DIMDEX 2024: Damen MPSS, Dearsan FAC, Fincantieri in Qatar, Meteksan latest systems

[@BdogFinal14]

I’m no naval expert, but it seems none of these designs seems to take the threat of drones seriously. Some are basically drone launching platforms, with no anti-drone capabilities. Very soon, some adversary will develop swarm drone capabilities to overwhelm any ships defenses.

[@AlexandruSilivestru-g1t]

That is beying developed in a separate manner, we already have counter messures for drones,and most of options can be loaded in any ship,probably stealth drones wich will fry enemy drones will fly at all times around carrier groups, as you see in ukraine... Nato drone arsenal isnt always transparent

[@saltymonke3682]

Those ships won't be at sea alone. Other ships are always screening the mother vessel. Also, CIWS is standard in many capital ship nowadays.

[@casey203]

The “Drone Mothership” concept seems to be a good way to sneak in a low cost helicopter carrier against a skeptical Congress who might be holding too tight on the purse strings. Good for the Portuguese navy, air and naval drones have been proving themselves very useful in Ukraine. 👍🏻

[@SnowmanTF2]

The US is already kind of been going that route with the Puller class, sure shifting the mix of aircraft from crewed to drones would help drop the crew count more, but is already is a lower cost flight deck and sea launch capability than their amphibious assault ships.

[@jordibt1789]

LoL, 3/4 of the budget for it's procurement already come from covid rebuild funds, no need to tell them about being creative with funding solutions

[@ronclark9724]

Portugal recently laid up their ex-US Navy Newport class LSTs, and require a replacement for military sealift. At 7,000 tons displacement, this ships can accommodate landing craft and military personnel for up to 400 maximum. While this ship isn't a larger LHD or LPD, the MPSS is a better multi-purpose design than another 7,000 tons LST. She is also being designed to operate oceanographic submersibles as well, not just airborne drones. And that small flattop is sufficient to operate full sized helicopters too. She will be great for disaster relief operations, support UN peacekeepers, fishery patrols, etc. Think of her as a Swiss army knife, multi-purpose support ship, not as a replacement for a destroyer or frigate.

[@GDB11]

The first ship (multi purpose drone carrier) is already built for the Portuguese Navy at the Damen shipyard in Romania

[@kiknav]

People don´t understand so i need to clarify: That first portuguese Admiral is a freaking hero to the portuguese people, he saved us all through Covid, a no nonsense guy.

[@Nainara32]

The concept of a 3-ship navy is interesting. I don't see any VLS cells, and the radar mast doesn't appear very big, so I wonder how this NPSS frigate will defend against airborne threats.

[@nicholaosperackis7390]

I was wondering the same thing….

[@CC-ns2ds]

They won’t always include where the CIWS systems will be in concept designs. Usually they’re some of the last systems to be placed on board in shipyards. Also he said fully crewed only 45 people are needed and he did mention science purposes quite a lot so it might not be all military based.

[@nicholaosperackis7390]

@@CC-ns2ds CIWS are not enough, you need a long range air defense to engage threats when they are far

[@allenseeallendo5844]

It won’t defend against missiles. You need mass to carry missiles. Theres no VLS. Check out Russias Rubin class that’s 630 tons and they use MANPADS for air defense. They are meant to shoot and run away fast. Idk who Portugal plans on fighting but weirdest thing I’ve heard in 2024 is “we will only have 3 types of ships”.

[@CC-ns2ds]

@@allenseeallendo5844 well Portugal does not spend too much on their military so having either three of these ships (France only has 3 Mistral Class LHDs) or if he meant only three class of ships that would improve costs (parts commonality and quicker maintenance/easier to train young engineers). In terms of their being no VLS for missile defence, they are support ships, I expect they’ll serve in fleets with destroyers/frigates etc, the UK Albion class only has Phalanx CIWS on board it’s not completely unheard of, VLS are very large and heavy and it if you’re going for efficiency and economy (fuel, time at sea and speed) are all factors that people are paid a lot of money to think about before submitting concepts to militaries.

[@postyoda1623]

Very comprehensive reporting as always; much appreciated!

[@HélderFerreira-p2l]

This first ship its a prototipe and it will mainly be used in non-hostile operations in the atlantic, in cientific, SAR, maritime surveillance, etc, to test the drone mother-ship concept. but with some LPD, and humanitarian support, disaster relief capabilities.

[@greatminionsbomagendenk]

Good Luck Damen

[@miguelm3314]

There is a lot of misunderstanding here... This ship is for surveillance not for war. But will be the model of a future warship that the navy will build with Damen already with armament, this more for technology testing and coast guard tasks...

[@theoneandonlysoslappy]

That MPSS seems interesting. At first, its defense capability seemed ... nonexistent. Then, when the Admiral mentioned 50 drones, it became clear that such was not the case. Fifty armed aerial, surface and underwater drones would seem, if appropriately sized, to provide a more than adequate ASUW and ASW capability. I doubt, however, that they can provide an appropriate AAW capability. That tends to need pretty big, high-speed missiles out of a VLS.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

Not gonna be much use against subs or surface ships, either.

[@miguelm3314]

This ship is for surveillance not for war. But will be the model of a future warship that the navy will build with Damen already with armament, this more for technology testing and coast guard tasks...

[@SteveJones-om6ks]

Building an HVU or High Value Unit without any screening or escort provision is an interesting choice.

[@philiplewis8213]

They did mention ASW drones. Add a pair of attack helicopters and you are set.

[@lordtemplar9274]

yeah right 50 drones with a skeleton crew of 48 on a 7000 ton ship LOL and which drones? Damen isnt really known for its drones and Portugal isnt really a leader in that insustry either and doesnt really operate many? future my arse. this ship is vapourware! may as well use civilian shipyard for cheaper cost. it has 0 armament and does not seem to have many sensors. lets be real, drones are not the sci fi stuff yet, we arent close to that yet. today drones are basically remote controlled toys made bigger and added aramament and sensors. it works in permissive environments like Afgahanistan etc... sure it looks cool on anecdotal videos on the internet , but on the battlefield "drones" are nowehere near there. maybe in 20 years or 50 years but not today. if you look at Ukraine and realize that when EW is used drones arent that effective anymore. at begining of war, many were raving that TB2 was the future and a game changer. (not to mention that TB2 is just a copy of Heron and not even close to capable as MQ9 Reaper) Reality is quite different. in fact we havent heard of TB2 since the initial surprise factor in the first month when Russia thought they could roll in unopposed like they did in Crimea 2014. the fact is, once in place, AA and EW took care of drones. The only thing that has somewhat worked are cheap expendable kamikaze type drones or mini drones for local spotting (when EW is not present. but neither has been the determining factor on the ground. until drones are independant, its not the game changer that many like to think. Today it is just a complement and adds capability but it has not changed anything on the stalemate on the ground in Ukraine. so for a navy to replace existing frigates and rely on future tech which is not yet ready is a joke, or a pig you put on lipstick to hide a lack of money. dont get me wrong i think existing drones have their place/use today as a complement, but to abandon classic frigates like Portugal is doing is a huge mistake and a bad gamble, because has drones will undoubtedly evolve so will the counters. Basicaly Portuguese Navy is a joke and not credible one minute. may as well just produce small OPV and content yourself with fisheries and customs patrols.

[@LaurieSmith-p9j]

Without an escort of AAW frigates or destroyers,I’m not sure how the Portuguese Navy plans to defend their new ship/ships.Haven’t even mentioned ASW defense…

[@emanuelfaria2377]

Is everything old and need repair

[@paulsteaven]

They have some old frigates and corvettes for ASW, few of them has point defense system. It is safe to assume that this new ship class wipl be protected by other NATO ships.

[@ronclark9724]

@@paulsteaven Without any doubt whatsoever, if the MPSS went into harm's way, she would be properly escorted... Replenishment, amphibious, mine hunters, and patrol boats don't have SAM and ASW weapon systems either... Not every warship has to be a aircraft carrier or a battleship, destroyer, or a frigate in today's world... Support ships are just as important...

[@yaroslavgorislabe3551]

Could you show in more detailed views Turkish naval models - it is very interesting design projects.

[@erkanylmaz5564]

Thanks for video.

[@erentogar-kc9vf]

Turkiye💯

[@jorehir]

I also think that the Portuguese ship is the future. Lovely thing. However, it's concerning that it's not armed at all. The lack of armament probably cuts the cost in half, but still...

[@ronclark9724]

She is being built to commercial standards, not to military standards. So she will be a very affordable multi-purpose support ship, MPSS... Tug boats aren't built to military standards either, but they are important to every navy...

[@allenseeallendo5844]

Portugal just call Italy and have them help you out. You’re not buying 3 types of ships that make zero sense. A 500 ton patrol boat is tiny. You better have the best missiles in the world if you can only carry 2-4 at a time.

[@emanuelfaria2377]

Don't have money for defense, is for political corruption

[@edsonweise]

Portugal has 5 Frigates, 2 Corvettes, 2 Submarines and some Oceanic Patrol ships at the moment. Looking to what is happening in Ukraine and knowing the status and weaponry of those 5 frigates, throwing 50 drones against these frigates would lead to the destruction of two, maybe three of these ships. The Admiral forgot to mention that this ship is way cheaper than a frigate..and this is the first proto ship. In different videos he mentioned there will be different variants of these ships, most likely with proper anti air defenses. Instead of having 5 frigates Portugal can have 8 to 10 of these ships, with different weaponry, and still acquire a few more submaries. Portugal will never buy Destroyers or Cruisers so I believe these MPSS's are pretty good vessels for such a Navy, and I believe in case of war, these ships will always be supported by other NATO ships.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

“That’s…a…very different and very…interesting picture.” Yup, that’s one way to put it. 😁

[@guilhermefernandes2630]

Almirante Gouveia e Melo, Portugal.🇵🇹

[@mihalich7740]

01:10 - У этого, простите, "VIP" господина из Португалии, - такой русский акцент, что при первом прослушивании его речи - я просто сперва не поверил своим ушам. Потом уж только увидел его в белоснежной форме при знаках различия и с бородой подобающего его красивой форме колера. Теперь вот - верю, что сей господин - из Португалии.

[@manuellangius2896]

Its funny to see that many basic hull shape frigate designs are taken from the Dutch LCF (Damen design) considering this lcf is allready 20years old and it marks its last major midlife update.

[@Theboxingobserver]

What the cost? If in reach, the UK's Type 32 needs are fulfilled...

[@lottintv3518]

Would like to see Damen Sigma 11515 class Frigates.

[@killy831]

There is an video about that frigate from Defence Simplified: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pnmTioxsodqHa9E

[@ioanbota9397]

I like it

[@kimkristensen2816]

I would chose a multirole fregat with 32 MK41 VLS and 16 NSM and ASW capabilities such as towed aray and MH60-R Seahawk any day over the Portugise vessel. How does it protect itself!!

[@ronclark9724]

When she sails into harm's way she will be properly escorted... I am sure in a pinch a CIWS could be added overnight...

[@pauloperes7246]

Can an aircraft carrier protect itself?

[@danp5073]

The end of fighting capability for the Portuguese Navy, besides the 2 U214. Army is already nonfunctional and air force is going to use it's ancient F16AM until 2040 👌

[@claudio3821]

It's sad bro... And I'm Portuguese 😢😢🇵🇹

[@AlFreeman-xy4jy]

Now there is a change of government in Portugal, I hope something will change

[@claudio3821]

@@AlFreeman-xy4jy Me too

[@Errr717]

The laser dazzler looks pretty cool. I'd love to see a demo of that.

[@postakukusu]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/jpuyYotpfM56gKc&pp=ygULbmF6YXIgbGF6ZXI%3D

[@ethemkocak5283]

Lazer Elektronik Harp Sistemi NAZAR (Evil Eye) kzbin.info/www/bejne/raitmWewhaiAgKs kzbin.info/www/bejne/jpuyYotpfM56gKc

[@martinmorris299]

The issue is the Portuguese Navy is retiring all their frigates and they're building three of these support ships that can handle all types of missions. They're depending on drone and robotic weapons.

[@inkakorps]

interesante lo de Fincantieri

[@haocm]

Some modern ships look more and more like Legos. 😃

[@HélderFerreira-p2l]

This video show what kind of ship the portuguese navy wants. They drop the sky jump after Damen get in the project lol. But mostly is "situational awarness" all around the ship, sub-surface, surface and above surface, an "ocean control" ship. But peace time is one thing, war is another, kzbin.info/www/bejne/mKTYo5mAZseepK8

[@ronclark9724]

I believe they added a catapult in front of the bridge when they dropped the ski-lift... I recall battleships and cruisers having catapults before and after the Second World War...

[@quazar5017]

I always find it fascinating how billion dollar gouvernement contracts are awarded based on pretty miniatures, a powerpoint and a 60 second 3D animation. I don't find it strange or unreasonable, just fascinating.

[@Ezekiel903]

if you think they make the decision based on a 3D animation or a miniature model, then you have absolute no clue about how it works! Doesn't matter ships, air, train or car sector!!! absolutely no clue!

[@quazar5017]

@@Ezekiel903 you forget about the powerpoint. But you are right, I don't work in engineering, I work in administration and project management in a mid-sized company and it is really fascinating everyday how expensive decisions are made based on pictures, a model and the believable promise, that something can be done. I imagine government work is similar with more meetings and feasability studies.

[@tiagogomes3807]

The end of the oldest navy in the world. A navy with only 3 classes of ships, coastal patrol, submarines and a non-armed drone carrier. Good thing they wont be fighting anyone...

[@firechiefsampolitano1541]

So how many conflicts has the Portuguese navy been in, in the last 40 years or so... Meaning how does an Admiral in the Portuguese navy have a chest full of medals? What was he around when Portugal was exploring the new world and partaking in wars 500 years ago?!😂

[@itstugaboy]

Let me guess… American? Google is free you know? They've participated in the Gulf War (Operation Desert Storm), conflicts in the Balkans (Operation Sharp Guard), anti-piracy missions off Somalia (Operation Atalanta), the Mediterranean migrant crisis (Operation Sophia), maritime security in the Gulf of Guinea, and NATO support operations for Afghanistan. They also comfudcr many rescue missions in the Atlantic, provided humanitarian aid in disasters like the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami and the 2010 Haiti earthquake. Portugal also has a long history of involvement in Africa, including operations during the decolonization period Medals are awarded for a variety of services, including peacekeeping, search and rescue, anti-piracy, humanitarian aid, and contributions to international security. Maybe do some research before making uninformed comments. Also… they're responsible for patrolling one of the largest Exclusive Economic Zones (EEZ) which is one of the main objectives of the ship/drones he's talking about is for…

[@RenorOilamus]

Drone carrier❤

[@viktortsoy6999]

🇹🇷🐺💪🏻

[@n1k2-ja46]

The first ship introduced is a ship that looks like a mix of France's "Mistral" class and Spain's "Juan Carlos I" class. Is the propulsion method azimuth pod type? Is this the second example of a large battleship? The bridge isn't too big. Even so, it's a "luxury" flight deck layout. From an amateur's point of view, I think it would be nice to have a layout that allows both manned and unmanned aircraft to operate. 最初に紹介されている艦艇、フランスの「ミストラル」級とスペインの「ファン・カルロス１世」級をミックスした様な艦艇。推進方式がアジマス・ポッド式か、大型戦闘艦では２例目？艦橋が大きすぎるんじゃない。それにしても”贅沢”な飛行甲板レイアウトですね。全体的に有人、無人機双方運用できるレイアウトにすればいいのにと素人目に考えてします。

[@ronclark9724]

Think of her as a TINY flat deck for drones and a helicopter, useful with a vehicle deck below for military vehicles and rescue vehicles sealift, up to 100 specialists and 400 troops, not to mention submersibles. That vehicle deck is around 360 lane meters, and the flight deck can also be used to carry vehicles in a pinch as well... She is NOT be typed as a frigate, she is a multi-purpose support ship, MPSS...

[@bijoylaha7245]

Indian navy ships design more modernization needs

[@claudio3821]

The government will not invest in the Portuguese armed forces. Our armed forces are in a miserable state, in the last 4 or 5 years we have lost around 6000 soldiers. We now have around 20,000 military personnel. The salaries are terrible and the resources and weapons they have are old and not maintained. The Portuguese Navy's naval base also uses machines to maintain ships from before the Second World War, yes, you didn't read that wrong. The few ships that Portugal has built have no war capacity whatsoever. Portugal has ships that are over 50 years old, of the 5 frigates that it has, only 2 are operational and all of them are over 30 years old and there are still no intentions of replacing them. This ship was made with money from the European Union's (Recovery and Resilience Plan), and in fact, it was Mr. Admiral Gouveia e Melo who had to make an effort to make this ship possible, if it weren't for him, this ship wouldn't even exist. This ship was not designed for war, only for scientific exploration, combating drug trafficking, protecting the exclusive economic zone, etc... We, the Portuguese, are in trouble if we enter into a war. We still use the HK G3 gun in some military forces. And this is just to begin with, because Portugal is in a deplorable state in terms of both the navy, the army and the air force. We have reached a point where more than 15 billion euros would be needed to rehabilitate our forces. This is what happens when you have successive socialist governments in power for decades.

[@joaopaulosilverio1680]

Portuguese socialist government destroyed the oldest navy in the world. 🇵🇹 The Templar Navy of the Order of Christ has its ships stopped due to lack of maintenance . One day we will be great again...

[@joaopaulosilverio1680]

The country Portugal has existed since 1139, although the Kings had ships since then, officially the Portuguese Navy was created on 01-02-1317, and continues to this day. It has existed for 707 years.. What other country has a Navy that is more than 700 years old? Almost every country on the planet is newer than the Portuguese Navy ...

[@AlFreeman-xy4jy]

Now he will have a new government, hopefully something will change.

[@itstugaboy]

@@AlFreeman-xy4jyive seen they plan to renovate/modernize a lot of stuff and build 30 new ships + submarines… hopefully this new government will do some improvements…

[@MrG100000008]

Yaya, and then it forced by the powerful nations to do a disastrous decolonisation

[@cannonfodder4812]

That turkish ship looks like they took a yacht and slapped a turret in place of the hot tub

[@kanal756]

Arasında 53 hava savunma korveti tasarım ve insansız projesi geliştirme olarak yaptım boyu 130metre yaptım

[@Wannes_]

I see a big sitting duck

[@martinmorris299]

How can this ship defend itself? No VLS, RIM or CIWS weapons are visible on the video.

[@ronclark9724]

Like most tank landing ships she will be escorted by destroyers, frigates, and if necessary by submarines... I am sure if she is sailling into harm's way some sort of CIWS, RAM, or chain gun would be mounted... She is designed to do the jobs of a sea lift ship, oceanographic ship, and as flattop for helicopters and drones... Better to use a patrol ship, ocean patrol vessel, or frigate for naval warfare...

[@martinmorris299]

The Portuguese Navy is going from a Frigate Navy to three new ships that “can do it all”. I still don’t understand how these ships 😢can defend themselves against airborne threats or anti ship missiles. They could easily add a VLS or a RIM or sea sparrow launcher.

[@ronclark9724]

​ I am sure in a pinch a CIWS could be added overnight. She isn't being typed as a frigate, she is a multi-purpose support ship. A TINY flat-top for drones and a helicopter, with 360 lane meters vehicle deck below for submersibles, vehicles, and containers. With a crew of 48, she can carry up to 100 additional specialists and up to 400 troops... She is the replacement for the ex-US Navy Newport class LST Portugal laid up a few years ago... That LST didn't have a VLS or RAM either...Duh!

[@grahamkearnon6682]

As the sad little canadian fleet has found out you cant put to many different jobs for a single hull.

[@HayMaker-tv2dm]

I hope Portugal start to invest for real in the Army and navy because the investment in defence in the last 2 decades are just ridicolous, criminal, Portugal should buy is weapons for the land army like artillery and simple machine guns that dont have 40 years, its just a disgrace, Portugal need huge investment and get again some military industrial complex capacity that was completly destroyed, not even the basics Portugal have for their Army its just criminal behavior and people who dont understand nothing of war or defence that got the top jobs, but Paulo Portas when Portugal defense minister just conpletly destroyed the portuguese navy, army and industry corrupt bastards, Portugal have some of the toughest soldiers in Europe you can see them on UN missions with old equipment just kicking ass, Portugal use to sell artillery shells to America in Vietname and mortar rounds, produce HK and Rheinmetal AG weapons and a browning division that just built some of the must beautiful and reliable weapons, now not even a bullet they produce, i dont understand, not even a artillery cannon they use, just a dozen of L118 105mm for show, its sad thats why they cannot find recruits, i hope Portugal really change is behavior in their defence, they should buy some of the Dutch Frigates that they are about to retire and English type 31 Arrowhead 140 with a heavier cannon in place of the mark 110

[@claudio3821]

The government will not invest in the Portuguese armed forces. Our armed forces are in a miserable state, in the last 4 or 5 years we have lost around 6000 soldiers. We now have around 20,000 military personnel. The salaries are terrible and the resources and weapons they have are old and not maintained. The few ships that Portugal has built have no war capacity whatsoever. Portugal has ships that are over 50 years old, of the 5 frigates that it has, only 2 are operational and all of them are over 30 years old and there are still no intentions of replacing them. This ship was made with money from the European Union's (Recovery and Resilience Plan), and in fact, it was Mr. Admiral Gouveia e Melo who had to make an effort to make this ship possible, if it weren't for him, this ship wouldn't even exist. We, the Portuguese, are screwed if we get into a war. We still use the g3 in some military forces. And this is just to begin with, because Portugal is in a deplorable state in terms of both the navy, the army and the air force. We have reached a point where more than 10 billion euros would be needed to rehabilitate our forces. This is what happens when you have successive socialist governments in power for decades.

[@claudio3821]

Are u Portuguese??

[@HayMaker-tv2dm]

​@@claudio3821 Yes! Sim sou português e já servi no exército 4 anos é uma verdadeira desgraça o que se passa em Portugal nem só com a marina nacional mas com o exército que sinceramente é ridículo Portugal tem que escolher se quer ter um exército porque as ultimamente os PS tem sido letal para as forças armadas. Portugal além de ter pouco ainda faz contratos ridículos e nem 1.5% gasta do PIB! Sinto mesmo uma revolta porque quando estive no exército vi militares com grande vontade e capacidade mas completamente desarmados nem cartuchos de morteiro de 81mm Portugal tinha é simplesmente ridículo em vez de o Gouveia Melo ir comprar estes novos navios todos cheios de tecnologia ele devia era equipar as forças armadas com o básico mínimo para combate como armas que não tenham 40 anos, coletes prova de bala, artilharia de 155mm e vários sistemas necessários como mísseis anti tanque que Portugal tinha na altura só 30 mísseis Spike SR e MR ridiculo

[@claudio3821]

@@HayMaker-tv2dm Ya, mas repara o senhor Gouveia e Melo é um almirante da Marinha, ele não é do exército, nem da força aérea, por isso as funções que ele tem a cumprir são para com a marinha.

[@ronclark9724]

Unfortjunatelhy many European nations have cashed in on the "peace dividend" after the Soviet Union fell. Of course during the past few years NATO and the EU nations have stepped up their defense spending significantly... I wonder why?

[@billfanou42]

where is naval group ? 😯

[@grahamstrouse1165]

So, who wants to conquer Portugal! 😁

[@itstugaboy]

Good luck! You'll need it 😉

[@grahamstrouse1165]

I feel like a lot of hard drugs were involved in some of these ship designs…

[@DurzoBlunts]

All i see is huge a profile above water and vulnerabilities galore. But hey if youre selling it to Qatar it won't matter 😂

[@RegaRegas00]

Qatar Abu Dhabi test equitment join in africa

[@genripper-b8q]

this is an investor roadshow. nothing is being "ordered" here. concepts looking for sovereign funded partners. beyond the horizon timelines for a very small number of participants. boondoggle conference

[@XMAN4504]

Hadi lan ordan düdük 😂😂😂

[@nightwing.3378]

Damn Qatari navy is showing off.

[@engincansaran8879]

Anlamiyorum ya, nasil biz-dev yapiyor bu ingilizceyle. Biraz ders calisin be abi

[@DATBAYOUBOY504]

Nice AI photo shop

[@w.adr.wsniperprivatemilita9681]

I want a private army in all of Europe to be over 1 or 2 or 5 million soldiers military donations with all the technology I would establish it should be financed with billions of euros and dollars with America and the other NATO member states

[@ronclark9724]

America can barely afford to finance its own armed forces... It is up to Europe to step up to finance European armed forces...

[@hamzaouamrouche57]

M.ilitaryP.roce.SS.hipyard