EEVblog 1643 - DON'T BUY this Cheap 7kW 32A EV EVSE Charger

You get what you pay for in EV chargers. Don't buy this super cheap 7kW 32A EVSE Charger.
Does it even meet the IEC 62752 it claims on the label? Or the US UL 2231 standard?
A better MIDA brand EVSE: • EEVblog 1507 - Mida: A...
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#ElectronicsCreators #EV #Teardown

[@randycarter2001]

The best description of an EVSE is a "smart safety switch". It makes sure the cable is dead until both ends are properly connected.

[@emmettturner9452]

@@randycarter2001 …a fancy extension cord with safety switches.

[@edc1569]

Not sure this one makes sure, it has a half hearted go though.

[@Skoobedobedo]

The extension leads I use for powering all sorts of other appliances eg a welding machine, an electric lawnmower, doesn't have fancy electronics in it to make sure both ends are properly connected so why should the lead for charging my car need this?

[@mariueg]

@@Skoobedobedo Because the pins are big , so they can deliver lots of amps. Easier to accidentally get something into them

[@EEVblog]

Yep, and if it lacks both the "safety" and "bead" feature like this one does, it's a loser.

[@lucian5246]

Hi Dave! In Germany the standard requires a DPDT relay or dual relays for neutral + live. (SS 428 08 34 or DIN VDE0620-1) Also, as far as I know, the double pole switch in AU is mandatory too. (AS/NZS 3105)

[@edc1569]

Seems pretty sketchy, thought they needed a further set of relays to deal with contacts arcing solid?

[@lucian5246]

@@edc1569 That usually never happens or it shouldn't, the car will enable the contractors, as there is no high load the on the initial start the sparking should be minimal.

[@edfx]

What's the reasoning of relay also on neutral?

[@lucian5246]

@@edfx Neutral could be also LIVE if you rotate the plug, this is true for any county where the plug can be inserted 0 or 180 degrees. The approval for each region or country can be different but on some they require the following: when the device is turned OFF there should be no voltage coming out of the outlet contacts (neutral, live, earth).

[@JanicekTrnecka]

​@@edfx Total isolation. DC leakage is not funny ..

[@KeritechElectronics]

Look, mum! No RCD!

[@fredfred2363]

Which means it'll always work compared to all the public chargers that keep tripping.

[@KeritechElectronics]

@@fredfred2363 but then it should be possible to add auto-resetting devices to them. It will attempt switching the RCD on after a few minutes, a few times if necessary, until max failed attempts number is reached. Back a year ago, when I was working for Enelion, we were testing that, including high and low temperature environment testing - I'm not sure if it went into use in EVSEs though.

[@edc1569]

@@fredfred2363generally that’s down to the sparks not understanding they need to allow for discrimination so the internal protection has time to work before the RCBO trips out.

[@emdxemdx]

@3:07 "The front fell off!" Oh, that's cute: on the Chinese printed circuit, the hot wire is marked "火" (Huǒ), which means "fire"... 🙂

[@djscrizzle]

Keep that fire in the wire.

[@EEVblog]

Tempting fate there...

[@djscrizzle]

@EEVblog It's actually a saying among electrical utility linesmen, to keep that fire in the wire.

[@dennislacroix5478]

Here in North America, you'd have to have a relay on both sides as the 240v is center tap for 120 each side so both legs of power are hot with respect to ground.

[@smalltime0]

This wouldn't work in the states or Japan/Europe. It's made assuming that only one side gets 'hot'

[@Croz89]

​​​​@@smalltime0Would work if you've got single phase supply, which would be the case in Europe or Japan for smaller homes (and in pretty much all of the UK).

[@FlyingShotsman]

Given that it only switches live, it would be interesting to know if it's capable of detecting when its plug is wired with live and neutral reversed, and if so, what it does.

[@repatch43]

Yup, this thing is a death trap!

[@repatch43]

@@smalltime0 Of course it would 'work', the issue is it sure wouldn't be safe.

[@FlyingShotsman]

Dave, have you ever looked into the OpenEVSE project? It would be very interesting to hear your take on that design.

[@ai4px]

openevse is quite good. it has all the ground fault detection and an extra test wire around the common coil so it can cause a ground fault imbalance for testing.

[@EEVblog]

Haven't really looked into it. Is it 32A capable?

[@IanScottJohnston]

Always concerns me to see screw terminals that if they slackened off they could rotate and touch, especially on a portable device. Some heatshrink over the crimp terminals would help if they can't use locking terminals.

[@TrickyNekro]

Bring your own RCD

[@TradieTrev]

@@TrickyNekro Any decent sparky would have its own RCD circuit. That's if you follow AS3000:2018 lol

[@vk3fbab]

Fire Rescue Victoria recently responded to a fire in Glen Waverley. Some muppet was using a charger like this with a travel power adaptor. Looks like they lost their garage and two vehicles. Luckily the EV battery didn't ignite. I can see a world where insurers over here won't pay out on claims when non RCM marked cables are used. Fires are real and 32A is a considerable constant current.

[@edc1569]

In a travel adapter, Darwin Award? 😂

[@TheKnobCalledTone.]

Imagine spending $40k or more on an EV and then buying the cheapest, crappiest Temu charging cable for it

[@jfbeam]

Cheap as in quality, not as in money. (they're all stupid expensive for what they are.)

[@av_oid]

This wasn’t Temu. He doesn’t name the retailer, but EVSEs like this are listed on Amazon in Australia.

[@samholdsworth420]

This is an Amazon special for sure

[@wtmayhew]

I saw an EVSE which looks similar to this one listed for the US market on Amazon. It would be interesting to see the inside of the unit to see if it has a proper GFCI and relay switching on both supply leads. I doubt you’d find that out from the Amazon listing or any of the product reviews. It would work, but it would be patently uncool to relay switch just one side of a split phase connection to the vehicle. I wouldn’t put it past a sketchy Chinese manufacturer to sidestep proper design. On the other hand there are excellent Chinese manufacturers, but it is difficult to tell if you’re getting excellent or sketchy from an Amazon listing. Unfortunately Chinese authorities allowing the sketchy manufacturers to persist damages the reputation of all Chinese manufacturers.

[@wtmayhew]

I saw an EVSE which looks similar to this one listed for the US market on Amazon. It would be interesting to see the inside of the unit to see if it has a proper GFCI and relay switching on both supply leads. I doubt you’d find that out from the Amazon listing or any of the product reviews. It would work, but it would be patently uncool to relay switch just one side of a split phase connection to the vehicle. I wouldn’t put it past a sketchy Chinese manufacturer to sidestep proper design. On the other hand there are excellent Chinese manufacturers, but it is difficult to tell if you’re getting excellent or sketchy from an Amazon listing. Unfortunately Chinese authorities allowing the sketchy manufacturers to persist damages the reputation of all Chinese manufacturers.

[@theantipope4354]

For those playing along at home, Aussie sockets are 240VAC, so a 32A socket can supply a max of 7680W.

[@edc1569]

How did Australia end up with its own plugs, you’d think they’d just use the British ones or pick the European standards!

[@AfifAhmad]

​@@edc1569 Euro plugs are used typically 50A+

[@Mjoll87]

@@AfifAhmad He's likely referring to schuko or the others used in EU in consumer applications. The high current / high power ones are the CEE plugs (search for IEC/EN 60309-2). They're available in 16, 32, 63 or 125A and either in single phase 230/250V (blue plug) or three phase 400V (red plug, either 4 pole without neutral or 5 pole with neutral and ground)

[@ralfbaechle]

Copper-cladded aluminium is not new. For cost reasons it was commonly used in the Eastern Block. As inheritage from the Eastern Block we now also have it in Germany.. In East Germany it's know as AlCu or ALCU. To the best of my knowledge it's an ok material for conductors though the larger diameter may make cables a bit stiffer. Yet its still lighter than an equivalent copper cable. I've only ran once across it, in Hungary.

[@randycarter2001]

One of the specifications for the SAE J1772 standard is the EVSE is to have a GFCI/RCD safety device. That unit there is 100% unsafe.

[@mrlazda]

But SAE (including SAE J1772) is meaningless for Australia, it is North American standard (but not even for all of North America) and is applicable to US and Canada only, for Australia are applicable IEC standards, so because this is not according SAE not necessary mean is not legal (and safe???) according IEC (I don't know what IEC standard say about it).

[@dgo4490]

You can't really make that verdict without detail expose of the intended purpose rationale behind the specification and its overlap with the real world operation of the unit. Yes, you can say it doesn't meet a "specified safety standard", which is a legal thing, where "unsafe", at least for me, is a practical operation thing. Exploitation settings also matter, is it in a bare concrete garage, or is it the garage of a hoarder, full of cardboard boxes willed with flammable stuff. If you know you skimped on it, and it doesn't meet certification, it could prove quite useful to know what negative consequences that might have, and avert almost all of it by being a tad educate-informed so you ACTUALLY pay attention when you handle high voltage stuff. I think those "safety standards" which makes average people a bit too much looking at it as an iphone cable, which can in turn delegate to many situations where those people get to apply the same low level of diligence when handing high voltage that doesn't have a certified "pacifier" mandated and stuck to its dangerous end...

[@randycarter2001]

@@mrlazda The only difference between the European version (I don't have the number handy) and SAE is the European is set up for 3 phase. The protocols are the same. They also open the ground connection in some countries.

[@wtmayhew]

One could say this EVSE is “possibly or likely unsafe in US, Canada and some of Mexico*” due to use of split phase 240 volts with both supply leads separated from ground by 120 volts. This unit only has a current transformer on one lead, thus it would not properly detect a ground fault in a split phase wired situation. *Mexico has both 127 v / 220 v three-phase and 120 v / 240 v split phase regions.

[@teardowndan5364]

Pretty sure GFCI/RCD protection in the EVSE itself is required in most civilized places.

[@robina.jensen6114]

Why? RCD is installed in front of the outlet. RCD is required in the installation, so all equipment connected is protected and all the wiring is protected. I live in a civilized country. Actually all european countries have RCD before fuses or a combined RCD / autofuse in the main distribution board.

[@intrest86]

@@robina.jensen6114 At least in the US, the standard outlet based RCD would trip regularly because EV's test ground by passing a small current through it. EVSE's integrate a CCID that triggers at ~20mA to avoid that nuisance tripping.

[@SlyerFox666]

Not to mention the 6ma DC trip

[@SlyerFox666]

@@robina.jensen6114No point using a faulty one tho hey and according to the foreigners I worked with they only had fuses at home in Poland

[@repatch43]

@@robina.jensen6114 Some of the world (North America) doesn't generally have whole home GFCI. I consider myself 'civilized'.

[@emmettturner9452]

I believe the designs that also switch the neutral are also made to work with 240v US “Level 2” charging where that neutral is actually a second hot 180° out of phase. The board on your older one is flexible enough for EVSEs sold in other markets while this one is only for single-phase power.

[@Gameboygenius]

Also needed in 230 V Europe where the plug is often not keyed so it's a 50/50 which side is live or neutral.

[@emmettturner9452]

@@Gameboygenius You’re right. I was just looking at a European IKEA-brand power strip someone donated to Goodwill and noted how the ground can connect in either orientation.

[@Juergen_Miessmer]

​@Gameboygenius The europe 32A plug is keyed.

[@emmettturner9452]

@Juergen Yes, but this board can be used at lower amperage with other outlets too. It is very common for the same EVSE control board to be sold in various configurations, like the Gen2 from Clipper Creek (one of mine is 12A with a NEMA 5-15 and the other is 16A with a NEMA 14-30). There is also the potential to get it backwards when you hard wire.

[@Gameboygenius]

​@@Juergen_Miessmer That's true of course, but most home chargers in Europe will probably be either a wall mounted unit with a permanently connected EV plug, or a 16 A plugin charger using a 2 phase schuko plug. I think it's pretty rare to have a CEE socket in your garage unless you live on a farm or used it for power tools like an old drill press in your garage.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Definitely cheap-assing it- single pole switching and no RCD. Also lack of approvals marks. But why are they measuring the line current ( and voltage) that is totally unnecessary, whearas RCD protection really is needed.

[@EEVblog]

Yes, no approval marks either. They need the current for the energy display.

[@mikeselectricstuff]

@@EEVblog ..don't need the display either if they want to really cheap-arse it

[@emmettturner9452]

I believe the dual-pole switching is mostly to make the EVSE board flexible enough for 2-phase (so to speak) electricity, like US 240v Level 2 charging. Both conductors are hot (neither are neutral).

[@emmettturner9452]

…and as @Gameboygenius pointed out to me in another thread, you’d also need to switch neutral for unpolarized applications like Japanese and European plug types.

[@cjmillsnun]

@@emmettturner9452 to be fair in Europe you'd be using a commando plug for 32A They are polarised.

[@Distinctly.Average]

Lack of GFCI/RCD aside, I would love to get a thermal reading off the insane bend in that neutral cable. That looks like roast chicken territory to me.

[@Cheepchipsable]

Yes, was wondering how hot it gets when working.

[@davidmcclare443]

1:36 i thought it was electric vehicle supply equipment

[@vevenaneathna]

that recent garage leaf fire was blamed on a bad portable evse with an adapter.

[@Bobo-ox7fj]

They're desperate to blame anything but the vehicles themselves when property damage and loss of life are involved.

[@Cheepchipsable]

@@Bobo-ox7fj Why would the fire dept lie? Sure looked like the car didn't burn from the pics I saw.

[@EEVblog]

What aspect of it caused the problem?

[@perfumedmanatee6235]

I'm pretty sure the point of the earth monitoring in an EVSE is to disconnect all live conductors if there's a potential difference.

[@SeanBZA]

Cable stripped by mice biting off the outer insulation, and then the core could be CCA, you would need to cut a strand to see if it is shiny copper or bright aluminium under the copper. Only live switched, will still probably pass approval, but yes relies on the main RCD for protection, and I suspect that a short to the PE could blow the traces off the board before the main breaker or RCD will open, making it now unsafe, though, as the control chip likely will also be blown up, as it has connections each side of that trace, it will probably fail in the on state, as the relay will not be actuated to turn off.

[@EEVblog]

I scraped back a strand, seems to be copper all the way.

[@SeanBZA]

@@EEVblog They sprang for real copper, so it at least is good enough to keep in the car as emergency charger, and if you find somebody stranded at a place with no battery, but with a charge outlet, cheap enough that it being lost is not a real issue then.

[@Tim_Small]

I think there are rules around DC leakage on RCDs in or with EVSEs as well. At the very least the RCD has to be able to detect AC imbalance in the presence of superimposed DC. Many upstream RCDs won't have that feature.

[@edc1569]

I don’t think it would make sense for these high power applications you’d have to make the cable too thick, maybe for the earth conductor 😂

[@SeanBZA]

@@edc1569 Aluminium is only slightly bigger than copper for same current, and of course with chinesium manufacture it will be exactly the same diameter for the supposed ratings.

[@Thatdavemarsh]

The scary part of no switched neutral is if someone didn’t follow code and/or didn’t have a qualified install and inspection and then swapped hot and neutral in the supply circuit.

[@EEVblog]

But then the in-built safety switch would.... oh....

[@Rangeldangeldodo]

That blue cable bending radius gave me ED!

[@graemebrowne1463]

I was a little concerned that the earth connectivity is via the pcb trace. I was brought up to have a longer earth lead so that it is the last to break off if the cable clamp fails. I am sure the lawyers will argue that electrical safety is not the manufacturers responsibility as long as its works out of the box without any 'wear and tear'.

[@nicholasvinen]

I don't think Earth through PCB tracks or solder joints is ever permissable for safety Earths. It's only valid for purposes like EMI suppression where it doesn't matter so much if the track fuses.

[@NiHaoMike64]

Maybe they implemented the RCD functionality by checking for current returning on the ground line? Might be worth a try introducing a fault with a resistor to see if it trips.

[@graemebrowne1463]

​@@NiHaoMike64😫

[@benespection]

Definitely not legal in Europe. Both live and neutral must be treated as live (we have a mixture of delta and wye supplies), plus who knows how a house has been wired. Full earth monitoring is required, and it must include the most simplest 30mA RCD. Earth leakage or broken earth must be detected too. The granny charger I got with my VW ID.3 has switched off with earth fault detection at old houses I've visited (which still don't have even a 300mA main RCD) when certain appliances have been switched on, like electric ovens or kettles, highlighting faults in those devices :)

[@BreeUSA]

Technically it's an adapter, not a charger. The chargers are in the car. I'll show myself out. 😆

[@sdgelectronics]

It's an EVSE, rather than the charger as you say. But he did say it around 1:30 in.

[@BreeUSA]

@sdgelectronics yep, but the title still has it 😉

[@EEVblog]

@@BreeUSA People search for the term charger. Title turns up first in any keyword search. Bread and butter KZbinr stuff.

[@BreeUSA]

@EEVblog title can have charger in tags.... the title can say "charger"/EVSE.. I get the search issues, but it doesn't hurt to use the correct term, engineering "conciseness" and all. Lol

[@zoom_h2625]

The PE is to small to carry the short cut current from a 6mm^2 current! There should be a RCD included, the RCD must check the PE connection, while you switch on. IF there is no GND connection the charger should not start.

[@edc1569]

Does the PE really need to carry a fault current for very long?

[@zoom_h2625]

@@edc1569 the MCB needs for fast action (magnetic trigger) a lot of current. A 32A MCB Type B needs a minimum of 160A to act fast. With 160A you get a fast acting PE (lost by burn out). You will be able to charge your car. But without any safety!

[@moestrei]

The Tesla AC adapter (the actual charger is in the car) has the same Type 2 connector in most markts. Those chargers a high quality in my experience.

[@SimonCoates]

That teardown has got me a bit worried. I'm going to check for neutral continuity on my Chinese made EV lead.

[@Mladjasmilic]

For all of you who did not notice, this device has 0.75mm² ground wire, same as CP wire. While this is more than enough to carry communication, it is not enough to ground a 32A circuit. And this EVSE has no RCD inside, so the only protection you have is RCD somewhere else in the circuit. If your 32A socket is not RCD protected, and there is a short circuit, ground wire would catch fire. If they were cutting cost, they could use thinner wire, for example 2.5mm², which can handle 32A short for a few second, enough to trip the breaker. But 0.75mm² is not enough.

[@flymypg]

I was very glad my '21 Nissan LEAF SV included a factory 120/240 EVSE, as I was not looking forward to shopping and evaluating the alternatives. Plus, in San Diego, installing a hard-wired EVSE needs a permit, but a new 240V outlet doesn't, which sealed the deal for using the factory EVSE.

[@float32]

Why would you hard wire a level 2 charger!?

[@zaca211]

1:30. Copper coated aluminum is a nightmare. With PoE, it has the potential to cause a fire because of its lower current carrying capability.

[@michaelwebber4033]

That cable doesn't comply with AS/NZS 3000, the earth conductor should be 1.5mm minimum

[@sectokia1909]

AS3000 doesn't cover appliances it ends at the wall outlet.

[@edc1569]

I doubt that applies to appliances.

[@peter.astrand]

This is an "In-cable control and protection device" (IC-CPD), defined by IEC 62752 (printed on the back). RCD feature is a must - should monitor both AC and DC faults. Also note that the ground wire is thinner than the other wires; this is typically not allowed. Don't buy.

[@gungagalunga9040]

Hi, would you ever do a teardown of an AC to DC onboard charger? I guess they're hard to get because they are built into the car. You would have a lot of components and PCBs to examine...

[@llxibo]

Hi Dave! That charging cable could be bought online in China for CNY 258.2 (~AU$ 53.5) after discount, with free delivery. Of course it comes with Chinese type I mains plug, not AU mains plug. Dual relays for both neutral and live are mandatory in Chinese standard (GB/T 18487.1). RCD is also mandatory. GB/T 20234.2 stated on the marker is Chinese standard equivalent to IEC 62196, which defines the type 2 connector on the vehicle side. On the control board it says "单继电器底板" (single relay base-board) so the single relay design is intended. They may have a dual-relays version as well. Maybe you could talk to the company "宁点" (Ning-dian) with the cellphone number they left behind it. The push-in connector J5 on control board says "温度" (Temperature) but left unconnected. Maybe there is an external temperature sensor not installed yet.

[@DarkFireGibson]

How does the components even justify the cost of the product?

[@Huvada]

I don’t even care if it’s still complying with the safety standard or not. I would want it to switch both sides and have an RCD. That car connector is likely to have a lot water ingress, or just be left in puddles with the carelessness of people leaving it on the ground without the cover. The wall outlets may be DIY too, so the protections on there and correct wiring order. Well, you can only hope it’s correct.

[@ats89117]

The review seemed a little harsh. We've all seen much worse...

[@richardjones38]

It amazes me that people buy cheap junk 'chargers' / plug in EVSE's (unless it's for a review video!). I picked up an unused genuine Audi one with both the 32A 'commando' plug cable and a 13A plug cable here in the UK for about the same amount. They're the same as the Porsche ones, just branded differently. They're a clever design where the changeable incoming cable to the configures the maximum charge current. One model can do 11kW / from 3 phase, 7 kw from 240V / 32A single phase, 3 kw from 240V 16A, and slightly less from 240V 13A, given the right incoming cable. Built in 30 mA AC and 6 ma DC RCD, and earth checking too. BMW / Mini's chargers also have their output current configured by the changeable incoming cable in the same way, but they usually come with only one cable, at least here in the UK, and the other incoming cables for them are ridiculously expensive. Many of the Audi / Porsche ones seem to have originally been supplied with 2 incoming cables, making them considerably better value if you want to be able to use them at say 3.5 kW and 7kW.

[@wtmayhew]

The relay is marked “80A” suggesting some type of 80 amp switching capacity rating. It looks like it may be iffy even for 32 amps.

[@HenryLoenwind]

Oh, my. The ground connection is horrible. The two ground wires are only connected via the PCB? I'd say that ground connection will blow before the circuit breaker when there's a short to ground... If that was done properly, I'd say it'd be ok to use for countries where you can 110% rely on the polarity of your wall sockets. On those with reversible plugs and/or sloppy wiring, this thing's dangerous.

[@pertinax_17]

I believe the ground conductor should be of equal thickness as phase/neutral.

[@GodmanchesterGoblin]

It has an incorrect CE marking too... Always a sign that corners have been cut.

[@SlyerFox666]

It's not incorrect it's for Chinese export, quick way to tell is if you carry the C on to a full circle does it overlap the E 👍

[@smalltime0]

CE is self certified until not, so it's really a low barrier to entry. but as @SylerFox666 pointed out, thats the Chinese Export mark.

[@GodmanchesterGoblin]

@@smalltime0 No such thing - ask a real Chinese manufacturer (I've worked with a few). This seems to be an internet myth that has gained too much traction in some areas, even in the EU (I have yet to come across any source that confirms it having official status). Also, the CE mark and the claimed Chinese Export mark both use characters that are part of a circle, not a regular font. If the C is extended to form a complete circle it exactly overlaps the curved back of the E in the CE mark and overlaps much of the E in the claimed Chinese Export mark. But the marking on this product as shown in the video is neither - perhaps they just used an Arial font or similar

[@Mladjasmilic]

I make the simplest possible EV chargers using DIN modules, but: They all have RCD They all have double isolation relays Note that having lathing relays is a terrible design. If your internal power supply fails, there is no way to unlatch it, and the user might plug it in within the latched position. Effectively making a mode 1 charger.

[@sectokia1909]

Certainly not legal for many reasons. No RCM mark is the main give-away.

[@samuraidriver4x4]

Whats wrong with aluminium/aluminum instead of copper? Its a whole lot lighter then copper especially when you have a 380v 63a 3 phase cable with a neutral thats 25 meters long😉 Only downside is you do need to make sure its strain relieved properly and you roll it up in bigger loops then you would with copper.

[@TradieTrev]

Double pole isolation switch for you!

[@pahom2]

I don't get why do you need it? Why can't you just plug the cable directly?

[@TrevorClarke]

It's a shame... Looks like they had some decent attention to detail on board layout, decent crimps, etc. But it was missing a couple of biggies...I wonder if they make a model that's a bit more expensive and has dual relays, etc

[@me_at_blue_sky]

Does not look to be legal in EU. As much as I remember, in low power systems (like 32A is) PE core must be at least same size as live (phase) wire.

[@Zonkotron]

Considering that these things ought to be designed out entirely (just plug into the wall, dial-a-charge on the car dash, why need a dongle, waste of material and money), the worst and cheapest is the best! Always has me shaking my head. What absolute muppet came up with this specc. Any car should accept AC and DC without a dongle. And should be able to charge off solar cells directly. Matter of national security, so people can charge on dodgy sources in an emergency. And actually - as a power engineer - no real added effort. I need a lot of control authority for CC/CV charging let alone more advanced algorithms anyways. All digitally controlled. Easy to include some MPPT and other features. Finally we get to the issue of burning down your garage. A proper circuit will trip the breaker before burning down. Dont need "smart" for that either. If it doesnt, it was installed by criminals.

[@a68k_de]

Actually, the disappointing thing is that you don't build something so simple yourself and/or modify another charger to suit your needs. Disappointing. Then such a charger can't be expensive enough.

[@edc1569]

Being a good engineer is knowing how to best use your time!

[@a68k_de]

@@edc1569 ... and money ;) Building these simple adapters is a question of a few minutes with available components and a thing of 1/2 day building that all from scratch. There is "nothing" in there. That's the great thing charging an EV is so simple. I took available conponents and build my own wallbox and mobile box (adjustable power)

[@JSMCPN]

It makes me sick how eager people are to waste raw materials on poor quality unsafe products

[@davidlloyd1526]

Do not go cheap when it does 32 amp.

[@smalltime0]

dw it's only doing 31.6 :/

[@dlmac]

Tesla > all other chargers. That thing looks like a Tumor. no thanks.

[@dfgaJK]

If the car contains the charger and logic, why does the cable need a relay to isolate it?

[@HenryLoenwind]

Because when there's a short between live and the car's body, the electronics inside the car cannot turn off the power. Also, you don't want the plug to be energised all the time. The touch-protection of those contacts is rather rudimentary, and it's used and stored outside where it's wet.

[@dfgaJK]

@@HenryLoenwind Does the car not connect to earth via the earth pin? Isn't there an RCD on the 32A outlet? It is essentially an extension cord, aren't thoes are always energised? It is unfortunate that the touch protection is poor such that all the extra complexity is required. I expect it would be used in the same environment that the Aus 32A connector outlet is, it is a shame the car doesn't just use one of thoes instead.

[@edc1569]

Well that’s the point of it is, so when you’re standing around in the rain you don’t fry yourself.

[@switzerland3696]

Looks good for the price.

[@dbmandrake]

Also not impressed by the Earth connection being carried by the PCB - why do that ?

[@wazza33racer]

High draw appliance meets cheap crap.......what could go wrong?

[@iam21h]

There are so many problems with electric cars. Gasoline cars are more environmentally friendly, cheaper and more energy efficient.

[@shaunclarke94]

I didn't see any RCM compliance marks on the back.

[@briankmetz2735]

$160 Australian dollars is $110.55 USd

[@backgammonbacon]

My wall charger has a cable attached to it that works perfectly.

[@voltare2amstereo]

see the leaf fire video from autoexpert? a dodgy charger was to blame

[@Flying0Dismount]

$100 local currency is about the right price point for an emergency EVSE to keep in the trunk just in case of emergency... I would consider this one even without all the safety stuff inside because it wouldn't be my everyday charger, just something I kept in the trunk in case I ever found myself without the range to get to a real charger. I reality, it would probably never get used, but like a spare tire it's good to have just in case, and if it's got a better than even chance of not burning or melting during it's one and only use, those are good enough odds to bet $100 on for me...

[@float32]

I’m using a sub $100 charger because the $650 pos Wallbox stopped working even more than usual after two years. I think the only charger brand I would actually trust is charge point.

[@Tim_Small]

Better to buy a good used one. For not much more, I bought a used Audi branded EVSE with both 13 amp UK and 32 amp CEE plugs. German designed and European made with a decent RCD inside too.

[@mannbat]

No RCM compliance marks anywhere?

[@Chris-bg8mk]

It’s not a charger. The charger is in the car. I like my Clipper Creek evse. Quality.

[@joeyscleaninglady2877]

I don't see any rectification electronics in this charger it looks like it outputs AC? This doesn't seem to be a rectifier aka a charger

[@dd07871]

I wonder if it has short circuit protection.

[@EsotericArctos]

At the current conversion rate as of today, $160 AU is about $110 US. You get what you pay for. Don't buy cheap crap if you are plugging it into a rather expensive EV

[@kralg]

So if this cable were sold for like $500, would it be OK to buy it? The problem is not the price. For this $100 price you should be able to buy a decent quality relay with a microcontroller and some plastic casing.

[@EsotericArctos]

@@kralg A EV charger is a lot more than just some relays and a microcontroller, if you want something safe. But sure, if you want to risk your EV on a device like this, then do so. There is a reason it's recommended not to buy it :)

[@kralg]

@@EsotericArctos You did not really read my comment, did you? I never said this charger should be bought, I only said it is not the price that makes this charger good or bad. But for sure I cannot really see that "lot more" you are talking about.

[@JoeBlow-zr2ru]

3m05s ... The front fell off! (it's an Aussie joke ... youtube it if you're curious)

[@shazam6274]

So Dave, doesn't your car mfg. have one of these? How much is that? Many EVs have one already provided in the trunk. Did yours?

[@Cheepchipsable]

He stated he had a lower amp one.

[@GrahamGopalan]

I really appreciate your efforts! Just a quick off-topic question: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (behave today finger ski upon boy assault summer exhaust beauty stereo over). What's the best way to send them to Binance?

[@Luzgar]

I'm not an expert, but not switching neutral seems sketchy to me. What if the guy that installed the outlet get it mixed up ?

[@HenryLoenwind]

If the car's electronics are good, they will refuse to initiate a charging session. Otherwise all will work fine but you'll have a live port in your driveway that's big enough to take small fingers.

[@Luzgar]

@@HenryLoenwind That's what I'm worried about, the plug lying live on the ground outside.

[@BollingHolt]

So thankful for my internal-combustion engine 😎

[@peca89]

So there is absolutely nothing actually wrong with this "charger" but we still get an all capital DON'T BUY clickbait title?

[@Cheepchipsable]

It's non-compliant is the issue. Might work fine but there is a greater risk of failure compared to a compliant unit. If this unit caught on fire and the insurance examined it and found it, what would happen? If I buy a Jeep and have no problem I might say they are good cars, but there are a lot of failures in those vehicle, I just have survivor bias. 😉

[@stevenbliss989]

What is the point of relay'ing the NEUTRAL. Is it for crap wiring that has N & A reversed by a bad electrician??????????? Otherwise I cannot see why this is a thumbs down??????????

[@Cheepchipsable]

How do you know if the house has good wiring?

[@stevenbliss989]

@@Cheepchipsable 1) A simple tester (many on eBay) will tell you, WAY WAY WAY cheaper than paying TRIPLE the price for an extra relay! 2) It is ILLEGAL to wire a house incorrectly, and here in Australia, such wiring errors are ULTRA RARE! as a result. 3) In the car ALL chargers are ISOLATED electrically for both A & N magnetically by a HF transformer, so it actually does not matter anyway.

[@Blasterxp]

Does anything get hot when charging? What is the box next to earth terminal?

[@f-s-r]

Why do EVs need this, instead of including the electronics on the EV itself?

[@emperorSbraz]

because every charge port is different. its the port telling the car what to do.

[@HenryLoenwind]

Because those electronics cannot measure what kind of plug and socket is on the other end of the cable. And for the safety features, having them only in the car cannot protect from a fault between the charge port and the electronics or from a fault in the charging cable. Both could energise the car's body, which is a very large metal thing sitting on four round isolators people have no qualms about touching.

[@edc1569]

To protect the users, consider the conditions you charge a car in, also to ensure the car understands how much power is available to ensure the socket is not overloaded and also to aid in grid stability in some applications.

[@vladpalas]

If you have this on an European plug, than you can have live instead of neutral going to the type 2 plug just by having the charger plugged in 🤔

[@funkyironman69]

I wonder if the PCB earth connection would be able to handle the required fault current? I don't see why both the in and out earths aren't attached to the same stud?

[@cool386vintagetechnology6]

I think they might be relying on the earth current only being 10-30mA before the RCD trips.

[@sasiuru]

Cheap, Electric, high kW. Sounds like a perfect match... to burn down you car & house... :D

[@hillppari]

32amp single phase is just dumb. australia should just adopt 3 phase already

[@cool386vintagetechnology6]

Australia has 3 phase available to every consumer that wants it. I agree that a 32A single phase supply to charge a car is a bit strange, when 415V is available from the mains going past the house.

[@LawpickingLocksmith]

Knightridery?

[@ThinkingBetter]

It has 4 rubber feet hahahaha...with that heavy cable it's plain impossible to ever have those 4 thin rubber feet resting on a flat surface at the same time.

[@Cheepchipsable]

I wouldn't call them feet so much as plugs.

[@ahaveland]

AU plug is polarized so I guess it can skimp by relying on the live and neutral always being the same. EU plugs are 180° rotatable, so that Earth is always Earth, but Live and Neutral can be either, so in that case both would need relays. The relays look terribly weak considering they would be carrying 32 A @ 7kW

[@romelec]

EU plugs with earth can't be rotated, and 32A plugs are similar to Dave's plug. Edit: type E plugs can't be rotated, type F can

[@edc1569]

Earthed schuko can only go in one way?

[@ahaveland]

@@edc1569 In Hungary where I live, the earth connector on the socket has strips on opposite sides of the diameter, 90 degrees from the L and N pins. There is no E pin, it's on the sides.

[@BersekViking]

Doesn't look IP66.

[@irishguy200007]

Would it charge the T800

[@adamnowak8876]

Is this even a charger?

[@stusue9733]

Just how much worse are Aluminium cables? For something like a winch, if I double the size of the conductor(while changing from copper to Alum) am I better off or worse off?

[@rocketman221projects]

Aluminum wire is perfectly fine if you use a larger conductor size to make up for the higher resistance. Just make sure your terminals are rated for aluminum or you will have corrosion issues that can cause a fire. Be sure to use anti-oxidant compound if the terminals or code requires it. It doesn't hurt to use it even if it's not required too.

[@alch3myau]

but how well do they run on modified sine inverters

[@Skoobedobedo]

All this bullshit should be built into the cars onboard charger so that suitably rated standard extension lead could have been used for charging EV's at home from a suitably rated standard power socket. Maybe even the earth wire could have been used as a reference potential for determining if there is a significant voltage drop occurring between each end of the extension lead? The extension leads I use for powering all sorts of other appliances eg a welding machine, an electric lawnmower, doesn't have fancy electronics in it to make sure both ends are properly connected so why should the lead for charging my car need this? Anyway we are stuck with needing these special charging leads so I guess no point thinking about what could have been.

[@Cheepchipsable]

Probably cheaper to make it external for the various power grids around the world. Also easier to modify if need be, and have the owner pay for it.

[@operator8014]

Why doesn't the car just have a mains socket on it?

[@HenryLoenwind]

Because that would limit the car to charge at the amps that one socket can take. Or you would need a bank of different sockets. Also, imagine how many different sockets you'd need for a car driven across Europe.

[@edc1569]

People just want to plug a car in and not have to worry about getting zapped in the rain or overload the supply.

[@Electronics-Rocks]

😮😮😮RUN AWAY FAST!!!!!!😮😮😮 No RCD & yes double pole switching is required in the countries that are in the harmonisation pact of electrical engineering!! Plus the earthing load bearing capacity & what they are doing looks even more dodgy. Do you have a local gov trading standards department to drop this off too?? Get your money back & tell them. Even ask them about Aussie regulations compliance, as would be interesting to see their comments!!

[@stevenbartlett2057]

You sound different

[@murataydn5613]

Türkiye den selamlar.

[@TestECull]

just makes me even more glad I drive a 53 year old Chevy truck instead. Ain't gotta worry about this cheaply made crap starting a fire or failing to do its job or sommat.

[@TheKnobCalledTone.]

Damn straight... EVs are a meme

[@edc1569]

I’m sure it’s great fun in January.

[@TestECull]

@@edc1569 3 pumps, bump the key, lights right off. 🤷 Not my fault you can"t maintain, operate your shit and have to resort to computers to do it for you.

[@sl06bhytmar]

The single relay on/off is good enough according to standard. "The switching contacts of the IC-CPD are not required to provide isolation, as isolation can be ensured by disconnecting the plug." Also because the plug is polarized, there is no real need to have relay for neutral disconnection. Otherwise seems normal to me expect earthing. Standard also says max. current allowed is 32A, so no worries there either. 6mm2 copper seems to be standard minimum for two wire cables inside a duct and cable. So judging it is just a energy meter, relay, technically the design is not wrong but if the components used do not fill the advertised minimums, then it probably will burst eventually in flames. Relay is probably the most suspect where this might not last.

[@petergabrielsson2013]

I suspect that language meant to say "reinforced isolation". In that same standard a hipot test is performed from input to output and it's impossible to pass without 2 relays. The standard also dictates the minimum contact distance of the relays so at least basic isolation is required. The ground wire is way undersized at 0.7mm, it should be 4-5mm iirc. Type B RCD is also required. Nothing about this design is safe or compliant

[@tommyblair6008]

I stopped watching when you said Tesla rubbish. The Tesla cable is become the stand in US because it far better in everyway. So I lost faith in any knowledge you will clam to have.

[@pinkiepie1656]

I lost faith in the English language by reading your comment...

[@nameredacted1242]

From its size and crappy plastic construction and heatsinking, I would trust it to handle 70W, perhaps.

[@edc1569]

If your evse design is dissipating 70W you really screwed up