Do You Need A Cloudlifter? | Shure SM7B + Cloudlifter CL-1

[@joelepley]

Thanks for yet another excellent video! I'd say that the short, unhelpful answer to the question of "Do you need a Cloudlifter?" is "Only if it would result in a lower SNR." Now if we all already knew when that was, we wouldn't be asking the question. My background is more in electronics, broadcast, and RF engineering, so I really appreciate your audio expertise. I'd also add that another situation where using a Cloudlifter or similar preamp might be helpful is when dealing with long cable runs and/or noisy environments. Putting the CL as close as possible to the microphone means that you're amplifying the signal prior to noise intrusion or line losses, which should improve SNR. One example I can think of where I could have used a CL is when I ran the board for a radio station DJ who once pulled a stunt where he broadcast from a lawn chair on the top of the studio building, overlooking the highway. I had to build a long (75 foot or more) XLR cable, and, to make matters worse, the studios were co-located with an AM broadcast tower that seemed to bleed its signal into everything electronic, even when using balanced audio. That broadcast didn't sound good at all, and though I couldn't have done anything about the road noise, I could've reduced other sources of noise by having another 25 dB of signal before the noise started getting in. Additionally, another related benefit for using a CL or any other form of low-noise amplification with long cable runs has to do with the inherent capacitance of audio cable, which increases linearly with cable length. The physics of R-C circuits means that long cable runs want to act like low pass filters, rolling off your high frequencies and causing phase distortion. If a CL has already amplified the signal prior to the long cable run, the higher input signal might allow us to use a lower impedance input to our next gain stage or ADC, which would increase the center frequency of the RC filter. In turn, this would reduce its amplitude and phase effects in the audible frequency range.

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks for taking the time to share this information, Joel! It's nice to have input from a more technical perspective!

[@dr.bijuvarghese6805]

I am enlightened Sir. Thanks.

[@dr.bijuvarghese6805]

Thanks a lot for your valuable input Sir.

[@MrMPodcast]

I just bought a Shure SM7B combined with a Wave XLR and without a cloud lifter the volume is super low, and exactly like you said if I bump up the gains...hello noises...Fantastic video thank you so much 👍🏼

[@nickeno]

I felt like I learned so much in less than 10 minutes. Great video!

[@AudioUniversity]

Glad to help!

[@FightingThroughPodcast]

Thank you so much. The most competent explanation of all this stuff I've come across!

[@NickWeissMusic]

My experience: 1) Clark Teknik works just fine for under $40. 2) a high end channel strip or preamp (usually around $500 and up) usually has enough clean gain to negate a booster. 3) if it’s a loud source, you can get by with a consumer interface, but if you have to max the gain, there’s usually audible noise. My suggestion: get the Klerk Teknik and get on with your recording ;) anything more expensive works fine too, but at worst the differences are a minor eq tweak, essentially indistinguishable.

[@Nexus2UAll]

Love your videos, no fluff, just great knowledge and well presented. Couldn't be better! 🙏🖖✨

[@MichaelNatrin]

Great video! Thanks for showing alternate options at the end and for explaining everything with actual gain dB levels.

[@AudioUniversity]

Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching and commenting, Michael!

[@joecaner]

I'm a big fan of the Cloudlifter CL-Z which has HI pass and Hi/Lo output switches and a variable impedance knob which allows one to dial in tone by selecting the input impedance from 150-15K ohms. It is very versatile bit of kit.

[@via_negativa6183]

This is hands down the best video I've seen on this topic. Excellent work. I've noticed that the official focus rite drivers are really quiet compared to the ones windows assigns despite input being turned to full in the driver. Wtf is up with that?

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks! I’m not sure about the difference in the drivers. Maybe Focusrite just wanted to offer more digital headroom for the user. Of course, the analog headroom will remain the same with both drivers.

[@via_negativa6183]

@@AudioUniversity Thanks for the response. Well, I struggled getting a stable level of clean gain at -18 out of a first gen even with a CL1 without it being too noisey and this was driving me crazy. So I tried a M-A192|4 and... problem is solved 🙈/shrug oh well looks like I have a new interface.

[@GabrielTobing]

I just put a limiter, and a noise reduction filter on my Streamlabs. Then I was able to put it to the max and stuff and not need a cloudlifter. Gain not to high on the mixer and all, and I was pretty close, allowing nice sound.

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks for sharing, Gabriel!

[@JoshuaC923]

Thanks for the explanation, no wonder my dynamic my sounded so soft with my Scarlett 2i2

[@andyhsong]

this is my new favorite channel!!!

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks, Andrew!

[@Xechor]

Wish this was the first video I watched. Thank you!

[@DuaneDouglas]

This is extremely helpful for a new streamer like myself. I already have a Samson Q9U. So, this video will be very useful when shopping for an audio interface.

[@AudioUniversity]

Glad it was helpful!

[@helmanfrow]

Most preamps exhibit their best SNR with their gains wide open. Julian Krause has an excellent video on this subject.

[@MichaelW.1980]

Lets add some more information, that might be useful here: 1) There is actually one inline preamp available that you might use with a condenser microphone, namingly the "FetHead Phantom" by the comapny Tritonaudio, not to be cofused with the "Fethead" by the same company. This inline preap passes through phantom power and thus is mean to be used with microphones that require phantom power. Its important to know this difference, because the "Fethead Phantom" might destroy a dynamic microphone without a transformer and it will destory ANY ribbon microphone. So you actually need to differentiate between inline preamp that don't pass through phantom power and those which actually do. 2) To figure out, what kind of preamplification you need, you also need to understand not only the gain, but also what the interface considers it’s maximum input level. Simple math does the rest: Gain Range (dB) - Max Level in (dBu) = the actual gain, if you will. Examples: The Scarlett 2i2 gives you 56dB of gain range and has a maximum input level of +9dBu. 56dB - 9dBu = 47dBFS@0dBu of (comparable) gain. The MOTU M2 has a maximum input level in of 10dBu, but therefore a gain range of 60dB. 60dB - 10dBu = 50dBFS@0dBu of (comparable) gain. And as a reference: 50dBFS@0dBu are enough to drive the Shure SM7B. Wanna know if it’s noisy? Check for the EIN (which is calculated at maximum gain) and dynamic range (which is calculated at minimum gain). If you have an EIN that goes to -128dBu (negative 128dBu!) or lower, and if your dynamic range is 110dB or higher, you can be sure, it will not be noisy and an inline preamp will NOT give you a lower self-noise. And PLEASE try to understand: Self-Noise is the noise of your equipment. Ambiance noise is the noise in your room. And for many - if not most people, the ambiance noise is higher, because of the PC or an Air conditioner in the same room as the microphone and due to bad treatmant of the room.

[@AudioUniversity]

Wow! Thanks for taking the time to share this info, Michael!

[@tearsandflwers]

How can i tell if its self noise or room noise, i dont have any air conditioner or noisy computer. Ive strugle a lot with this issue, of a hiss type sound that doesnt go away with any set up.

[@scottsmith4145]

​​@@tearsandflwersSelf noise is typically just the hiss you hear when the preamp gain is high,,, the white noise sound. Line noise is different though and thats due to interference from RF or ground loops etc. Your total noise floor is made up of all of these components including room noise and the mic self noise. Room noise can often be substantial. You can measure self noise just like focusrite did with a dummy load of 150ohms on the mic. Or if you have an sound isolation box to put the mic in. The self noise of the sm7b and scarlett mic pre at max gain combined probably wouldnt even go above -100db so if the noise floor in your studio is reading -70db for example,,, you have 30db+ of other noise most of which is room noise.

[@ContentMonsters]

FANTASTIC! 👏🏾🔊💯

[@mrwanggolf]

This is the way. My exact setup for Shure SM7B.

[@blakejohnson1264]

Scarlet with the Cloud lifter?

[@ExpatAjazInItaly]

Can I just say that the audio of this video is exceptional and can I please ask what you have set up to achieve this level of quality?

[@scottsoriero9827]

Great video! I thank you. I just received my new Shure SM7B mic and my Scarlett 212 3rd gen yesterday. The Cloudlifter hasn't come in yet. Without the clouslifter my recordings sound very good and I have not changed the mic setting on the back either. I had an ATR 2100 mic prior with the Scarlet 212 1st gen and it was fine, but always picked up a hum and background noise. I had to use the audio filters on OBS studio to remove those sounds. The quality was just ok. I hooked up the SM7B and the 3rd gen 212 and was blown away at the sound clarity. No background noise at all! Thanks again for the great video!

[@vypermajik]

Your videos are very helpful. Thanks so much!!

[@straycatds]

This was a fantastic breakdown, thank you so much for this.

[@AudioUniversity]

Glad it was helpful!

[@mickedavis3503]

I use a Cloud lifter with my Focusrite Clarett+ 2Pre and it made a big difference with my Shure SM58 when having a video meeting lately. I did not have to turn the volume up significantly with the Cloud lifter. Without the Cloud Lifter I had to rise the volume 75 % .

[@Abihef]

That Apollo sounds so much better, it's crazy😂😂 Worse with cloudlifter though. But that Apollo sounds great

[@Urbanwino]

Great lesson for me. Only thing I'm missing here is the usage of eg. Cloudlifter with some poor gain Focusrite.

[@ShockeyTV]

well done. wish more videos were perfect like this

[@tomtomclubsandwhich]

really helpful. Thanks Kyle!

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks, Tom!

[@nolanjohnson7401]

this explanation is fucking amazing and i love you

[@josantos1213]

Amazing video, great techinical explanation in a very ditactic way.

[@toddwmac]

Great stuff Kyle...much appreciated!

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks! Glad to help.

[@granite_planet]

Thanks for sharing the knowledge! :)

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks for watching!

[@uriel-heavensguardian8949]

awesome!! Thanks for the video

[@vernonjames4265]

WELL DONE!! Very helpful.

[@DavidListenMentalHealth]

Awesome explanation, thank you!! Follow up question: If I use my SM58 dynamic mic directly into my 1st gen Scarlett Solo, and instead of getting a mic-preamp, just crank up the gain within my DAW, will it have the same volume boost effect? Or will there be more noise because of amplifying the Scarlett's machine noise? Second question: there's some strange mic noise that sounds like it's coming from e-interference, but it only happens with the dynamic mic and not my condenser mic. Could that mean that I need a better shielded cable? Or are dynamic mics prone to picking up signals that condenser mics don't?

[@BobiAdamMaryn]

So if I have the Rode NT 1-A i dont cant use a cloud lifter?

[@Sonicboom2469]

Actually wondering same thing

[@JmbeatsOfficial]

When I tried to plug in my sm7b all I got was ear piercing static, I moved my phone away in case it was to do with the frequency but it was no help. I don't have a cloud lifter, if I get one will that fix my problem?

[@AudioUniversity]

I don’t think lack of gain is the issue here. I’d recommend testing your preamp with a different mic or testing your preamp with a different mic. Might also be a bad cable. If you’re exaggerating and there was some signal, but a lot of noise: try moving the mic closer and speaking louder into the mic.

[@severtone263]

Great video! You easily earned my sub.

[@scottyofeden]

Can the little brother "Shure MV7X XLR Podcast Microphone" use one of these inline preamps?

[@elvisn]

Thanks! You just saved me 150 USD. You and the fact I have a nice pre-amp - in this case a Yamaha console MG12XU with -128 EIN and +64 dB max gain :)

[@michaelmoneytv]

I plugged a cloud lifter into my first gen 2i2 and after about an hour it caught fire and blew up in my studio lol

[@sugarwick]

Is it the same as using Yamaha mixer MG10XU? I am 76 and find the details fascinating and to the point.

[@HamBands]

Very concise and informative.

[@guitarlearningjm]

So helpful!

[@PrincessOfTheWilderness]

I have a M-audio interface. Everything works and I am using Shure microphone brand new but have the same issue as other microphones I have used. I have to turn my interface alllll the way up and get a hissing noise but thats the only way I can hear the vocals on my reaper vocal track.I am concerned its either a reaper setup issue or I need a vocal boost.

[@deadSalesman_GD]

I’m a big fan of the sE Electronics Dynamite

[@plague88]

Excellent video 🎉

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks, Matt!

[@Paul-gg8hn]

Question: No Audio Input from Shure SM7B with Focusrite 2i2 (3rd Gen) I recently got a new Shure SM7B and connected it to my Focusrite 2i2 with a new XLR cable. The output is fine, but there's no audio input at all from the mic. I can’t get a replacement from Amazon, just a refund. I'm considering a Cloudlifter, but since there’s no input, not just low volume, I’m worried it won’t help. Any suggestions?

[@samnicholson5051]

Good video but I don't really think the whole lack of gain aspect is even that much of an issue. There may be exceptions but most preamps (that I've seen measured) reach their lowest, or very close to their lowest EIN at about 40 dB gain and stay that way (maybe with a very slight improvement) at higher gain levels than that so there's not really much of a difference in noise whether you get that further gain on your preamp or through digital or analog trim. Although max gain can often have issues with frequency response, distortion etc.

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks for commenting, Sam!

[@dr.bijuvarghese6805]

Thanks Sir.

[@nomadesdeltiempo]

Excelente!! Gracias!

[@migueldias2568]

I have the Shure sm7b straight to my apollo x8p, what ever i listen a lot of noise in the parts that i am not singing, do you know how to fix it?

[@ภณวิสิฏฐ์นาถรังสรรค์]

Thank you! very good explaination.

[@Jadevibration]

Fantastic content! Question would I need a cloudlifter with my SM7B and a motu m6 audio interface?

[@ItsJustaMeNow]

What's that guitar in back that looks like it's made out of Pearloid?

[@JohnJohnson-jw5uz]

"NOISE FLOOR" is the classical term for how noisy your mics and instruments are in the mix. More noise=more gates.

[@JeremyShieldsMusic]

I have an RME Fireface UCX, the EIN is -128 but i do have a bit of a quiet voice and vocal style..think id benefit from the cloudlifter? I just want to eliminate as much noise as possible..thanks man!

[@waltherwaa1750]

Does universal audio volt 1 interface require cloudlifter with Shure sm7b?

[@philbrook5655]

Fantastic video.

[@AudioUniversity]

Glad you enjoyed it, Phil. Thanks for watching!

[@dr.bijuvarghese6805]

Thanks for the info. Should I use a cloud lifter for use along with SE V7 dynamic mic connected into arturia minifuse2 to record class podcast. Please suggest an ideal preamp for this setup 🙏.

[@AudioUniversity]

If you struggle to get an adequate signal level, you can use a Cloudlifter. If you get a good signal level without a Cloudlifter, it isn’t needed.

[@Abihef]

Isnt that 128dB your 24bit limit anyway so then 120 dB leaves 8 dB noise room anyway in the average 24bit adc recording. Quite a significant range difference in low end audio interface preamps when it comes to noise. I started typing but was also making porridge and coffee and now the video has stopped and I forgot where I was going but perhaps some will still catch my drift. Interesting specific numbers though given the ranges bitdepths provide.

[@bushyeyebrow]

Hi. I am wondering if a McBoost can be used when recording through a preamplifier inserted into a 500 series lunchbox interface. Namely the 500R8? And if so, do you need to turn 48v on, in the 500 preamp to activate the McBoost gain functionality? Thanks.

[@martbittner]

Using the cloudlifter + SM7B, using the scarlett 2i2 4th gen, do I use Phatom power or no? I understand that without the cloudlifter, I should NOT be using phantom power..

[@AudioUniversity]

SM7B with Cloudlifter - Use Phantom Power SM7B alone - Don’t Use Phantom Power

[@farber2]

Does the sound get distorted when the Scarlet is all the way up like that?

[@Tnwwnt]

Great video Do you know if there is the same thing for condenser mics ? Thank you

[@alibi_swk]

so i do arround 60 db on the apollo without the CL and arround 35 with?

[@kingpaco1]

Hi, how are you, sir? I hope you had a wonderful day. I have a few questions to ask. Currently, I own a FIFINE XLR/USB Dynamic Microphone AM8 and the Focusrite Vocaster Two. I'm wondering if it would be worth it for me to upgrade to the Elgato Wave XLR - Audio Mixer or the RØDE PodMic USB Versatile Dynamic Broadcast Microphone with XLR and USB. Alternatively, should I consider the Rode PodMic Cardioid Dynamic Broadcast Microphone in black? I want to make sure I'm making the best choice, so your help is greatly appreciated.

[@PatrickQT]

The current 2i2 has "69dB gain range". Im I correct in the assumption that this should be enough for a sm7b without a inline preamp (for podcasting)?

[@AudioUniversity]

It still depends on the distance from the mic to the source and how loud the source is. But 69 dB is probably enough for most people!

[@PatrickQT]

Got it. Thanks a lot!@@AudioUniversity

[@yzimsx]

How about an SM57 with an A81WS windscreen. :)

[@SagunManandhar]

Hi, Thanks for the video. BTW, can i use cloudlifter if I want to put the mic 2 feet away instead of 6inch away ?

[@GamingMilesR]

Great video.

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks!

[@Ronronjuicee]

I have a Shure sm7b and a scarlett 8i6 gen 3 and just use both for gaming audio and discord, do you recommended an cloud lifter?

[@PufferBoyzOffcial]

@AudioUniversity Do i really need the Cloudlifter CL-1 on my Shure SM7B ? Actually i record vocals only for my song. then i set it up on my audacity. and i send it to my mixed and engineer. I hope it will be noticed thank you !

[@AudioUniversity]

You only need a cloud lifter if you struggle to get adequate input levels in your DAW while recording. Aim for around -12 or -18 dB.

[@PufferBoyzOffcial]

@@AudioUniversity Thank you so much very helpful. but I prefer to get a cloudlifter just incase.

[@corazoninmaculado77]

excellent video... tank you.

[@alibi_swk]

can you give me a good chain for the apollo twin with cloud lifter ? im struggling to get the mic to good volume without making it sound bad , im sitting on arround 20 - 25 db on the apollo but the mic is still super quiet with the cloudlifter? would be awsome if you could share your apollo chain file

[@TheSeangerber]

yes you need

[@sinnintara]

Hi! Just wondering, I have an Universal Audio Twin infinity 710. can I used it as an inline amp for my Shure SM7B and connect to The Apollo Twin MKll to computer? Will it be too hot for the mic? And play with the adjustment on both amps. Thank you 🙏

[@AudioUniversity]

That’s possible. Just be sure not to clip anywhere along the signal path (unless you do it intentionally, or course).

[@sinnintara]

@@AudioUniversity 👌🙏🙏🙏👍 will give it a shot!

[@philipperigault5911]

Great video, clear as always. Just a small error: pairing the FosusRite 2i2 3rd gen with the Cloudlifter provides 81 dB (not 71 dB) total Gain. Since you mention the Zoom H5, could you do a video about the recording quality difference when using it as a USB audio interface vs a recorder? There are conflicting information about this (including Zoom acknowledging the poor quality of USB interface recording and saying it is not present on the H6) and it would be great to have the issue cleared up with measurements (also, Julian Krause speaks about gain clipping on the H5, which you could confirm or not).

[@AudioUniversity]

Thanks, Philippe! Sometimes math is not my strong suit! lol These are some good suggestions!

[@synapsexcracked501]

7:09 u said focusrite was about 3'o clock something brother what is this 3'o clock mean ?

[@AudioUniversity]

That means the knob points to the right (like the 3 on an analog clock).

[@synapsexcracked501]

@@AudioUniversity ooooh !! Thnkeww 💛

[@synapsexcracked501]

N bro can u tell me is Audient id 4 is a good choice under 200 dollars , coz I'm planning to buy it today or tomorrow

[@AudioUniversity]

I haven’t tried it personally, but yes. I’ve heard excellent things about the Audient iD interfaces!

[@synapsexcracked501]

@@AudioUniversity Thnkew Thnkew very much 💛

[@Caba-Rojo]

Quick answer… YES.

[@spinningaround1083]

Mic này lắp được trên điện thoại không anh

[@majorstokem8839]

ur the fkn man!

[@Bradleybrookwood]

I feel stupid for getting the SM 7B when I should've waited to get the DB version.

[@johnson_guite]

What is the mic stand that u use?

[@AudioUniversity]

This is the stand that I use and recommend: audiouniversityonline.com/best-microphone-stand/

[@top_tech.500k]

6:22 test

[@laserpuffle369]

the answer is no I dont need one, but im still gonna get it

[@AudioUniversity]

I’ve got 3! You’d be surprised how often they are useful!

[@scottsmith4145]

Ah yes,,, the famous debate of mic boosters and a sm7b. In a nut shell,, there is no advantage UNLESS you simply dont have enough gain in your preamp or you have a long mic run. Having enough preamp gain with scarlett is the big discussion here and my answer is that if your preamp has gain of 60db or less and you are doing spoken word narration then yes, you could use more gain and it will improve your sig to noise ratio. On the other hand if you are tracking singing vocals then no you prob dont because 50-60db of gain is perfect for driving this mic because you want about 10db of headroom above peaks as protection. (Edit,, i will add that the 45db gain models like the one he demonstrated in video def could use a booster. Thats just really too low with the sm7b. ) I have a scarlett 6i6 1st gen interface w 60db gain and the sm7b and when I turn gain to max its PERFECT for most all vocal recordings giving me 10db or more of headroom as buffer. Its like this preamp and mic combo were born for recording vocals together without clipping. Remember shure says 3 inches away is typical distance for using the mic. If you're 12 inches away you are wrong. If you have a really loud vocalist at proper distance or closer you may actually still clip! Lastly, if you have a long mic run 50 ft or more where line interference could be an issue,, then having 20db of clean mic gain from a booster means you can drive your mic pre lower and lower that line noise level and improve sig 2 noise. Most users unless they fall into the categories mentioned dont need one with the scarlett. Hope that helps.

[@luk7n]

Could you please explain to me what effects you are using in post processing to make the SM7B sound this good? Don´t tell me it´s raw. Sounds to good

[@AudioUniversity]

Compression

[@luk7n]

@@AudioUniversity Only that? That´s insane, thanks

[@press_start_to_play]

It's funny that your video contains static noise :D

[@trevorvonritter]

Why do these audio channels all have people with terrible audio?

[@titans2720]

why are these videos so long? if you have a quiet voice then you need a cloudlifter, otherwise you can just crank the preamp on your interface plain and simple. in my band two people can do heavy vocals and sometimes when recording they double up vocals with each other, for the main vocalist he's very loud and will heavily distort through a cloudlifter even with the preamp gain dialed back, so we can't use it for his vocals but the other guy is really quiet in how he projects and he does need the cloudlifter. if you plan on singing or talking into the mic then you do need a cloudlifter to avoid preamp distortion and noise but if youre screaming and can project very loud then a cloudlifter will actually ruin your takes, i didn't even know it was distorting the audio because it wasn't clipping in my daw, but when listening back to the take isolated you could very clearly hear distortion, and not the good kind.

[@digs-]

Bruh it’s a 10 minute video

[@danarnold4210]

Why is this comment so long. I did not even read it after the first two lines 😂

[@titans2720]

@@danarnold4210 takes not even 30 seconds to read my comment but hey that’s cool reading comprehension is difficult for 3rd grade dropouts so I don’t blame you.

[@danarnold4210]

@@titans2720 Yea, you're right. It must feel nice to put a rude comment on people's videos huh 🤣

[@titans2720]

@@danarnold4210 mean comment > wasting peoples time Piss off

[@MetalThrasher91]

I have an Apollo Twin and just bought a SM7B, why would you need a cloud lifter if there’s a phantom power option?

[@AudioUniversity]

Phantom power doesn’t amplify the signal.

[@MetalThrasher91]

@@AudioUniversitywhat does the phantom power do then if it doesn’t amplify the signal?