Does University Brand Actually Matter When Choosing a University?

USYD vs UTS, or UNSW vs Macquarie University? Does university brand and global ranking actually matter? How should you factor this in when choosing your university?
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In this video, Rowan from #AOSTV shares:
- Why the most important factor is what employers perceptions are about universities
- Why your degree and faculty at a university is more important
- Where global reputation might matter
- What if you want to become an academic or work overseas?
Have more questions about choosing your university? Leave them in the comments - we’d love to hear from you!
So take a second and say ‘Hey’ and ask a question ;)
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ABOUT #AOSTV
At Art of Smart we’re on a mission to help you answer the difficult question, “What am I going to do with my life when I finish school, and how do I get there?”
We provide world-class K-12 tutoring and mentoring to help you get options for life after school, career and leadership mentoring to help you develop the skills needed when you finish school, and help you road test your dream careers.
Everything we do is based on over 8 years of research with Australia’s top students, and work with over 10,000 students around Australia.
Find out more here: www.artofsmart.com.au/

[@TingBie]

Being a big fish in a small pond indeed gives you so many opportunities! I graduated from the University of Tasmania and I can't agree more.

[@leeselle7070]

Thank you so much! This video gave me my confidence back and pushed back my self-doubt a lot! I received an early offer for a Bachelor of Psychology at Macquarie University and I'm so excited to get started there!

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Great to hear :)

[@sanjabosancic6767]

congrats! May I ask if you got a unconditional offer or a conditional offer? I would love to get an early offer there but was wondering which scheme they provided other students!

[@dhwanisoni4487]

Did you get in there?

[@nickb-]

Counter argument: many (perhaps even the majority) of undergraduates will change their major/area of concentration at least once. A top-tier university has many strong faculties, a third-tier university may only have one or two strong faculties.

[@maraisfan4life517]

That’s false. You’re just making assumptions.

[@theminecraftprime1]

Change University then. His point still applies

[@notdoingeetswa3690]

the actual brand doesn't matter but the networks you have do. it's not about what you know but about who you know. that's a huge reason why people choose the nice brand name universities because they'll have a better chance to network with students with good connections to their industry.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Very true - although if you're proactive about it, you can build your networks anyway across other universities even if you don't study there through getting engaged in university societies, events, and the start-up communities.

[@milly4543]

This is a great video tbh but it's not gonna help change the mind of the average HSC student. The problem is high school students are hyper focused on the uni rankings and in reality it's just not that important especially in the Australian context. It doesn't even correlate to a guaranteed good undergraduate experience as rankings reflect research output. Also, it's not like we've got a Harvard or Oxford equivalent, or a society that values institution name the same way as the US and UK do. Experience trumps everything after your first job in Australia and it's what you do outside of the classroom that will help you get that first job you really want. I know my opinion about uni prestige has changed a lot as I've become older. I've had offers from USyd and UNSW law and at the end of the day I've come to learn it's not the uni it's you. Plenty of people get to top tier law firms from MQ and UTS. I have friends from UNE, UNCLE that are doing really well in the Big4 and top tiers, and I know people that went to USyd and UNSW that are doing ok but nothing spectacular. Also, sometimes a uni isn't ranked super high overall but is great for a specific department like MQ's Ancient History, Psychology, Biology and Environmental Science departments are amazing and UNSW is quite average for Arts.

[@dreamsteddybearsmaster]

True that

[@raimajohnson3460]

I totally agree and love the information you shared! But I want to know for an international student in a long run the university brand has lot of importance right?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

If you want to work overseas, it can matter yes!

[@ariehastagonebad7321]

Which university is fantastic or having an amazing reputation for Master or Tesol or Applied Linguistics?

[@rainbowdoge9574]

Hi, I am aiming chiropractic in Macquarie university. Does this degree in Macquarie University have good reputation?

[@yashsarda4292]

Hi I wanted your suggestion. I have recieved offers from unsw , uni sydney for the civil engineering program . Both are ranked top 15 in global ranking for the faculty. In overall ranking also both are equally good . Now i wanted you to help me in choosing a uni between these. I am looking for a good job at a multination in australia and abroad .

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Ultimately both are very similar and it's more going to be an equation of other factors now. Cost, the campus, integrated work opportunities provided. How do they compare on these factors for you?

[@satrWIRA]

I am from outside Australia and want to do Law, and still not sure which Uni to go.

[@dreamsteddybearsmaster]

Why is this on my feed LOL? I already got to MQ and my ATAR wear nowhere near high enough to get me into USYD

[@leventmert4296]

Hi , please advise if I made a reasonable choice to study Bachelor of Science with Human Biology at Macquarie University... thanks in advance...

[@albert4491]

Can anybody give reviews about Master of Business Analytics in Macquarie..

[@appyosua2273]

Macquarie uni good for exercise and sports science?

[@ee-uj5hq]

Hi! Great video. I currently live in Mexico, and the government is offering scholarships with 2 universities in Australia, RMIT in Melbourne and Macquarie , which one of the 2 would you consider for a Master in Urban Planning?

[@merewetherful]

RMIT

[@killerDNA1001]

I would choose RMIT if I was in your place

[@hermione8999]

can't decide between UTS design in visual communications/creative intelligence & innovation, or USYD architecture or bachelor of arts/advanced studies

[@ArtofSmartTV]

The course content and career directions are quite different across these - what's your challenge in picking one?

[@eduquestptyltd]

INFORMATIVE

[@afshaanksingh2542]

Hi Rowan! I want to do BSc with a major in Computational Biology, and later do research in this field. So which one would be a better choice: USyd or University of Melbourne?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Is there a reason why you're only considering these two universities?

[@afshaanksingh2542]

@@ArtofSmartTV ummm... not really.... I have applied in USyd, UNSW, UniMelb and ANU for the Feb intake 2021

[@pragyakaushik8505]

Hi guys, What about Uni of Adelaide for Computer Science? I have got offers from UNSW and USYD but I have also gotten a 30% scholarship from Uni of Adelaide. This means I would have to pay around 50k lesser. What should I do? In my opinion, Adelaide would be a more practical choice, but I hope that I wouldn't be making a bad decision. I would love to hear your opinions. Thanks a lot.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

UNSW is the best for Computer Science, but honestly, with a $50K scholarship, and the fact that Computer Science grads are in high demand, it sounds like the better option!

[@rajkiran3389]

Hi, I intend to pursue a master's degree in International Business and have offers from Latrobe, Griffith, and Macquarie. My questions are: 1. Which one of these 3 has the better faculty? & 2. Which one of these 3 will get me better job-ready?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Hey Raj, the best thing to do is to jump online and go to the global university rankings. You can then do a deep dive into specific faculties. www.topuniversities.com/subject-rankings/2019

[@tanishjain8927]

Is macqaurie good for commerce. And will employers prefer a usyd graduate over a macqaurie for a financier position?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

MQ is good for Commerce and Applied Finance. While USYD may still get some preference from employers, really the key thing to do in either case is to get work experience as that will really determine your employment opps when you graduate.

[@milan3066]

A bachelor of Science. in Astrophysics, in Macquarie, could you give me some insight on that

[@ArtofSmartTV]

There aren't a lot of career prospects directly in astrophysics - often graduates end up working across a range of other roles. In terms of Science faculties at MQ - generally other universities in Sydney (UNSW, USYD) have stronger reputations for Science. MQ is great for Accounting, Actuarial, Commerce, Cyber Security, History, Arts

[@jonathanchen9587]

do you think Macquarie is a good university for a double degree in commerce and information technology. I have recently gotten an offer there

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Yes, MQ has great Commerce and IT faculties :)

[@FaizanKhan-rr9ke]

Hello Rowan, how difficult is to get admission in the University of Melbourne for Actuarial Studies?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Hey Faizan, What's the ATAR cut-off for it? That's the best way to get an indication of difficulty.

[@sanderpatrick4716]

Hey I'm an international student, so I got a 10k scholarship in Macquarie, but I am still confused to go either Macquarie or Melbourne uni as that Melbourne uni is in the top 20th for business world rank while Macquarie is like on the 100s I think, but I am still confused whether or not to trust the ranking by the QS and on how to choose the university (Mq or Melb)

[@sanderpatrick4716]

I am looking forward to study Commerce major in marketing as that I am planning to run a company afterwards (after I work in Australia for maybe a year or two)

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Is the 10K scholarship annual, or a one-off?

[@sanderpatrick4716]

ArtofSmartTV Annual

[@icedcoldbeer]

Check www.qilt.edu.au. QILT provides data on all colleges & universities in Australia along with its specific discipline on where they're good at. You can make a comparison out of it and can help you decide which best suits for you.

[@rohitjoshi8132]

@ArtofSmartTV Hi. I am planning to apply for Masters of Data Science (data analytics) either at UNSW or UNI of Sydney or UTS if I move to Sydney. Or else, if I move to Adelaide I will apply at UNI of Adelaide or UNISA. Now which one of them are best for this course in Sydney or Adelaide?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

UTS have had a great Data Science faculty for quite some time. www.uts.edu.au/data-science-institute UNSW and USYD are also strong options from a brand POV, but UNSW also has better faculty generally for Data Science.

[@rohitjoshi8132]

@@ArtofSmartTV how about RMIT? I am applying to RMIT for this semester for same course till we relocate in October. And what if we move to SA..how is University of Adelaide for this course? Or UNI of SA?

[@sanjanakailasanathan1006]

@rohitjoshi8132 what did you pick

[@rohitjoshi8132]

@sanjanakailasanathan1006 none of them. It was very expensive even after getting a scholarship. Will accept the offer once I start my research after citizenship.

[@suzi-ml8ep]

what if i want to study a double degree in commerce/business and design? The rankings are different in each uni, for example the uni is strong in commerce/business like UNSW but not as much design compared to other unis like RMIT or UTS... Which one should i choose then? thx same applies to monash business and design.. they are much more famous for business than design... in the end is it actually the same or does the subject rankings matter too?

[@milly4543]

UTS doesn't offer a combined Design/Business degree. RMIT is amazing at design. I guess you have to choose which is more important to you: Business or Design? A friend of mine from school studied Design at UNSW and they work as a graphic designer. Unless you're interested in Investment Banking or Management Consulting I don't think it matter where your Business degree is from. RMIT/UTS are not no-name universities to begin with. But yeah, figure out what your primary career goal is. You can always do a Masters in Commerce at a Go8 after your Design degree if it really bothers you.

[@suzi-ml8ep]

@@milly4543 I see, thanks! is UTS design good btw? I at first I thought I needed a business degree to get a masters in business aha

[@milly4543]

@@suzi-ml8ep UTS design is really good, or so I've been told by my Graphic Design friend. He initially wanted to get into UTS but didn't make the cutoff. I've also noticed a bunch of insta designers that study at UTS. Apparently it's one of their strengths, that and journalism.

[@suzi-ml8ep]

@@milly4543 oh ok I see, thanks! I'm not from australia so I wasn't sure at all.. appreciate your reply !

[@jonathanchen9587]

I have gotten an offer for Commerce at UNSW. Do you think I should take that university or MQ?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Congrats! UNSW has a very strong reputation for Commerce, and ranks well internationally, however I'd recommend looking at a broader range of factors as well: artofsmart.com.au/university/choosing-right-university/

[@Amadagagawatch]

Macquarie MSM is quite reputable, and has qs rank 19 globally. So now should I choose Melbourne or Macquarie, Melbourne doesn't have the same rank for the program.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

When you say MSM, what are you referring to here?

[@Amadagagawatch]

@@ArtofSmartTV I'm referring to marketing.

[@anvayawalgaonkar4119]

Thanks brother for this video..Just wanted to ask hows the Macquarie university in comparison with the UTS university ? I got the offers from these two universities..

[@ArtofSmartTV]

What course are you considering?

[@anvayawalgaonkar4119]

@@ArtofSmartTV masters of Data Science from both

[@mohamadel-zmeter7250]

What uni is better for engineering Macquarie or wsu

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Take a look at the Global Rankings based on Faculty. Neither have strong reputations for Engineering! www.topuniversities.com/universities/subject/engineering-general/country/australia

[@suzi-ml8ep]

Is design a useful or useless degree btw? Are earnings low in australia compared to other disciplines like commerce (marketing) or media comms?

[@milly4543]

Useful for someone interested in design. Yes earnings are generally lower that marketing but there's money to be made in UX/UI and graphics. Depends on how good you are.

[@suzi-ml8ep]

@@milly4543 I see, thanks for your reply!

[@akshaybiradar259]

Any recommendations for universities that are considered reputable for data science?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Given this is an emerging area, it's still a little unclear how employers are viewing different university's offerings and graduates. In saying this UTS has had a data analytics/science courses for quite some time and have a good reputation here. Additionally UNSW also has a good reputation in this area.

[@dreamsteddybearsmaster]

MQ is not bad. I have plenty of friends that go there and do a Double Degree in Acturial Studies and Data Science, but be warned neither degree is for the faint hearted

[@regynieto]

@@dreamsteddybearsmaster hello, I’m planning to take Data Science program. Is it really that hard? I submitted my application to MQ a few weeks ago.

[@gamewithjason]

UQ, QUT for computer science, which is better?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

How are you evaluating them? What criteria is important to you?

[@vanessaeshou1514]

Any recommended universities for studying economics? I’m torn between Macq, UTS, and USYD 😆

[@ArtofSmartTV]

What is most important to you? Have you got a hit list of the key things you are going to evaluate these universities on?

[@thumbnut3345]

What did you go for? I think I'm having to make the same decision.

[@vanessaeshou1514]

@@thumbnut3345 I know USYD has had some very successful economics honours graduates... only pick if ur really passionate. And note it is NOT like HSC Eco, instead it is highly mathematical & full of statistical analysis

[@tanishjain8927]

​@@vanessaeshou1514 what did you pick

[@namanagrawal3854]

I've offer letter for Master of Engineering(Electrical) from almost all universities from Uni Melb to lowest rank university in Australia. Can you please guide me with how to shortlist university that best helps me to get a job after my graduation. Your help will be really appreciated

[@ArtofSmartTV]

We've created a guide of questions you should use to evaluate each university. Check it out here: artofsmart.com.au/choosing-right-university/

[@samad3251]

Naman Agrawal if you are an International Student it is not a big deal in getting an offer from any Aus Unis as you would be paying 4X fees in comparison to Domestic/ Local students, it is very hard to get a post graduate experience in Engineering in Aus (more so post-COVID). Even if you achieve High Disticntion from ANU, but you are an International Student, you have a dimished job prospects in comparison to pass grade local student from any other uni.

[@JiyeonKoh]

I was trying to compare btw Usyd and Macq, but in all areas, Usyd is always ranked higher than Macq, only except for tuition fee. So here remains my concern. "Am I affordable to pay that amount of money for the school?"

[@ArtofSmartTV]

What course specifically are you looking at?

[@ClosetedPlatonist]

I need some help. I’ve been offered a bachelor of psychology from Macquarie, but I was also considering the bachelor of psychological science at UNSW. I have been pretty committed to Macquarie up until now, thinking that it may be a less competitive and more balanced overall university experience compared to some place like UNSW, if that makes any sense. On top of this, Macquarie is a 15 minute drive or 20-30 train whereas UNSW would be closer to a 2 hour one way commute. I am fine with going to Macquarie as I’m aware that Macquarie is reputable in Psychology, however a small part of me is nagging, most likely due to the associated prestige of UNSW, with me subconsciously wondering if I would have any regrets not choosing UNSW and somehow ‘wasting potential’ if that makes any sense. Could I get some advice? Is the extra large commute to UNSW worth it? Is Macquarie still good? Would I be losing the opportunity to attend a very high class education or is it about the same? Would my employability suffer? Is there a social life difference? Etc etc.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

MQ has a great reputation in Psychology and generally speaking, brand matters less for employment in psychology. So on that note, MQ is a great option. Social life is better at UNSW though.

[@xinglan1147]

I guess I will choose UNSW if I were you. As for me, the reputation of the university is so significant, not merely the first job after leaving the uni.

[@antoniamercado1306]

@@ArtofSmartTV ooh really!? why would you say the social life is better at UNSW?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

@@antoniamercado1306 UNSW have lots of clubs and societies which play a huge role in student campus life and experience - this is backed by a very strong, well funded student union. MQ had some issues a number of years ago around their student union and funding clubs, and it's meant that the student university clubs are a lot more subdued.

[@righteous...]

This video read my mind haha.....

[@rahulshankar9055]

“to what degree”… pun intended?? 😂

[@subodhbhandari4684]

I am a international student what will be the best universities in Sydney for computer engineering??

[@ishaanverma5765]

UNSW, Usyd and UTS

[@davispan77]

I want to study a Arts Degree Majoring in Philosophy my criteria isn't job oriented it's the best faculty for the arts and humanities what University is best for me?

[@milly4543]

idk where you live but for Sydney USyd hands down has the best Arts faculty esp for Philosophy. MQ is strong in Ancient History.

[@davispan77]

@@milly4543 Thank you so much I think I have a clearer idea of what uni to aim for

[@ArtofSmartTV]

Micha is right on!

[@SW-fy8pq]

Rich people say money is not that important. Elite uni graduates say uni brand isn't that important. Ferrari car owners say all cars are similar. Do you believe in this kind of bxllshxt?

[@BackwardshturT]

13 minute video and the answer is yes. Work experience is mutually exclusive to the university's brand reputation. You can have both... Im a unsw law/science grad who has worked in the uk.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

In certain circumstances sure - which is what I was getting at in the video. I think the goal is to get students to be more critical of making decisions purely based on brand and rather consider what employers think about universities as this is more important. I was speaking with a very senior representative of one of Australia's largest banks about this very question yesterday on whether university brand matters. He was very clear - they don't look at university. They look at the degree, and outside work experience. In fact, another major financial services firm Deloitte publicly have identified that they hide the university when reviewing job applications. The aim is to limit the "prestige" associated with an institution, so as to more accurately test the abilities of the applicant.

[@BackwardshturT]

@@ArtofSmartTV interesting you say that because a UNSW Law cut off is like a 97 atar + LAT test wwhere as a WSU law cut off is like a 65 atar with a couple of bonus points. That is a huge difference in the capabilities of the cohort. I have friends in law across all NSW universities and the level of competence is completely different when comparing USYD/UNSW to macq or WSU. Your mate probably told you that because he wanted to be PC and accepting but no way it doesn't matter. Also, go look at Deloitte's grad cohort and tabulate how many UNSW and USYD guys there are and compare that to how many WSU guys there are and you will see who gets in. That's kinda like saying a Toyota Camry and a Mercedes C63 AMG are the same because they are both cars and we don't have any preference to either when we are looking for a car that drives well.

[@ArtofSmartTV]

​@@BackwardshturT Sure - although, if you score a 95+ and go to WSU on a $20K+ year scholarship, and you're a 'big fish' in a small pond, there are a lot of advantages. I think generally you're focusing a little too narrowly on Law... My advice ultimately was to look at what employers perspectives are for specific degrees and specific universities. Sure, UNSW and USYD have stronger employer reputations in Law which are fantastic. Other universities, however, have stronger reputations in other faculties. So the point here is to evaluate this more critically at a faculty level, rather than just using the overall global rank and perceived prestige of the entire university as your key driver in decision making.

[@BackwardshturT]

​@@ArtofSmartTV True. I am focusing on law because I have just graduated and feel I can give an accurate opinion about the degree at UNSW and my anecdotal experience with people studying elsewhere. However, I feel that at the end of the day the university brand does matter and there are no two ways about it. Employers might say that it doesn't or that they are not biased but then look at the guys in their grad cohort and you will see what they really have a preference towards. In the legal industry, there are some firms that definitely prefer you to be white, go to USYD and attended a GPS high school. You are definitely right in saying other universities have strong faculties. Macq with finance or actuarial, UTS with eng etc.

[@BackwardshturT]

The real conclusion is, even if it does matter: (1) can you change it (2) can you accept it and improve your selling points as an employee candidate in other areas? (1) you can transfer to a more prestigious uni (2) you can improve your non-academic experience i.e. work, EC and volunteering

[@misterbig9025]

Good luck when looking for jobs

[@simoniwamoto8451]

How about law degrees?

[@ArtofSmartTV]

As in, does brand matter for universities and their law degrees?

[@abanoubwakil1196]

Is Notre dama a good uni

[@ArtofSmartTV]

What criteria do you want to evaluate it on? What's important to you?

[@vishwakalhara6235]

Hey i m gonna study engineering in macquarie and there is a scholarship opportunity as well but i know that it is not reputed in engineering that much. Do u think it is good idea

[@ArtofSmartTV]

It depends on what other offers you have received.

[@jn8851]

Trust me guys, the best go to the best universities , e.g.if you can complete a degree at Cambridge, would you go to UTS? Come on, this BS clip 😭

[@somethingfishy1088]

From a job perspective, he's on the money. I'm currently at UTS, tier 1 engineering project (over $2 billion) for large multinational, regional student with no family contacts. My company has only hired UTS Undergraduates and majority UTS graduates. Comparing Australian universities with world renowned institutions is not a fair comparison. There are other benefits to going to G8 unis though. Eg. If you know how to socialise, my wealthiest friends (through large amounts of intergenerational wealth) go to G8. As unfortunate as it is, that's good for networking if you know how to benefit from that. Anyway, I assume you're in year 12 based on your attitude. Hope you got into the uni you wanted.