Discovering the Secrets of 11,000 Year Old Carvings at Sayburç

While at Göbekli Tepe last year, we made a pilgrimage to the famous 11,00 year old carvings at Sayburç - here is a report of our adventure.
The media got quite excited in early 2023 about how the little man in the Sayburç carvings was holding himself. We too reported on the discovery - but I hope we managed to emphasise that the significance was that it seems to be the first known example of a narrative scene recorded in a carving.
Little did we know that thanks to support through our Göbekli Tepe to Stonehenge project (see below), we would be in Turkey within the year staring the little fella in the face.
Anyway, here is our overview of the day we visited Sayburç Man and our take on the significance of the carving and the archaeological site as a whole.
00:00 - Introduction & Overview
01:42 - How Sayburç Man became famous
04:02 - Getting to Sayburç
05:12 - Sayburç village
11:58 - First impressions of Sayburç Man and the carvings
17:15 - Do the carvings tell a story?
26:26 - The bull/aurochs and man carving
31:01 - The significance of the carvings
33:18 - This is a ‘special building’ amongst many.
36:00 - Modern re-use of T-Pillars at Sayburç
38:00 - Rounding up and goodbyes
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[@Rusty-GB]

To be fair. If i were standing between two leopards i'd probably be holding my bits as well. 😱. Another very informative upload. Thank you Gents. 👍

[@differous01]

Among Massai and Zulu you're not a man (ie. your bits don't count) until you kill either a lion or leopard.

[@HBADGERBRAD]

Hear hear! As would I.

[@tammiewilson5185]

😂😂😂😂😂❤❤❤❤

[@tammiewilson5185]

​@@differous01interesting!

[@donfronterhouse4759]

Indeed, myself as well, old boy.

[@kateveneroso5754]

as a lady with a degree in Myth and World Relgions, it makes me smile to see a man holding his bits between two leapords!

[@kiminnehalem8669]

I wonder if Dr. Irving Finkel, British Museum, might have some knowledge of a Sumerian, or older, story relating to this narrative panel? He is an amazing human resource!!!

[@hhunstad2011]

An absolute delight, on top of being a brilliant historian and storyteller!

[@JonnoPlays]

Yes they should really have him on the program. That would be a good watch for sure.

[@735Gladstone]

Sumer isn't' older than these Turkish site. But you are right about the wide spread motif

[@bethbartlett5692]

I adore that man!

[@garyleiser753]

Turkey/Anatolia is a treasure house with far more to be discovered.

[@watcherspirit2351]

I was delighted to see the image of you standing near to the little fellow. Now I have visual context. He's smaller than I thought! Thanks for the fantastic report.

[@bonitareardon5987]

Given the astonishing age of some European folk tales, it might be interesting to look at Turkish folk tales from the area around the "Tepes", to see if foxes, leopards etc play a part.

[@kariannecrysler640]

Loving all the art! We spent so many years with the idea that people back then were so “wild”, but really they were just people lol 💯💕

[@ellen4956]

The whole narrative sort of reminds me of the old breakfast restaurants in the U.S. called "Sambo's" that had a narrative panel around the top of the room of scenes from the story, where the little boy gives the tiger parts of his clothes (including his pants - he's hiding behind a leaf then), and he eventually convinces the tiger to chase its own tail around a tree, going so fast it turns into butter. I know, it doesn't make sense but that's the story.

[@wandapease-gi8yo]

I remember that chain (if it was a chain). We would stop there when on Vacation at the Oregon Coast. He is still there, but looking at the pictures he is properly placed in India.

[@Sally4th_]

I loved that story when I was a kid but sadly, because the title was "Little Black S...", the name got used as a racist insult here in the UK and the book was withdrawn by the publisher.

[@wandapease-gi8yo]

@@Sally4th_ it might not have made it in the UK anyway because of the British Raj. But here in the States any suggestion of Blackness brought out the hysteria that the only Dark skinned people in the world were ex slaves from Africa. Mention had to be deleted even though the young hero was very bright in negotiating with the Tiger (the black focused hysterics missed that Tigers don’t live in Africa) to take a piece of useless to it splendor instead of simply eating him. Then getting the cats to chase each other around the tree until they turned into melted butter which Sambo used with his breakfast cakes after retrieving all his clothing! As a child I always thought highly of Sambo’s intelligence and quick witted ness! Was the book originally written for a UK audience?

[@richardfinlayson1524]

little black sambo was a childrensbook my grandparents had when i was a kid, same story. not politically correct i suspect lol.

[@caralynhale3757]

Thank-you - wonderful stuff. Curious / significant ..... the figure between the leopards is carved in high relief, while the rest of the visible carving is in low relief .

[@chappellroseholt5740]

Good Sunday morning from the glorious SF Bay Area. Hold onto what's important! Thanks for another great video.

[@williammeyer214]

Perhaps it’s the eternal theme of a man caught in a tight place ,whether between two leopards, bulls, or wife and mother-in-law. The hero must summon his manly courage to emerge from the threat intact. Very thought provoking.

[@braddbradd5671]

The turf roofs id say is more to keep the sun from distressing the the wood and branches of the roof than from keeping the water out cos they do that now in Iran wooden beams then a thin plastic sheet then they cover it with soil last for years and years

[@She_Nanigans]

Proof that since the dawn of time man has been obsessed with his bits. 😂

[@gaufrid1956]

The man facing the auroch was either very brave, or very afraid. The same goes for the guy holding his bits between two leopards. Another excellent video, guys!

[@arzucufoglu8932]

Thank you.

[@LynneSheridan-ve2cm]

I think we are always trying to work it out - what could this be or what could it be used for. However, I think all we can do is to respect that people were there, they created these buildings - how and where they did create them and for what reason, is hard for us to deduce. But how can we know the reason, we see the site through the lens of 2024. People of the past were clever, they were creative and they were innovative..................just like people today. Excellent presentation and thought provoking as usual.

[@geoffjohannes4787]

The Armenian Anatolians in this area believed in the Svot. A little man who lived inside their houses in the walls in winter,rwho had to be driven out in winter by the women of the hose to work the fields ensuring a good harvest.

[@logos1242]

Maybe the belief in the Svot was inspired by finding the carvings on the base of houses built on top of ancient ruins. Interesting that it is to do with good harvests. Wasn't that region where farming wheat began ?

[@forestdweller5581]

Good observations by you gentlemen!

[@janetmackinnon3411]

THank you!

[@carolhutchinson566]

Love your relaxed approach to your scholarly work… especially appreciate the giggling

[@mr.d6987]

You could say Sayburc Man is Standing With Stones... in his hand.

[@toniomalley5661]

Another great one guys

[@Mirrorgirl492]

Thank you so much for this incredible behind the scenes adventure.

[@holly50575]

I truly enjoyed the comparison of the narrative depictions from three different sites! Very thought provoking!!! Many thanks.

[@nodarkthings]

It's all so exciting. Your videos from inside these places were fascinating and important. I've just been looking at excavated Easter Island statues and the similarities between the depiction of their arms is staggering.

[@nightlyshift]

It 's the easiest way to carve arms on a large block… any other way you'd have to remove WAY more stone!

[@nodarkthings]

@@nightlyshift I mean the way they come down and cradle their bellies with their hands. It's quite distinctive.

[@nilcarborundum7001]

@@nodarkthings sure, I know what you mean. Quite an iconic stance! It's what pregnant women do instinctively, but we're told the depictions here are all male…

[@nodarkthings]

@@nilcarborundum7001 that's true..

[@bill8784]

Fascinating. Just been reading about the climate at the time it was occupied and seemed a lot more pleasant with plenty of scope for wild cereals and animals.

[@Ari-jj9op]

The bog body they named Louvernius/Fox was named that because he had a wrap of fox fur around his arm.

[@lulubelle0bresil]

Gents, please remember there may be first-time viewers seeing your current vid, or even "casual viewers" that watch you on occasion but aren't much acquainted with the theme and you don't want to alienate them - it would be good if, for example, you mentioned that "tell" is a mound or artificial hill (the automated subtitles say "tail") and other things of that archaeo-lingo nature - I don't think it would disturb hardcore fans and it would be somewhat refreshing for most people - please consider the possibility! 🙏 PS not describing the dishes of that great meal was a SIN! 💔

[@PeachysMom]

The thumbnail for this video is a masterpiece

[@1916JAD]

Great conversation chaps. Thanks very much.

[@jonkayl9416]

Great Video, Thank you for making.

[@bigbadthesailor5173]

I remember staying a night in Sanliurfa in 1988 - it did feel very very old, but little did I know!!!

[@MultimediaIreland]

Well it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to suggest it's a euphemism, seeing that these people were immersed in animal iconography, maybe 'dangling the snake' is what it sounds like. We have many euphemisms today for urinating and other bodily functions, can't see why these people wouldn't think similarly.

[@bonnieskilton3247]

Tas Tepler was a grouping of individualized centers of GARDENERS. Not yet agriculturalists, but ‘gatherers’ who understood and took advantage of natural seasonal harvests… To make beer. IF YOU BREW IT THEY WILL COME! Stone vats have been analyzed and determine that in Gobeckly Tepe, BEER was being brewed. So my conclusion is: humans gathered at these sites to celebrate BEER…so there was probably a ‘side-show’ of entertainments and feasting. Turn the party into hunting tales of bravery and courage as drunk men tend to do. GARDENERS.. BREWERS.. count on it!

[@terrabytesarcheology]

Lindow man AKA pete march, wore a fox fur arm band

[@nelshrestha]

Rather than thinking of the carvings being something modest due to them being on a bench, maybe the bench was where someone/several people of status sat, which is why it warranted being decorated? It will have taken someone quite a bit of time and effort to make those carvings, so it could be considered as a relatively expensive undertaking when even basic daily needs and chores were time/labour intensive.

[@sabrik3885]

Great video. I heard someone speculate that the figure that looks like he's dancing in front of the bull holding a snake / sling is actually a man holding the private parts of the bull that he has castrated and is taunting him with it. Food for thought.

[@Lerie2010able]

Another informative and enjoyable talk - thanks guys.

[@MrGaborseres]

Thanks guys I enjoyed all the great information and you to explaining it 🤗👍

[@AngelsVoiceASMR]

New subscriber here! I have been binging the channels “praveen Mohan” exploring temple carvings and “mind unveiled” that explores tartaria and underground tunnels and symbols in history. Now just came across this video and so thankful for another new fun interesting truth seeking channel. As an Art History Major, I am so intrigued by every historical art piece!!

[@KathleenStidham]

❤

[@aranciataesagerata2506]

Bulls are frightened of snakes, so the figure in front of the bull is trying to keep the huge a and dangerous bull away shaking a dead snake

[@OwlTiny]

This story is known. This is the proto Master of Animals, specifically the Leader of the Summer Hunt, the period to hold this position is explicitly shown: 9 years. A sar the period between eclipse lunar and solar eclipse. This is well recorded at GT using snake years. A snake has sufficient ribs to count the days in the year. Nine Snakes (years) are shown terminate at an auroch, again the master of the hunt is implied as it is here. This is shown on another t-pillar also, this shows eight snakes, with two becoming three 8-2+3=9(years)! They also refer to eight (years) as this is when the moon and venus appear next to one another (this is explicitly shown on another t-pillar), an eight year Octaeteris (with five visibility cycles of Venus) . They are screaming 'we have a calendar!' actually a really good one. The reason cats are used is to do with the number of digits, they have 8 at the back and 10 at the front, 18 - this is referring to the period between solar eclipses (A Saros) and half this is a Sar, they are showing the cat at the side, 9 digits shown on each side. They are using animals to refer to astronomical periods (counts). Snakes are a basic abacus to count the days in a year, cats refer to Saros and Sar. The Minoans articulate this very well and the Dactyls (fingers) their founders hailed from ANatolia! They even use the SAME symbols in Cretan hieroglyphs. It is a long read, but this puts this earlier symbolism in context: www.quora.com/What-can-we-not-understand-about-Minoans/answer/Nick-Deakin-4 "Minos (leader) was last to leave the arena and went to the caves to consult with Zeus (Sky Father) to bring in new laws every nine years." Minos means nine. At Catalhoyuk hunters are seen to be tapping migratory herds (it appears to be some right of passage), this evolves into Bull Leaping in the fullness of time and it is most likely the leader is the most talented becomes the leader of the summer hunt (requiring many tribes to drive migratory herds into traps). They are mimicking what they observe in the sky, following natural order. Their deities are: Mother Earth, Daughter Moon, Son - the Sun and his lady Venus. This is specifically shown at Catalhoyuk on a relief carving, there is a stone tablet from GT, it uses signs instead, here is the thing, the MInoans are using the very same signs! The bulls horns are to trap a celestial body above at a datum event like solstices and equinox. The Son/Sun (the Master of Animals) in this context is the tribes son, the Leader (law-giver). This symbolism is important, they are limiting the leaders time in the role to no more than NINE YEARS. This is known well before this, there is a mamouth tusk from modern-day Ukraine, it is explicitly showing horn type devices trapping the sun at datums, they are marking solstices and equinoxes, even where eclipses occur! 15,000 BCE and this technical diagram is recorded along with repeating astronomical counts (9 and 18 years). At GT they also use scorpions, that have nine appendages. They are not revering these creatures per se, they have the right number that they wish to refer to (symbolically) and reasonably unambiguously (what else has the right count for days in the year (snakes have around 350 ribs), scorpions nine appendage, cats 18 digits.

[@williamhorse5527]

If you were retelling a story or theme and needed a way to convey ‘and he was afraid’, I would think that depicting a figure guarding his most vulnerable places, would be very recognizable to a majority of predominantly hunter/gatherer people 11,000yrs ago

[@elizabethmcglothlin5406]

Yes, absolutely there's a story there and we'll never know what it was. But can't help wondering if it was an ancient running joke--or PSA--'Remember to watch for leopards while having a pee'. And the gent just past him is, 'Don't try to hunt an aurochs with a sling'. (or a snake!)

[@wrorchestra1]

When looking at the carving as a whole (looking past the fact he's holding himself), I can't help but get the image of the Epic of Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh would be the carved relief. He's a King/chieftain and the leopards seem to be important as status symbols. The figure is also carved, not just a bas-relief. The second figure is bas-relief but depicted the same height as the first. Less of a servant more of a companion, just as Enkidu was. He also has a weapon of some kind. Enkidu was a hunter/warrior. They appear to be fighting a bull (somewhat similar in shape to the constellation Taurus). The Euphrates is only 25 miles north of Sayburç. Follow the river south into southern Iraq and 6 miles East of the river, you'll find the city of Uruk. Probably a few thousand years between the 2 but I found the parallels to be really interesting.

[@richaelblewett5068]

Lol, could the story be that yes indeed, men are turned on by danger. Thanks for the discussion today.

[@Melih_R_Calikoglu]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1800">30:00</a> May be the guy is tricking the bull to a trap :)

[@oldschool1993]

Tuned out as soon as I realized it was those two smirking, giggling fools.

[@alexanderguesthistorical7842]

You keep saying "fox", but there is no definitive proof that the animal depictions are indeed foxes. I think, given the setting and the fact that the animals are depictions of somewhat long, thin quadrupeds with short legs, it's far more likely that these carvings were actually meant to represent stoats (mustela erminea). In medieval Europe, the pure white winter coats of the stoat (with a black tail tip) were known as ERMINE. Indeed stoats are thought to have originated in the near east, possibly Armenia, not a million miles away from Gobekli Tepe. Is it therefore possible that the 'holder' of the 'fox' at Gobekli Tepe was in fact a representation of a KING? Certainly that T pillar also bears a representation of an animal pelt tucked into his belt. Could that therefore be representation of an ERMINE pelt? Was the tip of the pelt tail originally painted black? Were these Tepe monuments, with the possible association with the carving at Sayburc all to do with the coronation of kings? The kings in question, in that time and place, being (to our eyes) related to very small, probably city-state polities, hence the somewhat profusion of Tepe sites in Turkey. This would echo many of the Greek myths who featured heroes who would complete tasks and then become the king of a city state, like Athens or Mycenae perhaps. It may seem an improbable proposition, given the extreme antiquity of the monuments. However, nobody knows the when was the birth of the system which gave rise to coronations- i.e. Kingship and the panoply of symbolism which surrounds it, such as ermine in the medieval period. Where the priesthood anoints the King with their blessing for his rule, therefore upholding his regime, and the King in return receives a weapon from the priesthood as a symbol of his duty to defend the faith and priesthood with his martial power. Indeed the Sayburc carving could be a depiction of the very moment of coronation itself, where the rite is 'sanctified' by the King holding on to his penis, to 'testify' (from the same origin as the word for testicles). The fact that there is no crown, which is our own ultimate symbol of kingship present within these monuments is not such an issue. As the use of a crown, as a symbol of divinity may have arisen at a later date, or in a different area, or both. Personally, what I see on the left of the 'jaguars' (if that's what they are supposed to be) at Sayburc is a man who is obviously dancing, as he's in a dancing pose with knees bent, back leaning forwards and arms aloft. I think in his right hand he is holding a spear, with the point downwards. His hand doesn't wrap around the shaft of the spear however. This is analogous of someone who is holding not just a spear, but a spear with throwing stick, known today by various names such as 'atlatl' or 'woomera'. These were used to add extra leverage to the throw of a spear, therefore adding to the power of the spear strike and were used all around the world by many ancient societies, often as a pre-cursor to the bow and arrow. The Dancer's proximity to the bull (for surely that is what it depicts) may well allude to an act of hunting. Indeed it's my belief that the gaebolg of Irish myth is also one of these type of weapons, as they were supposed to be thrown 'from the foot' - surely an allusion to the throwing stick and it's somewhat foot-like shape. Also, you mention the little dishes or troughs, by the side of the (utterly fabulous) boar carving at Karahan Tepe, for use with water. However, what this says to me is that this dish was probably used for (unfortunately) animal sacrifice - no doubt for sacrifice of boar, in this instance - to collect blood. Which is a very unappealing thought, but it must be remembered that animal sacrifice is often used in high ritual, even around the world to this very day. Very tantalising video. Excellent!

[@hectorpascal]

Any narrative that is important enough to be depicted graphically on a wall, is probably also important enough to be orally transmitted for many generations as a "folk tale". If the ancient population has essentially remained in that area to the present day - a VERY big "ask" I know - some investigation of local folk tales may reveal some interesting clues to what is seen on the wall.

[@andymcgeechan8318]

Michael, we are either end of the X11 bus route and should meet up, perhaps on campus or at the Art Centre at least. I did mention stone age trade routes some time back and I am confident I have enough stuff to show to you.

[@peterdeans4635]

Hiya guys, this area ís fascinating. What i cant understand is why nobody is seeing that the carvings including the erfa man ( sorry if spelled wrong) and the repeating of the motifs are the equitorial zodiacs that they used, the same groups of stars we use but they used the animals that were most familiar with them. The man holding his bits with the v neck top is the peruvian god that holds two sticks in one hand and one in the other, hes also the north american indian painted in red ocre on a rock face, his body is a big inverted triangle some say a six fingered hand or a duck as a headdress. He is most likely part of the libra constellation, just above aquila and scorpios tail and in the west represents begining of spring but in the east when seen on the eastern horizon just before sunrise probably coincides with the harvest. If a whole circle is found well see a lot of the carvings already seen on the t pillars, also im not a fan of some that will try to date the site like using the sphinx as leo and finding how long ago it was looking at itself,, it does that every year for a month which possably meant something to their yearly callender without claiming its over 10,000yrs old. The carvings at gobekly tepe and surrounding sifes are a well thought out and clever callender by using the sun,moon and zodiacs that most of the older cultures were using. Great video by the way and as insaid a fascinating site, take care👍😊

[@anatomicallymodernhuman5175]

Has no one ever suggested that looking at the bull's head from the top is reminiscent of the constellation Taurus?

[@grazhopprr]

Remember the astrological aspects of those carvings. Jumping the bull, has always been connected to the astrological age of Taurus, and of course the cats, which I assume to be Leo. The man holding his unit, is a social construct, methinks, which can have a thousand interpretations as we go along. The statues and T pillars having arms that go generally into the same region of the privates, might be related in some fashion. Easter Island statues, et al. I study the astrological implications of ancient items, and the bull and cats are my assumptions along that line. I have the same implications of Egyptian symbologies, Mycenea etc.

[@petehoover6616]

It seems clear to me that that's not the original image: someone came along and defaced it. The lions were added later and you can tell because one's nose is touching the shoulder and to finish the image of the nose they had to go into the channel that the bas-relief is cut into. Look below the man's rib cage. The image was altered from rib cage to knees. I suspect the head shoulders and ribs are original, along with the knees down.

[@brendacooper5729]

I think we need to rethink the hunter gatherer hypothesis, there seem to be a lot of permanent dwellings in the area, if there was no actual agriculture, there had to be adequate pre-agricultral resources to support a rather large permanent population. It is going to be fascinating to see how these excavations unfold over time there has to be a lot of even older sites that have not yet been discovered, it will be great to figure out if agriculture really started about 4 to 5 thousand years earlier than previously thought.

[@seeglines]

I still think the little guy is marking his territory. Edit: Random thought. Renaissance paintings of Jesus on the cross often show blood trickling down toward his loincloth. Reportedly this was done to signify that Jesus was not only the son of God but a human as well - thus the blood leading the eye toward the reproductive organs. Therefore IMO, I think the holding of the penis could be something literal as well as metaphorical

[@dreddykrugernew]

When males especially young boys go into a blind panic they sometimes grab their penises like when fighting with other young boys and some boys get really scared when some other boys come to fight and have never been in that situation. Ive witnessed quite a few times as a child when other kids have got really scared but also my friend years ago when I was older pulled up fast in his car and jumped out and shouted and scared his nephew half to death, and his nephew didnt know who it was at first it was just blind panic and he also grabbed his penis in that moment of confusion and pure panic poor kid. But me and my friend specifically said something about it and said its a strange thing when kids or even sometimes grown men when they are sh*t scared they grab their penises. In the carving he is surrounded by lions/leopards and it kind of reminds me of that part of male nature, maybe some boys when confronted in this situation stand their with their penises in their hands waiting to die and other boys fight back and its the boys who fight back get chosen as warriors/leaders, if they are worthy, who knows maybe...

[@seeglines]

@@dreddykrugernew Yes, I've seen boys doing that as well. 👍 I thought of territory marking due to Never Cry Wolf ... but I've done it myself when stray dogs and cats were making there way into the yard.

[@annepoitrineau5650]

Urfa man has the square shoulders and head/neck shape of early greek art, like the Jizo scupture. The cycladic god sculpture does not seem related to Archaic Greek art, but Urfa man does. The hands on the T piillars remind me of the hands on the bellies of the easter island Moai. It is so touching when unconnected cultures turn out to have a sort of common pictorial vocabulary. Were foxes having a tough time. or was it such a prize/popular animal/difficult animal to catchl it deserved representation? Had they domesticated foxes to hunt, instead of wolves?

[@bang7764]

The burial mentioned at 23 minutes is probably the Majoonsuo burial in Finland. But it's canine fur, not fox. May have been a pet dog, or a wolf pelt.

[@KAL5370]

The story is clearly, Dont get caught with your pants down. :P

[@elizabethtowers3321]

The face of the 'man' has changed drastically since first discovered. Check your other video about this and compare the image from back then to what we see now. Disfigured/ made to look more 'human' now?

[@nilcarborundum7001]

Could it not be just a different angle of lighting? Relief cravings especially can look vastly different in different lighting conditions! As a sculptor, I'm familiar with photos of one piece of work looking like at least three if not photographed at the same angle under the same light.

[@bethbartlett5692]

The Brits crack me up, "Holding his bits" ...

[@richardfinlayson1524]

for some reason im thinking it could be showing people in a shamanic trance, the guy dancing and the animal images particularly , also im thinking the guy holding his gear may also be a reference to the effects of a hallucinogen which can strongly affect your perception of your own parts. this is just my initial gut reaction

[@johnmarkmcintyre4204]

Given the size and location of the sculpted piece, perhaps this only signified the location of a urinal/toilet. During an intermission in the theatrical presentation, all the men would “flood” out and stand in line there to relieve themselves. Now as for the leopards, I don’t have a clue. Maybe some prehistoric play on words.

[@annepoitrineau5650]

I so love it when areas thus far considered to be cultural backwateres turn out to be anything but.

[@dieterschonefeld7428]

"Talking in Pictures" and expressing proverbs seems to have been a common thing in all the regions most of our bible-texts com from. So when monks or others tried to translate them the lack of insider- and background-knowledge created "rubbish-talk" like using Google-translate for a manual of some technical device. A culture is a region with both a hieroglyphic writing form and a phonetic definition form. Bible-Hebrew even has a line of strict mathematical coding besides that to be able to detect if the decoding process in our understanding creates the "correct picture intended".

[@GrahamCLester]

Fertility symbol seems to be the obvious interpretation, assuming that he isn't part of some ancient soccer wall.

[@davidknight5537]

my flash was connection was that the leaping image of the fox sure coincides with the shape and appearance of Bally's comet.

[@AdDewaard-hu3xk]

Ar ar.

[@Pikkugen]

What I'm wondering is the respective timeline of the narratives in the stone carvings. Could be that the T-pillars were something like The Great Ancestors and the mundane little bench-figures were the very same a few iterations later, when they're hardly more than comical folk tale figures, since now there are New And Better Gods (since forgotten or absorbed into Even Newer And Better Gods). Has happened before, and is happening even today.

[@TheVJTiticaca]

From an energy weaver point of view, in the Andes tradition, the pose of the statues looks like they work with their spiritual stomach, without grabbing the low hanging fruits thou...

[@megalotherium]

designates the urinal wall... could even have kept pots for collecting urine for various uses.

[@RigSMP100]

Great discussion and episode do you guys do private tours of the area or who do you recommend for that?

[@KarenShackleton-qg6zz]

An Interesting subject. It occures to me that someone more scholarly than myself, might find clues to the inferred narrative of this frieze in the mythology of Gilgamesh. As a visual artist I spend more time with images than I do with text; still I am struck by the frequent depictions of gilgamesh between two cats (leopards, lions or tigers?) and also slaying the bull of heaven??? I know that this sight is way older than Gilgamesh but a good story is one that is told over and over for many eons.

[@deormanrobey892]

😎

[@weethree2070]

I hope you don't mind if I make a small and rather pedantic point: "aurochs" is the singular as well as the plural (in English); "auroch" is not a word. It comes from German, where "Ochs" is the spelling for ox, meaning cattle. - Just for info!

[@claudiaxander]

Bits!

[@Yuhaszsakii]

The leopards seem to have human-like teeth, and the cat on the left looks quite jocular. Could they be speaking to him?

[@hglundahl]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1362">22:42</a> I think there are some guys in the English Aristocracy who may have predecessors in the Neolithic in making times tough for foxes. Think Walt Disney's Robin Hood in the Neolithic!

[@vetprehistgeek]

Or were the T pillars in this room removed by Romans or others as part of their quarrying?

[@charondoherty9036]

Just a thought..... Well, first I have to admit that I do not watch 100% of the video, I listen to 100% though. Anyhow, in the " Bull/ aurochs and man carving" segment got my attention . I watched twice 😊. The fox/ leopard skins just feels right as a definition of " team " or "tribe" mark. Speaking of teams... The " man holding bits" carving looks and feels like entertainment... A show. Here in America we have rodeos. Bull riding is the big thing people come for . In the event a rider falls or needs help we have " rodeo clowns " who run out and distract the bull.... The man holding bits and leopards other shows at the event ??? Just my snap imaginings... Thanks guys 😊

[@braddbradd5671]

The little man was built first and the animals don latter thats why he sticks out further than the others so why would they carve him first then put lions in latter ?

[@nilcarborundum7001]

maybe a re-purposing of the imagery… after the story behind it acquired new significance?

[@leanette999]

Maybe Saburc’s man is holding his ‘bits’ because he is a sign post telling where you can alleviate yourself or not.

[@AdDewaard-hu3xk]

Relieve?

[@leanette999]

Yes, relieve, I was distracted. Thank you for letting me know.

[@jimkessler2001]

Perhaps a primitive Gents Toilet sign ?

[@allangardiner2515]

Not saying they are related but I recall the 3,300 BC tatue of Min in the Ashmolean and, much later, the story of Onan in Genesis chapter 38 and the Greco-Roman Priapus imagery. Also, again not saying related but ... the low relef picture of a woman exposing her vulva carved into the seat area of Gobleki Tepe might be just erotica but maybe points to sexual connotations as part of the "special buildings" in this era? The flanking leapards recall the ones around the "throne" of the little female sculpture from Catalhoyuk and other "mistress/master of beasts" images?

[@murieren2830]

The site at Sayburç reminds me rather of a sort of ancient academy where hunting was probably taught to the plenty of students in this yet still incompletely restored facility. Keep in mind that the human figures in this "arena" look rather vulnerable and defenseless and therefore protecting their guts and groins in the leopard scene, while the bull seems to have already killed that unconsciously appearing human that has dropped his bat, as a sign of possible death. Why else would humans create such a big locality, with all these "hunting gone wrong" scenes? We should remember how our classrooms were fitted with all those pictured letter posters, teaching us the alphabet in elementary school. Makes sense, doesn't it?

[@nobodyyouknow6655]

What was the purpose of the bench at Sayburç?

[@olgaroche2929]

Hello Gents, Did you look at figurines of Cucuteni- Trypillia Culture mostly female but only very few male, male figurines are holding their bits! And only one or two male holding their head like in Thinker from Hamangia. Mostly male figurines are holding their bits!

[@honeperrott9607]

kia ora e korua, does the bull have a tail? maybe he holding a tail?

[@Unit8200-rl8ev]

The Goddess of Catal Huyuk (ca. 8,000 BP) sits on a throne between two leopards. The Egyptian Aker is a pair of leopards or lions that represent the eastern and western horizons. The Earth goddess or the sun god stands or sits between the two felines of the east and the west. This is also seen in Persian art. If archeologists fail to study ancient art and mythology, they won't understand, nor know how to interpret, the art and artifacts that they find.

[@GlassEyedDetectives]

Delightful speculation chaps, thank you. I pondered on what you presented and i wondered if any signs of latreens have been unearthed. Lets face it, all sophisticated communities establish rules, buildings and rituals etc, with regard to the natural bodily functions and thus promoting hygiene.The figures carved on that wall could be humour based caricatures to diffuse social embarrassment; i.e; don't be caught with your 'pants down' out in the wild...come here instead and do it safely......mmmm?

[@spiritnsage]

How about an old fashioned chain gang to remove some dirt?

[@davidknight5537]

comet appearing in taurus or snake or Leo?

[@kennedyjames007]

Have any tels been found below sea level?

[@ronjohnson4566]

ive always thought these tepe things were fake. those animals and people seem like adults trying to carve like a child. in the french caves 18000 years ago those artists can draw like any trained artist today. and the older Egyptians' work is considered stylized. in addition, the Australian Aborigines are older and they are obviously stylizing. they were IMO stylizing to make an event area. a little fire, some flickering images, add a drum, whistle and strange human sounds would be a great Friday night concert.

[@nilcarborundum7001]

Would you go to the trouble to make a fake tepe, and if so, why?

[@ruthcherry3177]

Thanks for another fascinatingly, informative video, but I do wish you'd stop worrying about "going down another rabbit hole"!!! I think Robert kind of hits the nail on the head when he talks about people eating cute things; well omnivores anyway - herbivores and omnivores are tasty, but few animals hunt pure carnivores for food, unless there is little choice. There is another thought though: how many people today have jewelry made from the hair, and even ashes, of a beloved pet? Surprisingly, a lot!!! I know this because a friend of mine makes the jewelry. People also take beloved, deceased pets to be stuffed by a taxidermist. Who is to say that these ancient people didn't revere and remember their best (or any) hunter by taking its skin after death and putting it to good use? A good fur pelt (not a modern day farmed one, of course) has so many desirable properties - why would ancient humans throw away such a useful resource?

[@vetprehistgeek]

Oh i bet money the foxes were domesticated at that place and time!

[@troyanderson7351]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1404">23:24</a> Gilgamesh

[@bethstehouwer922]

Maybe it was a warning to boys going peepee that there may be leopards lurking in the bushes. The same with the bull but for everyone.

[@anemonevej77]

Thanks for your very nice channel! Could the motive illustrate the lust, young men have trouble to deal with, sometimes it felt out of control , like an annimal inside you. and you have to learn to control it..