Dune - Invoke the Amtal

Invoke the Amtal

[@Gabronthe]

"Jamis, come on, you're being a prick."

[@Gabronthe]

"Wow Jamis, your dead and your wife belongs to a kid, bet you feel really brave now."

[@wikipediaintellectual7088]

That was me in the theater.

[@ieat10kittens94]

"Jamis, we are running for our fucking lives now you dont have to do this"

[@RockSmithStudio]

I love that in the visions, everything is beautiful and warm, and Jamis's voice is kind, soothing, and welcoming. He looks at Paul as a child. In reality though, the scene has a cold tone and Jamis's voice is extremely hostile and when he looks at Paul, he stares at him like prey. Love the contrast

[@hannahgallagher2676]

If I remember correctly, his visions show many possible paths that the future could take. The futures with Jamis alive are ones where he was a friend to Paul and taught him all about living in the desert.

[@fabriziopelli4577]

I actually don’t see much of a contrast in terms of concept. I’ll explain better: if I remember well, in the vision Jamie tells Paul that he will teach him the ways of the desert. So, in a way, he did: he showed him how the Fremen behave, what’s their culture, and most of all how to kill a man.

[@RockSmithStudio]

@@fabriziopelli4577 I completely agree. I'm just pointing the contrast in the cinematography. A huge part of Dune, like you point out, is how prophecy is fulfilled but not in the way that it's expected

[@J.H.Lee_]

Was it hostility?? My interpretation was that he wanted a rematch with Paul since he bested him when they all got into the first fight. I thought he was even smiling around 0:56 Just my interpret of course. Everything else I agree.

[@MFM230]

Stilgar has a fantastic voice; I love his lines.

[@Desmaad]

That's Javier Bardem for ya!

[@ravensthatflywiththenightm7319]

How brave of Jamis, picking a fight with a child.

[@VideoMask93]

To be fair, a child who had humiliated him in front of everyone. In his mind, he wanted to prove that had been a fluke.

[@nocturnalrecluse1216]

That child kicked his ass.

[@BW022]

In the books, Paul is 15 during this. However, Timothée Hal Chalame was 25 at the time of filming. Maybe youngish looking, but no one watching this thinks this is a child. Further, in most of history, a 15 year-old male can easily be close to physical maturity and except in recent times would be off to war, heavy labor, etc. Treating old teens as children is a fairly recent notion.

[@phj223]

Jamis should have read the script and realized he was a (very distant) supporting character.

[@JnEricsonx]

Even worse, because Stilgar makes it clear that if Jamis wins, Stilgar will kill him. Kindof a lose-lose.

[@einsUNDcolt]

The tragedy of this is that in a potential future, Jamis and Paul were good friends. Jamis would teach Paul more about the Freman. At least in this movie's continuity

[@christianealshut1123]

There is also a funeral for Jamis in the book - I don't know right now whether it's included in this movie - where they all have to speak good things about the deceased and proclaim themselves to be his friends, and Paul does so also, as Jamis has taught him that you pay for it if you kill someone.

[@ridemx323]

You fight when the necessity arises.

[@insight917]

No matter the mood.

[@aleisterseverusgrey3778]

"I was a friend of Jamis," Paul whispered.

[@GrayCatbird1]

I thought the whole introduction of these Fremen was very effective, and show how no-nonsense and stern they are. Contrast it with how Paul saw them as friends in his visions. Culminate with how someone who was a friend in his visions is suspicious of him and is ready to kill him.

[@double-og4570]

Javier is exactly would I thought Stilgar would look and sound like.

[@NewGoldStandard]

Underrated line? "The night is fading."

[@teamvlcn6820]

"Then the sun will witness this death." That is a badass response.

[@ronaldh6466]

Stilgar realized how powerful Jessica was and why he was overpowered by her. Jamis was ignorant to that fact. Stilgar tried to talk him out of it.

[@impersonal6650]

I love how Jessica was instantly ready to fight.

[@thestarhopper]

"I have spoken."

[@joesephjoestar4449]

I love this guys voice

[@_Cato_]

Which one? Both Jamis and Stilgar have awesome voices

[@joesephjoestar4449]

@@_Cato_ no doubt both voices are really cool but jamis has a unnique voice i really like

[@MFM230]

And I had just written that I like Stilgar's.

[@NtoTheM]

Good strategy by this Jamy boy here. That woman beat your leader, who is chosen through being the toughest of y'all. Challenging said woman really is a master chessmove, I gotta say.

[@NiceTryLaoChe]

He thinks he can kill her son, the water-fat offworlder, thus getting her expelled from the tribe (thereby killing her.) It's honestly not the worst play, and it would have worked against 99 out of 100 water-fat offworlders.

[@NtoTheM]

@@NiceTryLaoChe In the worst case scenario she gets the others to let her fight him. And judging how he A.) as a Fremen gets schooled by a teenager with no actual battle experience and B.) said woman he means to scheme against is essentially a breathing bio-weapon it's still kinda an odd choice to ego-trip at this moment.

[@haychlc]

Jamy boy ? Whatchu mean by that🤨

[@tenjenk]

@@NtoTheM Given time, he would have realized and seen reason. But Stilgar always chided him for being too hasty. Its a shame he never got to be Paul's closest friend and mentor, a father in place of his lost father.

[@GrayCatbird1]

I got the impression he acted in part out of principle. He didn't accept the situation, so he had to act accordingly, following the rules laid out. Kind of like "either I get my way or I die".

[@andregordon2599]

After my 4th rewatch of the movie, I went to my local bookshop and got a trade paper back of Dune, and randomly opened the book about 50% of the way in.....It was literally this fight. Dennis wasn't kidding, he literally stopped half way lol

[@hexagon2185]

why do you think its called 'part one'

[@blitzme99]

Jamis is actually an important character since Paul has quantum conciseness I think Denni will have him speak with jamis a few more times

[@BigMikeMcBastard]

Denis.

[@EvilTurtle97]

Probably won't, Jamis had one purpose for Paul; teaching him the ways of the desert. The fight and following death was the lesson.

[@ojakoo288]

You've got your terms mixed up, Paul is 'prescient'. Quantum consciousness is a theory that seeks to explain consciousness with quantum-mechanics and has nothing to do with foresight.

[@blitzme99]

@@ojakoo288 I don't mean foresight. Jamis is dead. Paul can not only speak to Jamis in the past, but he can also speak to Jamis in realities that never even occurred where they were life long friends.

[@ojakoo288]

@@blitzme99 Paul with his prescient abilities can foresee all the possible paths laid out for him. Though, some can be hid by another prescient being, as we can see in Dune Messiah. Paul's prescience, again, has nothing to do with the theory that is quantum consciousness.

[@cchavezjr7]

I was kind of disappointed at having Jamis being all about protesting the mother being taken in. In the book he was embarrassed because Paul took him out so easily when he ran away. He wanted Paul from the beginning.

[@WorgenGrrl]

Do you wrestle with dreams? Do you contend with shadows? Do you move in a kind of sleep? Time has slipped away. Your life is stolen You tarried with trifles. Victim of your folly.

[@Hittingman]

I wish they hadn’t included “the sun will witness this death.” Kinda precludes the fact that the duel is to the death but somehow Paul missed it.

[@jenkhemhuffersanonymous3990]

Bruh 🤣😅

[@spandanganguli6903]

Paul thought that killing was an option, not a necessity.

[@Hittingman]

@@spandanganguli6903 I’m not sure that is true. His prescience had shown Jamis as a teacher, and his death at the hands of Jamis. Paul should have known given that. Big old plot hole that they pointed a big stick at with that line.

[@InsertTheCoin1997]

maybe Paul thought Jamis was just being a drama queen and all

[@queengoblin]

@@Hittingman it's really not that big of a deal, and anyways if you were in that situation, you'd likely be in some kind of denial. in the book, paul was hesitant to kill jamis not because he "didn't know", but because he'd never done it before and it scared him. he knew in the book someone was going to die, him or jamis.

[@lazyjam6542]

0:36 I love Jamis’ line here not sure why

[@cg6977]

it's a badass line

[@victoreem2]

Jamies need a Snickers

[@GhostEye31]

Was that Stilgar leaning forward as if to step up before Paul did? I remember in the book Stilgar did try to make Jamis angry enough at him to fight him instead.

[@Drazakhan_Dynasty]

My favourite scene in the novel. So much subtext. A couple things not included was that part, Jamis sees through Stilgar's ploy. Aditionally, Jessica puts a little Voice on, and Jamis holds his ears and invokes some more Amtal rules that forbid the interference of witchcraft, So Stilgar has to demand she be quiet. Also, my favourite part, when Paul wins and he receives a lot of praise and compliments from the men, and he feels a boy-like pride in himself despite his prescience, Jessica immediately decides he needs a Bene Gesserit teaching in humility so that he does not become addicted to killing (trying to stave off the dictator she fears he could become). She bursts in and uses a bit of Voice to say 'so how does it feel to be a killer?' It sows a seed of shame within him and he withdraws a bit. It kind of brings him back to the moment, and he very seriously observes the Fremen burial rites, later shedding tears for Jamis as he realises that Jamis was not an enemy but a teacher, and also that the duel was the first step on the path and that there was no turning back now. All alternatives were now closed to him, only the Jihad or death remained. Not knowing his thoughts, the Fremen see him only crying (giving water) for the dead, which is considered sacred to them, but also somewhat of a sacrilege that they don't themselves give in to. Only serving the myth making around him even more.

[@JnEricsonx]

In the original movie, Stilgar tells Jamis that as he has given his protection to Paul and Jessica, that if Jamis kills Paul, Stilgar will take him apart.

[@brentrebrab]

Nobody: The sun: WITNESSS HIMMMMMMM

[@nachoolo]

Just two good friends having some fun with knives.

[@florianschramm1983maydayyear]

To Show the World the church and who I am long an Illumination for me and all with me ,an long life and an end of tortures

[@quitequiet5281]

Testing to destruction does not always result in expectations.

[@Dunbarick]

On tonite's episode of "When fu*king with the new guy goes wrong"

[@electricangel4488]

well he doesnt know paul is human computer esper and martial arts master

[@jordanrivera8174]

Paul is a mentat ?

[@electricangel4488]

@@jordanrivera8174 pretty sure he is in the books

[@jordanrivera8174]

@@electricangel4488 or it’s because he’s the one so it makes him more than a mentat?

[@yakplateado1923]

@@jordanrivera8174 Paul is being trained to be a Mentat yes, in the book he reaches an age in which the Duke reveals to him that he’s being trained to become one but it’s his choice if he wants to continue. He’s algo being trained as a Bene Gesserit by Jessica apart from all the combat training he get’s from Gurney and Duncan. Kid’s prepared af but still this is his first kill and actual fight out of training.

[@patmcbride9853]

All serve, even those that serve as bad examples.

[@DC05570]

🔪🩸🎶Pump up the Jamis, pump it up While your feet are stompin' And the Jamis pumpin' Look ahead, the crowd is jumpin' Pump it up a little more Get the party going on the dance floor See, 'cause that's where the party's at And you'll find out if you do that🎶🔪🩸

[@qididah1405]

inpaindaily

[@NielsMulvad]

I still think that if Paul hadn't given in and let the glider drop when he did, they would have glided further and the crash would have resulted in jessica's death. Which would have resulted in Jamis not invoking amtal. It's just a theory but it works for me.

[@kevinrudd1]

LMAO if Jessica died the entire story wouldn't work, Paul would not have bested Stilgar, no water of life, no joining the fremen, no aliya, nothing

[@notavailable8232]

wow its jace beleren

[@thinkinyblinko6666]

Jessica is the main character of the first 3 books dude. Without her the plot doesn't work.

[@RizenST]

My theory is that the moment that sealed Jamis' death was when Paul successfully used the voice on the Harkonnens that were flying him and Jessica to drop them off into the desert. If he had failed, he would have been thrown out and Jessica would have been raped and left to die, either way they would be separated. Then, Jamis would have found taken Paul in The scenes with Jamis always felt sombre, the scene where he took Paul in seemed like he was being gentle with him, like he would act if his mother had died. And from what I remember, none of the prediction scenes with Jamis had Jessica in them, including the one where the Fremen were back on Paul's homeland.

[@RizenST]

@@thinkinyblinko6666 Yeah, only because she survived. If she had died and Jamis would have survived, you would have said the same thing about Jamis. The story would have been much different sure, but there are multiple paths towards the Jihad.

[@abdoudescend887]

Amtal

[@drunkweebmarine9492]

Dune gets Harah who later marries Stilgar. I love Dune so much. The next dog I am getting will be called Stilgar!

[@jdfigs5916]

Are you going to upload the clip where they meet the fremen

[@Dune-xo8tn]

which

[@Joshua0810]

@@Dune-xo8tn I think he means the scene after Paul and Jessica escaped the sandworm and Jessica has that quick little fight with Stilgar.

[@decespugliatorenucleare3780]

@@Dune-xo8tn yo upload what we really want but nobody uploaded yet: Rebecca Ferguson's porn movie

[@VictorIV0310]

@@decespugliatorenucleare3780 Temple OS

[@thlee3]

chamalaya ding dong

[@223308887mrfly]

Where is her champion?? *2 seconds later* I accept her champion 🤝

[@_ace786]

Jamis stated stilgar was no leader cause he got disarmed but didn't he get disarmed too

[@amramjose]

In the book, Jamis wants revenge for having been bested by Paul.

[@veetour]

Learn from this. Don’t be a Jamis.

[@bursegsardaukar]

Do they fight with their stillsuits on in the novel?

[@mcsniper180]

If I remember correctly no. No reason damaging the stillsuits.

[@mrmofo36]

but they also did it after they'd taken shelter in one of their cave/hideouts

[@cg6977]

Nop, they undressed first and fought without their suits - if I'm not mistaken, it was part of the process

[@alanmartin6436]

Jamis was a friend of mine

[@evita9284]

Jamis is right when he said the sun will witness his death. In the novels, the sun around dune is a sentient eye that is part of a galaxy where its stars are like atoms, making up a galactic body that moves. It is the same as how our atoms are actually star systems with civilizations - the nucleus is the star and the electrons are the planets.

[@AlexHalt100]

he said "this" death, not his.

[@lycanthropeify]

Anyone know why he wasn’t allowed to challenge the mom?

[@funnyall311]

She is sacred in their religion.

[@cchavezjr7]

It's made up for the movie. The book he was mad at Paul for knocking him down when they tried to escape.

[@TheTruthIsGonnaHurt]

*It's something to be said of Paul's visions.. and how wrong he actually is..* When he sees Chani, its always slightly erotic and seductive. Typical of a virgin. When he sees Jamis, its always friendly, as if they are going to be best pals. Typical of a child. Finally when he sees them both in reality, he quickly realizes how foolish he has been.

[@athenastewart9167]

As I understand it, the future is not yet written. He sees possible futures, depending on future choices of the people he sees, added to his own choices. He has been a rather sheltered young man; his interpretation of the visions is still imperfect.

[@stoveguy2133]

They ain’t fremen. Easy to kill. Whoops

[@James-dc3yt]

Paul is not a hero....

[@hannahgallagher2676]

He was never meant to be one. He may be the protagonist, but I don’t think Frank Herbert ever meant him to be a hero.

[@davidwuhrer6704]

"Beware of charismatic leaders." "Hero" does not mean "good guy". A hero is someone who gets other people killed. Paul is a hero, in all the worst ways.

[@namratakshemakalyani9165]

They should have cast someone for Chani else instead of Zendaya. Sorry but she just doesn't fit the mature/adult vibe of Dune. The casting director was so unserious. Smh.

[@davidwuhrer6704]

She is supposed to be a teenager.

[@Brandon-tk2rw]

black actor: should we at least consider what it would look like if I won? bc my shooting schedule is pretty open ....

[@haychlc]

this feels offensive and yet I’m laughing 😭😭😭😭😭😭

[@JnEricsonx]

Stilgar would then kill him.

[@armands3863]

Like all blk people, he should have thought before talking too loud.

[@Dynomafia139]

I hope you find yourself in a better state of mind in the future

[@jatd104]

This whole scene made no sense.

[@cg6977]

Care to elaborate?

[@leoniousmumblescraper1311]

A beautiful movie from a visual standpoint, but it deviated too much from the book for me to enjoy it. I actually like the Sci Fy channel Dune mini series much better. The 1984 Dune movie is something I wish I could forget. Some books may just be too complex for film or television.

[@Drazakhan_Dynasty]

Ne this movie needed to happen for me, it got the aesthetics of Dune so right. Sy Fy mini series is far too camp and cringe for me.

[@rwgosse]

@@Drazakhan_Dynasty I try to combine all versions somehow in my head. Different views of the same history makes a bigger picture. Plus, the Lynch version is quite 'trippy' and it got me laid. Hard not to like.

[@ezkimus6104]

The movie is a prime example of show not tell. Movie is a visual medium you don´t need that much of exposition. And I have to say I like the Lynch film for the visuals but the story and pacing are a utter mess...

[@xyaeiounn]

It's the fact that Dune IS too complex and nuanced for the screen that this version is my favourite. It clearly has the love and respect for the source material, without slavishly trying to bring it all to the viewer. It feels to me like one of the cases where the cinema is better than the book.

[@queengoblin]

@@xyaeiounn I agree, this is a different medium and an art form all on its own. The dogma of "book purity" is just silly fan pathosis rooted in an unwillingness to let oneself experience pleasure out of fear of disappointment.

[@engasal]

The two worst players in this film were the dude who played Jamis and the woman who played Kynes. Both very irritating

[@galwitprifor001]

They played their parts well enough.

[@wikipediaintellectual7088]

I was only irritated by Jamis and that's because he's supposed to be irritating. He got what he deserved in Defenders too.

[@schelle8]

Hmm... wonder why exactly those two

[@Jacob-sb3su]

@@schelle8 so many low key racists in the dune fandom lmao

[@haychlc]

what was wrong with kynes?