Divide & Conquer: Top 5 Elven Archers

[@awl61]

Welcome back to high elves win 1st place.

[@tihanyidani3862]

Cuz they arent OP or anything

[@TrashbinCat]

Hin e Daur are hilariously effective at clearing out entire armies if they can catch a long line of enemies in front of them on top of walls. I find their huge range to be a weakness now, causing them to spend their limited ammo too quickly. They really shine in short range when their firing arcs are low and can blast through lines of troops at once.

[@MrSimeonk]

Save them for trolls or other elites. Game over!

[@fridolinmaier8806]

just turn off "fire at will" and target any specific unit

[@dolamrothknight]

100 archers shoot 30 arrows 3000 arrows. 30 archers shooting 36 arrows 1080 arrows =/

[@jensenhowell2827]

6 x 30 is 180 man

[@cCROMm]

From my experience playing with the Noldorin Guard, they are hands down the most powerful unit in the game. They excell in sniping other elites, but their true strength lies in their incredible flexibility. As straight archer units though, I wouldn't say they are the best.

[@dunadan1995]

Huh, I guess Hin E-Daur were nerfed slightly more then I expected. I didn't think they'd be first, but was sure they'd be in the top-3 spot. Also, really weird to see Noldorin be on top of this list, obviously they are absurdly powerful, but I thought the 30 unit battalion would surely make them worse then other elite elven archers that have 50-70 more elves in them.

[@povilzem]

I will still maintain that Noldorin Guard are not as strong as you seem to believe. Numbering a third of their competition is too big of a weakness. They would get surrounded, stunlocked and brought down in melee too easily.

[@povilzem]

I'm almost tempted to mess with the game's files to increase their unit size to match Eregion Smiths... THEN they would indeed be number 1 on the list.

[@Cizzzeron]

@@povilzem now I have to do it 😎

[@afrog557]

But from my experience Noldorin guard always get around 500 kills just at range at range owing to their exceptional accuracy and 12 missle dmg

[@alexeyalexandrov7583]

Noldorin Guard is a tricky unit to use - on one hand you want them to shoot all their arrows, on other hand you want them in melee in order to save other units (especially in early game) :)

[@afrog557]

@@alexeyalexandrov7583 However with the agility of the elf,im able to just fully avoid melee and skirmish with the orcs all around the map,so often time im able to use up all of my ammo before sending them into melee

[@Catstecc]

Shouldn't the title be "Top 5 Elven Archers"?

[@amandafranks5108]

it is xD

[@dusk6159]

@@amandafranks5108 Of course he meant/was there when it wasn't

[@Rukdug]

You’re testing for the best archers. The role of an archer is to reduce the number of enemies who ever even make it to melee by as great a number as possible. If they get the least kills, they’re filling the archer role the worst. They killed 38 before being charged. 38. That’s not very effective. That having been said, aside from the Noldorin Guard, I think this list was pretty good. And the testing was done very well. But the number factor is important. Because a unit of 30 is going to have a very rough time against 120 survivors in melee, while a unit of 87 is going to mop the floor with 24 survivors. Again, the testing and video (especially the editing, this video was beautiful for such an old game) were both really good, and I really love that you did this. If there’s any criticism here, it comes from a place of care, not some need to be contrarian. Also, I love the special mentions you made. Everyone forgets that Lorien’s best archer has the worst range in the game, meaning any other archer unit will have a field day with them.

[@atanvarno1696]

In my woodland realm campaign, the Hin E-Daur has just proved to be so overpowered :) Last battle Legolas bodyguard alone killed 1200 dwarves on a bridge battle. They are simply just monsters when it comes to bringing down large numbers or bridge battles. In open field they still perform excellent, but they are definetely most effective against large unit stacks.

[@Wolfeson28]

I'm not sure how much I agree with putting the Noldorin Guard first. When you rank their stats in the chart compared to everyone else, it seems like that list includes some stats that aren't really relevant to the question of who the top *archer* is. For example, defense stat, melee attack, and morale mean nothing to how well a unit can kill enemies at range or absorb return fire (the Noldorin Guard at least tied for 1st in all of those categories, btw). Those might be reasonable tiebreakers, as in the case of the Elbereth and Hir-e-Beng, but I don't think they should get equal consideration with something like armor or arrow damage. Unit size, on the other hand, really does matter; it was clear how that small unit size held the Noldorin back in the unique test, and I think that should be weighted a bit more strongly. It just seems bizarre to have the unit that came in dead last in the test that essentially represents the core function of archers at the top of the list. And even with the higher arrows per soldier, they still come in well behind everyone else for total arrows per unit. However, as you pointed out, the Noldorin did beat everyone else in the 1v1 test, so that is a clear point in their favor for getting a high rank. I'm just wondering if maybe the low kill count in the unique test should have knocked them down to 2 or 3. Great video, though, and I'm looking forward to seeing if my favorite human archers can get it done in the next one.

[@axelhyltan]

Thank you Galu for another great upload! Im currently rewatching your Gondor campaign, love to binge-watch you!

[@LDRL1995]

It makes no sense that the Berio-i-Ngelaidh are so much worse than the elvenkings guard when they are basically the same ranged statwise. Did you not use the marchwardens by accident in the test since the Ngelaidh were called marchwardens before?

[@sone77]

he did

[@jameswood805]

did you not include the lorien ones with the spear and shield that celeborn had in your lorien campaign?

[@zepplin-]

They were the march-wardens in the honourable mentions,

[@jameswood805]

The Only True Witch-King yeah those were the ones

[@zepplin-]

@The Only True Witch-King they are the Berio-i-Ngelaidh, if you look at the stats listed in the end of the video, and then look at the stats of the Berio-i-Ngelaidh, they're the same, so either there's been a name change, or it was a simple mistake :) Furthermore, Galu even references the fact they have a shield (which the Berio-i-Ngelaidh have, while the other unit doesn't) :)

[@zepplin-]

@The Only True Witch-King yeah or they may have even changed them back to marchwardens for 2.3 :) who knows

[@jameswood805]

olly hudson the marchwardens in the footage looked nothing like the berio lads do though they looked exactly like the marchwarden unit that Haldir had in his Lorien campaign which were definitely worse archers if I remember correctly

[@Owlr4ider]

I actually think that dismissing the melee stats in your testing is a huge mistake, considering we're talking about the elite archers here. If you were judging regular archers I'd say sure who cares about the melee, but 1 of the major differences between the regular and the elite archers is their melee capabilities along with their defenses(overall not just against missiles). In fact all of the archers on this list especially(the Elven part) are quite good if not outright amazing in melee which is actually 1 of the biggest strength of the elite archer over their regular counterparts, and especially of the elite Elven archers. Also archer vs archer combat, while important, is tricky to test due to the range differences. When you're actually playing the game, if you have the superior range you should never get into actual archery duels(unless you specifically want to, say to prevent some specific other units from receiving the enemy fire instead) but either avoid archery duels altogether in favor of higher priority targets or shooting from max range where the enemy archers can't shoot back. So pretty impossible to test in any of the methods you're using to do the testing.

[@fritzbaum7332]

Out of all the generals you can get, who has the most starting hitpoints? With and without unit type and of course traits like brutally scarred?

[@Nicole_Auriel]

Can someone help me understand this? Why are the Mirkwood Archers (Hin e-Daur) so underrated? Sure they have 16 arrows but if each arrow pierces 1 enemy, that's just as good as having 32 arrows in a normal battalion right? If they can pierce 3 or even 4 enemies, they get more value out of their quiver than any archer in the entire game. 4 pierces x 16 arrows = 64 hits per unit. For example, In the test I did, It took the Eldarinwe Archers 2 volleys to decimate an Orc Warband but the Mirkwood Archers could do it in 1. The very fact that their arrows pierce means that the enemy has to COMPLETELY overhaul the way they play and not clump their armies up. It's very difficult to keep your entire army spread just to counter one single unit of Mirkwood Archers. Now if this test is all about overall strengths such as melee capabilities then I suppose this list is accurate but if we're talking about pound-for-pound archer damage, the Mirkwood Archers are so far ahead of everyone else they deserve atleast 5 tiers above everyone else like this: #10 Elbereth Archers #9 Eldarinwe Archers #8 Elvenking's Guard #7 Noldorin Guard #6 --- #5 --- #4 --- #3 --- #2 --- #1 Mirkwood Archers

[@edymihalescu1482]

I love this kind of videos!!! But i have a question.. shouldn't celeborn's bodyguard( i think they are called berio i ngelaidh or something like this) be at least an honourable mention?

[@zepplin-]

I think those were the Marchwardens in the honourable mentions :) (they may have had a name change)

[@dusk6159]

Damn, how can it be a top 5 elven archers without Celeborn and Lothlorien's elite/them not being good enough for at least one relevant spot for Lorien

[@blady-vs5oy]

What about berio i ngelaidah, celeborn bodyguard in official version

[@spamhonx56]

sindar archers win on style points, they look fantastic! In terms of pouring arrows into charging orcish hordes they will also feel like they perform better than elites, because having fewer arrows per quiver matters less than how many arrows you can set in the air at once, and indeed if feels as though even range, attack and accuracy are secondary to that.

[@safety128]

I expected this to be one of the harder top 10s because of conflicts like elvenkings guard vs eldarinwe. The top 5 is definitely good but the order maybe less so.

[@alamar1205]

I tried Moriquendi Sentinels against Hir e Bang and Elbereth Guards 1 on 1 many times in a custom battle and never lost against them. Perhaps you forgot to include them in this video. Cheers mate, good job!!!

[@alexeyalexandrov7583]

Wow, where is Lothlorien Uber-elite unit, Berio-n-something? Forgotten or cut from 2.3? Keleborn is upset :(

[@MrSimeonk]

Mae Govannan - I still have NOT got my head around morale. It features in all your videos but I only thought it was relevant to "cowardice". ability to run away. Does morale in any shape or form contribute to combat effectiveness? Intrigued if it does!

Morale starts each battle as a certain number. It will drop or rise based on battle events (chanting, death of general, flanking etc). Once it reaches a certain number (not sure what that is, likely to be 0) the unit will break and run away. So first of all, units with lower morale will break quicker. Secondly, as morale begins to drop, units fighting effectiveness drops as well. This is less quantifiable but is listed as an effect of morale decrease. It probably is not a very noticeable drop in effectiveness but it is a thing. :)

[@jakobschoning7355]

Why have the Hin E-Daur so few missiles then? Is there a special reason for this? Or just Balancing?

[@feelingpine9123]

Balancing. Because their Silverthorn arrows are body piercing and keep going even after striking their target each arrow can potentially hit dozens at once. This is why just shooting at a single unit isn't really playing to their strength. You want to target clumps of units, they can cause absolute carnage then.

[@ineednochannelyoutube5384]

You also want them to show on low arcs, from close range.

[@juhopitkaranta6883]

So in other words, the Noldorin guards are awesome as a counter-archer unit, but against mele troops far from being the top dog.

[@YungGandalf]

Bruh, the upload schedule this week is 🔥🔥🔥 my dude 🙏

[@amandafranks5108]

I agree with You putting the Noldorin Guard at number 1. They are the best per man in game.

[@50ULL355]

"The notifications! The notifications are lit! Galus video calls for viewing!" "Then my view shall answer. Muster the subscribers. "

[@nikoladedic6623]

So would you rename this to top 5?

[@Ugurcan191]

Hin e Daur = Mirkwood Archers with silver arrows from BFME 2 :D

[@tihanyidani3862]

Along with 70% of the voiclines xd

[@Nicole_Auriel]

I know! I was so disappointed to see most of their audio comes from Legolas in BFME. For some odd reason, most of the Mirkwood Archer dialogue goes to the Woodland sentinels. I always remember that badass feeling when you clicked on a Mirkwood Archer battalion and they resounded with "Archers of Mirkwood!"

[@tihanyidani3862]

@@Nicole_Auriel "we come from mirkwood" guess they dodn't want tobterealed siege.

[@aintnoslice3422]

how'd you get your camera to track the arrows?

[@lukeharris864]

Press the delete key when you have the unit selected and the camera will track the arrows they fire, press delete again to stop tracking, works with artillery too like ballistas

[@aintnoslice3422]

@@lukeharris864 trippy. Thanks

[@randomenemy4770]

you missed the "Berio I Ngelaidh"

[@zepplin-]

They were the marchwardens in the honourable mentions :) (I think)

[@ineednochannelyoutube5384]

That quiver and bow looks like a gun from mass effect with its barrel sawn off.

[@konstantinostourl1722]

It's literally been two years that he said he would do the top 10 pikes video and it just came out yesterday

[@mrduck6720]

So not only do they have the best archer, they have the best infantry, best cavalry and best pikemen? Although, Elvenkings guard should've claimed the top spot. You also missed Lorien's uber elite.

[@jimmyjoyce3554]

Dwarves have the best infantry

[@afrog557]

@@jimmyjoyce3554 one to one smiths of eregion will beat any dwavern infantry,especially the standard sword and board one(smiths can destroy a unit of guards of kazzadum with only two or three unit model death in return)

[@jimmyjoyce3554]

@@afrog557 yes but dwarves are just generally better like one on one smiths would win but u could get more dwarven units for the cost of one smith unit so like hammers of gundabad AP and one of the dwarves best units u could probably get 2 or 3 of them for the price of one smith unit and the smiths are good but they woudnt be able to beat that

[@afrog557]

@@jimmyjoyce3554 yeah but what i think Mrduck means was that Imladris owns all of the best unit inthe game(stat wise and when campagin is not taking into account)

[@jimmyjoyce3554]

@@afrog557 yes purely stat wise they are the best but i still think the dwarves are the best infrantry nations

[@jakeyoder1800]

Makes a test to rank units, proceeds to rank them completely differently...

It's almost like there is more than one way to rank a unit? Madness!

[@jakeyoder1800]

@ indeed! No hate, just found it comical. I really love these videos, I have played all the DaC mods since the original (I believe) and I am super looking forward to this next one.

[@DoublleTroublle]

Great video just more fun if you do honourable mentions before you do number 1

[@Rachub]

You forgot the Berio-i-Ngalaith didn't you? 😁

[@Jayjay-ef2gt]

Weird that lothlorien wasn't very present in this top 5

[@josephharrison8354]

Boy, DaC has changed over the years... I've only played it with v4.5. Actually, I kind of wanted Lindon and Imladris to be separate realms, so I'm curious as to why they were merged back into a single High Elven faction.

[@jellyhd4178]

Is this ranking of the current available version or?

[@_stayoung_]

Yes

[@Ace_xD999]

Great video. But where are the Moriquendi Sentinels?!

[@afrog557]

They r ok but thier only "high" accuracy makes them worst than most elven super elite archer

[@bavettesAstartes]

Next, best Orc archers! All two of them!

[@logycaa]

The Gûrveleg are the Middle Earth DELTA FORCE. They can shoot down Great Beasts, Olog-hai and the bloody Sauron without a sweat. I love them so much.

[@hindibad-bad8898]

DO MORE VIDEOOOOOOO great work tks :)

[@Dannyelfable]

Hello, nice top, but shouldn't this only be with units that you can actually train? You cannot train the noldorin guard, you start the game with 3 bodyguard units and that's it. If it is with all units, than your comments of how you did not count the price and recrutment are not very relevant

No it is on all archer units. My comments on not including cost and recruitment are for the benefit of the user: not everyone is going to know "the Noldorin Guard cannot be trained in the campaign therefore he must not be factoring cost and recruitment into the video."

[@Dannyelfable]

I was mistaken than, thank you for clarification. Then the noldors deserve the 1st place 100% as even they start with 30 men, in a couple of turns and with some traits they can reach 60+ men/unit in the campaign, which is terribly OP. Which is really great😁

[@RenzeKoper]

How do you mean not fair to include non-elven archers

[@spamhonx56]

because nobody can really match the elves in archery. there's outliers, but if he did a mixed top10 archers, it'd be dominated by elves, which would surprise nobody.

[@MR-ux2vu]

Somehow felt it Noldorin Guard and Elvenking Guard would be top 2

[@sone77]

you didnt include berio i ngelaidh

[@konstantinostourl1722]

They probably weren't in the mod back then

[@sone77]

They are but they are not named like that in the game files and prob he tested another unit instead

[@arturravenbite1693]

@@sone77 probably, hes so scatterbrained like myself lmao

[@obliviify]

The Elven privilege is real.

[@dolamrothknight]

top 10 spears. top 10 swords and sheilds. top 10 two handed weapons. top 10 creatures. top 10 skirmisher. top 10 generals

[@MasterNinjaXz]

TOP 5 Elven Archers? - *DUNEDAIN RANGERS* -

[@amatthew1231]

Lorien should have better archers if there top tier aren't in the top 5. If the Berio can't compete with the Elven Kings Guard and they are supposed to be evenly matched, buff them. That being said the SIndar and Noldor from a lore perspective were always the best archers bar none save the silvan elves of Mirkwood, who do compete well as they got number 2. So to see the Sindar represented in game so low compared to the Silvan archers is a shame.

[@notpublic6410]

im guessing best elven archers either the really ugly (sorry) looking archer unit or the Thranduil's realm is ummmm their name i forget their name.

[@jamaly77]

I have to disagree, with 16 missiles only you never aim for single units. only unit blobs. and certainly would never do an archer shootout wit them :D

It was a damned tricky list. :P Of course in the right situation, the Hin e-Daur can get thousands of kills but in your kind of run-of-the-mill battle, they will perform about as well as standard archers. I felt that overall they were worthy of the Top 5 but not the top spot. Same thinking with the Gûrveleg as well to be honest. :)

[@jamaly77]

@ oh I agree, the answer is as always in good strategy games: "It depends...." ;D

[@AridLegion]

angryaboutelves.swf

[@kimsnightmare]

Woodland realm trait " best " archers in the game. Its sad that the thing woodland realm should be best as is not there biggest strenght 😅😔 as my favorit faction its sad that they arent unik in any way

[@Nicole_Auriel]

Well I would have to disagree with the video on this one. I still think #1 goes to the Mirkwood Archers (Hin E-daur)

[@TheRybob]

Your Controversial!

[@galacticironmike4516]

Goblins is best elf archers

[@_aziazi_3072]

Second, also great video

[@cyrusupshaw9269]

_Azi Azi_ ah so close

[@_aziazi_3072]

😂thx

[@cyrusupshaw9269]

First?