Mercedes Clever Turbo Engine - "Hot Inside V"

[@DanneIDasset]

Ford 6,7 PowerStroke "Scorpion" also has it hot side in the V, with twin intake singel turbocharger. Ford also made an Indy V8 engine, bor turbo and NA, with the hot side inside the V and the intake between the camshafts, much like the Lancia Triflux (with the exeption of the dual exhaust per cylinder bank).

[@Scotford_Maconochie]

BMW launched the N63 engine in 2008 with a hot vee design. 4.4L V8 twin turbo. The S63 variant is used in ///M models

[@MattMaranMotoring]

Great explanation Jason! You can definitely tell the difference with this setup and the lack of lag. Thanks for the link to the deliberation video too, much appreciated man!

[@EngineeringExplained]

Yes, neat to feel how effective it is. Loved it, awesome spending time with ya man!

[@Chattanooga_Sparrow]

I understand the reduced turbo-lag, but trying to contrast it to the Mclaren and GT-R is apples to oranges as the turbos and displacements are different, so spooling characteristics aren't going to be the same anyway.

[@WeirdBrick]

Exactly! Compare this 4.0 to the Mclarens 4.0 in the 720 and lets talk about which has greater lag then....

[@josechirimoya]

I concur. The Merc hot V is masterful in engineering and execution. But, to a large extent, it is the answer to a problem that nobody ever had.

[@-Tme]

American drag racers did something similar with Buick Nailheads in the early sixties. They ran superchargers into the exhaust side of the heads with specially ground cams and headers mounted in the intake valley all in an effort to compensate for the awful exhaust flow of the vertical valve design.

[@AutOdometer]

Sounds like a nightmare to service...

[@Ms.Fowlbwahhh]

AutOdometer Yep. I pity whoever has to service these turbos when carbon build up needs getting rid of.

[@dinobot_maximize]

lol no one services mercedes. just throw them away and make a new one. they never reach an end user that cares to pay to fix them.

[@cleric3236]

It's called planned obsolescence

[@OEMPlus]

its definitely more efficient and compact. makes a lot of sense from an engineering perspective.

[@OEMPlus]

oh and it looks cool as all get out :)

[@brly4542]

Ford's 6.7 diesel is also a hot v engine, it actually helps keep the engine bay cooler and makes the turbo piping much shorter and easier to route and doesn't spread hot air around the engine bay.

[@naeje2]

i'm glad to see that i'm not the only one who noticed that Mercedes was not the first with the hot V design. BMW i think had it first in their 7 series, Ford in their new diesel and Audi .

[@inkno701]

I'm on youtube basically everyday and you are the only person I've even heard of in your "Automotive Video Association"

[@lucasjohnson1399]

I thought that BMW was the first to introduce this with the N63. Formula 1 had been doing it for a while I'm pretty sure though.

[@jannikmoller3705]

BMW did it in 2009, Audi in 2013. So Mercedes isnt the first at all.

[@fuzzy1dk]

F1 rules explicity says exhaust ports must be on the outboard side of the heads not inside the V

[@bryanwelch6209]

Lucas Johnson fist production car to have it.

[@lulube11e111]

Lucas Johnson I think 2014 was the first year of turbo aspirated engines

[@MKBorn2000]

Roko Krstičević there were Turbos in the 80s

[@wandaxDesign]

Great video. I just want to point out that BMW did it back in *2008 with their N63 engine

[@EngineeringExplained]

Thanks for sharing! I wonder if Mercedes added the "first in a *sports* car" tag to differentiate themselves and say that whatever BMW this was used in wasn't a "sports car?" Anyways, interesting! And yes, it's been around in racing certainly.

[@TheGbizaille]

Exactly what i was about to say

[@carlosrein2317]

and BMW got the Idea form marine engineering ;)

[@Kaisuke971]

Actually it's 2008 in the X6

[@kbc8090]

The 2012 M5 was indeed a sports car. BMW also goes as far as designing a cross-bank exhaust manifold so the turbos receive equal pulses of exhaust gas to give the best response.

[@mikebagwell8229]

"Hot Inside V" seems like an opportunity for Mr. Regular to step in here.

[@brianborell4469]

BMW has been using this design since 2008. They actually started development work on it in the 1990's.

[@themza912]

despite your recent increase in exposure and ability to drive these high end sports cars, you've stayed true to your MO of explaining innovative automotive systems. good on you!

[@EngineeringExplained]

Fun fact! The Porsche 918 actually has a 'Hot V' setup as well (the exhaust is mounted inside the V), however it is naturally aspirated. It's what allows for those epic exhaust ports right behind the passenger cabin. Hope everyone's having a great day! And if you're into sneak peaks and other nonsense, consider following on Instagram - so close to 80k followers! :) instagram.com/engineeringexplained/

[@skrimyt2484]

The Audi R18 Le Mans prototypes also had 'hot V' turbodiesel V6s, although of course they were not production vehicles.

[@stevemic]

Ford powerstroke v8 since 2011

[@iLupi]

Engineering Explained so if something ever went wrong with one of those turbos I'm guessing this would be an absolute pain to fix without dismantling the engine? Edit: I just realized they are mounted atop it appears XD so that shouldn't be as bad of what I was imagining.

[@grebo121]

^ I imagine, it's when you write the comment, while underneath the car, then jack it down and have to edit.. :D Well, still hanging question - how to change the sparkplugs?

[@KARR]

Would call the 918 a V motor

[@larrylentini5688]

I love these videos explaining current things manufacturers are doing

[@dominiccampanella21]

This 4.0L motor has been in production for over 2 years. Great video!!

[@mjdeluxe]

wow what an informative video, answered every question I had about this system

[@Blakearmin]

I'm incredibly happy for you that your channel has done so well.

[@ZWortek]

This is extremely cool to see, what an impressive package. Turbocharging v8's are usually super cumbersome.

[@rust2985]

That's the same basic design as Ford's 6.7 Powerstroke Diesel. I'm glad to see that sports car manufactures have adopted the same technology as I think it's a far superior design. Much more compact and generally just makes more sense for a turbocharged V8.

[@irvingherreraquintana3728]

Mike Tunstall are you trolling?

[@Ruboniasfinest]

mike is correct. ive had 2 of them a 2011 and a 2016 i think id know 😂

[@questioner1596]

The 2003.5-2007 6.0L Powerstroke was the same design, and also had a variable geometry turbo. My million km 2006 E350 had minimal turbo lag, and was much smoother and quieter than older diesels (way louder than the diesels from this decade, though).

[@exothermal.sprocket]

7.3, 6.0, and 6.4 were all International engines. 6.7 is a Ford engine. GM and Chrysler still don't make their own diesels. Kudos to Ford.

[@kayzrx8]

the 6.7 has the turbo in the middle of the V but it has exhaust pipes routing the exhaust behind the motor to the turbo. It does not have the exhaust ports in the v of the engine like theses engines mentioned in the video. it has the intake in the middle of the V like a traditional v8.

[@mysock351C]

GM-EMD and other diesel manufacturers have been building them like this for years with the exhaust in the valley for ease of service and layout. Ford also uses this layout with a single turbo for their 6.7 diesels.

[@electric7487]

And most medium-speed (300-1000 RPM) marine Diesels are like this.

[@BenJamin-ou7kd]

Very nice set up, I work with diesel engines around 50 liters with this turbo setup, cummins and cats

[@volvo245]

This been the standard for all BMW forced induction v engines for years now...

[@SoccerBoyAP]

Both the V design and the turbo have been around since the early days of automotive engines (roughly 1880's to 1900's) and here we are over 100 years later still making improvements. Impressive!

[@publixskate]

If doug was not there it wasnt official

[@machdaddy6451]

I drove an AMG GT-R and it was a blast.

[@barney9008]

It seems inconceivable that for the past 50 years of american v8 engines no one has ever thought of reversing the intake & exhaust/turbo setup

[@fang75429]

It would be great for you to look at the BMW S63Tu engine and discuss how the cross bank manifold improves spool (or is it just marketing fluff) and what exhaust noise it will make with its firing order. It doesn't really sound like a flat plane or a cross plane V8 at all I don't think.

[@peterrrr]

Well, MB is so proud claiming they did it first in a sportscar(!), which if you take the whole context is true, but if you take a closer look, BMW (2008) and Audi (2011) did it way earlier.

[@straight_intro]

i think the main advantage of this engine is putting ehaust at the hot part of engine and intake at the colder side, i mean the things are located where they logically have to be

[@pwv613]

Ford has been doing this since 2010 when the 2011 model year F-250-F550 6.7L Powerstroke turbo diesels came out... Love how it drives in mine compared to other diesels!

[@jorgelelexd]

You always makes me want to take a degree in mechanical engineering. Love your videos!

[@TyinAlaska]

Do it.

[@jamest.5001]

I have seen Indy cars from the 69's with the inboard exhaust. and flat head fords been modified back in the day like that also.

[@UntitledSpaghetti2]

There's another advantage to this "Hot Vee" set up. Since the turbos are so close to the exhaust ports, the exhaust gases have direct influence on the propeller vanes. The use of variable geometry turbos allows engineers to time the exhaust pulses and the turbo vane angle together for maxiimum efficiency, reduced lag, and increased output.

[@ahvsry]

BMW was the first production car to have a hot V motor which is their N63TU motor that was first produced in 2008. Ferrari first put it in their formula one car but as for first production car it was a BMW

[@Hammerhead547]

They used the same sort of idea with thier F1 engines a couple of seasons ago, only they went more extreme and cut the turbocharger in half then bolted each half to different end of the engine and connected them with an auxiliary drive system that was connected to the hybrid drive sysrem.

[@AverageNeighbor]

Got to witness a AMG gts in person, beautiful car

[@f99o46]

Awesome explanation, yes I concur, my 63s hot v configuration certainly compacts overall appearance of engine. And what an engine it is 😎🔥🔥🔥

[@henrywindsor7037]

The first production sports car to have this was the 2011 F250 Super Duty.

[@apprenticefelix7740]

6.7 made in house by ford

[@Scotford_Maconochie]

Because an F250 is a sport car 😅😅

[@kevintoly2864]

"in blue here everything is cool and in HOT here everything is warm" finally someone else who can see infrared.

[@jandrevanderwalt9651]

Thanks for this! I always had the idea that the airflow would still take a conventional path where the intake is in the middle and the exhaust on the outside. It sounds silly, I know, but I've drawn so many diagrams trying to make that work.

[@socas_nic]

How will reliability be like? I mean with this setup you are creating very cool and very hot spots on the engine so isn't that going to affect reliability and cooling?

[@ben3989]

Makes even more sense for a single turbo

[@FlashManinSpace]

Ben Davis it's more psychologically appealing to have two nuts...​Err. I mean turbos then just one...

[@statusquoreject]

Have the same setup on my AMG C63s, nice to see a video explaining the details

[@thesparksplug]

Still impressed with your presentations.

[@Liazon098]

I wonder if you had a hood scoop strategically on that car would it help allot with engine temperatures....

[@adampancechowski5965]

now correct me if im wrong, but my best understanding of turbo lag is that it has next to nothing about exhaust runner length but rather to do with inertia of the rotating assembly

[@aracon9721]

I'm really happy he explains in videos.... would be very tricky to rewind him in reality...😂

[@datka3]

Very usable power range on both m177 and m178 love that engine

[@SirtubalotTX]

I thought Audi was the ones that had been doing this first.. Cool vid..love your channel.

[@henrytsai590]

This AMG V-8 has a cross crank, which means its exhaust has an uneven pulse on each bank. BMW M5 of 2012 has a similar setup (4.4L biturbo, also reverse flow) but with the out-board cylinders mated with those in-board cylinders of the other bank to even out the pulse. Let me know if I am wrong.

[@GraezGaming]

Most of the BMW V8 Turbo engines have this design, been doing it since the mid 2000's

[@WarpedYT]

I watched the AD

[@foreignerhill]

Hot inside V. Jeezus I cannot get over that naming.

[@ziggyfreud5357]

What are the disadvantages of having the turbos in the "V" ? Are there only advnatages? Why aren't all the manufacturers doing it this way ? EE has come a long way in a relatively short period of time. Congrats. You are a skilled and personable educator. Best for the future.

[@shmoofgang]

Such a gangster ass layout....I don't see one down side

[@daniyo25]

Great video

[@kennercitykid112]

I'm pretty sure this is one of the first F1 developments to be brought to road cars since the "flappy paddle gearbox's"

[@Arturo_S3]

Gives it a supercharger look, awesome!

[@Reverb4444]

i can already see some madman modding an engine like this for quad turbo

[@MrBranboom]

I REALLY like this move by Mercedes. The beauty of the ICE is like that of a Rolex clockwork. I love the symmetry on top, and I feel that ICE vehicles need to showcase their Symphony of Metal in the world of Tesla and Face Time.

[@halopersin]

It works great on the 6.7 powerstroke

[@MTreddevil12]

Another advantage is that you can use exhaust pulses from either side of the engine to reduce turbulence.

[@MaliciousSRT]

I pity the 3rd owner of that car - good luck to ya bud.

[@EngineeringExplained]

Do you really pity someone who's probably going to shell out $90k for one of these down the line haha?

[@matthewmatthew638]

Engineering Explained Uh I am pretty sure nobody is gonna pay 90k for 3rd hand C63s, heck I doubt 3rd hand AMG GTs go for that..

[@guillermolopez1690]

Seems way easier to service than having the turbos on the exhaust to me...

[@4ndyr0g3r50n]

Guillermo Lopez All turbos are on the exhaust, Mercedes simply reversed the cylinder head flow so the exhaust side is on top, but I know what you mean. With the AMG GT they did it years later than BMW so they must be saying that the 2011 M5 isn't a production sports car.

[@PhunkBustA]

my final offer? $20.

[@timothyearp631]

Ford Powerstroke engines have used that layout since 2011 since the 6.7 came on the market, but only one turbo

[@Davidfromsaskatoon]

Can you do a video on start stop technology whether it’s a good thing or a bad thing for your engine

[@TechSurreal]

Great engine but can't drive through rain!!! Autovlog's subscribers know what I'm talking about :D

[@rogert151]

that engine would cost like 100k to replace lol

[@doctorzia247]

Abbas Sadeghi Bajgiran ! Can you explain the reason behind it ?

[@dpt4402]

I know in all it's greatness a little water took in down

[@quinatakara650]

Intakes for turbos are all along the top. Water and open holes dont mix

[@V8Supercar1]

Quin atakara Wait a minute. So you are saying someone built a car you cant drive in the rain??

[@PROTEK123]

I was with you up to the point you said "Hello everyone"

[@cme2cau]

Three things concern me 1. there is still a lot of heat concentrated on top of the engine. The heat shielding on the hood better be good 2. Intakes very low making hydrolocking possible in heavy rain 3. all the electronics for injectors and so on are out where they are more vulnerable to weather etc.

[@swayingGrass]

Need minivan reviews again! Seriously though, when you were doing more than sport car reviews was a good time.

[@suprafill]

Obviously BMW came out with this almost 10 years ago as stated below, but BMW has also implemented cross pulse technology that shares exhaust pulses from bank to bank to keep a even flow of exhaust air on the turbine that helps to diminish lag and is most efficient way to move high velocity air by eliminating turbulence.

[@ryancooper73]

I want to point out that Audi did this back in 2011 when their 4.0 liter twin turbo V8 engine came out 😁

[@Kaisuke971]

The E71 X6 50i came out in 2008 with the N63 engine that had a Hot V layout

[@jannikmoller3705]

And BMW did it in 2009 ;)

[@team_project_23]

i'm an apprentice for Mercedes Benz and I found this video really helpful, they can be a pain to service though (I've not had the chance to service one yet but from what i've heard they can be)

[@GAMRMNTS2]

Did you service one yet?

[@team_project_23]

@@GAMRMNTS2 never got the chance, never will, I left Mercedes 2 years ago.

[@GAMRMNTS2]

@@team_project_23 👍🏾 thanks for the reply

[@MacJunior696]

The latest m5 also has hot v and alternates the two sides of the v in the manifolds, it sounds like a flatplane but it has a crossplane. Its an interesting thing

[@St0RM33]

Not new, i proposed this idea for our Formula student car running an Aprillia V4 engine. We've designed new heads for this

[@SGT-StudMuffiin]

My Alpina B7 has a hot v too, that came out before the AMG

[@DoRC]

Large diesels have been doing this for years. Makes sense

[@sahiel5]

two words : - reliability - maintnace

[@777MAV]

so, you drove some nice cars... lucky you.

[@EngineeringExplained]

Haha, yes indeed, very fortunate!

[@JDM_MSK]

I think you're the smartest person I know.

[@keloduma]

Saabkyle is also there :D

[@BigHeadClan]

Soo when is Engineering Explained going to do the VR30 motor. :)

[@aspenyukon6845]

Turbocharger itself needs redesigned as the compressor is next to the hot turbine. Maybe a longer shaft connecting them.

[@EsotericFleetMechanic]

Fun fact, most v8 diesels, have this set up. Vt365’s international and a few others.

[@garygrenier]

How can mercedes say they were first with the Hot V? BMW twin turbo V8 from the M cars had this configuration sijnce 2008. Below is from the N63 Wikipedia page. Great Video though. "The BMW N63 is a twin-turbo DOHC V8 engine which has been in production since 2008 to present. It is the world's first production car engine to use a "hot-vee" layout, with the turbochargers located inside the "V" of the engine. It is also BMW's first V8 engine to use direct injection. The N63 was launched in the 2008 BMW X6 xDrive50i.[1]"

[@Basih]

Can you please explain how AMG manage to make their unique sound of their 6.3l V8?

[@dicorp2000]

BMW did this on the N63 engine(used on E70/E71/F01/02 chassis cars), years before Mercedes Benz.

[@martinvanek5951]

Hot air rises, heat only transfers:)

[@waydigga1982]

Clever design....still makes me nervous having hot turbos in the center like that.....But hot air rises, so heat shouldn't damage anything around them

[@CapablePimento]

Now how about a long shaft quad scroll turbine setup on each port!

[@NicuplusWILD]

"in hot here everything is warm" 🤣

[@khanyilemgwebi2575]

This engine has aged well, Mercedes have now squeezed out 780hp out of it,I say 780hp because Mercedes underrated it stating it's only 740hp. These numbers were confirmed on Dyno runs. The new code name of the engine is M178 ls2...not a Chevy by the way.😉

[@kingmarz3635]

Cheers mate! I've learned a lot from your whiteboard!

[@foreverinteriors]

great show, always informative!

[@DiscoMan]

Ford did this with the 6.7 powerstroke V8. Although it's a single turbo and a diesel, still the same concept.

[@Shon304]

GTC looks epic

[@edgartaylor7421]

Make a video about if it's okay to turn off the overdrive while coasting downhill?

[@KeyurGTR]

Great video! You have given more knowledge to me than my damn engineering University! Keep going and many thanks for knowledge!

[@keijimorita1849]

I would love it if they almost doubled the power of gasoline engines by making them into blower fed 2 strokes like large diesels 2 strokes and combined that with the camless valve tech!

[@sketchyssk8shop]

Looks like a modern v6 n v8 outboard