EFE - SOUTHERN "BOOSTER" 20002 (with sound) : REVIEW

[@John_Grole]

Another excellent review from Melchester. Adds history to the technical information and running experience. Really helpful to modellers. Many thanks.🙂

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks for watching and glad you enjoyed the historical element too - I enjoyed researching it.

[@Gscalenut]

Finally someone willing to criticise this model for its flaws. My two have the same defects which the researcher defines as "minor manufacturing issues..................... affecting very few models".

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks for watching. I suspect the "manufacturing issues" are probably fairly widespread.

[@andrewcalladine2507]

great review, it amazes me that they don't test some of these locos on different track layouts prior to signing off the EP.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks, certainly seems to be a lack of quality control.

[@ModelRailwaysUnlimited]

Hi Chris, great stuff. Thanks very much for the link. I'm sure the metal e-clips will help you, mine has run faultlessly since I put them on and my track is terrible compared to yours. Take care. Mike

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks Mike, I'm looking forward to trying them. I've just watched Chadwick's video on the Accurascale 37, and he had a very similar bogie issue.

[@stretchedits]

Hi Chris, a really lovely look at something I'd never seen before, so I really enjoyed the prototype information in your video. As I understand it, the idea behind the EFE brand is a collection of models originally made by a third party, like Kernow models in this case..... The J94 0-6-0T by DJ models is another, were Bachmann has bought the molds and manufactured them but they aren't Bachmann designs in origin. So they probably have a Bachmann mechanism including stiffer bogies instead of Kernows original floating bogie like your 1-Co Co-1. I notice that loco actually had the same bogie design as the Accurascale Deltic and Class 37 which you had issues with. Your booster locos have the Bachmann rigid design with more float in the axles, but it's quite a long wheelbase bogie, so maybe that doesn't help. It seems to me your only having derailment issues at the one spot, I may be wrong but that's how it appears watching the video. I didn't realise you had super-elevated your curves when you layed the track, this may account for your issues as I had the same with one curve on my own layout. I raised the outer rail by only 1mm, but the trick is not to return to level too quickly as that can unbalance the bogie as it comes round the corner. The end of the curve is really close to the point so maybe that's not helping. You probably know this already so ignore what I just said! Oh also did you end up with two working speakers on the loco as your sound chip came with one attached, ESU chips do come with a speaker fitted as standard, by the way. Just curious! All the best and thanks for a great video, Dave.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Great assessment Dave of the issues, I will go back and check the Deltic bogies again now you've told me about the similar design. It's only these two loco's that have ever derailed at this spot, and I did end the super elevated rail before the end of the curve. Like you, mine was only the thickness of a couple of layers of very thin cork, so the effect is very subtle - if noticeable at all. The sound chip came with speaker casing attached, but nothing that actually looked like a speaker, so I assumed the purpose was because the wires had to be attached to something, so I left it on - Charlie at DC kits said I could break it off if I wanted, but I kept it on just in case. Thanks very much for watching.

[@stretchedits]

@@melchestermodelrailway The Accurascale Deltic bogie is similar in design to the Kernow 1-Co Co-1. Your Booster loco is similar to the Bachmann Co Co locos like the Class 47. It probably has a Bachmann mechanism. The ESU decoder had a SugarCube speaker attached, I find them quite good, you have to build up the sound box on the back using the kit that comes with it, I used superglue to glue it up, in order to get a decent sound level. I was curious if you had both the loco fitted speaker and the small one working? Your super-elevated track does look very subtle, I never noticed it until you said in the video. From my own experiments I think I raised the rail by 0.5mm for about half a loco length so about 120 to 150 mm before going to 1mm for the curve and then the same as the curve transitioned back to straight. I did try to have about a loco length of straight track before encountering any pointwork, just to be safe. The only loco I had issues with is my Heljan DP2 which derailed half way round a curve later traced to finding a dip in the outer rail at that point allowing the wheel to lift up and ride over the rail. Corrected by wetting the ballast and raising the rail until the ballast glue dried out and set again. Sorry I have gone off on one again. Hope my comments help, it's always nice to share information and tips with fellow modellers. All the best Dave.

[@petersmith4455]

hi there, great video, as a child i remember these locos 20002 and 20003,the sound is about right, great memories of them, ! why the clowns at BR scrapped them i don't know. i have the black version.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Nice to hear about your memory of these loco's. It's a shame they didn't survive longer.

[@PattRail]

It did surprise me that the Co-co locomotive could derail at points too. I have experienced only with steam locos. Thank you for sharing. Both liveries look lovely.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks Patt. Yes I never seem to have an issue with steam locos, just the occasional co co!

[@monsvillerailways5736]

Nice background history. She looks like a bit of weathering is in order? Happy Modelling

[@Shauniboy1984]

Great review - enjoyed the intro as well. Tbh I just shudder at most EFE models, so nothing in any of the reviews on this surprise me

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks, the only other EFE model I have is the Beatie well tank, and I didn't speak too highly of that in my review either. I remember Sam's Trains reffered to EFE as "Ever Failing Engines", although he wasn't too critical of their Booster this time.

[@Shauniboy1984]

@@melchestermodelrailway Ive got the well-tank myself, its got quite poor traction and a bit plastic'y but one thing I would say with lots of running it is now smooth and controllable. Seems the same with this very good in parts and then the usual dissapointments

[@Night_Ferry]

Great video. I am sorry you are having trouble with this and the Deltic. Although that Deltic shot was damned impressive! I have the malachite version and I am happy with it. Too good looking to pass up for me.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed the Deltic crash! I couldn't avoid the malachite one either, I'll have to see if I get the same problem, but haven't had chance to run it yet.

[@bianchikat]

Thanks for that review and I give a sigh of relief as my 20002 derails on a double slip. I haven't fully investigated this yet..tho I did notice the wide play on the centre axles.. I haven't altered the headcode discs so indicate Victoria to Newhaven not sure how this is done as the leaflet says push fit bit I couldnt shift it...look forward to your next review.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Sorry to hear you've had derailments too - I do think it's down to the lack of upward movement in the bogies as well as the wheels. The headcode disks are in quite firmly and I used some rubber tipped tweezers to help get them out, with a bit of a twist.

[@jkirk888]

Wonderful presentation,many thanks.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thank you, glad you enjoyed it.

[@BigBadJohn5358]

Is there actually a place called Melchester?, I remember in the Tiger comic there was Roy of the (Melchester) Rovers, my brother told me there was no such club in real life. Off the subject of football!, it seems the Southern had non-standard vehicles as well as the Great Western with their Warships, Westerns and Hymeks. I think on the Euston lines there was the non-standards numbered 10000 and 10001 and the Class 15 and 16 one-cabbers that didn't last long in service.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Yes the Great Western had more than its fair share of non standard loco's! Roy did play for the Melchester Rovers but I used the name in connection with Thomas Hardy who used it as a fictional name for Salisbury.

[@tenfootvoyager]

Nice review and history. Also initially had Peco point gremlins with my BR green 20002, quite surprised me. Noticed the large side to side movement of all axles and uneven pick up pressures and as you say some not contacting at times. Adjusting all the pickups helped contact/centralise the axles and seems to have (fingers crossed) done the trick. This is a must have loco because I spotted the real 20002 at Norwood Junction many years ago when I was a kid.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks, it was a must have loco for me too - although I never saw the real things. I'm going to try one or two "fixes" that may help iron out my derailment issues.

[@hotdogpilot6319]

Enjoyed your review but it's only reinforced my avoidance of the model. I didn't class it as a "must have" so waited for the reviews. It didn't take very long for the "cracks" to start showing. Great review nonetheless, thanks.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks. Yes, it was a bit of a risky, but felt because Kernow was involved it would be a certainty. Well, it almost was!

[@danielholden-storey5107]

I am unare of any photographic evidence of class 74s being used on Newhaven boat trains partly because the allocated to duties on the SW Division.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

It was possibly only for a very brief period between 66 and 68. The Southern Way book I mention in the video states that "from 1966 onwards work was being lost by the three locomotives, the Newhaven boat trains -for so long their mainstay - were now in the hands of the electro-diesels." ( I assume this was class 74). "In 1968 when the boat trains were resumed after their usual winter break, they were formed of multiple unit stock". Perhaps that accounts for the lack of photographic evidence.

[@danielholden-storey5107]

I would suggest your assumption is incorrect. Class 73s were allocated to Stewart's Lane and many seen at Brighton Lover's Walk) and Three Bridges (yard) in this period. Class 74s were only slowly appearing on the SW Division even after 9th July 1967 and were certainly not at full strength. Therefore it is highly unlikely that a class 74 would have been 'spared' for the Central Division boat trains service especially when a Class 73 was quite capable of dealing with the train.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

The author must have been referring to the 73's then rather than the 74's when describing the electro-diesels that took over the boat trains (he doesn't specify the class) so that would make sense.

[@anfieldroadlayoutintheloft5204]

Cool video

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks Lee.

[@railwaymechanicalengineer4587]

BEST MODELLING MISTAKE EVER ???? At 0:07 approaching the camera we see a 4-vehicle train. Problem is the leading two vehicles are steam "Pull-Push" coaching stock, and behind is a classic Southern Railway 650v EMU, propelling the coaches !! Which is of course totally IMPOSSIBLE in real life for the following reasons !!!!! The (Hornby) Pull-Push 2-car sets were introduced between 1959-61 by BR converting normal Maunsell 57ft mainline coaches. Twenty 2-car sets were introduced, numbered as SETS 600-619. They were designed to work with steam locos fitted for "Auto Train" equipment requiring a "Donkey Pump" for the Pull-Push air control system fitted to the steam loco. Such as locos Class M7 0-4-4-T (available from Hornby) & Class 02 0-4-4-T (from DJ Models). The (Hornby) Maunsell designed 2-car Class 2BIL (2 BI Lavatory) 650v DC third rail units introduced in 1936-38, were intended for "semi-fast" workings on the South Western Division lines electrified in 1936-38. Namely: Waterloo-Reading via Staines. Waterloo-Guildford via Ascot & Aldershot; Waterloo - Woking - Aldershot & Alton line. The 2BIL units could run in formations of up to 12-cars. Post War they spread to numerous other routes including the Central Divisions Brighton lines. These units had one powered motor bogie under the brakevan with just 500hp & a maximum speed of 75mph. Why can't they run together ? The Pull-Push sets being steam hauled coaches had VACUUM brakes, and when propelled had to have an air supply (from the steam locomotives Donkey pump) to operate some of the Drivers controls. All pre-war Southern EMU's used the Westinghouse STRAIGHT AIR BRAKE, (a totally different system to vacuum with a different sized and shaped connection hose between vehicles) so couldn't operate with vacuum braked steam hauled coaches. Further the EMU could only operate in "Multiple" with other similar EMU's (including HAL & SUB types) which had the same type of electrical control system, and electrical jumpers between vehicles. Obviously steam hauled vehicles didn't have electrical jumpers of any sort except a low voltage lighting cable as standard on loco hauled coaching stock. Further these EMU's did NOT have the power to pull or propel non powered vehicles. The whole point of EMU's is that each has just enough power for itself, but as you join more together you also increase the power available in proportion. Which is why EMU's are more economic to operate - no wasted power as in loco hauled trains. One other issue is of course these EMUs couldn't run without a "Third rail" to get the necessary 650v DC, through their pick up shoes, which hung from the "wooden shoe beams" on the outer bogies each end of the unit !!! Happy modelling😊

[@melchestermodelrailway]

Thanks for the interesting explanation, however it wasn't a mistake as I ran this combination on purpose.

[@PeckhamHall]

Super elevation curves, I think this is the route cause of the derailing, not only wearing out the wheel rims like the brakes on a 17 year olds first car.

[@melchestermodelrailway]

It probably has something to do with it, although the degree of elevation on my layout is barely noticeable; nevertheless, it may be enough to tip unyielding models over the edge. Fortunately I've only had two loco's that have been effected - none of which are steam.

[@petes6814]

Correctly applied super elevation actually reduces wear on wheels and rails if speed is at equilibrium to the radius and cant applied. It does however require careful transition design to avoid twists at the start, throughout, and end of the transition.

[@railwaymechanicalengineer4587]

SOUND SYSTEM Doesn't sound remotely like either a Class 70 or 71. They had a lot of electrical humming noises, & of course the humming frequency rose as the locomotives began moving. If they passed you at a station another prominent sound at speed were those heavy 6 wheel bogies thumping as they went over rail joints. The Model sounds more like a whimperish Gas Turbine than any type of Electric loco. HEADCODES Another problem seems to be the confusion over the headcode disc system. The lights were NOT "marker lights" and were only for night time use as the night time route headcode. There were never any headcodes using five or six discs or lights on any Division. The most used was four for for the "Royal Train" which these locos occasionally hauled. Including the Annual Epsom Derby. The Royal train ran from Victoria to Tattenham Corner. The Queen however returned from Epsom by limousine to Windsor Castle usually. OVERHEAD 650V TROLLEY WIRE. Another location that had a lot of overhead trolley wire (there was no Catenary wire) was of course Hither Green, and as that was in the suburban area the voltage was 650v. The "Hornby's" were therefore seen at Hither Green on transfer freights from Norwood Yard fairly regularly.

[@marksinthehouse1968]

Lovely looking model but even at £157.20 you shouldn’t have to modify the bogies it should run ok straight away glad I’ve decided at this time not go get one unless we start sending models back with faults then manufacturers will get away with it even the cavalex 56 is not perfect😮