EEVblog

[@SouthPlanObservation]

For those who wondered what this beast cost back in the days. The MSRP for the M3000A reached from $11k to $17k, for 24-56 channels with VCAs.

[@ppdan]

That is a decent price for such a mixer. Expected it to cost more

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Mag shielding on relays probably to avoid magnetically coupling clicks into nearby low-level audio signals rather than adjacent relays.

[@ijf03208rek]

Haha 7 years later and 69 likes. Niiiice

[@mikeselectricstuff]

Insert is to allow effects to be placed in-line with individual inputs - things like compressors/limiters, reverb etc.

[@DirtyRobot]

+mikeselectricstuff I believe it is classed as a channel insert that allows you to pass the signal path to an external device and then back before the signal is passed onto the rest of the channel.

[@obiwanjacobi]

+mikeselectricstuff Yeah, although reverbs and delays are usually put on an effect bus (the middle 'matrix' part of the channel section).

[@xyanide1986]

+mikeselectricstuff You mean all those except the reverb, hah!

[@xyanide1986]

+Marc Jacobi Nah just give the whole effect its own return channel! Look at all those suckers on the far right. More mixing more better.

[@asdf155]

+Marc Jacobi It depends on whether you want to use an effect on just one channel or on a subgroup or on several channels across subgroups. It's not that uncommon to have something like reverb as an insert.

[@trustthewater]

Having been the technical friend of a number of musicians years ago I can say they aren't very complex to use. It's intimidating, but it's just a lot of repetition. The real challenge is having an ear for what you are doing. There are plenty of people that will say they want to help be a roady so they can meet the band, hang out, have fun, learn how to use the equipment... After running a couple dozen cables they tend to suddenly disappear. Those that do stick around to help set everything up are not there when it's time to take it all down. Another fun thing about doing live audio at a concert is that when everything runs well the tech gets no attention. If a guitarist is standing to close to his amp and it feedbacks (not something the board operator can control), the audience turns and give the tech The Eye.

[@MrBanzoid]

So true.....

[@mycosys]

The only way you know you are doing a good job is if nobody notices XD And i dont get the pikers, there is no feeling like seeing a gig through from plan to bumpout, the feeling when you get off and chill is incomparable

[@Ma_X64]

Absolutely agree!

[@squelchedotter]

your cordless screwdriver makes really weird whistling noises

[@Engineer9736]

;) :D

[@elguinolo7358]

That's because Dave is a Time Lord ;-)

[@JanBabiuchHall]

I spent my best years working at a radio station and doing live sound on this puppy's younger cousin. As soon as I saw the thumbnail my hands were shaking. This video was a treat. Brought back memories of diagnosing in the field and bodging on-the-spot repairs. Beautiful old school engineering. These devices really have a soul. Just superb. Thanks a bunch, Dave!

[@DIYTAO]

With all pots, filters, VCA:s and opamps, wire looms it migh contain a nice set of parts for making an analog synth.

[@josiahlee1982]

Or the worlds most complex fuzz pedal ever created.

[@jordangunit3078]

I'd love to see/hear you tear down/analyze a studio quality ultra discreet recording console. Something like API/NEVE/ SSL. The electronic engineering that goes into making them extremely efficient and quiet audio path's would be such a cool concept to see you explain. I am an audio engineer and merely a hobbyist at electronics. Love your vids. Thanks! -Jordan

[@Thesignalpath]

KNOBS! KNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOBS! Cracked me up. :)

[@EEVblog]

+The Signal Path Blog Knobs are exciting!

[@Subparanon]

+The Signal Path Blog He layed down on a bed of knobs and none poked him hard enough to break. ^_^

[@MrChief101]

+The Signal Path Blog Me, as well! Pretty much my internal moaning when I'm around big switch panels. Dave's a very funny fellow-- in a serious way!

[@Nighthawke70]

+EEVblog Don't you DARE let your wife see this! She may start questioning your sanity, or worse! XDD

[@artcarsnguitarsAdamS]

+Sean Buckwell I was going to say, no wonder he's tearing it down, there's a strange noise coming from that one master knob. wah wah wahhhhh..

[@theteenageengineer]

These things are really impressive I've been working with analog audio consoles for most of my life but these things are being phased out for digital consoles which are smaller, can handle more channels and have some really cool features. But analog consoles are still the way to go if you want cheap. Yamaha's flagship digital console the CL5 retails for $26,000 US dollars and its little brother the QL5 retails for $16,000, you can get an analog console for so much cheaper. The other thing to keep in mind here is servicablity, this thing was designed to be serviced by roadies because they don't have time to have a piece of equipment down for weeks due to repair. This way they can quickly replace a module and do regular maintnce in 1 to 2 hours rather than 1 to 2 weeks. The parts are very likey made by JRC since that was Yamaha's go to supplier for things of this era. The CL5 and QL5 take inspiration from this console with the matrix system. Normally analog audio consoles indivual channel knobs go as follows: Gain, AUX send 1-4 and somtimes 5 and 6, High EQ, High Mid EQ, Low Mid EQ, Low EQ, Pan, and then mute, fader and fader send. AUX sends are just a way to send audio to another source becides the main output, and they can be either pre fader or post fader, pre fader meaning that the signal leaves the AUX send before it goes to the fader and post fader meaning it leaves the AUX send after it leaves the fader.

[@c.m.bigbee6115]

I have the baby brother to this console (mc2403) and was incredibly interested in this video. It is so neat to have someone who really understands electronics dissecting the various functions even when he has no clue how to use, or even the purpose of some of the parts. Amazing, now I want to experiment with my own board more.

[@stevenallen512]

Loved this video. Many of your videos go right over my head, but with this one I found myself yelling at the screen trying to tell you what stuff was and why it was like that. I do live sound (not to mention lighting, etc), I'd really like to see your reaction to the insides of some other consoles. There is a BIG reason having things modular is key, if something dies before a show or during a show and you NEED it, it is not unheard of to open up the console and start having at it, swapping parts, making spot repairs at the component level even. I remember killing a section of a console mid-show (at a music festival) during a small act to repair a section of the console live. Had consoles open mid show far too many times.

[@EEVblog]

+Steven Allen Live on-site repair during a show, awesome!

[@stevenallen512]

EEVblog yes indeed. Gotta do our best to make sure the show goes on! Thank god the better consoles are very modular. A soldering iron inside a console on site is a bit of a nerve racking thing I'd say.

[@PrinceWesterburg]

+Steven Allen You should get a fake pair of legs (i.e. jeans bottoms and boots), lift a section and stuff that in. Any one complains just say "The guys in there now working on it!"

[@MetalDEmpire]

+Steven Allen As an Audio Engineer myself, its really interesting to see the internals of a board, although I cringed at the idea of tearing a board apart. Regardless, cool to know the things buried within!

[@stevenallen512]

45redrooster Completely agree... I have an old Soundcraft Spirit Studio that I've had to tear apart to get working fully again. Too bad the thing was way too much of a pain in the butt to transport most of the time for me lol

[@Elfnetdesigns]

The arrays above the channel gain sliders are for individual monitor levels. The talk-back is so the board operator can talk through the PA system to the crew or to the performers during rehearsals . Talk-back is not widely used anymore except in garage / bar bands where the musicians are all sound engineers lol, and has been replaces by portable two-way radios. Performers no longer call the shots on how a system is mixed and EQ'ed either like they use to, it is all on the ears of the tech, like it should be.. That sports venue got the hard metal shaft from the sound company who sold them that thing, EPIC OVERKILL

[@TheCubus95]

Hi Dave! It seems you can read in my mind! Im sound engineer on live events and about 4 days ago i was looking on your channel for "mixing console teardown" -presumably Tuesday :P. And now you're publishing exactly what i was trying to find. Thanks for your videos i've learned tons of knolwedge. Thank you again!

[@Geoxor]

I feel special because i know what everything does xD

[@lolzlarkin3059]

+Geoxor Well, once you know how to use everything on channel 1, you basically know how 90% of it works.

[@abcefg3813]

+Geoxor me to mate

[@Geoxor]

lolz larkin yup :P i know how they work cus i produce music and the terms that the mixer has writen on it is oftenly used in DAWs (Digital audio workspace) (aka music making program :P)

[@xyanide1986]

+Geoxor Good boy. I was trained to use recording studios and couldn't find a job so I got an electrical engineering degree instead.

[@slowgold20]

+Geoxor Yea :P Finally not everything on Dave's channel goes over my head XD

[@tiltedstudio]

VCA = Voltage Controlled Amplifier. In this mixer, this facilitates mixing multiple channels using a single fader. Helpful for grouping drums, etc.

[@erikdravn]

I'm a live sound audio engineer. This was better than porn to me!!! :)

[@tubical71]

+erikdravn me too in the past, reminds me of the days where i used to do FOH....I used these consoles...:)

[@Txmj122]

12 hours + per week combined at my church for The past 4 or 5 years. It's a thankless job isn't it? Good to see another member of the “club”

[@IanScottJohnston]

Loved this also, takes me back, I gave up FOH mixing 5 or 6 years ago (Nexo, Crown, Allen & Heath).

[@jtn191]

+UNENSLAVER haha, same here. nice to hear Dave figure out my domain

[@Subparanon]

+erikdravn I thought I was watching snuff porn though. He said they put it back together when they were done so it's cool.

[@1a3b5c7d8e]

ST = Stereo Insert = Place an external bit of equipment in line with whats in already. Dave if you've got any questions just ask, my job is to operate them.

[@hingeslevers]

+Cameron Marks I have a suspicion that you're not the only sound engineer in this crowd ;)

[@Foxwolf9Tails]

+hingeslevers Oh, he's not, I am as well.

[@lightaces]

+hingeslevers Well, I'm a former, but yeah, definitely not.

[@getrolli469]

+hingeslevers I played with Winamp equalizer plugin in the 90s, does that count ?!

[@getrolli469]

+Ge Trolli sure

[@mikeselectricstuff]

I'd thin that big-ass ground strapping is more about signal integrity than current

[@EEVblog]

+mikeselectricstuff Well, yes, not actual current handling ability, as we are only talking a few amps which a connector pin or two could handle. But getting extremely low drop over big distances at those currents requires those big strappings for low impedance.

[@WouterWeggelaar]

+EEVblog They are indeed there for signal integrity. My Allen&Heath mixer has one big strip going along the whole board (only 24 channels).

+mikeselectricstuff You are alright Mike, and to avoid ground loops too.

[@Si1983h]

+Wouter Weggelaar And I'd much rather have the Allen & Heath too. Much better sounding and better built desks than Yamaha. At this level the boards should all be fibreglass and all sliders and pots should me mounted on discreet channel strips for serviceability.

[@cnvogel]

+mikeselectricstuff If you look into the service manual the big copper strapping is labeled "SUM-GND". It's not only the power-return but also the reference voltage for the busses (the summing junction). Some boards do the sensible thing and have separate ground-reference pins on their bus connectors, thereby decoupling power distribution from the signal-reference. But probably copper was much cheaper when this board was built ;-).

[@phillipbartlett1819]

I never get tired of watching you tear things apart explaining how it works.

[@mrpnzl]

Hi Dave, the SSM2018 is made by Analog Devices and is a Trimless Voltage Controlled Amplifier. I had a friend that was into designing custom audio equipment so I recognized the part number. Really enjoyed the teardown, don't often get to see gear bigger than yourself!

[@upstageshowsystems]

These consoles though they look quite impressive were built as a low cost alternative to there PM series (PM4000) which were one of the industry standard touring desks.

[@tubical71]

What a great thing for a teardown.....Thanx Dave!!! I used to work with a little brother with 32ch into 16ch sub into 2ch main out with lots of subOutd for stage monitoring and effects... YM-consoles always done a good job, when I worked on and with them, especially in live situations where a clear routing is essential.. What a nice thing to see one if them here! :)

[@qwertyFUBAR]

Having worked a PM1000 16x4 I can attest these are sweet machines in every possible way. Smooth sliders with rubber rollers on the back, contoured knobs you can tweak in the dark with full confidence, not many machines out there you can operate completely by touch like these.

[@7head7metal7]

You can't imagine, how excited I am to watch this video! I'm sort of a selfmade Audio Engineer, and love to tear down my equipment, repair it or develop my own stuff. This is so inspiring! My Yamaha 01V Digital Mixer was really nice to tear down, Yamaha clearly knows how to make their stuff servicable. really nice system engineering! This bad boy on the other hand looks a lot more challenging :D At that size it's really hard to make it servicable. The phantom power caps where the only part that died so far in my 01V, they were only rated for about 50V, sadly that seems to be "okay" to save cost. The SILs from JRC are often used in Yamaha mixers I saw so far, they seem to prever SIL-packages, e.g. for their DM2000 digital console. 5532 are not that often used there, I guess, maybe for saving space. For me personally, this was one of your most interesting videos, even without you knowing everything about it while filming. Thank you, I really liked it!

[@lightaces]

I learned live mixing on this thing's big brother, the PM3000 (and later, the next generation PM4000). The PM's are even more modular, in that each individual channel can come out and be replaced on it's own, and you can get mono or stereo modules. The Matrix sends are used for a lot of things; sends to time based effects (reverb, delay, etc.), monitor mixers so the players on stage can hear each other, delay clusters (speaker clusters placed further back in the room, and delayed to match the mains - this is to fill dead spots in the room, and is pretty uncommon these days, as everyone else seems to love line arrays), and sub-mixing things like drum sets (though on a console like this, you are more likely to use the VCA's). VCA's are control groups. You assign the individual channels to the central VCA faders, and you can control the channels in groups. They have VCA group mutes as well. On this generation, the scene memories usually just dealt with the VCA groups. So, you mix the drums, and assign them all to (say) VCA 1, and you can control the overall drum level with one fader. You can also use one of the matrix busses for this, but the extra summing will usually add more noise than you really want. The stereo channels are mostly used for effects returns. Inserts are for amplitude effects (compression, mostly, and noise gates). The mic input in the mains section (the center section) is for a talk back mic, so you can communicate with the stage during sound check. 40 channels of noise (and 20 mix busses) adds up quickly - the shielding on the relays is not optional! Keeping the noise floor below 90dB is tough! That's a big part of the external power supply too - internal power supplies just don't work on boards this big!!! Yamaha boards have a mixed reputation - some people love them, because they are very clean, and basically do exactly what you tell them to, with out coloring the sound. The EQ's are considered by many sound engineers to be rather sterile. I tend to think it is just a matter of preference. I think they sound great for jazz, classical, or corporate talk talk gigs. Not great for rock and roll, though! What they really do, though, is expose the mixer's skill level - you get out what you put in, and if you know what you are doing it will do exactly what you tell it to do. A lot less forgiving than some boards if you aren't so skilled! It's not a baby, but it is a mid-level professional console, and a 20-30 year old design at that. These days, everything is digital, and EVERY promoter is constantly arguing for smaller and smaller footprints at front of house. Still, back in the day, those boards probably did more events than any of the higher end consoles, and while they are not quite as versatile as a 4k or Midas XL4, it probably cost about a quarter of the cash, and they sound pretty decent.

[@BenFranske]

The good old days with the PM4000 when you had to tear out the channel strips between songs and hose them down with contact cleaner...

[@lightaces]

Regular scheduled maintenance, my friend, regular scheduled maintenance. We used to clean our patch bays every six months. Sure, it's a pain, but it sure helps avoid problems.

[@TheBrightPixel]

For someone who has no idea how this works going in, you did pretty damn good job of figuring most of it out. Really enjoyed this vid!

[@EEVblog]

+The Bright Pixel Thanks.

[@MsHUGSaLOT]

another reason to shield those relays is to not cause noise inducting into the audio channels. clicks, pops, and interruptions.

[@kurtstabel9674]

Great teardown, moooore. Who needs TV, when we have Dave and Dave? :)

[@makestufflearnstuff2386]

Worked on pro audio/video in a previous life. These units were well built and a joy to work on. Great vid as always.

[@cdw4255]

That's an entry level, very entry level, touring desk. The upper end consoles have individual modules that you can remove on a singular basis for repair, replacement, or even reconfiguration.

[@SonicOrbStudios]

That is one sexy mixing console, gotta love Yamaha mixers!

[@Willam_J]

I just picked up a 16 channel Tascam recording board today for some small home recording projects. The guy I bought it from purchased it brand new in 2011, opened the box to make sure that everything was there and then never got around to using it. When I say this thing is in brand new condition, I'm not kidding. The plastic bag covering it was still taped closed and the power supply cables still had those twisty things on them to keep them bundled. The best part..... I got it for $65 US. (Deal of the century!) I was feeling pretty good about my new board until I clicked on this video. Now I want to go kick it. LOL I'll just go play with some faders on my 32 chan live board to make myself feel better. :-)

[@jellybean7253]

Three years late here, but... It was fun to see this blast from the past. In my career I kind of skipped right over the 3000 series and went from the 2K to the 4K and then the 5K. Now, of course, everything is digital and these old workhorses are rarely seen. Anyhow, it was really fun to read all the comments about what this and that does. We used to take the opener's console into the sub-in's so that we could use the same monitors while keeping the opening band engineers from messing up our mix on the headliners console. Inserts on the outputs were, 99% of the time, used for EQ's to keep the feedback to a minimum. As far as inserts on the inputs, I saw a lot of people here that had "absolute" ideas about how dynamics, eq, and effects should be handled. I'm guessing they are pretty linear thinkers. I would suggest that they open their minds to the endless ways of making sound great (again!) Sorry! Couldn't help myself... I will tell you that I have seen every variation on a theme that you could think of with inserts and how to use them. There is no wrong way to do things if it works for you and your artist. Thanks Dave. Great stuff.

[@Subparanon]

The insert jack on each channel is a TRS (tip, ring, sleeve) connection that allows a single cable to be both input and output. You use them to send a channel to an effects chain and then loop it back into the mixer. It's like a stereo headphone connector with one channel being an output, and one being an input.

[@theLuigiFan0007Productions]

That 7805 5V rail made me smile. Simplicity at it's finest. But really, I gotta say, this thing has some seriously complex analog mixing circuitry put into it. Very well engineered. Seems fairly straightforward to service as well. +1 to Yamaha. Yamaha FTW!

[@djhenjin3425]

Dave: in the master section where you mentioned that the board to board interconnects are not continued on the right edge of the board, had you looked up at the master section you would have seen that there is a board which hangs down into that space. and as such it was for clearance. if it was not for clearance I would think the copper bus bar would have been straight across rather than dipped way below the boards.

[@EEVblog]

+David Nelson Ah, ok, of course!

[@tacojiminez7243]

+David Nelson It's also likely that the board was designed for multiple form factors. Mixers tend to be pretty modular in construction, as this video demonstrates really well.

[@ickipoo]

Looks to me like the board that hangs down is the scene logic - potentially the bus board came from an older model without scene control.

[@stonail665]

That's what I needed: Top tier teardown.

[@RODALCO2007]

Interesting video, very nicely built device. Thanks for showing.

[@yabgu79]

This would be the best answer to "why digital" questions

[@mrjazzycharon2]

I agree!

[@asdf155]

+Abdurrahim Cakar Also analog EQ creates phase shifts between different frequencies leading to quite a bit of distortion if not compensated properly. You don't have that effect in a digital mixer. Width 24 bit resolution and 96 kHz sample rate being standard you don't have any noticeable signal degradation due to the digitization itself.

[@AAAZ2A]

+Abdurrahim Cakar I'd exchange my laptop for one of these any day :)

[@janvomocil4534]

why digital ? "every idiot can count to one"!! :DD

[@MrTridac]

+Jan Vomočil Why Digital ? Because there's no room for noise between 0 and 1 !!

[@slowgold20]

I find its usually the mute buttons that go first... some guys just hammer down on those and they just die

[@skuker]

+Julian Amrine It's usually the pot's that go first on yamaha's they get nice and scratchy, a couple twists and they're usually fine

[@lightaces]

+Scott Kuker Not if you keep on top of your scheduled maintenance. The PM3K I learned on was 20 years old, with about 200-250 shows a year, and had most of it's original faders, and none of them were scratchy. The ones which were replaced were because the whole channel had been replaced, usually because of a bad pot or VCA. Clean and lube your faders every year or so!

[@bigredlevy]

+Scott Kuker spray deoxit (electrical contact cleaner) into your pots and switches. just dont use on faders, as they are open and attract dust.

[@djscrizzle]

Even better, use the liquids CaigLube/DeOxit! F5 and DeOxIt! 100% that comes in the bottle with the brush/needle tip. That way, you're not putting chemical where it's not needed. Less waste = more useful product.

[@rosendigitalaudioinc.3953]

Hey Dave, Coming from a synth world, that SSM chip is a VCA chip. SSM made many DIP package solutions to common circuits in music electronics. Most notably, SSM made oscillators and filters that were used in many famous synthesizers such as the Korg Polysix and Sequential Circuits Prophet 5 Rev 2. Along with SSM, Curtis Electro Music (CEM) also made similar chips that often replaced the SSM chips in later model revisions. Would be cool to see a synthesizer teardown from you!

[@ym160]

When I was a senior in high school my buddy asked me to help do the mixing of the school play and I get there that night and none of the other sound guys could make it. I had to learn how to use that machine and mix everyone on stage and the pit band, which is a job meant for 3 people.

[@clementcarriol3912]

Insert I/O = INSERT In & OUT. Use a TRS ---> TS/TS . TRS jack goes into the insert plug at the back of your consol and the 2 TS jacks go into INPUT & OUTPUT of your external device ( Noise gate, compressor, or whatever you want in your channel path)

[@ok_engineer]

The relays are for the "scene" feature. Scene allows you to create, well, scenes with certain channels muted or open. By switching to the next scene, specified channels are muted or unmuted.

[@helldriver85]

With the "scene memory" you can program mute scenes, so you recall which channel is muted which unmuted. Same works with mute groups, you can mute/unmute multiply channels using one button

[@Entarra]

Such a gorgeous piece of tech, if bloody massive

[@AriannaEuryaleMusic]

Dissection of the Mixing console of my dreams.. Yep The knobs are hypnotizing.

[@PiddeBas]

Awesome video Dave, your efforts are appreciated! :)

[@whitcwa]

You're right about fader maintenance. We had a 64 fader SSL console which needed fader service after ten years. Electrically, they were fine, but they started to stick slightly. Each week, I would remove a few of the Penny & Giles faders, disassemble, clean, lube, reassemble, test and reinstall them. It took about 2 hours for each.

[@EEVblog]

+Chris W Each week?!

[@whitcwa]

I only did a few faders each week. It took many months to complete.

[@hydrolisk1792]

Always wanted to take one of those apart and see how it worked :) Cheers mate for the video!!! I could build so much stuff with that thing.

[@Giuseppe86]

From what I've read about this thing, the M3000 was pretty much a POS for any sort of serious professional use. I read on a forum that many larger acts specifically mentioned that they would refuse to play if the venue only had an M3000 on hand. Still it was probably good enough for a certain uses where sound quality isn't that important (like a sporting venue) or for a small gig on a tight budget.

[@sea-ferring]

I have used this console many times. M1-M16 are mix busses, not matrices. On this console, the matrices are created (mostly) from the mix busses. Every manufacturer configures matrices differently. ST channels are stereo channels with minimal EQ and routing used for pre-recorded music sources. It's a decent enough console. The previous generations of Yamaha consoles like the PM1000 are quite sought after because the preamps are class A discrete. They have been referred to as "Japanese Neve".

[@stonehartfloydfan]

I know that desk very well.. I trained on a PM3000 back in the 90's and used the M3000 often enough over the years ... seeing this makes me feel kind of old lol

[@PeterCCamilleri]

I think the relays are shielded to prevent the switching magnetic fields from inducing pulses of current into the signal path of nearby wires.

[@ydonl]

I would think a small click in a signal being amplified by tens of thousands of watts and pumped through scores of speakers might be a life-changing experience.

[@Nicos_archive]

I had a 48 channel analog mixing console once. I used it for Skype. :/

[@macarena3184]

I love how for the first time, I know more about a product on the EEV-Blog than Dave. At least about how you use it ;)

[@DragonworksProductions]

when the video first started, I thought, that's small then Dave pops up then mind blown, that's huge!

[@AndyMac]

Best. Teardown. Ever! I actually understood most of it for once! :-)

[@McErer]

KNOBS!!! As a sound engineer this teardown almost made me cry ;)

[@ppdan]

Yeah, was also my first thought but when I saw how "crusty" those faders look (pots have probably also had it), this console should have been retired a while ago and wasn't worth it anymore (at least not in that price range)

[@HiHo232]

The craziest thing about this whole teardown is that an inexpensive (in a relative sense) digital board like the Behringer X32 does a much as this board and a whole lot more with better specs and full storage and recall of EVERY setting with motorized faders and takes up about a third of the space. That's not to mention that the need for most outboard gear is eliminated because EQ's, effects, and all that stuff is built in. I would never want to go back to working on an analog console after using a digital console for the past three years. I would love to see a teardown of something like the X32 as I believe Behringer has come a long way in improving the quality of their products and it would be interesting to see what Dave thought about it.

[@BenFranske]

The sound quality is better on an X32 but the build quality is much worse and I say that as a happy x32 owner. You can't compare the quality of a real digital encoder fader module like an Alps (used by Yamaha on their digital consoles) with the cheap open frame ones on an x32.

[@benballard7521]

Jackson Linder Yeah but gotta love the old analogue desks. They were/are great.

[@InteliWasp]

The split in the bus board is the traditional right side end to a mixer, so the channels to the right are addons.

[@Georges3DPrinters]

that little weird stop with the bottom board and the bends in ground strap and wires is only for clearance of the board that you swung up.

[@wdavem]

Glad to see you used your skin's 'snapshot learn/store' function to capture all the knob and fader settings before you took it apart.

[@andersevenrud]

Looks like the price ranges from 1500 - 15000 EUR used (there's a few models with different channel counts).

[@MaxKoschuh]

+Anders Evenrud: these desks sell for approx. 1000 Euro her ein Europe (sometimes even cheaper)

[@xyanide1986]

+Max Koschuh That's not bad at all! With power supplies?

[@asdf155]

+Anders Evenrud Look for the A model. It has some fixes (like LEDs on the PFL buttons). For 1000€ or less it might be ok, but I'm sure there are better options, depending on your requirements and your ability to fix the thing as some part will certainly fail.

[@AlexanderBrevig]

+Anders Evenrud anyone of a sane mind would buy a digital mixing console if working with that many tracks :) My mixer is about 1/3rd of the size and can mix twice the number of tracks. The only real reason to get a huge analog desk is for recording purposes, if one is (for some reason) in love with the preamps that come with it. For instance a Neve desk from the good old days. Personally I'd go for a modern set of transparent preamps from a brand name. They will be so close in spec (and so transparent) that any will do :) [also, did not realize you watch EEVBlog, nice to see you here]

[@slowgold20]

+spookanide They are a little obsolete... If you're dying to go analogue save up for something nicer.

[@shelvacu]

"That ones upside down. all the electrons are gonna fall out" HAhahah! I love your little jokes like this.

[@CSO3DOnline]

dat tripod fail priceless 😂

[@MaxKoschuh]

+~☆ XzCraftP ☺♂ reminds me on scary movie: "One day I will build my own tripods,.... with four legs"

[@jordanjohnson714]

+Max Koschuh Then it wouldn't be a tripod, rather a quadpod

[@aserta]

+~☆ XzCraftP ☺♂ Someone send Dave one of these i.imgur.com/l73a4wu.jpg

[@jope7137]

+Jordan Johnson (Mighty Burger) That's the core of the joke.

[@PeterWalkerHP16c]

In 1986 I built the (Jaycar?) 16 channel mixer kit. Boy, was that ever a job of work. Used with a couple of 300W MOSFET power amp kits also from Jaycar. Once debugged, it wasn't a bad piece of kit.

[@electronicsNmore]

That is one big mixing console. It is rare to see you that far away from the camera. :-) A lot of work went into wiring that up.

[@QR_Code]

dave the mix inserts are to "patch in" outboard gear..mainly dynamics processing like compressors, etc

[@jj74qformerlyjailbreak3]

I’m making my own sound. My own music. My own creativity. Having something like this to use or completely harvest parts from would make my Thinker Tickle.

[@johnparker7299]

Thanks, I've picked one up and doing some service work on it now.

[@lucianoalberto4760]

Had two 24ch analog board before we went to pro tools and their consoles, the PSU was serious business! Rackmount like you said, a huge monster. A diode kept burning out every now and then and it needed to be repaired. That 40 channel one must be an even bigger monster :O

[@PeterWalkerHP16c]

+Luciano Alberto That Pro Tools S5 Fusion desk doesn't look a whole lot smaller !! :-)

[@emprsnm9903]

Neat teardown Dave! Thinking it over, a power supply for it wouldn't be too hard to cludge together. The power requirements aren't ridiculous. Hope it found a good home and not the scrap, as with that many channels, it was mostly still in woking order I'd wager. And only ~15yo. My Yamaha Clavinova is older, and going strong!

[@somethingelse2lookat502]

That was fascinating. Just as complex as one might think they are inside.

[@Jeff-Russ]

Wow an SSM2018 VCA. SSM = Solid State Micro Technology for Music. They made IC's for synthesizers in the late 70's and most became "obsolete" in the 80's with CEM (Curtis Electromusic). SSM was bought out by PMI, which in turn was acquired by Analog Devices, hence the logo.

[@chrispychickin]

SIP parts are super common in Japanese-made audio gear from the 80's to early 2000's. They make for smaller, neater layouts, and usually have higher power dissipation. As for the NJM2068, very common part in line level applications. Rather low noise, and not too high cost. They're comparable to a 5532 in most respects, but cheaper for a Japanese company to get ahold of, if they were to manufacture the device in Japan. What a super cool teardown, I love professional quality audio gear!

[@petersage5157]

Disregarding stereo, it's actually mixed to two buses - house sound and foldback monitors. If you must include stereo, then you must also include multiple foldback monitors, so it can easily get a bit complicated if the lead guitarist and vocalist and rhythm guitarist need separate foldbacks, which is where the matrices come in.

[@filipenicoli_]

Hey Dave. How did engineers design these sort of things in the pre-CAE era? Did computers served PCB design since the beginning? What's your experience? How it was done on the 80's?

[@cabanelas]

Take into consideration that this is normally operated in conjunction with light gear. Dimmers cause a huge interference into audio gear, so those shields all around have some reason.

[@fredyearian4968]

The relays are shielded magnetically to avoid magnetic coupling into the circuitry at the low signal levels found in these mixers. The transients would couple into the audio. You can bet this was a "fix" that was required after production.

[@CameronHeard]

It's funny to see how these big guys have been replaced by things as small as the X32 by Behringer. But the x32 does loads of good on the ol' back! (Seasonal job is a Live Sound Engineer)

[@saberpeep]

I love these big teardowns

[@wadehicks9270]

That's huge wow!! I serviced one that I don't recall how many ch it was I think either 28 or 38 it's been a long time ago. It was at a big Baptist church I went picked it up for service. Had broke connections on the sliders where they were putting their weight on the controls hooking stuff up in the back of it Lotta contact cleaner went into that thing.

[@coriscotupi]

I've seen mixing radio station consoles that don't use resistive sliders. Instead, the slider knob carries a magnet that determines which of a series of reed relays should be closed and the console's logic goes on from there to decide the appropriate value from a resistor bank for fading or mixing. This setup provides a discrete, limited number of fade values (some 50 IIRC) as opposed to an infinite, continuous fading, but OTOH it has a much greater maintenance-free service life than slider pots. Probably not good enough for studio but radio stations loved the idea.

[@qwertyasdf66]

+corisco tupi Interesting. I believe the crossfader on decent DJ mixers is optical in some way. But that's mainly to allow it to be very free of friction and thus easy to move fast.

[@coriscotupi]

Halojen Cool how there is always someone thinking of better ways to do things.

[@kporter85db]

I used to mix front of house on the 56 channel version of that 10+ years ago.

[@kporter85db]

Ours had another 8 channel bank each to the left and right of the center.

[@kporter85db]

I believe we paid around 15k for it in the very early 2000's.

[@asdf155]

+Ken Porter Were you happy with that thing?

[@asdf155]

blitzwing1 This thing here is not a studio mixer, it is for live mixing. For professional live environments, analog console are no longer used, as good modern digital ones are better in almost any regards. For recording, huge incredible expensive analog mixing desks (with digital controls) have their place in top end studios.

[@LemmingGoBoom]

+blitzwing1 A lot of the desks nowadays are software driven, but there's still no replacement for a huge bank of knobs and sliders to allow you to easily and rapidly set levels. Some of the more modern desks are basically a digital interface to a digital mixing setup, but most desks are still primarily analog mixing.

[@RonLaws]

@EEVBlog the Shielding on the relays is most likely to prevent RF noise (or clicks) from being picked up on the audio channels and affecting the overall sound quality, since it is analogue. :)

[@faultylee]

The reason why the center board didn't extend to the edge is to accommodate the vertical boards from above, can be seen @37:12

[@Geeky907]

Dave, Many of thease boards are CTO, so there's alot of "Modularity" to them, I've seen that same board witthout the channels to the right of the master section. That yamaha is actually one of the "BMW's of its age" Although very clean sounding board, not very complex in comparison to others in its same vintage. even for a FOH board. There's even Field retrofit kits for some consoles to allow you to move your mains section around in the frame or to add aditional features. Great tear-down tho.... Love to see ya tear its powersupply apart.... those things were EPIC

[@Shawn_White]

I thought that was on your bench until you jumped up behind it. Man that thing's huge.

[@soundrecordings2659]

The smaller PCB size is probably due to component sharing between different size/feature mixers. Back then the M3000 was part of a family of mixing consoles.

[@RobiSydney]

I've worked on a M5000 with the motor driven sliders. BIG board!

[@matthewcreelman2736]

The SSM2018 is a VCA (Voltage controlled Amplifier). I work on Analog Synth Keyboards that use other SSM chips

[@djrobwilliam1673]

love this one.. please do some more on musical equipment.

[@travis4798]

Yamaha quality right there! Note the string wrapped wires. :P The 48 volts I assume is for non powered mics. You could also clean up the sliders and sell it for around $1,000 (or aussie equivalent). Wouldn't even have to take it apart again just get yourself a vacuum, suck up the dust and spray each slider with some deoxit. The potentiometers rarely ever get dust in them because the knobs are almost strait up.

[@marcop8273]

This seems my (old) Hill Audio Multimix mixer i'm using for recordings. They are awesome built, and they are built for lasting and easy maintenance (if you have an issue with one channel, you can simply remove the channel, without have to remove everything else).

[@Audio_Simon]

That Analog Devices chip ssm2018 will be a balanced to singe-ended converter or vice vera with laser trimmed resistors for optimum common mode rejection / phase balance. The grounding is the amazing this in kit like this! Keeping every signal route clean with noise -100dB is not trivial even with far simpiler circuits.

[@StevenSwensonCtiGeek]

I think the gap to the right of the main PCB is for thermal expansion, which is why the copper doesn't go straight across.

[@CH_Pechiar]

No size problem with the heatsink size of the 7805!

[@ethanpoole3443]

Size, no, but the sheet metal thickness greatly limits how efficiently heat can be conducted away (particularly in the case of a steel chassis). But for a lightly loaded 7805 the chassis is perfectly adequate.

[@harrkev]

The relay magnetic shield -- I would guess to keep the relay coil from inducing clicks on the audio channels as it is energized or de-energized.