Drinker's Chasers - Indy 5 Director Blames Fans For Flop

[@kevinoneil5120]

Guy has a lot of balls saying "things come to an end" about an IP where the third movie ended with our hero *literally riding off into the sunset*

[@derekgorman7939]

Here here old boy, well said sir.

[@starwarsroo2448]

Even Ford and Spileberg were tired of it at that point and wanted to do different things a bit. It is the perfect ending

[@Umega101]

Nah ... It's the Ego of this guy implying that he is more deserving of sending off

[@death-king1834]

I'm not the biggest fan of Kingdom of the Crystal Skull (I'm still of the opinion there are three Indy movies), but I won't lie, there is something about seeing Indy getting married and settling down as a family man with a wife and son I do like. I still prefer the original ending of him and his dad riding off together into the sunset, but it's overall a nice enough epilogue for the character. Too bad even this one decent element had to be ruined by Kathy and Disney.

[@starwarsroo2448]

@death-king1834 KOTCS is bad and he was too old then to play him. This last one was a joke and I skipped it. I agree with at least he sort of got an ending, even if he'd already got the perfect one

[@TheCrusaderKing]

Say it with me, "Fans don't owe you our money!"

[@CecilWindbush]

Especially if it's some kind of Bullshit.

[@46sn29]

Because these narcissists refuse to learn. You give the fans what they want. You don't make what YOU want and demand the fans like it. Nobody wanted to see old depressed Indy take a back seat to an insufferable girl boss. You could have easily made this a father/son bonding film by bringing Short Round back. But no, the message was more important.

[@Caspeaon]

@@46sn29Idk I think artists (im using that term very loosely here) are entitled to make things for themselves that they like, BUT that also means they can’t complain when everyone else hates it, because they made it for themselves. You can’t have it both ways, either it’s for you or it’s for the fans, just be clear who it’s for, and realize that our job as your fans isn’t to suck you off for doing your job, ESPECIALLY if it isn’t even for us.

[@hephzbah1130]

BOOM!!!

[@delbroox]

*their

[@chance_ondriezek99]

Who knew that Indiana Jones fans didn’t want to see a movie where he was emasculated and upstaged by a girl-boss?

[@Bonesawisready926]

An ugly girl boss too, couldn't even give us a pretty woman to root for.

[@SubZero-hs9xc]

I think alot of people didnt want a movie that has a 80 year old him

[@reginaknoll4258]

​@@Bonesawisready926, look at this unsympathetic girl boss a little bit clother! Those long arms, big hands, massive jawline, big feet!

[@motherplayer]

I'd say more seeing them try to pretend an 80 year old man can still bring the same energy he did at the prime of the series MAY have been a bit....misjudged, I don't know.

[@JRRob3wn]

Plus half the movie was atrocious video game cut scene level CGI judging by the trailer.

[@Sousabird]

I'm honored to know that I helped destroy this nightmare.

[@archmage_of_the_aether]

I too endeavoured to not watch this movie at every opportunity

[@ramigilneas9274]

It was super easy, barely an inconvenience.

[@krissteel4074]

Evil prevails when hard earned cash funds it... and encourages them to do it again

[@archmage_of_the_aether]

@krissteel4074 don't dilute the word 'evil', lad

[@krissteel4074]

@@archmage_of_the_aether yeah in comparison to a lot of stuff its more of a 'swindling' people for cash at this point. Film makers are risking being put in the same block of undesirables as phone scammers

[@cappyjosh4509]

Last Crusade dealt with Sean Connery's age without humiliating him.

[@archstanton9073]

Spielberg even got him to not wear a toupee which shocked a lot of people at the time who didn't know he was bald.

[@flankspeed007]

Remember when it turns out they both slept with the same women! Talk about respecting your elders!

[@delbroox]

👏👏👏👏

[@geeebuttersnap2433]

@@archstanton9073I call bullshit, that’s implying that he was bald in the rock, no way.

[@Travula87]

Best argument

[@Astroman10]

They chose PWB over the fans! They can blame us all they want! We are done seeing our favorite characters shoved into the dirt and pissed on for The Message!

[@Cyberleader672]

PWB?

[@Astroman10]

@ Phoebe Waller Bridge

[@ephraimwinslow]

@@Astroman10 Pewb works quite well as a shorthand for her, actually.

[@Dragoon-yg7fi]

Oh no I take full responsibility. I haven't even seen this movie and still trashed it on principle

[@thEannoyingE]

The whole movie, no joke, I thought she was trans.

[@ViolaDawson-s1c]

Moviegoers had little interest in seeing Indiana Jones with a rude British woman at dusk.

[@specialk9424]

We had nothing wrong with Harrison Ford being old. We had a problem with Harrison Ford being MADE FUN OF, because he was old, and being pushed aside by some girl none of us had ever heard of, and mocked by her, through the whole movie. If they wanted to do a sidekick, they should have brought back Short Round. Ke Huy Quan would have jumped at the chance to come back. Did you see him at the Oscars? He's almost 50, but when he ran on stage and hugged Harrison Ford, he was 10 years old again. But no, Kathleen had to shove her "girl power" bullshit in all of our faces, and ruin yet another lucrative IP. Indiana Jones is THREE movies long. Period.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Lets not forget how they brought back John Rhys Davies just for Indi to tell him to f* off and reject one last adventure. That was basicaly telling us fans they know we want that, and mocking us for wanting it.

[@TheEvertw]

I thought the fourth movie was amusing, and you can see that actors were having a good time making it.

[@jackyallop5313]

Preach brother

[@Knight5533]

Thank you! This is exactly it right here. All they needed was to bring back short round and have an awesome adventure with just him and Indy, she no girl power bullshit along the way. It would’ve been so much better!

[@Durzo1259]

Tbh, it did stretch credulity pretty hard to watch an 80 year old man defeating hoards of young men in a fist fight. I guess I can forgive that for the sake of one last Harrison Ford Indie movie, but I only made if halfway through when I got bored to death of 80% of the movie being nothing but first fights while driving really fast. It's like we have a new generation of Hollywood writers who have lost a basic understanding: excitement is only exciting when given in controlled doses. It's not exciting to inject the most extreme excitement non-stop for hours.

[@awesomehpt8938]

Can people stop giving Phoebe Waller-bridge jobs please?

[@MorningStar293]

If I see anything with her or Awkwafina in it it's an instant nope from me.

[@beastmaster6943]

The power of one The power of two The power of manyyyyy

[@Tha_Chancla]

@@Durzo1259 Because the chance of a project being shit goes up immensely if she is present.

[@zacharymcmillan2788]

Legit 💯,she's the Sweet Baby Inc. of the film world. 🤨👍

[@A_Noid]

Weird that Fleabag was actually good, and everything after that disappointing.

[@defaultthecritic121]

Studio releases crappy product. Said product loses money. Creatives blame fans for failure. Fans abandon the IP. Studio announces more crappy products. Repeat cycle.

[@SamtheBravesFan]

What fans are left moved to the video game if they have an XBOX. Interestingly enough, it may actually be good.

[@archstanton9073]

@@SamtheBravesFan It's on PC too. And it's a lot of fun.

[@darrenthompson7995]

@@SamtheBravesFanIndiana jones and the great circle is so fun! Been having a blast with it

[@5persondude]

The definition of insanity

[@kaasmeester5903]

@@SamtheBravesFan NGL it looks really good too... I might give it a spin.

[@incurableromantic4006]

The blindingly obvious thing to do would have been to re-unite Indy with Short Round from Temple of Doom - the actor is still working in the business, and you'd have had instant chemistry and nostalgia pull: unlike with Phoebe Waller Bridge who seems to have been put into the movie just to annoy the fan base and humiliate the lead character.

[@iplayeddsharpminor]

Yes this. His first appearance on screen in years was everything everywhere all at once and it was an incredible performance

[@stellastarbrightk7563]

Wish I could give you two thumbs up. Had not thought of this take

[@JRRob3wn]

Not to mention they also had given Indy a son in the previous movie. They could have had the son get mixed up in some shady business in Asia and go missing (he’s on the hunt for some artifact). Indy comes out of retirement to find him and enlists short round’s help. Let the young guys do all the action.

[@bjrnhalfhand2258]

​@@JRRob3wn yes and also have some tension between Mutt and Short Round once they catch up with Mutt. A kind of awkward brothers thing.

[@JRRob3wn]

@ Yep. It’s not rocket science. Same with the Disney SW sequels. 5 fans sitting around drinking beers could have come up with ideas far more interesting than the utter trash that they made. All of Hollywood needs to be purged, they are nothing but a bunch of talentless hacks.

[@doberski6855]

🤔Yet fans back in the day had no trouble seeing an 'old' Sean Connery in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

[@ogierthedane6025]

Epic movie :D

[@MonkeyKingsformerroomate]

Plus Logan, which Mangold directed, so he should know better.

[@marzipanmonkey]

Funnily enough Sean Connery wasn’t that much older than Harrison Ford. But yeah, the way he played Henry Jones was spot on. What he lacked for big stunts or action he made up for with his intelligence and charisma. The “I’ve done it all before” factor.

[@JRRob3wn]

Which is exactly the role they should have had Indy play in this movie. His son, disappeared in after returning from Vietnam and Indy has to come out of retirement to bail him out of trouble (or some such variation of this theme). Indy uses his wits instead of his brawn, once he and his son are reunited the son takes all the action scenes. Literally every single fan would have been fine with old man Indy if the movie had been good and didn’t have a girl boss in it.

[@georgepoitras3502]

Yes even knowing the 2 Actors were only like 7 years apart it was still excellent.

[@ereini0n]

Fans are responsible for something succeeding and something flopping. He cannot take the one without the other.

[@Mereologist]

Democrat elitists in Hollywood prefer everyone else accept their role as slaves. You are to work hard and applaud anything the elite do or say.

[@zztopz7090]

Now that you mention it, they never thank us when something does well.

[@roywall8169]

I accept full responsibility for not going to see the movie. It is my fault. I will be the reason many more movies flop.

[@williamedwards4151]

Thank you for your service.

[@steadfastandyx4947]

Me too.

[@kathleenhensley5951]

Same here. They seem to think we have some sort of responsibility towards them. we don't. What is ridiculous is they say these movies are for "modern audiences" but also say they think we fans owe them our attendance... they didn't make the movie for us, they made for others, we noticed and didn't spend our money.

[@evalramman7502]

Wicked person, just wicked.

[@Self-Signed]

Have you tried getting 20+ brand new vaccinations? I hear it can help.

[@sirloin8745]

What have I done this time?

[@richarddangler7596]

😂😂😂😂 don’t worry they’ll let you know.

[@whenpigsfly8178]

What's in your interest, not theirs. You bad man.

[@Bonesawisready926]

Had taste.

[@Umega101]

I'm white. Male. Straight. Which means I've done everything wrong since birth, but this has to happen so humanity can become enlightened and more inclusive, or something

[@jackyallop5313]

Lmao

[@ieetemos4breakfast]

I choose not to acknowledge the existence of crystal skull and DoD. If people these days can reject basic biology then I shouldn’t have to accept shitty movies and TV that destroy legacy and lore. That includes Indiana Jones, rings of power, new Star Wars and Star Trek, and pretty much whatever else I choose.

[@Mereologist]

You are right to do so.

[@theradgegadgie6352]

He says I'm partly to blame for helping wreck this movie?! **sniff** That's the nicest thing that anyone's ever said to me.

[@whenpigsfly8178]

Happy to repay their contempt with my indifference.

[@ephraimwinslow]

"Do better! ...By which I mean give me money." "No." "...Well we think you're nasty istophobes!" "Don't care." "You keep this up and we'll make a hackneyed parody of you in our next terrible film!" "Won't see it. Doesn't matter." "You're a bully!" "You represent a studio worth over 8 figures. I am a random guy in a home office on a PC." "STOP IT!!! We'll tell on you! T.T"

[@geeebuttersnap2433]

@@ephraimwinslowdon’t forget the reeeeeeeee reeeeeeee reeeeeeeeee we’re canceling you because your toxic and a ista phobe.

[@DavidAnderson-m5c]

Pithy *AND* succinct. Nicely done.

[@kpsk8031]

Mangold made "3:10 to Yuma" and "Ford v Ferrari". He should be able to recognise the huge, gaping, bottomless chasm between these movies and Not-Indy 5.

[@aureycox7990]

The problem is he wasn’t involved in the writing of those stories

[@izzieizuako9373]

310 to yuma was a masterpiece

[@izzieizuako9373]

Sorry, IS!!

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Hard to believe the same man made these bangers

[@surrealcereal603]

He also made Logan and Walk the Line. He was, in my opinion, the only hope that Indy 5 would be at least decent, despite the Disney component.

[@ryeguy7471]

Moviegoers weren’t interested in a movie sundowning Indiana Jones with an obnoxious British woman.

[@skylx0812]

Went to _her_ twitter page the last time _she_ threw a sissy-fit. The comments were mostly from the snobbish of the snobs agreeing with _her_ . That industry needs to be torn down. Nothing of value will be lost.

[@Bonesawisready926]

They'll take all the praise for a project succeeding but none of the blame for it failing. And these people wonder why the audience just finds it amusing to watch their industry fall apart now? Same goes for AAA gaming too.

[@Sergeant_Fury]

Victory has many fathers, defeat is an orphan.

[@CleverGirlAAH]

"Managementnis never wrong"

[@ron5545]

Harrison Ford doesn't even care about Indy anymore but I, the fan, am supposed to?

[@prestigeworldwide5047]

Very good point

[@archstanton9073]

He seemed to care at the video game awards.

[@devlinallistair-zx5by]

He really is just a miserable bastard.

[@jakemiller4411]

@@archstanton9073tbf he probably got paid a bunch to show up

[@_XR40_]

Why do people think he _ever_ cared? Ford never "cared" about Han Solo either. The man is a working actor and it's silly to think he has to be a "fan" at the same time. Anyone paying attention would understand that his roles are a paycheck, not a fetish. He's made this very plain in innumerable interviews for decades....

[@HeadRusch1]

Hitler blames WW2 loss on "hateful, meddling Allies", Film at 11.

[@johnmcintosh8673]

What channel is that on, I'd like to see it!

[@blackieblack]

Don't compare him to these awful people

[@Shoelessjoe78]

He'd gotten away with it too if it weren't for those meddling Allies! Darn kids always freeing things...

[@Lithilic]

Kingdom of the Crystal Skull was already beating a dead horse. Dial of Destiny came back to sweep up the bone dust.

[@PeakDennisReynolds]

The great circle is the canon fourth movie as far as I'm concerned. Those two disasters don't exist to me.

[@Mikedegot]

From the moment it was announced, the reaction was "why?" They ignored that and continued with the project. Their actions, their results.

[@Simon-xc5oy]

Yes. Ford was too old and the fourth film was a bad idea and not well received and that should have told them to not try again. Spielberg and Lucas accepted that and worked away as they could not make it work or come up with anything good. And that was it. Till Lucas sold Lucasfilm to Disney and they put Krapthleeen Krapperdy in charge. Its not Mangolds fault. Its KKs. She green lit this, she wanted it made, she put PWB in to it, the whole thing was her project, ideas and all. Including her original ending of PWB taking over by writing Indy out of everything by killing him so he never happened! Mangold came in to direct later in the day and he was just the director that they managed to talk into it and keep him around to make and finish the thing. I have way less respect for him now though, because of this, because if he had half a brain, or was an Indy fan he would have told them to shove it, refused to make it and he would have known it was a bad idea and disaster in the making.

[@Bailonus]

Because Kennedy wanted to prove she could make a better Indiana Jones movie, with a female lead, than Lucas and Spielberg could ever manage.

[@Simon-xc5oy]

@@Bailonus Yes that is exactly why made Dial of Disaster. Didnt work out very well for her though did it? The worst Indiana Jones film of them all, and a total flop millions in the red. The worst Star Wars films of all time, the worst Star Wars series of all time, the worst Willow series / sequel etc of all time. All flops and fails and costing millions and losing even more. And yet she is still in charge...

[@josay3394]

Didnt Mangold attack a podcast crew bc he stated exactly why the movie would fail years before its release? That podcast was right in the end

[@rayanderson5797]

And in other news: The sky is still blue, the ocean is still wet, and the sun rose this morning (everywhere except Scotland, naturally.)

[@Falconlibrary]

Aye

[@MusicalBoarder]

Water isnt wet. Water makes things wet

[@josipmarasovic2436]

@@MusicalBoarder it is wet since it made other things wet it couldnt make other things wet if it wasnt wet. water is wet

[@PabloTheThug]

@@josipmarasovic2436that’s like saying that since fire burns things, fire itself is burnt.

[@josipmarasovic2436]

@PabloTheThug fire and water are two diffrent things same doesent apply to water and fire

[@UnbeltedSundew]

Director: "I failed at this thing I did, I blame the "fans"." CEO: "I failed this quarter on reaching our earning projections, I blame the investors." Carpenter: "I failed to make a table that stands straight, I blame the floor." Chef: "I failed to make a meal and it tasted like DS, I blame the customer." etc. etc.

[@wyssmaster]

Tbf if I make a table that's perfectly square and plumb, with the legs perfect flat such that the top is perfectly level, and then I put it in the customer's house and it's suddenly incredibly wonky, it's entirely fair to blame the floor. Also tbf, the carpenter actually WOULD be the person at fault, as carpenters are construction workers (they frame houses, do drywall, flooring, cabinets etc) while a woodworker/joiner would have built the furniture. A better analogy would be a carpenter framing a house with half the necessary studs, no rafters, no joists etc and blaming the mill where he bought the lumber when the entire thing collapses.

[@UnbeltedSundew]

@@wyssmaster lol. Fair enough! 😄

[@imperialwolf7872]

Guide to Lucas Film under Disney Step 1: take a beloved franchise Step 2: disrespect any existing characters or established lore whilst introducing an annoying Mary Sue girl boss as the new main character Step 3: film bombs Step 4: blame the fans

[@jamespazuzuairsoft5369]

Repeat on gulp shitto: a star wars story and expect different results for some reason.

[@rider275]

Step 5: Return to step 1.

[@bastianogr4960]

Ford's age and energy in the trailers certainly weren't enticing. But I could name about a hundred other things, that made me avoid this movie, and none of them had anything to do with Harrison Ford.

[@spook407]

“Things come to an end” apparently not the Indiana Jones franchise

[@phonepunk7888]

As a fan I couldn't accept that things come to an end, that's why I didn't bother seeing the 2024 movie in a franchise that had a proper ending in 1989.

[@DarkestKnightshade]

Game is so fun

[@MysticTroll]

Wish it was 3rd person

[@CoffeeBrainzz]

The worst part was Phoebe punching him in the face and removing the choice of how he wanted to die in the time era he dreamed of… but NOPE 👊🏻 Why aren’t they screaming about Indianas ‘agency’ being stolen away. In the Acolyte they screamed like banshees how Sol took away the girls agency because he ‘accepted his death’ “she couldn’t even take it from him the way she wanted to💁‍♀️” they come up with these weird psychotic, narcissistic plots and reasonings and it’s just so azzbackwards

[@DavidAVest]

I didn't see this Indy movie, but what you describe reminded me of the horrible Star Wars moment when Rose took away Finns sacrifice, a moment that took away Finn doing something unexpected, badass, and would have given the character at least some gravitas.

[@wyssmaster]

Man doesn't get to choose if woman dislikes his decision

[@mjefferson3223]

There were five Indy films? I seem to recall only three

[@Cyraxior]

Right? Raiders, Crusade, and Skull.

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

@@Cyraxior nice try, but no.

[@WH250398]

To give Kingdom SOME credit.. It was nowhere near as good as the trilogy, but it is better in every way than Dial of Destiny.

[@LegendsOfBloodGulch]

1:00 Not making the movie. That was what would have made fans happy.

[@scottmcfadyen293]

Girlbossing is just bullying boys by media. Pass it on.

[@johntumahab323]

I'm still stunned that Hollywood still won't alter it's ridiculous model for getting people to see their bad entries of franchises after the past few years... Step 1: Insult and slander your audience for being too stupid, racist, bigoted, homophobic, sexist, etc. for not loving your take on a franchise. Step 2: ??? Step 3: Profit!

[@DanCooper404]

Raiders: I was on the edge of my seat. Temple of Doom: I was biting my nails. Last Crusade: I cheered throughout. Perfect ending. ************************* Crystal Skull: I laughed at how bad it was. Dial of Destiny: I fell asleep halfway through, and didn't care.

[@PizzaGuy2001]

“I’m I so out of touch? No, it’s the fans that are wrong”. - Modern Disney

[@joshg.6315]

It’s pretty simple. The fans are YOUR CUSTOMERS. Make whatever you want, but if you don’t give them what they want, they’ll spend their money elsewhere.

[@SqueakingLion]

How DARE we have an opinion that counters theirs??? Dobby must punish himself! Dobby must iron his hands! Jesus, grow up Hollywood.

[@westaussie965]

Why you telling Jesus? Don’t forget allah and buddha🤔

[@diogogomes3238]

Indy 5 is got to be one of the most disrespectful movies ever made, right up there with movies like Nightmare on elm street (remake) or Joker 2.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

How they brought back John Rhys Davies just for Indi to tell him to f* off and reject one last adventure. That was basicaly telling us fans they know we want that, and mocking us for wanting it.

[@SlapstickStooge]

I was obligated to see Dial of Disappointment at my nephews birthday party. My ticket was already paid for, and I still felt ripped off. I was robbed of 3 hours of time.

[@cinemamadness6920]

We didn't reject Indie because he was old, we rejected him becoming an alcoholic bum, and we rejected his girl boss granddaughter who was extremely unlikable

[@DVX_BELLORVM]

From Indiana Jones, to Joe Biden, to Mike Tyson, I think we can now definitively say that age is not just a number.

[@archstanton9073]

Everyone loses a step when they get older. More than one if they make it to their 70's and 80's. There's no shame in it.

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

It never was. People just watch too much fiction.

[@Simon-xc5oy]

Exactly, you get old. I am sick of hearing this from people at each birthday I have. I am getting older. I can no longer run flat out, I get tired earlier in the evening. Walking is harder, I get aches and squeaks and clicks in my joints from time to time. And I not "old" its just that I am not young anymore. And that stupid saying age is just a number etc is utter bullsheert. Age is age. We get old. And you feel it eventually. Its inevitable and a fact of life. Trying to pretend you are 18 when you are 50 or 60 something is just embarrassing.

[@ronaldbell7429]

None of the fans cared whether the director really loved the ACTOR Harrison Ford, as he says he did. What we cared was that he denigrated and degraded the CHARACTER Indiana Jones.

[@rodemus18]

It ended at the end of kingdom Crystal skull and had the perfect ending with Indy and Marion getting married

[@JRRob3wn]

Never heard of that movie. Is it a fan film?

[@drby0788]

It ended with The Last Crusade

[@347Jimmy]

​@@drby0788 literally riding off into the sunset

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

Crystal Skull? Is that a fanfic?

[@fakshen1973]

Kennedy and Disney were filling quotas not theatre seats.

[@chasehedges6775]

Kennedy and Modern Disney know no bounds when it comes to money and greed LOL😂😂😂😂😂

[@MrBoz1968]

How about the fact that every time in the movie Indy goes to someone he knows for help, she gets them killed. He has to watch all of his friends die as a result of her pursuit.

[@deltics735]

The bottom line is that Last Crusade was a perfect send-off for Indy so *anything* that came after was going to have a hard time overcoming the lack of momentum; Indy’s story was done. As a character, there was no more story to tell. Handing off to some other character was the only way to keep the franchise going, but it would have to be a character that fans of Indy would embrace. Crystal Skull fumbled that catastrophically. I feel there is a worthwhile comparison to be drawn with another franchise: Star Trek The Undiscovered Country gave the original crew a perfect send-off; second star on the right and straight on ‘til morning, and the cast signatures in the credits… about as final a finality as was possible. Then we got Generations. Whatever you think of that film as a whole and whatever the actual reasons for the lack of original cast characters in that story, the result was a token, but significant, presence of characters, necessary to pass the baton to the new (Next Gen) crew. And to justify their presence (rightly or wrongly) the story weaves in a literal ending for the figurehead original crew member as well as the vessel that literally brought the new crew into play, providing a clearly delineated but narratively authentic transition from new to old. That the Next Gen films that followed were pale shades of the Original Crew adventures is unfortunate. I believe that was largely due to the decision to retain the entire ensemble cast of the next gen crew. That ensemble is helpful for a TV show to have adventures for different characters over a season’s worth of stories, but creates a real problem in a movie where you need a tight story following a smaller number of characters. To that extent, Generations was a missed opportunity to dispose of some of the weaker, less interesting next gen main cast. I have some picks but won’t list them here to avoid creating arguments about which crew would have been the better choices to continue the story, though I think it’s fairly obvious…. :) Generations, for me, is the most Trek-like next gen story. First Contact was a misfire attempt at an action film (lots to recommend but suffering some fatal flaws), Insurrection was a misfire attempt to find a Next Gen vibe in a movie. Nemesis… I need to watch again, but the fact that - as far as - I can recall I’ve only ever watched it once says something in itself. Dragging this back to Indy…. After Last Crusade, Crystal Skull should have featured Indy in a much smaller role with a new character taking up the role of franchise lead. This was made more difficult by the lack of an established character to hand over to, so the story had to work overtime to achieve that. But by giving so much time to Indy himself, the story wrote itself into an impossible situation and failed to achieve a hand-over in any sense. Which left Dial of Destiny to clumsily attempt to fabricate another ending for a character that had already had the perfect ending. It could have worked in the hands of a particularly talented writer with a genuine love for the character, but the stars didn’t align so what we got was a cash-grab that thankfully failed. (the saddest part being that given the machinations of Hollywood Accounting, even as a financial disaster I am sure that Dial of Destiny was turned into a “success” from a bean counting perspective by creating tangible losses that could be offset against tax liabilities incurred by other, more successful productions)

[@marzipanmonkey]

Crazy times we live in. Back in the day film companies were striving to find out exactly what movie goers wanted and tried to deliver something that would get people flocking to the cinema and earn them a pretty penny. Now if a film flops it's because the "bigoted" audience are all in the wrong and we should love the film? 🤣

[@YourOlderBrotherChannel]

I love how James acts like Disney had a gun to his head and forced him to make this movie… “You don’t understand! He has to be an old, sad failure! What was I gonna do, NOT make another cash-grab installment???”

[@davealfdergraue3266]

I watched that awful part with the "Alien Skulls" and it killed my love for the Indy Franchise. Why should i watch a even more worse movie or care for a director who is failing his job?

[@Seracen]

I always say this with Indy 5: they had a blueprint for what to do with him from Sean Connery's role in Indy 3. It was pure lunacy to not just take that as inspiration. Sean Connery's Dr. Jones is STILL winning at life, has something to say and teach, and is respected and fully developed, while still being able to learn something. In other words, a real character that is still sympathetic and admirable. Nope, they wanted to subsume a character to prop up another, shallower one. Hard pass...

[@Nickle_King]

Really does show the rot and ego in the industry.

[@seriously58]

So what? Will they now pout and say "In retribution, we don't give you more of these film" - well...I call that a win - win. They don't lose more money, we don't get more shit

[@Simon-xc5oy]

Yes. Which then leaves them in a pickle as they cant come up with any new ideas. So its only remakes, belated sequels and girl boss characters or prequels and reimagined versions of movies. And since all those crap films remakes and late sequels are so bad and flop so hard, and cost soooo much as the idiots making them cant seem to keep the budget under control, the whole film industry is going to be either - defunct and broke and gone in short order, OR forced to come up with new ideas and or change course...

[@thenecrophymm6591]

Replacement Fatigue, to steal their terminology. Folks are sick of seeing characters replaced by, not even lesser versions...WILDLY DIVERGENT versions. Characters are not costumes

[@andracoz]

So many people in the film industry are out of touch with the fan bases nowadays and they forget that the fans are the make or break for them. Then when it fails they double down with bs excuses.

[@Dreamfox-df6bg]

They are not out of touch with the fan bases. They are out of touch with normal humans.

[@chilidrummer8333]

It’s like they didn’t see the disaster she made of Bond in „No time to die“. There were clear signs that she’ll make a mess out of Indy too

[@WH250398]

"M, Darling!" -Actual thing said by James Bond in that awful movie.

[@ogierthedane6025]

The music alone in Raiders of the lost ark is EPIC !!!

[@marzipanmonkey]

That soundtrack would have even carried a rubbish movie it was so damn good. The fact it backed up one of the best of all time is just lightning in a bottle.

[@crokkadoodledoo9956]

Sir John Williams hit another grand slam with Raiders. All the great movie composers ie Sergio Leone > spaghetti westerns Akira Ikfube > Godzilla are genius. The musics trancends far beyond the film.

[@maxjones9112]

Tbh I’m just glad he’s calling us ageist instead of using the classic misogyny excuse. Tbh I didn’t think the film was as bad as some people called it. Ending was extremely rushed, didn’t make much sense, and didn’t really answer some questions. I didn’t hate Phoebe waller bridge’s character but I did think she was a bit sociopathic when she was all happy and upbeat after seeing a bunch of indiana jone’s friends getting murdered but the movie was entertaining I guess. That being said, this franchise was milked hard and did not need the last 2 movies.

[@troymash8109]

You're what my twenty two year old calls an NPC. This garbage is made for the mindless.

[@acutelilmint8035]

@@troymash8109well your 22 year old is a judgemental pos. Be a better parent

[@acutelilmint8035]

Ironically Waller is pretty popular with young demo.. i was shocked how many male youtubers i watch like her ( from tv).. so there is a reason why she was chosen. I dunno her, didn’t like her BUT i do understand her characters developement . Nd i didn’t’ hate the movie… i like indie I’ll always like indie.. i like adventures and puzzles not fist fights. But her punching him.. and taking him to the present for me, was a big thing for her character . Her character is really selfish.. she doesn’t’ do anything for anyone.. seeing indie say he wanted to stay.. he’s been studying this stuff all his life.. he finally gets to see it.. he has “ a role” there.. she punching him.. was the most selfless thing shes ever done. She helped indie realize, he does have a place in the present. That he too has his history and stories.. thats kinda the point i think.. she gathered everyone that was important to indie.. after he retired. That ws his last piece of his identity taken away.. but it’s only one part of him.. he failed to see the other parts. And thats where indie and Waller character is similar.. they’re very one track mind And don’t forget.. indie is always running away. She stopped him from running. I liked it.. meh. I don’t htink the franchaise is milked if the trilogy was back in the 80s. Starwars is being milked.. lord of the rings is being milked.. not indie. But i get why peopel didn’t like this movie as well. 4dx made this movie soooo fun.. props to the programmers!

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

Y’all kinda prove the point that people will just mindlessly watch anything no matter how bad. This movie was abysmal.

[@hobi1kenobi112]

People just didn't want yet another Punish The Patriarchy film. In the West we've all been saturated with that stuff for the last few years, in every walk of real life. Excuse us for not accepting it in a beloved action hero universe.

[@kathleenhensley5951]

We promise not to be fans any longer . Things coming to an end shocks no one past about 25. We all lose things and people. Friends fall away. Older family members die, We graduate grade and high school... we end our childhoods, pets die. What I don't like, and I'm a 70+ fan, was I saw the trailers and they didn't respect Indiana Jones. He was a great hero and needed a dignified last movie. He needed to be a hero, one last time before he retired. They treated him like garbage to be done with, a broken-hearted old man with very little to show for all his glorious youthful adventures. It was EVIL. I saw the trailers, listened to the commentators and walked away without ever seeing the movie.

[@awesomehpt8938]

In my mind there are no movies after the last crusade.

[@smash461986]

But there is a new game which is good.

[@Jeff-cn9up]

Fans of Indiana Jones didn't want to go see Mangold's overproduced, modern Hollywood re-interpretation of an Indiana Jones movie, you say? Surprising. How insubordinate of them. Who do they think they are?

[@Barbinheimer-ke6fl]

My grandpa was happily married with grandchildren while still being very physically active in his 80s. Has Mangold never met a single happy senior citizen? Being old doesn't mean life is trash

[@purefoldnz3070]

and it takes a video game like The Great Circle to show Mangold what a proper Indiana Jones story is like.

[@WH250398]

Man did that game leave a massive smile on my face. The confession scene was a thing of beauty lmao

[@purefoldnz3070]

@@WH250398 yes! I was thinking the same when he punched that guy out in the confession both. That's Indy!

[@neildennis7294]

James Mangold made Logan…no one had an issue with Wolverine being old or X-23 being introduced as his legacy. Pheobe Waller-Bridge just rubbed Indy’s face in all the shit that this film cruelly lumped on him like a dog begging for death.

[@death-king1834]

I'm sorry but Harrison Ford IS too old for this role now. He was too old for this even back when Crystal Skull came out. The appeal of the original Indiana Jones movies was a young daring adventurer, traveling around the world, fighting bad guys, collecting artifacts, and hooking up with beautiful women. Nobody wants to a see an out of his prime old man shafting around the place. It's the same problem I have with Arnold and almost all the Terminator films he's done after T3. Seeing a nearly 80 year old Arnold Schwarzengger running around and still trying to be a ruthless unstoppable killing machine is just beyond ridiculous at this point. And the in-universe excuses they've had to make up to justify why a killer robot who doesn't age looks so old.

[@williet.3058]

Should have made a deepfake Ford - or nothing at all

[@devlinX]

Absolutely, he was too old. He was too old in the Crystal Skull.

[@williamedwards4151]

I can't even take it seriously whenever he punches some 20-something soldier and the guy drops like a sack of potatoes. My grandpa is Harrison Ford's age. He can barely hold a cup of water without spilling half of it. That's if he remembers he's even holding it or what year it is.

[@kri249]

The worst thing about the Terminator films is that they're now self aware parodies of the IP now.

[@hosaepalvin9795]

not their point. watch again

[@ToyotaCorolla-qs7ml]

Really Annoyed that Mangold decided to blame the fans rather than the movie just being plain bad. What makes me really upset the most was him saying we couldn't accept Harrison getting old, when the best part of the film was the opening scene on the train. Ive really liked several of his films, and its really frustrating to see that.

[@WaterFaucet24]

To this day, I refuse to watch this movie. I want to remember Indy as he should be. There are only three Indy movies.

[@randolphplanck9320]

Any film creator working on a project attached to a major franchise that blames the target audience for because they failed to respect original source material is unfit to be in entertainment.

[@5persondude]

Now *that* is the definition of insanity. Keep blaming the fans

[@Callum_009]

You're Welcome Disney.

[@ephraimwinslow]

"Doesn't want to confront their hero at that age" Old =/= infirm and miserable and useless. Making that the point of a character *IN* old age just proves how much spite you have for them. (Get phoque'd, Fleabag -- not literally though. The last thing the Writer's Guild needs is another single mom.)

[@Bonesawisready926]

Yet Unforgiven is still one of the best westerns of all time. It's got nothing to do with age, it's got to do with how it's written This is also the director of Logan saying people don't want to see their heroes at an advanced age. So how does he explain Logan's success then?

[@ephraimwinslow]

@@Bonesawisready926 "I've killed everything that walks or crawls at one time or another... and I'm here to kill you, Little Bill. For what you did to Ned. ...You boys better step away." -William Munny

[@ephraimwinslow]

@@Bonesawisready926 I love discussing that film just to make the case that Little Bill is much more morally grey than people admit. lol

[@MS-sb9ov]

Someone in the studio must have questioned PWB punching old man Indie, so the answer must have been ‘nah it’ll be funny and fine’. Except it wasn’t and just shows how hypocritically messed up these people are.

[@DavidBrewer-q4m]

I never wanted to see Girl Boss movie # 476 to start with. WGAF.

[@Grobert8026]

Indy had the perfect ending in The Last Crusade. Nothing needs to follow that. It was the most logical and ideal point to hang up the hat and whip

[@scots2129]

In the diarrhea of dysentery we had a problem with the bad guys flying their planes with guns so low that they were getting skewered by harpoons.

[@smash461986]

That part was so infuriating. If they needed to go back through the vortex, why did they fly so low to the ground?

[@Al-ok6xm]

"That's your fault if our movie flopped !" Me : "Ho, thanks for the compliment."

[@jeffreyfrey1936]

To do an Indy story centered again on religious underpinnings is to acknowledge that religion is a strong and central aspect of human society. The last thing Hollywood wants to do is promote something that conflicts with their ideology.

[@marda0maranwe]

Fans making Indy 5 flop. Appreciate the kind words. I am honoured.

[@Draven_X_23]

The new chick made me miss whatsherface from Temple of Doom

[@ephraimwinslow]

It's genuinely hilarious that the woman who only got a role in one of the previous movies because she was sleeping with Spielberg at the time is a legitimately better character than *all* of the ones Fleabag wrote. (Including the character she cast herself to play, who breaks the fourth wall to directly tell everyone how gorgeous and brilliant she is.)

[@smash461986]

Willie

[@nicholasvinen]

"Am I so out of touch? No, it's the fans who are wrong."

[@AncestorEmpire1]

The Witcher and Indiana Jones: There should only be 3.

[@NotALot-xm6gz]

Add Star Wars to that list (in order of release).

[@AncestorEmpire1]

@ I was fine with 6. 1 and 2 would have been better without George hiring just yes men around him. Yes men that include Dave Fioni and Kathleen Kennedy. That woman is akin to the Snake of Abrahamic faith.

[@hiddenbutdeadly]

Witcher 4 is fine as it follows one of the most popular endings in Witcher 3 with Gerald handing Ciri his sword. What did DOD follow from?

[@AncestorEmpire1]

@ which lore breaks do you need sighted, Normie?

[@Rejoice1631]

You'll notice, hopefully, that the director of Indy 5 did not mention Feables Character? I haven't read the article, and I am curious to know if he acknowledged the fan's reactions to HER supplanting Indiana Jones? THAT was the BIGGEST reason that the fans disliked the director's view on an "old, aged" Indy Jones.

[@Axecon1]

#1 reason why it failed - PWB. And a bunch of other reasons.

[@owenarnold7611]

I completely disagree. #1 reason was Jez Butterworth, John Henry Butterworth, David Koepp and James Mangold. The MALE writers. Unless you're of the opinion that a better actress would have elevated Helena's character and that she was well written in the first place?

[@Axecon1]

@@owenarnold7611 My previous answer was a bit sarcastic and trolly. It's easy to point and blame a single person for ruining a film. Truth is, modern Hollywood is a mess. Their over-reliance on old IP which turns a cheap buck (until recently) has plagued the state of cinema to where audiences tend to lean towards the familiar instead of seeking out new and original stories. This creates a negative feedback loop in the system to where sequels & remakes dominate the landscape. But eventually people get tired of this and it fails too. Even this is a simplification of one aspect of the many problems that face modern entertainment.

[@Fishster]

Bad casting for sure but no where close to #1. Id say #1 was making Indy a pathetic old man rather than just an old man.

[@Imylover]

No one has a problem with elderly heroes. Did anyone have a problem with Alec Guinness as Obi-Wan Kenobi in ANH? Has anyone ever had a problem with Gandalf? It's when they remove the hero part from the character the problems begin & then the character can be a baby or on the death bed, doesn't matter. When a hero is not depicted as a hero, especially a hero we already know is a hero & why, that is when the fans absolutely SHOULD start complaining & criticizing. Mangold & others believe we attack the age of the character & the actor. No, we criticize a character that used to be awesome but is now presented to us in the worst humiliating & destroyed manner as humanly possible. They totally miss the very idea why the audience return to old stories that continue. We wanna catch up with old friends, see how they are doing now. When they clearly are not doing well & is even unrecognizable as the friends we once got to know, why should we bother to keep checking in? Why stick around with someone that is now a total stranger to you & is absolutely not providing the entertainment in which you spend your time & money on originally? This has nothing at all to do with age. Or sexism or racism & all that other crap. It's all about NOT giving the consumers the products that they expect, desire & even crave. And as long as they deny the consumers what they want, very much deliberately & on purpose, the consumers can & should continue to exercise their greatest power = not consuming the very bad product produced for very much the wrong reasons.

[@acutelilmint8035]

Yes and no.. personally again maybe it’s the 4dx taht made this movie so good for me lol.. but, what I saw was a man who’s entire identity was studying history.. now being taken away by the institution.. a man who was always running away ( like he says in all his movies ‘ watch me’) from stability. Lost. Just like a relic.. now that hes retired.. does that mean his passion is gone? Does he have a purpose? He is miserable.. like many who are forced out of their passion.. This annoying girl asks for his help and indie realizes.. tho the title is gone. The passion is there.. the lust for adventure is still there.. hes very very capable.. every scenario he gets them out of, not the girl.. he solves all the puzzles, hes the ones with connections etc.. so you see this cocky girl demean an. Old’ man’ but realize.. oh 💩.. dad was right about him.. she is really annoying but she does represent those who look down on others.. and realizes shes dead wrong.. and she like indie sees they both are similar - they both are running away. But ya.. i dunno.. seeing indie again, be this old depressed guy but still able to do everything.. is why he is special.. and at the point he is about to give up because as someone that studies history, he is finally able to see it with his own eyes.. this is litearlly the dream .. he can stop running and watch and see how accurate his studies were.. but , Waller after going through the adventure with indie, does the most selfless thing for the first time.. she does knock him out because she knows he doesn’t belong in the past.. she could have left him there.. but hearing all the people who loved indie including her dad.. she knew how to make up to him. Yes on the surface it’s liek wtf.. but if you really think about the characters.. it’s that lesson of its ok to close one chapter and start a new adventure..and indie himself his character hides his feelings, it’s up to Waller to gather all those who love indie together.. thast his stubbornness.. and him taking his hat is always that hint that.. you can’t take that side of indie out.. Would a reunion feel good movie be more fun? HELL ya, i wanted to see a comedy flick with him and short round… or if not short round his son or daughter who litearlly is a super fan of indie.. but what it was was a bitter girl boss being proven wrong.. that’s kinda what i did like.. and her growing admiration for indie

[@koragg4193]

It's not the director/writers/film studio's fault for making a dogshit movie. It's the fans' fault for not paying for that dogshit. Talking about being out of touch ...

[@DJWHITE_]

I don’t have an issue with it. After Luke Skywalker, I didn’t want to watch it and I don’t think I will put myself through that, thank you!

[@JakeCampbell61382]

Whenever I see the audience being blamed for a product flopping I can’t help but think that there is truth in that statement, but that truth is just that the audience decided not to give you their money… to imply that that is a bad thing is to imply that your obligated to give them money… take this attitude and apply it to sex and see if it holds up… they literally want to rape your bank account and when you say know they cry victim

[@Gillymonster18]

So apparently the director has no responsibility for making a crap movie no one wants to see? Fans are under obligation to shovel money into entertainment we don’t like? THIS DELUSION IS WHY HOLLYWOOD IS FAILING.

[@rkitchen69]

I really didn't like how they killed Mutt off screen in the Vietnam war.

[@acutelilmint8035]

What’s interesting tho is when mutt appeared everyone hated him.. but now he was killed people care about him lool 😂 .

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

⁠@@acutelilmint8035 are people not allowed to draw lines? Also, hatred is another form of caring. You sound brain dead with this take. 😂

[@smash461986]

​@@acutelilmint8035 I think it's more that it makes Kingdom of Crystal Skull even more a waste of time than it was when it first aired. No Marion, no son, just miserable, drunk indy.

[@Rob_Kankerboef]

The thing i genuinely hate most about dial of destiny is that a lot of people seem to think its better then Crystal Skull, Crystal Skull is a master piece in comparison. One of the things people hated most about crystal skull was the overuse of CGI, which was much worse in dial of destiny, and the CGI wasn't even any better then that of crystal skull.

[@TheRoflcer]

At this point I'm not sure half of Hollywood even knows how to Spell accountability.

[@rider275]

The director's comments would be the same as McDonald's blaming the failure of the Arch Deluxe on their customers. The fact is that Hollywood is going back to previous franchises to see if they can squeeze more money out of the intellectual property that they own instead of coming up with original ideas.

[@nickjohnson410]

Remember back in the day when you failed at something people would laugh at you and hold you accountable for your failure? Pepperidge Farm Remembers.

[@skill14]

James Mangold (who i think is great director) responded to my tweet years ago denying mutliple things about Indy 5 that all ended up being true. This guy vanity searched his name during reshoots and was so thin skinned he had to respond to me and essentially called John Williams a liar 😂

[@Gaius2k]

The problem with the New Indiana Jones is the same problem with Star Wars: LucasFilm, in their delusional narcissism, does not want to bring pre-rendered stories to the Big Screen, because they think they can do better - besides how dare they show a strong male lead without a woman putting him in his place. But, just like Star Wars with Legends, Indiana Jones 5 could easily have drawn upon the expanded lore. Imagine if they adapted Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine, or the Fate of Atlantis! But no, let's have the creatively bankrupt activists at LucasFilm raze another iconic IP.

[@__-xv3pr]

Fate of Atlantis was fantastic and would've made a great movie back in the mid-to-late 90s.

[@mykal.7424]

There's many issues of Dial ... Phoebe Waller Bridge, Script issues, James Mangold is a good direct , but he's no Spielberg ...Harrison Ford gave a very good performance which is sad, because the movie itself didn't do him justice. Plus being under the Disney umbrella doesn't help either. Phoebe Waller Bridge isn't a bad actress her character is written so annoyingly , but it's ironic she's one of the main reasons that Dial failed and she's also hugely responsible for ruining James Bond's last outing as a screenplay writer .