Discussing the new courtship pattern with Helen Fisher

[@xcosmiccrunchx]

I think "what we're seeing" is a bunch of women being "friends" and then "friends with benefits" with the same dude and only one (if any) entering the courting phase.

[@AnonyMous-gt8vq]

We see they are all fucking chad and all the oofy doofy men getting nothing. There are two types of friendzone. One is where the man doesnt want to or doenst know how to fuck the woman. The other is the woman not wanting to fuck the man and basically using him for free resources and attention. The second type is the one where it will never move into friends with benefits. Further seeing this decline in divorce rates. Its not due to longer courtship patterns at all. Its due to women not having to marry the oofy doofy whey would never truly desire. Of course, we also see fewer marriages in total which she fails to mention. And abysmal birth rates.

[@Ken19700]

This is from the podcast

[@murphymacken]

Yes!:)

[@gray8853]

First comment! Great discussion.

[@michellefilby]

Sometimes good sex is an illusion

[@yanickpunter324]

I think romantic love isn't limited to one person.

[@CherryFlower24]

if you put both on a cliff there's only one you'd save. That's romantic love.

[@b9ig]

Yes it is

[@yanickpunter324]

@@CherryFlower24 Plenty of men in history have had several wives

[@CherryFlower24]

@@yanickpunter324 because of lust not love let's be honest here

[@yanickpunter324]

@@CherryFlower24 I'm actually not into casual sex or kissing

[@mrbabyears]

I don't know. I think things are different for blacks in the USA. Only 1 in 4 black woman will ever marry. About 70% of black children are born out of wedlock and the divorce rate in the black community is high. And I read that marriage isn't as beneficial for black men as it is for white men. We have a set of issues that are unique to us.

[@MA-gu2up]

She always repeats sex is good and so on, but im sure she knows that sex can be good and can be dangerous There are circumstances when sex isn't that good, especially for women, causal sex specifically (women report a lot of negative feelings when asked about their last casual sex) Also, her point about delaying marriage, well, the correlation with the delay in marriage till late 20s is because people who have higher education "have" to marry later, and those people tend to be more conscientious, so i don't think it is necessarily causation Especially because cohabitation is shown to correlate with higher divorce Also, religious people who wait till marriage, they have lower divorce risks when they get married in their early 20s compared to later. And there is a big correlation between higher number of previous sexual partners and divorce, and since this culture of friends with benefits increase this number, i expect it to be a bad strategy at forming long relationships. Those who get married virgins without cohabitation have very low divorce risk, even after controlling for religiousity and so on.

[@matthieurouyer1826]

Low divorce rates are not necessarily an indicator of marriage quality. And she's specifically not recommending getting to know each other through sexual partnership.

[@MA-gu2up]

@@matthieurouyer1826 The biggest reason for divorce is low marital quality, so divorce is a good indicator of the quality of the marriage. Now, of course, some people will stay in marriages even though they aren't that happy for the kids or something, but the correlation between a higher number of sexual partners and cohabitation and higher divorce risk exists even after controlling for religiousity. So, it seems there is something about those things or something about the people who do them that make relationships be of less quality.

[@MA-gu2up]

@@matthieurouyer1826 The biggest reason for divorce is low marital quality, so divorce is a good indicator of the quality of the marriage. Now, of course, some people will stay in marriages even though they aren't that happy for the kids or something, but the correlation between a higher number of secual partners and cohabitation and higher divorce risk exists even after controlling for religiousity. So, it seems there is something about those things or something about the people who do them that make relationships be of less quality. Also, my point about how religious people have lower divorce risk when they get married in their early 20s, well, that is compared to other religious people who get married at different ages, so religiousity is controlled for here.

[@MA-gu2up]

The biggest reason for divorce is low marital quality, so divorce is a good indicator of the quality of the marriage. Now, of course, some people will stay in marriages even though they aren't that happy for the kids or something, but the correlation between a higher number of secual partners and cohabitation and higher divorce risk exists even after controlling for religiousity. So, it seems there is something about those things or something about the people who do them that make relationships be of less quality. Also, my point about how religious people have lower divorce risk when they get married in their early 20s, well, that is compared to other religious people who get married at different ages, so religiousity is controlled for here.

[@MA-gu2up]

@@matthieurouyer1826 .