How Dutch vs Americans think of PERSONAL SPACE | Dutch culture vs. American culture

[@Dutch1961]

The touching when apologizing actually serves a purpose. The person literally 'connects' with you to show the apology is meant for you and they mean you no harm.

[@jerrymiller9039]

Many women view it as harm when random men start touching them without consent

[@Dutch1961]

@@jerrymiller9039 I know. My comment was just explanatory.

[@H1SCOTTY]

I’m a guy and wouldn’t appreciate being touched by a stranger. All the hugging these days isn’t how I’m brought up, nothing homophonic or something like that, just that I’m not that touchy even with friends.

[@CorporateG0th]

@@jerrymiller9039 different context, it's just a regular part of communication in this culture.

[@leenprael3583]

@@jerrymiller9039 snowflake

[@MartijnHover]

If we left as much personal space as they do in the US, some of us would have to stand in Belgium or Germany... 🙂

[@elenaaristova1003]

:)

[@atjantis5555]

:)

[@AmsterdamKayakGuy]

:)

[@Lilygirl283]

😂🤣😂

[@situationsixtynine8743]

Hilarisch 🤣

[@War4Skills]

About the apple thing: most Dutch people would only do it if you really are taking too long and often they will try to grab their items while saying sorry or excuse me. I think it is funny, because to me it is rude if you take a whole damn minute in front of the food someone else just wants to grab, pretty much the reverse of what Americans apparently think.

[@ericlarousse1149]

I'm American and I agree with you. These generalizations are overly broad. Even some of the American cliches, like ending your declarative sentence with a questioning tone, are not the majority.

[@StayTh1rsty]

I'm coming here trying to find actual people talking about Dutch culture, and what I got would have been more kindly, and appropriately, labeled "Traumatized American unpacks how dehumanizing and isolated American culture can be from an anxious perspective" and I'm not judging, just... moving on, now 😅

[@arthurhagen3826]

In The Netherlands it is considered rude to take up too much space for too long a time. So in your Apple exemple, you would be the rude person. The person 'creeping in' is just being polite 😁

[@DutchAmericano]

😂😅

[@gert-janvanderlee5307]

This is true. You're not the only person there. So either buy something or move out of the way.

[@henkwilts7533]

But the other person could ask.

[@arthurhagen3826]

@@henkwilts7533 we could, but the reaction is usualy not friendly. People rude enough to claim much space and time in The Netherlands usualy are not polite responders. I have had this experience several times.

[@gert-janvanderlee5307]

@@henkwilts7533 "De bus stopt hier niet." That's sometimes my line if I'm waiting too long.

[@EdZ3rD]

The situation about the apple shopping, i can actually understand quite well why it's seen as lack of personal space and thus can be rude, but i don't think it's rude exactly. We generally just like to be efficient to avoid wasting time and space (which also relates to the being in lines at escalators and traffic lights), so if somebody is taking their time standing right in front of something we need, we just slowly move over and grab what we need and move on. Sometimes we will be more polite and say something like "Sorry, mag ik er even bij/langs?" and proceed to grab whatever we need and move on. Now that i think of it actually.. I think this isn't being rude in the dutch perspective, i think the dutch in general actually deem it more rude instead if somebody is lingering somewhere in the way of where others need to be. Example; If you're unsure about what kind of cheese to get, it'd be more so considered polite to just take a step back and figure it out so others who do know what to get can freely grab it without anyone standing in the way and move on. So just standing right in front of stuff but not grabbing anything, being in the way of people who do want to grab something, that's more so considered to be rude. I mean, i can't say this is a fact ofcourse, but this is from my own experience and what i've seen around me. ^^

[@jacobdeboer1074]

Exactly this!

[@honema123456789]

my gut reaction was also "no it's rude that you don't watch for others and move aside when they need something!", but ofcourse that's exactly the cultural difference she was talking about. But yeah we see shopping isles as walkways, and if you want to stand still in a place meant for movement, you're the one with the responsibility to give others the right of way. At least that's what it feels like to me

[@lightblue_12]

Exactly! It feels rude to stand in someone's way like that. If I would be standing in front of the apples and someone creeps in infront of me. I would be the one apologising..

[@linndalief]

Exactly this! I would be a little annoyed if someone would ask me to make space but I don’t mind at all if they just grab what they need. That we we all have what we want and nobody has to interrupt eachother

[@robinsommer]

I agree and I admit that I do "sneak", if that means silently and swiftly getting what I need and not interrupting someones pondering. I will say the equivalent of "Excuse me, can I grab something for a moment, I can't reach it." if there's simply no possibility to get it myself. I do see it as rude to claim space in front of something where you know others want to get to. And as soon as you realize someone else also wants to get the same thing, you step aside and apologize. I've also found myself daydreaming in front of some food options but feeling guilty when snapping out of it, I apologized, not knowing how long I was there :P

[@davidvandenbroeck5068]

I am an American and am used to having extra space. My wife who is from China grew up with less space. When I first went to China with her to meet family, I had to adjust quickly to not having as much personal space and having complete strangers right against me at times. Each trip back, I noticed it less and less. It was a quick adjustment to be honest. You just have to understand it and adapt. When we visited Netherlands in 2019, I barely noticed the lack of space. And it is not stopping me from wanting to move there in a few years. Love the videos Ava!

[@juloedtb1420]

The Netherlands is too small to have the same personal space like you were used to in America. As far as hanging out your window to see what's going on with your neighbors is quite normal and very social. My experience in america was that people are sneaky peaking behind their curtains. When you catch them watching you, they quickly close the curtains and think they didn't get caught. I personally think the Dutch way is more honest.

[@adpop750]

The apple thing, I'd say to Dutch people you are the one being rude/inconsiderate, because you are the one blocking access to the apples and not paying attention to people around you. In fact if you sneak up to indecisive people blocking you from things you want, the moment they notice you they step away and often even apologize for blocking you.

[@mikepictor]

Yes, but then you’d say “excuse me, can you move over a bit?”

[@klaasvanbeek5985]

Yeah, people take way to much time looking at apples! Just grab them!

[@H1SCOTTY]

@@klaasvanbeek5985 what? I’m paying for them I’m Dutch so I’m selecting my apples carefully. 🤣🍎

[@papamaanbeerVideo]

when im spacing out if to buy appels i be sure to take a step back from the appels so other people can still acces them, while im takeing my time to make a decision

[@TakanashiYuuji]

9:40 the crowding at the traffic light is more about keeping the bike path clear. Traffic lights for bikes are usually only present when crossing car lanes and bike paths also typically run alongside car lanes so at intersections there isn't a lot of space to queue up.

[@RFGfotografie]

Curtains (or rolflexen or whatnot) we Dutch do have, almost all of us. But we freaking LOVE light as our homes and the Netherlands can be quite dark. So, we don;t mind people being able to look inside. Certainly because we all have some sort of code of conduct where we just, accept privacy. So we don't look inside other people's houses unless it's really needed. Some people do, but we've got nothing to hide so, why hide. Though a lot of us do love our privacy. it's WAY less extreme as in America.

[@H1SCOTTY]

I’m looking in, at the television program I know what time it is. 😅 And my (and lots of neighbors) curtains are “in betweens” your looking straight trough them. While developing my house I’ve even increased the size of the windows, sunlight is key for your mood and your day night rhythm.

[@ConradvanderMeer]

I defenatly love my privacy but I also like to be 'in touch' with the outside world. I hate to be in a room with the curtains closed and feeling disconnected with the world outside that room, really like to get the light in, see the rain fall down or see the trees waving in the wind. So therefore I prefer to give up some privacy by keeping the curtains open.

[@marleenb2979]

yeah. natural lighting is just a neccesity, much healthier and more comfortable than artificial lights. so we make use of natural light as long as possible by keeping the curtains open. plus if you have a small room, you need to keep the curtains open as much as possible to make it feel livable. strangers on the streets are just supposed to not mentally invade our home by staring through the windows. thats one of the reasons i dont want to live on a main floor or directly at a road. i want privacy and light.

[@pierrerutten]

I'm a dutch man living abroad (Curaçao) and I've learned a lot of my own life in the Netherlands through your eyes thanks to your videos.

[@pierrerutten]

@A_peary_legal I'm not living in Venezuela but on a Dutch island! It's of the coast of Venezuela

[@hchouwaard]

The supermarket thing is just about efficience above personal space. If you are unsure, don't block others access to apples, step back a bit. Once you are sure what you want, grab your apple and move on. It's maybe expected to be more aware of others, even when doing your own stuff by yourself.

[@MrAronymous]

Americans: don't touch me!! my personal space!! Also Americans: hug everyone

[@DutchAmericano]

So true!

[@HigherQualityUploads]

I think it's mostly that Americans don't like _unexpected_ touching. If someone touches them from out of nowhere then they'll go into defense mode. If they see it coming they're much more accepting of it.

[@silentwilly2983]

Funny you mention curtains, I remember long time ago when my parents came back from Canada they found it strange that 'nobody' had curtains over there and if they had curtains it were Dutch migrants. With respect to personal space, if you think the Dutch lack personal space, go to Asia, things are at a whole different level there. Specially in India.

[@rohansarpate9546]

Not just India there are many..... China, Japan, Vietnam, Thailand.... List goes on.

[@henkwilts7533]

It is not actually the norm here. It depends on the person and perhaps also the region. Touching a shoulder is most of the time not seen as very invasive, but there has to be a reason. Standing close to each other in an elevator depends on the available space and how well you know each other. In case of the 'apple' situation it is considered polite to ask instead of pushing yourself forward.

[@Dutchbelg3]

Hey Ava, The touching thing that happened to you is actually a nice thing... If some one is doing something clumsy and smashes into you or fall on top of you or do something discomforting to you they will apologize and touch you a short while (shoulder or arm) and this is meant as a kinda hug-it-out kinda thing. To show no bad intention. It also happens if you are in a very enthusiastic conversation with some one. Arms will be touched... it is a spontaneous gesture to acknowledge a connection. It's funny you mention the talking distance.. it might be because we Dutchies talk in stead of broadcasting our opinion or point of view :-p When I am around American colleagues I notice they talk like the whole room should hear what they are telling... We like to keep intimate : conversation for just 2 persons.. :-)

[@hansc8433]

I think touching someone‘s shoulder or arm when you bump into someone, or interrupt them in a conversation, or when you want to show your empathy in general is a very common thing to do. I think I would hesitate to touch complete strangers, but certainly for friends, co-workers, family, it‘s a very natural thing to do. If you go to France, or Italy, you‘ll find that it‘s even more common. I can imagine that in a „new“ culture like the US, with people from different cultural backgrounds and nationalities, the common denominator for personal space will be a bit more conservative than in a slightly more heterogenous society. Wrt queue crashing: those are just annoying people. Just go ahead and scold them :)

[@Gnomelotte]

Am Dutch, born and raised Dutch, but a lot of things described in this video makes me feel like I'm secretly American.

[@WendyLopezGazquez]

Most of the time I really like your content as a Dutch person but this one is really over the top for me. Me as a Dutch person who is been in America, I really experienced American people as very fake and cold people. And the fact that you told that you cried in public in your home country and no one cared at all, didn't suprise me. The lack of real genuine and friendly contact made me miss my home country the most when I was in America.

[@mariskarademakers3236]

Don' t make me laugh ! Americans cold and fake ??? You met the wrong people.....Americans are great !

[@trueg66]

Pretty funny that an American complains about a lack of personal space, the biggest invasion of my personal space is sitting in a restaurant and then literally being able to follow the conversation of an American party 4 tables away because they talk so loudly :)

[@jerrymiller9039]

You missed the point. She is talking about different cultural norms and yes that goes both ways

[@erikthehalfabee6234]

That's a bit of a generalisation, are Americans that much louder than other nationalities?

[@trueg66]

@@erikthehalfabee6234 ...yes they are.

[@LaLa-ck9zp]

@@erikthehalfabee6234 As an American, yes - most Americans are incredibly loud as their default setting.

[@SuDaixi]

Chiming in from New York City. It's somewhat hard to explain but I will try. It's kinda rude to mumble and/or whisper here. You will have at least one class on presentation, public speaking, projecting your voice and proper diction. Shy kids who don't often speak up will be forced to speak more often and would often get corrected until they can speak loud and clear. New York's City Colleges actually have a requirement for graduation that is passing public speaking or having it waived by participating in classes and/or activities that show proficiency. Depending on a school it might be part of English curriculum but some schools even have whole electives for it. It's considered very important to pronounce things loudly and clearly because there is such variety of languages, accents and dialects around. If you see someone whispering or talking quietly in public spaces, there will be at least a few noisy people side-eyeing them. In general private conversations are had in private and not public spaces, so in public spaces anything you want to say should be ok to be overheard. It's the height of rudeness to have a private conversation in public. If you don't want to be overheard on certain topics - don't speak about it in a public place. It's basically an unwritten unspoken rule that anything you say in public spaces: you are ok discussing with strangers. You set your own rules and lines at where your comfort lies with what you are willing to discuss with strangers. There is so many cultures around that it is simply impossible to remember what is and isn't rude to discuss with everyone, so you gauge by what they themselves are willing to say. And if you are having a private conversation in public someone WILL chime in and offer their opinion. It will just happen. So why would you have a private conversation in public? You wouldn't. Having a private conversation and then getting angry when a stranger chimes in is very rude. You knew that you were in public and that people will speak up so you are setting some unwitting stranger up to being yelled at by you. Abd so from the way you are taught in school, to general etiquette on where it is appropriate to talk about certain things, EVERYTHING just screams at you to be "LOUD AND CLEAR", "be confident", "speak up" when you are talking and there are never any caveats and limitations on that besides places of study or certain workspaces having to be quiet (libraries, labs, and so on). And since everything you say in public you should be ok discussing with just any random stranger, there is usually no reason to speak quietly at all. It's considered ok to just join in conversations between strangers that you were not a part of and most people get taught to speak loud and clear in classes and get reprimanded if they don't project their voice, it becomes suspicious when there is like somebody on the side talking quietly to each other. In a place where any conversation in public is free game for anyone to join, it is just suspicious to have a private quiet chat. They are likely either talking sexy in public or talking shit about someone. Maybe planning a murder (joking, mostly). Plus since our personal bubbles are so big we have to speak louder anyway to hear each other. Plus everyone is talking loudly so you also have to account for that. And then it just becomes habit to really project your voice that you do not notice doing it. It gets so ingrained that I imagine that is why we seem louder when we go to anywhere else, where it is ok to mumble and whisper and talk quietly enough where only a person standing very close to you will hear you. P.S. The amount of times I heard teachers in school tell someone to "project your voice", "speak up", "louder please", "speak more confidently please" is rather large. I heard something like this being said to someone in all subjects and from every teacher at least once. They pound that "loud an clear" into you until your head rings.

[@peterdelaat]

About the apple and the traffic light situation. The store and road are not considered your space. If you block people you are the one who is considered annoying. About the touching: People in the Netherlands have different norms about that. I was taught in school 'don't touch others'. That's pretty common. It annoyed my mom a lot. In her view people who don't touch stay islands. She taught me that you can touch someone's shoulder after eye contact for a few seconds when you want to connect with them. If you ask someone 'are you okay' with or without a shoulder touch - that's is an enormous difference in how you connect. And she insisted to do that too with someone bullying me. Best response in her view was to walk up to him, touch his shoulder, look him in the eyes and say 'leave me alone'. I wish more people would try to connect with one another in a positive way. Touching in such a way can help with that.

[@remcohoman1011]

3:19 comforting hand on shoulder, nothing more.Indeed being nice, and assuring you it doesn't matter you bumped in to them

[@bastiaan4129]

On the apple thing, the person who's taking too long to pick an apple should still be aware of his/her surroundings and move aside if they see someone who already made their choice in apples. If not i'll just grab the apples I need no matter how much you are in the way. On escalators I'll only stand on the right if there are no stairs. If there are stairs you should take those when you're in a hurry and not inconvenience the people on the escalator.

[@MrAronymous]

This goes with the cultural norm of not modesty by imposing yourself on others.

[@mavadelo]

disagree on the escalator. You should stay on the right, the left is for people in a hurry. Looking at your name... I seem to remember it from some reaction videos from "Localia project". In fact... I think he reacted to one of your comments in his latest "reacting to comments" video?

[@bastiaan4129]

@@mavadelo When there are stairs (several meters wide) next to an escalator, it's always faster to take those than to passively aggresively push yourself down the left side of a busy escalator. Dutch escalators are also so super-slow that the stairs are pretty much always a faster option and those angry escalator-shovers should maybe learn that. (And I hadnt seen that video, thanks for the heads up!)

[@Questerer]

Being dutch and trying to keep the 1,5 meter distance form other people. When I’m in a store and people want that same apple im looking at. I will notice they want to go there and I will give enough space for them to take the apple. After that I have enough time to think what I do want.

[@freudsigmund72]

when the then proposed minister of Justice, Ernst Hirsch Ballin left the office the prime minister he was surrounded by Journalists. His response was legendary in my book:"Heren, Heren! U belet mijn fysieke beweegruimte" ("Gentlemen, Gentlemen! You are preventing my physical movement space")

[@gerbrandlub]

I suddenly remembered The Speld articles about Ernst Hirsch Ballin. I gotta look those up again.

[@anthonyburke5656]

I’m Australian, my son lives in Amsterdam and has for the last 10 years, he now owns his home, but previously lived in a “share house”. We were recently chatting and he commented that the share house had a “square footage” of about 1/4er of his house and 5 men lived there, he lived there for a couple of years! He was commenting that he had just finished building his workshop in his back yard and that was bigger than the old shared house!

[@eddys.3524]

If Dutch tactile behaviour shocks you, don't ever go to the south of Europ where people are even more tactile.. BTW you perhaps can also explain it in a different fashion. The non-tactile behaviour in the USA could be indicative of a more egocentric way of life and being indifferent to others..

[@KaasSchaaf666]

exactly what I thought, save me writing it myself😄

[@jwmderooij]

Egocentric way of live in the land of the free.

[@mdgev2001]

True. Touching is common in southern Europe and Latin America. Totally different cultures.

[@Questerer]

Right now I’m renting a house in a small city of ~1000 inhabitants. The living room is on the back side and on the front side of the house is a bedroom. As a Dutch person I am a bit sad I can’t open my front windows to look outside from the living room. To me the street in front feels like part of my house. Which it is. The view from a house is very important to the “gezelligheid” in my opinion. I don’t want to feel cut off from the world.

[@giliorr2263]

Interesting

[@casperklerk5054]

About curtains. It was a tradition to have the curtains open to show anyone in town that you're a very neat couple living according protestant christian traditions with "nothing shady is happening here". These days closed curtains may indicate you're not at home and thus inspire a burglar to have a look. Or closed curtains may indicate someone you're familiar with wasn't able to open the curtains because he/she is not doing well and in need of help. Personally I like to have as much light inside my living room because it is healthy.

[@xmidsummersky]

Dutch person, same here! I couldn't imagine doing things during the day while having the curtains closed, I just love having natural light come in. Then again, the fact that most people (who own houses with multiple floors) don't really bother with curtains in the living room, because most of your private things take place in the bedroom. I don't really need curtains to be closed when all I'm doing is cooking or sitting behind my laptop hahah. The only time I've ever got my curtains closed is when I'm sleeping, since I don't have a separate bedroom.

[@longstockings]

I am Dutch and I feel the same in regards to the escalator. Example: me standing in line for my boostershot. The whole building shouted: keep your distance, 1,5 meter, leave some space between you and the other person....et cetera. But, people around me and further in line moved closer and closer to each other. It is our default state when we stand in line, I think.

[@transient_]

I'm Dutch. In regards to the first part, literal personal space, my behaviour is far, far closer to your (Ava's) behaviour. Maybe it is the norm in Utrecht? I'm not certain it is the norm in other parts of the country.

[@FrietjeOorlog]

When I'm not sure what to get in the supermarket, I stand way back in the aisle, so that people who do can go in front. Or I stand to one side at the narrow stands for fruit. Again; so I'm not blocking access while I think. And I keep checking if I or my cart are in the way. It is very impolite to take up someone's time without good reason. This is also why you wouldn't show up unannounced at their house. Very rude to assume your time is more valuable than theirs. I do the slow approach too if someone is just loafing. The American way of standing there looking at you with that typical crazy half-smile is much creepier. That smile is considered insincere and disingenuous, and is about the most un-Dutch way possible to behave in public.

[@Feeburgproducties]

About the situation thing in your street. When there is a fight, some yelling or accident, yes people will go look out of their window or come out. (Whats happening in our usually so calm street 🙂) Sure its curiosity, but also some kind of safety. When it gets out of control, people will be ready to help, try to control it of call the police. Its likes a neighborhood watch. + You always have some witnesses when needed.

[@amberkoenders6352]

Yep, in my street everyone will get out of their homes/ watch from inside or even intervene. It's a very neighbourly street so people also just want to see if their neighbour is okay and see/ask what has happened and help if needed/ report to the police or others what they saw. I also notice when there has been an incident and we call the emergency services, someone else usually has already called it in, people are fast responding and they will look out for each other. And sure there are people just curious and go outside to see what has happened but usually people who don't have anything to do with the incident will keep their distance. We also talk a lot about incidents in our neighbourhood/ street among our neighbours, many safety initiatives like street planning issues have been carried out/fixed by the municipality because of concerned neighbours. :)

[@mimimotor]

In Amsterdam when the is a fight or a fire in their streets they not even get out in the street, but they will comment also.

[@maartendevuijst]

I have been to India with some co-workers and we had the same experience there as you have in the Netherlands. Perhaps the social distance shrinks or grows with population density people are accustomed to?

[@gerbendekker6632]

She is from NYC. Talking about population density...?

[@TheEvertw]

I really enjoy these videos. Your humor and sparkle come across and it is always good to see your world through different eyes.

[@hardanheavy]

One not physical personal space thing in the US struck me as very odd, too intimate: I met this guy at work, just once. We got chatting and he invited me and my German co worker (also over from Europe for a few weeks) to go to a happening disco on a Saturday evening. He knew the bouncers, no problem with the queue, we'd see. So we go with him, walk past the entire line of people and he starts talking to the bouncers: these are my friends from Europe and blah de blah. (We got in and felt like VIPS. Pity the place was as plastic, people-wise, as you would expect in a cliché place in LA, so we soon left and found a dive with rock music, huge pitchers of beer and interesting blue collar workers to chat with. Definitely more our scene. We never were into that flashy IT scene). Anyway: this 'friends' thing is just... no. We met once, barely know eachother's names. A friend is a person you at least know and like. Way too intimate of an expression.

[@jschouten1985]

I guess he just told the bouncer you were his friend to make sure he would let you in

[@iamalexwolf]

I was thinking the same thing. If he said “I just met these people, can you let them in?” They would think, ehhh no

[@P0nyl0ve]

Also about the curtains we do have them but it is normal/good practice to open them during the day to get as much light as possible in, like what's the point of having a window when you always have the curtains closed! Also I think that the general opinion is if someone always has their curtains closed that there's something shady going on in there! (Or that they're never home or something)

[@AwoudeX]

If you have the Dutch waiting for a traffic light in a SINGLE FREAKING LINE, the line starts in New York......

[@gerl9869]

I am Dutch. What I find most striking is the herd behavior of people. At Christmas I was in a supermarket, there was a pile of six packs of special beer, in cardboard boxes. Big pile, all the same 2x1 meter high. Nobody is there, I place my basket on the pile to sort something in the basket. Suddenly a person appears on the other side of the pile and slowly slides in my direction. Remember: high pile, everything is equal. I see that and stop. The person moves so far that she is standing next to me and yes, she wants a carton of beer from exactly the spot where I am standing. Apparently thinking: that's where the better packaging is, otherwise he wouldn't be there. Incredible herd behavior. Try it out, herd behavior, look for a refrigerated display case where no one is standing, look in the display case for a few minutes and in no time another person will join you.

[@francinewillemsen7214]

In American restaurants the waiters are coming into my personal space and disturbing my personal conversation almost every 5 minutes by asking if I want something else, or want some more coffee etc. In the Netherlands it is to the client to order some more and give a sign to the waiter.

[@beal7ebub]

In the apple thing: honestly, as a Dutch person, I think its rude to stand there and just watch the apples 😁 We tend to either be efficient or, if we're thinking about which apple we want, we keep an eye out for others and give them room if we're in the way.

[@willemh3319]

the curtain doing goes back in history when the dominee would pass the houses to see nobody was doing unheard things , like drinking gambling later on they closed the curtains , and also against cold temps also carpets against the wall

[@jayandreas1131]

8:34 wonder what people on the subway in NYC during rush hour consider personal space?

[@lauriedepaurie]

Fun new observation: When someone says good morning Dutch people pause, look at the time and either reply good morning or correct you. It was pointed out by a coworker who's originally from Germany.

[@graceholmes9219]

that escalator thing is so interesting, because in bigger dutch cities (maybe because it’s not peak tourist season and the pandemic) i’ve never had to deal with someone standing close to me. if someone is close, i just move and i’ve found the other person will respect that i might be uncomfortable. this is mostly on the metro though, im sure it’s different than other places, especially when it’s more crowded in tourist times. love this video, thanks for another great one! -an expat also in NL :)

[@ronaldderooij1774]

Just two hours ago, that same thing happened to me in a Dutch supermarket. The lady politely asked me to move over as she wanted to grab some apples... haha. No sneaking in my space there.

[@codex4046]

As a Dutch person I don't recognize the touching thing at all. It would feel very weird to me to just touch me randomly in a conversation. I see people from the US doing it about as much as Dutch people and if people would put a hand on my shoulder I would also be "wtf are you doing, get your hand off of me" In the Netherlands if you spend a minute or more looking at apples while someone else is there as well, you are being rude. Most people would take a step or two back, still doing the apple thing but allowing others to do their thing with the apples as well.

[@cristakampert8740]

I'm dutch, but if strange people touch me in the supermarket or something, I get pretty annoyed as well

[@romyfennema8650]

The curtain thing made me laugh. When I leave for work (around 7:30 am) I often forget to open the curtains. By the time I get home, it's already dark so I leave the curtains closed. A few weeks later our neighbour (which we hadn't even met yet) asked us why our curtains are always shut. I was kinda surprised she had the guts to ask and it made me feel so uncomfortable 😂

[@Nitzpitz]

When we first came to the Netherlands, we always left the curtains closed. The neighbours actually thought we were in mourning.

[@Mars-Stuff-314]

About the covid press conference with Mark Rutte stating we're not shaking hands anymore ending with him shaking hands with the other guy was imo a brilliant and probably staged move by him. Rutte is a clever guy.. how better to put the point across by doing whatever you said everyone shouldn't do anymore and make a bit of a funny scene about it. Definitely stuck in my mind!

[@marielvanhees9531]

In my experience stubborn Dutch people will just go for it. Kind Dutch people will quickly say "Mag ik even?" And go for it with out your answer. My husband and I were in Amsterdam a few years ago during the summer. On the Tram it was packed with people. The driver even announced "meet a new friend and sit on their lap so we have room to let people on." 😂 Thankfully I was with my husband.

[@eyepatchpirate7726]

13:57 Dutch people don't have curtains but these days they will use 'raamfolie' or 'plisségordijnen' .... which is a very strange and funny development. "I won't close the curtains but don't you dare look through my window!"

[@P0nyl0ve]

Haha yeah because the folie let's light through and curtains don't! (Or to a lesser extent)

[@charlesvanderhoog7056]

I have a great story that actually happened. A couple from Sofia, Bulgari was in Amsterdam for the first time and was taking a stroll. Through a large window with no curtains they saw some people drinking wine and having a good time. They rang the bell, the lady of the house opened, and with a heavily accented German "Danke schön" they walked right in, passing the lady just like that, and ordered some wine for themselves. The two couples that were there were completely taken aback. The Bulgarians thought it was a public place because of the openness of it all. The next day they were to visit their friend from Sofia (and much later a friend of mine). All posh people, of course. It happened near the Beethovenstraat. The Diutch had a good laugh and the couple from Sofia felt ashamed and confused.

[@barrygerritsen7053]

My personal take on standing close to each other while having a conversation in public is that if you keep a larger distance you have to speak louder and thus making the conversation a public conversation. I would not have a big problem with obviously listening in or even commenting on what they are saying. Especially if they are speaking loud enough to be annoying. It is what is considered rude here in the Netherlands and I feel I can be rude back to them. I don't mean that I always would, but I've done so and when I see someone else do so I have a little smile.

[@TheEvertw]

11:00: whether a place is a city or a town is determined by its history. We have a city of 2,620 inhabitants (Buren), and a town of 514,861 (Den Haag). Utrecht and Amsterdam are definitely cities, since 1122 and 1300 (or 1306, depending on sources) respectively. Note that Utrecht is quite a bit older, dating back to roman times. Cities had the right to levy taxes and build city walls. Also different laws applied to them than to towns. In order to become a city, you had to be given city rights by the Lord of the land, which was quite a privilege.

[@expatfamilylive9041]

We love watching your videos, Eva! As we've also found a lot of interesting aspects of Dutch culture as Russian people living in the Netherlands 🇳🇱 Hugs from Almere 🏡 🤗 💙

[@DutchAmericano]

Hugs back!

[@alejandrayalanbowman367]

@@DutchAmericano Are you sure that you are not infringing on the other person's personal space by giving hugs back? XXX from Spain.

[@gert-janvanderlee5307]

0:14 Yes! I guessed right! Mainly because you already mentioned it on the title.

[@daanwindt1633]

I'm Dutch and I would never touch someone I don't know on their shoulder to apologise, I wonder if that's a regional thing. I do some of the things you mention, like the supermarket thing, but some of the examples you gave are just rude.

[@gert-janvanderlee5307]

It's a personal thing. I've met strangers who like to touch everyone and I've met people who don't. It's often the same people who also did the three kisses.

[@nilsjurgens4112]

Touching is normal in all the world, except for American culture. In the southern part of Europe it is much, much more common than in the North

[@dudie5403]

About the apple thing. It depends if it's rude or not. If they just stand next to you to grab the apples it's totally fine but if they bump into you to get to the apples that's rude. As for myself I always excuse myself when I need to get something and someone is standing in the way to get it and it takes to long. Usually I just wait a bit till the person is done and then pick the things I need but I also had it happen to me that someone started calling someone on the phone on what to get and I was like you are standing in the way and she didn't hear me when I politely asked her to move and I freaked her out when I bumped into her a little. She gave me a glare but I was like pay attention to your surroundings. And as a Dutch person I don't like to be touched by strangers but sometimes it happens.

[@jacobkajuiter5496]

You know the story about "not closing the curtains"? ....in the Dutch history were a lot of sailors and when they were out on the sea and there wifes were left home to take care about the kids and the household, they wanted to be "transparent" to the rest of the people in town to show them that they didn't do anything wrong, like being with another lover or something like that. So, we like big windows for a lot of sight and open curtains for transparency.

[@MrEnygma]

I'm not so fond if people stand so close to me, even if we are in a dialogue. This is my personal space Maybe because i'm an introvert, but i think more also because i cannot read their bodylanguage, Funny thing tho, in US movies and series most dialogues between two persons is even closer than you visualized for Dutch conversations😉 which gives then a false impression how things are percieved in the Netherlands (or at least to me as a Dutch person)

[@vincentvanstigt2926]

dutch are direct and efficient. so if someone blocks the acces to my product I wil say clearly "excuseer" and I will get my product. thats not to be rude, but it is kinda rude that your blocking my acces. so I will let you notice, but also I will not wait for you to make up your mind. (the dutch "excuseer" is allready a polite gesture)

[@marijeb278]

I liked your view because when I saw the title I suspected it to be the other way around ( since the nerherlands is often likened to Scandinavia which is big on personal space) but I do recognize the examples and can imagine how they might feel like a lack of personal space. To a Dutch person, these are in fact the condiderate things to do, but I can see why theyre not always perceived that way. it all depends on the context

[@alettejurgens2883]

About crowding up on the bycicle instead of standing in line. In Utrecht, where I live too, it is so crowded that you have to crowd up or you will be in the way of crossing traffic. It is interesting what you mentioned in a earlier vlog about crowding up while entering the train. Every time I board a train now I see it through your eyes. You have to step in front of somebody else to board the train! I never realised this because I just am used to this. But I saw on the station a child from about seven years old with her mother, the mother wanted the child to board the train but the child was too shy to step in front of me, so I boarded first... It is because of these little things that I watch your vlogs!

[@erikthehalfabee6234]

Excellent observations. A middle ground between how Americans and Dutch deal with personal space seems the best to me. And as you hinted in the video, how we Dutchies deal with personal space will lead to a faster spread of infectious diseases as a side effect.

[@barrygerritsen7053]

lol, I agree it is rude to block the apples!

[@wasneeplus]

When there's a fight in my street I do go stand on my balcony to watch. In fact I make a point of doing that, so the people on the street can see me watching. That way they know they can't let it get out of hand too much, since there are witnesses. Eyes on the street and all that.

[@MrC-y2r]

I think the start of point is the same when i hear you compare USA with NL: pragmatism. We have just different 'surroundings' , so different paths from that start of point. For example: we have big windows , not much curtains .. because of mental health actually. Lots of dark days , so we want to have as much as (natural) light as possible entering our house other example: touching the Netherlands is one of the most crowded places in the world. An 'open touch' is a very quick way to show 'good intentions' , or 'bond', 'connect', etc. Unconsious we all 'feel' eachothers vibes. In a crowdy place , a 'touch' helps to filter 'the vibes' from the interfeering vibes of other people so to say sorry for bad english, its just 'pragmatism' under 'different circumstances' as far as i 'feel' when i watch and listen your video(s) .. which are great by the way!

[@diegoserrano8302]

I live in Germany and it is the same here personal space doesn't exist like sometimes you are standing in the street like texting on your phone or just standing and people will literally walk and hit you or walk towards you also I've noticed sometimes im walking fast and people will start walking faster as well its so frustrating

[@Linda-hs1lk]

Touching someone while talking I find very annoying and I'm Dutch but I do think Americans are pretty hysterical over a lot of things. I see videos almost daily the way Americans are behaving. They might not like it being touched but minding other people's business seems to be totally normal. What you're saying about getting the apples is SO RUDE here too. I'd say something about it too.

[@moshemordechaivanzuiden]

Here's the clip: kzbin.info/www/bejne/lXnHZoKZncZmgdE (15 seconds, hilarious, no more handshakes, he said.) First time, I was in the States, any time I stood anywhere talking with someone, every minute or so, someone interrupted: "exCUSe me." They wanted to pass by. They could even if they were double their size but they all imagined that they were driving a truck. So annoying. But, here in Israel, it's the opposite, especially in certain neighborhoods. People shove you, push you, stand with their elbows pricking into you and they have no idea. I go into supermarkets in those neighborhoods saying like a mantra: "This is my body, don't touch." Is that how Americans feel in the Netherlands?

[@eefneleman9564]

I think most of the points you make can be written down to our Mediterranean temperament. As for looking into someone's house, that's actually what those big windows are made for. In the 'golden age' the room facing the street was literally a showroom, where people displayed their wealth.

[@roykliffen9674]

after living in my apartment for over four years, I only recently hung curtains. Not because the neighbours in the apartment complex across from mine could look into my living space (including bedroom) but because in the afternoon the sun shines straight in and makes using the computer difficult by either shining in my eyes or making the scrren difficult to see because of reflections ^_^ .

[@hermanfinkelstein8105]

The difference I think is you are not allowed to film in the netherlands inside people's house, thats privacy invasion. in the US from the public road you can film anything. if you can look inside you can film inside. for example in the netherlands public camera's have some software to block out windows so they do not record the inside of a house. even if they could.

[@jbird4478]

There's a lot of social safety here. What you may consider a lack of personal space, Dutch people see more as looking out for each other. People keeping an eye on what's happening in the street is also what makes it safe for children to play outside unsupervised. And depending on the neighborhood you live in, keeping your curtains closed can make your neighbors worried about you, or - if they don't know you - suspicious of what you're doing. Generally speaking, in bigger cities people tend to value privacy more. Where I live now if I wouldn't open my curtains for a few days, my neighbors would at some point be ringing my door to see if I'm alright. I think that's nice, but in some places you wouldn't even be able to do so for a day without being bothered. You just have to find the place where this balance suits you.

[@MarkDDG]

Can you maybe make a video about things that are surprisingly similar in the USA and Netherlands? I'm interested to learn about similarities that you might not expect.

[@DutchAmericano]

Great idea! Will do 😊

[@qpqp1236]

It is funny how you describe the difference between the US and Dutch concept of personal space. My daughter in law is from India and she describes the same difference, except that she experiences personal space in the Netherlands while in India it is nonexistent.

[@roykamaaina]

You are right on the point that they come so close even if they still talk about 1.5 meter distance.

[@robinb2105]

if a stranger is in the way at the supermarket i always put my hand on his/her shoulder or lower back followed by a “excuse me, i need to grab one of those apples”.... thats pretty normal for me to do, never really thought about it to be honest...maybe because others do the same to me. Personally i would find it strange if someone just asked me to go aside without any hand gestures or touching haha.... but it also depends on the location...i wouldnt touch a saleswoman in the shoestore for example...at least not usually. But in my view, putting your hand on someones body is a sign of friendlyness, to make someone at ease, and to let them know you want their attention for whatever reason...

[@damouze]

Personal space. I'm with you as far as the whole apple scenario is concerned. I too find it annoying when I am at a display looking for the groceries I need and someone else pops right past me and grabs something from that display as well. The thing is, I think it happens subconsciously and now that I think of it, I am pretty sure I am guilty of doing exactly the same thing from time to time. Random people touching you for no apparent reason other than being polite or reassuing and to apologize. To me that is a very Dutch thing to do, but I don't think it comes naturally to all of us. Sometimes it is uncomfortable and awkward both to the person being touched and the person touching the other person. I recall being in my twenties and early thirties and being totally unsure of how to deal with either situation. I had never learned how to act in these kinds of situation. It took quite some time and effort to be less self-conscious about it and more comfortable. Or who knows, maybe it is just a part of getting older.

[@Doubleranged1]

Do you watch WIDM this season? What are your thoughts of it?

[@SwirlingSoul]

Our country is SMALL. Space is not as available as in the USA. Everything is so much bigger there. We have learned to share the space we have, and we DO lean across each other, or in front of each other, and usually we then just lean back a little bit to LET the other grab their apples TOO. We kindly nod and make sure we both can reach the apples. When we're not being rude. The slowly creeping up is being POLITELY not pushing you out of the way, it is politely letting you know that we're coming for those apples too and you're supposed to share the tiny space for just a moment or two until the apples were taken ;-)) It's a gentle ballet, how we move, cross, lean, pass and hand eachother stuff. I love how you placed this under personal space, because it IS, and I too am sometimes uncomfortably close to a fellow shopper, (dude, lighten up on the aftershave? or Gal, you need a new perfume!), but over all, we manage to squeeze all of us and our apples into this tiny country! Most of our space is shared, due to the lack of it, look outside, when you are in a park, we do less of that closeness, unless we're all scrambling around the same trashbin, to clean up....then it might happen again, lol! , now I'll go watch the second half of your vid. Edit to add: This definitely is mostly a space issue. We don't have the space for 30 bikers to stand in one line. Your roads are wide and long enough to easily accommodate that in NY, but here, not so much. We're USED to crowding because it's often needed. As for the curtains...when it gets dark, we do close them, as we don't like the big black hole window. But, at dusk, people are welcome to look in and see us have dinner. It IS inviting, it DOES feel open and friendly. And it indeed shows: Hey, normal folks here, just going about our day. We usually see closed curtains as: hermit, ill, drugs, abuse or other problems. That's why it is so normal to have open curtains, it shows you're hiding nothing. And, it's also normal to want some privacy in the evening. We're not all red light district windows ya know... LOL ;-))) (in jest)

[@dutchyjhome]

The first examples of personal space really has got to do with the concept of Time... In The Netherlands, whether you like it or not, in our culture you'll get a certain amount of time to do things. When you've been given that time, and no action follows by you... the Dutch people here will let you know your time has expired, and so they'll will go in front of you. At a stoplight we'll hit the horn of our car, when you do not react swiftly when the light turns green, it's basically all about our obsession about loss of time, which makes us react like that; it's a respect thing. Do not stand in our way, do not slow us down, we've got quiet a high pass in our life. When you want to go do something, then go do that thing and make way for other people whom also want to do that thing. (picking apples for example) Want to hesitate and take your time? --> then step back so other people also can continue their thing and so you can take your time to decide what you want. The Netherlands is one of the most crowed countries in the world, so in case of a personal talk in public, you'll have to talk in a modest (soft) way since you don't want to be known as a shouting airhead, and so you'll shorten the distance between two people, so you can almost whisper in each others ear, or at least talk softly. This conversation is between the two of you, so nobody else should be able to follow it or be bothered with. We are so different is this than Americans are in general, American are trying to keep the distance grand and talk loud, both things we do the exact opposite of, and both things we consider to be rude: keeping the distance grand and talking loud.

[@Tonceitoys]

As a South American, talking about personal space is so strange, like, from what you're talking about, I think we have more in common with the Dutch in that regard than the 'North Americans'. Here we don't make a big fuss about being very close to people on markets, elevators, or even touching people in a friendly way to say sorry, greet or even just while having a conversation 😅

[@thepsychicspoon5984]

Because in the US, standing very close to a stranger can mean one of two things. You want to fight, or you want to...do other things. For one, getting close is the first thing a pickpocket does. Second, if you live in certain areas, being physically attacked by complete strangers is common.

[@wilfredclarity7642]

For the curtain thing i think its just because theres more social policing in the netherlands then the USA, although it has lessened more over the years, people just wana know whats going on and if theres help needed

[@Johanna-Rogier-Awad]

What I don't like in the States is that people are leaving their carts in the middle of the isle in the grocery store. I am waiting until they move their carts. People just looked at me and left the cart where it was. I find that disrespectful.

[@passais]

To run by your examples: 1. I would never touch a person "to connect". I'm not even big on handshakes. 2. I would totally get them apples. Although in most cases I would ask whether they could step aside a bit. If I were in the USA I would reply to "Do you mind!?" with "Not at all". 3. I would not be breathing down anyone's neck. Especially not with Covid. 4. I will make sure I manouvre my bike in a position that allows me to pull away first and pass people by. I'm a fast biker. 5. A crying person I would probably ask whether they are okay. Unless I suspect the answer would be more then I could handle.

[@rubensrozsaneto5715]

The way you described ppl going out to see the fights or discussions is so funny. In Brazil ppl are exactly the same way and if things go south they'll interviews 😂. I just recently moved to The Netherlands and I'm having a blast with your videos 👏

[@branding01]

Hi Eva, Welcome to the Netherlands; Yep. We do this. It's basically an 'overcrowded' country, pubs are packed, trains are packed, it's a little India in Europe, haha. (don't go to India, you will be shocked compare to here, when it comes to 'touching" ;-) I think you have to get used to it a little and i hope you know that it's very well meant, if someone explains a 'sorry' with some physical contact. it's warm hearted and since most europeans can appreciate it, its oke. :-)

[@theogeelhoed1589]

As a dutchie I don’t like unknown people to touch me without reason, nor breathing in my neck, and I excuse myself if someone is dwelling too long at the apple department… so I reckonize this behavior, and I know a lot of Dutch folks don’t like it but undergo it😊

[@helmaschippers3968]

I think that our personel space is more in our head. We have a lot of people around us, so we have our space in our heart and in our houses. It takes time to be invited in our personal space. Also living in the bigger cities give you an city view of live.

[@1glassMilk]

Interesting how a supermarket visit can be so adventurous. ;) The apple thing is something I see many times in the Netherlands. People are just trying not to waste time I think. Efficiency is something aswell. I think Dutch people think that its better to first think what apple you want and then take it. First looking will block the way to others. But as a Dutch person I agree. It would be nicer if someone said excuse me. I try to do that. And I hear it sometimes too. I live in the North of the Netherlands.

[@coenraad59]

I'm Dutch, and I feel the same as you about rude behaviour! And about the touchy-feely stuff, I don't think that's typically Dutch at all. In fact, of all the people I know, I can only think of one person who does it. And standing uncomfortably close happens more in the Randstad than the rest of the country.

[@LLI-j1k]

I never been touched by strangers in the Netherlands and i live here 10 years.

[@babsstrijkert5365]

The escalator rule is generally: standing on the right, passing on the left. We have better things to do than waiting. We hate waiting. Is not impatience it's timemanagement. Same with the apples. It's okay for you to be interested in the apples but like if you leave space for people that aren't, theres no issue. imo, You're not minding your surroundings, so why would I mind you?

[@mikedehollander6848]

i do it automatic touch other people on the shoulder haha just my enthousiasme, and being tall also plays a role you should step aside just a little bit so the other person can also take the apple standing next to you , small country little space haha

[@elsotto3314]

During a conversation we are closer to make sure you are listening we look you in the eye( it’s considered impolite if you don’t) and I don’t know if you noticed but we use less volume less loud as Americans for instance. For me personal I think of war when all curtains are closed, besides I’ve got nothing to hide 😊

[@XxXx-Evo]

I live in the Netherlands and I recognise a lot of what you say from the time I lived in cities. I now live in a much smaller town, and people here seem a lot more like you describe americans. I'm glad because I don't like being touched by strangers (although it doesn't make me angry) and like a bit of personal space. The difference is that here we will be quicker to ask if we can take some apples, and will not wait for a long time till someone notices we want apples too... So maybe this behavior is not typical Dutch, but 'city dutch'.

[@rutgerb]

I am from Friesland and I never touch strangers nor am I am beeing touched. It just doesnt happen.