PS5 Firmware Beta 2.0 Tested: M.2 SSD Storage Upgrade vs. PS5 Internal Drive Loading Time Tests!

[@XxMsrSzprzxX]

Its great to see Richard “In The Here And Now” Leadbetter, here and now.

[@LewisHamiltonMSPR]

"Change for the better Hit it then dead her That's my vendetta Richard Leadbetter" - Star67 by Drake.

[@waltzraghu686]

Whenever Richard appears, I just think how 'Bespoke' he is.

[@manuel0578]

Linus used “bespoke” in the steam deck video lol

[@waltzraghu686]

@@manuel0578 But has he used 'in the here and now'? 😏

[@MrSadface]

ＢＥＳＰＯＫＥ

[@faisal_the_man2116]

Done and dusted

[@AbrahamZX1]

Next gen bespokeness

[@KarlRock]

Thanks mate. Looking forward to the next storage video with all the different SSDs tested 👍

[@yogeshkandare3214]

OMG Karl ??? :))

[@slipknotbalushi7135]

@@yogeshkandare3214 🤦🏻‍♂️

[@ca9inec0mic58]

You have an Xbox Series X and now you're getting a PS5? Awesome

[@neosmith166]

Karl, what are you doing on DF channel? Hope your visa issue got resolved.

[@KarlRock]

@@ca9inec0mic58 na, my nephew has a PS5, but I just like to follow all gaming consoles so I can play their exclusives too.

[@ramellmerced8899]

This is great information and I like how the tested the Xbox Series X Seagate SSD in the mix. Richard you did an amazing job nothing but respect.

[@tommoex]

I'm so glad digital foundary does such tests so well and covers near all bases, it's great for consumers.

[@jollama]

*Foundry

[@ALLXDARE]

Now I can download Knack as many times as I can.

[@RidgeRacer]

Knack 500 baby

[@Shukulo]

knack 8k babeeeeey

[@laworder6637]

Knack3 Baabyyyy

[@El_Gallo_De_Oro]

You’re a mad man!

[@David-nd4to]

Knacc attacc

[@soapa4279]

Yes finally been waiting for DF's tests

[@kentgabucan]

Rich made a good point , the external ssd does not have to contend with OS process accesses.

[@ultimate_president]

So true i didnt think about that since now and thats actually really good, will use the m2 space then primarly for games as soon as i get a ssd

[@qwertmom]

Makes sense since a lot of people say PC's should ideally have separate SSD's for Windows OS and actual games for PC. Guess it would apply to the PS5 as well.

[@codean909]

Would really like to see a test with a clean OS install with everything else stored on the added ssd slot vs a ps5 with a full internal storage and also using an added ssd.

[@MarvinConnell]

INDEED & I'm All For spreading load to improve performance & longevity - which is why I HOPE Sony gives the PS5 the ability to AUTOMATICALLY save Capture Data to external HDDs... >.>

[@othman0077]

👍🏻

[@DanXcel]

I'd love to get a comparison video with other drives of similar spends and slower speeds. Great work as always!

[@Joshjames1234]

I've been eagerly waiting for this analysis! Really fascinating results. My suggestions for the next video: 1) Try sustained transfer rates for large files (500+ GB). You could transfer five 100 GB games to see if there is a significant slowdown. I imagine having the heatsink would be most beneficial for this. 2) Please include summary graphs! It is hard to mentally keep track of all the numbers when they run by so fast. Making a simple graph in Excel would help people like me see the big picture, and not get lost in all the numbers. 3) Please test 1 TB and 2 TB drives. There are small spec differences with controllers, etc, so it would be useful to know. 4) Any way to test the temperature of the SSD itself, both with and without a heatsink? Judging from the overall results, there is no universal benefit to having a heatsink, at least in terms of pure transfer/read speeds. I'd be curious though if the temps tell a different story. I would pay extra for a heatsink if it really made a difference for longevity, but I don't want to waste money if the Samsung heatspreader sticker is enough. You guys rock! I'd be curious if the final firmware will make a difference at all.

[@MattMcConnell93]

I have two PS5s and got two 1TB 980 PROs to expand both. I can confirm the initial load up of my 1TB 980 PRO tested in at 5500 MB/s on both systems I upgraded, two different models on two different PS5s.

[@MattMcConnell93]

Also I got a heat sink on Amazon for about $10 on Amazon which fit about the same as the aorus. It should help with longevity over time.

[@KarrasBastomi]

And lower than recommended spec ssd!

[@MiniRunnera7]

DO NOT not use a heatsink, especially if you play for a long time, something will break or burn if you dont lol

[@RoyBrown777]

Who cares? You'll do this once, I only have an interest in game performance.

[@johnmariano4918]

The video I've been waiting for! ❤️

[@mrmagoo-i2l]

Now your PS4 games can load 2 seconds quicker. Fantastic

[@RandomGamingMoments925]

Respect to DF! The amount of times they had to shift apps (and the SSD) back and forth for these tests must have been exhausting.

[@shaundavidssd]

Really?multiple ps5's .............

[@jonteguy]

I think they got multiple PS5s, probably one each. Just a guess though.

[@MrBandaforce]

@@jonteguy Richard mentioned having both disc version and digital version ps5 for extra storage back when there was no patch for external storage

[@khaledm.1476]

@@MrBandaforce yea that sounded super annoying, like he had to get a whole other ps5 so he can enough space to test games

[@m1lkshake766]

As if it's not literally their jobs lol

[@mikemuponda1781]

Looks like the best move is to set the internal ssd as the default install location then when its full copy games over to the m.2 ssd since it’s faster to copy from internal ssd to the m.2.

[@woodiemarv]

Depends on the drive u use

[@Kingtoby1981]

I'm using the 2TB Western Digital SN850 M2 SSD drive and it's faster than the Samsung M2 SSD drive

[@playstationnextgenil491]

@@Kingtoby1981 they are of the same speeds.

[@Kingtoby1981]

@@playstationnextgenil491 I know but it was a little faster after watching and comparing this video with my speed test at home. It doesn't make sense at all and I'm still scratching my head

[@Ayoul]

People are rarely going to be moving around their data that much between both since they are internal anyway. Either could be the default with the other as backup with such marginal differences. I'd say M.2 as default if the person plays lots of back compat.

[@jasonwilliams5046]

Do the same test but with a NVME that doesn’t match PS5 recommended specs, like a 3000mbps card

[@owwmykneecap]

AFAIK, the system test wouldn't allow you to use it. But who knows.

[@wetw0rk14180]

When the PS5 does the read test, cards below spec are rejected. While it would be fun to see how Ratchet would play on a slower SSD, the machine won't allow you to use it.

[@khaledm.1476]

@@wetw0rk14180 I did hear insomniac devs actually tried that and got like 15% slower loading in ratchet and clank, which you know is a tad bit more annoying but I don't know if it's immersion breaking

[@madezra64]

@@khaledm.1476 It breaks the the mechanic though technically. You expect a portal to be instant or near-instant. Adding 15% delay to the already present delay would ruin the effect, illusion, and gimmick. If it was a matter of a load screen it wouldn't be a problem at all and you'd be right, but this would ruin the portal mechanic almost entirely. It would be weird to see such a noticeable lag on visuals. They wouldn't be insync.

[@TheFirstRealChewy]

I wouldn't even both with that test. We only want to know about the SSDs that do work with the system.

[@BlackAesop]

While watching this, my GF says "Everything about his guy's voice sounds boring to me". I replied this is why I love his videos. Pure Information at it's finest. Ty m8!

[@daddyt2837]

Then your gf must have the personality of a door nail

[@Console_Gaming_Vids]

I hope she’s now your ex-girlfriend. You don’t need someone with bad opinions in your life.

[@arithmetic7105]

Get rid of her, she's clearly not worth it

[@HoudiniFontmeister]

She's just wrong for one. His voice is like butter. Further more as you say the information relayed makes it hard to be bored while listening to him. she just doesn't seem to understand what he is talking about thus it is boring. If you need someone to talk fast, Hyped and/or Loud to stay focused and enjoy what they say then there is a good chance that you are just not interested in the source subject. Fortunately none of that matters and she is entitled to feel as she wants.

[@WayStedYou]

Ex GF i hope

[@aj0zzzz]

I appreciate all the work that went into this video. Thanks DF!

[@malventano]

The heatsink vs. no heatsink deltas are almost surely only run to run variance. Thermal throttling is a go / no go thing, and if the drive throttles, you’d see a very large difference in times since performance would fall significantly for several seconds. Also, the Samsung drives have an effective heat spreading copper layer in their labels. The only time you would have risked throttling in that testing would have been when moving games to the drive (power consumption is highest while writing).

[@HueyTheDoctor]

Can't believe it took a year for this to be implemented.

[@Ayoul]

Yeah, I'm not quite sure why there was a delay. It's not like they only support 2021 drives or something.

[@ketchupcatsup753]

And its so simple for everyone to do🤓

[@kthebarbarian8223]

This was likely a strategic wait and see as the market had to catch up. There weren't many choices in the realm of super fast M.2 drives, as even the 980 PRO didn't soft release until January of this year. Many of these drives were supposed to release in early to mid 2020, then got summarily delayed once the pandemic hit. Sony likely didn't want to cause a slew of consumer confusion by having the feature day 1, with barely any drives to take advantage of it. Leading to a bunch of people purchasing drives that are way too slow. Or having the 1 or 2 drives in the market going into hyper-inflation/ a bot buying frenzy. Exactly what is happening with the PS5 right now.

[@Espedals]

I subscribe for Richard's bespoke, pristine quality hand motions.

[@BDreGameplay]

Been waiting for this! Even though I personally don't need more storage on my PS5, I am enjoying watching the coverage of the new SSD slot

[@255bb6]

Though speed between with and without heatsink is insignificant, it is still required. Someone on Reddit tested 980 pro too, a heatsink reduced temperature 20 Celsius (from 74 to 50). I hope you test temperature as well.

[@shakengandulf]

Have a link, love to read this..? No biggy if not.

[@chrisb1047]

74 to 50 is definitely not possible. Either they screwed up their experiment or they recorded incorrect/erroneous results.

[@tinhoyhu]

Were they using a thermocouple or IR thermometer? Shininess of materials may affect accuracy when going with IR.

[@255bb6]

@@tinhoyhu In that thread, he used an infrared thermometer.

[@karnliberated8891]

Samsung Magician doesn't even warn you until it gets to like 82c. Anandtech had a whole breakdown of temps with their review

[@ShadowHolder748]

I imagine the heatsink is more for hardware longevity rather than speed (although as said in the video it does seem that it may actually make a small difference to performance).

[@griffgames9538]

The expansion slot leverages the full internal IO subsystems like the stock drive. Without that, you wouldn't see these speeds in native PS5 titles. Down the road when DirectStorage becomes more mainstream and game supported on PC, you'll see the same advantage using a superfast SSD with or without DirectStorage in play.

[@jamescorey3516]

They do want to cut the time by having the GPU directly accessing the SSD rather than going GPU then CPU then RAM then SSD to then back to the CPU, then back to the GPU. Yeah, there are huge advantages here with the PS5 being an APU and accessing directly the SSD. Some PC fanboys said there wouldn't be a difference but there certainly is now they want it too.

[@untamedronin8339]

I'm excited for DirectStorage. Finally something that'll put my Sabrent Rocket 4 through its paces in games.

[@paul1979uk2000]

@@jamescorey3516 There's always a difference and it's mostly because Microsoft didn't come up with something like Direct Storage a long time ago when considering M2 drives have been out for years but to be fair, games have not really needed that until now, hence why SSD and M2 drives perform about the same with games even thought a PCI Express 3.0 drive is about 7 times faster than a SSD drive, PCI Express 4.0 is even faster. What I do find strange on the PC is why is it just games that don't take advantage of M2 drives when pretty much everything else does on the PC, this was never a problem with games when PC gamers went from mechanical drives to SSD drives, the performance on everything including games was instant.

[@fredsas12]

@@paul1979uk2000 The reason they perform the same is because games DO NOT rely on sequential (i.e: the 7000MB/ps) speeds. They rely on the random access speeds to load data in game. If you stuck a SATA speed class M2 drive in there, it would perform pretty much the same. Where sequential speeds matter is on the inital install. When one is copying games from the install program over to the drive.

[@glenmcl]

Keep waiting

[@DragonDoFogo]

Nice to know that there're some SSDs that function atm. Don't need to upgrade right now but sounds promising for the future.

[@Dr.WhetFarts]

Yeah when those cheap bulk SSD will start dying people will have to replace their drive. Thats the problem with SSDs when you go cheap as possible. Longevity.

[@benjaminlabrie6982]

This makes me so excited for the future of this console... being given a bare minimum to essentially be limited by bandwidth of pcie x4 is wild... Awesome video!

[@Trevorischillin]

Console gaming is in such a great place whether you are on ps5 or xbox, so excited to see where it goes..

[@David-ln8qh]

except the buying it part

[@spyro440]

I wonder if you really are supposed to re-attach the cover after the SSD was installed? This way, the headsink isn't exposed to the airflow? Wish you had checked the temps as well.

[@nowonmetube]

Or you have to because dust? I guess the PS5 manual should tell about it.

[@randypender2867]

It creates a negative air pressure thus aiding in the cooling

[@pesfreak18]

Finally it´s possible to extend the storage with highspeed solutions. I have some room left on the internal storage but options are always great and the game library get´s bigger and bigger over time. Now I wait for prices to come down.

[@Black-lw8nd]

the music at the beginning of the video reminds me of the old songs used in comparisons of games from different consoles

[@PCAgentSi]

Thanks for the tests! Will try the SN850 once 2.0 is out

[@ScrapKing73]

No question, being able to put in drives of any size is an advantage for PS5. But I prefer the hot-swapping ability of the Xbox Series expansion option vs. 10 minutes to swap drives from one system to another. The fact that it’s plugged in externally should be a heat-dissipation advantage too. Hot-swapping won’t matter at all to some people, but will matter hugely to others (such as people with an Xbox in the living room and the bedroom).

[@Ayoul]

I agree. Both methods have their advantages and disadvantages for sure, but I just don't see the average gamer being comfortable getting the right kind of drive that already are pretty expensive, need a heatsink (they probably don't even know what that means) and then opening up their PS5's. Average Xbox gamer can just go to a Gamestop and buy the dongle and plug it in. Like I know the common counter argument to this is that changing the SSD is basically child's play for them (especially PC builders), but it really isn't for most people.

[@ScrapKing73]

@@Ayoul Agreed. I don't think this is necessarily beyond most people's ability. I do think it is beyond many people's *perceptions* of their ability. And also beyond their desire to do so. They'd be more likely to be PC gamers if they were comfortable with disassembling their systems, even if it's an easy disassembly. :)

[@paracuja]

Got my Mark Cerny WD-Black SN 850 1TB today ... for 155€ a pretty good price also (+20€ for a 3rd party Heatsink) 😍 unfortunately i have to wait for my beta access or for the final release of the SSD support 🤣 but prices already go sky high and most of ssds are already sold out 🤓

[@nikolavonfulton5195]

Oh absolutely got a 2 tb western digital with heat sink and it is already backordered for 3-4 weeks. I wanted to get a drive before the dumb scalpers buy them up like crazy and sell them for obnoxious prices on eBay like they like to do.

[@paracuja]

@@nikolavonfulton5195 nice 😃🙏 they also have ridiculous prices for the 1TB version with heatsink ... without its like 160€ on amazon and with heatsink it was 320€ 🤣 same with 2TB version... they are so clever 😏

[@paracuja]

@@thehoonta5312 980 is also pretty nice 😏👌

[@AntiTako]

I got the 2tb version with the heatsink. Also, my PS5 is already running the beta version and my SSD is arriving Monday.

[@silentkb]

Exact same combo as what I bought. I got the update yesterday and it works flawlessly. read speed of 6559mbs.

[@mr.h5566]

Would love a second video with the sn850 and maybe talking about heat problems, throtteling and the question of leaving the flap of the m.2 open or not (airflow problems...?!?).

[@gameingworldusa2604]

Oh my god thank you I’m not the only one having problems with the 980 I seriously thought I was the only one but I guess a lot of people are having problems with it and other drives to thank you so much I’m glad I was reading the comments

[@shadowskill111]

Cool, cool. Saw the video this morning and Amazon delivered my Samsung 980 Pro drive this afternoon and the heat sink comes in tomorrow. :) Im glad the console drive tech caught up to PC. My current main gaming PC has two Western Digital Black SN850 drives which are almost copy and paste spec as the Samsung 980 Pro's.

[@XiLock_Alotx]

I’m hoping to see the Firecuda 530 M.2 NVME Gen4 detailed soon. Proclaims to be the fastest read/write speeds of any m.2 Gen4 drives to date

[@JeanSamyr]

It’s good to see the flexibility and the freedom to choose any SSD vendor and capacity that you like, Sony knows how the proprietary expansion hurts the reputation of a system like they did on Vita with pretty expensive cards on a era of MicroSDs

[@mostmost1]

Good move by Sony because people don't trust them with storage cards.

[@x-coin0420]

You people never pay attention xbox has already confirmed cheaper 3rd party expansion cards will come too so xbox did It better still.

[@offspringfan89]

Too bad Microsoft didn't learn with Sony's mistake on PS Vita cards, what were they thinking?

[@x-coin0420]

@@offspringfan89 read my comment above yours.

[@JeanSamyr]

@@x-coin0420 the Seagate is actually a third party, it’s not made by MS, but they have to pay a tax to MS to make a compatible drive with the MS connector. The PS5 use standard M.2 compatible with PCs, so the drive is multi propose, you can buy for PS5 and in the future if you want use on PC. The MS approach is like Apple with the MFI

[@joshuab1707]

Thanks for the video! I am 2 years late to upgrading my PS5, however now that I am sharing the storage space with 2 other people, I've been in need of an upgrade. I was always under the assumption that we'd REPLACE the internal drive. So great that it is instead a separate storage slot on its own which can be used in addition to the internal storage. Guess I won't have to opt for the 2TB drive after all. For anyone who is watching this now as well, Amazon has the 980 Pro, with a heatsink, for pretty cheap. About $80 and no more expensive than the version without a heatsink.

[@dirtnapstor6884]

I’ve watched several videos regarding this topic… but I’ve been waiting for DF’s run through specifically before I move forward 👍

[@stevegomez232]

I bought the 1TB WD 850 NVME myself. Specs are pretty much the same as the Samsung and I've seen it used by another KZbinr testing out the beta. I'm happy with my choice.

[@ryanbarrett96]

Missed opportunity with 1st party game loading times. Spiderman: MM absolutely should have been included here as it has some of the fastest loading times of any ps5 game.

[@MrHabushi]

Agreed. Really not interested in PS4 game load times, it was already established that they don't greatly benefit from being on the system SSD vs an external USB one so not sure what was expected here?

[@Driftwood420]

Meh that's probably because there's not much of a game to load. Not very interesting tbh

[@Ayoul]

@@MrHabushi I think you got that all mixed up. The reason why they might not have looked at Miles Morales is because it wouldn't make an interesting difference. It's already only a few seconds with older games. Why would they look at Miles Morales if the difference is possibly less than a tenth of a second on a game that loads this fast. Also, it's not because we already know something that it's not worth testing. We knew going in that newer and faster SSD's would fare better in most cases. It's literally the same tech, plugged in the same way on the MB. But the exact difference is what they wanted to look at and if perhaps there would be an unexpected result (like BFV).

[@Driftwood420]

@CJ P. You for real? The game's like 5 hours long 😂

[@Driftwood420]

@CJ P. The amount of content could have an affect sure. Either way it's uninteresting to test

[@stephenbak6154]

I would love too see the Seagate Firecuda 530, Aorua Gen4 7000s and as previously stated WD SN850.

[@jonteguy]

I honestly think it's amazing that Sony decided to allow non-proprietary SSDs. Not a greedy call at all. They will probably benefit from this in the long run and they know it, obviously. Still, it doesn't come off as greedy because they are taking a risk and chance this way.

[@Shadowespeon17]

I mean, financially, Sony gains nothing from third party SSDs so there's nothing greedy about it

[@thelarry383]

They've gone the non-proprietary route since PS3 which used just a normal 2.5 inch HDD.

[@mrrglass3407]

Xbox is going to offer more SSD companies solutions to the Xbox series.... With varying sizes.

[@Sparatan18608]

I don't think Microsoft was coming off greedy for their solution. I think they just want it easier for the average consumer. Plug and play as they say

[@syed2694]

They've learned their lesson from the PS VITA lol.

[@SICresinwrks]

How did i never know about this channel until now?!? Got a new sub here

[@LoverOfTech]

Amazing work from the team here

[@TDamsma]

980 pro (500GB) is freaking sci fi. I bought it at a discount €85 + be quiet MC1 heatsink €15. Perfect combination and fits in the PS5, read speeds tested at 6700MB/s.

[@housespecial7855]

I bought the 1tb with heatsink, am only getting read speed of 5670, and looking on other videos, people are saying similar 🤔

[@TDamsma]

@@housespecial7855 yeah depends on the size of your drive, the smaller ones (250-500GB) tend to show faster speeds. Don't think about it. It's just a check from Sony, look it up.

[@housespecial7855]

@@TDamsma just a check?

[@TDamsma]

@@housespecial7855 jep look it up, If you put the 980 pro in a pc it would be much faster. Don't worry. The drive is faster than 5600MB/s. Go KZbin similar videos about this particular situation. But I wouldn't worry, because it exceeds the minimum read speeds. Go have fun and enjoy the extra space.

[@ColeDedhand]

My takeaway from this is that the native PS5 SSD is not optimized for write speeds. Which explains why Sony doesn't spec write performance for compatible M.2 drives.

[@stephensiemonsma]

Or that Digital Foundry shouldn't have ran write tests on a nearly full drive. Their testing methodology for this part was terrible. Lack of SLC caching can fully explain the result.

[@Soremwar]

When you consider that most of the time you are gonna be downloading or copying from game discs where the read speed is the limitation, it makes sense

[@devilmikey00]

Which isn't really surprising. Consumer SSD's might get used in some write intensive workloads, the PS5 is only playing games. Read speeds are all that really matter in that environment.

[@romanhrytskiv8845]

I think they’ve consciously made write speeds that slow because this doesn’t matter when you play the game and because they can cut the manufacturing price because of that (i guess), still a pity.

[@tigerdefensesystems]

@@romanhrytskiv8845 any HDD or SSD drive will slow down its write speeds significantly the fuller it gets, so when you start to fill that expansion NVME same deal.

[@BlacklistBill]

Thanks for the great video. It looks like Sony team really optimized reads on the internal ssd and was less aggressive on the writes (makes sense for limited-bandwidth requirements for game installs). Interesting results on battlefield as well, I wonder if it uses higher or lower numbers of small files vs the other tested games

[@Ayoul]

Nothing to do with optimization. It's just cheaper for Sony to have a slower writing SSD.

[@BlacklistBill]

@@Ayoul That's incorrect. SSD performance has more to do with the controller hardware/firmware connected to the NAND flash with the flash memory chosen as complementary to that controller (ie you would not put a porsche engine in a hyundai accent body). This is especially true for the PS5 since Sony developed their own SSD controller hardware/firmware rather than using something off the shelf meaning that if the write performance is slower, it was by Sony's design. If they really wanted to save money they could have purchased the fastest flash memory in the world alongside the fastest controller available instead of developing their own control hardware. Doing that was very expensive for Sony.

[@johnhansen04]

Richards video profiles keep getting flatter and flatter. :D

[@雪鷹魚英語培訓的領航]

That Ratchet & Clank frame hitch test was a clever experiment.

[@AndyGilleand]

Adding a heatsink isn't about performance. It's about making sure it doesn't overheat.

[@bluedestiny88]

Wonder if that’s the reason why it took so long for internal storage expansion options to come along - they were hoping they might be able to make it work without a heat sink first

[@AndyGilleand]

@@bluedestiny88 Well maybe they shouldn't have enclosed it the way they did then lol. I was always worried about the airflow over the M2 slot when they showed the teardown.

[@beardymcbeardface69]

NVMe drive controllers, like many CPU's and other high performance semiconductors, throttle their performance with clock throttling, based on operating temperature thresholds. They do this to avoid overheating. A heatsink equiped NVMe drive, will allow sustained reads and writes for much longer before performance throttling kicks in, versus an NVMe drive which does not have a heatsink. You can find info about the various levels of heat threshold throttling in the manuals of some NVMe drives. My Firecuda is an example. With a heatsink, a drive can operate at max performance for longer, during sustained reads and writes, than the same drive without a heatsink. In the short term a heatsink provides greater performance and in the longer term a heatsink provides greater lifetime.

[@GamesplayChris42]

I was very surprised Sony went with standard off-the-shelf M.2 drives, traditionally Sony has always tried to come up with their own format for storage in their electronics. Whether it was Betamax, Minidisc, MemoryStick, or UMDs they always tried to get that extra nickel out of the consumer so this was a pleasant surprise.

[@akkibajaj705]

Msft on the other hand tho 😬

[@jaydee2847]

PlayStation home consoles have supported standard storage options since PS2

[@chibicascade]

Well, PS2, PS3, and PS4 all used standard hard drives. Psp works with microSD if you get an adapter to make it for the slot.

[@wixxzblu]

its not really that surprising for Sony's mainline consoles. The PS2 have a 3.5" hard drive bay, while PS3 and PS4 have a 2.5" bay. The PS2/PS3 playing your favorite DVD/Blu-ray when other dedicated dvd/blu-ray drives where more than the console itself is not really in line with "getting that extra nickel out of consumers" as you are saying.

[@zan8117]

You can put any 2.5HDD into a PS3/PS4 even PS2 had a HDD expansion bay for games like FF11 but can also mod a PS2 and run games of it.. They used their proprietary storage for PSP and Vita which was a terrible idea when more people are buying digital games and they're charging people $100 for a 32GB SD card. Also of course Memory Card which ironically they stopped doing because Xbox had an Internal HDD.

[@tulegaming415]

I'm waiting for black Friday to get a good price for an SSD.

[@ShadiFagihi]

Same 😂

[@ayovenom9906]

The 500gb is only 107 and the 250gb is 57

[@Mr_Battlefield]

You better be quick cuz I'm sure they'll sell out like hotcakes

[@T1tusCr0w]

👀 you thirsty fools stay away from my bargains you hear 🤣⚰️💪🏻

[@shivmom7903]

I have 2tb this last black Friday ya

[@fractallusion7121]

Digital Foundry proving again they are the best in their respective field. Great video! Just picked up a 2TB Samsung 980 Pro on Black Friday 🙌

[@hiawa23]

Awesome vid. I am using the 2TB WD SN850. Love it..

[@Ruhul612]

I’m so glad Digital Foundry exists

[@hattorihanzo1329]

Note: the Samsung SSD 980 Pro Gen4 500GB version has 5GB write speed vs the WD_Black SN850 500GB Gen4 has 4GB wite speed. Only from the 1TB version you get 5GB write speed. So if you are going for 500GB SSD, then it would be better to go for the Samsung

[@dannyruiz3820]

Thanks that's good info

[@Vegemeister1]

Why would you care about write speed, though? The only thing it affects (moving games from the built-in SSD) is a rare use-case.

[@AntiTako]

@@Vegemeister1 updates, installing games, transferring games...

[@Lead_Foot]

@@AntiTako You somehow got a 50Gbe port and internet connection? Or did this suddenly get a USB4 with pcie pass through?

[@ElGrueso]

@@Vegemeister1 I recommend you to read about SSD to see why the constant write speed is so important. Beside Samsung SSD is always recommended because of the best reliability.

[@rmo9808]

I'm curious to see why there was such a big difference in speeds between the 980 pro 500GB here and the 980 pro 1 TB that was on Spawn Wave.

[@AlejandroLZuvic]

Different SKUs some times have 1) different controllers that are simply faster 2) different block sizes in the formatting which result in the controller being able to “grab more data” addressing the same number of blocks or clusters. Usually the difference is pretty small and it only happens during big linear reads, I don’t know how big is the difference you saw.

[@rmo9808]

@@AlejandroLZuvic Digital Foundry had a speed around 6500 MB/s and Spawn Wave had one closer to 5500 MB/s

[@lesserlogic9977]

How convenient you tested the exact drive I have! thank you!

[@xyoxus]

Great and very in-depth tests and comparisons. A explanation why transferring to the internal SSD of the PS5 might be slower because that's also where the system is running from? Don't have a PS5 and don't know much about it, but it's an idea that came up when seeing the video.

[@stevenross-watt8640]

I wish there were enough ps5 games for me to want a storage upgrade. I plated Demons Souls and Returnal and now I'm stuck with no more I want to play.

[@carpetfluff35]

Lucky you, between PS5 stuff and PS4 games I've been revisiting with PS5 benefits I've had to constantly shuffle and delete games.

[@GrimDrive]

@@carpetfluff35 Yes dude! It’s been so annoying to constantly delete and redownload apps, because I have ADHD and it’s really difficult for me to stay interested in one game for a long period of time sometimes.

[@narutoblockhead3]

Honestly that’s just what happens when you’re an early adopter of any new console. I have those same 3 games and now I’ve been playing older PS4 games until the new games are here.

[@greendayfreakrct]

I'm one of the lucky I guess that skipped alot of ps4 games. Nioh collection On ps5, and Ghost of Sushi are going to keep me busy for awhile. And FF14.

[@NEEDFORSLEEP213]

I haven’t played any ps since ps2 I switched from Xbox sucks for you tho

[@JFinns]

When an SSD literally 1/2 the price of the entire PS5 DE console beats its load time by 2 seconds :D

[@AlejandroLZuvic]

To be fair, the Microsoft solution isn't cheaper (in fact it's a bit more expensive). It's what happens when you introduce new technology.

[@WutipongWongsakuldej]

It feels a bit weird to call M.2 SSD "external" as you'd have to go so far to install it (and it rest inside the PS5 chassis).

[@WahyuSetiawan-sz4lc]

Lol, ikr

[@bluesrike]

I think it should be called "secondary" storage or something.

[@justinmckenzie3318]

Thanks for both the info and hard work with the tests so we don't have to look else where. Keep up the good work.

[@adiptakabir2382]

Awesome Explanation, on point discussion. You guys deserve at least 5M subscribers 💖💖💖

[@matthewmcewen1]

I'm guessing the M.2 -> internal ssd transfer is slow because the console is verifying the data, due to the fact that the drive is potentially modifiable by a PC. Thoughts?

[@ckianak]

That's a good point

[@stephensiemonsma]

The PS5 drive was also nearly full, limiting its ability to transfer using an SLC cache. Terrible methodology, honestly.

[@f-22raptor25]

the seq. writes is much lower for the internal ssd, which is expected as its not a pro level ssd.

[@SentinelBorg]

Nah, that is simply a result of the internal SSD being rather bad in terms of write speeds, which doesn't come as a surprise. A 980 Pro is made for creators that write a lot in comparison.

[@imo098765]

The write speed would be slower than read speed. You dont need amazing write speed unless you are doing massive data transfer often. You not downloading a GB/s so why would you need that fast write speed. but the 980 PRO is designed as it name says for a professional work load that requires the moving of data on and off it. Assume someone that does 4K video editing and uses that drive daily

[@ajdaniel8128]

Just looking at the price of these SSDs just proves how cheap the PS5 actually is when compared to machines with similar parts. 399.99 is a steal for this gaming system. Easily the best deal so far plus you can play the best exclusive games on earth

[@mjc0961]

$499.99 Also, what exclusive games? All of those games are on PS4 or PS3 as well, except Ratchet and Clank, which is still just another Ratchet and Clank game of which you can find loads on PS3 and PS4.

[@ajdaniel8128]

@@mjc0961 you should consider doing some research before you post comments. It's 399.99 (PS5 starting price). Also, you forgot to add Returnal and Demon Souls along with Rachet & Clank rift Apart and also, 30fps is a joke so your PS4 comment is irrelevant. That system released 8 years ago

[@ajdaniel8128]

@Transistor Jump Thats why they have multiple AAA studios working on multiple titles at the same time split across different teams. It's only been 9 months since PS5 and already has 4 AAA Exclusives released. If you count indie exclusives, then the number would be even more

[@ajdaniel8128]

@@ericl6460 Me too

[@Tekeysix]

@@ericl6460 I bet he plays forza with a mouse and keyboard too, just the thought of it gives me the shivers.

[@PAPO1990]

would be interested to see the Ratchet & Clank testing compared with and without heatsync. It seems like it should be the most intense workload we could give storage at the moment to see how much we REALLY need that heatsync.

[@siszi6]

thanks so much for this vid, cant wait to add my WDsn850 to my ps5 soon

[@DJCRYg]

I believe it to be a great choice. 3rd party options for capacity upgrade. Let us not forget what happened with the PSP's memory cards. Thanks for this detail review as always. Much appreciated.

[@vintatsh]

I wonder if the heatsink required is a preemptive measure to when the SSDs might be used much more heavily for streaming. I remember Cerny talking about streaming in all the assets in the viewport in real-time. Maybe a future technique for the PS5 VR headset?

[@nitinanku]

If rumours are to be believed then the PS5 will use eye tracking to know what to render in at a higher resolution. I assume that would need the ssd to be very fast and be used pretty heavily for that

[@photonboy999]

Copying data to the SSD (i.e. a game) is likely far more intensive than streaming textures. The SSD temperature also depends on many factors including ambient air temperature. You might not use one and be fine. You might use one and have the SSD throttling down so you'd never know (unless a game needed it to run full speed so you got stutters).

[@Steve-ph7qn]

It’s mostly because of the enclosed and unventilated design for the m2 SSD. It’s basically gonna have no way of exhausting heat in there otherwise.

[@One21P]

SSD performance with the heatsink last longer. The longer you game without a heatsink is when you get speed throttle.

[@jamezxh]

@@One21P hah what a load of crap 💩

[@FFFan3445]

I've had a 1TB 7000MB/s NVME on standby, just waiting to get either beta access or a public firmware release. My 2TB XSX storage is totally sufficient, paired with an external, but the 667GB in my PS5 feels totally anemic.

[@2drealms196]

They had to hit a mass market pricepoint. Not everyone has alot of money to spend on videogaming hobbies.

[@maniacmcmuffin5025]

@@2drealms196 Xbox hit that same price point with more storage and a better GPU so what’s your point? All whilst running cooler and quieter.

[@Zenzuu]

@@maniacmcmuffin5025 you're forgetting the fact Microsoft is a much larger & richer company than Sony. They can afford to take the hit with pricing while spending more on faster hardware. Sony doesn't as much money to burn like them.

[@jonteguy]

​@@maniacmcmuffin5025 Storage is cheap, not really a great argument and Xbox expansion card is propritery which is a awful thing. GPU though, is faster but they are not that far off, not to the point where a price difference would be a thing. You see different 3090s at different price points as well so what is *your* point? It's the same card right? PS5 has MUCH better audio tech than the Xbox, that is not to scoff at. So I think the similar prices really are justified along with the faster SSD PS5 has, although beit not by much. Budget is just used slightly different for the machines. The machines literally cost about the same to make.

[@FFFan3445]

@@maniacmcmuffin5025 Yeah, the XSX is my favored hardware this time around. First generation I haven't preferred the PS console to the Xbox, though I'm primarily a PC guy. XSX's SSD on-paper is less than half as fast as the PS5's, but in most cases the PS5 loads games like half a second faster, and in some cases like Cyberpunk 2077 and Monster Hunter World, the XSX loads faster. So yeah, the PS5 does not get the win in this area, I prefer the XSX's internal storage.

[@TrevKen]

"Upgrading a PC is complicated compared to consoles"

[@JayzBeerz]

Make sure and update the firmware on the 980 Pro before putting it in the PS5 to get the 6500 read speed.

[@wardencobb7442]

Nobody else does it as well as Digital Foundry. Great vid.

[@xwingpilot33]

Excellent breakdown! Still interested in seeing more comparisons on made-for-PS5 titles such as Demons Souls and Returnal. Loading times are nearly absent in those titles because of how much they lean on the PS5 storage tech. Also while Microsoft’s solution is plug and play, I think the proprietary drive solution will be a bottleneck for allowing games to have the incredibly seamless experience offered on those select PS5 titles. Obviously Sony did their legwork before making this feature official, recommending only the fastest of M.2 drives and even pushing for a heatsink. The PS5 is the only system that these drives will be so stressed to perform. Love this console!

[@Alex_Logan22]

Returnal would be tough to test since it’s always loading/streaming in different assets. Overall I would assume Demon Souls and others would perform as good if not better since Ratchet is easily the most intense till we get other games like The Medium.

[@bertoyoung3876]

Lol it's a 1080p game the ps5 is loading it's not loading 4k textures I haven't seen a ps5 game thts 4k or 60

[@markblow1966]

The 500gb write speed is slower than either the the 1TB or 2 TB version.

[@Mr_Battlefield]

I was wondering why they didn't pick up the 1 TB or the 2 TB version. 🤦🏼‍♂️ If I was going to buy the Samsung it would have been the 2 TB version. I end up picking up the two terabyte Western Digital myself with the built-in heat sink. I purchased it directly from Western Digital. I'll be receiving it on Monday and I do have the beta

[@Steve-ph7qn]

@@Mr_Battlefield save money🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤦‍♀️🤦

[@Tr3ndZ3r0]

@@Mr_Battlefield Or the Fire Cuda 530. That would be the fastest out right now with read and write speeds. I would expect DF would inform viewers about these impacts to performance

[@AngryApple]

Writes are quite useless for games

[@manuel0578]

The 500 GB 980 Pro is likely slower than the bigger ones

[@CivilianCheesy]

Larger drives are usually slower due to having more locations to search for data in. It's less of a gap with SSDs than HDDs but it's still a common issue and is why most marketing will say 'up to X speed' when advertising drives.

[@j3001m]

You be right about the 500 being slower and the 2nd post is very wrong, the bigger the ssd in most cases will means it’s faster as it’s got more ram and more ssd chips to run faster, just to add if It’s one sided you find it’s faster I.e. the 2tb wd850 will be faster than the 1tb

[@flAMe9610]

@@CivilianCheesy The bigger the SSD the faster it is. This should be common knowledge.

[@flimermithrandir]

You forgot to mention the crucial Info you are referring to (at least i think thats what you wanted). The Write Speeds on 500GB and below M.2 NVME SSDs are lower. Read Speeds are the Same on higher sized SSDs.

[@plivajucipauk7742]

@@CivilianCheesy Lol, you got everything backwards.

[@drunksquirrel2051]

Just installed my 2tb WD Sn850 Black with blue 3rd party heatsink, looks awesome

[@dezfoto7534]

Thanks Richard! I'm using the same drive, haven't had any issues at all and I was able to get the 500GB version for $119 on Amazon.

[@stephendonovan5056]

Will you guys be trying other SSD’s? I’m Curious how Cerny has picked his own brand… I feel like I should buy the WD one because he’s plugged it. It’d be good to see you guys put them against each other - but I appreciate that’d be a lot of work. Keep up the good work.

[@unnoticedhero1]

Honestly the 980 pro and WD SN850 are very similar drives in terms of performance, I think one's got slightly faster read speeds and the other has slightly faster write speeds but they're fairly equivalent, I got a 980 pro for my new build with a Ryzen 5800x and I love it but I know WD Black is a great brand as my 7500rpm 2tb HDD is a WD black and I've had it since 2015 with no issues.

[@WayStedYou]

980 pro wd 850 or firecuda 530 are the top 3 I would go for

[@stephendonovan5056]

@@WayStedYou yeah... I've watched a few now that puts them near the top. In all honesty, I am happy to wait as I'm not desperate right now. I can happily manage storage without making tough choices.

[@fela280]

Very nice video, many thanks for sharing these analyses! Would love to see, how the firecuda 530 will perform, since its specs are very promising, which is particularly true for the 2/4TB versions. Optionally, would also love to learn, which heatsinks are most suitable.

[@RustyRoj]

Given how well the Samsung performed you might find there’s a case of diminishing returns on the extra performance from the Firecuda drive. If the Segate cost more you might just be throwing money away. That said we need to see tests first though to confirm this other wise it’s just me speculating. Personally I’m inclined to get whatever Mark Cerny is using since he obviously knows the system better than anyone. Also since it’s been in the market longer so the WD black might be easier to find on sale.

[@FelipeCh]

Cant wait for this to drop in price

[@randydoan5173]

Thank you for the thoughtful video. Now to make up my mind on which size I want.

[@marcopetaccia88]

Great technical video, as always. Covers everything!

[@steveozone4910]

When your storage costs more than your console 🤣

[@ot9523]

Xbox series x has a better ssd it’s £170 on sale right now lol

[@jyotiwaghmare4100]

@@ot9523 better?

[@jyotiwaghmare4100]

@@ot9523 14:40

[@RawWrath]

@@ot9523 the ssds for PS5 are all better than Xbox's and more affordable the read and write speeds are almost double

[@jyotiwaghmare4100]

@@ot9523 so are the ssds caonpatible with ps5

[@charliehustle2591]

Good to see these SSD’s working well. So Sony’s factory internal is really just a Gen 4 SSD as far as performance goes. Nothing really unique, if not even a bit slower than aftermarket depending. I have the beta and was really looking at the 980 Pro. Looks like it may be my choice.

[@Gmzshortys]

Lmao you're that stupid to Believe a $500 console would have a unique SSD 🤡🤡🤡🤡

[@superderpyderps]

Based on the storage tests they ran, it looks like it has roughly the read profile of a 980 Pro (which is quite good, that's one of the faster consumer drives out there), but with the downside that the write speeds are pretty abysmal. On the upside, that's how you'd typically want to balance a gaming drive, since you aren't writing to it as much and it's still fast enough to keep up with a gigabit connection assuming you could even saturate a gigabit connection for game downloads. But yeah, it's "custom" but nothing particularly special compared to contemporary drives that came out alongside the system.

[@Your_Paramour]

@@superderpyderps I'd be very surprised if the write speeds are actually as bad as it appears in the video. The ps5 has a 12 channel controller compared to the 8 channel on all high end aftermarket drives. There is probably some software problem that is slowing the m2 > ps5 transfer.

[@charliehustle2591]

@@Gmzshortys no, but a lot of people were based on Mark Cerny himself saying as much. I’ve always suspected it was just another SSD. Are you always an insulting dickhead?

[@tombexhill]

I'm here faster than the m.2

[@lfcobrikom5612]

I'll like to install you in my ps5 😂

[@NEEDFORSLEEP213]

@@lfcobrikom5612 was that supposed to be funny

[@HazyJ28]

I felt so fucking cool last year when I finally got a 970 EVO PLUS. I thought wow- A drive capable of 3,000 megabytes a second read and write, running on PCIe GEN3 x 4 LANES. Storage will never get any faster than this. In 1 year's time, Samsung has doubled that speed thanks to the new PCIe GEN4 x 16 LANES standard. So fascinating.

[@SimonBuchanNz]

Until devs get load times down to at worst 10s, the transfer speed isn't likely to be the limitation (even gen 3 speeds at that time you've probably filled up VRAM a couple times!). There's going to be a lot of figuring out how to take advantage of these speeds properly in upcoming titles so I'm not too concerned about jumping on gen 4. 10s to 5s optimistically isn't a big deal, but 2s is hitting "instant" feeling range.

[@logitech4365]

I have one of the Aorus drives with that very heat sink. Its badass with my RTX 3090 and Ryzen 3900XT.

[@Wogle]

I put in a WD_Black SN850 into my PS5 (500 GB). Games seem to run exactly the same as on the internal. Will see if that changes as time goes on, but currently very happy with the setup

[@Aggrofool]

500 too small

[@ZeeVoe]

Would it not make more sense to keep the SSD slot cover off, so that the heat sink will get better airflow?

[@brandon_nope]

no there's air channels in the SSD bay

[@ZeeVoe]

@@brandon_nope right, but wouldn’t there be some airflow if you left the cover off? I just can’t think of a good reason to put the cover back on

[@jsarwari5556]

@@ZeeVoe that’s what I’m wondering about as well. Is the cover there to keep unnecessary dust particles out or something of these sort? It seems more logical to keep the cover off for more air flow like you say.

[@kcamfork]

Would love to know this as well.

[@cmdr101z8]

The reason is because the compartment is cooled by negative pressure from the fan, so you need to seal it for proper airflow

[@The_Madhatter666]

I'm curious if it's better for the longevity of the SSD to omit the metal cover @4:39 to improve airflow and heat dissipation (the two air vents “notches” seem too small).

[@JuanSanchez24]

I'm curious about this as well

[@metallicafan416]

Sony says to use a heatsink

[@NickBFTD]

I'm pretty sure the air flows through the bay as part of the cooling of the system, it wouldn't be a good idea to leave it off.

[@devilmikey00]

SSD workloads in a gaming environment are going to be short and heavy. So 100% for under a minute then low usage. A heatsink will soak the heat in that short workload and have plenty of time to dissipate it when it's barely being used.

[@maxmaxneolit]

You'll mess up the designed airflow if you leave the metal cover off. Just put a good coper heatsink on your M.2 and you'll be golden in terms of longevity.

[@TrigrH]

Sabrent Rocket 4 Plus, SN850, Crucial P5 PLUS, AORUS Gen4 7000s, Seagate FireCuda 530

[@NightMare-ce4ds]

Not interested on adding storage to my ps5 for now, but it looks interested. Great video

[@leopamir]

You should try some pcie 4 drives that don’t meet the recommendations and see how those perform. That’d be way more interesting

[@feldartillerie1620]

what for? You don't build rims on your car that don't fit ... or fill up with the wrong fuel ..

[@leopamir]

@@feldartillerie1620 because they’re usually a lot cheaper, and test from the verge revealed that the biggest difference they could find was only a second

[@WholeHolyHole]

PCIe 4 is extremely fast.. I’m not sure there are any drives in that class which wouldn’t perform well.

[@leopamir]

@@WholeHolyHole WD sn750 se

[@feldartillerie1620]

@@leopamir but it doesn't make any sense ... if only one game needs more than 3500 mb then you destroy the whole gameplay and just get upset. In addition, you have to buy a new ssd and you have to spend twice as much money. Since there is hardly any SSd with 4500 or 5000 speed, it makes even less sense because then you would have to take a 3500mb and that is 2/3 of the performance .

[@caramelpepsi2582]

NGL when hearing all the marketing Sony did about their super fast SSDs I thought it was just marketing fluff, but after seeing this I'm damn impressed. Well played Sony I say that as someone who hasn't owned a Sony console since the PS2.

[@freddywayne]

Yet, an NVMe M.2 SSD inside the expansion slot is faster than the PS5's internal SSD that's built-in to it's motherboard! 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@VGJunky]

@@freddywayne the external SSD costs half as much as the whole console

[@freddywayne]

@@kimpossible4450 - I think you mean when Sony enables the full capacity of the 12-channel SSD controller inside the PS5. 🤦🏾‍♂️

[@caramelpepsi2582]

@@freddywayne Let me set what I mean straight a little bit. What I mean by marketing fluff was I thought Sony's SSD wouldn't even come close to a NVME Gen4 SSD. The fact they are as close as they are is a shocker to me considering NVME Gen 4 drives are pretty damn expensive a terabyte one goes for almost £200/$277 if the exchange rate turns over for the cost of these drives. The fact that the drives themselves cost not far off of the console itself and yet the consoles own internal storage can keep up with them is a feat worthy of praise in my opinion.

[@freddywayne]

@@caramelpepsi2582 - I knew exactly what you'd meant in your original post and how you were a skeptic about Sony's claim of their SSD specs. I, on the other hand, is still a skeptic and not impressed by the PS5's SSD speeds. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@vScoobyDoox]

Those game transfers to and from the internal PS5 SSD and the M.2, was that done with or without the heatsink? Didn't hear you mention it.

[@jondoe1444]

I don't think that would matter, because other youtube vids also mention the slow speeds when writing back to the ps5. I think it's because the ps5's ssd was mainly "tuned" for reading speeds as against writing speeds, since most times game data will be read from the ssd.

[@vScoobyDoox]

@@jondoe1444 Oh yeh almost certainly unrelated to that issue, I was just asking as the longer transfer times are where the heatsink would really come into play. I'd like to have seen these tests done with and without the heatsink really.

[@paul1979uk2000]

@@vScoobyDoox Can't comment on this drive but on one of the Samsung drives I've got which can do 3.5GB per second, not having the heatsink on makes a massive difference, basically, with it on, temps are around 55c-61c, with it off, temps are around 91c. I would imagine that PCI Express 4.0 drives get hotter because they run much faster and an easy way to test that out would be with the same drive on a PC with and without a heatsink and see what the temps are. For the record, performance didn't drop on my drive without a heatsink even with such a high temp but it shows that a heatsink can make a massive difference on temps.

[@daniellapointe5356]

You got me I suscribed ... I just wonder when the final software update will happen I was not chosen to test the Beta :(

[@Thevinylhead]

Thanks for a great view into the internal upgrades!