The Nowhere King: A Flawed Show's Perfect Villain

[@WeRNotAlive]

The Nowhere King is really scary! Here's a Wammawink video to protect you: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZKkfaSXr9Spn7s

[@henrygalley2831]

I’m more of a Jeffica fan. Wammawink is pretty cool too, I guess

[@taddad2641]

Think you also missed a few parts though. The Elk in fact wasn't the 'worse half' of elktaur. It was his human half. To note, neither of them were 'complete'. The Elk humble, if incredibly jealous, compelled by his more animal side but not a violent, aggressive creature by any means. He did not have much in the way of pride either. The human half was bombastic, emotionally abusive, and lacked empathy and was prone to violence. When th slightest chance of the nowhere king dying came up, he nearly killed rider to stop her, and to note the nowhere king is seemingly unkillable at this point.... and when the Elk threatened to reveal the truth and end the lies, again showing a better half and realizing the mistakes of their actions, he tried to murder the elk.... also possibly showing the elk had more of the elktaurs knowledge and wisdom. Both sides show aspects of elktaur's personality, but both balanced each other out. elktaur would never inflict violence upon another from what we can tell, short of shoving a racist roughly through a portal. Separated his human half resorts to it constantly. Before the horrific abuse he suffered under his human half's imprisonment, the Elk never used violence. He could have literally interrupted the wedding then and there, but hesitated. He could have spoken to the princess/queen herself, but chose to try and reconcile with himself, in a very literal sense. Perhaps part self loathing, perhaps part him being the part that genuinely loved her. it was only after that psychological damage that he became the nowhere king. A comparison i've personally made is like the skeksis and the mystics from dark crystal. in this case, the skeksis side corrupted the mystic into something horrific and suffering, a threat to all. Note the skeksis side never started as evil, but became that through a lack of human empathy and for fear of their own lives. .... Also i would say, the elktaur deeply regreted his actions. This is the Elk part reviving, in part thanks to horse, inside of the nowhere king's being. The part that regrets, the guilt in his heart that the general lcked. Elktaur in his final moments was a guilty riddled shell, bearing the sins of both sides.

[@MisterHeroman]

Half the art in this show looks pretty good, the other half... bean mouths, puffy cheecks, perfectly circular eyes, and flabby thick arms with no detail. Wow. Of all the styles to choose from to look different from the human world.

[@selalewow]

Did Waterbaby know the Nowhere King's secret? The lady trained with her, did she ever reveal what she knew?

[@nickkorkodylas5005]

Why are your videos in my feed and why do you have so much free time?

[@satinizer8021]

many people joke about how Elktaur was animated in the "human style" only to "make him more hot and likeable", but i think it was to show how detatched he was from the Centaurworld and how he didn't want to be there, just like Horse at the beginning of the show.

[@WowItsErin]

Exactly! The show spends hours building up a great visual language that ties the cartoony centaur style to Fun and Cuteness and Sillyness, and the more anime proportionally-correct human style to Seriousness and Grimdark and Intellectualism: It's not a coincidence that when we see Elktaur, he's already in that latter style. And more importantly. It's no coincidence that Elktaur, like 99% of the human characters in the show, *doesn't have a name.*

[@satinizer8021]

@@WowItsErin ohhhh i've never noticed that he also didn't have a name, that's a good point!

[@HazzronIV]

@@satinizer8021 Probably a little late to mention this but I do recall Wamawink saying something along the lines of centaur world will only change you as much as you let. So it would stand to reason that perhaps he was letting the human world change him.

[@magicalowl4322]

i sometimes ask myself is the nowhere king the real Villain, or his other half

[@satinizer8021]

@@magicalowl4322 they're both villains, the Nowhere King just decided to be a villain of other people's stories, than just his own

[@goldybays]

If you notice, the elktaurs voice at the very end before he dies is NOT one voice. It's two. The two halves that made him up were too separate to ever be whole again.

[@silvercheetah92]

The singers actually sound really good together in harmony though

[@goldybays]

@@Master-Works I think the elks voice is alot deeper than his human half so you mostly pick up his.

[@cryptidgator]

I thought so! I picked it up during the second watch (even though I listened to said song several times between). You definitely pick up on the Elk more because his voice is deeper, but they're both there...

[@goldybays]

@@Master-Works not sure tbh. Maybe to help distinguish them more?

[@semi-san1736]

Mayhaps looking at the cast/voice actors would help?

[@Aexsion]

I just realized when the general was first introduced, his arm was in a sling. He immediately starts talking about his helmet and shows it being damaged with an arrow in it so you wouldn’t think much of it, he was wounded in battle. But now knowing the connection, that was right after the nowhere king was stabbed by the spear and the general is now recovering from that same wound.

[@lowfn]

Oh my god you are right

[@generalfloppa5798]

Holy shit

[@an_enigmaticdream]

Holy hell

[@Madisongs]

Oh my stars.

[@rokkraljkolesa9317]

goddamn, it's stuff like this that really makes this kind of stuff great

[@CesarTheKingVA]

Centaurs in Greek Mythology were typically used as a metaphor for learning to accept and control the animal and human parts of oneself. They were wise creatures who heroes would go to train with who had mastered both sides of their existence. The Nowhere King is the opposite of that, and rather than learning to accept both parts of him, rejects that union, becoming a monster in both the animal and human sense of the word. He's a true Tragic character, and I love it.

[@thelouster5815]

I thought Greek centaurs were supposed to be a representation of man’s primal lust, with a couple exceptions.

[@andistansbury4366]

Weren't a lot of centaurs pretty much just drunk idiots tho

[@gameboy1619]

Percy Jackson is an accurate example

[@enquuu]

So that's why Chiron, a unique lad amongst the centaurs, was known to mentor a lot of the Greek heroes in the myths :0

[@Anonomius0]

I thought the metaphor was that they were caught between human and beast nature with chiron being the exception to the rule?

[@hyenaedits3460]

"A flawed story is a thousand times better than a story that's never been told" Tattooing this on my forehead.

[@cactusgamingyt9960]

Lol unhealthy skin

[@SheetGhostWithBones]

Tattooing this on my ass

[@thedog5k]

bruh

[@solsystem1342]

​@@cactusgamingyt9960 Did you miss kurzgesagt's most recent video? Cause tattoos are metal 🤙 Also they're just splotches of ink inside your body. They're separated from your cells by your immune system pretty darn quick

[@A_Random_Eevee]

​@@Leunenkoenigone example. Just give me one.

[@ohno8398]

Absolutely love how The Woman's first song is describing how terrible love is, and her final song is an acknowledgement that the way she was treated was never love, and that revelation is what gives her the strength to put the elktaur out of his misery and end the war.

[@WobblesandBean]

That's a very good point that I don't see many people bring up. The General wooed her based on lies and deceit. That's not love, that's wanting ownership of her and stooping to any level to get it. I also see people complain that she killed him at all. Uhhhhh.....did they SEE the genocide he caused, all done purely out of selfishness? People have been put to death for far lesser crimes.

[@derboe_thebeast6869]

@@WobblesandBean exactly why can people just accept the fact he deserved to die to pay for his crimes

[@mewtwotwo2222]

yeah it's so tragic what the elktaur had for her before he split was real love but he let it become corrupted by his self-hatred and it turned into something else it turned into the lies and deceit of the general

[@vukkulvar9769]

@@WobblesandBean Some westerners tend to consider killing to be worse than any crime unless it is done by fate/god.

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works Well, then Elktaur’s love for her wasn’t true love - at least, it may have started out that way, but that changed - because it did end up turning into obsession on both their ends, not just the General’s. That’s the whole point; they _both_ ended up holding toxic feelings towards her.

[@TindraSan]

the last reprie of his lullaby made me cry so hard. we didn't see alot of Elktaur and Mystery Woman's relationship, but the everything from the acting to the animation sold that they could've had something beautiful, and tearfully singing him a lullaby before he closes his eyes for the last time has such a gentle and fragile feeling it just makes me cry as well

[@galaxygamer4923]

Dude the entire ending had me in tears, I was in no way ready for that

[@kirbybie]

Same i was literally crying

[@damien678]

@@Master-Works both sides of him did inexcusable things, horse reaffirmed that what he did wasn't love, and she had to suffer alone for so long in centaurworld to try and keep the worlds separated. he really bloody hurt her and both worlds, there's no way that she would or even could be the one to heal him

[@damien678]

@@Master-Works both sides of him did terrible things to both worlds, he was still a threat and in her eyes, didn't deserve it

[@JeffCJY]

@@Master-Works If I was in her shoes. I would kill him too.

[@LeSpeederus]

It's almost jarring how he ended. When Woman wanted to reunite them, it was the nowhere king who allowed it to happen, like his elkhalf wanted for all those years but the general would've objected. In his final moments, Elktaur seems deeply unhappy and doesn't object to his death, almost yearning for it. Up until his final moment, he was in conflict with himself.

[@toukkero]

Elk/NWK wanted to die, but only through hands of Woman. At season 1 finale he lowers his head for Woman to kill him. Season 2 finale General dies or is mortally wounded after falling to canyon and it is only Elk there when Woman combines Elktaur. He aims the key-weapon to his own head. He wanted to end his own miserable life.

[@darkpone3731]

The Elktaur was in great pain and was literally at war with himself, I wonder if his war was a means to kill the General and thus himself to end his misery and damn the price.

[@jacobfreeman5444]

Nothing so well thought out. Full of self-loathing and agony he pretty much went mad. Not to say you are wrong about what was desired but just that he was too irrational to work towards such a goal. In his broken state he simply aimed his wrath at what he saw as the source. That he might meet his end, one way or another, would just be a bonus. He couldn't just let himself lay down and die but he no longer wanted life. He was hopelessly twisted and simply sought a place where he could truly rest.

[@iluvzurara2]

@@toukkero he does that AFTER saying that it was her fault that he was like that. personally, bc he said that i feel like he did that almost mockingly... maybe a little bit of both (mocking and genuinely wanted to die by her hands). i feel he knew she wasnt going to kill him. at the end, the song Woman sings indicates she realized he was basically psychologically abusing her by saying that when he is gone, she will be at peace and all his lies will be gone as well. he was toxic.

[@shadenox8164]

@@toukkero Its both, you can hear the General harmonising with him.

[@LinguiniSoup]

Man, he may be a sympathetic villian, but the only character that truely has my legit sympathy is the mysertious woman. She had to deal with this entire situation herself, knowing the truth, being betrayed and instead of uniting the worlds, (tried to) separate it completely. I found it really cool that this hidden protagonist had a history with the nowhere king, but damn it was heartbreaking seeing her finally tying up her loose ends at the end. She looked so happy at the beginning of her back story. Glad she wasn't overused and still served a significant purpose at the end of the story. brilliant

[@elisehoyt4107]

Yes, exactly! Horse helped her realize, but Mysterious Woman was also smart enough to see that it didn't matter if General and/or Elk and the Nowhere King claimed to love her. Their actions were clear they didn't love her, and that was no excuse for all the pain and suffering they caused so many others becausse of their OWN self hatred. Mysterious Woman said "fuck no I am NO excuse for your shifty behavior."

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works How is granting yourself closure after being hurt so much “self-centered”?

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works Demanding that the General merge with the NWK wouldn’t help anything or anyone. The relationship between the two halves is unsalvageable at this point. Also, what do you mean she didn’t kill Elktaur “right”?

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works She’s mostly focused on herself because _she is the one gaining closure for the suffering he caused her, and for the fact that his downward spiral into causing suffering started with his feelings for her and the resulting self-loathing._

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works I think a large part of her actions during Season 1 was the fact that she didn’t want the NWK to escape and cause more suffering, and she knew more than the protagonists. I don’t know if her approach to that was the best she could’ve gone with, though.

[@66Roses]

It's amazing how I can... Feel terrified of the Nowhere King Feel disgusted by the General Feel sorrow for the Elk Feel disappointment in the Elktaur All at once and not feel conflicted whatsoever. It's brilliant writing.

[@Fut_re]

@@Master-Works bro go to sleep, you've been trying (and failing) to argue for 9 months because how someone interprets the story isn't how you want it to be. this ain't your writing, you don't have the one-and-only truth.

[@PootisPlayer]

@@Master-Works man shut the hell up

[@samiam2003]

​@@Master-Works ?

[@samiam2003]

@@Master-Works ?...

[@samiam2003]

@@Master-Works what is true

[@thecrownedprince5005]

The saddest part is that the woman loved the elktaur for who he was, both the beast and the human side of him, even calling his antlers "cute." If he had only loved himself, and accepted the elk side of him... heck, if he had only opened up to the woman about his esteem and allowed her to help him... they probably would've gotten married, and, as the woman WAS a princess, her marrying a centaur would probably secure complete peace between both realms. He could've brought peace to all the lands, but instead, he brought war, hatred, and misery... essentially everything he was feeling inside himself. And all with the excuse of "for love" Another detail I found interesting was how out of place he was in Centaurworld. His animation mirrored the more anime-like animation and art style of the human world, and he even looked more human than the other centaurs, showing us how uncomfortable he really was in his elktaur skin. Edit: Holy... I've never gotten this many likes on a comment before... MoM i'M fAmOuS-

[@katherines.7508]

Definitely. Also: Horse came to have her centaurworld appearance once she accepted a broader image of herself. The elktaur looks like that because he never did.

[@ItsameDesire]

Well, they did get married. Three quarters of a marriage at least (human half of a nowhere king and the princess). Would be weird for guests to see three-way wedding of two humans and a rando elk.

[@Uhcip]

The show has strong themes of body dysmorphia. Parts of it are difficult to watch for this reason.

[@AYellowSnowman]

@@katherines.7508 Oh damn. That's a take I didn't expect, but in hindsight I totally agree.

[@baburik]

did she really "loved the elktaur for who he was" tho? loved, not liked? I think the problem is she was a princess. this puts a lot of pressure on the hero to become a even better version of himself than he really is. remember Alladin? or should I say prince Ali Ababua? there is an entire subset of fairy tales where the fool of a protagonist wins the princess and the half of the kingdom by becoming an unlikely hero and defeating the dragon or whatever. if she was just a girl the story would be much shorter and happier probably. the Woman liked the Elktaur, but was it enough for him to be more than a good friend from abroad to talk about magic gadgets? we want to think that the best case scenario is the most probable and natural outcome, but this is not how the life works. just because she said she would probably loved him as he was doesn't mean she would.

[@duskianfae]

Here's my take: The Nowhere King's story is basically The Little Mermaid gone (even more, if you consider the original tale) horribly wrong

[@crow3467]

How so?

[@algiz_3696]

@@crow3467 Ariel thought the prince would only love her if she was fully human, and this got rid of her full self. (I haven’t read the whole original Grimm’s tale so I’m not sure what happens different other than it’s more of a Greek Myth with no true happy ending)

[@duskianfae]

@@crow3467 Okay so originally this was just a joke on how Elktaur's song on wanting to be part of the human world was basically "Part of Your World" once you stripped it to it's bare essential, but the more I think about it, the more I see the paralels. Both Elktaur and The Little Mermaid are fascinated with the human world, to the point they feel like they don't fit in their respective societies. In the original tale, the Mermaid also wishes to have a human soul to get to heaven. To me, Elktaur's desire to be "taken seriously" is a tamer and less religious version of that - seeing in humans something he believes to not have, and thinking of himself less for that. The catalyst for both of these characters is to meet a human on whom they develop a crush on. And in both of their stories, they project on this human a reason to follow their insecurities and do whatever it takes to become human. For the Little Mermaid, she goes to the seawitch, and exchange her tongue (or her voice, if you go by the Disney version) with a pair of legs that will hurt at every step she makes. For the Elktaur, using the key's magic to separate both his halves. This is where the connection is more complicated to explain, so I hope it makes sense. In the original Little Mermaid tale, the prince does not recognize the Mermaid as his savior and the one he wanted to marry. He instead falls for another girl, one who also helped him, and marries her instead. And the tragic part is, it's implied in the text that he would have loved her had she stayed a mermaid - many times he says "if only you were her." And because the Mermaid failed to make the prince fall in love with her, and because she refused to kill him and his new wife (as per a deal her sisters made with the witch, it's a whole thing), she becomes seafoam. (And there was a whole thing on her getting the chance to ear a human soul if she helped people as a spirit for 300 years or something?? I don't like that part tbh) While Elktaur's second half of the tale is very different (the Little Mermaid did not star a war, for once), you see the echoes of the same tragedy. The Woman would have loved him the way he were, just like the Prince would (maybe) have loved the Mermaid. The change was painful, in a way, to both of them, and took away something that was quintessential to who they were. And they both die in the end. Anyway, I hope the random rambling of mine made any sense. I probably am stretching a lot here, specially towards the end haha.

[@cicadaplum]

It's like if the original Little Mermaid story ended with the Mermaid reawakening as a Sea Foam monster and reigns hell upon the world.

[@Jabroniville]

@@duskianfae A big deal with the original story is that Mermaids don't have souls, and her act of mercy in refusing to kill the prince who spurned her and his new wife, had in fact earned her this soul. It's a very "Christian" story and her earning a soul is seen as like the positive moral. There's a reason Disney changed this so utterly, lol.

[@sandi539]

The fact that there was no redemption arc for The Nowhere King was honestly so refreshing and satisfactory. Almost every other show would have let him off the hook, considering he has all the traits that would make his redemption be desired by the audience : tragic backstory, having a "loved one", being a nerdy tumblr sexyman etc. But Centaurworld doesn't pull any punches and has him being punished accordingly to his crimes, even when he is no longer a threat, because he conciously made every bad decision that affected him and the world and someone has to bear responsibility for the crimes he and his army commited in both worlds. Because there are things after which redemption is simply impossible and punishment is due, which is a less comfortable message than "everyone can be salvaged". So kudos to Centaurworld for not going the easy path, amd being a bit more mature in this regard than most of the other animated shows.

[@rubyy.7374]

Nowhere King’s story was tragic and preventable, but the fact of the matter is that HE was the reason for every bad thing that happened to himself. He convinced himself that he didn’t have a chance at love; he resorted to deceit and cruel experimentation to win the mysterious woman over; and it was him who decided that being at war with himself (knowing full well that each side can never truly win), irreparably hurting countless others physically and mentally, was preferable over self-acceptance. He is more irredeemable than most, because he was incapable of any sort of self-reflection because he thought himself to be special. You see it in how he doesn’t respect his boss and clearly sees himself as above other centaurs, not to mention how he kicked that human into the void. (Just because said human was a jerk, he had no right to stoop below his level!) He’d also grab the key whenever he felt like it, the only thing responsible for keeping the two worlds together, for his own selfish purposes. He was so stuck in his own head that despite seeing how much humans were flawed, he frantically clung to this idea that humans were better somehow so that he could retain his backwards world view. Yes, Nowhere King came to understand his mistakes eventually (I think?), but it doesn’t undo his decades of terror like you said, and I’m glad he got his just desserts for it. This show and Infinity Train did it very well, and I hope more shows adopt that more nuanced take in the future. P.S. The protagonists went through far worse growing up (I’m mainly thinking Durpleton and Wammawink here), giving them an actual excuse to lash out at others, but unlike the NWK, they refused to let it consume them. Instead, they tried to keep what happened to them from happening to others.

[@t84t748748t6]

after nowhere kings dead i was sure the kill rider also but the didn't wich i found a total cop out so many dead but the main characters got to live

[@sharkjumpingwalrus6744]

To be fair, a lot of redemption stories tend to fail at the redemption part. Becoming a good person after doing bad things requires a great deal of effort, as everything you do makes who you are as a person, and redemption would be a painful process of fighting against that. The more bad things a character does, the more they would have to overcome in the journey of becoming a better person. Often times you will find writers taking shortcuts to get to the parts they want to write, but in doing so they rob their story of the best parts.

[@TheCoolmaster131]

It's funny how now some people have redemption arcs for villain's. Now everyone is crying about it. Like villains not being redemped never stopped happening. Stop living in a trend.

[@JustCallMeHeavy]

I think it's nice to see people trying something different.

[@fatcat1414]

I wouldn't say Elktaur was split into a good part and a bad part. I interpreted his transformation as his whole mind being duplicated and both duplicates living parallel lives. The General was equally as much of a villain as the Nowhere King because they are one in the same. The Elk's final descent into madness was prompted by the General's hatred for his animal half, after all.

[@marissam3176]

I believe when he said for better or for worst he meant the situations.

[@shadenox8164]

@@Master-Works How did the General seem to forget about her? He literally sent out a scout to attain the one thing that could possibly reunite them. Why would he go for that given the Nowhere King being trapped forever is literally the best scenario for him personally?

[@perrywonderclub]

The general's battle song wasn't just to showcase the animation. The song and animation were intentionally punchy and heroic to frame him as virtuous and capable. It sets up the viewer so that we hold him in similar esteem as horse and rider to make the betrayal that horse feels, when she witnesses his cruelty in the following scene, personal to the viewer as well.

[@sparxstreak02]

One thing about Horse’s physical transformation I would’ve liked to be tweaked was her being able to find & choose a form SHE felt comfortable in rather than being forced to adapt to the Centaurworld form that proved irreversible (shown further with Stabby & Rider after they also spent prolonged periods in Centaurworld) And yes I know it was meant to represent her inner transformation but a blend of both forms would’ve been able to show her accepting every side of herself (like still having the muscular physique she loved but also keep the white nose blaze, rainbow tears & her magic)

[@iclynnx]

I like your idea. Horse was strong enough to learn to accept her appearance, but in reality we aren't all warriors. Sometimes changes, although preferably realistic ones, have to be made to be happy. Some people will just never find happiness if they can't change something about them or their lives. I speak from personal experience. Still haven't found my happiness, and I refuse to accept living like this. And I will try not to go down a dark path over this unhappiness I feel. Being unable to accept does not equal becoming cruel unless you let it consume you. Right?

[@gingermaniac5484]

i always thought it was a representation to how seeking help for ptsd, depression and suicidal thoughts often includes medication that can and often times does change your body in ways people aren't always ready for, such as gaining weight, by accepting her body, she's accepting help and that it's okay and not shameful to receive r ask for it

[@Lisa-kt7jr]

I think the form is actually based on what they feel comfortable with most. Elktaur never fit in Centaurworld, and he was styled like the human world. Woman never accepted the silly Centaurworld-ness either and stayed human-styled even after decades spent in Centaurworld. Rider on the other hand accepted it really quickly, as evidenced by her transformation starting really fast. Horse COULD'VE transformed back if she wanted to, just like she could've gone back to the human world if she wanted to... but she didn't want that. Oh, and remember when she jumped into the NK's mind? She notices her war-horse form and sounds sad and panicked when she says: "but, my wibbly-wobbly physique!"

[@hyalophora]

@@Lisa-kt7jr Yes, thank you, I thought this as well

[@donnelwaddledee965]

@@Lisa-kt7jr That makes me feel more okay with the transformations in the show. It didn't make sense to me initially until you brought up how it relates to the other characters.

[@dashiethebunny]

"Flawed doesn't mean bad" THANK YOU. SO MUCH. I don't like how terms like "cliche", "flawed" or "weak" seem to automatically mean "bad". More often then not, flawed or weak stories can have legitimately better content then shows universally considered "perfect". Centaurworld is easily one of my favorite shows in the past 15 years. Hell, it might even be in the top 10. And the Nowhere King was the moment this show went from great to fantastic.

[@sarahzahira7432]

I agree🥰🥰🥰

[@iclynnx]

Thank you!! I get so frustrated when people hate on something for something so simple. We humans aren't genius all the time, mistakes happen, and what matters is that we can learn from them. Heck, the people who worked on this show were likely aware of the mild flaws, but they have their budget and time limits. It was good enough to work.

[@BasementCorvid]

T h i s

[@munchobell2890]

so adveture time

[@semi-san1736]

I honestly think there can't ever BE a perfect story. There's always going to be supposed flaws in someone's eyes, in some way. Much like this very animation, it's better to accept things with all their nuances.

[@scatmanjohnfan22]

So in conclusion, comfortable doug.

[@dreaming_destiny675]

Comfortable Doug is indeed the conclusion to all.

[@henrygalley2831]

He’s the hero of all our stories

[@flapjack0925]

No, Flat Dallas

[@kingcyclops4079]

This made me smile, thank you.

[@chidivids2005]

There should always be comfortable Doug

[@newblackpaladin8246]

For a show that initially comes off as extremely childish (mainly centaurs and the crazy world), it has a surprisingly powerful warning about self-hatred. I mean people at any age can watch this and reflect on their own views towards themselves. Heck, I know I did. At times I feel worthless and am not comfortable with who I am or how I look. Learning about the Nowhere King's story definitely gave me a wake-up call about needing to learn to love and accept myself even if I'm not perfect.

[@ScytheTheDemon]

Also, if you didn’t see the war scene at the beginning of the shows, it would have come of as a show for kids… until they make a few jokes, the jokes start to come off as more complicated jokes that seem to be based on how insane the herd appears, while not directly addressing it. Also, in the war scene, she did snap one of the mutant’s neck 360 degrees, there’s a lot of death in this show, I was genuinely suprised when I first saw Elktaur’s death, it felt… different, more violent, it leaves the viewer to imagine what it looked like.

[@lilytoa8761]

I think the name "Nowhere King" also has a different meaning. Since his entire existence is based on Elktour's completely internalized self-hatred with no healthy outlet that leads on to create the abominable creature that is the Nowhere King, I think he called that because he gets *Nowhere* with that unnecessary self-conflict he has with himself, and using an entire war to excuse his actions and impulses fits that type of inexcusable behavior. And it's not _just_ that, but also the fact that he created a convoluted solution to a problem that could easily be fixed if he just let go of his pride. What's worse is that even when his problem got "solved, he was still unsatisfied and wasted every good opportunity to *be* himself, regardless of being elk or human. The greatest irony I also see in the name the "Nowhere King" is that he is the both the human King of an empire that is responsible for so many lives, but he is also the monster responsible for ending so many of them at the same time, an endless, neverending cycle, going *Nowhere*. The elk and human is a physical representation of what he wants and doesn't want, but he wouldn't be himself if those two aren't together. In the end, even if he were both the king and monster, both holding great power, he is _still_ the greatest loser of them all, just because he didn't want to save himself.

[@jayrenea5446]

09l9ljkjly9oo06o06l0l77 was pl

[@avrileibeck2225]

I dont believe he was separated into an "evil" and "good" half. One liked what he got and wanted tonstay that way, and the other didn't and wanted to go back. That is how elktaur would react in either of those situations. they are very much the same person even though seperated. The general wanted to stay seperated as much as he possibly could, the elk wanted to go back. But after he was imprisoned he wanted to hurt. It didnt help that the general had animosity to his elk side in the first place and fear towards it. He didnt love the princess from the start. Continuing a war just to see her again, when he could end it with self sacrifice, it was all for him; he wanted to prolong himself. The fact that he imprisoned the nowhere king and didnt stop it after it stop being elk showed that

[@Disatiere]

Being imprisoned in a dark room which you can not even move or stand in for 10 years is gonna break anyone.

[@aydan-taylorrome1029]

I agree with this a lot. Their duality i would argue is neither good or evil; more fear and pain

[@sarafontanini7051]

it's kinda like that joke in dragonball z abridged where a villain is revealed to be the good half of a morrally questionable ally character, except played completely seriously. And yeah both halves are terrible people, it's just one got to pretend to be the hero and justify himself and the other was pushed into the role of the villain and dove into it wholeheartedly because hurting people and kickstarting an apocalyptic war was easier for him.

[@Spacers3057]

And in his song he mentioned how he wanted the NWK alive. It was never about her it was just about him.

[@K0ira]

Well, I think the General was definite the 'evil' half at the beginning considering he tried married the love of BOTH of their lives and didn't invite the Elk, tried to drown the Elk, and then imprisoned the Elk and most likely tortured it in some kind of sense. But then again, both were Evil because then the Elk went down a dark path.

[@zealotoftheorchard9853]

"This is not what love looks like" - Horse to mysterious woman

[@rainbowstar5705]

@@Master-Works I believe he loved, but he used that love as an excuse for his actions. He mixed the love he felt for her with the hatred he felt for himself, thus corrupting everything

[@rainbowstar5705]

@@Master-Works Hmm, I think you're right. maybe I'm being too simplistic about his feelings

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works Against the Minotaurs’ will, though.

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works I’ll bet it was still painful for the bull - it clearly was for the human. They were both merged against their will.

[@ammonitetheseaserpent3761]

@@Master-Works I think he probably didn’t realize he was in danger until the last moment.

[@ShadowoftheMask]

I think lot of people miss the thing that really makes redemption impossible for Nowhere King, with them simplifying it to "he doesn't deserve it": Nowhere King's major character flaw that caused all of his problems was self hatred. Elktaur hated his beastly half, Elk hated himself, General hated elk and Nowhere King hated everything. If Elktaur had learned to love himself or if Elk and General had accepted his beastly half, none of this would have happened. So fusing them back together solves none of it, he still hates himself and now he has even less reason to stop hating himself.

[@sarafontanini7051]

plus even so he killed like a LOT of people for really selfish and petty reasons

[@leonorcrafts9877]

So…. Literally everybody hated elk. Poor guy

[@josephstahl9119]

@@leonorcrafts9877 *Reminds me of Darth Vader. The person that hates you the most is yourself.*

[@DolusVulpes]

@@sarafontanini7051 and he enjoyed doing it, most likely because it distracted him from how much he hated himself.

[@DolusVulpes]

@@Master-Works maybe, but that's not an easy thing to do. Most people in the real world struggle with being able to love themselves for who they are, even when they have friends and family who are there to help them. The Nowhere King had nobody and nothing except his own thoughts, and when someone who hates themselves is stuck with only their own thoughts it can only lead to a downward spiral.

[@notakittie7285]

"A flawed story is a thousand times better than a story that's never been told." That quote is going on my wall!

[@IrisGlowingBlue]

+

[@mishal2401]

I find the contrast between the Nowhere King's and General's reactions to seeing the Mysterious Woman very interesting. When the MW shows up to confront the Nowhere King, he bows and let's her take his life if she so chooses. But when she reunites with the General, the person she married, he first tries to smugly manipulate her, and when she charges him, he stumbles and runs like a coward. It kind of implies that the Nowhere King's love is more genuine than the General's. The way I see it, the Elk, as an animal, is the sort-of id between the two. He received all of the feelings from the Elktaur; good feelings like love, bad feelings like self-loathing, and the animalistic desires like eating trash. The General meanwhile turned into a straight up sociopath. He doesn't ever show any regret for any of the awful things he does, only fear of having to suffer the consequences of his own actions. I like that of the two parts, the General is the part that actually turns evil first. The Elk only becomes the Nowhere King after being driven mad by the General imprisoning him in a claustrophobic prison cell for a decade.

[@Maria-fz8km]

Rewatching how the Nowhere King speaks with the woman in season 1 after knowing all the context was really shocking. He says things like "YOU did this to me," despite this being all his own fault, and then has the audacity to say that HE forgives HER. When I fist saw the scene I thought it was a hint at him being more sympathetic but on rewatch it shows him being just as manipulative as the General.

[@idontneedaname318]

@@Master-Works she literally never did that what show are you watching

[@idontneedaname318]

To be fair neither of them ever show any level of remorse except kind of toward the mysterious woman when the elktaur comes back. But for all the people they killed? Nah

[@rutheblues4161]

Sometimes I wish that Centaurworld was a completely serious show. Moments such as The Last Lullaby always makes me mourn a show that does not exist-- one that further explores that fairytale turned tragedy. It took rewatching the series to finally come to terms with how beautifully the show intertwines that oversaturation with the bleakness of the human world. Even though I was skeptical, I'm glad I stuck with it. It's endearing in the weirdest way possible! Edit: Just to clarify, it's okay to love the show as is! Regardless of any gripes I have, I think the writers did a damn good job with the show. Silly or not.

[@TailsThewolfcat]

I agree with this take completely. I am definitely not the right audience for most of Centaurworld's humor and put off watching it for months. I'm glad I finally caved and got through the entire show, but I still found myself cringing and unable to watch large chunks of it. Though I may wish it were different, that it took itself more seriously perhaps, the times when it was serious were truly beautiful and rewarding.

[@elfertrn]

I wish they played more into the disturbing contrast between a gritty world where hundreds die and the sickly sweet centaur world, and the first bit of violence being introduced to this clean happy world could have been amazing, I wish I could like this entire show as much as I liked its best parts

[@WobblesandBean]

Agreed. By far the worst part of both seasons was the pointless, infantile fart jokes, ESPECIALLY right after Horse enters the Nowhere King's mind. Like....was that really necessary? Came out of nowhere, added nothing, and ruined what was a tense, suspenseful moment with juvenile potty humor.

[@TailsThewolfcat]

@@WobblesandBean omg right? like please, you got this far, why ruin it

[@rutheblues4161]

@@WobblesandBean See, I think fart jokes can be funny if they're done subtly. What makes it infantile really wasn't the joke itself-- it's how obnoxious it was. I think if it was less gross it would have been a bit more effective because the sudden appearance of Elk lighting a match was pretty funny and served as a perfect introduction to a creature that took himself too seriously. But I also think the constant repetition of the fart jokes in the show also made that moment a bit less funny since you could already expect it.

[@dragonkeeper1z86]

The Nowhere King: a villain who's self loathing causes a war that spanned multiple worlds and lasted decades (if not centuries). When you strip the concept of his character to those bare bones it makes it both the silliest, and most horrific summation of what he was. He was a man who could have had everything he ever wanted if he'd just stop listening to his own self hatred and started to listen to the love everyone gave to and around him. This makes him incredibly relatable as who has not listened to that nagging voice of inadequacy within themselves? Hating himself so much he externalized his hatred and harmed everyone around him, the Nowhere King's story takes that emotion to its most logical extreme.

[@SleepiAbyss]

Ah, self hatred. what a lovely thing. Welp, time to go burn down some embassies and start a war

[@FeralFelineFriend]

Damn, I felt that.

[@darkpone3731]

This is why Envy is listed as a Deadly Sin.

[@Yurikon3]

Who knows, if self hatred has been one motivation, though hidden one, to justify some real life wars.

[@gemfire400]

The people who loved him should have gotten him a therapist

[@Bluepikmin64]

I think it's super important to the nowhere king's character how the elktaur and the elk/nowhere king share a voice actor, while the general got a new voice actor. Like the elk was the true version of the elktaur and the "beast" was actually the human half, which tracks with how the humans treated the centaurs in the flash back.

[@idontneedaname318]

It could also be because if they shared an actor with the general it would have spilled the secret way too early. I suppose they could've had three actors but perhaps they didn't because of costs?

[@24601st]

but! both voice actors are named brian

[@Zistheone2]

The only thing I wish they showed with the Nowhere King's backstory was how Elktaur started admiring humans to begin with. Not only would show how his self-hatred started, but they could've introduced him being in Centaurworld's art style first (sort of a role reversal to Horse's development) and they could've even shown Woman and her family were the first humans to come from the rift when she and Elktaur were younger, showing that his crush on her was a "love at first sight" scenario.

[@shadenox8164]

I actually would prefer they didn't show it as a love at first sight thing.

[@MrStyro]

It’s crazy how the General pulled a “King Andrias” especially with Rider, he’s honestly pretty violent so I wonder how many people might have been killed because of him alone.

[@ketzellrae3888]

It's pretty telling that the Elktaur took two of the most powerful titles in history of "General" and "King" for his separate parts because deep down he was trying to make himself feel better and "in control" of the whole thing.

[@Sosotora55]

When Elktaur saw the princess his thoughts weren´t necessarily "she is the love of my life" but rather "this is my excuse to become prince charming" .

[@RasmusVJS]

When did he insinuate that? I guess you could say that it was the idea of being more human, but even then, why would it be her specifically then?

[@pinkiichi]

As amusing as your wording is I think falling in love with her is simply what pushed him to finally go through with his desire to change.

[@Sosotora55]

@@pinkiichi A change that was rooted in self-hatred and deception. Wanting to hide an uncomfortable reality instead of owning up to it and being honest with the one he loved. Like, imagine your spouse starting a war because he wanted to protect the sanitized image you and the public had of him.

[@Sosotora55]

@@RasmusVJS He married a charismatic princess that gave him love, adoration, status and fame, all while hiding a vital part of himself away for 10 years. When she went away he litteraly started larping as both the hero and villain in a made up war against himself, one with real concequenses and real harm done to everyone around him.

[@Uhcip]

@@RasmusVJS I mean, the humans saying things like "you guys smell bad" probably didn't help with his self image. The whole backstory is messed up, but kind of bold.

[@chidivids2005]

I found the death of the elktaur heart- breaking and I felt sympathy for his elk side. The general was completely appalling to me, and as much as I pity the elk-half, his nowhere king form is completely unforgiveable. His character as a whole brings up conflicting feelings in me, and is just so interesting

[@heyimjaytee]

i was SHOCKED when she actually killed him! i didn't think it was really going to happen. it was such a sad moment since i felt so much sympathy for the elk. however, it was really relieving since all of the evils of the nowhere king were gone and the herd had won

[@Mediados]

The Riftkeeper was generally a good person, but circumstance strengthened the darkness in him. That's the terrible duality of the character and why he is so good.

[@kentackett4631]

What's brilliant and the reason why I don't actually feel sorry for the elk part is that he and the general are one and the same. So he was literally doing it to himself. No matter his form, he is still the same coward.

[@darkpone3731]

He was like Gollum, a pitiable tragic villain that could not be saved after what he had done.

[@darkpone3731]

@@Master-Works but that would not free him of his guilt, he had raged horrible devastation in two worlds because he could not accept himself for who and what he is. Is he tragic? Yes. Did he accept his punishment? Yes.

[@johannaswirski934]

One thing I find interesting is that when the Nowhere King and the Woman reunite in season 1, he said that she made him into this but he forgives her.. but he literally only ever did it to himself! She was only a victim to him in all of this! She flirted with him, then he decided to mutilate himself (repeatedly) because despite her clear interest he could not believe it was true. There is clearly a part of him that blames her for how he turned out to be despite the fact that everything was self inflicted. This ties into the fact that the Elktaur (in my opinon) was never in love with her for her, but simply in love with the idea of her - the first pretty human to notice him. When she frees him from the box the General put him in he goes on about how it was her and he knew she would come, but from our perspective it seems like they only had met two other times (before the rift, at the party). He was driven mad those 10 years, was freed by her increasing his obsession, then when told to run he turned to suffering. At the end of the day she could have been anyone, and he never really knew her.

[@Nyghtking]

I've never watched the show, but one of the reasons he may be in pain, is it distinctly feels like he's an unnatural entity that reality itself is trying to reject. In that scene with the void it feels like the only place and time he is comfortable is when he's literally nowhere.

[@christinehoward415]

Personally, I think that the General is the more evil half of the Elktaur. The Elk half didn't become the Nowhere King until his other half tried to drown him and locked him away, almost certainly, alone, for a full decade. I think that the Elk half was, for the most part, driven mad from his own self loathing, spending ten years in solitude, and watching the being he loves most be married to a man that would soon after try to drown him (not in that order, obviously).

[@Mediados]

They are both the same person, what makes this so interesting. They had both their good and evil parts, and they both elevated their personal desires over their morals. The General and the Elk show perfectly how someone can change when exposed to different circumstances.

[@Mediados]

@@Master-Works Yet again, circumstance. I am sure that the General also loved the Woman just as much when he married her, but at the time when the Elk called the meeting, he had been with her for probably a few years. The General started to see her as a given, not valuing her presence as much anymore, while the Elk's desire grew ever stronger in his exile.

[@caldw615]

@@Mediados They "were" the same person but they did change as a result of the paths taken by both halves. Personality and experience wise they can be considered seperate. General managed to intergrate into human society and achieve his goals while Elk is what happens if that same person failed to obtain those through self hatred. As people, one decision or event in our lives could drastically change the person we become over time based on that. You can make all sorts of points about nature vs nurture too but it is interesting how one person could differ greatly from other versions of themselves based on these differenced in experience. Think of any life changing event you have gone through and I'm sure you've probably also wondered what it would be like if that event never happened or was different somehow (i.e breaking up with someone or choosing to stay with them).

[@idontneedaname318]

Honestly I disagree. The elktaur hated his animal part so much he split himself in two. And so his human half reacted with the same amount of hatred, but now externalized. And the elk, who was the subject of all that self hatred turned that hatred against everything else.

[@idontneedaname318]

@@Master-Works my man what show were you watching. And why are you leaving replies on every comment

[@DistantKingdom]

Awesome vid : D Another great thing about flaws is that it let's you appreciate the growth associated with overcoming said flaws. Imagine how boring a perfect, flawless world would be with no flaws to contrast against

[@filoupfluff5821]

Totally agree with your statement, this was a great analysis :) Also; I did not expect you here! :D

[@necropalypse]

Wasn't expecting to see you here. Love your vids bro. Glad to see we have other interests in common. Don't settle for less, fight for more. Imagine if gamefreak put heartwrenching stuff in their games as well as this show did. That would be amazing.

[@AnomalocarisWizard]

What a great surprise

[@cringememes1044]

Yeah if the world didn’t have flaws you would be able to milk pokemon controversy dry

[@munchobell2890]

so adveture time

[@mildarkaa]

I was surprised at how sympathetic it made me feel for the Nowhere king despite how terrible he is, and seeing the elktaur for the final time and seeing him accept his fate was really emotional for me. I've seen a lot of people compare it to Sona (which I have very little knowledge of) which the creators have used already to explain the tiny versions of the characters as well. The elk lost the coin toss and had to deal with the fact that the general, of course, wouldn't want to go back to being miserable. It was far more tragic than I expected from what we'd seen of the character.

[@snail-q6107]

Nice profile Sauce?

[@AluraAlua]

I love how this show attacks the idea of changing yourself 'for love.' Doing it for love is nothing but an excuse and will hurt you and everybody involved. If you're unhappy with yourself you have to confront it or talk about it with those closest to you, not pretend like the flaws you perceive don't exist.

[@shadenox8164]

The thing is he didn't change himself, literally yes but not in the figurative way people mean when they say that. He did nothing to actually address his real flaws, his deep self loathing.

[@AluraAlua]

@@shadenox8164 He turned himself from a magical being and split himself in half, that's a pretty big change lol

[@AluraAlua]

@@Master-Works Not split himself, maybe address why being a magical creature made him feel less-than. The girl clearly liked him before he changed so he could say he wanted to be normal for her all he wants but reality is something in him resented the magical part for some other reason he needs to figure out. He also can't then blame her for changing and basically say "Look! I did this for you!" Because, again, he did it for himself

[@AluraAlua]

@@Master-Works /She/ didn't torture him, The General did. /She/ set the elk free. I don't think she knew about the split from the start. And yeah, he should have lived the rest of his life as a magical being. We don't know how it really was, there probably were magical royalty. (Such as the CentaursTM). We only know he fell for human royalty as he himself was a rift worker. Maybe he could've done better and been more as a whole if he loved himself enough to try instead of letting the belief that he was lesser hold him back. If he believed he would never reach higher because he was magical then he never would because he gave up before he tried.

[@AluraAlua]

@@Master-Works She did that because of what HE did to both worlds, don't get it twisted. Don't you remember the war he waged, all to hide his past? Of course once he was whole again she was disgusted by all he did out of his own self-hatred. She even says she would have loved him whole in her song at the end. She hesitated for decades to hurt him because of the past they shared but in the end had to put an end to him because of all the pain he caused. He had plenty reason to love himself before he killed an unknown countless number of people and creatures to hide himself and make himself into some kind of hero character when it was himself he was fighting the whole time. He sacrificed other lives instead of facing himself and dealing with the Elk half he abandoned.

[@stellanovaluna]

So it's like the opposite of Star vs the Forces of Evil? SvtFoE: Good at first, but ends in a terrible and unsatisfying way that makes no sense CW: Not very good, but ends in a wonderfully satisfying way that perfectly wraps up the major plot points

[@canalsincontenido]

Oximorons are usually used for jokes, but there's some strength in taking an incompatible concept and giving it to someone functional to the plot. Nowhere King should be an insult, it sounds like someone very pedantic, but given to a threat it implies a lot of things that can't be defined so they'll forever be stuck in the absolute power of the unknown. I sometimes think about Kana/Azuka from WWE. She's The Empress of Tomorrow. By definition "tomorrow" can't have an emperor, and at the same time it could be an insult, it has to mean she isn't an empress today. But seeing an stopable brutal destroyer with that nickname turns into a threat. Sort of implying the outcome has already been decided.

[@ildathet]

Nowhere King has a lot of "if i don't belong anywhere, i'll be king of nothing" vibes

[@silvercheetah92]

Well he’s technically a king since part of him is married to a princess/queen but you’re right about how he belongs nowhere

[@F1areon]

Given how much he hates himself, he probably called himself "Nowhere King" bc "nowhere" is where he felt he belonged. :S

[@Phantom17685]

@@F1areon He literally states that himself when he creates the first minotaurs and is interrupted by Guskin. "I don't belong anywhere."

[@hungryLIKEALI0N]

I love this show, can’t wait for the full analysis. The Nowhere King elevated CW from a show I thought was amusing to one of my favorites.

[@KitzuneAmayori]

When I rewatched the show and got to the tree shamans I immediately knew what they meant for Horse's wants and needs. She wanted to be reunited with Rider back in her own world to get back into the war and help but what she needed was to be revealed her backstory magic to find the truth as to why the war started and the tree shamans did a good job foreshadowing it.

[@Kareszkoma]

I think the Elk died and became some kind of undead, leaving only hatred behind. Elks live usually 10-12 years, sometimes up to 20 years. From this, the Elk was in prison for 10 years. Couple years before that, couple after it. Before he uses the spell for the first time, he already seems to have problems and a highly decayed body. And inside the Nowhere King, he seems like a ghost. Maybe it wasn't that. As it seem the artifact, or the centaur origin keeps them alive and un-aging. As it was with the General. The general was old. From his birth as a 20yo guy, couple years courting, the marriage, the 10 years, the deer wandering, the first minotaur, destruction of Wammawinks home, finding Durpleton and Durpleton's age of 47. Close to 50 years have passed, and it is visible on the Woman, but not on the general. Yet, they are biologically what they became.

[@AroundTheBlockAgain]

Ooooh, a ghost haunting his own bones? That's metal as hell.

[@Kareszkoma]

@@AroundTheBlockAgain Ohh. That does sound kinda metal.

[@piraptor5677]

Honestly the nowhere king is quite the emphasis of the tragic villain archtype, none of it justifies the suffering he caused but his backstory does help you understand and even sympathize with the events the led to his creation

[@Anonomius0]

It's like Horse said "I'd feel sorry for you. If it wasn't for the suffering you caused."

[@glasstrash]

I wanna add onto the topic of the General not taking the Elk or any animal/centaur very seriously. In the scene where the nwk gets trapped in the rift and when the Mysterious Woman confronts the General. The General says "Look at him. He's gross." so casually. It really cements his self loathing and disregard for who he used to be

[@jojothebard6687]

Excellent analysis! I’ve heard through the grapevine from fans of the show that Elktaur deserves redemption instead of death. Putting aside how that ruins the tragic aspects of his history and weakens the overall story, people seem to forget that redemption doesn’t work that way. Redemption works best not if it’s forced on people (looking at you Steven Universe), but when redemption is a choice on part of the person; the path to redemption isn’t easy, it’s something to earn, not forced to earn. Redemption also works in timing, it’s a choice that could be left in the dust, that’s why there’s something called the moral event horizon. And Elktaur passed that threshold long ago, the moment his two sides turned on each other and dragged their worlds into their feud. Elktaur is pitiable in all his forms, sure, but they are also consistently irredeemable.

[@sobersplash6172]

also like how *could* he feasibly work towards redemption when everyone wants him dead for his war crimes anyway him dying was the only destination he had, and he was lucky that he went out at the hands of his beloved

[@vincetravis8701]

Elktaur's death was a cathartic end to the story. It just works and I'm kinda glad they didn't decide on having, "Steven Universe Syndrome." So many shows tend to just forgive the villain (no matter what they did) and then the victims end up playing their therapist. It tends to get tiring and I'm glad Centaurworld decided to go against the grain on that. That being said, there are some fans that have posted their general AUs and what if's on the Elktaur realizing his mistakes earlier and trying to redeem himself then. Some of them are honestly really creative and fun to read through and I actually enjoy it despite me being content with the canon ending. There was even one that I read where Elktaur never changes himself, and ends up marrying the woman, but a war still happened due to the woman's father. I have my annoyances with fanbases, but I really can't ignore some of the art and fanfic creativity that comes from it.

[@sobersplash6172]

@@vincetravis8701 yeah, like what he got was definitely deserved but the tragedy was in that _this didn't have to happen_ and that she would have accepted him as he was but then he did that, and then there was really no other destination for him than the one we saw, and the one we saw was actually the kindest result he could have gotten considering his crimes

[@RasmusVJS]

I mean, from a purely practical standpoint, narrative satisfaction be darned, unless he was still extremely powerful in his centaur form, couldn't they just, like, put him in mole jail. And please get the man some therapy while you're at it. :D

[@tartlynerdy]

I agree. His death was a long time coming in order for both worlds to heal and move on.

[@stevenclark2188]

Seeing so much evil from such a humble origin, and with such mundane relatable motivations is very unusual. I think it might be important to tell ourselves stories with villains like this because they psychologically resemble real ones so much better.

[@Gen0ration9k]

Elktaur actually did feel regret, though he didnt remain long enough to runinate on it. When he's about to be stabbed he raises his head to show he understands and accepts death openly.

[@Beel3-t9t]

Horse's growth is one of my favorites, to be honest. She has changed a lot in her personality and how she looks. I gotta say though, I loved Horse's last design.

[@WyrmsOfWonder]

honestly, wish that centaur world had gotten more episodes so it could give more time to cover everything. IT honestly felt like they weren't given enough time and budget to do everything they wanted to do

[@BrokensoulRider]

That was I think the main complaint. It should have been a 3-season epic with the 2nd focusing on flashbacks and building up to WHO the Nowhere King truly was, and a lot of build up to a great climax.

[@cryptidclaws3640]

Okay so it may just be blinding nostalgia but the nowhere king always made me feel uneasy to an impressive degree. The reason I mentioned the nostalgia thing is because of the resemblance to The Litch. They both give off such a powerful feeling of unease by design alone and the fact that neither appear very often just adds to the intrigue. Or maybe I just saw a creature with a dark colour scheme, gold horns, green eyes and a skull for a face and made a connectionthat wasn’t there.

[@princetchalla2441]

I think skeletons in general give us a primal fear, because I remember seeing artistic portrayals of the Wendigo with a skull as a head and that triggered that spine tingling fear to some degree. Even to this day.

[@autobotstarscream765]

The Nowhere King reminds me of the Hollows from Bleach and the Grimm from RWBY.

[@RainyStast]

Yes! When I first saw the nowhere king I immediately thought of the Lich. Slow head rotations will never not be creepy to me and I feel that alone scared even more than his design.

[@catelynh1020]

When i was watching the show, i had strong evil version of no face vibes as well as the litch from adventure time. There's something about a dark color scheme with a contrasting light face, the use of bones or horns or even a mask of a sort to separate you from them, of something so sizable being *fast*, the use of ooze or a nonstatic body... it tells your lizard brain to watch out for danger. Add to that that the nowhere king also gave me strong wasp vibes with his segmented body type and embodies illness (illness of body and of mind), and you have a villain that a deep part of you will always feel unease towards

[@uncroppedsoop]

@@autobotstarscream765 okay let's start a list for this shit - The Lich - Hollows - NWK - The Grimm What's next?

[@ScribeHolder]

I was unconvinced to watch centaur world til I saw the Nowhere King a character I saw as a character driven to anger and murder by his own self.

[@AlexHyena1]

the story of the Elktaur, the General and the Nowhere King reminds me of a popular theory in real world psychology - the ego, super-ego and the id. the id is the side of us that is impulsive and greedy, the super-ego is our rational and logical side, and the ego is our perception of reality with a balance between the former. The General represents the super-ego, being cold and planning, using his power to achieve a logical goal. the Nowhere King is the id, being destructive, reckless and thoughtless. and Elktaur is the ego because he was literally the balance of these two entities

[@sethleoric2598]

I legitimately never expected such a terrifying and badass villain for such a show like.. this.

[@bearlyalive9669]

Can we talk about something Horse said in Season 1 when the flowers sang the lullaby? She said, "I think I've heard this before.. " was that ever touched on in this season?

[@empressofkingfishers8656]

I think that implies she heard the Minotaurs or maybe villagers singing the song back in her world

[@lilimeowkitties5766]

I like how they used backstory magic instead of using people talking to progress the plot

[@chaoticcordi]

I don't mean to sound evil, but I think Rider should have not had such an easy and simple recovery. It just seems... wrong, especially after watching her almost die.

[@shadenox8164]

Centaurworld has more than enough magic to explain that.

[@ReddwarfIV]

I thought she died until she appeared later. You'd think someone would have called for a medic.

[@pika1222]

At first, I didn’t watch Centaurworld show because I thought it was too goofy. But now, seeing this Nowhere King, I wanna watch it just for them

[@descent1667]

i honestly just wish the nowhere king's presence had been felt more throughout the second season. not in the sense of him literally being on screen more, but i wish it felt like the status quo of centaurworld had been changed at least somewhat by his release -- that would've added even more weight to him as an antagonist, in my opinion. even so he's a great villain, and this is a great analysis, i'll be looking forward to any more videos on the series :)

[@SuperSylar]

19:30 "Is a show about how important is to finds ways to be comfortable" So that's why Comfortable Doug is the most powerful and important character! It all comes full circle now!

[@Zarmdthecoolest]

Comfy Douglass

[@shadenox8164]

But remember, war is never comfortable.

[@ImperialWarrior6490]

Centaurworld was a great example of why Hollywood should stop the "happy ending" trope. I'm not saying that we should stop making endings that are happy and sunshine and rainbows and only dark and depressing, but we should have endings that are a mix of both. They stay with us longer and/ or have a more profound impact upon viewers instead of just being all goody goody. TLDR: Happy endings shouldn't be forced.

[@Oshroth]

In regards to there not being enough buildup with the general, I do somewhat agree with the sentiment that we needed a episode with Rider and General to better flesh out the bond between the two and show why Rider takes the General's side over Horse's during Episode 8, but that may have felt out of place as when it comes down to it, Centaurworld is about Horse and her journey

[@artisannoteworthy]

I also really appreciate that Elktaur in the end, DIDN'T get the whole switch of: "I see how bad I was. I swear I'll be good from now on." and suddenly became a "good guy." He had MANY chances to make that change, but never did. He DID see the suffering he caused, and even got some closure - The Woman told him that she WOULD have loved him, the way he originally WAS (Elktaur, rather than the General or the Elk). It confirms what he'd already said; "We didn't even *try*" If he had, this whole mess would never have happened, but he couldn't see past his own hatred of himself to listen to the one person who COULD have returned the love. His end was perfectly done. He came to the realization of all the misery he caused, had some form of an apology to the woman he loved, and finally got his peace. Shows are too afraid to let a character DIE, opting for the cheap, complete 180 on their personality. That said; The Nowhere King has ALWAYS been my favorite character in the show. He threads the line of; 'I feel so sorry for him' to 'what he's done out of petty spite is unforgivable'.

[@Peridact]

Check out Infinity Train please, the characters arcs are amazing and told in such an incredible way. The show also has a character that went tragically irredeemable while not failing to make the audience feel sorry for them. The shows character arcs and themes are so original and relatable, talking about things like identity, empathy, adjusting to change, peer pressure and much more. Hell, they even had a character who is a clinical narcissist. The show is one of the best written cartoons ever made and pays close attention to detail as well, so if you love foreshadowing using background details that will also be a treat for you. Simply the design of a tool a character uses could foreshadow their past, the season 3 protagonists were in a hidden Easter egg in the season 1 finale, cleverly hidden and intriguing from the start.

[@ashers1930]

Who was the narcissistic character?

[@Peridact]

@@ashers1930 Simon. He's also my fave character.

[@Santisima_Trinidad]

So, it's a (extremely well done and unique) version of the old story where a scientist creates a machine that will remove his evil half, and then the evil half will actually come out as a clone and proceed to do evil stuff, typically ending with the "whos who" face off because it can be funny.

[@Santisima_Trinidad]

@Sauc3r thats not quite the one I'm thinking of, but it's a decent enough example yes. Oh, and its Jeckal and Hyde.

[@mochiandturtles5642]

I thought it was Jekyll and Hyde?

[@Santisima_Trinidad]

@@mochiandturtles5642 I'll be honest, not sure about the spelling of it. But those two specially stayed as 1 body, it just flipped between the 2 personalities.

[@IronycheinPain]

@@Santisima_Trinidad it isn't even 2 personalities as it is more the same person with a different set of faces (literally, in Hyde, Jekyll just feels younger in every aspect (like teenager??? young) and is unrecognizable enough to let him do whatever the hell he wants with no perceivable repercussions) that eventually are perceived as two different people by the very person who caused that persona of himself to exist

[@Santisima_Trinidad]

@@IronycheinPain i don't appreciate the message spamming (it might just be youtube fuckery, but theres like 7 copy pastes pf the same message) but thanks for clarifying it a bit. The point still stands, its only 1 body, not 2 separate bodies, but it is similar in it being separate people.

[@godricnecro]

The Nowhere King feels like the Extremist version of Doug's phrase "none of us are comfortable until we are all comfortable." because it is taken to "nobody is *ALLOWED TO BE* comfortable until *I AM* Comfortable." I'm sorry to anyone who hates Comfortable Doug (Flat Dallas(insert another name change here)), it is just what came to my mind.

[@cherudon5310]

I loved how op the NK was. If Horse never froze him and instead he kept up the fight ... I don't think anybody would lived.

[@hayleyhistorynerd2211]

This was a truly beautiful and insightful look at the Nowhere King and some of the biggest components of Centaur World. I absolutely loved the part where you said: "...flawed that's a term of endearment. It takes courage and perspective to recognize flaws, and more importantly, to see past them. In the grand scheme of things, a flawed story is is a thousand times better than a story that's never been told, because every work of art has something meaningful to teach us." Such an excellent philosophy! I wish I could frame this and put it up on my wall. It's such a powerful way to look at the stories we consume. I know in critique circles this argument has probably been made to death, but I could help but think of my love for the Star Wars Prequels and my sadness with the Star Wars Squeals. I have the feeling the writers/producers where so afraid of flaws that they dropped huge parts of the story's potiencial and even characters. I know the Prequels have flaws, but I can get past them and I really love those films and characters. The Nowhere King is on my top list of villians, for all the points you mentioned. I thought he was very well done and thought out, tragically sad, but also undone by his own flaws. I thought your point about him being forever uncomfortable with himself was r a revaltion, I knew that he had self loathing, especially for his centaur-elk part, that it was the fatal flaw that tore him apart and ultimately led to his descruction, but putting that within the realm of uncomfortableness really takes it to the next level. I noticed the importance of self love and healing and connection with others in the story, but putting it in the framework of comfortable describes a whole theme I hadn't noticed, but now I definitely see it. Fantastic work Diregentleman, Subscribed! \^_^/ Hayley ^_^

[@drooler8557]

Wow, this was some phenomenal analysis! I really appreciated you pointing out the parallels between the Nowhere King and Horse - I remember the elk telling Horse that they're more similar than she thinks with her denying it, but this makes so much more sense.

[@edsiecap898]

I would like to point out that visually, the elktaur stands out in centaurworld. Where centaurworld's style is round with blurry shadings, he is sharp with cell shadings, making him stand out in thw crowd and I think its a neat detail that really signifies how he really doesnt feel comfortable in centaurworld despite being a centaur

[@Dawn-900]

KZbin getting a lil bold with these two 15 second unskipable ads

[@nessie968]

I know right? It's super annoying.

[@lunagale1573]

It'll cool down after January. They're increasing ads for Christmas season

[@jeremy1860]

Something I appreciate about this show was their decision to have the King come to an end in the way that he was. Very often in animated media, there's this prevailing sense of "forgive and forget", where those who do wrong can come back and be better people. And while I like that as an idea, especially in these doom and gloom sort of days, it doesn't feel warranted in many cases I've seen. Frequently, the forgiveness is given to those whose actions are objectively too terrible for there to be any real making up for it. Sympathy we may feel, and regret they may feel, but that is not the same thing as them being redeemable, as harsh as that may sound 😟

[@KlearChristal]

@@Master-Works A cliché overused one.

[@ryanfink4206]

@@Master-Works that's great and all, honestly. But the nowhere king commited unspeakable acts, no, waves, of mass murder, death and possibly genocide. WammaWink is the last alpacataur from her entire home. In the bearatuar's recreated battle, which we know is backed up by fact from the princess, the dead centaurs are all alpacas. He killed hundreds of thousands humans and centaurs alike, not to mention the fucked up lives the minotaurs live, being an amalgamation of different, previously existing beings, formed into one, by his own doing. It gets to a point where they can't just say "I want to be good now". There has to be consequence.

[@ryanfink4206]

@@Master-Works in this case; Killed by the object of his obsession.

[@ryanfink4206]

@@Master-Works But he clearly isn't harmless. He never learned anything. He never made an attempt. All he did was self hate, manipulate the princess, and cause suffering. Just because he was made physically one being again, doesn't mean he was harmless. It sounds very straw man-y, but Would someone like Hitler be considered redeemable? Would vlad the impaler be redeemable? Stalin? Khan? Caesar? You can't just take that many lives and cause that much suffering and get off scotch free

[@hyalophora]

@@Master-Works As you said: redemption is a choice. At any time, the Elktaur, the General, or the Nowhere King could have made that choice. He wasn't forced to do any of the horrible things he did- he _chose_ to. He made the wrong choice, and he paid the price. He _could have_ redeemed himself, but he refused to, and _that's_ why he had to be killed.

[@songbird6414]

I know nothing about this character, but his design was so fantastic that I had to look into him.

[@cyndaquil1433]

I like the idea that elktaur was actually drawn more “realistic” and didn’t have that centaur world “Pop” causing us to see how he felt different and not understood in centaur world but felt he belonged in the human world

[@bluejellyfish4983]

His ending was subverting in an amazing way. I was expecting them to give him a quick and lazy redemption arc in the last 30 minutes but no, they let the bad guy be bad and got rid of him. The song the purple princess lady (idk her name) sang was honestly amazing and it was all really refreshing

[@brashblond]

@@Master-Works Dude, it was Elktaur’s fault. BOTH sides of him for various reasons. Why is this so difficult for you to understand? No amount of “good intentions,” “misguided efforts” or whatever you want to call it will subvert the cruelty of the Nowhere King’s actions. Period. In real life, you reap the repercussions of your actions and in some situations those repercussions are far to great to be redeemed by simply having a change of heart. Even if the General side was more intrinsically cruel, the Elk side was still equally as flawed and in end they both contributed to their ultimate downfall. For Elktaur to have survived in the end after everything that his two sides had done would have simply been terrible storytelling from a literary perspective. Not all endings are happy both in life and in fiction. Deal with it.

[@andistansbury4366]

I think her name might just be woman

[@normalhuman9878]

She doesn’t have an actual name, so we just call her “mysterious woman”

[@Wolfiyeethegranddukecerberus17]

The King didn't even have malicious intent, but his actions spoke differently. Depressing to see how low desperation dragged a good hearted centaur. I also love how the show made me sympathize with the horrifying elk zombie monster over a human character. Mad respect.

[@TheBigE9999]

The virgin horde prime: I'm bringing light and order to the universe, so I'm really the good guy The chad nowhere king: I am literally going to kill everyone and everything and I'm going to sing a kickass rock ballad about said genocide while i do it

[@SomeRANDOMpersonwhodraws]

So glad someone made a video on this! After I watched the show I was like Damn this is a underrated villain

[@ItsSpudNick]

You know throughout the final I didn't have much sympathy for the nowhere king... but do you know what broke me? It was the moment his love see's him for the last time and says " I would of loved you whole"... I know the nowhere king did alot! Of terrible thing's but... dang I didn't want him to die

[@iblekoblek]

Personally, I really love The Nowhere King in the first season finale, but after that he felt a lot less intimidating. He's been released onto the world, but he barely shows up and when he finally does something he's frozen in place and danced on by a hair-eating bird. I wish he'd gotten to actually do a little more.

[@MfwPrivate]

I haven't heard about this show, but the nowhere king sounds incredibly cool.

[@markerofthemidnight7469]

You see, there’s something I’ve been thinking about that really blows my mind about just how well the Nowhere King was written. A few minutes ago, I looked up what the worst traits of animal and human were. I found absolutely nothing, so this is just my interpretation. The worst trait of humans is our mind (because duh). The worst trait of animals is their foolishness. Elktaur was very intelligent as centaurs go, but he was also very foolish to give up his animal side completely, to traits that, once you think about it, the General and the Nowhere King also have. The General is both intelligent and foolish for, well, obvious reasons. The Nowhere King is also intelligent because duh, and also very foolish for thinking that he genuinely belongs nowhere when that’s not the case. The Elktaur tried so hard, but no matter what he did to himself, there was one thing he could never escape: *He will always have the worst traits of both animal and man.*

[@Hey-Its-Dingo]

A really cool detail: I saw a comment on an upload of the song "The Last Lullaby Part 1" that pointed out how, at the end when Mysterious Woman uses her magic to pick him up and throw him to the ground, he looks at the shadow of his antlers, but also, his hand is clearly a separate shadow. The point of this is that it is the first time that The General has seen his antlers since The Elk escaped, but also the first time The Elk has seen his hands since The General imprisoned him. (I really wish I could remember who the commenter was, because it was a great observation. If you read the comments of a few uploads of the song, than you'll surely find them yourself. Sorry.)

[@ruthiewitter569]

“A flawed story is 1,000 times better than a story that has never been told.” That means a lot to me. Thank you. I needed to hear that.

[@dasme8210]

elktaur was pretty much the definition of : You can't truly love someone until you love yourself.

[@bnsz8704]

The Nowhere King has got to be one of the coolest villain names I’ve ever heard

[@HighlandHellboy]

Literally just binged all of s2 today now that my semester is done and this video came at such a perfect time for me! 💚💚💚 Parts of s2 was meh, parts of it was wonderful, The Nowhere King truly exemplifying that.

[@hecc7906]

Remember kids, if you don't accept yourself you'll become a horrid creature that wreaks havoc and commits gruesome crimes with an army of centaurs

[@-Secret]

I genuinely appreciate the route the show went with the nowhere king. He was beautifully written. What I value the most is his end. We learn that he is tied to a human who is ALSO responsible for destroying the world. It's almost as if it doesn't matter WHICH half he is, he is destined to destroy. One is selfish and afraid to die and the other is full on obsessed with revenge to everyone. We the. Learn though that the nowhere king has a backstop to his insanity and mindless killing, and although he was tortured when he finally was put back together with his other half there genuinely wasn't a redemption arc. He paid the price, both halves did for their crimes. He was truly a perfect antagonist. I felt so much empathy for him, but at the same time it felt right that he died. He wasn't innocent, and made horrible decisions that in the end had a price. I loved the way he bowed his head, he shed a tear, but accepted his fate. He knew he was wrong. He didn't run, he finally let the torture for himself, and everyone else to end.

[@rat7791]

The Nowehere King, his story, and the small background segments of the main cast were the only parts of this season I enjoyed. It's just the WRITING, THEY F E E L GOOD. Now, I don't mind silly or cartoonish fun, but DAMN DOES THE REST OF THIS SHOW JUST IRRITATE ME, THE MAIN CAST JUST DON'T FEEL LIKE PEOPLE TO ME, I dunno.

[@LiIGremlin]

I was watching this show, because i had nothing else and i was bored, and i suddenly just found my favorite cartoon villain, cool!

[@FTMothman]

Your breakdown of this is honestly one of the best videos I’ve ever seen on KZbin. Especially the end, I don’t know what it was about what you said about the nowhere king resigning to being never being comfortable but it hit me like a truck. It might be due to how my life has been but hell if that didn’t make me have to sit down and stare at my own hands for a while.

[@Chorauless]

I have no idea what the hell this show is never even heard of it but you still made me watch this entire video amazing just amazing

[@SarahBabe]

I flipping love Centaurworld. Glendale is the anthropomorphization of my internal anxieties.

[@lordskull4382]

12:41 I know that’s not a pun but I can’t help but hear it as progenitaur

[@ryand394]

I don't think the elk is the worse part of the Nowhere King. The fact that he woke up, conscious and capable of language, and with his usual memories, in his elk body, just as conscious and capable as his human counterpart, wasn't what he expected at all. Surely he expected to get a human form, and for the elk in him to be all animal. Before he was imprisoned for years, he did try to undo the damage he did. He tried reasoning with the General to get them both back together. It's the General's selfishness that really sparked the madness in him. The General tried to murder him. The General kept him locked up. Not just for ten years in that dungeon, but for many more in the body of the elk that deteriorated. Even back when they first meet in the Nowhere zone, when the Mysterious Woman came in with the key, he immediately and instinctively offered himself up and forgave her. She's the one who hesitated. There is definitely corruption there. His forgiveness was probably some form of gaslighting, or maybe his wrath afterward when she hesitated was calculated, but that doesn't change the fact that the Nowhere King is a victim that deserved redemption. Not the General. Not the Elktaur. Just the Nowhere King. All that said, I'm still glad that when made whole again, he didn't beg for his life or try for self-preservation, and the Mysterious Woman didn't pull any punches. It's definitely not the Nowhere King's fault, but it is his responsibility to atone. And dying is really the only suitable punishment, after all the destruction and damage dealt.

[@ryand394]

Very underrated comment. Glad you underlined the nuance! I'm very much of the same mind.

[@hioman]

I love watching 20 minute videos on a show I've never seen

[@AquaticFerret]

Truly one of my favorite villain arcs in like anything. What a fun, and surprisingly intriguing show Great video