Do Spinning Sword Attacks Work?

[@hshocker98]

I still don't understand why Hollywood still didn't use any HEMA sword techniques. They are beautiful to look at.

[@justin9202]

Hema sword techniques are all sword techniques. Hema is just a style of fighting designed to recreate the techniques of ancient Europe

[@justin9202]

@@hshocker98 hema litterally means historical EUROPEAN martial arts not historical world martial arts

[@gwynbleidd1917]

@@justin9202 as you said hema means Historical European martial arts. it doesn't mean exclusively ancient. not all history is ancient. Ancient is colloquially considered pre-medieval, for one. Most of the treatises study for Hema are dated to late middle ages/early Renaissance.

[@justin9202]

@@gwynbleidd1917 true but I think the best warriors are the ones that are most well-rounded and have practiced martial arts from all eras and regions that way they know how to take on any challenge they might face

[@gwynbleidd1917]

@@justin9202 lol ok.

[@monstermcface838]

Lesson: Don't copy sword techniques from movies and video games.

[@andrewcollins133]

A bigger lesson is to not say what you think is right based off experience alone. Without understanding the concepts behind winning a fight/the psychology of your opponents defense or your own offense. Most people are taught how to fight without also being taught the (why) or being forced to remember the (why) of behind what is most safe

[@Aerostarm]

I’ll try spinning, that’s a good trick

[@sparrowhawk81]

now THIS is fencing

[@pangopod2969]

It's already difficult to use spinning attack unarmed but still used 'cause of the power and the lower risks. But it's foolish to use this when one hit can take your life and when a single simple hit can already take out your opponent.

[@pangopod2969]

(sorry for my bad english)

[@gwynbleidd1917]

what

[@pangopod2969]

@@gwynbleidd1917 ;-;

[@Darth_Anomalous]

Any weeabo: you just need to move faster. You don't swing your katana 1000 times a day.

[@SellswordArts]

You joke, but just look at the comments. We already have a few like that 🤣

[@Canal_Marte]

High risk, low reward. Shows your unprotected back of the head, and hardly will help you to hit your opponent.

[@andrewmontague9682]

When you were between Mark and Wade all I could hear was my Krav Maga instructor shouting "You entered the kill zone, you're dead". We would drill just defending attacks and moving away so that we stacked our opponents and NEVER ended up between them, because you lose sight of one of them and you can be stabbed, bottled or grabbed in a way you can't get out of.

[@henryc7548]

I think this is generally right, but it depends on weapons and armor. Hema unfortunatly seems to be practiced in a manner where the tough of a blade to any part of the body is a "Kill" I could see spinning being more useful in a situation when a stab is not a danger and moving around someones guard is more feasible. This is why the spinning backfist is a really good, if niche, attack. I could see it being used to good effect with a mace and shield.

[@SellswordArts]

It's not that a touch anywhere is a kill, it's that a touch anywhere with a bladed weapon most likely is going to end the fight. There aren't many parts on the body that can sustain a wound from a sword and not cause the other person to either stop, drop your weapon, die, or be incapacitated enough that they are no longer able to continue the fight at the same pace. We talked about in some of our other videos the fact the adrenaline can sometimes cause you to forget about a wound, but if you watch our videos, we often discount touches that are very light. We only really stop the match when one of us sustains a wound that would have incapacitated them, or cause them to not be able to continue their attack. And when were talking about weapons that are bladed, there is no such thing as eating a hit. The reason that there are some spins and things like MMA is because you can take a punch or even a kick and still keep going. In fact it's some fighter strategies. They are tougher than the other person, and can absorb a certain amount of punishment. Additionally turning your back to an opponent in an unarmed fight can sometimes be a good strategy, as there are less vital points on the back then there are the face chest groin and stomach. With bladed combat the consequences of even a minor hit are so devastating that you cannot afford to turn away from your opponent, unless you're going to run. With a shield, the entire point is to keep the shield between you and your opponent. That's the only way it can do its job.

[@henryc7548]

@@SellswordArts Agreed, that is why i use kill in quotes to denote an ending of the fight. A sword blow nearly anywhere in the body is usually likely to decide a fight, in the absence of armor. My understanding is that not a lot of combat occurred with sword armed, unarmored combatants, at least until the gunpowder age. This is a serious problem for hema in my opinion. It makes it very difficult to make accurate pronouncements on what would have worked in history. On a side note, I often see when I watch hema videos a combatant will reach around a shield and draw a blade along someone's back, this is counted as a 'Kill' as well when it shouldn't be as it wouldnt be decisive even on a naked opponent.

[@j.d.4697]

Here are 3 things you can use to make it work a lot better: - Set it up with a parry or a feint. - Do a thrust instead of a swing. - Use do fewer footwork steps (might have to look into Asian combat arts for that).

[@drimwalkr8923]

Lol, I remember my martial arts teaching us not to spin. It was a great demonstration of him still putting us on the mat

[@bloodangel7731]

Spinning attacks in media were created to make characters look badass and flashy. There is no advantage to doing it whatsoever in the real world

[@Or_ros117]

If you read this this is not a attack. Just a opinion Skallgrim showed a vid where it worked, granted different types of swords, but the guy defending against it did not just stand like he knew it was coming, of course if you know a spin is comming you can absoluty defend against, and yes if a guy was going as slow as yall were, thats a easy win, but in a real fight i dont think yall would be stationare and only moving to attack or parry, expecially truly unarmored snd with legit sharp weapons, i think there would be way more hesitation than usual to just straight up attack, which could make it less risky(still can be vary risky). Also everyone athletism us different, take a ballerina for example the can spin pretty dagum fast and still maintain complete control, just an example, and i think a spin does add more power, i think its with momentum or something along that line, i would need to do more research. Now im not saying a spin should be used all the time no, but with the right person i think it can used in a effect situation but it would be a high risk, completly off guard or the person doesnt know what i am about to do moment. Just my opinion, by the way, i think you might be surprised at how many times a spin move whether its a elbow, fist, or kick was used to extreme devastating results because its unexpect, and in fist fight, one punch can end a fight real quick, whether its to the head, body, even to other limbs can be game over, turning you back can be a really bad move if miss timed. But with all that you did make a very informative vid and did show the risk, all of this was not to dismantle your vid, i doubt i could, just give an opinion.

[@RiFeX2703]

I have been using spinning attacks in HEMA for the past year and a half and 9/10 times it worked. You were doing it slow and sluggish because you want to make it seem like the dumbest thing you can do in sword fighting. Obviously if your opponent knows that you are going to do a spin attack it's a different story, but your opponent doesn't know what you want to do in sparring or in a real match. Top 3 reasons spinning attacks work: 1. You assume that your opponent has lightning fast reflexes and will slice/thrust your back as soon as you turn around. He won't. 2. In a real match / sparring with a non complient opponent, you are not going to be spinning for 3 business days and then letting your opponent hit you like you were showing. A spin takes a second or less and with that amount of momentum and power you generate you can very well knock your opponent back if he chooses to block your attack. 3. Your opponent doesn't know when or even if you are going to attempt a spinning attack, so he won't instantly stab you in the back because no one has inhuman levels of reaction time. In the heat of the match your opponent most likely will back away from you because he won't know what you are doing so he won't know how to defend against that.

[@LongswordRussia]

You responded to the clownish behavior of the author of this channel in the most logical and adequate way. My respect!

[@unfortunatesun]

Spinning attacks are a great technique for when you have utter contempt for your opponent's skills and want to be disabused of that notion.

[@andrewmontague9682]

Spin kicks work in MMA because legs tend to be longer than arms and punches are not bladed. 😁

[@kylebillings2431]

I saw a video that outlined a technique that is more so a passing strike, that emphasizes maintainted blade contact during the spin as you pass under their arm, but for some reason, after hours of searching, I cannot find the video again...

[@thegobucketfromkfc841]

As a Chivalry 2 player I can confirm that the highland sword special spinning attack sucks. But I still use it 🤷‍♂️

[@nathanielwilcox4947]

All thease people be like " butt in MMA" use a sheild or dual weild", but nothing you expose yourself and can't see your opponent and, you can't tank a sword hit, unless you like dramatically increasing your chances of dying and looking like a complete idiot. It doesn't matter how much you want it to work it does not.

[@xCorvus7x]

Half serious, half joking: What about a spinning attack such as that leap Chancellor Palpatine did as the Jedi masters tried to arrest him? The axis around which he spun was directed right at his target, so he kept his eyes on that throughout the whole movement.

[@TheKing-qz9wd]

Short answer is no. Especially if I have a shield and another tool. That's how you learn what Dark Souls Thrust Counter damage was referring to.

[@folstag4419]

Oh that optical illusion (looks like door) confusing me

[@Fooma777]

They’re so tall!! Or…are they?😂

[@Nylspider]

Smol door

[@IKuzmos]

Don't want to be that guy, and I realize it's still a silly idea that probably doesn't work in practice, but just to stretch this idea to the fullest. How about dual wielding? That way your mainhand weapon goes around you way quicker, you can do a slash with it, and when the oppopent goes for a counterattack, you can use your - just arriving - offhand weapon to parry it.

[@juanhoffmann4096]

You can pull it off but you have to be a good fighter overall if you do Muay Thai, MMA, kick boxing... You'd know how effective spinning back fists and spinning elbows are they can be one hit KOs and they're unexpected, you can't move in with a spinning attack, you gotta be in close range after missing a shot or if you and your opponent are in perfect position to that. I don't know you it would translate to sword fighting though

[@TheInterplanetary]

I think it would help if you were more comfortable with it, although I agree with you in theory. I believe spinning and turning and even dual dagger techniques you see in games are done in a very agile, comfortable way and usually are done for area of effect (multiple attackers). Wouldn't do it in a straight fight against an enemy that is hyper focused on me, but look at spinning backfists used well in MMA fights. Best used as a counter while in bladed stance because you're already halfway there.

[@TheInterplanetary]

Also much better with single handed weapons than double handed

[@SellswordArts]

Actually, it doesn't matter if it's single or double handed weapons. If you are spinning in a fight, you're only exposing yourself. The reason it works with unarmed fighting is because you can take a certain amount of punishment. You can eat a punch or even a kick, and keep fighting. In fact sometimes it's advantageous to show your back to an opponent because it covers up more vital things like your face or stomach. So when they do a spinning back fist in MMA, they are concealing their vital points. With weapon combat, especially sword combat, you cannot eat a hit. Any hit is probably going to stop the fight. But you'll notice, very few people do spinning a text in those sorts of things. It's noteworthy when it does happen, because it's so uncommon. Usually you want to face your opponent and not break that line of sight.

[@TheInterplanetary]

@@SellswordArts Straight to the point and very logical. I've pulled it off many times in sparring when I realized that I was much faster than someone else, and they never see it coming. Usually paired with movements that are similar in style with Chinese martial arts such as ba gua that make use of unorthodox, swirling spinning change of direction type attacks. You're right in that generally speaking it would be frowned upon and wouldn't make a lot of sense, especially with a longsword or anything super heavy. However I would say that someone who really wanted to make use of it could use it to their advantage. I saw a monk in China using a polearm do some fantastic work entirely with his back turned to his opponent, it was so swift his opponent was almost taken completely by surprise because he thought he had the upper hand. It seems like a more agile person with a flair for creativity and a lot of stamina could probably confuse an enemy with a flurry of spinning attacks coming from different angles but it would be most effective against multiple attackers. Would love to see more genuine trial and error of it.

[@austinfleck6394]

@@TheInterplanetary question in regards to your sparring partners not seeing it comming. Is it possible that they’re falling victim to anticipation? My first few years of karate I got very comfortable throwing and subsequently defending straight punches and then I got into a scrap with a friend in the street (it was a friendly scrap) and he threw a looping right and I went to defend it as if it were a straight and took it clean on the orbital. Could it be that your partners OVER reacted to something they haven’t seen before? If so that’s an issue of inexperience wouldn’t you agree?

[@gwynbleidd1917]

@@TheInterplanetary either you're talking about spinning in an unarmed fight which is completely out of context, making your comment dumb, or you're lying about your experience, or your sparring partner has little to no training with weapons. Not good any way you look at it.

[@leonidasachilles7490]

2 things that swordmasters often criticize, but never admit the cold truth. 1. They say reverse grip, spinning and jumping attacks have risks, but fighting a swordsman alone is a risk, as the aim here is to injure or kill the other. Cold truth: There are no sword fights without risk. 2. They say sword techniques from films are fictional. Every sword technique was invented at some point a long time ago. No one can tell me that techniques came automatically with the sword. First, the fighters of that time invented movements, which have improved over time. So I find it a little hypocritical to say that sword fights from films are completely made up. Cold truth: Every sword technique is invented.

[@8-ball350]

*Link wants to know your location*

[@yojieazenila7239]

Can you do a long spinning?

[@andrewcollins133]

I believe spin attacks would only have a use at the master level. Usually only after they have had enough of being safe and a bit scared so they believe they need a high risk high reward(due to potential of capitalization of this maneuver if worked as intended) you don’t just do a spin attack when you feel. They are only probably and somewhat likely if used by a master. The key to becoming a master is truly understanding the psychology behind 1) controlling the fight 2) being as safe as possible 3) utilizing knowledge without having to actually take .2 of a second to think which requires experience with high level offensive concepts such as a calculated being the only way to control a fight

[@pizzatparker]

If Gwenpool and Geralt can do it, then so can I.

[@mysteriousronin1227]

Is kicking good

[@sparrowhawk81]

Depends. As an initial attack out of distance, no. I mean...you have to stick your leg out there. It could get stabbed or cut off by the other person. However, if you find yourself in a very close bind and the weapons are locked up, you could stomp on someone's foot, kick their shins, do an oblique kick to their leg, or perhaps use a kick to get them off of you and open distance. But you better get that leg out of the way if distance opens back up. This is all in the context of some kind of imaginary "real" sword fight to the death. In fencing and sparring and tournaments, I get the sense these kinds of things are generally frowned upon.

[@XLORDPROPL]

First time doing spin attack? ;)

[@kierxandermeneses8279]

Unless you are an Op mc from another world then yeah you can

[@zacharytaylor5360]

Spinning? Does it work when you start a fight with it and extremely telegraph it? No. Obviously not😂.

[@salah6160]

I appreciate your video and great skills guys, it's nice to see this passion in swords fighting. Howerver, every time you spin, you freeze and let yourself loose intentionally. I believe there are still situations u can spin and hit, it's also a type of defence and counter, u spin (very fast) and move to a spot where u can hit.

[@tweakanimations2225]

4:00 am anyone?

[@justin9202]

I noticed you guys have never covered miyamoto musashi's twin heavens swordsmanship techniques. I think that would be the only style where a spin attack could work, since miyamoto stated the beast way to fight is always two swords.

[@SellswordArts]

He specifically references a sword at a shorter sword. Much like Rapier and Dagger. One is mainly used to block the incoming attacks allowing you to attack while you defend. In this instance you also would not want to spin

[@drimwalkr8923]

Even with 2 swords, it still leaves you open when you turn your back because you still can't see your opponent

[@justin9202]

@@SellswordArts actually when he mentioned swords he mentioned the only two swords used by samurai. The katana and wakazashi. His book the book of five rings specifically mentions that not using two swords is a waste of a swordsman's skills and a waste of tools. Hence why he references using both in his technique. He also mentions a spin technique in the book of 5 rings when faced against multiple enemies and using two swords. I also just wish you could cover his sword techniques too because the man was never defeated in combat and had a facinating life. Especially with all his other techniques too

[@SellswordArts]

@Lominoth Productions we have to remember, that anyone who's writing a book is trying to sell their way of thinking. The actual history of Miyamoto musashi is a little bit murky, and he wrote this book right before his death. As with all historical accounts, we have to take them with a grain of salt, and remember it's only one person's opinion. There are many Masters who have used a longer and shorter blade like the katana and wakizashi the Rapier and Dagger, and so on and so forth. It is a very popular stule of combat in the late 15-1700s The idea that any combat not using two weapons is a waste of time is definitely incorrect. There are many styles that use one weapon and are very effective. Dismissing anything that doesn't conform to one person's opinion is a good way to get tunnel vision. Look at martial arts in a wider context, and pull from many different sources.

[@justin9202]

@@SellswordArts I'm not saying your wrong, but we are talking about a swordsman who had a proven record of never being defeated in combat. Regardless of weapons or techniques he has evidence he has never lost We also have to remember that miyamoto was dying of cancer at the time of writing his books he would never see any sort of profit from them so what's the point of writing them if they're only for profit. Also he founded one of the only schools of martial arts in Japan that is still around today and it's still one of the most prevalent schools of samurai martial arts. There are also third-party accounts of his achievements and historical evidence to support a large majority of what's written in all three of his books.

[@yarikyaryi]

Spinning is efficient only in witcher xd

[@vomitcollecter4899]

And Zelda

[@sparrowhawk81]

And don't get me wrong, i *LOVE* the sword animations in the witcher 3....for what they are...fantasy.

[@Dyundu]

Sorry Anakin-not actually a good trick.

[@seamusswanton3391]

it'd be cool to see you guys fence with montante swords

[@SellswordArts]

It's on the list

[@KiokiYuudoku]

Spinning kicks work, why wouldn’t a spinning strike work?

[@SellswordArts]

If you watch MMA you will notice that very rarely does anyone throw a spinning kick. If they do, it's giving a lot of attention because it's so rare. And that's because, they are very easy to counter, slow, and leave you very open. Additionally, we talk about this in the video, I'm getting hid in an unarmed fight it's completely different than being hit with a sword. You can eat a certain amount of hits from fists or even feet, but it only takes one from a sword for the fight to be over. There's a lot less room for error, and therefore you shouldn't take unnecessary risks

[@gwynbleidd1917]

lol

[@jolsh]

Soul Caliber is modeled after real life. Fact check: FALSE

[@mysteriousronin1227]

Can you tell me about kicking

[@sparrowhawk81]

Kicking is where you strike someone with your foot. Oh, I assume you mean in the context of swordfighting. Generally not a good idea if you can avoid it. What situation do you think it'd be useful to kick someone you are sword fighting with? If you are unarmored and you initiate an attack from sword striking distance with your leg, you have to put your leg out there. I don't care how fast someone can kick, it is not as fast as most swords. It is also nowhere near as devastating and doesn't reach as far as your sword. Probably not very fun to do footwork with a leg that has been run through or chopped with a sword. I think it'd only be useful in a very knock-down-drag-out kind of sword fight situation. Stomping on someone's foot or kicking them in the knee in the right way or even tripping them could be useful, but...it's dangerous in a friendly fencing situation because people can land wrong or fall on their sword wrong and get hurt.

[@frontrowattheshitshow8849]

I'll use spinning, but I'll keep my eye on the opponent to find a suitable moment to use it. If I use spinning, it is in a situation where I have overextended my swing and I calculate that it will take too much time and effort to reverse the direction of the swing instead of continuing in the same direction and adding more force to increase speed so I can land my attack in the shortest amount of time possible after that overextension. The conditions I must observe before deciding to use a spin are as follows: My opponent must be recovering from absorbing my attack, my opponent must be unguarded, my opponent must be at a point in their recovery where it would take them a little more time to launch an attack, I must overextend in the wrong direction, I must assess that the spin will bring my attack to them faster than stopping and redirecting. But that's probably indicative of my poor technique...

[@gwynbleidd1917]

that comment is indicative of your lack of actual armed sparring experience.

[@neilaldenrivasquilodran5576]

Imo spinnin’ works but not on two handed style and specially better with something like a shield, its based on unpredictable movements while you still parrying the oponent hits with the shield. In two handed style spinning its obviously BAD and for many reasons… the weight of the blade, the relatively slower movements that expose you to a direct hit and even because a skilled foe can predict your whole movement thus u finished! I’d suggest you to look at how capoeira was made to be a distraction of the real damage input! Good video as well! :D

[@SellswordArts]

Many people cite unpredictable movements as a reason or validation for things like reverse grip or spinning, but as we discussed in this video the movements are very predictable. Because of spin takes so much longer than a normal attack, you can easily track your opponent and be ready to Perry or just get out of the way. Additionally, if you're spending with a shield, The shield isn't doing its job. The shield should always be between you and your opponent, and if you spend your opening yourself up. Spinning does not work in one-on-one combat with swords

[@sparrowhawk81]

You do not need to spin in order to do unpredictable things in a one on one sword fight. Shields don't change this either. I'm not sure why you would think that. Your weapon and your shield are both capable of defending lines of attack from your opponent. You want them between you and them. Unpredictability can be useful in a sword fight, but not in this way. Unpredictability in a sword-fight is achieved with things like syncopated changes in tempo of your footwork, feint attacks, going slightly offline, disengaging, a myriad of useful things. If you do a wild spin while closing distance in order to strike your opponent and they are even a half-decent fighter, they are going to keep their cool and either hit you while you're doing it, or wait until you are done being silly and just hit you.

[@neilaldenrivasquilodran5576]

I guess what you both said it’s legit but seems that you didn’t read a thing ‘bout what I said… in what moment did I say that spinnin’ should be a way to engage? xd and I clearly said that the weakness of spinnin’ is gettin’ expossed right? That why I used Capoeira as an example of a “dance” raised on Brazilian jails… Changin’ your feet tempo, at least for me isn’t valid as part of the prediction in a battle is a dynamic analysis of fightin’… and yes, I’m precisely talking about feint! What happens if you disengage with a spinning ending that let you get back to your defensive position? Like an reverse grip ascendant cut? That’s what I was tryin’ to say… and ofc you’re ignoring a shield can be a useful weapon if you craft it different! 🙌🏼

[@gwynbleidd1917]

@@neilaldenrivasquilodran5576 I higy doubt that you have any experience/practice any form of weapon based martial arts in any real capacity because no legitimate instructor would teach you those things, nor would any good sparring partner. Maybe you can get away with ridiculously stupid moves like that with LARP, but not real armed martial arts of any kind. A hema instructor would quickly disabuse you of those notions.

[@gwynbleidd1917]

@@neilaldenrivasquilodran5576 reverse grip is literally a fake hollywood fighting style, except in very very specific conditions with a small dagger or knife

[@Nylspider]

Speen

[@galactic-hl3vl]

Do the same thing but with dual wield

[@heyyou9137]

Poke - you are dead

[@crimeman621]

Same thing

[@sparrowhawk81]

Fighting with two equally sized swords is something that is touched on almost as a novelty in some treatises and systems, but is not particularly useful in my opinion. If you have two hands and want something in each hand, far better to have some variety in my opinion. A buckler in the off-hand is a very useful device (it is not a shield, it is a very active thing you can use to manage your opponent's weapon). It was also very very common for people to duel with a rapier in their main hand and a dagger in their offhand. I guess this is technically dual wielding, but not in the sense you mean I think. Man, that scene in Game of Thrones really did do a lot of damage huh.

[@kev7361]

Saw the first 15 seconds and saw what i needed to see and got my answer, No, it doesn't work lmao

[@re6748]

You got to replace the hand that you just swung and grab the weapon with the other hand and continue through...