with Eve slowly making her way to bed only for Lindsay to be the driving force behind all this mayhem, a great link back to S1E1 with Lindsay introduced in the Pilot and back yet again for more double crosses and betrayals. Super writing and another great episode to follow too. ,S5 of Angel contained some of the best episodes ever in The Buffyverse.

[@КирилЛитвинов-в1п]

А конец его понравился он вобще был не о чём начало просто Войны и нет продолжения сам думай чем закончилось всё 6 Сезона так ине сделали в то время.

[@TheNoybusiness]

Unfortunately, Lindsey and Spike's upcoming meeting involves Lindsey tastelessly impersonating Doyle. :( (before someone who doesn't know jumps in, this is not a spoiler because Dakara finished the series months ago)

[@user-knightoftherealms]

Okay, Lindsey is the one who is behind the things that have been happening at Wolfram and Hart. He's playing both sides against each other to come out on top? If Angel or the Partners find out there's no place that Lindsey could run to get away.

[@itsreeeshaaa7560]

This is one of my favorite episodes of Angel. Spike and Angel having it out was long overdue. I know the reasons why Spike beat Angel to the cup but it was so satisfying to see Angel lose to Spike for once. Sorry, I’m ride or die Spike. Lol

[@DJZ64X]

Great episode, Angel's motivation is clearly gone in this season until later, but the cool part about this episode is how joss whedon demonstrated the strength between Angel and spike between their fight, Angel is physical stronger then Spike, but Spike's motivation allowed him to win.

[@wagenbach]

The conversion you're watching of these eps is making the voices all weird and higher pitched than they should be it's odd :/

[@КирилЛитвинов-в1п]

Осталось тебе досмотреть не много и у видеть Адский Конец всей историй Ангела и Баффи хатя Баффи уже не когда не покажут всё.

[@КирилЛитвинов-в1п]

Самое странное то что Ангел как то проиграл в Битве спайку бред наверно свой Плащ не на дел в нём он всегда побеждает ну эта очень странно потому что Ангела больше уже не кто не сможет одолеть и он будет Сильнее и Сильнее становится до саомго конца.