Did the British Empire Commit Genocide? | Prof. Nigel Biggar

In this clip, Nigel dismantles the myth surrounding the British Empire's participation in genocide throughout its colonies. Nigel also highlights the negative actions of the unsanction few in contrast to the actions of the State, which actually tried to preserve native lives from the 1800s onwards.
Nigel John Biggar CBE is Regius Professor of Moral and Pastoral Theology at the University of Oxford, author, Anglican priest, and theologian. He also directs the McDonald Centre for Theology, Ethics and Public Life at Oxford which aims to foster a conversation between Christian theology and other disciplines.
In 2017, Biggar initiated the Oxford project “Ethics and Empire” which aimed to scrutinise a purely negative view of empires and argue that they were morally mixed. Some progressive historians and academics voraciously criticised the project for 'attempting to balance out the violence committed in the name of empire with its supposed benefits.'
#colonialism #empire #debate
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Nigel Biggar
/ nigelbiggar
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[@kaylenehousego8929]

"The intent to wipe out a people" - currently , this is what our nation and indeed the whole of the Western world is living through and may God guide us in His will . Blessings from Sydney .

[@benjaminwinchester3408]

What, so some immigration is supposed to compare to the some of the worst crimes our species has committed, wiping out the homelands, culture, and way of life of almost all in North America and Australasia, the systematic transport of millions from Africa, the attempted wiping out of Jews, wow if I give Germanics one thing, it's a crazy ability to believe their own hypocritical nonsense. If you don't like immigration, then enjoy being on a trajectory like Japan, as the old civilisations, China, and India close the gap the industrial revolution gave the West. At least you'll be genetically pure in your poor corner of the planet or whatever volkish Germanics believe these days.

[@tomsmith2181]

It's happened many times before and will happen again. 2000 years is but a drop in the ocean when compared with the lifespan of our beautiful planet. Evolve or perish, this is nature.

[@marcostation1000]

Correctio , not all the west. Pmited genocides. Brithis , french, duch, canadians and americans did and blame It on spaniards. The propaganda IS coming to a end.

[@jonahtwhale1779]

How many countries returned to their pre-colonial political system and society after the colonial system ended? None of men. Lots of African and Asian societies threw off Western European cultural hegemony and accepted Eastern European Marxist hegemony - with the concommitant huge uptick in the number of corpses.

[@mohamedali2858]

America, the leader of the free world, is the one who killed three million four hundred thousand Vietnamese people in order to establish a politically loyal president in the 1960s, and this figure is recognized by Defense Secretary Robert McNamara. Is revenge justified while changing the balance of power?

[@davidegral7152]

Great comments. Thanks for your input.

[@roselee979]

So, Murdering people is not the way

[@roselee979]

I don't care how much you want to sugar coat what the British have done. Thru are the biggest murdering land grabbing evil pricks on earth

[@twelvecatsinatrenchcoat]

What a grandiloquent way of saying "and the".

[@JohnWilliams-iw6oq]

I remember being told about the massacre of the Tassie aborigines at school in the mid 60's and we were taught that just one woman, Truganini, had been left and she was taken to one of the Bass Straight islands. If that's true then I would love to know where the thousands (estimates range from 6,000 to 23,000) of Tassie aborigines we have today came from!

[@librandancer]

Yes where did they come from?

[@jonahtwhale1779]

White fellas pretending to be what they are not to get free cash!

[@barryjones4973]

'Sins of the Fathers'---Give it up, virtue signalling woke attention seekers.

[@rogerdee.926]

The Lieutenant-Govenor Authur cartoon is presented in a book, '200 in the Shade' of historical cartoons by David Swain from Collins Publishers Australia.

[@susanfrederick33]

Wihy is it the British are always blamed...what about the French, Dutch that settled other countries...it was done...lets learn from it!!

[@jw-vx8im]

Yes finally a sensible comment. I wonder if Indigenous tribes ever colonise the lands of other tribes

[@peterwebb8732]

@@jw-vx8imInter-tribal wars over hunting land were common enough in pre-Settlement Australia…. And good luck finding a country that doesn’t have local conflicts in its history, anywhere.

[@stevec9972]

Don't mention the Roman empire or Vikings etc. The reparations would be endless. Look at any place on the planet in history

[@Jaishankar_s_supremacy]

Cry in the corner not here under the comment section.

[@davehallett810]

​@@Jaishankar_s_supremacyThe Japanese imperial empire slaughtered millions in Burma the Philippines and Korea, and what the Japanese did in Nanjing China in the 1930s was so horrific it's even been called the forgotten holocaust...... give the British bashing a rest now my friend because it's getting really old and boring now 😔

[@andrewcole4843]

In the Irish case whilst the Empire was not the main cause of famine there was some political culpability in failing to take some mitigation matters - so the Tories outvoted the others to vote down food aid from a big surplus in northern Britain. By the standards of the day clearly a lot of people did understand the consequences but just one more decided not to act. I think our critics might well point out that if the famine had been in East Anglia say then the vote would have been different. I do not think these things were an absolute at the state level even by standards of the time but sometimes better to admit the poor performance issues if the good is to be defended.

[@cctv5348]

Your version of the Irish famine is at odds with the Irish history. Whigs were much worse than the tories. The country was rich in foods just most of it other than spuds was exported. Religious conversion was demanded for food.

[@contraitaly7800]

Exactly. Whigs were the ones responsible for the famine. Trevalyan was a Whig influenced by Malthus theories of overpopulation. A sort of 19th century Klaus Schwaab

[@benjahmon]

What about the current "Iatrogenicide", the "unexplained" excess mortalities recorded around the world?

[@angusmckenzie9622]

@benjamhmonn "What about the current "Iatrogenicide", the "unexplained" exc..." Assuming that you mean the higher infant mortalities and average shorter life of the Australian indigenous, those rates are skewed by figures recorded in the outback, essentially 3rd world living conditions. You can't expect first world results in a third world environment.

[@andhewonders]

On average 9.1 million people die of starvation every year according to the W.H.O, who cares about a couple of million, there are 1000 millions in every billion, and there are 7 billion.

[@dehe82]

​@@angusmckenzie9622I think he's referring to the medical establishment in general, and COVID vaccines in particular...

[@angusmckenzie9622]

@@dehe82 "I think he's referring to the medical estab..." That makes sense although it's moving away from the theme of the video.

[@williamvorkosigan5151]

The British Empire was the greatest net force for good the world has ever seen.

[@luciusesox1luckysox570]

That will annoy so many people but you could well be right. Don't forget many are jealous of the achievements of the British as well.

[@frankie3041]

@@luciusesox1luckysox570 And many have been stirred up by politicians in their home countries, e.g. India, where current or long-existing problems have been blamed on the British, rather than the government’s own incompetence or negligence.

[@ohasis8331]

I recall reading about the British government, knowing full well what might happen to Aust. Aboriginals with free and released whites, had passed laws for their protection.

[@williamvorkosigan5151]

@@ohasis8331 Sorry, I am not quite sure what you are saying. Please rephrase. If it helps. I recall the British poster with an Aboriginal spearing a white farmer, then hanging. Underneath that. The image of a white farmer shooting an aboriginal and then the white farmer hanging. It was the steadying hand of the British Empire that prevented Australian settlers behaving in a similar manner to that of US settlers in their Westward Expansion. Does that help?

[@sandpiper9288]

Big deal

[@wutangclan2051]

Wow.. people forgetting the Romans, Ottomans, Moors, Spanish, Greeks, Vikings, Soviets, Hutus, Qing Dynasty.. etc etc

[@stewartmckay9830]

That was the great British con. It held power without having very much.

[@SS-wysiwyg]

None of the people who comment here will ever experience what the indigenous peoples of now-West countries went through. We can talk all about it, but we'll never ACTUALLY KNOW

[@AviViljoen]

They certainly did in South Africa.

[@phil.s2245]

Lets not just look at the british, lets look at every nation. Lets start with the instigators of the last world wars, the south east asian countries, polynesia, america, rwanda. Etc.

[@venividivici1982]

No no, let's start with the British empire, which Australia, USA, Canada, New Zealand and other Commonwealth countries are part of it. Is it a coincidence that those are the richest countries in the world and the rest are the poorest

[@phil.s2245]

How about equality. What about equality. Hahah

[@cctv5348]

@venividivici1982 there's a good case to be made that native Americans suffered far more from European invasion than Jews in ww2.

[@noweternity3101]

Throughout History Super Powers Over Step Their Mark And Have Behaved Quite Cruelly - South Africa Will Certainly Attest To That With Their Women And Children Left To Starve. But There Has Been Much Good Done As Well By The Powerful Rulers. The Aboriginal Community Is Far From Squeaky Clean And Has Behaved Badly Also. Time To Move On Now - One Australian Nation - A Federation For 122 Years.

[@johnrualmond2176]

As natives We were colonised by 1840, Te Tiriti O Waitangi and Our lands where occupied by Imperial forces and administered under the doctrine of discovery; As recent as 1916, due to paramilitary action, We lost some of Our great grandfathers to government overreach and use of deadly force during an illegal arrest and unlawful invasion war crime incident; the modern authorities have since issued a pardon and said sorry for Our loss; however, Our family have lived with the stigma and reputation as criminals all that time;

[@runawaysailing2032]

Historical maps estimate that the indigenous population of Australia (pre colonial) was 2.5M, however our history books tell us that Australia's population was only 250 to 300 thousand. The british weren't the only ones that were guilty of colonial genocide.

[@venividivici1982]

And that should make you feel better 😢

[@Mat-eq8mk]

Were these historical maps not in history books then?

[@michaelharvest931]

Who else are you referring to then? And I thought the pre estimates were at 750,000 to 1.5million.

[@no-body-22]

Where is everyone getting these numbers from? I understood the numbers to be 300K to 750K. The near or above 1 million becomes very unlikely. Australia had 3.5 million at Federation. How much larger was that?

[@annviolet4727]

If Australia had been populated by a thriving healthy peoples for 60 000 yrs there should have been enough of them to run the English of the land! Do you happen to know what the longevity of the Aboriginal population was at the time of the English arrival?

[@sunilanandatheertha]

Saving the skin by setting or resetting the standards. Saving the skin by showcasing isolated positives and drawing attention away from the large spectrum negatives. Saving the scheme of the skin from changing the Grammer.. My great grand father went through it all first hand.

[@jackwhitehead5233]

😂😂😂

[@mattmcguire1577]

The Empire would have restrained intertribal violence as well.

[@ministeroffice9251]

The British tried just dropping off a wheel and instruction manual first but realised they needed to return and stay for a while to teach people how to read and write 📖 ✍️

[@venividivici1982]

Who gave them the right to do so. If there is no principal, than the history can be repeated, coming in this country from somewhere else, and claiming it your own land

[@jw-vx8im]

​@venividivici1982 it's the history of the entire world. The vast majority of places have been invade or ruled at one time or another by another power. Your attempting to alter history with your woke idealism.

[@cctv5348]

In the Irish famine religious conversion was demanded for food. A million died, a million emigrated.

[@cctv5348]

In India rail workers had less nutrition than concentration camp Jews.

[@cctv5348]

In America letters survive where people were aware they were spreading disease to natives, they documented trying to use this to their advantage.

[@locustsandhoney486]

DEFINE ST EDWARDS CROWN FOR ME

[@gandydancerfilms6272]

I really object to this title. I like Biggar and Anderson. So why this headline?

[@petermizon4344]

MANY TIMES BUT IT WONT BE FOUND, JUST LIKE WHAT HAPPENED TO THE 2000 TROOPS REMOVED BY THATCHER LETTING THE ARGUES IN 2 MONTHS BEFORE

[@mohamedali2858]

The numbers and objectives of the wars of the West and the numbers of killings between them illustrate the inevitability of the exterminations committed in non-Western lands . 1-World War I, and the death toll was seven million people and the wounded were twenty-one million. 2-And World War II, where the number of people was killed at fifty million and ninety million people were wounded, while the war expenses amounted to thirty-seven trillion pounds. 3-America, the leader of the free world, is the one who killed three million four hundred thousand Vietnamese people in order to establish a politically loyal president in the 1960s, and this figure is recognized by Defense Secretary Robert McNamara. AUSTRALIA - Investigations confirm war crimes soldiers have committed in Afghanistan Based on an investigation by Australian authorities, the Australian Army Commander has declared that there is credible evidence of “unlawful killings” committed by soldiers belonging to Australian Special Forces in Afghanistan. At the end Let’s remember Madeleine Albright for who she really was The former US Secretary of State, who once publicly admitted that she thinks the deaths of half a million Iraqi children were ‘worth it’, was no force for ‘democracy and human rights' This is part of a flood, now who can define the massacres & Genocide according to What has been mentioned?!

[@peterwebb8732]

There are records of inter-tribal wars between aboriginal Australians in which the per-capita death rates are equal to those of major participants in WW1. There are similar records of killings in the same order of magnitude in India, Asia, Africa, the Americas and Europe under the Mongols. Don’r kid yourself that this is anything close to a uniquely “western” phenomenon”.

[@robbieelliot9491]

​@@peterwebb8732yes, but we do need to recognise what we in the west are doing in recent history and now. And Australia was part of it and has signed up for more. And we deludedly think we are the good guys and they ate the bad guys. And tyranny is not just a western phenomenon... but when we engage, we sanitise it with words like democracy freedom... when we are doing the exact things that we criticise our "enemies" for...

[@mohamedali2858]

@@peterwebb8732 The spiteful is the one who denies the achievements of the West, and the ignorant of those who do not know how these achievements were formed. Westerners need to stop claiming credit for the West's achievements, while disassociating themselves from its crimes. This only reinforces misplaced loyalty to a civilization that never actually cared about them.

[@user-vj6us1nn9q]

Yes, many times.

[@uditfonseka]

NO

[@anuragsinha2013]

Unless its the french or the Germans the British never thought they did anything wrong.

[@annviolet4727]

It is said that Aboriginal and New Guinea populations have a higher percentage of Denisovan DNA above the proportion in other populations. Did the Denisovans die out peacefully as migrations passed through their homelands?😢

[@beepbeep6861]

And that means what?.

[@annviolet4727]

@@beepbeep6861 Denisovans were first people somewhere, what happened to them?

[@beepbeep6861]

@@annviolet4727 We're all part of man, stop with the theory.

[@peterreay1373]

Premise - is broken by 1789-1803 Pemulwuy wanted agreements but Gov. Philip would not - [to Treaty(s)]. Criminalised by G P then pursued,then shot, beheaded and head sent to Sir Joseph Banks,London.(2nd Lt. W. Dawes was learning Aboriginal language from Patyegrang, refused to enter pursuit of Pemulwuy(innocent)). 1816 - Gov. Macquarie declared war on Aborigines - Appin Massacre and so it continued. No Peace was sort to Treaty(s) - the acts of genocide well documented in Nation(s) of FNP' places of significance. Still today - no justice from Royal Commission into Deaths in Custody. Why? Systematic genocide continues. Bringing them Home Report still not implemented as required-resulting in further removals of children. Many unexplained processes since 1788, which as uncovered paint a deliberate point of ensuring 'terra nullius' was true. Mab Wik rulings make 'terra nullius' void. And still no actions to Treaty(s) to Peace.

[@jw-vx8im]

A treaty is pointless at this point in time as there are not feuding parties to create a treaty. A treaty would be the implementation of a woke thought to appease a group

[@peterreay1373]

@@jw-vx8im All is about Treaty(s) when talking with FNP. It is not for 'white' colonialist constructs of well intentioned settlers to determine how when or what...but rather as Pemulwuy* intended 'agreements' [which W.Dawes understood his language] - towards Peace of intents of British Empire now Australia, to acknowledging 'terra nullius' is void-and has been for 65,000 years (proven by rulings of Highest Court Mabo Wik and supported by UNDRIP(signed by LNP). Treaty(s) have been requested by Nation(s) FNP in past and present - to end wars (of Gov. Macquarie ongoing) and bring peace of Law equal to Lore FNP. Nothing about (woke) all about Justice now and into the future. Surely we want peace. Voice is a distraction, a noise, that Gov Philip created by ignoring FNP call to agreements*.

[@rowdy5697]

Another reason to vote NO.

[@peterreay1373]

@@rowdy5697 No in the context - that its not moving any faster than 235 years dawdling by Gov. Philip and every other Gov. and Parliament Com.Aust Fed Gov. to want to have effective - Self Determination for and by FNP, directly in and on their Nation(s) for Land Language Culture to be restored for intergenerational custodians of their lands of Nation(s). FNP have offered Treaty in past and present but nothing occurs but empty promises. Something William Dawes could understand in translation - for Justice in 1789.

[@annviolet4727]

@@peterreay1373 The Stone Age was superseded in other parts of the World long before the Australian Stone Age due to distance. Fortunately for the Australian Aborigines it was the British who brought advancement to this country.

[@peterkern6101]

They are currently committing demographic suicide but this is a different story...

[@AEMachinas]

DUH.

[@pebblepod30]

Great example of something making ome be percieved as a wise or intelligent person, yet not true.

[@hannovonbahrenfeld5986]

It’s so funny how many excuses the British they make up for their own actions😂

[@guyh9992]

In the end, the British Empire failed during WWII to protect its own people in SE Asia and SW Pacific. The British chose to follow a Europe First rather than an Empire First strategy. Churchill's plan was to leave millions of British subjects under Japanese occupation for several years until Germany was defeated. The Empire lacked the moral authority to survive after the war. Its people saw no value in remaining in an Empire that did not prioritise their defence.

[@peterwebb8732]

Grow up. Britain had a lot of troops in Asia from beginning to end. They did not have either the men or resources to defend everywhere, equally at all times. You talk as though Britain should defend the Dominions,but the Dominions had no responsibility to defend themselves. You may not agree with every choice, but you shouldn’t pretend that Britain should have committed suicide .

[@johndoe1999-zq5di]

“I don’t think it was a genocide. Other old white men agree with me.”

[@davidjames1620]

Professor Nigel Biggar, is the classic teacher holding a white paint brush of innocence! The British Empire offered money for the skulls and bones of natives and indigenous people all over the world, that in itself promoted the doctrine of genocide throughout the British Empire. The number one question that still sits on the table is; where are all the bodies and remains of the natives and indigenous people from all over the world? No mass graves, no signs they even existed on the planet accept through rock paintings, artifacts, and historical records. The large numbers of natives disappeared from the planet without a trace, where did they go? The bishop of Sydney in a report to the House of Commons, stated exactly that,none day large groups of natives were here, over night they disappeared from the planet. The only ones capable of producing that sort of firepower and man power was the military acting under orders from the government and commanders. The British Empire is a Godless Empire, and its people were well known for being bloodthirsty, and would stop at nothing to wipe out innocent natives, to obtain lands and wealth. Two biggest questions on the table; 1/ Where are all the bodies/remains/bones, graves of the once numerous populations of natives that once lived in their lands? 2/ The British Empire government policy was give lands to the military, it's officers, militia and local government officials organising military operations local natives. Those questions will never be answered by Professor Nigel Biggar, because he would have to admit the guilt of the British Empire, rather than using his white paint brush of innocence to cover-up what the British Empire did to millions of innocent people all over the world. Professor Nigel Biggar needs to answer questions like, what happened to all the orphans shipped into Australia, New Zealand, Africa, Canada from the British Empire that vanished without a trace under local military rule. Local government officials and members of parliament are in historical accounts as leading the massacres on native people. But to professor Nigel Biggar, that's not genocide, It's simply death by diseases, and stress to changes brought on by white officials.

[@davehallett810]

The Japanese imperial empire slaughtered millions in Burma the Philippines and Korea, and what the Japanese did in Nanjing China in the 1930s was so horrific it's even been called the forgotten holocaust, so give the British bashing a rest now buddy because it's getting really old and boring 😔

[@wattlebough]

You speak as though it was only the evil white man that practiced colonialism and imperialism. The reality is that the British Empire was only one of the very last and most expansive empires, by virtue of the timing of history to coincide with the Industrial Revolution that began in Manchester. All the many sins of the various Arab empires, the Turkic empires, the Aztec, Champa, Moguls and many other famous empires have been forgiven and forgotten. But the evil white man is the only focus of this discussion. The British sitting in Whitehall in the 16, 17 and 1800s who perpetrated Empire were pompous, hubristic, narcissistic imbeciles. For all of human history empire was just something every racial group with some level of centralised government engaged in. You are not guilty of their sins and neither am I. I will not pay for them and neither should you. The lesson has been learned ad nausium.

[@jackwhitehead5233]

Lame @ss copium for your inferiority. Deal with it.

[@venividivici1982]

And also Australia pays to international human rights organization.a yearly fine for not respecting human rights, amazing isn't it

[@Snowman666]

Genocide is Generally called Genocide! but why? the impact of colonialism offspring took over and created its own unique demands of genocidal system style

[@peterwebb8732]

Try re-writing that in a more coherent style. Then try approaching it from a real and historical viewpoint.

[@lindsaysmith7825]

Still at it

[@charlierondot7509]

Never happened, did it.

[@AviViljoen]

It did. Look up "South Africa" and "India".

[@ianenglish123]

Moral excuses if you ask me. Define genocide as wiping out a culture perhaps comes close to colonial Australians. Yet we continue to hide from the facts, the intent was almost certainty there, many tribes were wiped out.

[@peterwebb8732]

Seems to me that you’re hiding from any fact that doesn’t pain the English as evil monsters.

[@lynufojohns8882]

It is Genocide all over Australia

[@peterwebb8732]

If that’s the case, why are there so many left ?

[@cctv5348]

@@peterwebb8732 genocide does not require complete extermination.

[@peterwebb8732]

@@cctv5348 I didn’t say it did. Try answering the question that I asked, nit the one I didn’t.

[@cctv5348]

@peterwebb8732 there are millions of Jews left after ww2. Genocide doesn't require a complete eradication. According to statista 91.9% are not native, 4.9% not stated and that leaves natives with a 3.2% share of population.

[@peterwebb8732]

@@cctv5348 May I remind you, that that is not the question that I asked. But its merely scratching the surface. Your problem is that there is zero evidence of a “systematic campaign” of extermination. “Genocide” is a term that is thrown around because of its emotional impact, but in this case it is an accusation without support. May I remind you that Australia was a collection of British Colonies. EVERYTHING of an official nature is recorded, so any system, any policy, any government action or regulation is going to be on the public record. If you cannot produce those records, the accused are entitled to the presumption of innocence. No records. No Genocide.

[@misiknuo]

So no genocide..oh British Empire was so nice..as i expected it...

[@stansirlmkhope2312]

Of course yes. Just ask the Irish the Scottish then the English crown corporation went worldwide committing genocide.

[@THEROOTMATTERS]

What are you smoking, Nigel?

[@jamesmorrow1646]

Yes. Next question.

[@buildmotosykletist1987]

Your evidence ???

[@jamesmorrow1646]

@@buildmotosykletist1987 Tasmania.

[@buildmotosykletist1987]

@@jamesmorrow1646 : What about Tasmania ???

[@no-body-22]

Why do you think that?

[@bensjammin8531]

There is strangely large amount of aboriginals, maoris, Native Americans, considering they were all apparently genocided.

[@jasonsmith9968]

Ireland. Everything with Ireland.

[@James-kv6kb]

The guy being interviewed is obviously quite intelligent but he's really bad at presenting what he's saying staring off into the distance as he's trying to come up with exciting ways of explaining his point of view and stamering because he can't just use basic language

[@jw-vx8im]

Wow

[@peterwebb8732]

He’s an academic. How about we focus on substance rather than style. You know…. Like adults?

[@James-kv6kb]

@@peterwebb8732 it shouldn't be one or the other if someone cannot speak in public in a acceptable way they shouldn't be speaking in public. If you can't make eye contact if you haven't rehearsed what you're going to say if you have to keep stopping there is something wrong you're not a very good public speaker I should know I've been doing it a long time

[@mrdobalina3451]

@@James-kv6kbwhere are your digital recordings of you public speaking champ? People have different personalities, especially academics. Listen to what he is saying instead of the way in which he is saying it.

[@handbags4948]

@@James-kv6kb I agree - I've seen him in other interviews and he's just the same - stopping and starting, not making eye-contact and so on. You see it a lot on the internet - they're basically writers not presenters. Just write a script and let someone else do the presenting.

[@kingjae1498]

What do you calling stealing from a people...doing everything in your power to stop them from rising🤔...why did u waste time making this video...yall had nothing better to do?

[@xman933]

What a convenient academic distinction to make in this discussion by two white men obviously of British lineage: while British settlers may have deliberately set out to wipe out some native populations, this genocide was never sanctioned by the good Christian British colonial authorities so that absolves the British Empire of the claims of having committed genocide. In today’s world, that is called plausible deniability. The native peoples who were “genocided” were, of course, too backward, primitive and ignorant to appreciate the subtlety of this distinction. Empire by its very nature is about exercising dominion and control over other peoples without their consent and the cultural and societal destruction that comes from the imperialist imposing their will on the unwilling subjects of their imperial ambitions is genocide. There is nothing subtle about it. The British Empire, as did every empire in human history, committed genocide!

[@jw-vx8im]

Yes they all did but not now. Let's not live in the past I wasn't there then as none of us were

[@jjomalley8986]

Britain, and the rest of Europe wasted many resources at war with each other for religion, land, slaves, riches, just name it, but it was Britain who the Empire torch was passed from Venicians, the Knights Templar and Free Masons and the whole of Europe were very cruel masters of their colonies and the word colony is a bit of a stretch as I see it as conquering another land and exterminating and enslaving the strong until their death. The root of all evil is $$$ is a very old saying, and the banks and merchants played a large part in the many genocides, or whatever you tag it, they financed it, and all the wars too. The same can be said for " all roads lead to Rome " as well, for when the masons aquired the ancient technology of the sacred geometry they were builders and the thousands of Cathedrals built on layline high energy spots in designs of nature adorning them all removed or melted oddly in the late 1800s and early 1900s. Britain reinvented their empire with banks on island former colonies, as " The Spider's Web" documents, and The Greatest Story Never Told " seems to nail the 1900s and WWi and WWII and much of was not known.

[@PeterSSheehy]

Well said. The British, like others at the time, did not go off to far off countries with the intention of only helping those poor hapless people to become civilized. They went there to benefit the British and only the British. If they did not have enough resources it is because they planned it that way. As for today, we are the beneficiaries of that empire.

[@minimannik]

Your Rhetoric is combative and invites violence. Grow up and get over your pitiful insecurities.

[@PercivalC]

I have to say that after reading this comment of yours, what I personally find to be the most convenient here is you mentioning these men's ethnic backgrounds as a point of criticism against them for the views they hold - one of whom is a recognized expert in his field. If these same two men were lambasting and tearing apart British colonial history, you surely wouldn't have cared to mention their ethnic heritages at all. It's not like there's any shortage of politically left white people in the UK or its former colonies who frequently do this, so one is left to wonder why you thought it relevant to mention in relation to these men and their discussion. If you think their ethnicity should instantly disqualify them from being able to hold a discussion like this - that being one which you clearly disagree with - then you're being an unfair and pathetic reductionist. That aside, you are missing Biggar's point entirely - his point being that there was never a sanctioned policy of indigenous extermination, and in fact that we can find examples of the exact opposite policies. What he said about Governors Byron and Holloway in respect to mid-to-late 18th and early 19th century Newfoundland, for example, shows not one but two separate colonial governors ensuring the right to life for the local Beothuk indigenous people, against which settlers would be punished for not respecting. Governor Byron criminalized violence against the Beothuk in the late 1760s, and Governor Holloway reaffirmed this essentially 40 years later while also offering rewards to those who would report such instances of abuse against the Beothuk. These are not the actions of a genocidal power - quite the opposite.

[@venividivici1982]

Is that even a question, the British empire has done more harm in the world more than anyone else in the history,period

[@Paz133]

brought more prosperity you mean

[@no-body-22]

It is a serious question. The harm done by the British empire doesn't seem to be worse than any other empire. In fact it was a better alternative in many cases. Would you not agree that the Mongolian empire, the Assyrian empire, the Spanish empire were worse? If so, your statement appears to be erroneous.

[@venividivici1982]

​@@Paz133what what is worse than a blind person, someone that is not blind but doesn't want to see,shame ok on you, hypocrite, keep believing what makes you feel better, but the truth is harsh and difficult to swallow

[@venividivici1982]

​@@no-body-22doesn't seem to you,of course, what do you know,ask to the people over the centuries that have suffered and still suffer

[@Righteo]

Stop stealing my talking points

[@timandjacquinicklin9596]

The British Empire was the best Empire ever , you wish to speak differently . Remember what happened in places like Tasmania was down to Australians not the British Empire. We lost thousands of Sailors ending slavery whilst you Aussie slaughter aboriginals . Semper viratus Tim

[@alvanrigby6361]

Interesting that Australian Nationalists have a tendency to blame the "British" for what their British ancestors did. Or better still put all the blame on the "English". Irish bigotry par excellence.

[@user-kx7oi9co6w]

Most of the slaughter of Tasmanian Aborigines, and theft of their land, was perpetrated by people born in Britain. Tasmania was first settled in 1803 and the Black War lasted from around 1825-1831, after which only a few hundred Aborigines remained. Tasmania was a penal colony at the time and most convicts, settlers, mariners and administrators were British born men, which limited the natural birth rate.

[@alvanrigby6361]

@@user-kx7oi9co6w But descendants they did have. And from my experience Australians with pioneer heritage are wont to blame Britain and British people for what their ancestors did. And we are not just talking about Tasmania here. You can also add that the propensity to single out the British Empire while mostly ignoring even worse colonial empires such as the Belgians, Germans or Spanish is so obvious that one one must question your motives. Bad mouthing Britain at every turn while ignoring the bleeding obvious faults of others.

[@user-kx7oi9co6w]

@@alvanrigby6361 I agree that more attention should be given to the role that Australian-born white Australians played in the dispossession and persecution of indigenous peoples, as well as the behaviour of other empires and colonial powers (european and non-european) throughout history and prehistory. Britain is in a sense a victim of its own morality, however that doesn't let it off the hook. It just means that we should apply the same standards to everyone, not only the British. The British empire was better than many others, in terms of the institutions it left behind, but still caused immense suffering, including the genocide of Tasmanian Aborigines. As a Tasmanian, I have to live with this bitter-sweet legacy.

[@aussierecharge9083]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_of_Indigenous_Australians