Episode P - Bretz in the Scablands

[@jameskilpatrick7790]

Hi Nick, I'd like to address the conservation of all of this concentrated material that you're collecting and presenting. Having it on your website is wonderful for all of us right now, but what about in 40 years, when someone else wants to access it? I hope you'll consider a print/digital archive being set up at the CWU library. Basically an archive of all of the papers, photos, etc. that relate to your streams. Assuming the videos survive that long, (and that's an assumption, possibly a big one) there really needs to be accompanying material. Thanks for all that you've done to bring so much to all of us!

[@jameskilpatrick7790]

Agreed. It's largely going to fall on the librarians to keep media accessible. Over time, every form of storage will become obsolete, and Librarians will become responsible for keeping it in a format that will be available to the current researchers. Print is actually pretty decent, in contrast with current, rapidly-evolving digital media. I'd include the video streams along with the supporting material I previously mentioned, as part of the necessary archive. Maybe every 10 years or so, (unless a stable format emerges) the existing media can be transposed to a newer format. Current digital media is extremely fragile, which is insufficiently recognized. The mantra that "Once it's on the Internet, it's immortal", is absolute rubbish.

[@sandymartipoor6779]

Working on something to help

[@rosemariemann1719]

@@jameskilpatrick7790 The modern technology is amazing , but printed paper ( i.e.,books,📖, remember them ?!😊) last 500 or more years.... Nick Zentner's videos are a fascinating collection already😊. They make such a valuable archive, and I think it's wonderful that Geology in this form is so accessible to us all👍. I've really enjoyed learning about ancient events that shaped our world : it has added to my ongoing interest in general physical geography.🌎. Many Thanks 😊🌹. 🇬🇧😊🦉💙🌎⛏️🇬🇧

[@vinnynorthwest]

Nick, on the technical side of things you have become a master! The audio and video, switching of cameras, etc is perfect. I know you had many frustrations along the way, but you persevered and mastered it all. You’ve come a long way since days of the cozy-fort, although we fondly remember those days too. Thanks!

[@mettenna2635]

Bringing to light the explorations of the geologists of the last century is not only history, it's a revitalization of their work when you wrap it into modern research. The enthusiasm of viewers and their amazing contributions to the story are a measure of how inspiring this approach is. Just keeps getting better and better.

[@jasonmccord7325]

I love the robot!! And the walk off,,,, Fantastic 😂😂

[@beckyd712]

Thank you Nick Zentner and all the Zentnerds! I missed the live, am so grateful for replay. Stay warm and well, blessed be!

[@wendyspicer8588]

Note to self. When you open Pandora's box do not be surprise at what comes out. The positive reaction is a sign of respect for you.

[@JanetHouck-h5h]

Watching on Monday, 1/15, from SW Washington, Clark County, in the shadow of MSH. She is quiet and beautiful beneath her winter coat. Mt. Adams is to the east and south of her, Mt Hood sits quietly to the south across the river.

[@yimmymurph3135]

Thanks so much Nick

[@mbvoelker8448]

I must admit that, at this point, I'm rather lost. But I shall persevere and perhaps it will all click at some point. I *do* tend to *watch* by listening while working on my stained glass or needlework and only glancing at the screen from time to time rather than watching intently, but the experience remains a good one and I do learn things. :)

[@larrygrimaldi1400]

Love to see the seasons change out that office window

[@petemarquardt8099]

Thank you

[@yukigatlin9358]

That was great narratives with confusions and all, Nick!!😃💗I loved being in the directed confusion with you!!😆 We don't really know the whole picture of Ice Age Floods yet, maybe nobody does but, in bits and pieces... That's the fun of it, trying to scientifically put pieces together, and imagine how it might be look like..., finding out how Bretz and other geologists evolve their conclusions and questions!! To be able to understand the process of those thoughts in some way in my mind is thought provoking and very exciting!! Thank you, Nick!!🥰

[@acfanter]

Wonderful broadcast! 🎉

[@spamletspamley672]

And all this excellent travel and logistics, was before the world had seen a plastic bag!

[@wtglb]

Love Shawn Willsey! Was watching his live stream this morning!

[@jamesdownard1510]

@2:00:00 of course J would have been pissed not just at the typo on the publication date, but of their insistence on sticking a period after his first name, which was just J. I had a high school physics teacher back in 1960s from southern background, who had just initials like that , after which people made up names to go with them.

[@aryu-bts613]

Love Shawn Wilsey! That livestream was so cool, historical but a real live drone view was as close as you can get WOW. It's still amazing that 100+ yrs ago how did they know so much similar to what's being seen, measured and found today?

[@scottwoodland1]

Hi Nick, My grandma used the term shanks mare or pony and she meant I was to walk. Since my Dad was born in 1925, I believe her usage to be colloquial to the time. 1:49:18

[@acfanter]

Absolutely crazy … the world’s greatest erratic easter egg!

[@acfanter]

I didn’t get to finish during the live… but wow… I am so excited to see the interaction between modern&historic geos. Very cool Milkman Zinger

[@rosemariemann1719]

17 min's : " I'm your host, Ned Zinger ..." I remember when someone wrote that and you said, " He can't even get my name right !" It's funny how the wrong name has "stuck", and makes a sort of running joke , when it pops up now and then.😊 Jan 20, 2024 , chilly England 🇬🇧: north has had snow and minus 10 C....☃️ Just been watching Paul Beckwith video about " GreenDrill" project on Greenland. Your geology videos made a basis for following the information in the ( literally ) ground - breaking work. If Greenland's ice all melts, sea levels will rise 24 feet...makes the climate change crisis even more urgent... Nice to see all the folk writing from so many places across the world : your videos are so good, and your enthusiasm and humour spark inspiring extra interest in geology.😊🇬🇧 🇬🇧🌋⛏️💙🦉😊🇬🇧

[@jacotacomorocco]

Still Learning, Still Thankful

[@wtglb]

Drone guy is Johann, I was watching that, the rift opening was fascinating!

[@mitrawets]

When getting in to details, it’s very interesting to discern and define how sediments arrived at their current location. I keep thinking that it is possible to have ice below the running waters with sediment. The flows are running on ice! Plus, different times of ice/floods/shifts/quakes.

[@tiltajoel]

100%. There's a lot to consider there, but sediment production, transport, and deposition are key elements of the story.

[@DW-kg8hq]

I love that snowy view out your window. Glad you ran long, missed the first 40 minutes. So after some of that forever sale at Aldi I'll be back to watch the first 40. Thank you Nick

[@binkolney196]

FYI there is an obvious glacier erratic 12 miles south of Spokane at the intersection of Elder and Paradise roads which can be seen on Google Maps satellite image ...

[@therockybutteguitarslideco2390]

Hello from Rocky Butte in PDX. ITS 8:57 PM local time here, eager for another story in the ongoing ice age saga.

[@danielstevens5135]

Shank's mare meansON FOOT. He was walking.

[@SaveYourselfGents]

The screenshot used for the video literally and figuratively shows where the Scablands water came from.

[@anaritamartinho1340]

Seing in replay

[@woodruffashbourne8372]

Shanks mare means "on foot".

[@deanszczepanski453]

What does it mean to travel by Shank's Mare? Noun. shanks' mare (countable and uncountable, plural shanks' mares) (US, idiomatic) One's own legs used for walking; to "travel by shanks' mare" or "ride [on] shanks' mare" is to walk to your destination.

[@teacherdustinpnw]

i'm a fan of "hoofing it"

[@vickyrex4500]

Shanks mare= walking under your own steam...according to my great grandma.

[@johncabrall7826]

Hi Nick, John Cabrall from El Cerrito, CA: WATER, WATER, WATER! WHAT DOES THE GLAZIER RETREAT LOOK LIKE? WHERE DOES ALL THAT WATER GO? LOOK AT THE DEEP CANYON/VALLEY IN THE LATAH VALLEY. THE FLOOR IS FLAT, AND AT THE ELEVATION OF THE SCABLAND SOUTH OF IT. READ BRETZ'S FIELD NOTES OF 1925.

[@JeffDretinator]

Kahlotus wa, Emma pond,on the Lewis and Clark trail.whats up!!!

[@billy-go9kx]

I watched Shawn too. But at least my time was EST.

[@teacherdustinpnw]

I think I am thinking along the same lines as Zoltan; we keep talking about a unified glacier system, it seems like everything we have talked about is based on that premise and I am wondering if you are going to have Jerome clarify more about the Greater glaciers in the Okanogan, and over towards Alberta and how they reached down south in their various lobes. Is there any break up of the glaciers at stress points, like over mountain ranges and spurs? Is there the possibility of large segments of glaciers, coming down, then breaking free and being left behind from the receding ice shelfs? Would these in turn cause greater depressions at thier spots, as Spokane is at a low point in the valley, compared to the praries around it? Perhaps even Coeur D'Alene and Lake pend Oreille are remnants of such 'abandoned glaciers?' ... so many other thoughts going roound these rabbit holes!!! Thank you for another brilliant presentation with so many different perspectives and ideas!!! And thanks agin to all those supporting this adventure!!!

[@teacherdustinpnw]

p.s. I am so excited to be all caught up, but sorry I will not be able to join Thursday... teaching and all... but look forward to seeing you LIVE on Sunday!!!

[@vpohl5902]

Hello, from the other end of the Straight Creek Fault. I wanna know how the earlier(1-2.6MYA) glaciations affected Vancouver Island. They would only have dropped sea level 40-60m, and isostatically lifted the uncovered Island, barring large ice cap growing on it. How bout it, Gerome?

[@RussellSenior]

The world doesn't stand still. When you moved in StreetView, you were also shifting in time, maybe even to a completely different day due to the way streetview imagery is put together, but minimally several seconds. That explains why the ghost disappeared.

[@sincererespects6658]

Nick, Pantops viewed as a disconnected factual event of layering/(not to be always conflated with strata), if in isolation, could possibly be taken as a cliffside collapse, and a jumbled snowballing of confetti.

[@KSparks80]

Thx, Nick. See ya Thursday. Maybe earlier if your "streaming" turns itself on and you don't know it! lol Careful!

[@mr.morelock]

OPEN CAMERA!!! 🤣

[@jeffbybee5207]

QUESTION FROM THIS SHOW WHAT ARE THE PRAIRIES? SIGNIFIENCE DEFINITION? THANKYOU VERY MUCH NICK!

[@gordonbrackett7220]

Shank's Mare means "On foot".

[@andrewomalley2688]

To your photos of reddish "boulders" embedded in a matrix of darker sands: You mention the idea that those are older silty ice deposits, but I ask if those might be clasts of hardened loess/ caliche that was being picked up and eroded away by a flood and then deposited.

[@woodruffashbourne8372]

How about "Older, wider/ Younger, narrower"

[@PhilTaska]

Glenn's work is amazing as well as Nick's! P1-22: 1/4 mile east of Pantops Station. Gneissic granite, schistosity dipping 35 degrees to SE...Pegmatite veins and dikes. 8/1/22 Bretz Field Notes . Pegmatite veins? Gneissic granite? This is old rock. How did it get exposed here? Uplift plus erosion? So much material would have to be removed to expose that old rock.

[@ansarahjackie]

Shanks mare -- "used to refer to one's own legs and the action of walking as a means of conveyance." - Google

[@paulliebenberg3410]

Nick, thanks for answering my question RE Stage 2 carbon dating, seems like there should be something preserved in the periphery of the floods/deposits. Maybe the ice sheets are just so sterile that there's nothing (living) left to preserve as they retreat? Ice down to Tri-Cities would complement this. Funny thing we stopped watching this live at your goodbye and then watched Itchy Boots! On replay I see that you had done the same thing. And had consequences! (Noraly demands your full attention!)

[@tiltajoel]

Some of the most reliable MIS 2 radiocarbon ages seem to come from plant and animal macro-fossils in terrestrial flood deposits (e.g. mammoth bones), as well as marine micro-fossils (forams) in offshore deposits. However, it can be a challenge to prove that the dated material was not re-worked, and thus older by some unknown amount from the flood event, and/or to link the enclosing flood deposit on the periphery to high-energy deposits or erosive features in the core of the Channeled Scabland.

[@trevorinscho9762]

4th Dimension at work right there ! ( btw- visualize : converting 2D - cross sections > 3D > 4D ) ~1:08:31 |{ TEAMWORK : ratios } ; Intermediator ; Ned Zinger : Minions (e.g. Eugene Team ... other participation of viewers ) : "Persons of 'Certification' *degrees. : others. btw- very intimate with winter coat (Ep. O). aka VI BC Trevor Inscho

[@lethaleefox6017]

Chat ended about 11:31 time on chat entries ... with about 147 left when the chat ended... interesting ending with the old green car.

[@vinmansbakery]

I enjoyed that, too! 🚙

[@bearowen5480]

I'm a railroad "goober", not a geologist "groupie", so be forewarned. Thomas Large's reference to travel by "Shanks mares" doesn't ring a bell with me. "Mares" is an obvious reference to horses, but my extensive knowledge of railroading, particularly in Eastern Washington, casts doubt on the travel by train theory in this instance. An earlier reference to local train rides used to transport the Bretz party's camping gear underscores the prominence of railroads in rural Washington at that time. Highways and roads were still primitive affairs in Eastern Washington in the 1920s. Virtually every town east of the cascades is located where it is today because of the railroads. Local passenger trains were plentifully available at the turn of the century. For example, in the early 20th Century, over twenty passenger trains a day passed through Colfax! Spokane was a major rail hub served by six Class One passenger carrying railroads and was for many years the second most populated city in the state. Railroads famously were built in river valleys wherever possible in order to exploit the low inclines they provided, thus their inextricable relationship to topographical geology. Toot, toot!

[@lethaleefox6017]

13:29 after start Frozen Blueman poses. Green car at 2:35:08

[@johnnash5118]

My Live Chat question was: “IS THERE ANY POSSIBILITY THAT EVENT #6 OR AN EARLIER OKANAGAN LOBE DRAINAGE WAS CAPABLE OF MORE PRECIP THAN ESTIMATED, THUS POTENTIALLY EXTENDING THE LOBE SOUTH TOWARD PASCO OVER THE CFBs?” Should one assume that the Central WA. climate was too dry due to the rain shadow effect? But was it as dry or dryer than now? Did the Okanagan Lobe even require moisture independent of its own ice flows, or could it have conveyed South via gravity regardless of local conditions? Pasco is 500’ lower than Bridgeport, @150 miles away, @3.3’ drop per mile. What about wind transport of ice crystals? The windswept ice of Victoria Land in Antarctica stretches for hundreds of desolate kilometers. This area receives less precipitation than most of the world's hot deserts. Loess is also transported in this manner, why not ice in a cold/dry Central WA. paleo-climate? I keep an open mind about questioning popular long-standing narratives.

[@tiltajoel]

The main accumulation areas for the Okanogan lobe were to the north (e.g. the Coast Mountains of Canada). The ice sourced from the north flowed into the Columbia basin, which was an ablation area. Regarding Okanogan ice reaching Pasco, the boundary between glacial topography and rolling loess-covered hills on the Waterville Plateau seems to clearly delineate the maximum extent that the Okanogan lobe ever reached, marked by the Withrow moraine.

[@johnnash5118]

Thank you for replying @@tiltajoel ​​⁠Is the loess evidence mentioned in your second paragraph from Event #6?

[@trevorinscho9762]

Please " TURN ON : LIVE CHAT IN REPLAY " Thanks @nickzentner PS- Slept in , Caught the tail end. Now catch-up Mode. TIA

[@audreynims4940]

Glad to see it's not just me because I've spent 20 minutes trying to figure out what's wrong with my setup!

[@acfanter]

I think he did … it’s fun!!

[@Shelbyj13]

Live chat is thee during replay but it's not available right away. You have to wait for a little bit... Maybe a few hours but idk the exact amount of time.

[@churlburt8485]

Being they got off and on trains, horses would not be feasible. If some one would be willing to search the Ephrate, Moses Lake, and Othello newspaper archives, there might be articles about Bretz.

[@davidpnewton]

Not necessarily true. They might have hired horses.

[@librarious26]

Where can we find the issue of The Pacific Northwesterner you showed at 1:27:59, with the Sola and Kiefer article about Bretz? You mentioned that it's available for us, but I don't see it listed on your website under either Bretz or Floods. Thank you, Professor!

[@jimblack2171]

www.geology.cwu.edu/facstaff/nick/gFLOODS/2023_Sola_WelcomeBretz.pdf

[@phillipjacobson4457]

Why is it so difficult for modern humans to visualize that humans can travel over ice glaciers? And that a bridge between Russia and Alaska, was made of solid ice sheet on top of the ocean? And humans can just walk across? Raindeer and sleds, dog sleds, kayaks made from whale bone frames, and seal skins. Point is back in the ice age what was the temperature -50 degrees feranheit? I have walked across frozen lakes myself. Ice fishing. No land bridge required, just islands of land, and ice. When they say land bridge is this what they envisioned? I truly believe humans are way older then current time lines say.

[@churlburt8485]

at 2 minutes check the received date. Could it have been printed before the oral presentation?

[@lorrinbarth1969]

'Shanks mare' means you walk.

[@acfanter]

MAYBE “Wider” vs “Deeper” Is a better description…. Vs bigger/smaller

[@churlburt8485]

what is a kamey deposit?

[@ArmChairgeology]

Shank's mares......on foot. obvious.

[@nobody8328]

Help, please! Im trying to show Bretz's maps to a surveyor, but i can't get to them. It turns out that surveying in the 1920s was even more difficult (and heavier!) than I'd realized. I went to Nick's website. I located the drop down menu. I saw the name Bretz and clicked on it. It took me to a CWU page. The only relevant words on that page are Nick Zentner. When i click on his name, it takes me right back to Nick's homepage. Round and round I go. Am i doing something wrong? Is it because im mobile? Plz halp.

[@CAMacKenzie]

equivocal--uncertain, doubtful, ambiguous, subject to different interpretations, subject to suspicion on shank's mare--travelling on foot. Rare today, but not unknown. Earlier forms date at least from 18th century.

[@johnberggren3325]

Hi Nick. Currently watch Brett in scab.lands.repeatedly in this series I have remenised about the Nisqually flood which happened in the 1960s when an ice dam in the Nisqually glacier broke. Have you done ANY work with mt Rainier ? I did not spend any time at the Park until long after the Kautz flood