Early Mustang Cooling System Part 3: Timing Covers, Balancers Water Pumps, What Does & Doesn’t Work

[@andrewlevine6689]

Im a novice and have this problem. And this really helped me figure this ou

[@GregMelanson]

thanks Walter,great,informative video.i kmow it's not new,i'll have to go look at more of your stuff,but important to me now.i'm talking on a new project,a 32 Ford and want FORD power.i have a low mile 5 liter from an 88 Lincoln Town car and will get rid of all the EFI stuff and install a carb.i'm trying now to learn about the front cover and such as i plan to install an old cover or whatever i need to have the mount for a mechanical fuel pump.once i learn about the front situation and pulleys,alternator,etc,i'll be trying to learn what i need for an ignition setup?thanks a million,great video.

[@TheGT350Garage]

Shoot me an email to [e-mail]

[@robertdavis6708]

I've always used a product to seal my gaskets called Yama-Bond made for Yamaha bikes. Been using it for 45 years and never a leak. The less the better in my opinion.

[@TheGT350Garage]

When you find something that works well, there’s no reason to change. Over use of sealant is an issue so I wanted to show how I apply it and what I use. My recommendation is based on suitability for the application, ease of use, long term performance, and ease of disassembly and cleanup in the future. It gets high marks in all those areas.

[@dcsmitty50]

Good info! Fuel pump eccentrics, cam dowels and timing sprockets are another thing that can confuse folks.

[@TheGT350Garage]

That will be covered in great detail later when I get into the engine build. Thanks!

[@lewis8281]

Awesome video. Thanks for making it. It helped me find out which water pump I had and needed to get for a new one.

[@seano7971]

Sad to see this GT350 loose all that originality. I really hope you keep the original parts.

[@TheGT350Garage]

The car was modified before the original sale in September 1966 by High Performance Motors, most of these cars are modified in some way. Unmodified “survivor” cars are extremely rare finds that no one drives, and concourse restorations end up being unused trailer queens. The driver cars have character, the modifications make them unique, and usually far more enjoyable. If you had any true understanding of what it is to own me of these cars, or the connection that driving them brings, the gentle changes are not offensive, and of course, original parts are retained. If you’re just here to tell me what do do with my car based on what you would do with it, I genuinely don’t care, work hard and do what you’d like with your own example.

[@RickLincoln-z7f]

On oil pan end corner gaskets can I just use Honda bond or good grey and rubber seal under cover

[@TheGT350Garage]

If you have a 1-piece oil pan gasket and the gasket stays intact, a little 1/4” bead of ultra grey across the gasket at the block where the timing cover gasket meets the oil pan gasket and also where the oil pan gasket goes under the timing cover around the crank will do fine. If you use the cork ends that come on a timing cover gasket set, use a thin layer of ultra grey to attach them to the cover and install the end seal like you would normally. If you didn’t drop the pan, it’s a little tricky to get it all lined up but not a big deal. Just do t get carried away with the ultra grey. A smear on the timing cover gasket, and bond it to the cover first let it set up if you aren’t in a rush, then the same on the other side before installation. Don’t try to use the ultra grey as the only seal, while it would probably work, you’ll need a priest to exorcise your demons after the swearing fest you’ll have taking it apart down the road. I once had a customer buy a long 5.0L block I built and use probably 2-1/2 to 3 full tubes of black silicone trying seal it up for installation. It was fine for a couple of minutes then it lost oil pressure. He got really accusatory about my build and pulled it out, we stood behind the build and I stand behind my work to this day. There was so much silicone in the pan and lifter valley I pulled it out by the handfuls. Needless to say it wasn’t my fault and on seeing the pictures and that the oil pump bypass was stuck open after the oil filter plugged with the stuff, he apologized and paid for my time and the parts to fix it. The old saying “A little goes a long way” really applies with gasket makers and silicone sealants.

[@harveycrowley7337]

What do you normally use to block the hole in the block for the dipstick tube?

[@TheGT350Garage]

If I’m building a 5.0L (E7TE based) block for an early car, I usually tap them with a 1/8” NPT tap and thread in a plug with a little sealant on it. If it’s an assembled engine and needs the plug, you can get a cup plug, 5/16” or 3/8”, I haven’t used that method much.

[@jeffunderdahl8605]

Great video and I learned a lot. Building a 68 fastback. Question: do you use the same process for prepping the gaskets for everything else? (ie. thermostat housing, water jump to backing plate, and water pump to timing cover?)

[@TheGT350Garage]

Basically the same process, yes. Minimal sealant so as to not make a mess, but yet, enough to seal well.

[@ryanjamison8905]

Can a short water pump be used with a 68 302 timing cover ? Driver side pump

[@TheGT350Garage]

I’m not aware of any passenger inlet short water pumps, which would be correct for a 68 289/302 timing cover. Driver side pumps were not used until 1970, and the balancer and timing pointers both changed to accommodate the driver side inlet. There used to be short pumps available aftermarket, but never from the factory for early timing covers or standard rotation.

[@jorgegonzales4153]

I have a 5.0/302 in a 92’ ford bronco. I went to install a new reverse rotation water pump and the timing cover is standard rotation. Do you know the part number to the reverse rotation cover? Thxs

[@TheGT350Garage]

Allstar Performance Timing Covers ALL90018 is reverse rotation from Summit Racing

[@wendelloldham7350]

I have 1965 Mustang with a ACP 3 row aluminum with 0.75" tube radiator, with a two speed Derale electric fan 2,400-2,499 CFM. I have a 170°F thermostat. I'm running a stock 289 block with Summit MLL-HP9009 aluminum heads. At idle I running at 181°F water temperature going into radiator with a 20°F temperature drop coming out the bottom return radiator hose. My problem is when driving at 85° outside temperatures the radiator inlet water temperature is going to 203°F and rising. What can I do to stop the endless rise in temperature? Your KZbin videos really good.

[@TheGT350Garage]

The cold thermostat isn’t helping. Once you reach the temps you are describing the thermostat isn’t closing. This leads to a constant temperature rise because the coolant isn’t being stalled in the radiator long enough to shed heat. The secondary issue is probably your distributor timing curve and vacuum advance setup.

[@wendelloldham7350]

@@TheGT350Garage Hey, thanks much for your reply. It gives me insight on my next move. 👍

[@TheGT350Garage]

Once you’ve decided on what you want to do, I can give you some insight into the distributor setup and a couple of quick and easy changes that will help stabilize your engine temperature.

[@joeandlaurahaltom7173]

Thank you for the great information ! I have a stock 1973 mustang with a 302 2v. I changed the thermostat to a high flow , from the standard thermostat . But its still over heating, you can actually hear the water start to boil in the engine . It has a Luxerad/Champion 3 core Radiator which seems to work just fine. So I'm down to the water pump, I can't tell for sure if it's the original water pump or not. It's not leaking so so I assumed it was not the problem. My question is, how do I make sure to get the correct water pump clockwise/counter clockwise. After watching your video I'm thinking that could be the problem. I sat and watched the temp gauge before I changed thermostat , At idle It warmed up , it hit 195 and cooled down several times until it leveled off and stayed at 195 for a while then I could hear the coolant 50/50 mix start to boil , the temp seemed to stay steady but the boil got louder then it stalled and the temp rose to about 230. I let it cool , replaced the thermostat with a 180 high flow . It's still doing the same thing so I shut it off as soon as it started to boil . That's why I'm thinking it could be the water pump. Thanks again for the great information and have a great day .

[@TheGT350Garage]

There are many possibilities for what you are experiencing. The fact it was warming up and cooling off was a good thing, that 195 thermostat was doing it’s job, and that the water pump is moving coolant. The temperatures you’re describing have me questioning if the radiator cap is holding the full 13psi the system needs to prevent boiling, with no pressure the coolant will boil between 215-230°F depending on the age and condition of the coolant. 13psi raises the boiling point of 50/50 green coolant from 226°F to 265°F, so pressure is really important. Take the radiator cap off and watch the coolant as the temp reaches the thermostat opening temperature, you should see coolant moving. If coolant is moving it could still be a reverse rotation pump, watching the coolant, it should move faster if you snap the throttle to raise the engine speed. If you have access to an IR temp gun, you can check the temps on both sides at the front and rear of the manifold. If one rear corner is hotter than the other (typically the passenger side) it could be a head gasket has been installed incorrectly (a lot of amateur builders make the mistake of trying to install both gaskets facing up the same way and this leads to one of the gaskets being upside down moving the rear water transfer passages to the front and preventing coolant from circulating to the back of the block and head on one side. A basic inexpensive IR temp gun is all you need if you don’t have one currently, check Harbor Freight or Amazon for a deal if you don’t already have one. This is where I would start if your car came to me for this issue. Once you know where you’re at with this, we can go to additional steps to dig deeper into your situation.

[@kevinroyle6034]

Awesome info. Building a 65 Shelby cobra, 91 5.0, needed to run standard rotation (clockwise) pass side lower rad hose, from what I gather is I need a 351W cover with drivers side pointer. I found a 3/4 hole Summit or Jegs after market 50 oz balancer, so it will have the markings on both sides. I'm going to use the dipstick in the timing cover, so will need to plug the drivers side block hole. Any suggestions on how to do that? Also, do I need to switch up my oil pan to front sump? Thanks so much for such a well done informative video

[@TheGT350Garage]

So, if your kit uses a passenger side lower radiator hose, you’ll basically want to set the car up as a ‘65-69 289/302. That’s the easiest. You can get basic chromed steel pulses for a 3-bolt balancer, and use the Summit 3/4 bolt crank balancer with no problems. I’d recommend the California Pony Cars reproduction’65-67 timing cover and a Tuff Stuff water pump, iron or aluminum, I’ve actually stepped up to the aluminum version for my car from the iron pump. The CPC timing cover includes a plug for the dipstick hole that will also work for the bike in the block, it just taps in. For the oil pan in a Cobra kit, if it needs a front sump a stock pan would work, but I’d strongly recommend something with better oil control and higher capacity, it’s one area not to compromise, especially in a Cobra replica, take a look at Aviad or Canton for appropriate options.

[@sknallt2010]

Great video. What is your opinion on FelPro gasket?

[@TheGT350Garage]

Fel-Pro gaskets are great, I use them all the time. It just happened that Mahle gaskets in singles were substantially cheaper. FYI Fel-Pro is part of The Federal Mogul corporate family. Mahle owns Victor-Reinz / Clevite. All good stuff.

[@jasonporrazzo3573]

You were going to mention something about the two thin passages not being plugged up by silicone on the front side of the timing cover. I didn’t hear anything in that?

[@TheGT350Garage]

The are coolant “weep” slots. In the event the gasket leaks between the timing cover and the block at the coolant passages, the slots create a path for coolant to leak out of and prevent coolant from entering the crankcase around the timing chain cover.

[@phillashio2319]

I would like to get rid of my heater hoses on my 68 302 mustang altogether. can I: A) block off the outlet at the water pump B) take that heater hose from the pump and connect it to the front of the manifold next to the distributor C) connect the hose from the pump to the back side of the manifold where it currently dumps from the heater core

[@TheGT350Garage]

To eliminate the heater circuit from the cooling system 260/289/302/351W, all you need to to do is plug the port in the intake manifold and cap the tube or remove the tube then tap and plug the port on the water pump. Connecting a hose would maintain the coolant flow, but it’s not entirely necessary. I would make sure you have a thermostat with an air bypass hole, and I would strongly recommend a high flow thermostat (Flow Kooler Robertshaw 195°F or 180°F at minimum) running this way, and you should be fine at that point.

[@jungleflowerscanada5384]

Thank you for sharing this valuable information. For someone only works on Toyota engines and is now building my first 351 Windsor using a 1972 block This video is invaluable I was very unsure what to use for talking to techs. But you are so clear with information thank you 👍

[@christopherwright7541]

Hi Walter, great video. I have a 1967 Mustang Restomod with the original but rebuilt 289 with Edlebrock RPM upper end kit. I'm planning on adding AC to it soon and would like to use March Pulleys and Brackets serpentine conversion kit to get the AC compressor to the passenger's side so I can run the AC hoses outside the engine compartment/behind the fender skirt. March requires a reverse rotation water pump for this setup. I was planning on changing the timing cover, water pump and balancer (from 3 bolt to 4 bolt 28 oz). the car needs a new radiator too so I was planning on installing the big block 24" with driver's side inlet and adding electric fans. I noticed you recommend sticking with standard rotation water pump if the car came with that set up. Is this a deal killer for me????

[@TheGT350Garage]

Not at all, ‘67-70 cars are WAY easier to deal with reverse rotation pumps than ‘65-66 for the very reason that you can simply use a ‘67-68 big block radiator and a ‘70 lower radiator hose. Be sure to match the timing cover and pump. If you need a mechanical fuel pump the timing cover will be a challenge, reach out to me and I’ll help you verify the correct timing cover and water pump combination, an electric fuel pump would make things much easier in truth.

[@christopherwright7541]

@@TheGT350Garage AWESOME! Thanks for the reply.

[@daddyshovel7995]

I built this 64 289 around 11to 1 big cam put double roller chain not thinking that the fuel pump thing slightly rubbed timing cover had to take it all back appart to wash out aluminum shavings errr. Every thing has been a challenge put A.R.P. rod bolts and still nervous about them 5 1/6 rod bolts customer turns this thing 7grand. My butt hurts.