Elizabeth Holmes: The psychology of a liar

IMPORTANT POINT. Many of the studies referenced in this video come from Dan Ariely's book The Honest Truth About Dishonesty. Since creating this episode some evidence has come out that studies of this type contained false data. None of the studies I referenced have been questioned yet, but it's worth listening to this with scepticism.
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Most of us have heard that Elizabeth Holmes is a pathological liar. How she coned investors out of billions. But few of us know why she did it, why her employees endorsed her and why so many of us believe her.
In this episode of Nudge, I study the psychology behind dishonesty and attempt to reveal the psychology of a liar.
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[@markthompson180]

I'm surprised that video didn't mention the fact that her father worked for Enron, which is another company that became world-famous for its corporate lies. It seems that this sort of thing runs in her family.

[@swiftvaclavikstudio407]

Pretexts ...

[@k.s.h.2455]

Excalty

[@virginiapalau1153]

You learn to be at home

[@ddanusya]

and her grandfather too

[@deepgeny1]

Exactly.... Family of scammers

[@CiprianaLeme]

She appeared in magazine covers and was called a self made billionaire without ever producing a product! It’s incredible. All based on a promise.

[@maureenobrien4807]

LIARS. LIKE THE CONTROLLERS....

[@RonSavage01]

Just Like Obama's Nobel Peace Prize.

[@Venus-gn5oi]

She just revealed actually the incompetence of so many people who call themselves experts and professionals.

[@Venus-gn5oi]

@@GodChild63 Men have been doing since the existence of earth so what’s your point.

[@Venus-gn5oi]

@@GodChild63 Imagine the same for most men on earth.

[@indyj16]

Lies are easy, the truth is hard. Lies get you off the hook, the truth holds you accountable. Lies get you something for free, the truth makes you earn it.

[@CRFSUIGENERIS]

Well said!

[@WH0oo...]

Said in another way, a lie shifts the responsibility of discernment on to others while self preserving the ego of the deceiver, perpetuating a delusional self belief of infallabiliy (hubris).

[@ReadABookAndLearn]

You have it backwards. Being honest makes everything else easy. If you’re lying eventually it’s going to be exposed, especially in business. At some point you have to deliver a product, at which point your dishonesty becomes apparent. Lying simply delays the inevitable. How’d lying workout for Elizabeth? If she had been honest she would be a free woman able to do whatever she wants . Instead, she’s rotting in a jail cell during the prime years of her life. That sounds pretty hard to me.

[@WH0oo...]

@@ReadABookAndLearn the existence of Traitor Trump refutes your assertions.

[@user-iz1pb2sg9f]

@@ReadABookAndLearn What makes you so certain that she went to jail?

[@S_iswatchingyou]

Dan Arielly is no longer a good source as recently he was in a huge scandal for data fabrication, including the studies you mention. Ironically, he is just like Elizabeth and lied and cheated on the topic of lying and cheating. He even supported her by providing explanations for why her behaviour was justified (and by extension, his behaviour).

[@mayealalf4465]

I was looking for this comment. Dan is a liar!

[@sistagalsistagal8136]

And the truth just keeps on coming 😮.

[@Gredos625]

Gracias por la aclaración!!. Importante y conveniente saberlo 🤗

[@qwertyuiop-ke7fs]

Was gonna say, this ages poorly

[@simonf8902]

Who’s is Dan ?

[@energy5289]

Narcissist. Easy! I married one and every word out of his mouth was a lie. Comparing her to the average person who has empathy cheating on an exam is ridiculous. She lied without any empathy for those she harmed. Normal people don't lie when it clearly harms others. She didn't give a hoot about anyone except herself. She did it for power, control and fuel from those around who idolised her and fed her with praise. Her narcissistic grandiosity is clear to see.

[@markturpin5667]

I agree Holmes is a Narcissist of which another absolute (to go with a lack of empathy) is No Remorse.

[@SleepySloth2705]

And greedy AF

[@badouplus1304]

@@markturpin5667 Ian Gibbons suicide clearly demonstrate how much empathy Holmes had, that is, none. She never contacted his wife, instead, Theranos lawyers requested that all Theranos belongings to be returned. Oh yeah, she sent an email that a memorial would be organized but it never happened.

[@mandeedhillon7398]

My thoughts exactly. Elizabeth is a narcissist!!

[@maureenobrien4807]

@@markturpin5667 i

[@aaronjoseph7239]

She is the example of how a lie turns into more and more lies until your entire existance turns into an enormous web of lies.

[@iscreemz4494]

The woman clearly has "Psycho Eyes". She'd give me the freakin creeps.

[@buzzcutbiene2211]

yep, she could act in a Stephen King movie ;)

[@rosebecker2242]

Yes she has a psycho eyes 😂😂😂

[@rosebecker2242]

Greedy people doesn’t care . They only care about money and the power it holds

[@pete6705]

One of the interesting things to me about Elizabeth’s lying, and something that some people don’t realize, is that she was lying about everything from Day 1. As soon as she dropped out of school and started her company she was lying to potential investors and clients, partners, and soon media. Before it was even a blood testing company she was lying about other projects. She never even attempted to make it an honest company, or learn how do business legitimately. Her one and only plan was to fake it and then hopefully make it. You’d think someone would want to learn the business first before trying to find all the loopholes, shortcuts, and ways to cheat. But she went directly to cheating. So as a teenager she had already made lying her big career plan

[@ALT-vz3jn]

Narcissism makes it easy for them. They are legends in their own minds, they think they can do anything and have no issue with lying to get what they want. In her mind, she was so special and so smart she was going to change the world and get rich… Morals/ethics don’t exist for them; she felt her lies were fair game. The end justified the means. Her father was an executive for Enron which collapsed from a massive fraud at the end of the 90’s/early 00’s; she grew up parented by someone who was actively involved in fraud. Lying must be very acceptable at her childhood home. You should do a little research on Enron, it’s scandalous the money they stole from their own employees and investors. The execs emptied their employees entire pension fund…

[@RG-iw7py]

Constant lying, even in unimportant things, is one of 'Narcissistic Red Flags'.

[@picilocarnal]

I am sorry to report that I know people like that in my job. Several people. People like her are way more common than society is willing to admit. Look at Sam Bankman and his parents. It’s no coincidence how closely tied to Stanford they are.😏

[@jauneetbrun]

I think EH also lied to her family and loved ones, and the reason she lied was to explain away her failures, and ultimately for acceptance and validation. She wants others to love her. She needs to feel loved.

[@picilocarnal]

@@jauneetbrun we ALL need or want to be loved. EH’s lying goes beyond the “need” to be loved. It has more to do with greed 💰and lack of empathy for those patients who might have trusted her device. She could have gotten people killed and she didn’t care one bit. That’s a sign of a sociopath. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[@lornarettig3215]

I think she lied to the jury, too. She claimed that the same woman who was very obviously drunk on her own self-importance and giddy with how great she thought she was, was really just a poor innocent pawn of Svengali Balwani. I don't buy it for a second.

[@PungiFungi]

Her lying to the jury is a given. They found her the least credible of everybody who testified during the trial.

[@Toirneachgames]

Neither do I. The testimonies of virtually all ex-Theranos employees indicate that EH was the company's mastermind and had the sole decision-making role. Svengali Balwani had a sort of enforcer role, mostly doing the dirty work (firing and intimidating employees in particular) without her having to get her hands dirty.

[@iJayD]

I don't know whether the research in the book The Honest Truth About Dishonesty has been called in question, but I know Dan Ariely has been accused of fabricating research, which is ironic, given his field of study. Just something to note.

[@ceticobr]

He cheated.

[@JumpCutThis]

The Honest Truth About Dishonesty- I suppose he could have written this in an ironic way, right? Ariely is a complete fraud and fabricated vast amounts of data to make vast amounts of money for vast amounts of celebrity. His hubris was his undoing.

[@davidtatro7457]

I want to say that some college professor was also recently outed for fabricating data in one or more papers or books she had published about lying, and had to resign.

[@merediths2cents]

I once missed a doctor appointment and I told the doctor that I simply forgot. He immediately called his secretary and told her to remove my late fee or my cancel fee. He then told me most people make up excuses and I appreciate your honesty.

[@jackcutler9096]

Even her deep voice was a lie

[@buzzcutbiene2211]

Was it Frank Farian?

[@isakmlster4453]

I remember having heard about this and standing outside a kiosk window, looking at her picture in a magazine and having this gut feeling that 'she just doesn't look right. If it's that easy, why haven't anyone come up with it before? She looks too young, too un-scientist-y. If she really is that smart to have come up with this revolutionary thing, she wouldn't be on the front page of this magazine with those crazy eye. Something's off. So I didn't listen to the news about it anymore, and just waited for the thing to come crashing down.

[@yehmen29]

Pathological liar sums it up. She probably spent her entire childhood honing her skills. She would have made a good real estate agent, financial adviser... or politician.

[@TeeTee-zm2re]

Or journalist

[@jimsilvey5432]

Imagine what would happen if such a person became a President.

[@greenjupiter]

@@Kaw-boy here comes a minion with no braincells functioning properly who doesn't know who to worship who doesn't know who to follow and who doesn't know that he doesn't know shit. Dunning Kruger effect

[@constantined9015]

​@@jimsilvey5432it happened in Greece with the previous prime minister! He even changed his voice like her! Thankfully Greece doesn't weigh too much in international affairs!!!

[@BridgeTROLL777]

Or a lawyer, or a Ceo, or a spokesperson, or marketing chief or a salesperson or etc... lying is a valuable tool..

[@count_bodies_like_sheep9296]

It wasn't just the fact that she was a liar, but she aggressively went after people who she felt were a threat because they called her out on her lives or tried to expose the truth. Ian Gibbons was a chemist who was with Holmes during the early stages of her start up, committed suicide when he was threatened with litigation; Tyler Shultz was an entry-level employee, who noticed problems with the Theranos device, tried to address the problems with Elizabeth herself and wasn't only ignored and shouted down for his efforts, but was harassed, followed by private investigators, and threatened with litigation. Holmes even had George Schultz, a member of her Board of Directors, and Tyler's grandfather turn against him.

[@WeirdWizard97]

This video is seriously undermined by its heavy reliance on psychologist Dan Ariely, whose own work is now being challenged as allegedly faked.

[@nudgepodcast]

This episode was recorded over 9 months ago so it's a little out of date (hence the warning in the description). I've since released an episode which tackles these allegations: podfollow.com/1457621005/episode/4324e1ab34e9c1dd88e7a79dd7596d0332ab6958/view

[@chrisbg99]

I was suspicious of him with the half beard/half shaved face.

[@HieronymousCheese]

You mean Dan Ariely......lied???

[@markturpin5667]

Perhaps Dan Arley was "Projecting" (as a man is - so he sees) as a form of "Confession" (whether consciously or not) He was lying too !

[@nineteenfortyeight6762]

​@@nudgepodcastthis whole video is useless and should be taken down

[@TonyBurke-nq5ib]

Many years ago I ended up in court for being late with my tax return and in my country the authorities place every case at the same court. I was last case to be heard so when I was called up to explain why I had taken so long I simply told the truth, "procrastination " It brought the house down, there were people roaring with laughter including the judge who after hearing excuses that were insults to his intelligence gave me the token fine of $140 the smallest for the day while other fines started at $500.

[@gingerhiser7312]

What would your response had been if. you were first?

[@julianfoot8748]

Society encourages lies. We love and reward liars. We applaud people who spout rubbish and don't question their falsehoods. I have sat in meetings where everyone senior nods as some consultant talks nonsense... and never admit they didn't understand a word. Its Brilliant and explains why there is so much big fraud in business.

[@Sydney-il7bs]

Donald trump

[@julianyc422]

We voted Trump, a lifelong conman, President...

[@jasperaj1]

Same here. Worked in a big successful IT company for business software. It seemed senior management loved to be lied to, perhaps because they did the same to their superiors. Anyway, if you talked sense and made realistic predictions, you ended up with nothing but problems. I am a farmer now, working with nature is much more rewarding in all things but money and much more honest.

[@buzzin-hornet]

@@jasperaj1I’m not sure, but I’d guess that if the big guns in any company are happy to listen to and or accept what they know are lies or embellishments, it may be so they can then brag about the unbelievable heights their company is able to achieve. And then when the shit hits the fan, they can just turn and put all blame on those beneath them who’d told the lies in the first place. Just a thought… 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@FreebornLivingWoman]

Superb discussion. Well done. All of those employees who kept quiet all those years are also complicit in this fraud. How do they all sleep at night?

[@govindagovindaji4662]

They count fingers.

[@lornarettig3215]

Did you see how she spent millions of company funds on brutal lawyers to hound and try to destroy the lives of 20-something entry-level employees Erica Chung and Tyler Schultz?! I don't blame anyone for deciding to cut their losses and quickly leave with their career and life still intact. That, and she deliberately kept people away from each other, so it was harder to figure out that the whole thing was utter nonsense. (This, alone, shows her guilt for me - she knew it was nonsense and wouldn't let anyone gather the pieces to put the puzzle together.)

[@TheDavidlloydjones]

@@lornarettig3215 It seems to me America is long overdue for a Bonfire of the Lawyers. On any reasonable set of criteria of decency and honesty, probably a third of them ought to be disbarred and 10% of more jailed and stripped of all their assets through payments of damages to victims.

[@lifestylehomestead]

Same way it happens in any organization.

[@jameseverett9037]

There was constant turnover - people leaving, fired, and being replaced for questioning the princess.

[@McVaio]

In my experience, most people don't cheat. I remember working as a cashier. Unbeknownst to the employees, they'd put everyone on his or her own cash register for two weeks to find a thief. Everyone except for the thief had a balance close to 0. No one stole anything except for that one guy.

[@stephenschiavone8592]

People also didn't call bullshit because Holmes had her own personal Stasi of private investigators and lawyers to go after any whistleblowers.

[@ilostmyearpodsbtwiamhannah815]

why is no one mentioning how fucking insanely horrifying her eyes are… the light is reflected on them so throughly and they look like they’re ready to come out the socket

[@mercywaithaka3708]

Thank you!!!! Thats all we should be talking about..

[@maryhobbs4183]

I've read slot about those crazy eyes. Psychopath eyes.

[@lucypimentel12]

She began by lying to herself first. When she believed that lies, she decided everyone could believe them too

[@valalongtooth1]

The only reason this lady went to jail is because she robbed the rich. Just like Madoff. If she ripped off a bunch of poor people she would have just paid a fine

[@sabrinaleedance]

She really took "fake it till you make it"WAY too seriously

[@normansilver905]

She will NEVER admit she did anything wrong. In her mind she is always right.

[@JumpCutThis]

To admit fault is to admit everything she has ever said and/or done can now be called into question.

[@kupigusja9430]

woman moment

[@thedarknessthatcomesbefore4279]

Very trumpian of her. Obviously a narcissistic person.

[@StrangeHappening-iu4fu]

It's terrifying how everyone just believed her without question. Why would a pretty, young, smart woman lie?" Everyone can be a liar.

[@jameseverett9037]

Pretty????

[@BridgeTROLL777]

Everyone is a liar at times.

[@gerberbernstein7360]

At five years old when asked what she wanted to be, she said "a billionaire".

[@stephenraymond8414]

Yeah right...🙄

[@charleswhite758]

I'm guessing her parents implanted that idea into her head. At 5 I didn't even know what a "millionaire" was.

[@matukonyc]

It was "Fleischman's" yeast, and it is still the leading yeast brand in the US. The brand was sold in the 1920s, and some of the family money was used to found The New Yorker magazine. Holmes may be a relative, but I don't think her family has ever had THAT much money; they just think of themselves as the sort of people who SHOULD have that much money. Holmes' father worked for Enron, so arguably she comes from a background of people who value profit over honesty, which is very common here in the US. It's equivalent to cash-poor aristocracy, or cash-poor royalty-look at how unscrupulous individual member of the British royal family have been. They think they deserve that money.

[@RSEFX]

I think centering this discussion so much around Holmes may not be the best idea. There are a lot of specific reasons ---reasons specific to Holmes---that make taking her case into a discussion of reasons people start lying in general makes for a inequitable fit. Soooo, how about a video analyzing Holmes specifically: Allong with a few generalizations as to why people might have tendency to lie given a chance, focus as on her case alone, and how she might not fit those general patterns, ie analyze HER motivations, HER reasons, HER life situation etc...and I think it'll turn out a bit differently than tests of people taking tests related to lying. .

[@LozzaTx]

Watched the 2nd part 1st, now watching this part, great videos. Usually I flick in & out of videos but you have me hooked. Thank you for the upload, from your new subscriber 😊

[@charleswhite758]

All these fawning magazines and journalists who enabled her (in pursuit of gender equality) need to be held to account

[@katsmith8263]

and investors😊

[@BridgeTROLL777]

​@@katsmith8263what? Investors are like the only victim in this case. The ones who sued her... jeez

[@paulajaramillo937]

There is something I have not able to comorehend with all of this scandal. How could she lie for 20 years? How many blood teste were carried out in 20 years? Why did nobody notice it before? What happened with the blood test carried out before the truth was revealed? With the patients, doctors and laboratories?

[@maxxpopp2373]

it all sounds like a bunch of BS. They made money and hid as much as they could before they were busted. she factored in going to prison. She'll be out in half the 11 yr sentence. Not bad. make billions, cheat , lie steal , go to jail for a minute and pop out richer than fort knox!!

[@mm-a139]

12 years, not 20. She founded it in 2003 and the article was published in 2015. Twelve years of research for a pharma /pharma tech company is pretty average

[@jujujudio]

Holmes contracted the blood work out

[@aliceinwonderland1120]

Those in the company who were aware of the lies were under strict no disclosure agreements and threatened with professional ruin and scorched earth litigation if they spoke up. Ironic that two of the youngest people in the company - Tyler Shultz and Erica - were the only ones brave enough to speak out.

[@ajtempl3758]

Interesting and thought provoking video, well delivered. You should have addressed a very reasonable point that her pathological lying could be down to a psychopathic and/or narcissistic personality disorder.

[@BridgeTROLL777]

Could be but in reality neither of those is in light of research "disorder" of any kind but evolutionary adaptation because in certain environments its benefiscial to be a psychopath or narcissist.

[@brianholmes6626]

I feel like its more important to figure out why so many took her at face value with out any follow thru on her part. Obviously manipulation was the main tool she used but i wanna know why it worked on so many influencal figures in modern society? Thats where we need to focus in order to grow and move past it in my opinion, we already know theres no changing the pathilogical narcissistic peeps.

[@iceman4660]

A possible issue is that nobody wanted to be accused of attacking her as she's a woman. To paraphrase something someone said in the past, 'the bigger the lie the more believable it becomes'. So if you plan to lie then go big.

[@GeorgeT370]

This video is incredible....what an eye opener....thanks!

[@RG-iw7py]

There's more to it. Please, look up: 'Narcissistic Red Flags'.

[@charleswhite758]

Eye-opener🤣 like Holmes' crazy wide eyes.

[@EnglishPizza]

Her behavior is more psychopathic, have you considered this? People without such disorders just can't lie that long physically.

[@RG-iw7py]

No, it's enough to have narcissistic traits or personality, be sociopath.

[@lornarettig3215]

She lies like a little child, because she is staggeringly immature. (Some) Children get authentically furious when you don't believe their obvious lies, and I don't doubt that while Holmes went into prison still grinning like an imbecile, likely still trying to get us to believe that this lengthy spell in federal lock-up was all part of her master plan to 'change the world', she is surely spitting blood that the peasants refused to recognise her genius.

[@Ken-er9cq]

She had total belief in herself, basically narcissism, so she felt that eventually the problems would be worked out thanks to her brilliance.

[@katiecheung7993]

In life, there are two things that help some people get ahead more easily than others. Good looking people tend to give people the impression that they are more trustworthy than the average looking people. Second thing is, there are people that just have something that makes people believe in them and draw them in. Elizabeth Holmes has both - good looks and that believable manners. She probably didn't mean to lie to that extent, she was probably surprised at first how many people actually bought her lies, from high power politicians to wealthy billionaires. In the end she probably thought, why not and just went with the flows! Having all those powerful men believe in her also built ego bigger and bigger, to the point she didn't know how to stop!?

[@jameseverett9037]

She looks creepy to me. Those wide eyes look like a little kid's drawing, and full of hollow, melodramatic innocence. And the "empowering" clothes seem shrill & pretentious. She's embarrassing to watch. Everything about her feels contrived.

[@Chrisy0850]

The charm of the psychopath

[@johngalvin3124]

Nah. She was a born liar, end of.

[@katiecheung7993]

@@johngalvin3124 You are probably right. But there are lots of born liars, why do you think she managed to lie to so many supposedly highly intelligent people such as those billionaires and politicians?

[@AngelGonzalez-pd4cn]

If you see that broad a "good looking" broad then you are blind or you never have seen a real good looking female.

[@kimromero3247]

Look at them crazy eyes

[@redmed10]

Christopher holmes her brother doesnt seem to get any coverage at all in this saga. Very odd. But then again the whole family are very tight lipped.

[@lv4077]

Anyone can tell the truth when it’s to their benefit,it’s telling the truth when it hurts you.That’s called integrity ,and it doesn’t sound like anyone involved had any.

[@BridgeTROLL777]

People in general dont have any integrity. You dont, i dont no one does. But we virtue signal because it makes us feel mushy and special. 😊

[@lv4077]

I’m faking it though.Im not aware that I virtue signal .Actually I’ve never met anyone able to detect anything virtuous in my actions.

[@2000Redred]

People lying about why they’re on their phone during class. Me when singled out: “I’m playing Pokémon Go.” Entire class laughs and the professor just says to carry on. I wasn’t lying either lol.

[@lelandunruh7896]

I soent nine years as a lawyer for startups, mostly in the tech sector. Most founders are honest (at keast over all), vut there are more Holmses out there than we think. And this applies to my own profession, too!

[@UdoADHD]

The staff went with the lies because they were threatened with loss of job and legal action if they spoke against the lies.

[@eddiesmith8756]

Elizabeth like any other celebrity didn’t want a 9-5 and make it to a million dollars just by working not lying they wanted the fast life and fast life ended fast slow in steady wins the race go to fast you fall off the cliff but if you take your time it’s so smooth. Elizabeth should have gotten 20 year for extortion 11 years is way too generous. Another industry plant for Black Rock to push but now people found out she a psychopath (WHO IS EVIL BY THE WAY) I guess the show is canceled. I mean the fact that she hung out with other millionaires and billionaires and they didn’t know just shows these people are also liars themselves and not as intelligent as the masses thought they were all they have is just intellect half of what the definition of intelligence means (Left brain ism).

[@tulpamedia]

I am an ex heroin and meth addict. As everyone knows, one of the main symptoms of a substance use disorder is pathological lying. Something that I find very interesting is that I never really experienced ego motivation. Even to this day, I would never feel bad about lying. I try my best to be honest now because I know that my life depends on it, but I still don't feel bad about lying and I still don't have much ego motivation. This video is extremely interesting, thank you for the analysis.

[@valalongtooth1]

As someone who's in health care the idea of running complex labs off a pin prick is laughably far far far from any current technology to the point of almost being impossible.......

[@peterbigblock]

I’m still not clear, did the machines do anything? Did they analyze blood at all, or were they just filled with circuit boards and toaster parts? Also, what initially made her think this whole scheme up? What was the catalyst for quitting school to start a career pretending to do blood testing? It just seems like an odd con to dream up one night.

[@nando9195]

I think it did run at least 1 test. I saw on another video it ran a herpes test. Also a syphilis test early on. But im pretty sure the tests were not reliable. But yes i believe it did run at least 1 test lol

[@nineteenfortyeight6762]

Toaster parts. They took the blood out back where they had normal machines that they'd bought

[@personanongrata7976]

7:49 the one teacher who was interviewed said she (EH) was mediocre.

[@andrewbogle3350]

What’s almost. Damning as her lying is the gullibility of wealthy investors who were taken in by her scam. Which of them did due diligence? Very few if any I’d wager which tells you they had more money than good sense and too much money to if they thought they could afford such risk. It makes the argument for a wealth tax so much more compelling.

[@sidstovell2177]

Thanks!!!

[@boblaker8676]

Great analysis. On to the second episode.

[@mynameisjefferson3771]

Wow. Very well done and valuable to me. However, I think all the valuable things are about why we all lie; not really about why *she* lied. Sure, everyone lies. And some are pathological liars. But why does someone lie *when the stakes are so high*? When so many lives are on the line? This suggests the need for something like sociopathy to explain her lying. Sociopathy combined with natural human behaviors involving lying.

[@jameseverett9037]

She's a criminal mind.... some people are just criminally minded. They aren't honest, they know it, and they simply don't care. Their conscience either never developed, or they had contempt for such things. They just hope to get away with it, and there is enough evidence to support the belief that they can.

[@charlottepembroke5446]

We didn't get that much coverage of it here in UK really, but the story fascinated me because, from the very beginning I thought she seemed fraudulent and unhinged - it didn't surprise me when she was exposed at all, just a strong gut feeling about her (same with Meghan Markle).

[@jameseverett9037]

Same here. I don't get how she was remotely believable. Are so many people that easy to fool? Yikes!

[@Chrisy0850]

Always listen to your gut feeling, I had the same with Harry's first wife

[@benhaylock7097]

There you go, you proved you are a victim of the same cognitive dissonance as the test cheaters described in the video. Meghan Markle is a nice person who hasn't done anything wrong unlike Holmes

[@theivory1]

As with almost all of today’s problems, lack of fear of our maker is solely to blame.

[@birben5108]

do you have a list of the references of the publications/studies you are mentioning throughout this series? could you please share that?

[@jenmdawg]

Quoting Arielly on an episode about fraud is rich and tragic. He, unlike Holmes, was an actual hero to me for years. His fraud caused me pain and his lies after being caught still sting. 10:32 I’m very surprised you have put him in this as a source of insight on Holmes rather than her peer in the lying games of entitled, privileged f@kwits.

[@nudgepodcast]

This episode was recorded over 9 months ago so it's a little out of date (hence the warning in the description). I've since released an episode which tackles these allegations: podfollow.com/1457621005/episode/4324e1ab34e9c1dd88e7a79dd7596d0332ab6958/view

[@jenmdawg]

@@nudgepodcast fair enough. Thanks for the reply - I had a big reaction bc he really did break my academic heart.

[@stevenclarke5606]

Her Father was a director of ENRON , like father like daughter!

[@stephenraymond8414]

Another group of self anointed "Smartest Guys in the Room"....😒 Look, it's SIMPLE these people were all GREEDY...Had stock options,startup fantasies burning in their head It's insane wealth creation the World's never seen before This will not be the last... obviously Do your homework CHARLIE... i mean VC...lol I mean Venture Capitalists...😂

[@balletshoes]

This was a fascinating dive into what made it so conducive for her to lie. But I am far more interested in what it takes to stand one's ground when one discovers a lie, when put in a situation where lying is beneficial. In other words the opposite. The psychology of honesty and the one of whistleblowing.

[@BridgeTROLL777]

You are honest when it benefits you materially and emotionally and you lie when its the other way around. Empathy imposes negative cost to actions that harm others but empathy can be controlled. Either conscioussly or by looking the other way. Thats why normal people lie, sometimes kill in heat of passion, eat meat despite its produced with immense cruelty, have no problem killing in wars, had slaves in past, were nazis in germany in the 40s despite being loving fathers and mothers etc....

[@DeadDancers]

I don’t know if dishonesty ‘inspires’ others. In the example of the obvious cheater, I think the feeling would be more of a ‘that’s so unfair and if it’s unfair why should I be fair?’ Sort of a ‘why should the rules apply to me if they don’t apply to others’ sentiment. Which makes me wonder if E grew up seeing the adults around her lie and cheat and benefit from it - and so feel that honesty was a stupid, no-value notion in an unfair world full of people benefiting from deceit. It would have become very easy to be morally okay with lying then.

[@tomr1056]

She's clearly sociopathic/psychopathic, narcissistic, dishonest and after recognition/fame/money, all of these things are bad but you also have to add delusional/stupid to that, and that is what makes the real difference in this whole story. As, she must have believed it was possible, and more than that, that SHE could do it, she could make it happen, she could get enough money and good people together that it would actually happen like she said it was happening. I can't see it any other way. She herself must have had (delusional) belief in it all, otherwise what would she really think is going to happen down the road if it can't be made to work? She just put the belief before the evidence, that's all! :o

[@StrangeHappening-iu4fu]

Maybe she thought most likely the company would fail but people would just believe it was due to some technical reason that was no fault of her own. By that time should have already made a ton of money and was hoping people wouldn't see the dishonesty. That and the small chance her tech would end up working if she just had enough money and resources.

[@energy5289]

100% agreed,

[@charleswhite758]

That is the American way, believing in fairy tales is widely admired. She was just being very American.

[@StrangeHappening-iu4fu]

@@charleswhite758 Ouch. Shots fired. I couldn't agree more though. It's one of my least favorite parts of this country.

[@charleswhite758]

@@StrangeHappening-iu4fu It's actually what makes America great, when those fairy tales become reality for the very few with the personal qualities to make it happen. For example only an American could have invented Google, Wikipedia or Facebook, which all required big dreams and extreme idealism and philanthropism. Be very, very proud! If an Englishman had had such ideas his fellow-countrymen would have laughed at him and asked "why would you need to do that? Isn't your public library good enough?". I think it was an Englishman who invented the internet - but then couldn't find a use for it🤣 But for the other not so capable dreamers it leaves them looking somewhat gullible and ridiculous.

[@larrycoldwater1964]

Question 4: Where did she get the seed money?

[@RG-iw7py]

She was from somehow rich, well connected family. Please, look up: 'Narcissistic Red Flags'.

[@larrycoldwater1964]

@@RG-iw7py yeah but who gave her the start up money ?

[@lornarettig3215]

@@larrycoldwater1964 She was given more than a million dollars from a neighbour, who was a connection of her father. That was her first big cheque. Then she used her father's connections to target rich-family money. She did not get any investment from proper investors, the big 10 VCs, because they would have immediately sussed that she had no idea what she was talking about and therefore no idea what she was doing. She knew she had to rely on old, rich men who also had no idea what she was talking about.

[@lss74]

Walgreens hired an expert to do checks, Elizabeth didn't allow him to do the simplest most basic of things. He warned Walgreens,.... they didn't listen due to FOMO !!! Madness !!!

[@piotrkraska6144]

Great video, hopefully itll reach more people

[@estherjoucken2189]

A con woman.

[@fionaginsbury9633]

May be she grew up in a home of liars. Or had friend like that at University?

[@GGdreamgirl]

You should look into Dan Arieli’s and his colleagues case, they are under investigation for cheating as well

[@nudgepodcast]

I'll be doing an episode on this for the main podcast in 9 days.

[@jamesstack4278]

The emperor is naked but no one calls it out. Culture always always always flows from the top down

[@merediths2cents]

Welcome to KZbin. Wish I had your talent. I have a tiny true crime channel and am trying to learn. Keep up the great work.

[@musicoldies83]

Elizabeth Holmes was the Bernie Madoff of the medical field.

[@ernie5229]

I think predicting people's real-life behavior on these very artificial "tests" is a mistake. I don't think you can draw meaningful conclusions from them; at least not the one drawn here.

[@kimfletter4142]

I see a problem with the liar study. If a human being is given the answers to test without actively committing a behavior, are they cheating? The relationship between the tester and the tested comes into play. Fear of the tester can come into play. If this is how a label of liar is placed on a human being, they are more likely to join team liar. If the fact the answers were literally on the test defines a person as a liar, it's going to be difficult to lead them onto an honest complaint path. If compliance to a quality system is seen as a path, minor mishaps are part of every day life. It's more about the path people are on and less about minor snap shots. I would never allow anyone on my team to be called a liar because the system literally gave them the answers.. It's a problem. Its a systematic error. It's not a opportunity to define a human being as a liar. No one has a right to define another person life path, in this tricky manner .

[@alikazmi6597]

991st subscriber, I wish I would be 1000th. More power to you. Excellent topic on the whole.

[@curtiswilken4912]

She’s crazy. Saved you 37 minutes. But if you’ve got time it’s a crazy story.

[@dire-decadence]

In a dishonest world, lying is a logical means to thrive.

[@tomr1056]

Psychooooooooooooooooo....

[@dire-decadence]

@@tomr1056 correct!

[@ALT-vz3jn]

To a narcissist, maybe. Not for ethical people.

[@dire-decadence]

@@ALT-vz3jn Deferentially, it’s more-so for a Machiavellian and factor one psychopath or sociopath. Narcissism is folly, because it obscures ‘objectivity’ greatly.

[@dire-decadence]

@@ALT-vz3jn Ethics are overrated-unless your a psychologist, lawyer or in a profession where it is a necessity. In this world-there are only victors and the vanquished. Predators and prey. Hunters, and the hunted. Effers' and the Effed! I trust my point has been made, it may seem black and white-naturally there are many levels to this and it becomes somewhat hierarchal and thusly relative.

[@lesliekupchanko5001]

This video hit home. I have to share something personal. A few years ago, in my career, I had to do an exam. It was a fairly hard test, and in the end, we had to mark each other's papers. I got mine back and scored perfectly except for one answer. As we gathered up our papers I kept my eye on our teacher. (He was seated at the front desk, gathering the done papers of students and laughing) I had my chance to take my pencil and change my wrong answer to the right one. Heart thumping, I took my paper and handed it in. While listening to this I remembered that moment and felt terribly convicted. I asked Hod for forgiveness thinking about my teacher and willing to even confess to him if I ever run into him. I wondered also if he saw what I did.... (Still guilt, after asking for forgiveness) Then I realized it was because I needed to forgive myself. I got tears!!! Lol It's true: Lying not only hurts others, it hurts our self. Good video Part 2 coming up. Study s

[@paulborst4724]

*Everyone lies? Not everyone. I don't and I've suffered my whole life because of it too.* People don't like the truth and when you're the one who calls it out, you become a target and yet even this does NOT stop/deter me. This makes me a very difficult employee to work with, because regardless of your demographic, psychographics, or socioeconomic profile, none of that matters to me, if I see a falsehood, I point it out.

[@CamJames]

I cheat in every job interview by slightly stretching my qualifications. Very valid insight into human behavior, and I'm not gonna stop doing it for the reason he stated: I can justify it by learning how to do new things I lied about after I get the job.

[@BridgeTROLL777]

Ofc. Lying is a valuable tool for all humans and all humans lie at times.

[@elisabethmolatore9071]

​@@BridgeTROLL777 Your justification for "slightly" lying could change your mostly "honest" mind. Warned.

[@tomr1056]

She, stupidly, believed with enough investment and people working on it that she could organise that the tech would actually work like she said it was working... It must have, even for her, become gradually more sickening, as everything got bigger and more public, at the same time as not being able to work more and more assuredly! ...Like hurtling towards a brick wall in a car at higher and higher speed, knowing you can't change anything, and then... BOOMM!!!

[@charleswhite758]

There did not seem to be that realisation in her head, she slept well at night. She probably thought that the sign of a successful business person is that they never contemplate failure. So she never allowed herself to picture that approaching brick wall. So misguided.

[@Hans_Magnusson]

Excellent! Very interesting 👍

[@Slarti]

The irony is that Dan Ariely cheated himself by faking results in studies 😂

[@keneaton2855]

Absolutely no one beats trump for lies and I am sure no one ever will

[@karihamalainen9622]

This article is very good!

[@susanlynch1966]

What a fascinating story, and very well narrated. Looking forward to the next one.

[@w0rmblood323]

Great video, need one on SBF next!

[@brainstormingsharing1309]

Basically the title said it all! 👍👏

[@woodrowbarstad4549]

if a war criminal ie HK ....sits on a board its a questionable operation

[@roncollins1046]

The question isn't so much why one person decides to lie, it's more a question of why so many people DECIDE to believe her. Every indicator in Holmes' appearance and persona showed plainly all the signs of a sociopathic habitual liar who wouldn't speak truth even when it is to her advantage. Such creatures are drawn gravitationally to people who are predisposed to believe a good hustle, it's the primary skillset used by con artists and fortune-tellers throughout human history. This particular hustler grew up in a posh hyper-academic self-congratulating world of lies and magical thinking and overestimated capacity to sum up others by cliches and profiles, a world where a good presentation outweighs a credible record of genuine achievements every time. That world made her, and she just played by its rules: to target individuals who aren't even acquainted with the real world, and sell them a fake one where everything they want to believe comes true.

[@rineesinharay6009]

I heard all the staff had to sign NDAs.

[@kevinhealey6540]

I don't know why these people do this. Nick Leeson, Jordan Ross Belfort, Madoff, Bankman are examples. Leeson and Belfort got out of prison and were able to make something of their lives but still. But I could not think of stealing from people as well as hurting them. I've been blessed (some would say cursed) with a conscience. As it was said, "I'd rather be the man who bought the Brooklyn Bridge, than the man who sold it."

[@Contraster671]

Your analysis is very straight line in what is a complex situation. People invest or often work in high tech because they want to make money. You have an idea, then others often then have to design and deliver the solution. The greater the challenge the greater self belief is required until people reach a tipping point where stress results in them feeling they almost have the solution. There part though may only be a small contribution, but when you have whole teams at it then it’s easy to see how things go wrong. Many then get hooked into visualisation out of desperation, believe enough and it will happen, and this then frankly tips people over the edge. Seen it first hand and do think Holmes was wrong, but it isn’t as simple as just an untruth. Many are just as much to blame.

[@sidstovell2177]

And being in Silicon Valley? Going to Stanford? Wonder what would have happened if she was born in some small town, in a less notable state, if she would have even begun her con.

[@Tamlinearthly]

But my reaction in that Carnegie Melon experiment would not have been to cheat OR to stay honest based on my reaction to the plant, it would have been to say, "Oh, well that guy was obviously a plant, and the point of the experiment is to see how we react." Which I assume would skew the results, but I never hear about researchers correcting for this sort of thing.

[@duracell8258]

My one question is why did this very rich investors believed her, what did she say, what did they say. She was nineteen, what kind of a red flag do you need? I wouldn't by a puppy from a nineteen year old

[@derek04151]

She lies just by looking at you, she doesn't even have to speak a single word. She's just one huge made up lie.

[@maximillianomartinez]

Very ironic that the main thing I remember from this video is that the research is supplemented by Dan Ariely

[@itzamia]

The wider the eyes go, the more they think they got you. I worked in sales for a few years, and I seen people I worked with that were shady in this line of work do this. In this industry, you get commission from companies by direct sales, up-sales and sub-sales. You get money hungry, chasing that commission. People like her take it to the next level.

[@eureca2681]

I heard she got pregnant during trial so that her sentence would be a slap in the wrist

[@andrewpetersen6116]

Fake it till you don't make it

[@Jack-il3qv]

I believe that anyone who has never told a lie in their life is not a liar.

[@thomasclancy4607]

She even lied with her voice when she spoke publicly. She purposely lowered the tone of her voice.

[@blingfire1850]

I think what Elizabeth Holmes did went beyond being depleted. She had plenty of of energy to plan this scam and push it hard and push it and push it and push it. I think a personality disorder was involved. She wanted what she wanted and went hard. She was going after what she wanted in one form or another no matter what.

[@BridgeTROLL777]

In a way admirable

[@blingfire1850]

@@BridgeTROLL777 Of course it's admirable to give false results on medical tests and make false claims about a medical device and risk other people's lives because you're a greedy narcissist who wants attention and admiration for lying and cheating and stealing and because you want to scam people out of money. Why would that not be admirable?