Episode 23 - The Iron Law of Autogynephilia - With Taftaj

[@Janyk283]

Finally a nuanced take on the issue...I love how genuine and articulated you all are...so refreshing! 🌸

[@HansLemurson]

Very interesting and thoughtful take. I'm becoming a big fan of Taf. I agree that there's a lot of problem that originates from the desire to "prove it's not a choice" as a route to acceptance. It forces people to distort and contort their sense of self and their self-expression to just fit within the "safe" label where they can shield themselves from blame or judgement. I also agree that "Autogynephilia" is badly misunderstood by so many people, used as a bludgeon to label "the bad ones" (which WE are not!). Joining many online trans communities, I was warned against "Blanchardian ideology" as if it was an exclusionary form of bigotry. But when I watched an interview with Ray Blanchard, he was totally chill. What we need is a compassionate way of understanding and accepting transsexuality without trying to create a new reality and etiquette to force people into. I don't really know who the "pronoun declaration" thing is supposed to help, but it makes me twitch whenever I see fellow progressives perform that act of virtue-signaling.

[@MaiaPoet]

This was a good episode. Glad to see it’s getting coverage via the algo

[@NotesinJuly]

Love the way Taf expresses her ideas, her journey really is so interesting, and the "engine" behind her sharing all of it really is admirable. I really like her disposition towards switching the conversation from "necessity" to "enjoyment", Good work by the presenters as well. Tali's experiences were also illuminating and I found her motivations for pursuing truth equally admirable. Interesting to hear about the TERF/GC past I think that some of the things mentioned are i guess reasonable in the american context of informed consent + private healthcare but that when "public" means spending and no longer just mere social dynamics, expression, etc. like in Europe's healthcare systems then stuff changes and the questions of gatekeepers start making sense, same with seeing people who are paradoxically trapped by a "rights-based" world. For example, it's different to argue that people "should be allowed to" X (bottom, hormones, etc) vs that the State has the obligation to provide them. It changes the balance of "what's harmful", from "neutral" to "bad" if you have a zero-sum mentality regarding public spending (which generally there is, I think for true reasons) I guess the part about the current "meta" of civil rights covers that and certainly there's "state interference" already in the US as you mentioned, and I do also think the US has sort of "lead" the international western ideology and somewhat soft-powerfully imposed it onto the world but I'm not sure of how it will go or if i'm as optimistic about this "bodily autonomy" new meta being a thing here in Europe. I think that there's good chances that the pendulum swings back to a bad place for autosexual/trans people. I think I have the same fears as Aaron but maybe a bit heightened bc I feel like in europe we do shit like the US do, but like 5 years later, and in a way that we end up worse off comparatively to you.

[@Gingerblaze]

"disgust response" is instinctive and protective, not primarily about morality, tho morality is often derived from it.

[@unreadlibrarian]

Incorrect, partially. Morality is instinctive and protective. 'Sanctity' is a moral dimension (governs disgust).

[@tonyhoffman3309]

Chicken and egg

[@non_ideological_transexual7414]

@@Gingerblaze True real disgust response is but most looks to be constructed / made up. For purposes of argument in this area

[@Gingerblaze]

@@unreadlibrarian sounds like we're saying the same thing.

[@StormBringer5]

Taf’s interview with Ben Boyce years ago was one of my first intros to AGP and helped me understand it through a more sympathetic lens. Specifically the discussion about there being a romantic component, like most sexualities have.

[@miroirs-jumeaux]

hot off the presses!

[@Gingerblaze]

6min this is sooo common for boys and girls going through normal development when allowed to do so. That was the way it had been throughout the 80s and early to mid 90s. It changed in the 2000s sadly.

[@Gingerblaze]

1:30:00 everything is temporal. Everything is time and place. "Turn and face the strange ch ch changes"

[@5-Volt]

I knew this would be a great show. Taf has such a clear & solid understanding of herself. It is admirable. I've always found it kind of ironic how both GCs & TRAs actually agree on the complete misunderstanding of AGP as a niche fetish. When auto-sexuality in general is a completely varied & complex phenomenon.

[@Naxela625]

An someone AGP myself, one of the features I've found that helps contend with it is what I call a double erotic target inversion. The way in which autosexual people can find making themselves attractive in the form they most like is itself something I can find attractive, and so rather than having solely autosexual interests, I can reengage allosexuality by being attracted to this expression of autosexuality in others.

[@OddGirlOutcast]

I relate to so much of this. From my early teen years, I was inclined to take riské pictures of myself, regardless if anyone saw them or not. Thank goodness i grew up in the 90s before social media. As I got older I definitely liked to share on Tumblr etc. When i was a kid/teen my parents joked that I was in love with myself....in my own my mom would literally tell me to stop navel gazing... I didnt really engage in group play unless I had to. But was pretty good at it when I did. I mostly wandered around with my own thoughts/imagination and maybe 1 friend. I was obsessed with drawing alternative cartoon girls that embodied my own fashion tastes and looked like me. I am a biological woman who is pretty much exclusively heterosexual and very much attracted to men. However, like Taftaj mentioned, I am unlikely to engage intimately if I havent made an effort to dress/look in the ways I find myself most attractive. This aspect has always seemed to be a way higher priority for me when compared to my female friends. How i look to myself WILL make or break an intimate experience. Oddly, i have never had any interest in watching other creators 'corn' ...which again, I noticed amongst my friend groups/partners throughout life, was somewhat abnormal. I do like to research various 'corn' for aesthetic purposes so I can incorporate ideas visually into my own "content" which i enjoy making and viewing 100% more. Prior to understanding autos*exuality as a concept, I would tell people I have a vanity k*ink. It was the closest idea I had to describe my experience since it is almost entirely based on aesthetics and self objectification. Yet, I am an otherwise run of the mill alternative heterosexual woman, even boring by some standards. I have always been fascinated by body modification, which is just another reason i find the topic of transition so interesting. I agree that adults should be able to express and make changes as they please...but that this should not have a strong bearing on policy or law. ANYWAYS!!! Love your channel and always love the chance to hear Taftaj talk some realness!!

[@coolbro6969]

Hahah I actually read this. Hell yeah.

[@Gingerblaze]

44:50 appreciate Tali clarification around Blanchard's typologies as well as Zucker and Baileys work all of which have been so vilified and misrepresented in the past decade. Interesting that Wu posted about AGPs since vilifying Ray Alex Williams on Dollcast.

[@Oendikla]

and what about legal s. change on documents? along with bathrooms, it's another issue that affects the everyday lives of all transsexuals. do you think it should be allowed? or are there possible compromises (such as third categories or optional removal of gender markers from certain documents such as driver's licenses or passports)? would you "legally detransition" those who have already changed legal gender markers? just as avoiding public bathrooms can lead to dehydration and constipation, avoiding situations when you have to show documents to strangers can also have similar life-limiting consequences. (also i'm a working class trans person and i couldn't do the work my male coworkers are given. you know hrt reduces the muscle mass.)

[@Supercalifragilisticexpial-r2x]

Bathrooms yes except for where there is open nudity. We don't need another wi spa incident

[@patrickdalton2424]

I love Taf he is so lovely🥰❤

[@Gingerblaze]

Definitely appreciate that he exposes, along with Ritchie Herron and a few other public transitioners/detransitioners, how both AGP and HSTS can and often do exist in the same person.

[@non_ideological_transexual7414]

That really is so passive aggressive .

[@patrickdalton2424]

@Gingerblaze 100% it is important to know that an agp and hsts can exist in the same person and that a bisexual agp ain't always meta attraction

[@agpgoddess]

Eh... can you not touch your keyboard while recording? That clicking hurts my ears