DIY 8x10 Color with FPP C41 Kit! - Large Format Friday

[@fourwallsphoto]

You're lucky she's such a patient girl. Ditto for the doggo!

[@Janboot]

Enjoy the break

[@mcburgerguy94]

Enjoy your break Mat, looking forward to season 3

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Matthew! :)

[@MichaelLloyd]

The colors on those two images! Wow! So far the only thing I've done with color film is buy it lol

[@chrisloomis1489]

Beautiful rich prints Mat , very very good !!

[@MatMarrash]

Glad you like them!

[@paulstillwell]

Congrats on another fantastic season! Enjoy your time off!

[@SilntObsvr]

I had a Cinestill kit, but I switched to Flexicolor last September (I used Flexicolor originally around 2005). For about three times the price of a kit (one liter size, capacity 16 or so rolls/8x10s) I started *replenishing* my color developer -- which gives me about 30+ rolls per liter of replenisher at much less per-liter cost (the chemicals come in "makes 5 liters" size, so about 60% as much per liter). The bleach and fixer give around 30 rolls per liter as well, meaning I'm getting around ten times the film processed (twice as much per liter, for five liters) for three times the cost. And despite warnings that a hobbyist won't process enough to keep the developer in spec, I haven't seen any problems with my negatives yet (about twenty-two rolls in). Using a full liter for two sheets, even in a rotary setup like you're using, should still work. The recommendation is to one-shot the developer in Jobo-style rotary processing where you'll use as little as 200 ml of solution for an 8x10, because of exhaustion and aerial oxidation -- but your setup is more like inversion with constant agitation. If you can use up the capacity of a one liter kit like that before its two-month recommended bottle life expires, I'd recommend springing for a set of Flexicolor LORR chemicals -- Developer Starter, Developer Replenisher, Bleach Replenisher (no starter needed if you're not running a mini-lab), and Fixer Replenisher (again, no starter needed for our working style), and the stabilizer you have, or the Final Rinse sold for Flexicolor, will both work (I reuse my Final Rinse, too; modern emulsions don't need the formaldehyde and it's better for you if you avoid it). Just one more way to take some of the sting out of shooting large format color: cut your processing costs to almost nothing (compared to paying a lab to run your C-41 8x10s), and help avoid the film sweats!

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks for the tips! Not sure how much more color I have left, but for older stocks this is a fun way to experiment.

[@geniuspan]

Thanks Mat! I am a beginner on 8x10 camera and I love Sinar too. I'm now using Sinar Norma 8x10, very nice camera on both shooting and collection.It's bought from a folk from British. I'm now researching to transform it into a 8x10 vertical or horizontal enlarger. You've really done good jobs. Very high quality and inspired channel. Looking forward to your new season.

[@brineb58]

I have certainly enjoyed these videos!!! I look forward to your return!!!

[@ljames43230]

Thank you Mat

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Larry! :)

[@stefanmelzer9943]

Thank you so much for loading up this last episode of the current season. Looking forward to seeing new episodes of the next season. This season was so educational and inspiring. Enjoy your break.

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you very much Stefan! It's only going to be a short break then back to the LFF grind!

[@bernardkelly235]

Sounds like Strudel has been putting on weight. Still looks as heroic as ever, though. Enjoy your break.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Bernard! Miniature Dachshunds are so sensitive to small changes in diet, it's like he's always on weight watchers! But also, Lauren was holding him for quite a while to accommodate focusing and filming.

[@marikapi1]

I'm gonna miss the LFF episodes! But thanks Matt and enjoy your break. Looking forward to season 3.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Mariette! It won't be too big a break, but should be back soon!

[@gui4j]

hi matt , really enjoy the channel. the channel is fantastic and its a great credit to you , its laid back and entertaining and informative and is slowing convincing me to make a dive in to large format in the new future, have even this week taken baby steps and bought a fuji 617 to start the transition from medium format to large , many thanks for all work and enthusiasm you put into the channel and to inspiring people to shoot large format and film /alternative mediums and processes in generally..

[@RogerHyam]

Have a good break Mat. Take some care of yourself.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Roger!

[@randallstewart175]

A tip for an alternative tank or drum for processing sheet film. If you have a drum roller as used in the video, go all the way and get an 8x10 print processing drum of the type designed to be used on that roller. This offers advantages: (1) On ebay these old drums seem to have taken on a significant price increase, but they are still cheaper than forking out for a larger Paterson tank and the custom sheet film reel shown here. (2) The film sheet lies flat in the drum, so you can process with the minimum amount of chemistry required for that sheet, used one-shot and then discarded. This makes maximum use and efficiency of your chemistry and avoids the process shifts you get by mixing used and new chemicals (reuse generally). 3) You won't be have to wait and wonder when the lid to your Paterson tank will pop off in the middle of a processing step. If you find yourself with a choice between old drums, I'd recommend the Cibachrome/Ilford ones, because the come fully apart for quick cleaning and drying.

[@GeirBakkenVestfold]

Very nice and inspiring, I hope you will share the pictures on FLICKR

[@JohnManuwal]

Thanks for the video! I just got a 8x10 enlarger. Looking forward to more videos.

[@richardstollar4291]

Another great video Mat... Enjoy your break and can't wait for you to be rejuvenated and back to full stetength. I had good results with the Tetenal C-41 kit; you can use lower temp to have longer develop times and that helps (me) with consistency.

[@arildedvardbasmo490]

Well done with season two - you have given us so much amazing content. I look forward to these every week! Love that flash and 8x10

[@MatMarrash]

Well great news, more flash + color content coming in season 3! :)

[@mikoajstarzynski3738]

OH NOOOOO! I need these Fridays! please come back asap ;)

[@MatMarrash]

We'll be back soon enough!

[@victordesabata]

Thanks Matt for all of your efforts. I finally took my leap into LF because of your channel. 😊

[@frankhdh]

Many Thanks! Really unbelievable what sharpness you can achieve! And how nice it is to use such a darkroom! I'm really looking forward to the next season and even more great trees!

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Frank, can't wait to get back out and shoot some frickin' trees!

[@jmdavis45]

I fear withdrawal syptoms. :-) Thanks again for LFF and your other content. It is inspiring and informative.

[@MatMarrash]

It's not going to be a long break, more like a short holiday. Be back in no time! :)

[@MichaelWellman1955]

I can't believe we're at the end of season 2. Thank you for all of your hardworking. I know that this has to take a lot of time, energy and money to produce but it is greatly appreciated. Enjoy your time off. I'll have to re-watch some of the older shows so I don't go into withdrawal . LOL Thanks for the intro into the C-41 from FFP. I've got some Cinestill C-41 but I've held off developing till I can get enough film to make it worth while (I don't shoot color very often). What caused the streaking on the first negative? How could you had avoided it?

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you Michael and LFF will be back before you know it!

[@Zetaphotography]

its the same kit

[@norbertsteinkamp9380]

Hi Matt, have a nice break! Thanks very much for all the great content you've shared on this channel! As to developing C41, I've had consistent results with the Tetenal kit, which luckily is available at Fotoimpex Berlin sized for one liter of developer, bleach, stabilizer (for C41; the E6-kit is 5 liters only). For heating the water and chemicals I use a CineStill-modified precision cooker in a water-filled IKEA storage box. What I'd really love to see in the future is reasonably priced color negative film. In 4x5", Portra 160 is "approaching 65€ from the wrong direction" (to modify a quote by Dame Edna Everage) per 10 sheets in Europe. Portra 400 is even more expensive, making the little Kodak paper boxes collectors items ... Looking forward to season 3! :-)

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Norbert! I'd love nothing more than to see somebody to step up to the plate and offer a new flavor in 4x5. Would really be cool to see something from the consumer grade side scaled up (one can dream at least!).

[@Raevenswood]

I have been getting the Tetenol C41 2.5 liter kits and just breaking them into 1L batches and storing the syrup in the fridge with some Argonne gas in the bottles. I've had the chemistry in the fridge for almost a year now and I just mixed a new batch last week and got fine results from it so it's totally possible to break down these larger batches into 1L working solutions. I'm going to try the Fuji Hunt kit next.

[@mathewmccarthy9848]

Mat - great job this season. Thank you. Can I request you do more color work, particularly studio portraits.

[@MatMarrash]

I might need to bump up requests for donations if the color work is to continue with regularity. ;)

[@BillPutnamPhoto]

nice work, Mat. I have a Cinestill C41 kit and QWD ECN2 kit. Sadly in storage because I'm still waiting to move! But I'm stoked to use em!

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Bill and let me know how you like the QWD kit. I've seen some pretty cool things coming out of the Cinestill kit but haven't seen as much from the QWD.

[@BillPutnamPhoto]

@@MatMarrash You bet. Who makes or made that rotary drum for your tank?

[@MatMarrash]

@@BillPutnamPhoto that's a 20th Century Reel in a Paterson 5 reel tank on an old Unicolor rotary base.

[@BillPutnamPhoto]

@@MatMarrash Brilliant. I'm thinking something like it would be nice in my future house developing area. Thanks!

[@DenisStosic]

It such a great ending for 2nd season, thank you Matt. Those colors OMG! Just Amazing work, thank you!

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you so much!

[@arturors30]

Those colors are awesome. Love it!

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you! Cheers!

[@donmacdonald5863]

I really want to try some colour film.

[@MatMarrash]

Totally get that feeling Don! There were a few years where I never shot any color, and here in the last few it's drawing me in more and more. My wallet is scared.

[@donmacdonald5863]

@@MatMarrash Yes. I know that feeling... I think I am still recovering from the initial purchase of camera.... 😊

[@andyvan5692]

nice shot matt, but where are the schmacko's when you need them (dog biscuits)?, as this would help you to gain the dog's attention a lot better.

[@darrylroberts5235]

Thank you so much Matt for your contribution to this wonderful art. You've definitely helped me at a time that I am pursuing large format photography. I've been shooting with a wonderful Norma, but am saving for a more travel friendly Chamonix 5x7 camera.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Darryl!

[@barselino9877]

I freakin love LFF! and the dogs, of course

[@johnearley9924]

Great photos from the best large format channel on the net!

[@MatMarrash]

John thank you for the kind words! Personally I feel like there's a lot of great LF channels out there doing different things. To even be lumped in with that bunch is an honor. :)

[@mathieubauwens9759]

Hey Mat, have a nice break. I already miss my LFF friday episode...

[@MatMarrash]

We'll be back super soon!

[@AlexLuyckxPhoto]

I got the same feeling when I first succeeded at Colour Processing! And congrats on getting that second season in, and looking forward to S3!

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Alex, these results were very encouraging and I'm probably going to be experimenting more with it over time (if I can keep affording the film!). Cheers!

[@dongxu2059]

Well earned vacations ! Having watched all episodes, I must say this channel really hooks people up with largeformat. You provide great and unconventional contents. Have a creative break ! Come back with more LFF in the third season. Super to see those sheet coming out looking great, it´s always a thrill when openning the tank ;)

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you so much! I'm not going to stop shooting on the break, only a break on the filming of them.

[@philipdahl9001]

Thanks so much for doing LFF! Looking forward to next season. I especially enjoyed this episode, I have 20 sheets of Ektar and Portra that I shot last year, I've now worked up nerve to process them😉

[@MatMarrash]

Go for it Phillip! Even if they're not perfect, it was a breath of fresh air to see those interesting colors and that immediate result. Plus, I think Ektar through a kit like this would look amazing!

[@JamieMPhoto]

Awesome! I am really excited for this kit especially because I've always heard that separating the bleach and fix gets better results than blix. Mine will be at home waiting for me when I get back from shooting untold amounts of film on a family business roadtrip ...

[@MatMarrash]

On paper it doesn't seem like a big difference but the results certainly show it. The color chemicals and temperature of them also seem to contribute. Might be fun to run some roll film at a lower temp to see what happens.

[@crocato]

❤️ ❤️ ❤️

[@evanspaulding672]

Hey Mat, just wondering have you heard of the new lomograflok? It's a attachment for 4x5 cameras to take instax wide shots. I know you like talking polaroid portraits, do you think you might pick one up to try out? Alternatively, maybe see if they'll send you a prototype, they're sending them out to other instant film youtubers. Cheers!

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Evan thanks for the question! I can't wait for the new Lomograflok and really think it's going to do great things for large format. Haven't resorted to begging for one (yet) but I certainly wouldn't turn down an opportunity to try it out. Cheers!

[@markfohl2167]

Great show, Mat! And definitely great colors in the neg. Did you pre-wet the film before developing? You encouraged me to do that with all my b&w negs. Thanks!

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Mark! The kit didn't call for it, but might be something to try next time to see if there's a noticeable difference.

[@ashleyhoff7561]

Thanks for this one Mat. I tried colour a few years ago, but decided it wasn't worth the hassle. But I am shooting more colour now and am thinking about it. The biggest concern for me is shelf life - to shoot enough film to make it worth while would mean stockpiling or hoping I could get more than 6 months out of the chems. Oh and how are you digitizing them? Colours look great!

[@metaiconic4557]

I had the exact same streaking issue pretty bad with this very kit from FPP because it was on a smaller 6x7 negative (see on Instagram @sayyoudidntnow). The fix for me was extending the wash between the developer and the bleach stage. I think the instructions FPP included in my packet were a little unclear for something that could seriously screw your negatives up. What gave me pristine negatives was 3x30 sec. washes, with a few cycles of filling and dumping out the water. I have no idea whether this is theoretically optimal for color or contrast - Kodak recommends just going straight from the development stage to the bleach -, but there were no streaks or discolorations.

[@MatMarrash]

I think some of what contributed to the streaks was using this tank with an alternating agitation method. Thanks for sharing what helped with your process, need to get back to DIY C-41 processing again soon!

[@KBRC81]

I really want to jump into 4x5 but it seems like printing and even digitizing the film is a whole separate journey from 35 and 120. I am already invested into a epson scanner and also a beseler that enlarges up to 6x9.

[@MatMarrash]

It really is a different animal as you scale up the film size. The beauty of sheet film is contact printing is also an option for darkroom work!

[@KBRC81]

@@MatMarrash Yes! I watched your video the other day about contact printing 4x5 and then I pulled the trigger on a crown graphic 🤦🏻‍♂️😆. At least I could still run some 120 through it also.

[@JasonRenoux]

Awesome sauce ;)

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Jason, a reminder I need to shoot color more often!

[@JasonRenoux]

@@MatMarrash indeed you do. Just discovered your show and am enjoying the content you put out 👍🏻👍🏻📸📸

[@loading12342000]

Thanks for all your work. Do you know what those purple processing streaks are? I've been processing c-41 at home for two years now and I still do not know what cause them. Again, you rock ;)

[@sgroadie6367]

Superb. Thanks again. Did you shoot the Porta 160 at box speed?

[@MatMarrash]

Yepper, rated the film at 160. Typically keep it from 100 - 160 for this film, never really liked it pushed.

[@Mparker394]

I was on the fence about FPP’s C41 kit. Looks like it’s a winner! Also, what caused the streaks in the processing that you pointed out?

[@MatMarrash]

Still trying to figure that one out, could be a number of things since it's been so long since doing drum and color processing. Might try inversion agitation with more chemicals next time!

[@MatMarrash]

@@foreigncorrespondent5140 These are flatbed scans.

[@billhackley3540]

:( went straight to the site, sold out. thanks for all you've done

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Bill, I chatted with Mike and he's going to be sending out an email update as soon as more are back in stock.

[@billhackley3540]

@@MatMarrash thank you would like to try again on a smaller scale

[@culleysmith]

Out of curiosity, what equipment are using to secure your three-in-one reflector (assuming it's a three-in-one). I see three clamps, a stand and an arm. Even with the wind blowing the reflector around, the stand looks stable. As do the arm and clamps. Curious what size clamps those are? And what "connector" and arm are being used on the stand. Or maybe it was a kit. Cheers.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks for the question Culley, those are simple 4" A-clamps you can get from the hardware or photo store. The one doing the hardest work is the one on the center column. This way it transfers the force down to the base of the stand (where there is a sandbag keeping it upright). The stand is a 20" double riser c-stand; known in Hollywood as a "Gary Coleman".

[@Exxcalibur186]

Hey mat, good stuff! In regards to the stop bath and wash after the bleach, the directions say 60 sec, rinse and wash 3x... Does this mean fill and empty the tank 3x over 60 sec (even with a smaller tank)? Or should I just swizzle/invert for 60 sec like the other kits?

[@akiras1981]

Thanks Mat for the video. I just bought that kit, Do you where I can fin the turning machine. 9:54s . Best

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Marco that's an old rotary base for processing prints, the most common ones out there are from Beseler and Omega. They do a pretty decent job for agitating film in a drum too.

[@victordesabata]

Since you are using a cpe2, would you consider (or already considered) using a 25xx drum? Those are really good for 8x10. I am a bit reserved on 8x10 holders as I have experienced scratches on 4x5 holders with similar design. That of course is partly due to human error. But the 25xx drums are sooo fool proof and uses minimal chemicals.

[@MatMarrash]

Good question! I've already got a 25 series drum, just not the right reel for one. The dream would be to get a CPP2/3 and a 3005 drum for really efficient processing, but that's a lot of change!

[@victordesabata]

@@MatMarrash oh I made a typo. I meant a 2800 series drums - which allows inserting two sheets of film without the need of a reel. I have been using it and find it really easy to use.

[@harrisoncable5885]

I just realized you look exactly like Chet Baker

[@erikepskamp1991]

Hey Mat, thanks for this video; this will give me the courage to try it out for myself. Any thoughts on how the FPP kit compares to the Cinestill CS41 kit? Congratulations on a great season 2 and will be jonesing for season 3! Always appreciate the can-do motivation.

[@shawnmiller4440]

How does the continuous agitation of the drum roller affect contrast vs intermittent agitation with tray processing?

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Shawn never tried tray processing with color sheet film since the processing time is so short (prefer to have times closer to 5-6 min.). Constant agitation is recommended and open trays would lose heat faster and likely speed up oxidation. Might be worth a try on some mystery film!

[@MichaelPhillipsatGreyOwlStudio]

In a remarkable coincidence, I've just decided to use up the last few sheets of 4x5 slightly expired Portra 160 that I have, and I was thinking of finally cracking open that C-41 dev kit I've been meaning to use. Never used C-41 chemicals before. Do any of them have a really strong odor? I've gotten used to the smell of the fixer in b/w chemicals, but I wonder about the color stuff.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks for the question and comment Michael! In this and many other kits, the step containing any bleach is the worst smelling. I didn't find the FPP kit as bad as others that have a combined bleach-fix (blix) step, but good ventilation is recommended. In my opinion color developers have a somewhat "sweet" smell to them.

[@MichaelPhillipsatGreyOwlStudio]

@@MatMarrash Thanks. That's helpful. I have the kit from Cinestill. It has a combined bleach-fix, but maybe if I'm really efficient and ventilate well then I'll be okay.

[@MatMarrash]

@@MichaelPhillipsatGreyOwlStudio Yeah blix is one to get used to, but please don't get any on your clothes. I reminds me so much of betadine in both color and smell.

[@SD_Alias]

Thats a great C41 kit. Most otheres are just too big. Would it be better to do a prewash to prevent streaks?

[@MatMarrash]

The kit only recommended prewashing if using motion picture film with a remjet layer, but that could have been one of potentially many things that happened. Totally agree, this kit is the right size for a lot of film shooters.

[@BeePee1503]

When loading sheet film, in your demo 8:35 the notch was on your right so you loaded the sheet with emulsion side facing up? I am trying to make sure I get it right. Thanks.

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Bhinesh, when you're loading the reel with the film faced towards you, feel for the notch code of the film in the upper left-hand corner, lower right-hand corner if the film is rotated. This will indicate the emulsion is facing down to minimize risk of scratches.

[@alexandermandache1628]

so the fpp c 41 kit is similar to the cinestill cs2 if it gives you the ecn 2 colours but without the remjet removal

[@MatMarrash]

From what I can tell yes. The included instructions advise on a remjet step but don't included a removal solution (recommends baking soda in water).

[@andyvan5692]

strudel?, thought for a minute you were photographing food (sweats).what lights are you using, we see the "pack", but not the heads, so what ones are they, and HOW do you fire them, as there is no ttl with these cameras.

[@MatMarrash]

These are the 2400w Speedotron Black line heads, fired remotely with PW Plus III's.

[@Michaelnapierphotography]

Hey Mat, I'm curious. I saw that the chem packs you showed were using CD-3 instead of CD-4. CD-3 was created for the E6 process and CD-4 for the C41 process. Do you know if there's a particular reason that the substitution was made?

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Michael, no idea why but I'm not particularly mad at the results. :)

[@Michaelnapierphotography]

@@MatMarrash No, I have to agree, the colors are gorgeous. I mix almost all my own chems and it never even occurred to me to sub in CD-3 so I was just curious. I almost think your colors might even be richer than normal, leaning toward slide film.

[@MatMarrash]

@@Michaelnapierphotography I've read in several places that using ECN-2 kits with C41 films will shift the color palette and contrast, so I think the added boost is from the separate bleach and fix steps. Will be fun to experiment more!

[@ganzonomy]

this is cool! Where's the blix step? (is it in the developer?) Apologies if i seem ignorant. I've only developed B&W. Jason

[@MatMarrash]

This is an unconventional C41 kit in that it goes developer -> bleach -> fix -> wash instead of developer -> blix -> wash. More like an ECN2 kit (which it also works with) than standard C41.

[@ganzonomy]

@@MatMarrash so bleach and fix combine into blix?

[@MatMarrash]

@@ganzonomy Well in most C41 kits nowadays they are mixed as one step. In the FPP kit and other ECN2 kits, they are separate steps. Bleach removes unused color dyes, and the fix removes the silver halide.

[@ganzonomy]

@@MatMarrash ahhh. Thanks! Enjoy a well deserved vacation! Your videos are fantastic. The one on creativity helped reignite my desire to shoot during Covid... Even if it was my 110 cameras, shooting something is key. Enjoy your break, and stay safe! Jason

[@Raevenswood]

@@MatMarrash technically the Blix is what is unconventional. Conventional is to have a bleach and fix stage separately which is actually better for longevity.

[@WietsedeJong]

Quick dog photography tip: Put a dog treat on top of your lens..

[@MatMarrash]

Strudel is too food motivated, he'd never stop lunging for it!

[@jeffdevries5044]

Thank you very much for all the work you do producing LFF, I have really enjoyed them. You have been an inspiration to me. Have a great rest and I look forward to season three. kingdom-creative-photography.ca/100-pictures-project/

[@MatMarrash]

Thank you Jeff and keep it up with the 100 pictures project! It's really shaping up nicely and I like the "pop" of your recent still lives. B&W is all about that contrast!

[@jeffdevries5044]

@@MatMarrash thank you very much. :)

[@lillianvalentine1975]

Rad

[@michaelprzewrocki4195]

not showing unpouring stop-bath. NO GO sir. Forget CPE2 and the nerving splishsplashing. Get CPA2 or CPP with lift. problems solved forever. check waterbath sealing if its really waterproof. at pouring-out hole. washing machine pipeline can be used jobo told. standard size.