Divide & Conquer: Top 10 Sword & Board

[@MrChaostheorie13]

I wish someone would love me as much as Galu loves Dol Amroth.

[@Duchess_Van_Hoof]

Elves, dwarves and numenorians. Seems about right.

[@jimmymitchell7745]

The was the knights of the vintner court

[@zajtoja]

@@jimmymitchell7745 North mens last hope.

[@danisrusski6297]

Ar-Adunaim are Numenoreans

[@trollwayy5981]

What about urukai infantry ;)

[@trollwayy5981]

Big ups to isengard

[@trevorp8124]

"Nothing standing out in their stats" Nothing except the true blood of old Numenor >:|

[@Grunk111]

Do the top ten crappiest crap units. At least then the High elves won't win.

[@danisrusski6297]

Nah OOTM will clinch half the spots instead lol

[@cstrutherskgs]

Dan Isrusski dont mean to seem dumb but “OOTM”?

[@TheAntinazi4444]

@@cstrutherskgs Orcs of the misty mountains I'd figure

[@miloradlukic6233]

fucking knife ears

[@juri-arturmae6067]

You know, i think i know what is next, The best Strike infantry, i believe that Galu absolutely loves the jammy word, cause everytime i hear him say it with a special passion... not strike infantry but STTTTRRRRRIKE Infantry aka the AP shock infantry....And maybe alongside that a best early game berserker just as a bonus :) and if you do decide to do it, please please please, say the word like you do in your videos, absolutely enjoy your passion for this game :))))

[@caesarg.9270]

SSTTRRRIKE infantry with high charge, high attack, AAARMOR PIERCING, AND they ALSO FRIGHTEN nearby enemy infantry.

[@Ottocide]

I'm with you here :D

[@feelingpine9123]

Dwarves get a bonus to Mass so that'd boost them up a good deal.

[@Dsonsee]

Was it because of it that the goblins flew up into the air during the recorded battle?

[@caesarg.9270]

How does it affect their effectiveness? I know for cavalry it affects their charge, but how about in infantry vs infantry?

[@Poggle_der_Geringere]

The goblins flew because of the shieldwall. It makes your unit push into the enemy line like you could see them do and push back the enemy but they spread out weirdly when doing so. So if the enemy unit is not snaga but something competent they often can stunnlock and kill you cause you're so spread out (really depends, I've seen different results). It is nice though if you have no choice but to push trough the enemy like when you have to go through a gate in a siege or when you're in a bridge battle and attacking.

[@caesarg.9270]

@@Poggle_der_Geringere Yes, I know how mass affects the shieldwall, and how it can be either good or bad (I once had a lot of casualties because my Dwarves with shieldwall on in siege defense pushed the enemy out of the gate and get themselves surrounded). Does mass affect melee combat besides the shield wall though?

[@Poggle_der_Geringere]

That I don't know. I hope Hummingbird can answer that :)

[@l.c.4992]

The Pale Uruks look amazing, well done DAC team

[@noobster4779]

I nearly expected the sword quindi :D

[@Wolfeson28]

Or the Nanohtar.

[@chickensforthechickengod9337]

Whenever someone says sword and board I always think of a chef charging with a knife and a kitchen board

[@Grunk111]

Chefs are the modern age heirs of medieval warfare.

[@jameswood805]

top 10 unique bodyguards? Top 10 armour piercing/non armour piercing strike infantry?

[@Owlr4ider]

Sword and Board's main purpose is to be the anvil to your cavalry's hammer. Their killing power is generally not as relevant as their staying power as literally all the other units in your army(cavalry, archers, shock infantry, monsters if your faction has them) are meant to dish out the damage while the Sword and Board as well as Spear infantry units are holding the line and dishing out some minor damage. Thus testing them purely against each other, while certainly a much better indication of their strength than in the case of the cavalry test, still leaves something to be desired.

[@21films92]

what about assault sieges?? this is the greatest reason for me to use sword and board units

[@Owlr4ider]

@@21films92 What about them? Your ranged units will still do the most damage, especially when they can arch their fire and shoot units behind the wall rather than shoot units on top of the wall where many of their shots will miss. You can also being a siege unit or 2 to break down a section of the wall for your ranged units to shoot through. This is especially strong for crossbow factions like the Dwarves, who also happen to have the best siege units in the game, it's as if they were designed that way or something.

[@craigjohnson2301]

Top 10 non-cavalry bodyguards would be cool

[@TheRybob]

This please, Iam calling Rhun Or Dunland winning this

[@caesarg.9270]

Northern Dunedain would be pretty high as well, archers with AP arrows and axes, with decent defense.

[@craigjohnson2301]

Maybe the skin changers of the anduin and I’d expect the Grey Company to be in the top three or so

[@joshuaclark3428]

hardly any factions have cav bodyguards anymore

[@TheRybob]

@@craigjohnson2301 Grey company i feel wouldnt be allowed, it would be the generic BG's against eachother.

[@atanvarno1696]

Great examination! Looking forward to using the pale uruks!

[@khenanezekiel9723]

Yay!! Knights of the vintner court made it to the list

[@grilledchicken8415]

Knight 2005 Dorwinion master race!

[@khenanezekiel9723]

@@grilledchicken8415 true that

[@MartinGreywolf]

Three things that could explain why some units with subpar stats reigned supreme are: 1) Mass, dwarves definitely get a bonus, and not being pushed around means your formation doesn't get disrupted 2) Armor upgrades, M2TW has a bug that only shows an increase of 1 to armor when an upgrade is purchased, while testing shows it's more like 2 or 3, and many units in DaC can be upgraded two or three times 3) Unit spacing, but the effects are hard to quantify easily, wider frontline means more people flanking, but narrower one means more attacks per enemy. Anyhow, even a small difference would stack up real quick thanks to Lanchester's laws.

[@mocho4110]

The most organized, clear and tidy Top10 I ever seen it... the BEST!

Thank you very much. :)

[@nicholasrockstroh6920]

Ah man, I'm sad to see the Talon Knights didn't make it higher. I once had a unit of 75 (Adrahil's bodyguard) fight off several hundred Haradrim with only some slight support from some depleted pre-barracks infantry. They fought almost to the last man; I think there were maybe 10 of them left by the end of the battle and they performed so admirably it was amazing.

[@Wolfeson28]

Out of curiosity, how do you determine which units do or don't make the cut to be tested at all. I'm guessing you mostly just glance through each faction's elite tier, but there are some units I was surprised not to see in the spreadsheet. For example, Harad's Serpent Guard and Imladris' Nanohtar seem like they would qualify. They probably wouldn't have any chance at the top half of the list, but they might surprise their way into the lower spots. Also, for future lists, I'd love to see archers next. It might work best to have one list for the best non-elven archers, and then have a second list for the best of all archers, and see how the top finishers from the first list stack up against the elves.

I put all contenders in to the list including the two above. Then I eliminate many based on their obviously low stats.

[@hothoploink1509]

Seconded, especially with the change to the Steelbowmen (now AP again), I wonder how high they will sneak up the "elven" list

[@ellesartelcontar2387]

great vid galu this will help me in my campaigns thanks again

[@kowo7795]

Hey galu, great video as always, but i do not come around mentioning that maybe a list with all one-handed units, eg axe and shield, sword and shield, that are mainline, anti-infantry, non-strike units would be more meaningful since they all share the same purpose.

[@kowo7795]

@The Only True Witch-King well, its actually the opposite, axes have, in general, less attack than swords. In case 2 you are correct. But i just read this -> (steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=909957531) and now i think galu's choice appears to be more than reasonable. I was just a bit said not to see the smiths or the guards of khazad slaughtering everybody:D

[@BSAAP34]

Finally! I have been waiting for this for ages, thanks Galu!

[@Elsneakakaze]

I love this video series and im going to make a prediction. Without considering cost and availability this will be a series of elven units annihilating everyone, dwarves punching down numenorians, and 1 or 2 factions near the bottom.

[@kreous4774]

I'm glad this list has finally arrived but i really miss the stat breakdown the top 10 Calvary list had

[@MrSimeonk]

An interesting video for the raw unit abilities. Of course weather, climate & terrain favour different units before factoring in all the many layers that influence a battle.

[@sambjork5878]

I honestly thought the Arthedain Knights would be higher on the list

[@Dsonsee]

Good to see dwarves on the first spots, they deserve them. Why not try best javelin units or best pikemen next?

[@zajtoja]

Enedwaith would end up with all 3 top spots ;)

[@Dsonsee]

@@zajtoja hahaha, true, but maybe there's a wood elf for your Wildman

[@Spartacusj23]

I was surprised about the mithlond nobles mainly because I forgot they existed

[@grilledchicken8415]

I think the best option for next list should be best halberdiers/pikemen. There are some really interesting ones in there, and a few very unique traits that would cause quite a few surprises.

[@grilledchicken8415]

Also, high elves wouldn’t necessarily crush everyone else, since the best elven pikes are Moriquendi, and some human factions have excellent pikes as well.

[@JirkaGasik]

@@grilledchicken8415 Imladris Guard....ehmmm...

[@grilledchicken8415]

Jirka Lukl oh... yeah... that...

[@amatthew1231]

It would be nice to see Uruk-hai sucking less. I understand why they suck but they are the fighting Uruk-hai, I know Gundabad is gonna be the best orc infantry and I think that's cool, at least Isengard's still got the pikes.

[@craigcostlow6180]

Aragorns grey company is the best fully upgraded with their amazing Arnor plate armor which makes them imo the best looking unit in game! But he is a general so he doesn't count lol but I am pretty sure he is the best...

[@danisrusski6297]

Do top 10 pikes, spears, shock/AP and missile units (possibly archers/ap like javelins and xbows) pls. Love the channel, keep it up B-)

[@alexeyalexandrov7583]

Surprised that Nanotari are not in top 13. Also IMO would be amazing to mention (just mention, withount affect on ranking) unit regional restictions, just to understand how many of them player can have. As far as I understand only Pale Uruks, Iron Guard and Gabilgathol are not AOR from top 10? Not sure about Barons and that Dorwinion unit

[@alexandereliott-lockhart8346]

Barons are restricted, honestly surprised to see them that high, I play quite a lot of dale and in my experience the barons are a lot of money for a better unit, but one that dies relatively quickly

[@DavidGomez-ln7xi]

Loving these videos!

[@killianleonard3410]

Can you do best general units? (Including special bodyguards)

[@yongo1304]

Just fought the full goblin last stand stack with 4 mithlond nobles units in a fort and won

[@thesethshow07]

That one dislike is Saruman because his Uruk-Hai infantry didn't make it

[@belegthoron8603]

With all due respect to Galu (lol) why Talon knights and the Adunaim armsmen are better than Arthedain knights ? Lore wise, I think It should be the other way around. The men of Dol Amroth are basically among the most noble and skilled in Gondor (and even elven Blood ) , yes , but the men of Arthedain are pure Dunedain. Wich means, they are basically better in any way than the other men (not pure Dunedain), like the men of Dol Amroth.

[@giovannicolombini95]

Because is a game . Lore is important but there are games change

[@belegthoron8603]

@@giovannicolombini95 ummm I'm sorry , but that's not a good answer... This submod its based very strictly in the lore , thats why It doesnt have Dwarven war Goats or anything like that , even though some people may find fun to have those... So, my guessing is that Swan Knights are above Arthedain Royal guard because Galu wants It this way .

[@modarnwarfare2rull]

@@belegthoron8603 Maybe for balancing ? You have to remember that this is a mod, so liberties are going to be taken to make it more balanced.

[@AntonSlavik111]

Nice to see the Knights of the vintner court on the list. On a side note what was the music in the background at the end it sounded like Dragon Age Origins.

[@lucasriddle5538]

Anton Slavik I believe that was the “Evenstar” soundtrack from the two towers used in one of my favorite scenes from the movies, though I have a heavy nostalgic bias for it I suppose.

[@caesarg.9270]

I thought the Noldor wouldn't win this one because there's no Eldarinwe sword and shield, but of course there's the Mithlond Nobles, which is even worse. What's next? AP and shield? The smiths of Eregion would have no competition at all.

[@noobster4779]

Doesnt Imladris has Eldarinwe Nobles with swords and shield?

[@caesarg.9270]

@@noobster4779 I don't think there's any, only a two handed sword wielding Eldarinwe swordsmen, Eldarinwe spearmen with spear and shield, and an uber Pike unit. Perhaps you're referring to their general bodyguard unit (which I think is named Eldarinwe Nobles).

[@caesarg.9270]

Ofc generic bodyguard units don't count.

[@caesarg.9270]

@The Only True Witch-King Stat wise, yes, but they have a small unit size, which will give them a big disadvantage. Not sure how well they'd fare against the lower positions in the list, though. But in any case, they're bowmen who happens to be devastating in melee (or the other way around?) with sword and board, so they don't count.

[@caesarg.9270]

@The Only True Witch-King No, in huge unit size Mithlond Nobles and the Smiths of Eregion have around 89 troops per unit, while Noldorin Guard has around 30 or 40 (boosted a bit for Elrond and the heir).

[@jonystyles9473]

there should be a Numenorean unit better than Mithlond Nobles and Iron Guard ;)

[@fatheroftheeverchosen5057]

Great video Galu I'm hoping pike units are next

[@kanefelarca7660]

The next top 10 you should do is shock infantry.

[@alexeyalexandrov7583]

Galu, in a next video please mention locked morale trait and put it into your spreadsheet. IMO it's a very important trait.

[@j4nnytor]

Top 10 Faction Leader bodyguards pls. (Spoiler: Sauron #1)

[@jaspervanheycop9722]

Do any of the surprising units have the "excellent stamina" trait? If so that might explain why they did so well in slugouts. In Vanilla this makes certain units outragingly powerful, like conquistadors. You might also want to look into what animation they are using, there are multiple in Vanilla, the toledo steel one (can't recall the exact codename) makes Sword-and-Buckler men significantly better with equal stats to their feudal knight counterparts (and is the second part to why Conq's are the best infantry in the vanilla game). Some of the sword kill animations are just more efficient than others. Some shields also have a better block chance as the animation lines up better. Don't know if either of these, animations or excellent stamina, are used in DaC though. One other thing that stands out to me is defense skill vs armour and shield stats. Defense skill is about half as effective as armour and shield to keeping the unit alive, as it is 0 when the unit is flanked (which always happens due to the units blending into eachother in a brawl).

Most elite units have excellent stamina. Although it is on our to do list to go through every unit and assign the stamina more thematically. In TATW all sword & shield units use the same animation. I must look through the animation file for Med 2 and see if there are others we can use. The shield stat does apply even if the animation doesn't trigger. Now the defence skill is interesting because I have seen people say that defence is applied in melee always and only arrows ignore it and I have seen people, such as yourself, say that it is discounted when flanked. I have also seen people say that defence skill reduces with fatigue. :) I can't find a definitive answer. :(

[@philoceraptor1733]

I'd love to see top 10 infantry bodyguards as well!

[@sworntoavenge]

Perhaps you should have a top 10 Elven archers and non Elven archers XD

[@jamaly77]

Nanohtari are definitely better than Uruk Hai Infantry. However, whenever I put Nanohtari vs Castellans, the unit I am controlling wins. With the AI charging properly.

[@notpublic6410]

i dont know why but ever since i found lotr i just have a "affinity" for the dwarves, no idea why but they are my besties

[@hothoploink1509]

I always love playing dwarves... heavy infantry means less micromanagement. They are excellent in defence and siege, and since the AI smashes it's battleline into yours usually good in fieldbattles too. One of my most fascinating battles was against Rhûn, they had cavalry, missile cavalry and archers, and even though my army was elite, I had only heavy infantry and they just kept evading my units and slowly but surely wittling them down, using up most of the cavalry early, but when their horsearchers ran out of arrows they charged in too, and ultimately beat my elite dwarven army... never happened before or since, not even when fighting mordors beasts or mûmakil... Made me feel like Crassus (battle of Carrhae) ^^

[@caesarg.9270]

@@hothoploink1509 One does not simply play Dwarves without catapults. :) On a side note, the Dwarves are among the absolute best in killing big monsters (trolls, great beasts, Mumakil), which I love. Dwarven catapults kill them easily if they hit (which isn't hard to do), Dwarven crossbows are among the best ap missile units, and even if they manage to charge and crush your lines, your elites are strong enough to not only survive (albeit with a lot of casualties), but also can kill them in melee.

[@hothoploink1509]

@@caesarg.9270 True, I guess, but I usually play without siegeweapons, either too op or too unreliable, and especially the dwarves become more challenging (and fun) without them. I may have lost the battle but there a few battles out of the thousands I've played in DaC that I remember as well as that defeat. That was epic :D

[@caesarg.9270]

@@hothoploink1509 True enough, I usually always put siege engines as the Dwarves in my "balanced" armies that I use on difficult and long expeditions, but I often have more or less elite infantry only armies because it's so damn easy and fun producing many elites as the Dwarves and watching them slowly but surely eat goblins without fancy maneuvering :) I think the main appeal of Dwarves is basically having relatively few, but extremely profitable cities that almost never stop spamming elites that you can sustain with your economy.

[@bane9933]

Top ten two handers? Also a lore video on Tom Bombadil would be interesting

[@Beserker67]

What are those monsters in the end against the pointy ears? Haven't seen them before.

[@pooopile]

Wardens of the white tower better be #1, although I know before watching that Mithlond nobles are going to be

[@HereticsRight]

Maybe do best cheap units? Set a bar, like 500 or 600, and the unit can't cost more than that.

[@matthewhart9610]

Was genuinely surprised that the Dragonslayers of Ered Mithrin and smiths of Eregion weren't in the top ten, thought they were basically the best infantry available in the game

They don't use swords.

[@jonaskingofsparta]

So the elves won the cavalry and the S&B lists. I wonder who'd win the archer list?

[@mrduck6720]

That's territory you don't even wanna enter.

[@sworntoavenge]

Hopefully there will be two lists for archers....

[@numenoreantemplar4871]

That will be Elves, Numenoreans (Faithful/Black Numenorean), and Dale.

[@jamaly77]

Mumakil do carry archers :D I don't even know if one unit of elite elven archers is enough to kill them quick enough.

[@mrduck6720]

@@jamaly77 I'm thinking kills per seconds on average would be a way to make a spreadsheet out of it + survivability on melee. I'd predict such a Top 10 to be 1. Hin-e-Daur 2. Elvenking's Guard 3. Beryan fjereikslqpdmght (Lothlorien uber elite) 4. Hearthguard 5. Eldarwinde Archers 6. Elbereth Archers 7. Hir-e-Beng 8. Dunedain Steelbowmen/Temple Marksmen 9. Galadhrim Marchwardens/Sindar Archers/Noretirno Warriors 10. Woodland Sentinels Gurveleg work as archers, but I don't consider them one; they're more like a javelin unit.

[@spirit959ful]

I really thought the Nanotari would easily beat the shit out of barons troll men and the castellans even.

[@feelingpine9123]

I am too. It's possible Galu just plain forgot about them ;)

[@jamaly77]

it's weird, Nanohtari vs Castellans....the unit I am controlling always wins. same width, proper charge from the AI...

[@ЯрославПетров-е6т]

Hi! And what a difference between sword and Smith in medieval and DaC?

[@swensken6230]

For the next one how about best non-elven archer?

[@hothoploink1509]

Steelbowmen Ranger Ranger Ranger Ranger [...] There you go :D

[@feelingpine9123]

@@hothoploink1509 Eh I'd put Hearth Guard and Temple Marksmen above the Rangers, but otherwise yeah that's pretty much it.

[@swensken6230]

Well, considering the changes they have made to rangers in the next patch it would be cool to se whitch one is the best

[@original5806]

Dragonslayers and guards of khazad dum did not perform?

[@50ULL355]

They're technically not sword and board. They're primary weapons are and axe and hammer respectively. Also, If you're including thèm,you'd also have to include the godly smiths of eregion

[@caesarg.9270]

@@50ULL355 Perhaps, but the Smiths of Eregion have Armor Piercing, which makes them quite different from normal sword and board. Guardians of Khazad Dum and Dragonslayers of Ered Mithrin don't have AP, making them work virtually the same as normal sword and board, although I think the Dragonslayers have bonus against cavalry.

[@spirit959ful]

@@caesarg.9270 pretty sure dragonslayers are ap in 2.2

[@stevothree]

@@50ULL355 smiths of eregion = strongest infantry in the mod bar none

[@50ULL355]

@@stevothree that is why i called them gods

[@benjaminnewman3833]

Love these videos. Quick question, do you think you should have included how well each unit does at defending from arrows? one of the thing that stands out to me about sword and board units is the ability to fight whilst being hammered with arrows. I understand this could be quite hard to decide which arrow type to use but just wondering what you think?

[@caesarg.9270]

He only pits them against one another because sword and board is a general purpose unit, you charge them in and let them fight in melee. For defense, spear and shield units are usually more specialized, with better shield, defense skill, and sometimes armor. It's not terribly difficult to see how good a unit is at defending against normal arrows. Defense skill is useless, so only put into account armor and shield. There are also simply more variables in missile defense test however, as there are AP crossbow bolts, javelins, and the possibility of being shot from behind (which negates shield stat).

[@50ULL355]

@@caesarg.9270 i thought the shield actèd as a bubble agàinst missìle

[@caesarg.9270]

@@50ULL355 Perhaps you're correct. I'm not exactly sure how good shield stat is compared to armor in defending against non AP missile, but they only work from the front and the left. Perhaps they're not staggered if protected by the shield? I'm not sure though.

[@lirielbaenre3313]

Galu can you do top best pikemen and/or spearmen?

[@GiovanniCamacho121]

But still to me no unit will ever be than the Gondor infantry absolutely love that unit and also the arthadain knights too basically and unit that is Dunedain i love and Galu you should do a video if the top ten basic standard sword and board list

[@caesarg.9270]

Gondor infantry is perhaps no match against Dwarven elites, but Gondor's mainly mainstream unit compositions with matching armor and very reliable quality is definitely charming in its own way. :D

[@cstrutherskgs]

Top 10 spear and shield next?

[@crackshack2]

I was hoping to see how smiths of eregion would have ranked in this list? They have over 40 defense and are armour piercing.

They don't use a sword but they probably would have been top. :P

[@lucaslederle7394]

If cost would be included, isn't the best mix quality/cost gondor infantry?

[@mungoblakey1494]

Hi Galu, what do you think of the new DaC submod just released on ModDB?

[@Rachub]

I'd really like to see pikes and javelins. Perhaps with pikes it would be best to defend a settlement (say 2 pike units vs X amount of Gondor swordsmen?). Javelins might be a harder one to test - maybe 1 jav unit vs a very good infantry unit (perhaps a Dwarven one as Dwarves don't have javs & you'r able to use all the javelins before inevitable melee?)

[@zajtoja]

Guardians of Enedwaith and Gteyfloods is all you need. Formers punching power is unmatched and latter's combination of numbers and range makes them the most deadly trash unit in the game.

[@Rachub]

@@zajtoja I don't think anyone wouldn't expect the Guardians of Enedwaith to come on top but it would be interesting to see howmany others stack up, especially after using all their javvies

[@mikealpha2611]

this list is a Lie everyone knows Snaga the best at dying in the whole game

[@ejedwards988]

Indeed

[@caesarg.9270]

Next top ten: Best Trash units The question is, whether the "best" is the least terrible of them all, or the most worthless. :)

[@amandafranks5108]

could do a best value for money trash unit scale

[@KathyMort]

Top 10 pikemen, You know you want to do it. =D Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim Adûnâim

[@Kor88Di]

Hey Arachîr, Why not make top ten for all infantry except pikemen and spearmen? Can you make it?

[@_quickmo_]

Which unit (looked like rhinos) were the elven veterans fighting against?

[@МаркоСтојановић-ю6у]

The arthedain knights are at number six not bad as always a good video....

[@slayer19978]

Top 10 shock infantry and duel welding infantry

[@VM-wi9jr]

Are you thinking about doing some stat changes after your testing?

[@weeSpig]

what about imladris forgers.. or whatever they were called? were they removed from the game or something?

They don't use swords

[@bamblaster5865]

out of curiosity, IF DAC have eldarinwe swordsmen (sword and shield not the 2h ones) what would their ranking be i wonder would they challenge the first 3 units heheh

[@50ULL355]

If such a unit was present they'd probably have an attack of 16, and a defence of close to 30. Also eldarinwe units have locked morale as well so i believe theyd give the dwarves a right run foŕ their moneý. Mithlond noblès would still own them imo

[@stankgangsta4105]

What a surprise evil faction only have one showing, not counting fan fiction

[@McCheesefalcon]

I love these videos, but I want to see their stats. Could you place text of their stats in the corner while showcasing them so I won't have to look up the end? Or note that you have a comparison at the end, because I didn't know that until I commented the first part... :( That's what I get for not finishing the video before commenting.

I commented heavily that the stats were at the end....

[@amandafranks5108]

Do a best value for money trash unit scale

[@mrdocterdeath2707]

What about axe and shield or spear and shield

[@sotirisvas7]

Grey company doesn't count i suppose couse it's a bodyguard only unit or it is weaker than those in the list?

[@feelingpine9123]

Tiny unit size. Their stats are second only to the Mtihlond Nobles yes but it wouldn't make up for being outnumbered 2 to 1.

[@sotirisvas7]

@@feelingpine9123 thnx for the reply. Yeah i didn't think about their unit size

[@colesawitzky1594]

where were the oathbreakers? ;) also did you test out the Grey Company?

Grey Company are Bodyguards. Oathbreakers would never be considered as they can't be killed.

[@colesawitzky1594]

Grey company are still a sword and board, a lot of these units on the list are also bodyguards lol

[@alexkarvounis9876]

wait i was suprised for the #1 spot. Where are the smiths of eregion??

Using their hammers and waiting for their own list.

[@alexkarvounis9876]

@ fair enough

[@spamhonx56]

the elves might not have such a good time of it if it weren't a list of non-armour piercing units. still though, elves are supposed to be good but few, so it makes sense. Swordmasters/strike infantry next?

[@alejandrosilva528]

You forgot the smiths of eregion, they are armor piercing

[@spamhonx56]

@@alejandrosilva528 True, they may still be the best but what i mean is, halve the armour stat and the dwarves and (high)elves get hit harder, proportionally, than a lot of evil factions.

[@alejandrosilva528]

@@spamhonx56 true xD, even in that case, the elite high elven and dwarves still smashing almost every one. Without count the Beast and special units like trolls, a few infantry units of bad guys do a lot of dmg: sauron's will, the ardunaim with the mace and almost 30 defend, the berserkers , the orc scoruger ? I mean the orcs of angmar wich wear a black armor and two axes... As you say xD, the armor piercing is almost the only way to win against the elite of the elves and dwarves.

[@spamhonx56]

@@alejandrosilva528 one rather interesting thing, while playing a campaign as Mithlond i faced the inevitable turn 10 betrayal from Ered Luin and then the subsequent war with Angmar, both of whom have heavily armoured elites. Surprisingly, i found myself utterly lacking a good response for their armour because Eregion was far away and held by imladris... and even so, the smiths take so long to recruit that they bleed out faster than you can recruit them. Heavy armour+armour piercing (like the witch-real hammerguard) is an absurdly effective unit against elves, especially considering how fast angmar can recruit them.

[@alejandrosilva528]

@@spamhonx56 well, I used to play with the northern dunedains so against angmar and later ered luin i just use the ballista, heavy cavarly if it take me to the turn 80-90, the lumbermen and every light armour that i have when they deploy heavy shock infantry or piercing armors units. With elves i usually use my "worst" units as a frontline and let them charge it, then i use other units like bodyguard or archers to destroy the right or left flank and try hunt down his general to make them fly, that against the orcs usually works to me in 90% of the battles. Against the heavy infantry of the dwarves as a elevn i use the archers as a skirmisher. the dwarves are very slow so a try to do battles of skirmisher, i use cavarly and archers to weak and got them tired persuing me before the mele fights.

[@willax7xboxlive]

Whats the next top 10

[@FinDan07]

Top 10 crossbow units

[@tylerwoody9879]

What about a top 10 worst trash units?

[@astilla9]

No Smits of Eregion? I though their AP would massacre all these heavy armoured units :/

[@einfach_kurt2393]

it's about SWORD units.

[@spirit959ful]

Smiths beat the crap out of any unit. They have no competition but they wield a mace thats why they arent in the list.

[@malekiththeeternityking5433]

I thought of one Top 10 factions the elves won't won cause Gondor is number 1 with Dol Amroth at 2

[@tristanburrows7786]

When will you do archers????

[@spirit959ful]

Yes pls i want to see top 10 elven archers aswell :p

[@alexlasky8534]

What about eregion smiths?

They use hammers.

[@lolply54]

the smitsh are not really a SWORD and board but theyare the dfinition of absurd: they can kill EVERY SINGLE UNIT IN THE GAME (cav, trolls, infantry archers thet are shooting them, you name it they kill it)

[@gamingpenguin422]

If you would have tested each sword & board unit against the same unit it would be more accurate, since 1 unit do better and worse against different units. Whoever wins against that unit the fastest would be the best one, the ones who don't win or have the slowest time to kill said unit is the worst.

"In my opinion..."

[@VenomCold]

its hard to do these lists because you are not trialing the sword units how i would use them e.g. against weak spears. instead you use them against swords which i would just cav charge while being held by a spear unit in shield wall ... its really tricky but still i think its fair to say well done.

As long as they are all tested in the same way then it provides reliable results. Of course different tests give different results but this isn't an academic study, it is a bit of fun. :-)

[@jimmymitchell7745]

Galu of course uruk hai infantry didn't make it there stats at least in 2.2 are comparable to gondor infantry

[@TheLordFedme]

I'm surprised the Troll-men did so poorly.

[@lucasriddle5538]

Lord Fedme same here

[@Kerendips]

The midgets of Erebor and the Blue Mountains get crushed easily by Ar-Adunaim macemen. The macemen win without a fuss and without even suffering half battalion in casualties. Indeed, the feared Iron Guard which somehow took second place only killed 27 macemen before being slaughtered. I wonder why you didn't test shieldwall units as they have such a huge advantage? Uruk-Hai swordsmen with their shieldwall easily massacre Talon Knights.

Macemen, by definition, don't use a sword. I kept the units level rather than bringing in abilities.

[@Aaron-io8vw]

Strike infantry or archers would be cool

[@tc618]

The Nazra Kai (excuse the spelling) from Isengard would win hands down, they are absolute monsters on the battlefield and I've never lost a unit, even after invading Mithlond and Imladris with them

[@galacticironmike4516]

What?! No goblins? Melkor take the elfkin who spreads these lies!

[@sworntoavenge]

You sound a little tired in this one Galu, hope you're feeling much chipper. :)