Evaluating the Modern Stocked Pistol: USW-320 at Desert Brutality 2022

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Forgotten Weapons

Forgotten Weapons

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 727
@broke417
@broke417 2 жыл бұрын
Hearing Ian say "pro gamer move" made my morning
@santerisuuri5139
@santerisuuri5139 2 жыл бұрын
Lol
@lamborn3D
@lamborn3D 2 жыл бұрын
Same xD
@Tallmios
@Tallmios 2 жыл бұрын
It's asking to be meme'd.
@u250_fpv2
@u250_fpv2 2 жыл бұрын
Truely a pro-gamer move, but reality shows there is a big difference in the outcome ;)
@vikkye2691
@vikkye2691 2 жыл бұрын
It got the most genuine smile outta me that iv had in awhile
@Schrodingers_kid
@Schrodingers_kid 2 жыл бұрын
Every time Ian says "Pro gamer move" I get motivation to live for a couple more hours
@LUR1FAX
@LUR1FAX 2 жыл бұрын
Next thing we know Ian McCollum will be shouting gamer words when he misses.
@bobhill3941
@bobhill3941 2 жыл бұрын
Me too, all the references reinforce my feeling that competing like this is just a real life fps!
@bengunderman5382
@bengunderman5382 2 жыл бұрын
His Liz Lemon video is the only thing keeping me going for finals.
@pilot778spartan3
@pilot778spartan3 2 жыл бұрын
@@LUR1FAX 💀
@NutjobGTO
@NutjobGTO 2 жыл бұрын
@@LUR1FAX if he yells 'Poggers!' at any point, I'm out
@candidmoe8741
@candidmoe8741 2 жыл бұрын
Ian is a truly sport man. Winning is not his higher priority, but testing things and having fun.
@spairus4492
@spairus4492 2 жыл бұрын
I feel like I've seen this exact comment before, and now I'm a bit creeped
@fullmindstorm
@fullmindstorm 2 жыл бұрын
Yes learning 🙌 Im sure by now he knows whats the best gear to take, but learning the outliers of what is better so surprise and push things forward is something he wants to discover.
@devongrey4135
@devongrey4135 2 жыл бұрын
@@Chino56751 Yes, but you have to be smart about it. The objective is winning the FIGHT. The competition is not the fight. It is training for the fight. If you optimize to win the competition, you are not optimizing the LEARNING that helps you win the fight.
@CurtHowland
@CurtHowland 2 жыл бұрын
I'm imagining the long-barrel Artillery Luger with stock in that same situation. I just can't imagine tossing it in the dirt to pick up the kettlebell. "Here, let me put a cloth down first..."
@s3watch
@s3watch 2 жыл бұрын
would thr fkbruno with shoulder stock be a better long range companion?
@AshleyPomeroy
@AshleyPomeroy 2 жыл бұрын
It's odd to think of the artillery Luger as an actual combat firearm. I'd feel guilty about getting it muddy.
@Ezekiel_Allium
@Ezekiel_Allium 2 жыл бұрын
@@mattrobson3603 I'd still be a bit worried, possibly more so in the mud of the trenches, about the toggle lock action personally
@Tunkkis
@Tunkkis 2 жыл бұрын
@@Ezekiel_Allium I recall the Luger did quite well in the InRangeTV mud test, but I may be misremembering.
@wh8787
@wh8787 2 жыл бұрын
@@Tunkkis it did. The tolerances are so close it's quite difficult for anything to get in. I suspect it isn't the easiest thing to clean if you do get mud in it. Lugers got ditched a lot because they were expensive and pistols just aren't that important a weapon.
@williamflowers9435
@williamflowers9435 2 жыл бұрын
I’d like to see you do comparable stages with a stocked C96 in 7.63x25… scoped Han Solo style. Flatter shooting round, no barrel tilt and the scope for longer shots… and if the spinner still doesn’t cooperate, send the Wookie to rip it’s arms out
@TheSwagDeer
@TheSwagDeer 2 жыл бұрын
*Record scratch* “I bet you’re wondering how I got here”
@aidanernst2199
@aidanernst2199 2 жыл бұрын
Resumes playing baba o’riley
@HereticalKitsune
@HereticalKitsune 2 жыл бұрын
Now that is ballsy, taking a pistol with stock to Desert Brutality. Fascinating results!
@petesheppard1709
@petesheppard1709 2 жыл бұрын
I expect he did much better with his normal gear.
@VosperCDN
@VosperCDN 2 жыл бұрын
Making a Brutality match even more brutal because life is too short to take it easy ..
@murphywd1971
@murphywd1971 2 жыл бұрын
One way you might counteract the parallax problem is to mount suppressor height sights on the gun. If the iron sights are aligned, the dot will be in nearly the same position every time. Really, it's just adding additional reference points to the sight picture.
@maxwood5157
@maxwood5157 2 жыл бұрын
Right, 2 sights are always better than 1
@johndaniels1197
@johndaniels1197 2 жыл бұрын
Honestly, not a bad idea. I'd like to see somebody test that and see what they find.
@murphywd1971
@murphywd1971 2 жыл бұрын
@@johndaniels1197 I use that technique with the red dot sights on my pistols. It works well, but is a bit slower than just picking up the dot. When I can correct my technique and get the dot immediately upon presentation, it'll be a lot better.
@mrkeogh
@mrkeogh 2 жыл бұрын
Or mount an Aimpoint Micro T1/T2? They function just fine on a Glock 🤷🏻‍♂️
@brainkill7034
@brainkill7034 10 ай бұрын
Great shooting but I love the overview at the end. What Ian talks about practical purposes of the firearm make a lot of sense, definitely recommend watching until the end. Thank you for sharing and great shooting!
@Primarch359
@Primarch359 2 жыл бұрын
I would be very interested in seeing this done again with an historical stocked pistol like a high power or c96
@IchNixHabenUsername
@IchNixHabenUsername 2 жыл бұрын
Same result i guess if not worse.
@Primarch359
@Primarch359 2 жыл бұрын
@@IchNixHabenUsername that is my assumption. But assumptions are often flawed. But if our assumption is correct it would underline why the adoption of such pistols fell off a cliff.
@IchNixHabenUsername
@IchNixHabenUsername 2 жыл бұрын
@@Primarch359if its hard with a red dot, usually its not getting easier with irons.
@ecarlate
@ecarlate 2 жыл бұрын
with an artillery luger and the epic tactical shoulder stock made for luger in the 20's, that ian already presented and shooted with :)
@lieutenantcoloneltanyavond8273
@lieutenantcoloneltanyavond8273 2 жыл бұрын
@@IchNixHabenUsername But on the other hand you don't have tilting barrel, which might make them more accurate? Maybe? At least if the gun was in pristine condition, so considering most of them served in one, if not two world wars might be difficult.
@matthewwellborn8468
@matthewwellborn8468 2 жыл бұрын
“Pro gamer move” I love you Ian. Never change.
@TheFanatical1
@TheFanatical1 2 жыл бұрын
Loving that Ian is not last with a not-great stocked pistol.
@El-Burrito
@El-Burrito 2 жыл бұрын
Makes me wonder what those people behind him in ranking were doing/using
@rob6850
@rob6850 2 жыл бұрын
@@El-Burrito once at an indoor range, the guy next to me was using an AR with a red dot. The range officer had to stop him to tell him he was hitting the CEILING. So maybe something along those lines 🤷🏻‍♂️
@CZProtton
@CZProtton 2 жыл бұрын
@@El-Burrito You would be suprised by how bad some people are. There are people unable to hit the target with a pistol at 10 meters after some training. I would guess anyone can hit that after just knowing how to hold the gun... but there you have it.
@bobghengis
@bobghengis 2 жыл бұрын
I think it's likely that they had a zero that had shifted in-between the match and their last range session
@CZProtton
@CZProtton 2 жыл бұрын
@@bobghengis Doubt it, they all nailed their targets at closer range. Its just that tilting barrel pistols are not accurate at all, the pistol red dot sucks and is on a reciprocating slide... Its not a system at all usable for anything more than 100m and that is pushing it.
@Ducaso
@Ducaso 2 жыл бұрын
How difficult do you want this match to be: Ian: *YES*
@B3nNyL3nNy
@B3nNyL3nNy 2 жыл бұрын
I put together a glock model 40 in 10mm with a recover tactical brace and a sig romeo 5 red dot on their optics rail that mounts to the side of the brace. it's a bigger overall package than yours but being able to exploit the 10mm's extra range by using a red dot with very little parallax is quite handy
@atomflunder2
@atomflunder2 2 жыл бұрын
it would be interesting to see this being done with a mp7. wich i think pushes the pistol with a stock concept further to a pcc while not being there completely. but it would probably be difficult to organize this
@philipwilkin2667
@philipwilkin2667 2 жыл бұрын
It would be really interesting to see how the MP7 would do in this match. It is a bit larger, but also designed to be carried in a holster. I would expect it to be really good for this.
@alun7006
@alun7006 2 жыл бұрын
Or a Steyr TMP/SPP - B&T MP9/TP9.
@spairus4492
@spairus4492 2 жыл бұрын
Is the 4.6 stable at the ranges the first stage had?
@maxwood5157
@maxwood5157 2 жыл бұрын
I wonder how a 5” AR15 would do at this stage, probably better. The main upside would be not having to listen to the operators constant excuses
@ScottKenny1978
@ScottKenny1978 2 жыл бұрын
@@spairus4492 supposed to be. Don't know whether it actually is or not, though.
@charlesphillips4575
@charlesphillips4575 2 жыл бұрын
I think the TP9 would be the most interesting comparison. Same ammo, similar size, but a purpose designed carbine, not a converted pistol.
@patrikhjorth3291
@patrikhjorth3291 2 жыл бұрын
Interesting experiment. It drives home the idea that "the more tasks a tool is designed to perform, the worse it performs those tasks." This gun can be more accurate over longer range than a regular pistol, but not accurate enough to warrant it replacing a rifle. It can also be easier to use at very short range than a rifle, but not really that much easier to warrant it replacing a regular pistol. It's basically a home-made PDW, and if you were to bring it to a competition for that particular type of gun, I would expect it to perform pretty well.
@Eubeenhadd
@Eubeenhadd 2 жыл бұрын
To expand on this, I feel like there's a bit of room to grow in this concept that might expand the utility. Where this package failed was mechanical accuracy, optical accuracy, and reliability. Platforms exist that readily improve those factors with some notable size and weight increase, but not so drastically as to move beyond a holstered firearm. The examples I can envision from the top of my head would be a range of machine pistols like the MP7, TP9, Uzi, and Mac 10/11 variants which while larger are still capable of being holstered and carried on the hip, could have collapsing stock systems to allow good PCC use, while also allowing proper optic setups that don't suffer parallax or sight radius problems.
@jamiewiley6853
@jamiewiley6853 2 жыл бұрын
a stocked Laugo Alien would be interesting with the fixed barrel and whether that has a significant impact on the versatility of the system
@jacobhorvath1817
@jacobhorvath1817 2 жыл бұрын
I was going to say, would a move away from the Browning tilting lock change the opinion on what it is capable of?
@grahamhancock4904
@grahamhancock4904 2 жыл бұрын
My thoughts exactly.
@atlas4733
@atlas4733 2 жыл бұрын
I think the fixed sight mount would also be very interesting!
@mr-huggy
@mr-huggy 2 жыл бұрын
The BT version of the USW has a fixed barrel and sights I would think the accuracy would be better.
@sir_vix
@sir_vix 2 жыл бұрын
I want to see a stocked maxim-9 long
@Ledmetacdc
@Ledmetacdc 2 жыл бұрын
I'm a school custodian, and honestly what you said it could be used for is something I thought a lot about as a weapon I could leave in my car in case of an active shooter situation. I decided against it because I wouldn't want to me misidentified by LE as the shooter, but I thought a lot about the Flux Defense Raider. With what happened in Uvalde, I'm more and more scared that if someone were to want to hurt the kids at my school it would be up to school staff to try and put a stop to that.
@haroldhenderson2824
@haroldhenderson2824 2 жыл бұрын
A reliable, short rifle, wielded my someone VERY familiar with the area (staff), would be formidable. A high visibility garment that says "STAFF" on front, back AND both arms might help. Criminals want victims, NOT gunfights. Personally, I would hire "front desk" people (and custodians) that are willing to train and carry.
@MrNgMichael
@MrNgMichael 2 жыл бұрын
I'd say the reasonable answer is yes, the more likely response you'll get from the school is a no to even carrying due to liability reasons. Management is unfortunately going to be re-active instead of proactive. They're not the ones in danger, so they'll always look at it from a liability stance. But yeah, you're the one that's going to be in danger and I think if that happened, I would gather as many kids as you can and keep them safe inside a classroom until help arrives. Your gun should be a last resort and I don't believe you should be actively looking for the shooter if you don't want to get shot by either police or the shooter. Unless you're in constant communication with the incoming police, they're going to be looking for someone with a gun in their hands.
@Sunflowercowboy
@Sunflowercowboy 2 жыл бұрын
Being that you work at a school, a p365xl or XL slide on a standard frame like I use would be a good candidate as it can mount a red Dot and a light and 17 round mags are out there but out of stock. Personally I want to take the concept even further with the 3rd party XXL 4inch slide and barrel, but keep the standard 365 frame
@salimj1485
@salimj1485 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for considering this. I doubt any administration would allow it for liability reasons. I suppose the people who decide these things decided headline risk and liability is the worse outcome. The fact you are willing to close, engage, and defeat an active shooter to save kids unrelated to you and yours is something that should be uncontroversial and celebrated.
@bobthompson4133
@bobthompson4133 2 жыл бұрын
Buy at least 3a body armor to keep in the utility closet. If no gun available at least you might be able to get in baseball bat distance without dying
@wbflashover
@wbflashover 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Ian. I truly love watching these challenges. The fact that you are always testing something out-of-the-norm adds to the ambiance and makes for great content. Love your channel Sir.
@nunyabidness9257
@nunyabidness9257 2 жыл бұрын
Ian, I think a few things have to be considered when evaluating and comparing between these and a PCC: 1) The lower velocity from the shorter barrel over a PCC will be quite noticeable at ranges greater than 120-150 yards. Doping the drop on a red dot past 120 or so becomes very difficult on a small match target like you were shooting at because the drop varies so much between there and 200. 2) My experience with my USW-A1, Glock 19 in a 20/20 chassis, and Polymer80 in s 20/80 chassis all show that accuracy goes totally out the window when shooting prone or on elbows on a table. There is something mechanically happening under recoil with my body that makes my group sizes open up enough that I initially thought something was wrong with the gun. 3) Triangle or chevron reticles are better for long distance shots and offer some BDC capability-my experience is with the dual illuminated RMR with the triangle reticle, but the Holosun 509 ACSS would be preferred if it were available when I got the RMR. Of the three guns I have, the USW-A1 has the best practical accuracy, followed by the P80 in the 20/80 chassis with a SilencerCo barrel. The worst of the three is the Glock in the 20/20 chassis…. And that has a KKM match barrel in it. The USW-A1 is marginally better than the P80 and I am very confident in my ability to get 1st round head shots at 120 yards. The Glock will need 2, maybe 3 shots to get that hit. I think the concept behind these stocked or braced pistols is sound and you can’t beat the portability of a 30 round quasi carbine that fits in your glovebox. The 20/20 and 20/80 braces are the best $100 you’ll ever spend on a handgun IMO, and the USW is the coolest gun I own-it looks gimmicky, but it really works well. I hope you get a chance to test one at some point, it really is better than the chassis guns.
@CommodoreFluffy
@CommodoreFluffy 2 жыл бұрын
thats super interesting. it looks like theres more practical space in the pdw spectrum than i expected. it would be kind of interesting to see a comparison between tilting action stocked pistols, compact pdws (mp7 p90) pccs (m1 carbine ruger pc carbine, maybe a 10-22 as well) and an sbr shorty ar15
@IR4TE
@IR4TE 2 жыл бұрын
I really like Ians The Division agent cosplay for this match
@user-fd7tl4xg6y
@user-fd7tl4xg6y 2 жыл бұрын
Man, you're really getting quite good with the pistols! Fantastic seeing you grow through competition Ian!
@alexholdren4009
@alexholdren4009 2 жыл бұрын
Looks like it was still a lot of fun. It would be interesting to see how a fixed barrel select fire stocked pistol would do at brutality. Something like a pm63 or vz61
@jabbott376
@jabbott376 2 жыл бұрын
Really enjoyed how much Ian was feeling himself in this video. Big up yourself, King 🤴🏽👏.
@stoptrackingourdata8158
@stoptrackingourdata8158 2 жыл бұрын
As someone who has two similar "PCC" setups in 9mm (USW-G & Flux Raider), they do not excel at 50+ yards. Their sweet spot is really about 25 yards. They aren't much more practical than a really good pistol, but they're still so damn cool.
@andyleighton6969
@andyleighton6969 2 жыл бұрын
Have to take my hat off to Ian's pistol shooting. Commissioned we did a minimal amount with the service Hi Power to say we'd done it, but no more. I wouldn't guarantee to hit a target I couldn't also punch! 😂
@bobhill3941
@bobhill3941 2 жыл бұрын
Great baptism by fire and I loved the explanation/opinion of where a stocked pistol would be best suited!
@germanredneck4414
@germanredneck4414 2 жыл бұрын
I love this style of video where you comment what you do and where you had problems.
@shaunybonny688
@shaunybonny688 2 жыл бұрын
Great video, interesting to see how that setup faired.
@joetaylor486
@joetaylor486 2 жыл бұрын
Gun Jesus is feeding the 5000 here with his Brutality match footage. Loved this.
@swagnut9864
@swagnut9864 2 жыл бұрын
" this is what you call a pro gamer move " Ian is getting in touch with the new generation
@olafervin
@olafervin 2 жыл бұрын
The match conclusion discussion was extremely helpful. My initial thoughts about the USW platform were very much like Ian's. Basically, a USW should function like an extremely compact PCC. Glad to better understand the appropriate use and limitations of the USW concept. Keep up the great work.
@toyotek2
@toyotek2 2 жыл бұрын
I had the exact same malfunction problem with my p320 with the Apex trigger.. Trust me is the trigger stop bushing and spring you install with the kit.. Believe it or not that tiny spring is the cause of the problem.. Hard to explain but that spring gets jammed and causes the whole problem..
@CalzaTheFox
@CalzaTheFox 2 жыл бұрын
I think the results obtained were to be expected - carry pistols are not really intended for ranges outside of 100 yd, and that isn't necessarily because they're missing a stock. I think this is where a pistol caliber carbine really shines: when you have to stretch outside of that initial 100 yards. Inside of 100 yds a PDW can shine. For rucking and movement a PDW really shines. But for accurate, medium range fire? Not so much. (never mind the tilting action) The added barrel length of a carbine can do wonders not just for accuracy but for velocity too. The thing to remember is the gun world is full of compromises and you just have to pick what you want to prioritize.
@kwongyeang
@kwongyeang 2 жыл бұрын
I see a definite application for suppressive and indirect fire with this system...
@TheLipardi
@TheLipardi 2 жыл бұрын
An additional use case would be people who work in bear country. The USW-G20 conversions for the Glock 20 might be worth it to bush pilots, truck drivers or even natives in areas with large populations of bears.
@TimberwolfCY
@TimberwolfCY 2 жыл бұрын
Super useful, super informative, and honestly super entertaining. Changed my opinion on the whole 'pistol chassis' concept quite a bit; I used to consider them kinda silly, but as you put it there are definitely uses for them. Thank you
@TimberwolfCY
@TimberwolfCY 2 жыл бұрын
Also, damn, that jacket is awesome
@BigBoyElectricToys
@BigBoyElectricToys 2 жыл бұрын
Great video! Hopefully you'll do this with the FK Burno with a stock at some point for proof of concept!
@lukeman9851
@lukeman9851 2 жыл бұрын
If the shortcomings are mostly in the limited accuracy of the action and the parallax of the optic, I wonder how other similar builds might fare. Perhaps a USW built on a Laugo Alien, or if it were possible to run the event with an MP7. Combined with an optic with less parallax we could really see whether the limitations are in the form factor itself or just the particular mechanics of this configuration. And, of course, I'd love to see Rhett Neumayer run this with a cheek pistol and see how that fares.
@bullzebub
@bullzebub 2 жыл бұрын
maxim 9 would be a interesting base too.. since it has a fixed barrel as far as i know
@keystrokecascade
@keystrokecascade 2 жыл бұрын
If I recall correctly you installed a 4" barrel in this thing, I have to wonder if it would have performed substantially better with a 6" or 8" barrel, even if it needs the barrel to stick out the bottom of the holster.
@UnlaunderedShirt
@UnlaunderedShirt 2 жыл бұрын
i honestly feel that the biggest reason for his accuracy issues isnt the pistol, whether the length of barrel or the action type (browning tilting barrel), but instead the calibre. 9x19 is fantastic at stopping targets in their tracks at about 30 ft, but a loing distance calibre it is not. 5.7 or 4.6 are pdw/pistol calibres specifically designed to penetrate at range. They have been designed to reach out and touch at much longer ranges than 9x19
@josephalexander3884
@josephalexander3884 2 жыл бұрын
Exactly what I expected. I really appreciated this video, thank you.
@FriENTlyFire
@FriENTlyFire 2 жыл бұрын
Your final conclusion was fascinating.
@ninebangtrojan4669
@ninebangtrojan4669 2 жыл бұрын
I'm told the Glock version is issued to\has been evaluated by aviation protection officers [Air Marshals] of a major European nation. When you think of the engagement distances & risk to bystanders from missed rounds it supports Ian's thoughts.
@DJTheMetalheadMercenary
@DJTheMetalheadMercenary 2 жыл бұрын
That sounded like Les/ Pegasus Tests behind the camera at the beginning of the vid, nice. Bold to run such a compact PCC for everything!!
@EvanDickersonM81
@EvanDickersonM81 2 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see you do a match done with Carl's FK Bruno once the brace / stock comes out for it. I'd be curious to see how much of a difference that I've velocity round would make.
@DarkWing127
@DarkWing127 2 жыл бұрын
I second this, Ive been waiting to get the brace for mine for months.
@angelsfallfirst7348
@angelsfallfirst7348 2 жыл бұрын
But you don't understand I'd catch a grenade for you
@alun7006
@alun7006 2 жыл бұрын
I'd be fascinated to see the 7.5FK in a proper carbine length - I know the whole point was not to need something that big but I think it'd be a great performer.
@mfree80286
@mfree80286 2 жыл бұрын
@@alun7006 I'd wager that the factory charge would be all done by 8" or so... which is still a *very* short carbine though.
@alun7006
@alun7006 2 жыл бұрын
@@mfree80286 MP5!
@jimlarson777ify
@jimlarson777ify 2 жыл бұрын
Loved this video! The combination of the build and the "experiment" was about the coolest video you've done (apologies if you have done this before, I've only been subscribed for a couple years.)
@jonny1943
@jonny1943 Жыл бұрын
Dude, you rule! Thanks for making such great channel!
@ArfurFaulkesHake
@ArfurFaulkesHake 2 жыл бұрын
I'd really like to know what a longer Barrel on the Sig would do. Edit: I forgot this pistol had a tilting barrel so a longer barrel wouldn't do much. ooops
@LUR1FAX
@LUR1FAX 2 жыл бұрын
@@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz Yep. A couple of inches more on a pistol barrel might give you 100 ft/sec more velocity (and that's reaching) but keep in mind that the velocity from one round to the next can vary by like half that, depending on your ammo.
@EvanDickersonM81
@EvanDickersonM81 2 жыл бұрын
More FPS, not necessarily more accuracy.
@JD-tn5lz
@JD-tn5lz 2 жыл бұрын
A slightly longer barrel and shooting a more realistic common (sort of) caliber such as .357 Sig or less common 9x25 Dillon. Also, a little more range time using irons only instead of a learned dependency on optics. Optics are wonderful, but the moment you chase the dot and put aside fundamentals you are screwed.
@mfree80286
@mfree80286 2 жыл бұрын
A longer barrel alone wouldn't do much but create some screwy dynamics with mass motion on recoil, but a longer barrel *and slide* would reduce the overall motion of the barrel, keeping the angle down because of the longer pivot point.
@ArfurFaulkesHake
@ArfurFaulkesHake 2 жыл бұрын
@@mfree80286 See Edit
@dallasjesuit
@dallasjesuit 2 жыл бұрын
I like your channel, educational and entertaining. I really liked this 2 part series, build and evaluate the USW-320.
@kowell
@kowell 2 жыл бұрын
Using only a pistol is one of these moments where "I took a calculated decision but boy do I suck at math"
@davidwilliams5497
@davidwilliams5497 2 жыл бұрын
22:30 Mall security whips out a stocked pistol, I’m going to be dead. From laughing.
@UserNamechannel
@UserNamechannel 2 жыл бұрын
There's a stock for the 7.5 FK BRNO PSD pistol, though I'm not sure about its availability to US civis. That would be an interesting one to test out as opposed to the limited 9mm here.
@Spuzzell
@Spuzzell 2 жыл бұрын
Thoroughly enjoy the competition shoots, thanks
@RonOhio
@RonOhio 2 жыл бұрын
This brings up a couple of points that could be expanded on. Parallax in pistol red dots, I would love to see an examination of things like the RMR, Delta Point, Accro, Holosun EPS etc. The C96 in 7.62 Mauser, with fixed barrel and tangent sights. I would like to see how a G31 (.357 SIG) with an extended barrel does. How carbine like does the stocked pistol have to become before long range performance improves? Do you have to have effectively (outside of NFA legalities) a short barreled rifle, or is there a sweet spot between pistol and rifle?
@maliceharding4668
@maliceharding4668 2 жыл бұрын
I mean the second you add a stock to any weapon with a barrel under 16 inches it is a sbr subject to the nfa. The USW that Ian is using is a registered sbr
@RonOhio
@RonOhio 2 жыл бұрын
@@maliceharding4668 That's why I added the qualifier about ignoring the arbitrary and nonsensical NFA. I'm interested in how rifle like a stocked pistol would need to be to be more practical, not what some ignorant politician thought in 1968.
@coltonb9194
@coltonb9194 2 жыл бұрын
Not sure if Ian will see this but for anyone else who does, that parallax issue could potentially be solved by adding a tall front sight post. For more precise shots, you could take your time (albeit giving up some view in your dot’s window). For close shots it wouldnt matter nearly as much and you could shoot them with the dot anywhere in the window. Just my thoughts on it, love the concept
@RichardCranium321
@RichardCranium321 2 жыл бұрын
I found what appears to be a similar device fot the p320 that uses a 1913 pic rail on the rear of the module and it also has a small segment for a red dot affixed to the top of said module... it's a Strike Industries frame, its rather expensive, but I didn't see any requirements to SBR it.
@Chang739
@Chang739 2 жыл бұрын
Having shot a Sig (granted it was a P226) for many years, I can say they are extremely accurate. The slide/barrel lockup has incredibly tight tollerances and my pistol would hit consitently even at silly ranges. The red dot parralax is probably Ians biggest issue, I've always preferred the stock iron sights which don't have parralax given they have two reference points.
@theKashConnoisseur
@theKashConnoisseur 2 жыл бұрын
I've got a P320 and it's also quite accurate. At 50 yards it's well capable of putting down grapefruit-sized groups and it could probably do better than that if I had steadier hands. Ian's was shooting groups so wide I was thinking maybe his red dot mount wasn't fully seated on the slide or something. With Trijicon's reputation for quality, you'd think their dots wouldn't have such extreme parallax that you can't hit the broadside of a barn at 200 yds.
@standardtoaster10000
@standardtoaster10000 2 жыл бұрын
Compact red dot parallax is the main reason why so many open division shooters still use the now ancient C-More Slideride.
@pittster57
@pittster57 2 жыл бұрын
It's because of this video I stuck to my decision for a cz scorpion vs p320 smc. Thank you
@frajecz
@frajecz 2 жыл бұрын
This is so cool. You know why? Because I've written my bachelor's work on basically this exact topic - I've made a simple experiment, shooting various handguns (a CZ 75 Compact D, a CZ 50/70 and a Skorpion vz. 61) and I came to the conclusion that the USW (or this chassis for the SIG) could be an ideal firearm for people in fields such airport security and similar. It's such a great feeling to see it get validated here.
@BeastHunterSam
@BeastHunterSam 2 жыл бұрын
What degree if I may ask? Sounds like a sick thesis
@frajecz
@frajecz 2 жыл бұрын
@@BeastHunterSam Security and law studies at Police Academy of the Czech Republic in Prague
@michelguevara151
@michelguevara151 2 жыл бұрын
interested in seeing how much more accurately this would perform with a red dot without the parallax issue. excellent shooting , Ian.
@matzeselloggs2392
@matzeselloggs2392 2 жыл бұрын
This was a lot of fun to watch. Didnt expect that in the beginning!
@helipilotuh1
@helipilotuh1 2 жыл бұрын
Great job on the polish rack.
@yrrosimyarin4180
@yrrosimyarin4180 9 ай бұрын
I would so love to see you re-visit this concept with a better optic and either a slightly longer P320 barrel or something built on a different system. I really feel like with modern optics we should be able to make a PDW that fits in a holster and can still hit a person-sized target at 150m. Heck, silhouette pistol shooters are doing it with iron sight revolvers...
@frugalsoul9984
@frugalsoul9984 2 жыл бұрын
Like I expected it wasn't a pro gamer move for the actual matches
@austincrowe5194
@austincrowe5194 2 жыл бұрын
One thing in really interested in the concept is how it would deal with a silencer. Would the stock completely mitigate the added recoil effect of a Nielsen device? I hope you get a chance to shoot it suppressed Ian. Like others, I’d like to see what a red dot with less parallax would do to the set up. I’d also be interested to know what some accuracy driven handloads could do for the longer stages.
@RedactedBrainwaves
@RedactedBrainwaves 2 жыл бұрын
1:36 has meme potential
@BYLRPhil
@BYLRPhil 2 жыл бұрын
Trooper division should have to listen to Iron Maiden during their stages.
@Eubeenhadd
@Eubeenhadd 2 жыл бұрын
"When the priest comes to read me the last rites Take a look through the bars at the last sights"
@comiketiger
@comiketiger 2 жыл бұрын
Great job Ian. Very interesting experiment. That was some good shooting. God bless all here.
@Indica_Cobra
@Indica_Cobra 2 жыл бұрын
On the parallax issue, that's why I like to run my dots cowitness with my front sight. Yes a different zero than my irons, as well as different sight picture but it ensures my dot is in the same spot every shot.
@LittlyLary
@LittlyLary 2 жыл бұрын
I was wonder if the original USW version with the fixed dot and the ACRO would be better with the parallax shift but did some reading and it's still present on them. They're very neat little packages.
@iarissei
@iarissei 2 жыл бұрын
I really enjoy watching your competition shooting. Especially when you go outside the norm, like this. 😁
@apethae1
@apethae1 2 жыл бұрын
Mall security or school resource officer: not typically market segments where B&T wants its name uttered.
@spydercomonkey
@spydercomonkey 2 жыл бұрын
Great video. I'd be curious to see if the slightly larger B&T MP9/TP9 performs better as a PDW / Holsterable Carbine.
@TheBeomoose
@TheBeomoose 2 жыл бұрын
Wonder if a faster, flatter-shooting round like 4.6 or 5.7 would nudge the results a little for the carbine targets.
@Gameprojordan
@Gameprojordan 2 жыл бұрын
FiveSeven USW would be awesome
@blue_ridge_shooting762
@blue_ridge_shooting762 2 жыл бұрын
Very interesting that it has such a large cone of fire. I've shot a P320 M17 handgun and about 80-90 yards and it's cone of fire was definitely smaller than that.
@MrJest2
@MrJest2 2 жыл бұрын
So, it's great at CQB ranges when a pistol-level penetration is viable, but nothing more is needed. A fixed and longer barrel pistol might give even better performance, albeit with a somewhat longer package. (Heh... that's what *she* said...)
@HiKrush
@HiKrush 2 жыл бұрын
I would love to see something like that, but with combo like glockmagfed keltec sub2000 and glock. You know, modern cowboy setup.
@nwolinsP
@nwolinsP 2 жыл бұрын
This was an experiment that gave a definitive result. To me this would be success.
@jfess1911
@jfess1911 2 жыл бұрын
I really wonder if a better sighting system would have produced a much much better result. Today TFB had a brief section about the Strike Industries Modular Chassis ALPHA that moves the optic to non-reciprocating mount slightly above and behind the slide. This particular chassis also uses a SIG 320 parts but could be fitted with a much more precise rifle-style optic. It would be interesting to see if Ian's performance would drastically increase with this system.
@ensinger341
@ensinger341 2 жыл бұрын
The dead trigger issue is quite common on our M17’s (P320). The trigger will reset and you’ll feel and hear the click, but when you go to fire the trigger is dead and there is no sear engagement.. The best way we have found to fix the issue is lock the slide back and pull down on the front of the guide rod. I am not sure why that seems to rectify the issue but it does and I suspect that may have been the problem you ran into here but 🤷‍♂️
@BlueJayWaters
@BlueJayWaters 2 жыл бұрын
I really appreciate you doing this Ian. I genuinely think civilian PDW's are slept on and can be a real potential for the best home defense gun, especially for those in apartments, close housing, and major city living. I'm still considering what to really use because most of the cheaper options of conversions are dubious at best, and the high end ones still cost more than a higher quality PCC or rifle. I'm hoping more attention breeds more innovations and perhaps shift focus away from the whole ATF anti-combat rifle political sentiments.
@jamesnorlin1273
@jamesnorlin1273 2 жыл бұрын
The “ Karl bad man” on the obstacle had me chuckling
@dryroasted5599
@dryroasted5599 2 жыл бұрын
I saw that too. I wonder if that was there from this match, or a previous one?
@jordanwalsh1691
@jordanwalsh1691 2 жыл бұрын
@@dryroasted5599 It was done with red spray paint, and there was a red DB 22 sprayed on a different obstacle at 5:00, so I would guess this match.
@amphibiousone7972
@amphibiousone7972 2 жыл бұрын
Some of the ways you choose to challenge yourself amazes me. Ian Boss💪
@DavidSmith-ke6zy
@DavidSmith-ke6zy 2 жыл бұрын
I bet the parallax is exaggerated because the optic so close your eye. Like the eyebox on a scope, the curvature of the lens is probably designed to minimize parallax at normal pistol distances rather than inches from your eye.
@texas66
@texas66 2 жыл бұрын
Makes me wonder if there is a just right "Goldilocks" barrel length, stock, holster, pistol that would be more useful (but still less than a carbine) for the long range shots??? A folding micro PDW kind of thing... Maybe an 8" barrel on a striker fired Beretta 92 style locking action??? A smaller MP7 in 9mm thing??
@kevmankom
@kevmankom 2 жыл бұрын
Seems like the package is good the tilting barrel and bad sight are what kept it from competing with the carbines for real.
@johnd0e25
@johnd0e25 2 жыл бұрын
"pro gamer move" LMFAO I love you Ian
@ericb.4358
@ericb.4358 2 жыл бұрын
I wonder if my RUGER 57 (5.7 x 28 cartridge) would make a good "stocked pistol with its much greater range than a 9 mm pistol. I also love my FN PS90 but hate the current stratospheric prices of 5.7 ammo. So now I shoot my much upgraded RUGER PC chassis carbine (16" barrel) and GLOCK 17 as my other carbine/pistol combo with its cheaper ammo costs.
@LawkzBro
@LawkzBro 2 жыл бұрын
I understood it's disadvantages when compared to rifles and carbines, but, in a situation where anyone would use a pistol and there is no need for it to be super light or super compact, wouldn't this type of stocked pistol be just better in every possible way? In other words, what are the disadvantages of a stocked pistol when compared to a normal pistol? The obvious is weight and size, but how much of a downside is that for police and military use?
@ronaldsanpedro4338
@ronaldsanpedro4338 2 жыл бұрын
Good day Ian. Huge fan of your channel. Maybe you can try the recover tactical 20/20 glock chassis. It has a forward and chassis mounted red dot mount for aimpoint t2 size rifle red dot. Since its chassis mounted, it wont move with the slide. Also the height was perfect. Its about the same distance and height of an ar15 in absolute cowitness height. Its really cheap too. The chassis price starts at only cost around $99. But with all the nice accesories, youll end up around $230. Also this chassis was design by the same guy who made tavor. Hope i can it in one of your desert brutality.
@Hansengineering
@Hansengineering 2 жыл бұрын
This kinda utterly deflates the hype from the build video.
@Packer1551
@Packer1551 2 жыл бұрын
That “pro gamer move” made mine and so many others morning
@ITOtter-nd1yq
@ITOtter-nd1yq 2 жыл бұрын
Maybe bullets on long range transition from supersonic to subsonic and loosing stability and accuracy? To evaluate that it would be intresting to try subsonic ammo (no transsonic transition) or try 9mm +P providing higher muzzle velocity and longer supersonic range. And compare accuracy results with those setups.
@duncanakerman1830
@duncanakerman1830 2 жыл бұрын
An interesting concept, I wonder if it becomes more viable for those 150 m targets if a more accurate base gun was used (fixed barrel perhaps? P7?) and like you said premium optics with no parallax.
@nateo6806
@nateo6806 2 жыл бұрын
Rocking that bandit costume for the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. competition I see :D
@johnkimball2561
@johnkimball2561 2 жыл бұрын
"You can also just shoot PCC" *sees the stocked pistol on Ian's hip* Me: Oh Sweetie, no....
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