JACK DEMPSEY DESTROYED THE MOST HATED MAN IN BOXING

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ET'S RAMBLINGS: BOXING & STRENGTH HISTORY

Күн бұрын

In 1917, four men were in contention to challenge heavyweight champ Jess Willard. One of them was the most dislike boxer of his time. Another was an unknown westerner who had worked as a sparring partner for him, and very much disliked him!!
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@Steve_Whitlock Ай бұрын

Marciano was on a “no-lose” mission to achieving greatness and he did so by simply out-working and out-conditioning all fighting foes. His work ethic was nothing short of remarkably consistent and disciplined: hours of running, gym work, sparring, push-ups and sit-ups, countless medicine-ball thumps to the gut. Marciano was committed to his training regimen. Rocky is also remembered and honored for his class as an individual, not only his 49-0. He never boasted or ridiculed his opponents. Regardless what others may think, Rocky Marciano was a great champion.

@beatlejimbo54 Ай бұрын

*Nobody ever wants to discuss little Rocky's resume. I wouldn't either, have you seen it? It's no wonder so many Rocky fans are terrified to even look at it let alone discuss it. It's horrendous. Anything, and i mean anything to avoid his appalling F-LEVEL resume. I mean every champ fights their fair share of cans but nobody and i mean nobody fought as many F-LEVEL bums as he did. Notice all the hundreds of 'Quotes' Rocky fans have to use. Don Turner said this or Ali said that etc etc. When have we ever seen a Rocky fan use Rocky's resume to defend him? How about 'NEVER'. Louis Walcott Charles Moore already had "'409"' fights before they faced Rocky, there's nothing honorable about that. It's no Joke, do the research:* Lee Epperson career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL* Jimmy Weeks career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL* Gilbert Cardone career record 0 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL* John Edwards career record 1 win 2 losses *F-LEVEL* Bill Hardeman career record 1 win 7 losses *F-LEVEL* Humphrey Jackson career record 4 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL* Harry Haft career record 12 wins 7 losses *F-LEVEL* James Connolly career record 12 wins 9 losses *F-LEVEL* Harry Bilazarian career record 15 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL* Bob Jefferson career record 3 wins 10 losses *F-LEVEL* Harold Mitchell career record 7 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Gilley Ferron career record 4 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL* Artie Donato career record 7 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL* Johnny Pretzie career record 10 wins 14 losses *F-LEVEL* Don Mogard career record 20 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Pete Louthis career record 32 wins 14 losses *D-LEVEL* Tommy DiGiorgio career record 9 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Kenne Simmons career record 9 wins 22 losses *F-LEVEL* Art Henri career record 18 wins 29 losses *F-LEVEL* Jimmy Walls career record 21 wins 41 losses *F-LEVEL* Ted Lowry career record 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL* Ted Lowry (twice) 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL* Gino Buonvino career record 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Gino Buonvino (twice) 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Joe Dominic career record 18 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL* Eldridge Eatman career record 22 wins 21 losses *F-LEVEL* Willis Applegate career record 12 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Lee Savold career record 104 wins 45 losses *D-LEVEL* Phil Muscato career record 56 wins 23 losses *D-LEVEL* Bill Wilson career record 56 wins 27 losses *D-LEVEL* Johnny Shkor career record 31 wins 19 losses *D-LEVEL* Fred Beshore career record 35 wins 17 losses *D-LEVEL* Jimmy Evans 18 wins 8 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Eddie Ross 19 wins 5 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 debuting amateurs and 7 other opponents with 10 fights or less.* Bob Quinn 20 wins 4 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 13 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Bernie Reynolds 53 wins 13 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 30 opponents with 15 fights or less.* Pat Richards 24 wins 9 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 20 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Carmine Vingo 16 wins 2 losses looks good until you see *ALL 16 wins came against F-LEVEL opponents.* Don Cockell 66 wins 14 losses looks okay until you see the majority of his career was at middleweight and light heavyweight. *By the time he faced Marciano he was suffering from severe glandular disorders that wreaked havoc with his physique. He was sallow-skinned, fat, and had a nasty boil on his neck.* Harry Matthews 90 wins 7 losses is a good B-LEVEL resume until you see *he was a career middleweight moonlighting at light heavyweight.* Matthews weighed 130 lbs vs. Joey Parks who also weighed 130. *Shouldn't one have to beat credible Heavyweight opponents to be respected as a legitimate Heavyweight?* Roland LaStarza *C-LEVEL.* LaStarza Refused fights with Charles, Moore, Walcott, Louis, Valdez, Satterfield, Bivins, Maxim, Henry, Baker, Johnson, Pompey, Marshall, Smith, Sheppard etc. In an article in RING magazine after his career LaStarza admitted as much! Rex Layne *C-LEVEL.* Layne vs. LaStarza reminds me of watching two midwest club fighters fighting a 4 rounder on an old ESPN card from Muncie, In. Two guys who were not well schooled, standing in front of each other acting like they were insulted if the other guy missed them with a punch. A lot of right hand leads, a lot of jabs with the rear foot leaving the canvas, little/no counter punching, just two guys willing to get hit but showing little boxing skill. Look how bad Layne swings and misses. What an oaf. Joe Walcott *C-LEVEL.* Low-power Walcott's high profile losses are what elevated his status and built up his credentials, not his wins. The fact that Walcott was granted (6) title attempts in a (5½) year span speaks volumes about how weak the Heavyweight division must have been at this time. But the most astonishing fact is (5) of these title opportunities came immediately after a Walcott loss!! That's because Walcott was one of the IBC's original fighters. He signed on when Louis retired. Fear and violence were the linchpins of Carbo’s system and the bedrock of his power. Directly or indirectly, he controlled scores of judges, officials, managers, promoters, and fighters. His power became such that no big match was made or title awarded without his acquiescence. Charles, Walcott, Marciano had mobbed managers, Charles a pair named Tom Tennas and Jacob Mintz, Walcott one Nick Bocchicchio and Marciano one Frankie Carbo. Archie Moore *A-LEVEL* MW/LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. Heck, Low-Power 171/173 lb Charles beat him 3 times, 182 lb Patterson obliterated him, and 188 lb tiny cruiser Marciano smashed him. Every time Moore stepped-up in competition he got KO'd. Ezzard Charles *A-LEVEL* LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. William Dettloff’s biography *'Ezzard Charles: A Boxing Life'* documents that Charles first felt weakness in his limbs, and some numbness, as early as 1951. This was 3 years before the Marciano fights and it was also the same year he lost his title. Ezzard, his family, Ezzard's trainer's Ray Arcel, Jimmy Brown, Chickie Ferrera and Bill Gore all said they noticed signs of ALS in 1951. Bert Sugar said, *"His trainer, Ray Arcel said, that even now, at this stage in 51, and then on into the middle 50's, you could see the beginning, the traces of the disease, that would later claim his life, Lou Gehrig's disease in Charles."* --@ 35:01 ESPN Ringside - Rocky Marciano The IBC had links to organized crime; most notably Frankie Carbo. *“Carbo,”* Russell Sullivan explains, *“established a well-organized centralized system of control over boxing. The system featured scores of managers who operated as front men for Carbo. Once a promising fighter arrived on the scene, one of Carbo’s managers would muscle in on his ownership. Rocky's manager, Al Weill, was a boxing politician who held hands with the mob. The Italian mob controlled it all, from the trainers and managers to the reporting journalists, with a combination of intimidation and financial backing ensuring everybody the mob wanted was under their control. The entire eastern seaboard was Italian, it was all Italian. Even the commissioner of boxing was Italian. In May 1949 Weill became the matchmaker for the IBC. That meant Marciano could fight against carefully chosen opponents when and where Weill wanted. Eventually the verdict was damning; 25 years in Alcatraz for Carbo. Marciano visited Carbo frequently."*

@beatlejimbo54 Ай бұрын

Most people openly admit that the versions of Charles, Moore, and Walcott that he fought were far from prime (The Louis fight really doesn't deserve to be brought up). So it isn't the quality of Rocky's competition that his reputation is based on among the greats, it is that famous record 49-0. If Rocky's 49-0 record is the basis of his greatness then the fighters on that record should be the very best that were available. But by my reckoning that is the furthest thing from the truth. Infact when you look at the highest ranked fighters of the era, and then you look at his record, it's scandalous how many he didn't fight. Many of the ones he DID choose to fight are just as scandalous. Top fighters Marciano definitely should have fought that he didn't. *1)* Harold Johnson *2)* Oakland Billy Smith *3)* Yolande Pompey *4)* Curtis Hatchetman Sheppherd *5)* Clarence Henry *6)* Joey Maxim *7)* Marty Marshall *8)* Bob Satterfield *9)* Jimmy Bivins *10)* Lloyd Marshall *11)* Nino Valdes *12)* Willie Pastrano *13)* Cleveland Williams had 35 wins 2 losses when Rocky retired in April 1956. Rocky had plenty of opportunities to fight Cleveland in 1952 or 1953. Those are just the definites, we could add many other names (like Tommy Jackson, Dan Bucceroni or even Bob Baker) that while not as good, are definitely better than some of the guys he DID fight that make up that "legendary" record. Guys like these; Lee Epperson (Career Record 0-1) Jimmy Weeks (Career Record 0-1) Gilbert Cardone (Career Record 0-3) John Edwards (Career Record 1-2) Bill Hardeman (Career Record 1-7) Humphrey Jackson (Career Record 4-3) Johnnie Pretzie (Career Record 10-14) Bob Jefferson (Career Record 3-10) Gilley Ferron (Career Record 4-13) Tommy DiGiorgio (Career Record 9-15) Artie Donato (Career Record 7-13) Harry Haft (Career Record 12-7) James Connoly (Career Record 12-9) Harry Bilazarian (Career Record 15-12) Joe Dominic (Career Record 18-12) Don Mogard (Career Record 20-16) Jimmy Walls (Career Record 21-41) Eldridge Eatman (Career Record 22-21). Eldridge had just lost 7 of his last 8 fights. Why would a 26-0 boxer fight an *F-LEVEL* diver who had just lost 7 fights? Marciano's 32nd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Keene Simmons who had a career 9 wins 22 losses. Marciano's 33rd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Harold Mitchell who had a career 7 wins 16 losses. *(Harold had just lost 10 fights in a row before diving against Rocky)* Marciano's 34th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Art Henri who had a career 18 wins 29 losses. Marciano's 35th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Willis Applegate who had a career 12 wins 16 losses. None of these guys beat anyone of note! Many of these guys he even fought pretty far into his career when there were obviously alternatives. In light of this should this 49-0 record be as revered as it is to some?

@martindunstan8043 Ай бұрын

You are absolutely spot on regarding Marciano's training regime. He was the consummate professional when it came to conditioning, I would say Marvin Hagler had a similar attitude when it came to training.

@johnsammon6741 Ай бұрын

It didn't hurt that his manager was head of the Boston mob. All his fights were predetermined

@thebigfist Ай бұрын

@johnsammon6741 That's baloney! Don Mogard and Ted Lowry, two tough, tough customers who both went 10 rounds with Rock, said they never encountered such a well conditioned, tough athlete in the ring.Why would Marciano have had to run 6 miles per day in combat boots and do football shoulder pad squeezes while treading water in a swimming pool, if he knew all of his fights were fixed? If you checked the sequences of the events of each fight , you would realize that what you wrote was nonsense that could not possibly have been true! You should recant your vacuous statement, as you've shamed and embarrassed yourself with such foolishness on this thread.

@davidabney7700 Ай бұрын

Mr. ET, I read that in Dempsey's early days, while serving as a sparring partner to Carl Morris, Jack had went into a small diner, with hardly any money to his name. Jack was sitting at the front counter eating a sandwich, with a cup of coffee. Carl Morris walks in the diner, spots Jack at the front counter eating a sandwich, he could barely afford. Morris walks over and plops down on the stool next to Dempsey. Morris orders a big meal, and while he was waiting, he starts talking to his sparring partner, seated next to him. Morris started talking to Jack, needling him about his sandwich, needling him about being "his" sparring partner and that would be all he would ever be good for. Nowadays, looking back through 100+years of boxing history, that insult would be mild in today's boxing, but never-ever in early 1900's USA. Jack used the word "hate" when speaking about him. Morris didn't offer his sparring partner a free meal, he was a class ass.Jack said that he left the diner determined to get resolution later. Doc Kearns comes into the picture around this time. He becomes Jack's manager, and what followed was that Jack would become one of the greatest Heavyweight Champions of all time. Dempsey got payback on Morris, when he kayoed Morris in two fights. Thanks for this video Mr. ET. I believe this is how the diner scene went down. I'm writing this from memory and my advanced age will sometimes throw me a knuckle ball. Sorry for the length here sir.

@ET-RAMBLINGS Ай бұрын

David, you've got a class-A memory!! That's pretty much the story according to Dempsey, except he was eating a donut, not a sandwich. No apology necessary for the length of your post. I enjoyed it!!

@johnsewell6593 Ай бұрын

David : Another beautiful piece of boxing history , my good man - will you please write a book and I'll take the first copy. Whenever I see a new piece on Boxing ( Sorry , the " Sweet Science), I imnediately look for your name my boy, because you're always there with some delicious morsel of Boxing History. JRS.

@martindunstan8043 Ай бұрын

New sub here,that was an informative and enjoyable piece of work, I appreciate it when someone takes time to discuss fighters from yesteryear, these men and their respective era's should never be forgotten. Thanks, and have a Merry Christmas✌️🥊

@ET-RAMBLINGS Ай бұрын

Thanks, Martin. Merry Christmas to you, too!

@jacksoncoleman-burke2630 Ай бұрын

WHEN I WAS ABOUT !3 i took the subway to times square and walking over to msg on 51st i passed by this restaurant on the west side of B'way and outside of the front door was this huge man who i recognized as jack dempsey and when i stopped to look at him, he said "how ya do'in, kid. I smiled at him and kept walking.

@RonaldLevao Ай бұрын

Great memory; wish I had done the same. I believe that was also Jack's greeting to Bob Dylan when his producer brought the skinny young man into the restaurant (Jack also told him to put on a few pounds.) You are good company!!

@darylCobb-u2d Ай бұрын

In his autobiography, Dempsey stated that Morris was the only opponent he hated!

@david-pb4bi Ай бұрын

You wouldn’t think so the way Dempsey roughed up every person he ever fought.

@darylCobb-u2d Ай бұрын

@@david-pb4bi True but that is what he said.

@david-pb4bi Ай бұрын

@@darylCobb-u2d I know read his life story seriously hard dude. It probably didn’t matter if he liked you or not would still try to destroy you regardless.

@Stout_Krout Ай бұрын

*6' 3" 225lb 78" reach Super Heavyweight Usyk proved that size matters. Past Heavyweight Champions 165lb Fitzsimmons, 175lb Burns, 181lb Charles, 182lb Patterson and little 184lb (Marciano) were simply too small.*

@Stout_Krout Ай бұрын

*Usyk only had 1 Heavyweight bout in 2019,* *only 1 Heavyweight bout in 2020,* *only 1 Heavyweight bout in 2021,* *only 1 Heavyweight bout in 2022,* *only 1 Heavyweight bout in 2023,* *only 2 Heavyweight bouts in 2024.* *Usyk has a long way to go to catch Joe Louis' 25 title defenses and Larry Holmes 20 title defenses. 225 lb Low-Power Usyk has only defended his belts against Joshua, Dubois, Fury, yet Usyk fans are already calling him GOAT. Defending one's belts against a mere 3 boxers is far from GOAT status. For Pete's sake Usyk's only had 23 bouts. In 24 rounds giant Fury couldn't even walk Usyk down. Fury was slow and lethargic. 285 lb Bakole 285 lb Zhang and 250 lb Itamua has real power and will definitely walk Usyk down. In reality both Bakole and Dubois have already KO'd Usyk. Usyk wasn't holding his 'Nutsack' vs Dubois, he was holding his stomach. Bakole's only loss was due to a dislocated shoulder.*

@TD-mg6cd Ай бұрын

$8,000 in 1918 would actually be over $167,000 today.

@SeptemberChild1835 Ай бұрын

In Biden’s America?

@jamespelton2921 Ай бұрын

I met Rockys trainer in Brocton Ma and he told me that Rocky absolutely hated running.But what he did enjoy doing was putting weights on his wrists and climb into the Brocton YMCA pool and simulate rounds in a fight until he could no longer even lift his arms.His bit of secret training!

@idx1941 Ай бұрын

He didn't wear weights in the pool. He just did uppercuts in the pool.

@StuStevens-rn7rb Ай бұрын

No wonder he had the stamina he showed. 😊

@JonfitzFitzjohn-k6s Ай бұрын

Nice One Mate thanks and keep them Coming

@michaelhurley545 Ай бұрын

To bad they did not have film on so many fights and fighters back then..

@RonaldLevao Ай бұрын

Agreed! But still it's amazing what is available on youtube

@DavidBaird-py9er Ай бұрын

Never heard of Morris thats how good he was 😮

@ET-RAMBLINGS Ай бұрын

David, for decades boxing magazines and many books focused only on champions or "uncrowned champs like Sam Langford; subsequently, top tier contenders were forgotten. Most were, in fact, very good.

@DavidBaird-py9er Ай бұрын

@ET-RAMBLINGS I take your point mate 👍

@iancotteral717 Ай бұрын

David there's a great amount of people like you who know very little about the internals of the fight game. There are great throngs of blokes with unlimited talent, that have gone through boxing gym's, that never made it to main events for one reason or another.

@rafflesxyz4800 Ай бұрын

Great video well presented. Thanks for doing that.

@robertungerbuehler9076 Ай бұрын

Johnson, Dempsey, Louis, Marciano, Tyson, plus couple others, all kicked like mules!

@theoriginal.Bobbyd Ай бұрын

So did/does Super Heavyweights Foreman Ibeabuchi Bakole Zhang Itamau

@SeptemberChild1835 Ай бұрын

Foreman, Shavers?

@davidcopson5800 Ай бұрын

I didn't know Jack Dempsey had destroyed Don King.

@Prfdt3 Ай бұрын

Jack Johnson takes the prize not jess willard.

@AlexWaluhoo 12 күн бұрын

Dempsey was also known to use a special mix of something similar to plaster of Paris at times. It wasn't an uncommon practice i that era. the mysterious mixture may have been lost over time. It supposedly would look normal but harden jsut about when the fight started. Yes some say Ricard was behind those rumors of loaded gloves but I saw an interview of a guy who was one of dempseys seconds who said that it wasnt uncommon for guys to do and jack did to when they thought they needed it. Sports illustrated tried to do a current plaster of paris in the 60's method and claimed they dunked the dempsey myth. When you look how Dempseys hands looked, when he punched or put them at his side they looked weighted in that willard fight. Boxing was born lived and will die in corruption but I love it anyway.