Did GOD OF WAR rip off RYGAR?!?

[@TBP]

As a big fan of Twisted Metal, and God Of War, this is kinda surreal.

[@Manny_Morales]

So cool dude! Great video as well :)

[@DarkRei7]

so you took it up to the man himself, gg

[@Manny_Morales]

@@CorruptionManX do we have that interview?

[@DarkRei7]

@@CorruptionManX can you link the interview?

[@jlestes1985]

I remember when I finally played GoW. It wasn't till it was a PS2 greatest hits title and once I played it I asked myself," Where has this game been my entire life!" Easily one of the best franchises in my 30+ years of gaming.

[@Chr15Payne]

Same. For some reason I didn't even know what God of War was till I went to my cousin's house and played God of War 2 for about an hour. First thing I did as soon as I got back home was buy GoW greatest hits and the rest is history

[@jlestes1985]

@@Chr15Payne GoW2 is the reason I bought a PS3. That cliff hanger of an ending had me craving a third title. Once they announced it for PS3 that settled it.

[@slick0046]

If I didn't grow up on need for speed and cod I would definitely be a playstation God of war gamer

[@WllKiedSnake]

I was expecting this day to come. Rygar has always reminded me of God of War.

[@Game-The-System]

Rygar came first, so kinda like saying "the father reminded me of the son."

[@Tenchigumi]

I love the layers of thought that surround the chain blades. Like, initially Kratos was planned to have close range melee weapons, but for that to be viable you'd need a pretty tight camera zoom (like DMC), but with fixed camera angles, those tight zooms can get pretty janky during abrupt camera changes (like DMC). Thus, you'd want to zoom out the camera and have as much action on-screen as possible, which avoids jarring camera angle changes during combat. However, that makes it easy to lose track of Kratos amid all the chaos and bodies. So what do you do? Draw inspiration from Shinobi's iconic scarf. Striking, vivid, easy to visually track. Literally just weaponize that concept with knives on a bright, flaming chain. Once you go that many layers of thought, you can see how Rygar's chain shield is more of a coincidental similarity than an uncredited inspiration.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

100%. These trolls want to make it like I ripped something off and don't want to share credit. I've credited TONS of things that we used as inspiration for GOD OF WAR (including Shinobi) but for some reason me not saying RYGAR was one of those is just impossible to buy. I have to assume they are trolling at this point. No way people are that dense.

[@Hybred]

@@DavidJaffeGames to be fair out of all the inspirations GoW took from RYGAR still ends up being the most similar game without being influenced by it at all, which is very weird and coincidental so I understand people's skepticism. I'm willing to believe you simply because I don't see why you'd refuse to credit this game if it really was an inspiration when you have credited a bunch of games in the past.

[@Tenchigumi]

@@Hybred The thing is, if you work in any sort of creative field, you'd find that these "weird coincidences" aren't really that weird nor rare. For example, in the late 2000's, I began writing a book that involved ghostly apparitions that would influence people and the world to bend to the whims of "fate." I spent a lot of time devising and revsing the internal logic to make the concept work, and I named those apparitions "Whispers." Over a decade later, Final Fantasy 7 Remake comes out. In that game were ghostly apparitions that forced people and their world to bend to their predetermined "fates." And those apparitions were called "Whispers." Welp, fm I guess. I've seen enough creative coincidences like these to be sympathetic to creators who show their work when explaining why their ideas weren't just copied-and-pasted without any original forethought, Jaffe's reasoning behind why the chain blades were used seem so much more compelling, creative, and logical than "oh that thing in Rygar looks cool let's just take that."

[@Game-The-System]

Ah Shinobi for the PS2. Absolutely one of the greatest underrated games of that era. Easy to get into, bit of a challenge to master...but once you did, the gratification level and cutscene rewards were awesome.

[@Game-The-System]

@@DavidJaffeGames We're roughly of similar age and I have little doubt that if you played the NES at all back then, I'm certain you were (also) aware of that 2nd version of Rygar. That version was mirrored in many ways on the PS2 version, including the iconic Castlevania-style throwing of the diskarmor. In this video you admitted to being aware of the arcade version and also to actually playing the PS2 version of Rygar PRIOR TO releasing GOW. You also claim that the chain blades were inspired otherwise (through Shinobi, etc.). This seems awfully convenient. As a creator you have the right to take all kinds of creative license and morph a story/mechanics/characters however you please. George Lucas has famously attributed numerous works that lead to Star Wars. One of those is Flash Gordon. Now just imagine had Lucas NOT mentioned Flash Gordon as an influence and then "conveniently" came up with the famous opening story crawl. People would've done the same exact thing and said that Lucas "ripped off" the crawl from Flash Gordon. Understand the difference? Perhaps in your mind(?), and possibly to avoid lawsuits, to save face and such, you feel like you have to (continue to) state that Rygar wasn't an influence. However, clearly IT WAS. Maybe it was only 15% or 10%. Heck, even if it was only 5% (in your head), that is still SOME influence. For anyone that is aware of Rygar and its history pre-dating GOW by ~20 years...or even anyone that watches this video and listens to your own words...your statement that Rygar was NOT an influence simply does not hold water.

[@jamescornwell1935]

I appreciate you taking the time to give an in depth sincere answer on this and reiterate the influences for gow. Caught the other video and even he says he saw it as coincidence, games being similar at the same time periods. Theres a few things that look suspicious like the chain combos, but honestly i think it’s like he says limited quality solutions to different game design / mechanics problems. The shinobi scarf was a clean example. I see it often in games the balance of what is fun / satisfying and what looks good / right married to the technical specifications of platform and controls and tv / monitor tech. SsDs now are the big solution on ps5/xbox series to change a lot of game choices and design, the grphics stuff is all good but fundamentally what you can do evolves off that, like unreal engine upgrades or the dual sense / joy con features used in elevating ways to immerse or as throw away gimmicks. the creators always have the true outcomes the tech just affords what is possible. God of war Rag is being scaled back for ps4/pro and pc potato to average, if rag was built for ps5 only and higher end pc they could really push the envelope more on what is possible so we settle for what the game is and the story. Gow 1,2,3 were pushed to what ps2/3 could deliver that is the difference now and why even on ps2 i’d absolutely go back and play gow2 right now even, a game i enjoyed more than my ps3 stuff at the time. Just a great action mythology game, 1 as well obviously save the jump on blades poorly playtested part. I also don’t understand why people can’t enjoy classic gow, psp especially sparta and also enjoy the reboots they aren’t in competition with each other, just a different spin. Only ascension felt phoned in and it still had some neat ideas for what it was. I wished on that they took longer with it and hadn’t wasted resources on the mistake of a multiplayer mode. had they made the main game couch coop or a couch coop hoarde style or separate co op multiplayer mode i think a lot of people would have loved that, versus some generic crush randos with hammers thing in boring arenas. Speaking of what could have been, ready at dawn getting real budget to make a top tier gow game for vita also would have slapped and could have gained momentum that portable desperately needed year 2/3. Thanks for all you did getting this franchise out into the world Mr. Jaffe, one of my favourite game series and settings including games back to when i was a kid. When my 9 year son is old enough i will be getting him into some of these to see what is great about a genre you helped carve out a huge slice of. I do show him stuff but you know how it is you have to pre screen most things these days and supervise and check in. Big respect on your sincere and quick detail here. Also always loved those old documentaries on the game discs back in the day.

[@twistedtick]

God of War (2005) is my favorite game of all time. So glad to see you here, Mr. Jaffe

[@jackka82]

It's very hard to believe that all of it was just pure coincidence. One or two things by chance, sure. The whole list of thing just falling into place by random luck? Probably not. 1. Guy with chain-swinging weapon 2. Fighting Greek mythology monsters and gods 3. In the same type of camera format, with combo AOE chains, while solving puzzles and backtracking with upgrades and even using chain weapon to latch and swing to reach areas the same 4. Released more than two years prior, right around the beginning of development for the latter game 5. Main designer of the latter game having played the full former game at some point during development I could believe that perhaps the entire concept of the game didn't emerge from the former game. But to say that it wasn't an influence at all seems quite a long shot, given the circumstances.

[@jackmeehoff1524]

Exactly but you know the fanboys will slurp it up The fact that he even responded to the video shows the TRUTH

[@pqcowboychanel]

God of war took 5 years to be completed. The game it “ripped off” hasn’t even existed yet

[@jackka82]

@@pqcowboychanel The developer himself said when the development started for the game. Where the frik are you getting your information from?

[@Game-The-System]

Exactly. I could give Jaffe the benefit of doubt and even the creative license to say that GOW wasn't a "rip off" per se. However, where he looses my respect AND my willingness to believe him is when he says there was "no influence" by Rygar. That is just BS.

[@asinaso335]

​@@Game-The-Systembro exactly he knew that rygar is just a gem ps2 game there's not allot people played rygar its so rare to find people played rygar anyway when i was 10 years old i played GoW and after that i played rygar i notice huge simulations between both of them the way rygar use discard armor to kill enemies and the way he moves and fight literally it reminded me of GoW

[@aninfinitemindofmusicandreams]

I definitely see GOW having more influence from Onimusha and DMC than anything else. And since you mentioned Onimusha I gotta say as somebody who missed out on the first three games as a kid playing them now the Onimusha games still hold up nicely. Playing 1 and 3 at the moment. 3 is really fun. GOW, DMC, Onimusha, these types of games are my favorite. Character action games with incredible combat that scratch that power fantasy itch. Just the coolest kinds of games. Thank you and your team for making GOW David.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

I ADORE that genre as well; prob my favorite! Thanks for the nice words and thanks for playing our game! :)

[@davidtattackforce4485]

OK FRAUD OF WAR FANBOY I CAN SEE IT HAVING INFLUENCE FROM THE GAME HE RIP IT OFF FROM

[@bernardbynum25]

spoken like a true fanboy Claim that they got inspiration from game that don't look like it inside the game that do look just like it 🤔

[@aninfinitemindofmusicandreams]

@@bernardbynum25 I'd reply to you kids but I got weights to lift and then chill for the rest of the day. Stay mad.

[@bernardbynum25]

@@aninfinitemindofmusicandreams because you got nothing worth saying in the 1st place go back to lifting your fake weights

[@StriderStryker]

Came from *TBP* and I understand the whole picture about *Greek mythology.* _Just remember that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery._

[@MrDegenerate28]

One of the main reasons why I love God of war is because you can clearly tell it was inspired by Devil May cry but added your own unique twist which was it was way darker than Devil May cry and very mature in its theme

[@Mega6staR]

Rygar is one of my favorite Ps2 games, honestly loved it more than the 1st God of War honestly. They were both very similar and I looked at Castlevania Lament of Innocence as that genre as well.

[@agtjackbauer]

I have never been more let down than from Rygar for PS2. i had the poster from pre oder skipped school so I could pick it up as soon as gamestop open. got home and was like what is this crap. maybe I had to high expectations growing up on Rygar. I'm glad someone enjoyed it though!

[@Mega6staR]

@@agtjackbauer man I had no anticipation for Rygar whatsoever. I seen it n never looked at it as a top notch game nor ever played the classics. I ended up gettin it as a "buy 2 get 1 free." What made me love it was how natural the environment felt as well as it's music. It was a tough game with fairly nice graphics and gorgeous stages. I still have my Rygar game too(tho it's been very long since I've played it). Many ppl never even heard of this game and should try it out...

[@mushra50]

I actually like rygar better than God of war because raigarh is more open world and you got more side quests

[@Mega6staR]

@mushra50 the music is epic as well. A game I might stream eventually.

[@mushra50]

@@Mega6staR if you do decide to stream it I bet you people are going to keep thinking that it ripped off God of war but you got to remember we live in a world where there's still lots of ignorant people out there that think go bots or rip off of transformers when in reality GoBots came out way before transformers Biden entire week

[@Waywardification]

Any developer/artist/writer/musician is influenced by something in their life. To say something is 100% original in this day and age would be absurd and naive. If you go just by Greek mythology then you can compare n-th amount of games/movies/shows/material with God Of War.

[@TorQueMoD]

It's funny that just because one thing existed before another, that people instantly assume it must have been an influence over the one that comes later. Sometimes people just come up with similar ideas. It's like listening to an interview with Justin Roiland recently about his upcoming game High on Life, he said he came up with the idea to make a gun that talks to the player, and was telling his buddy about it, who got really pissed off because the buddy had the same idea that he had been mulling over in his head for years.

[@Numenorean921]

yeah it's not like a weapon on a chain is a hugely groundbreaking idea either

[@PinHeadzBlackson]

So all these games influenced GOW except Rygar but Rygar reminds some ppl of Gow

[@sheriffdraws8789]

LOVE how the chains came to be due to solving a visual and technical problem. Great video

[@Galomortalbr]

There was another interview with the director of god of war 2 director that was also the lead animator of 1, talking about this subject

[@MVP_MAGAZINE]

I’m happy you admit seeing rygar before developing god of war, I was a fan of the original and the reboot When I played god of war for the first time I immediately recognised the similarities between the two games but there’s still enough about god of war and kratos to make it “original”

[@patlauron]

The Acclaim game I think you're referring to is Gladiator Sword of Vengeance. It's based mostly on Roman mythology, so the are strong parallels with Greek mythology. It's an ok game in my mind.

[@TheLastLineLive]

They definitely have similarities. It’s bound to happen, doesn’t mean there is necessarily a direct influence, just that both series share some common links . Rygar is a pretty sweet series, would love Koei Tecmo hand the reins to Team Ninja for a new one. But it seems that Koei dominates the creative at that company kind of like Square dominates Square Enix. They don’t really care about Tecmo IP other than Ninja Gaiden and DOA.

[@mario19885]

I really wish to see a new Ninja Gaiden and Dead or Alive game get developed!! Maybe a Ninja Gaiden 4 and possibly Dead or Alive 7! What if they actually brought back Dead or Alive 5: Last Round and make that one a Definitive Edition?

[@Tenchigumi]

​@@mario19885 I'm all for a new Ninja Gaiden, one that both brings back some of its classic adventure elements, but also just goes all-in with the character action elements. Like, NG3:RE might have its detractors, but I LOVE its revised Karma system and the post battle rankings; if they simply refine that system in a game build specifically around it, I think it'd be really something special.

[@nicolasmeisel]

I would never thought to make the comparison between Rygar and GoW. I always viewed Rygar as part of that wave of games (Ninja Gaiden, Contra Shattered Soldier, etc.) That tried to reinvent classic NES games for the modern early 2000s era.

[@XvFenixvX]

Ahh Shinobi, what a blast from the past, that was such a cool game. GoW will always be the thing that drew me into Greek mythology back in the day. Even though it wasn't a strict translation of some of the Greek stories it did make them a lot easier to understand when Greek mythology came up in our World Literature class as a senior

[@YoMrRice]

Nah someone lifted the chains, the basic combat, and smaller things like the way they moves right out of Rygar. Even the combo system is similar. This is actually shocking but ultimately not a big deal.

[@coffinbirth2847]

Right? It's not the end of the world, but they gotta own that one. That's like LuxoFlux saying Vigilante 8 wasn't directly lifted from Twisted Metal.

[@PNWAffliction]

Yeah, they should own it, and give Rygar its shoutout, at least. It was a fun game, great music, etc..

[@oilmustflow]

I’m actually playing god of war rn again😅 the Minotaur boss fight was a masterpiece same with its music

[@Micmeat]

Only new about rygar on the nes. Didnt know the made sequels.

[@donnydutchmen1284]

I like Rygar more then GOW. Kratos doesn't appeal to me in both design and personality. And about his personality.. Well he doesn't really have a personality for me. He is a generic flat and lifeless character that has nothing to say at all, but does it with an annoying deep voice just to sound cool. The whole atmosphere in GOW is absolutely awesome. But like I sad.. Kratos completely ruins the game for me. Even though I like serious acting and good soundtracks, I still believe the music and acting in Rygar suits the old world more. It has a very classic, gentle and fairy-tale like atmosphere to it. Maybe it just suits me more. Still, I believe that when the best of these two worlds could come together, It will result in an awesome game. I like the silent parts in Rygar where you have to find and figure out things. It makes you more connected and appreciate the environments more because you don't just hack and slash your way though it. But I like the action more in GOW with the absolute awesome bosses. The Diskarmor was in my opinion a way more cooler weapon. And the fact that you could summon gods to help you like in a Final Fantasy game was in this particular case a very cool idea. And I don't even like Final Fantasy games at all. But every Diskarmor had its own element and god power. That was absolutely awesome and not even used in it's full potential if you ask me. Rygar can in no way measure itself to the GOW production standards. But has far more unique gameplay elements that are now lost in time. But since GOW has now a more commercial like approach, and is in fact a completely different game, I think it is time to do Rygar in old Kratos style complete with all of it's powers, and with a modern day production standard. How cool is that game going to be!

[@mushra50]

Kratos is a cool character he's just looks like a generic bald guy with a mini skirt and sandals I like rygar bitter too because it has more side quests and it's more open world

[@AD3SPG]

The story of God of war what drew me in immediately as my 5 year old cousin got it for his birthday and would rage and I helped him with puzzles and bosses and the cinematics I was amazed by it all it's come along way and is still amazing.

[@ruminator3570]

Rigor for PS2 came out in 2002 on November 25th

[@joetroutt7425]

The baby headed hydra though. 🤣🤣🤣 What were they thinking

[@mushra50]

That gives me nightmares even to this day what was David cronenberg thinking when he came up with that

[@ugl933]

Thats that Japanese imagination, I find it fascinating 😂🤯

[@civilwarfare101]

Even Rygar itself ripped off Onimusha so it all comes back to that game.

[@darobyjb3869]

And Onimusha was heavily inspired by Soul Of The Samurai to the point that it could be called a ripoff

[@civilwarfare101]

@@darobyjb3869 I never even heard of that game.

[@darobyjb3869]

@@civilwarfare101 it's a PS1 game made by Konami, you should play it it's good.

[@civilwarfare101]

@@darobyjb3869 I'll look into it.

[@dogfoodnyc]

You may want to check out the NES Rygar. That game was great 😊

[@p3kante00]

Interesting info Mr. Jaffe!! I hope you do more videos like this where you talk about design decisions you guys made from your previous games (God of war specially!!)

[@sebastiansanhueza9601]

Great video, David, even though I had no idea such a "controversy" existed. To play along, however, not sure your line of reasoning works here. You talk about what you and your team were aiming for when making GoW. (That bit is interesting and a nice glimpse into the making of the project, btw.) But questions about "drawing inspiration" - not plagiarism - often have to do with how an idea unconsciously made its way into another piece of art. A good example is that Flaming Lips song, Fight Test. The song is very similar to Cat Stevens' Fathers and Sons. The FL's frontman didn't aim to copy the song, but when someone mentioned the similarity after the record was finished, he went: oh sh**. The similarity existed, whether he intended it or not (he didn't), and even though he didn't intended it, he assumed he must have ripped the song off, as he probably had listened Stevens' song in the past - he just didn't realized at the time he used the same melody. So, if someone wanted to pursue the "controversy" (I wouldn't) any further, what would be fruitful to do would be to figure out whether you and your team saw or played bits (at least some of the bits people are bringing up) of Rigar before publishing GoW, and perhaps whether the bits of GoW people compare it with were developed before or after you saw that game. Against that backdrop, it would be more or less immaterial whether you guys intended to draw inspiration on that game or not. Given the way the human mind works (a bit à la Inception), you'd better assume there was a crossover of ideas if (i) watching Rigar came before developing the relevant bits of GoW and (ii) there is actually a superficial resemblance between both ends.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

If you watched the video tho you would know not only did I play Rygar on Ps2, I finished it. And sure, I can't speak to the unconscious mind, I can just tell you consciously what I took inspiration from.

[@sebastiansanhueza9601]

@@DavidJaffeGames Do you actually enjoy being kinda douchy with people who take the time engaging with your videos? Or is it part of the channel persona? Or did you get bullied a lot back in school? Because I was too, and I reckon I'm not like that with people when they push a little bit back. Sorry for the trouble, man.

[@justrok79]

@@sebastiansanhueza9601 I think you're just perceiving his comment as rude.

[@WllKiedSnake]

Is it a controversie though?...

[@malekaius]

@@sebastiansanhueza9601 you’re misreading the intent behind his response. But also he is douchy for humorous reasons. Not to intentionally put channel members down. He’s usually trying to be funny

[@SupreemSPGamer]

Devil may cry still holding up well.

[@JesusProtects]

But guys, there have been chained weapons in games since like forever. I don't know 100% if he is hiding it or not, I don't know Jaffe, we are not family or friends or co workers, but is not so hard to believe the weapon choice was a coincidence as he says.

[@jonathanhammer8656]

Since God of war might got its inspiration from Rygar and adapted to Norse mythology. If Rygar had a sequel or later adapted to Celtic mythology in different regions like how Kratos made it to Norway.

[@Therake2602]

That make Sense

[@jonathanhammer8656]

Yeah, first off we have to a sequel starting off the beginning with at the wedding with princess harmonia time until it was interrupted rogue gods starting with Ares behind the rebellion during the Greco-Roman times, but he wouldn’t be alone he would have other gods join him Nyx and her other sons like Thanatos and other sons including some titans like Atlas to join in on this evil plan on stealing of Zeu’s and his siblings powers to become the true king of the gods. Rygar went on a quest by Athena to seek the powers to defeat the Ares and Nyx, but his journey Harmonia wouldn’t stand around wait she would tag along learning some archery skills on the adventure Apollo and Artemis in Rygar 2: Wrath of Gods. In Rygar 3: Roman invasion the main hero would fight along side his Roman legion from his emperor Caesar Augustus to continue to invade the Celtic land of Morini but later Rygar would end up betraying his legion of the tyranny that Romans had plague amongst the tribe to fight off the army he was supposed to aid in. In Rygar 4: otherworld he would leave Rome shame in betrayal of his home land of banishment and head towards a new land he will call home which leads to Ireland, but in this the gods of Ireland aren’t pleasing to outsiders of there land of not trusting him and Rygar joined the wrong side of Queen Mebd and later join Cu Chaluinn on his joined to fight off the Formorians in this epic battle.

[@quirkd33]

Rygar(1986 Arcade) - > Rygar(1986 NES) -> Battle of Olympus (1988)

[@dukemakaveli]

Glad to see you Jaffe

[@BloopinDaThird]

Rygar came out before God of War and Honestly both are great games to add to your PS2 collection. 👍

[@WllKiedSnake]

Rygar came to Wii also.

[@DrDipsh1t]

The chain like blade thing was just a fad at the time I feel. People seem to forget about the Daggertail in Prince of Persia: The Two Thrones which performed in pretty much identical ways. Released the same year as GoW if memory serves right. Regardless, cool concept and great game mechanic.

[@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக்]

Even devil may cry 3 had a chain like weapon with ice nunchucks which was also released in 2005.

[@Da_Most_Shady]

Says he played Rygar through the end years before GOW was completed and tries to lie about ripping off the gameplay. Tries to convince people that Rygar was too insignificant to even remember. They must have looked at the sales numbers and knew few people would even notice. At least give the original game credit. Anyone who plays Rygar will immediately think they're playing GOW.

[@zaselimgamingvideos]

If he can name other games like DMC, Onimusha which GOW does look like then why would he not name Rygar if he did get inspiration from the game. And yes i have played and I still own the copy of the game to this day and it was good game but forgettable for the most part and I never felt when playing GOW that it looks like Rygar but instead i did felt the DMC and Onimusha wibes which are one of my favorite Series.

[@ulurius]

​@@zaselimgamingvideosdoes DMC or Onimusha have literally the same animations as GoW? Of course he isn't going to say rygar was an inspiration, because they blatantly ripped off the gameplay and it would be 1 to 1 plagiarism.

[@asinaso335]

Exactly when i was 10 years old i played god of war 2 on ps2 allot and i can't remember the when I got rygar game exactly but after i played rygar i immediately remember gow thay literally look the same when they fighting with there weapons that has chains alos the camera how it moves when rygar on the temple or open places it just feels like a GoW game there's allot things i remember when I played gow and rygar that has the same the team who developed gow they definitely knew about rygar i don't know why they didn't talk about it ​@@ulurius

[@killyridols72826]

Hey, what about Castlevania: Lament of Innocence, did you know about that game during GOW1 development??

[@msg360]

IDK if it wasn't on your Radar but you played it to the end, its obvious you guys took some inspiration, because his chain shield is just too similar to Kratos's chain blade come on Jaffe

[@WllKiedSnake]

Who did it better though?

[@msg360]

​@@WllKiedSnake doesnt matter who did it better Rygar was first , and for him to act like there wasn't any inspiration is disingenuous

[@igodreamer7096]

Very interesting story, Dave

[@sverr0r]

Can't see that this Joe Reich (sp?) mentioned (06:02) is credited anywhere for the game or the studio... Extending the weapon kinetics beyond "human" range by way of an extend/retract is the only meaningful link to Rygar - the first game to succeed in injecting this, afaik. Works real well for maximising the gameplay:screensize ratio. Godlike indeed =) Sidenote: the OG arcade had a much wider "history" scope ("billions of years") than trying to shoehorn that IP into greek mythology, which I think was a major mistake on the part of relaunching of the Rygar property, back in 2002/2003. Can't believe this little link finally became a topic! As a diehard fan of the arcade, its 'been on my mind' since GoW finally 'took over' the formula & pretty much perfected it.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

Never heard of Joe Reich. Now, if you're looking for Jo Wright, I am certain you can find her in the credits for many Santa Monica games :).

[@sverr0r]

lol, thanks!

[@bigcloutmusic3255]

They used the concept of the game and made it amazing🖤🐐💯

[@msg360]

pretty much what happened , they took inspiration I don't know why he wont admit it

[@dwaresacksqb]

Yeah he won’t admit it because it’s too similar. If he says he was inspired by it then it becomes a rip off

[@traviszander]

I always wondered if you were influence by "Mark of Kri" at all when developing GoW.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

REALLY enjoyed that game and always thought it should have been a bigger hit. I'm sure some influence seeped in but prob the biggest was watching it not perform too well and assuming it was because the theme/style of it was too cartoony for the audience. Which very much influenced my feel that if we were gonna do a hack and slash game, we needed to age it up for a teen+ audience in terms of theme/violence/etc.

[@traviszander]

@@DavidJaffeGames couldn't agree more. Very under appreciated game. The level of brutality was surprising because it was a little unassuming on the surface. The stealth kills were awesome. Really loved the targeting system and allowing user inputs to jump from target to target while fighting.

[@navigatingel6104]

Honestly if he said it was any influence at all it could be liable so I get it. But if it is a ripoff, Im glad they did cause GOW is a better game overall. The combat was just a better combat application, but the disc armor is a better justification for a grappling hook. I always kinda wished they'd do a crossover.

[@Prodzick]

Anyone insisting on the chain weapons didn't played castlevania.

[@seanoggy5889]

Tried out Rygar not too long ago, got stuck on a late boss and kind of fell off. The game is pretty easy except for the boss battles. The difficulty spikes immensely during each boss battle.

[@WllKiedSnake]

It's out for Wii also.

[@AlexGusnawan]

I Hope they release God of War 1,2,3 as Trilogy on PC

[@xnet-pvzok728]

We just need to tie up one more loose end and find out if Joe did play Rygar.

[@jessie6769]

At the time I have never played anything like God of War. You can definitely tell it was original in so many ways. The only thing similar is the setting of Greek mythology. So there's really no comparison.

[@msg360]

actually there is alot of comparson , I think the difference is GOW has the Hollywood Budget and team that Rygar didn't , you can see where they took inspiration , the chain blade , the boss battles , and setting is very similar . but GOD just have better everything when it comes to production , gameplay etc

[@chrisredfield8548]

Did that Joe guy on the design team who created Kratos' chain blades play Rygar?? Maybe not, or MAYBEEEEE.......

[@pluto4816]

i am very very happy you made this video i was so interested in your opinion

[@lowerclassbrats77]

Not claiming any ripoff situation rather a recommendation, Shadows of Rome on PS2 is a criminally under played game.

[@John-996]

I might check that out, I loved love Ryse son of Rome not the greatest but had so much potential If it was like Kingdim come it could have been amazing.

[@Mintcar923]

Hell ya! I gotta get back to that one

[@killer1one1]

Fucking love that game, feels nice to see someone else remember it ✌️

[@WllKiedSnake]

That game actually did well back in the day.

[@lowerclassbrats77]

@@John-996 Definitely, you get extra points in the arena for ripping off arms if I recall correctly. It's a Capcom GOW-ish game with stealth sections.

[@killyridols72826]

I always knew GOW was never inspired by DMC combat-wise, both GOW and DMC were inspired by Onimusha's combat, but both of them have completely different combat systems. That being said the feeling of power is similar in both games and that's why Kamiya fanboys always try to say GOW is a DMC ripoff.

[@Jagerbomber]

Get your pitchforks, Gamers. *TO JOE'S!*

[@outtoxicated9104]

Lords of the fallen is similar to dark souls. That doesn't mean it doesn't have a right to exist. Some games just have similar gameplay.

[@QuinnOConnor]

I LOVED Rygar on the PS2(and Onimusha 3, so underrated). I beat Rygar and when God of War 1st dropped I didn't ever equate it to, or even think of it in any way as similar to God of War. On top of that GoW shit all over it(like it did everything ever made up until that point).

[@WllKiedSnake]

Rygar got a port to Wii also.

[@thegsk]

@@WllKiedSnake then you know it was doooooooooomed lol

[@WllKiedSnake]

@@thegsk Oh! Yeah! Hardly anyone knows it exists. It's actually a impressive port with a few improvements over PS2.

[@aninfinitemindofmusicandreams]

Gotta agree with you on Onimusha 3 being underrated. As a kid I played all the DMC games that released for the PS2, God of War 1 and 2 and a couple of other hack and slash games, but I missed out on the first three Onimusha games. Only played a little bit of Dawn of Dreams. Playing Onimusha 3 now on emulator I'm honestly surprised at how well it holds up and how fun the combat and controls are. It's not as complex as DMC nor as cinematic as early GOW, but it's a very fun game and I think it can be considered one of the pillars of PS2 hack and slash games along with DMC and GOW. I'm also playing the first Onimusha and that too has aged quite nicely but I'm finishing up Oni 3 first. Maybe I'll play Rygar after I'm done with these two games.

[@Jamesssssssssssssss]

God of war means a lot to me, being too young to play it. But getting away with it because i got a copy from my friend. To the most recent one that made me cry. Awesome times

[@ocult100]

What can i say Jaffe, Rygar from PS2 has a Gorgeous Music/Ost/Soundtrack. And Everyone who plays or Remeber This Game From those old good days, They know What i'm Talking About. As for the old God of war Games They're Keep Rocking Even Today, and all The God war Games have Memorable Battles, Boss Battles and Music.. I have to Say Thanks Jaffe For The Great Childhood you made for tons and tons of people Around the World

[@Afr0Punk]

Rygar was awesome back in the day

[@desertfox738]

To this day I wish Sony would put the original God of War games on PS4 and PS5, the 1st one is my favorite game of all time and now I can’t play it on my PS3 because the disc drive stopped working :/. I guess I could stream it through PSNow but I’d rather be able to download them.

[@breadordecide]

I dont understand gamers. Are two similar games not allowed to exist at the same time?

[@CorruptionManX]

They are, but it's no offense to say that one game clearly inspired the other. Clearly Rygar was a strong inspiration.

[@AmateurAnimations65]

I had a feeling this was just a coincidence. A suspiciously big coincidence, but coincidental nonetheless

[@pg6244]

Where can I get that Sweetooth hat?

[@DavidJaffeGames]

Here ya go, sir! :) streamlabs.com/dashboard#/merchadmin

[@pg6244]

@@DavidJaffeGames Hey Jaffe. Thanks for replying. When I click on the link It does not take me to the merchandise site. Can you share it again?

[@072kratos]

I head about rygar about two years after i played god of war in 2006 it looked similiar with the greek atmosphere and chained weapon but besides that i thought god of war was far better

[@Hey1426]

What the hell is Rygar?

[@briandenapoli3250]

Something past your age

[@batrol6687]

Hey Jaffe, could you tell us some behind the scenes about the music of God of War 1? Have you met Gerard Marino and the other composers? Did you have advices to them? Or they got free hand creating the soundtrack? The music of GoW1 is too good, I listen to it very often.

[@ShoXwavee]

I like how the video suddenly ends with "good game tho really fun"

[@JoypadDivison]

I think the person who came up with the chain idea had seen Rygar on the PS2. Seriously, didn't you all, and didn't you talk about that game at work? Extremely good game. I wonder if the team was worried it wasn't any good and was too repetitive? Because you had all seen and playdated it more than most people will ever spend playing the game. But reassured by testers I assume.

[@michaelw5456]

David, Please hear me out a with UE5 a "Twisted Metal: World Tournament". with level remakes from all TM games.

[@xeroscl]

And what about Spartan: Total Warrior. Back in the day I got the feeling they were very similar with God of War

[@casualtalk6512]

Both released the same year and both final boss fights are ares

[@drober8588]

Do your inside sources give you permission to put this infornation out there? Just curious

[@kylepherson1951]

I always felt playing God of War 3 (looking at you Stig!) that the combat was heavily influenced by what Rygar had achieved (3 damage settings with Blades of Chaos; light/fast, medium/balanced, slow/heavy damage).

[@Marshy50]

glad you explained this and didn't bash rygar cuz both games are cool :3

[@C0T0HA]

Thank you for the insights!

[@thegsk]

rygar was in the arcades and nes back in 87 always fought bug like enemies they just took it to 3d on ps2. Gow was more dmc then rygar i'd say.

[@blakewilliams5627]

I wondered if he would see that video

[@jomac3423]

Rygar was that game on Nintendo

[@Mediazzzzzz]

How do you explain that battle scene in the end

[@Mojaveknight17]

Iv'e never played rygard but the music is beautiful

[@advgym]

Sounds like cap! Should’ve never replied.

[@Mintcar923]

Wow we were just talking about this the other day.. I was a huge fan of the original Rygar and also the later PS2 installment and got to finish both.. It’s a real shame the series didn’t continue.. That said, God of War obviously more than made up for it as far as the Greek mythology theme not to mention tremendous gameplay.. Anyways just came off a session of Prince of Persia Forgotten Sands and it suddenly dawned on me ever since the “Soulsbourne thing” broke big in the action adventure genre it’s almost as if the vast majority of popular IPs more or less forgot about great platforming which was more prevalent going back maybe about 2 generations ago.. Getting back to the subject matter I’d say the Castlevanias, Rygars, Prince of Persia’s, and GOWs are more or less in the same family being they share a great balance of amazing combat mechanics, platforming and also noteworthy storytelling.. And, they are all special in their own unique way imo.. That to me makes them all very much worth the praise they received.. In any event, I guess that’ll make a hellova Saturday afternoon playing a nice mythology based title and watching a triple header in Clash of the Titans, Wrath of the Titans and Jason and the Argonauts come nightfall.. Gotta do this one of these days this summer hahaha

[@WllKiedSnake]

You should try out Prince of Persia Forgotten Sands for Wii. It's made by the team who made the original trilogy on PS2 and not the team who made the PS3/360 version and it shows. It's a way better game! Quite different world design and gameplay mechanics also.

[@Mintcar923]

@@WllKiedSnake You learn something new every day!

[@WllKiedSnake]

@@Mintcar923 The same thing happened with Driver San Francisco for Wii and Splinter Cell Double Agent for OG Xbox. Different kinda games and better for it by a mile with Splinter Cell Double Agent. Which was also made by the team behind the original trilogy of Splinter Cell games.

[@Mintcar923]

@@WllKiedSnake Also, got the digital version of Forgotten Sands on the good ol PSP! Actually if it wasn’t for PSP I may not have been such a die hard GOW fan.. I’d tried GOW1 first but I really wasn’t all that great at it so I kinda rage quit the first time.. Nevertheless after later playing through Chains of Olympus I got gud and was ready to take on most everything afterwards..

[@free_icecream76]

God of war turned into an afterschool special to me at least.

[@acct4600]

came here to bash dave but this sounded pretty honest... but i do think he was inspired by rygar more than he admits. 7:08 he's trying to play it cool & act like he wasn't worried that Rygar would steal God of War's thunder. the reality is Dave & his team was scared shitless because Rygar was a great game that ended up not getting the amount of press that God of War did.

[@TopoSalsero]

Exactly, like you can't say "we weren't inspired" when the chain weapons are a 1:1 copy.

[@Ah2o5b]

Usually people "avoid" talking about inspiration for two main reason 1. To look cool and original hype themself up. 2. NDA and PR team telling them what to say. For example developers make point and click and would say there inspiration was Mario😂😂

[@Dozaemone]

Yeah, come on guys. It is obvious they rip off castlevania's vimpire killer.

[@Keviqeri]

Hero of Sparta is also a GOW clone

[@doinks100]

Thank you sir and thank you for God of War

[@Sorry_ImTruthful]

Saying that you got the chains from a scarf to make the character pop is hard to believe when Rygar’s chain weapon “is” the very thing that makes that character pop!… i understand that there are things that cause inspiration to create? But there is no way that Rygar did not play apart in that creative inspiration 🤷‍♂️

[@DavidJaffeGames]

I honestly don't know why you folks seem to care so much. I'm always honest, I've given massive props to where our influences came from. Hell, if you want I imagine you could hunt down the depositions from the GOD OF WAR lawsuit (which we won- twice) where under oath I went thru all our inspirations. Rygar never came up. That's not to shit on it, it's just the truth. Do with that what you will but I'm more fascinated why people keep bringing it up. I'm telling you the truth, I can't help you if you don't want to believe it. Sounds more like a y'all problem to me. Be well! :)

[@Sorry_ImTruthful]

@@DavidJaffeGames Lol 😆, its just the crazy similarity’s that the two games have? But like i said, inspiration comes from all sources and its amazing how two different things can have similarities without having inspiration from another… and that “Lawsuit” had nothing to do with “Rygar” so i have no clue why you would bring that up 🤷‍♂️.. 😂

[@DavidJaffeGames]

Because part of the work of proving the lawsuit was not valid was explaining all of our influences. And when I did that a LOT of games were mentioned but Rygar never was.

[@GaggleofDoozies]

So cool to hear straight from the creator. 💪👍🔥!!!

[@coffinbirth2847]

Anyone that had a PS2 and these two games knows exactly what's up here. Rygar came out THREE YEARS BEFORE God of War. If you played this "to completion" towards the beginning of development of GoW how could you possibly say with a straight face that you didn't rip off Rygar? How long was the dev time on GoW? Oh, three years and some change? Hilarious. Jaffe gonna Jaffe, I guess.

[@bikerboy3k]

1:52 no mate it came out in 2002 don't play dumb, what Google stopped working during this video? This combined with him looking to the side every time he references the creation process, confirms that you did in fact copy Rygar. Ain't no fucking way in hell that an identical game comes out 3 years later and you label it as a coincidence.

[@navigatingel6104]

it's an obvious influence but honestly GOW was better execution all around. Rygar was cool concept but it was slow and a bit dull but still cool.

[@nyfinest487]

It makes sense why you like gamepass. As a designer, it seems like a must for you to try as many games a possible.

[@kingofeverything8833]

I think God of war is big partly cos of the story

[@akab211]

I don't know but it kinda did rip off devil may cry. Still it became a great game in its own right.

[@DavidJaffeGames]

100%. Ico, DMC, and ONIMUSHA. We totally stood on the shoulders of those games. Rygar tho? Not in any real meaningful way, if at all.

[@mikehustle3513]

God of War was literally the reason why I went for a Ps3 over an Xbox 360, ps4 over an Xbox one etc. Although I ended up having each console but damn man this franchise had that much influence on me.

[@jaynukem1929]

Regardless of the truth, God of War ended up being the better game. I say you can't knock a rip off if something better comes out of it.

[@MikDunkin]

Ripped off vigilante 8 too... unbelievable! :p

[@DavidJaffeGames]

I-76 you mean :).

[@outtoxicated9104]

I think the biggest difference between Rygar and God of War is that Rygar sucks ass and God of war is a 10/10.

[@FunStuff-zn2yb]

*facepalm*

[@agtjackbauer]

haha as a Rygar fan i grew up on it. the new Rygar sucks. arcade and nes Rygar are the only ones that I acknowledge. GoW i 100000x better than that Rygar its being compared .