Episode F - Canyons Before Coulees? w/ Joel Gombiner

[@bearowen5480]

On replay here, from Broomfield, CO, but native originally of Colfax, WA., "Heart of the Palouse Empire".

[@nvskywalker651]

Bretz taught in three different Seattle high schools during the next four years, beginning with Washington High School (later renamed Broadway) in 1907, where he taught history and physiography (the study of the physical features of the earth’s surface). He moved on to Franklin the next year, and then to Queen Anne High School for a two-year stint beginning in 1909. School district records show that he was assigned to teach only physiography at Franklin and Queen Anne.

[@2fishes-q5h]

Nick, spent Dec.03 with my 94 years young father, his birth date. So, before I jump into this replay... 2012 to 2020 I lived a boyhood dream. Moved to Orofino Idaho to wander the geological wonder of that area and do some gold and gem prospecting. And during those years thanks to KZbin, I discovered Nick Zentner! Thanks so much for revitalizing an amateur geologist's love for that ancient question, " How the heck does this planet live and exist?" My father, a retired professor of ancient history sends his kudos! I'm proud to brag, you're one of my best teachers of all time... science teachers were so dry and serious back in the late 60's thru the 70's. It was too painful to endure some days. Thank God for excellent teachers, from Socrates to Zentner! ❤

[@bearowen5480]

Amen!

[@fs7453-il]

Another great session

[@sunbird7349]

What an adventure, and how exciting to be able to meander between your excellent lecture, slow down have some tea then attend to my days on these Drakensberg foothills in South Africa, seeing the whole landscape through new eyes... Not that our geography is the same, but your leading questions and methodologies of researching ideas, threshing these out, are downright stimulating...I just want to begin all over again,, at 66 return to University or take online courses, and then I come in from the mountains, have more tea and find myself watching the closure of your presentation befor bed, and dreams of sandstone, basalt, shales, water course and ,,,,,,ZZZZZZ you are a star and thanks too to Joel... What a mapping genie.. Good night from Keith..

[@bobgrove1832]

Joel Gombiner just rocked this. Love the mapping!! I loved the tie to the historical monographs. This might be best in this A-Z.

[@briane173]

59:57 Columbia Basin stands out but in reference to previous discussions, when you dump 300 or so basalt lava flows from fissures in eastern WA and eastern OR, whatever the topography was there is all going to get pushed down from the sheer _weight_ of all that basalt lava, and create a bowl into which any number of dendritic drainage systems can drain. I'd give anything to see through tomography what the landscape of the Columbia Basin looks like underneath all that basalt; but to me there's no question that the 10 million or so years of almost continuous lava flows there have weighted down the entire area to help FORM this basin.

[@teacherdustinpnw]

Wow, another brilliant show!!! I have been refreshing my memory with the videos I watched from the Pandemic, and reviewing the "Nick On The Rocks" Series as well!!! I am so excited to see what your summations of all of these amazing discoveries, revelations, and speculations will bring about!!! The collegial way you approach the information and voyage of discovery always sets my brain abuzz, and I feel like I have several "Mind blown" expoeriences as I put the puzzle pieces together!!! This episode with Joel, it was about the Anticlines, as opposed to monoclines and subclines (?) and how they can help us understand the timelines of the floods, the various lobes of the glaciers, and the crazy north bend of the Culumbia in relation to the Okanogan lobe and Lake Chelan (its always Lake Chelan for me, as that's where I lived during the summers in 89-92). Now I am trying to think of a way to depict the glacial floods with the anticlines in my soil science labs with my third graders!!!! Plus so many thoughts about the whole story that we ar piecing together!!! Thak you to all the Zentnerds for your contributions!!!

[@zazouisa_runaway4371]

So interesting ❣️thanks Joel ❣️thanks Nick❣️

[@cristinejohnson6284]

I love the snow!❄️. Have been wanting to say how much I love your window view and with snow, most awesome! So cozy☃️

[@buckbuck8319]

Thank you again. Greatest channel of all time.

[@paulezycom]

In early June, 1999 my new wife went with me on an adventurous honeymoon starting from Rockford Illinois. We tent camped our way to the head of the Mississippi River near Bemidji MN. Then Headed west to Yellowstone Park for ten days tent camping. Took a drive up 90 to Coeur d'Alene for a nice hotel and dinner. We threw a dart at the map and headed to Grand Coulee for another motel night. At Grand Coulee dam I just could not comprehend how and why they were pumping water up and over to The Grand Coulee? Back then I had very little understanding of the geology in that area but it was puzzling me. We drove route 2, bisecting this entire region and then down to Wenatchee, up and over the Cascades to Everit. Such an amazing drive. I am so glad we went off the beaten path on that honeymoon. My wife still has hours of video she took out the window of the car. That small area of the North Western USA's and Canada's watersheds is just mind boggling.

[@louiscervantez1639]

THANK YOU JOEL. THANK YOU - Mind Blowing

[@deniseeconomy2363]

I'm blown back by this series so far! It never gets old discovering and re-discovering inside this community that you've created!

[@rozswartzett180]

Nick thank you thank you thank you for the end readings.

[@Marihl1354]

That ending!! Glad I looked at the screen for that!!

[@Eric_Hutton.1980]

Episode E was excellent. I look forward to seeing this one as I have just started watching the replay. I love story time with Uncle Nick. That's one of the best part of this A to Z Series.

[@janhelm3115]

Wish I could have watched live ,to the end but the replay was fantastic. Thanks

[@jamestorrence9340]

26:30 in, and Nick mentioned the Columbia River canyon at Wenatchee. I'm from Oregon, but have a lot of family between Wenatchee and Cashmere. I once walked through the Ohme Gardens in Wenatchee. The gardens have a wonderful overlook of the river and canyon.

[@richardlawton1023]

Great discussion. Thanks Nick and Joel.

[@ibelieveican3138]

John in Buffalo New York Loving being here!

[@HarrySevenEagles]

OT: Thanks for the Randy Lewis videos. Just plain terrific!

[@joesample3796]

You're the BEST Nick!!!

[@jacotacomorocco]

These videos drive a hunger for knowledge. Thank you guys for the great work.

[@jamescouture775]

I wish I could be their for live but still enjoy the replay when I can't. I am in Southern Illinois 50 miles from Kentucky.

[@grandparocky]

That is fun! Very good visuals on the topography of this issue!

[@a.visitor4309]

Hi nick from Toms River NJ. I like the new series.

[@franktippin9150]

beautiful!!

[@bearowen5480]

Nick, your question about how the Bretz newlyweds would have reached Seattle by train from Flint have two probable options, at least up until 1912 when the Milwaukee belatedly opened its high tech line to the Pacific Northwest from Minneapolis. They would have gone to Chicago via Detroit, most likely on the Grand Trunk Western or Pere Marquette railroads. In Chicago they would have changed railroads to one of only two possible options for rail passage to Seattle at that time, the Great Northern or the Northern Pacific, both of which would have closely paralleled each other to Minneapolis-St. Paul. After leaving the Twin Cities, both routes would have traversed the northern Great Plains closely paralleling each other until reaching the mountains of Montana. The Great Northern route would have taken them on the most northerly route through what is now Glacier National Park via Maria's Pass, then Whitefish, Sand Point, and converging with the Northern Pacific at Spokane. Then the GN would have proceded west to Ephrata, Moses Lake, Wenatchee, and crossing the Cascades via Stevens Pass, thence down the Snohomish River to Everett and south to Seattle following the Puget Sound coastline. The Stevens Pass crossing on the GN was not for impatient travelers or the faint of heart. It involved a series of time consuming switchbacks and was often impassable in winter. In summer however, it would have provided breathtaking views of the rugged Cascades, which might have appealed to Bretz's geological curiosity. The Northern Pacific took a more southerly and direct course westward to Seattle via your metropolis of Ellensburg, then Cle elum, and over Stampede Pass, entering Tacoma and Seattle from the south. If the Bretzes were in a hurry to get to Seattle, it's more likely that they would have chosen the NP over the GN, but I leave it to you or your Eugene sleuths to make the call.

[@lesliepropheter5040]

Ahhhhh, no commercials. Whew Thx Nick

[@charlessimons1875]

Right on Nick! break it open!

[@Trinity-Waters]

Watched this Monday, so missed the excitement of live, but what an interesting experience seeing you guys ruminate about geologic history. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🤩

[@timroar9188]

Viewing from the Mae Sai basin and range, Thailand/Myanmar border. Have to watch this in replay, I can't get up at midnight on a school day. I am really enjoying the series. Amazing maps. Meeting Russell in that fashion, just shows what a small world it is.

[@mrtony1985]

Great seminar today. Loved the visuals. Also, thank you for doing the drawings of anticline vs. sincline.

[@Valkyrie801]

Thank You, Professor Nick for helping me to understanding the uplifting and its correlational to the clockwise rotation. The Yakima River Valley animation was excellent. I understand it, now!

[@yukigatlin9358]

Awesome! A lot to wonder some more, having such a fun time slipping into the geological time of Pre-Glacial > 2.6 million, amazing!! Thank you, Joe🌟🎊😄💗Wonderful read as always, thank you, Nick😄

[@muddybuddy90]

So sorry I missed the live feed! I LOVED this episode, and the history of Harly. On brief note however. The mountain feature on the house he built was actually Mt. Baker. Im pretty sure. You can check me on that. Love what you do Nick! Love your enthusiasm.

[@derrith1877]

Sorry I missed this one live, but I was at a gallery opening of a wonderful show of woven portraits of Women and Water, weavings by Mary Burns, who lives on Manitowish River. Absolutely fabulous! Honoring women who are water keepers.

[@rozswartzett180]

Big smiles at ending

[@johnslater1460]

The best one yet. Nearly caught up.

[@richardstephens3642]

I do enjoy your names of your equipment, it brings back old memories lol

[@davediaz5127]

Love these...Yakima, wa

[@greglaspata8602]

I'm enjoying the human aspect of this story, just as much, if not more ,than the geologic story of the pre ice age flood topography. Thanks Nick !

[@danniegibbs6535]

Thanks Nick, Joal, I used to go fishing with my grandpa in Moses Coulee, Jamison lake when I was kid. My mom almost give birth to me on the forth of July 1964 at jamison lake

At 1:17:00 this is why I asked about the lakes above the ridges in the last stream. Without the old rivers flowing through the ridges, you have to have lakes north of them.

[@JanetHouck-h5h]

Janet reporting in: Viewing from Mt. Vista, a neighborhood in Vancouver, Washington. Mt. St. Helens is about 80 miles to the northeast. It is gorgeous now with a snowy blanket. On a clear day we can see St. Helens, Mt. Adams, and Mt. Hood.

[@royparrish2515]

Listening to the quote of Bretz's Father-in-Law, basically about how the pursuit of science and facts is a blessed thing for men and then you compare to today, where science and facts are now frowned on from many of today's spiritual leaders, because of the thirst for power. Facts and Knowledge are slow paths to power, over nature, over the world, over our destiny, but they want to take the quick paths of power that are couched in falsehoods and deceit. This is why we need to learn and grow, so that we can be better.

[@julescaru8591]

Watching the replay ‘cause it’s not easy to get up at two in the morning for the live lol, Joel and his maps are so interesting, presented just as many questions as answers, loving this series Nick, looking forward to each episode ! All the best Jules 💕👍

[@JamesJohnson-qe1tj]

very good. Maps are super. More info or speculation as to the origin of the anticlines and how about the corresponding synclines,they are .

[@40shellyfish]

Still loving the history in this series!! Joel was awesome, the maps make things so much clearer and so much muddier at the same time😂 I enjoy the brain exercise🤯

[@grandpamoonstone7772]

Nick this is a big meal I'll come back to chew on for days.

[@johnnysheen9615]

Fanny Challis. What a name.

[@rosaliewestphalen8121]

Wishing I could be part of the live audience! It's just a little tricky getting up at 3am to watch from Adelaide, Australia.

[@briane173]

I have the same issue watching a guy on his KZbin channel originating from Norway. He gets on livestream either right when I'm going to bed or finishing up right when I wake up.

[@julescaru8591]

Yeah I know the problem lol it’s 2am for me here on the east coast of NSW !

[@pmgn8444]

Wow! Another cool episode. Thanks Nick and Joel. Lot's of info! Looking at Google Maps, it looks like the Rock Island creek drainage does cut across the Badger Mtn Anticline. Short version of rail travel: Flint to Chicago to St Paul. Two options St Paul to Seattle. 1st: Northern Pacific - St Paul-Spokane-Pasco-Yakima-Ellensburg-Stampede Pass-Auburn-Seatle. 2nd: Great Northern - St Paul-Spokane-Harrington-Odessa-Quincy-Rock island-Wenatchee-Stevens Pass-Everet-Seattle.

[@tiltajoel]

Good point! It's complicated there because there appear to be multiple anticlines. It looks like the Rock Island drainage crosses the southernmost anticline that is continous with the main Badger Mountain anticline that Moses Coulee crosses, but Rock Island does not cross the next anticlinal ridge to the north. Interesting. Hopefully with everyone staring at it we can make sense of it :).

[@TheTrueKat]

Jen from Erie Pa

[@StanDavid-ix6yk]

Nick incredible interesting series. At least four generations of geologist have worked on this topic, four generations of mentoring.

[@georgegrader9038]

Your deep dives [Joel don't be mad] are the fun & mystery of genealogy & historical context, on top of the discovery & joy of geology.

[@matrixcardinals]

Thank you for putting your life on the line to educate us all. Nothing I hate more than driving in snow.

[@GeoFan-uk4fi]

Hi Nick , Alan from. Ipswich Uk

[@kennethconger3469]

The yellow lines of anticlines on the Western Columbia Basin appear to be directing "Canada Flood Water" into more narrow areas. Therefore, more energy and deeper coulees. On the Eastern Columbia Basin, the water is allowed to spread out and only scrape off the loess. The Palouse canyon is deep because the flood allowed the Palouse river to find a steeper route to the Snake. Wonderful episode Nick and Joel.

[@2whostruckjohn]

Is there a way to image the boundary between the Columbia River Basalts and the underlying Eocene topography? (Beyond, of course, the deep drilling done by companies prospecting for resources?) Does that boundary show up in gravitational anomalies or can it be imaged by looking at seismic wave behavior crossing the boundary? It woudl be fascinating to see how much of our surface anticlines and synclines go all the way down versus how much does not carry through the boundary.

[@lethaleefox6017]

Was hoping to see the chat replay but maybe it hasn't been processed yet... still not seeing the chat a couple days later.

[@adamcollegeman2]

clicking on bretz or floods etc shows the left stuff but not the box on the right with all the red links.. unless one zooms out! ALL THE REFERENCE PAPERS ARE NOT VISIBLE at least on a android mobile device, UNLESS ONE ZOOMS OUT you are excellent thank you for all the great work love love love

[@richardstephens3642]

Hey Nick sorry I missed your stream this morning I overslept a little lol

[@geoffgeorges]

Wasn’t the main train line what is now the Polous to Cascades trail ? I have been on the Beverly bridge that was recently finished, this would have been his first sight of the Columbia River.

[@hestheMaster]

Itchy Boots might be Nick's go to traveller but I really like Sarah Jane Woodall aka Wonderhussy Adventures even more. Keep it going Nick , this info on preflood areas in central Washington is absolutely fascinating to learn and think about. Thought process is very logically presented and hand drawn maps are undoubtedly spot on. You are still my favorite teacher on YT Nick after watching just about all you've done on your channel . BTW Joel's maps made things quite clear.

[@DennisHough-y9m]

Dennis Hough in Syracuse, New York

[@georgegrader9038]

Anyone can answer this: Somehow i missed the point on the synuplift/folding of basalt with dendritic erosion...(not the compressive/rotational structure or the underlying Miocene paleovalleys & syn-basalt interflow cuts, sediment deposition or paleosol -- i get that part). The dendritic streams are initiated on the anticlines, but they get cut off by Missoula floods... Ok, what else / sequence of pattern am i missing? BTW John Bush worked this too, and there are structures in the east.

[@geoffgeorges]

I couldn’t be live with you because I was scratching away at lose sand, mud and rocks 200’ up in the pouring rain in Index Wa.I instantly thought of you when I uncovered a layer of clay that I scraped off a thin layer of slippery goo to reveal compact dry clay, and everything above that was saturated and sliding off the clay layer. The layer above the clay was sand and river cobbles.

[@anaritamartinho1340]

Just amazing youtube video of Nick, amazing maps of Joey, all good🤤...HOW DOES IT FORM A CURVE FAULT?CAN BE MEASURE MORE LESS THE DATE OF A FAULT?

[@frankbarnwell____]

I watched until work... 30 minutes. Catching up

[@brycecarver991]

I've driven between Kennewick and Umatilla many times, I think there is more flooding amongst the Horse Heaven Hills to investigate. Not sure if it matters that much but I think in some parts it may have been overtopped in the highest peaks of the floods. Just curious since I live in TC and see the horseheaven hills often.

[@alanrobbo6980]

Hi, from the glacial deposits of the River Thames England

[@wamor4107]

Obrigado, gostaria de ver a situação atual em fotos ou video. desse local de estudo. Thank you, I would like to see the current situation in photos or video. of this study site.

[@robtippin9111]

😎

[@michellalonde137]

Hi Nick..I was wondering wen Gold finger drill those cord in the pacific ,if he drill 1 near ,where the flood exit into the Ocean ,also I know that his cord date back for 10,000 year maybe more , could we found sidemen from the flood in those cord if they date more then 10,000 year ..just saying ....

[@arttesian]

According to G. O. Smith, the Pliocene-age, Cascade (Methow) Peneplain of Willis and Russell reached a “perfection of planation” in the Yakima Valley. River network disruptions can play a key role in shaping low-relief landscapes. I suspect some of the planation in Central Washington is related to Lydia Staisch’s integration of the Kittitas Basin into the Columbia River system some 3.7 million years ago.

[@tdub18914]

Willis, Russell, Bretz... amazing what they did without the aid of any satellite imagery. Tom, Wenatchee

[@jeffbyrd424]

Just wonder if all eastern Washington was a big valley before the lava

[@brianlhughes]

When I first saw topographical maps of the Columbia Basin I thought it might have been a very old huge asteroid impact crater later on filled in by basalt.

[@markp.9707]

Interesting thought.

[@montananative2414]

I thought that before the theory of plate tectonics geologists believed that originally there was a large penneplane (sp?) that was subsequently eroded to the geography that we have today, which is why Israel kept going back to that visual.

[@scottowens1535]

This might be a record...says Late as usual.... 👍.... Coffee left hand... start video button in the other... let's Go!

[@markp.9707]

What if the Columbia Basin was much wetter 16 millions years ago. How old are the Cascade uplift? Back to Russell commenting on Pita Plain all the way to the Pacific?

[@saireygamp62]

Metolius Oregon

[@TheZinmo]

Ýou need for the oil companies to come back. Modern 3D-seismic methods are phenomenal, you can really see those buried surfaces, you could see the old valleys before the lavas.

[@diabeticdarrell5798]

PUYALLUP

[@darinjones209]

Is there a way, to say using earth quake data to understand the bottom side of the basalt floods to basically see the original landscape that it covered. I would think that sound waves would travel at different speeds through sediment than basalt. Just a thought.

[@scottsluggosrule4670]

Those n to ne folds..the area is rotating so would you not expect folds in all directions..yes mostly moving north but definite rotation is also indicated

[@Josh1888USU]

Do you also have a ISU pennant? If not might be a good idea for a viewer that is also an alumni of Pocatello local to get you one.

[@bobkat8765]

After spending time watching the Icelandic flows, I came up with a hypothesis of my own about how the canyons were formed. What I noticed in Iceland is that there are rivers of lava moving away from the erupting fountains and craters and as they flow freely, cooling and crumbling debris builds up along the edges, slowly increasing the depth of the channels where the lava is running. This creates a landscape of rivers of flowing lava filled in between with much looser, broken up rock and (I assume) much easier to wash away by flooding, leaving the rivers of more solid lava in between. Now when I drive through the canyon past Lake Lenore toward Sun Lakes I imagine the canyon walls being the exposed edges of those more solid rivers of lava and the space between completely cleared of rock as the debris field channeling the rivers. Does that make any sense at all. Are the mountains of debris downstream mostly columnar or mostly broken up rock like that in Iceland?

[@richardlawton1023]

Im inside close to my 80 degrees orchids.

[@skipper2285]

Nick and Joel beating their heads literally against rocks, showing us how much we just don't know even after 100+ years of scientific inquiry and field work.

[@lucyj1261]

WASHINGTON HIGH- 1907, see skywalker comment

[@briankepner7569]

I keep going back to my imagination of a giant flood basalt event moving across a landscape filling in the valleys and then you have this region of chaos like there is a deep lake there and that the lava flowed down into it. Maybe even not a lake but a great canyon that already established highly vertical differences. So what you're seeing on the surface is the preservation of that deep canyon that existed there or deep lake with its structural ridges. Possibly an artifact from previous flood events in itself a type of coulee I guess. That's why I love watching your show makes me think. However I'm untrained and probably a runniness it's still a fun way to look at things. So what would happen if your giant flood of basalt ran into a steep canyon how would it present today. What if you filled up the Grand canyon with basalt and let it weather over time and let the geological processes continue. Would also comes to mind is the differences in material density at these locations if there's a flood basalt cap it's going to be much more dense than the surrounding rock or the original topography. Thank you for making my day more interesting

[@101rotarypower]

Like the idea of putting head shots on a "popsicle stick" I think that would fit in well with approachability and inclusivity this channel tries to facilitate.

[@dave082360]

You mean THAT'S the hammer you lost in the video (bounced on end and dropped in between)? He rescued it for you? Frking aeesome?

[@GeoFan-uk4fi]

Alan Ipswich Uk

[@billstronk4321]

5x5

[@wildwolfwind6557]

[@normanzimmerman5029]

Rocks are us