The Complicated History of Sunsetting & The DCV - Destiny 2

[@evanf1997]

Okay.. so again.. I am going to be doing the pantheon event on stream with exclusive twitch drops in a Bungie sponsored event (I DON'T KNOW HOW EITHER PLEASE DON'T ASK LMAO)! So it would be sick if everyone came by, it's every tuesday for the next 5 weeks.. Yeah.. thanks for all the love you guys show on videos as it it, thank you thank you!

[@V-Vuheli]

DOES THAT MEAN THE PLANETS WILL RETURN?! (that'd be cool lol)

[@jasonkeely7269]

I work in government contracts and I wonder if an underlying catalyst was a rights issue with Activision, HM, and VV. The timing of it all made me raise my eyebrows and the only other thing I could think of would have been what server farm they had contracts with before and after the split. If any of this is a contracts issue it will be buried under a pile of NDA's and we'll never know the true reason.

[@XUtionerx]

ok im pulling out a recluse for my titan

[@Mister_Puffins]

Just make sure to not call him bald or you will have to pay...

[@amazin_faith7687]

ILL WATCH BUT ILL BE IN CLASS THE NEXT TWO WEEKS!! My professor shouldn't mind tho :D

[@ibrahimmoinhaque569]

Bungie just went "blind man with Alzheimer's forgets he is blind is able to see again"

[@ChadWarwick0]

But still got Alzheimer's.

[@freshmilk4631]

The destiny community doesn’t always agree, but everyone unanimously agrees that the DCV was the worst thing to happen to the game.

[@T3chn0Panda]

not me homie. Could care less. Im ok with change. Old content that isnt designed for new meta. I can see for newer players but ive never had a problem besides missing the old raids . So unanimously -1

[@scxm8825]

@@T3chn0Panda🤓☝️

[@oxsila]

@@scxm8825 When you don't have an arguement and just resort to adhom emoting

[@dayhaven8442]

​@oxsila straight up tho and look at his likes, other clowns

[@scxm8825]

@@oxsila *tips fedora*

[@humonculusroguthetumor7535]

Sunsetting gear vs content such as campaigns and raids that we paid for is a distinction that needs to be made. At least with Disney if you bought the movie you could watch it as much as you want because you BOUGHT IT! I’ve never before paid so much to rent a video game that I thought I was buying not renting.

[@gaminginthestars4262]

I still to this day think the DCV could have been completely avoided. Imagine if they took a "Call of duty" style route with it. You wanna play just multiplayer and don't touch zombies? Just don't install zombies. Don't play multiplayer either but like warzone? So only install warzone. Take that concept and apply it too the DLC for Destiny. You beat the Red war, and Forsaken and don't need to play those store lines rn? Uninstall them. Got everything in the leviathan? Unistall it. Want too re-experience Forsaken with a friend? Re-install it. Make it the players choice when they wanna access what they purchased.

[@turbo6328]

Feels like the Tiger engine can't handle this

[@raritybelle6876]

@@turbo6328with stories I think it can. Just bunch of maps and cutscenes for optional download

[@JustinSimoneau]

Exactly it would be so much simpler to do.

[@dmruggabugga6270]

​@@turbo6328 the tiger engine is just a heavily modified blam engine (what bungie used for halo and what 343 have used) and mcc has system don't like halo 4 don't install it

[@turbo6328]

@@dmruggabugga6270 Yeah i know it's a modified version, but can it handle it ? 343 modified the original engine for it specifically, can the destiny modified engine incorporate this system, while not breaking everything ? I don't know shit about coding, building engines or modofying them, but i know for sure it's insanely hard

[@andykazoo]

Christmas. I got Destiny 2 for Christmas. I played Destiny 1 with friends before, and my family knew it was something I liked. I didn't want to buy Destiny 2 for myself because I was in high school and didn't have an income. My parents got Destiny 2 as a gift, and watched me play the Red War campaign Christmas day. They were never interested in my gaming hobby before. Going Lightless to Guardian again was a good memory, and I did it with my family. Later, I fell away from Destiny for Fortnite with friends. Then, I learned Red War was "Sunset." Just a fancy word for deleting something I thought I had on my shelf. I vowed to never return to Destiny because it was no longer something I could share with people I cared about. I like to share cool experiences with my younger siblings. I couldn't stand the fomo. For some reason, I've never unsubscribed from Destiny creators. I've always loved the world and it's gameplay potential. Following the hype for Final Shape has got me tempted to step back in after years away. Evan, I love your content. From my perspective, sunsetting is THE reason I never returned to playing Destiny. I kinda expected you to flame Bungie more in this video. If you made it this far, thanks for reading my thoughts lol.

[@Kyubii01]

I agree 100% with your thoughts. I went through the same thing. Don’t be surprised that evanf and other content creators don’t flame bungie. Most content creators don’t go at bungie because this is their only source of income. They damage control for bungie to try to retain players but half the issues would be solved if people went at bungie the way we did when taken king was announced. They said TK was 60 dollars and everyone thought it was wack especially after two meh expansions that were really dlcs . They lowered the price to 40 . If we held bungie accountable more rather than when it’s cool to do so, we would be in a better place.

[@scxm8825]

@@Kyubii01dude, people have been complaining about sunsetting for YEARS what are you yapping about

[@huskycruxes7232]

I haven’t played the game in years, but played it religiously at launch and I loved the red war campaign. Especially some of the music from it. It’s a crime new players won’t be able to listen to journey while walking up that mountain

[@andykazoo]

Update: I installed again. Into The Light is pretty fun. After I made a nice arc build, I got carried by a warlock and hunter. I got shiny edge transit God roll. That's probably the only highlight of my time with Destiny. There is sooo much word vomit. Pop-ups, bottom notifications, side quest notifications, guardian rank, auto-tracked quests for DLC I don't own... I'm just done. I put in extra effort researching verbs and perks. Like what's the point? So many descriptors exist in the menus, and they are misleading. Weapon perks have descriptors for "increased damage" but some perks do more than others. It was a nightmare to learn what weapons were safe to dismantle. My vault was full of weapons with perk combos I wanted to try. I was getting into it to play with my brother. If I was struggling as a fps veteran, he would fail miserably as a noob. RIP the dream.

[@brunoutechkaheeros1182]

​@@andykazoo play RDR2 if you havent... its a visual buffet

[@darklightlegacyxx2605]

If nothing related to the story was ever removed, we'd have a god tier game and a better experience for new players

[@Aarkwrite]

Exactly this.

[@magnummer]

Not only do I think that they should bring all the dcv content back. But I think all of the d1 campaign should be in d2 legends tab to be played in legend difficulty.

[@beeman4266]

I too want a 300gb game.

[@magnummer]

@@beeman4266 yes, but unironically

[@gaminginthestars4262]

Yes exactly, then allow us too choose which DLC we have installed so when I beat it again, it doesn't take up extra storage unless I want it too

[@Grassdia]

I’d love that but genuinely the minimum they should do is bring back Titan and IO for red war and because they had 2 of the best destiny strikes ever imo

[@endar2401]

It would still be different. I think instead they should just make the Destiny 1 experience better by doing a PC port, crossplay, and current gen system updates. There's too much content in Destiny 1 that it would take ages for them to remake it into Destiny 2. But an update to the already existing game would be fantastic.

[@grimreaper6366]

As a D1 player who got the game around the rise of irons release, I remember really getting into the game because of the fact that all the main campaigns were still a part of the game. I had the ability to learn and play through the WHOLE story and grow connected to the characters and plot. Your thoughts on the fact that the story for us vetrans is almost 6 years old, but complelty brand new to new players really opened my eyes when considering how I started this Destiny jorney so long ago. If we don't give new players context for the story, visual and gameplay scenarios that they themselves experience, and build up to later events in the game, Destiny as a franchise loses context, losses meaning, and looses players.

[@ThePinkDrift]

I would probably say that sunseting is the most thing that terrifies me when I play destiny in mostly anything

[@AnAbsoluteUnit]

Well... it eases the mind that Bungie finally drove the final nail on Sunsetting's coffin.

[@simplychrisyt]

32:27 is that Liyue song from Genshin Impact? For a second i was confused to hear this song while you were talking about D2 😅

[@picklerick2861]

Yeah, it's the liyue battle sound track. I was very confused as I was at doing stuff in Fontaine while watching it. Either Evan found it in a random playlist or he's a fellow Genshin player.

[@simplychrisyt]

@@picklerick2861 Same, i wash in the kitchen so i was only hearing the video ahah

[@gabrielevolsa9829]

i feel like with no story you feel like a guardian while with the story you feel like THE guardian

[@NeroLucifarious]

2nd comment. I like how you mentioned "bungie didnt know how attached we were to our loot" Which is funny cause in the live action trailer/ad with cayde explaining how the cabak took from us specifically the "loot theyve taken from us"

[@ijustliketowatchvideosandc8630]

I'm sorry but people/bungie blaming older consoles for the DCV is a blatant lie and needs to stop. They say it was a storage problem ok well what storage problem because Destiny 2 before DCV happened was around 100GB+ in storage size and for example a PS4 has 500GB internal storage and can have upto 2TB with an external drive. So even if you added the DCV size to the current size of around 112.8GB you would still have lots of room and thats not even taking into account that update override files and don't always add to storage. Bungie just took the cheaper root of removing Old stuff so they wouldn't have to pay for more work. Also many games on PS4 are way larger than Destiny 2.

[@DrHersh3y]

My brother in christ do you not remember how damn long it took to load anything in the game pre-DCV? You would sit in the loading screen for almost 5-7 minutes and it was PAINFUL. I am not defending DCV cause I hated it myself but older generation consoles definitely played a very big reason if not the main.

[@bradstical86]

It's not purely a giga bite issue 💀 As bro said above me load times were absolute cheeks I remeber taking legitimately 10 minutes to load into crucible matches

[@idokwatcher2062]

@@DrHersh3y That has nothing to do with red war missions. Your inventory is more like a "website" on the back-end. You flying into crucible match is peer to peer connection to all 11 other players in the game. None of those actions load textures of red war. Sunsetting was a scam.

[@Sayocakes]

It's honestly absurd what they have gotten away and still get away with. In Terms of content quality , length, monetization models ... I just started playing again and I can't buy just one season except the latest one without buying the annual pass. Dungeon passes... Ugh ... Biggest current love hate relationship in my life

[@waffles8512]

another evening, another Evanf vid to be consumed

[@cbro79]

DCV. You took my Forsaken from me...

[@jamescromwell5646]

I have never been more relieved that I kept all my “sunset” gear in the vault and have not dismantled any of the weapons when bungie announced that they’re reversing sunsetting 😁

[@ethankim7979]

I was just too lazy lmao, but no one needs to know. As far as my friends are concerned, I was a prophet 😂

[@ArinTv999]

Sun setting was the worst thing to happen. IMAGINE THE RED WAR STORY WITH STRAND AND TELL ME we wouldn't shit on literally everything

[@SlimeyZockt]

I have 4 guns I am so attached to I cannot without, but 3 of these were sunset and I deleted them (RIP) Bygones, Threat Level and Misfit were such good feeling weapons to me, at least I still have my Seventh Seraph SI-2. At least one survived the purge I started in Shadowkeep as a F2P, I saw the downfall of the F2P Players first hand

[@pocketvoid]

I started before the game became free... i bought the game for 3 days after to become free and now i have to spend even more money in dlc's (i already bought some dlc's anyways but at last i would like to get something for that money i wasted to buy the game)(i have a phisical copy of the dam game) and that can be used as proof :)

[@UncleBensQuickRice]

why are you attached to them just use a different gun

[@SlimeyZockt]

@@UncleBensQuickRice and that is exactly why you missed the point. It never has been about performance but feel

[@John_II]

Sunsetting & The DCV = why I quit Destiny 2. Putting all the weapons back in the pool now makes sense because the game is almost done, they might as well let it all go. Now just bring back all the old levels, strikes, gambit maps, crucible maps, etc. and I might even consider coming back.

[@bradstical86]

They need a fresh slate Adding it all back would cause way touch technical issues I feel like we could fuck with the campaigns and some maps but that'd be about it

[@John_II]

@@bradstical86 I hear you. :)

[@bradstical86]

@@John_II i do want the gambit maps as u said tho😭 I used to be one of those lil gambit kids

[@Zakharon]

Imma be honest, maybe Bungie needs to make a side game that contains the sunset campaigns that is singleplayer only with premade characters you can choose from, a hunter, titan or warlock kind of like a halo campaign.

[@oxsila]

it's a nice idea in theory but they're literally trying to make final shape, it's episodes and marathon. where are they gonna find the resources for this

[@vertical_parallel]

"lost in time, like tears in the rain" i love you evan

[@NikoTheTerrible]

Dunno if this is a hot take or not, but I miss the Tangled Shore...

[@IRONWOLFZz]

nah the tangled shore was a cool location and would have been nice if it stayed

[@oxsila]

I miss it, but at the same time I remember when it was out not caring about anything in it except Hollowed Lair and Warden of Nothing. I just want them to bring back Hollowed Lair and i'll be satisfied personally

[@brendolbreadwar2671]

D1 Taken King was the best DLC ever. Wrath of the Machine was the most fun raid ever.

[@Walter__Clements]

Yep, and of course we had to get Crota’s End back instead of that

[@TheCodaCrew]

I'd love to see some sort of legacy tab that had a playlist of missions from seasons past that were good. each mission would have a lootpool of the best weapons from that season, that the community thoroughly enjoyed. That way players like me who started recently in terms of expansions can see exactly what we missed.

[@anonyorb4197]

I wonder does that mean the only truly never escaped unsettling fusion rifle, pocket infinity, shall return

[@Apt23-v8u]

No

[@nephillim8641]

If you defend bungie taking away any content from your game you deservee nothing. They now know they can take whatever they want from you. And you'll thank them.

[@DjentyB]

Bungie could implement a Halo MCC download select system for D2, that could get around the "storage issues"

[@mrcrabominablevods3477]

The questions I was asking when I came back were: Who is Shaw Han? Where's Omnigul? Who's Navota? Who's this giant cabal we became friends with? Where's the Red War campaign?

[@Quon]

I took a 4 year break, just got back super confused seeing the planets and raids i used to do just wiped....?? The Leviathan raid was one of my ABSOLUTE favorite. I'm glad I still got (ironic) my favorite hand cannon, The Sunshot 😅

[@endar2401]

Destiny 3 instead of removing content would have been a lot better. Bungie really has shown time and again they don't care as much or respect their previous releases. Destiny 1 could be brought to PC, have crossplay added, and have fps/fov and what not updated for current gen systems. This year is perfect for this, as it is the 10 year anniversary. We basically have Destiny 3 now, which spawned out of the corpse of Destiny 2 from 2017-2020. Sunrising gear is a step in the right direction, but I still want to see all content restored and playable.

[@Frankenstein_]

Games as a Service more like FOMO till we go broke cause everybody left after we continually kept pissing in their Face even tho they told us multiple times that they don't like being pissed on. xD HOW do you justify removing the Story Content that explains wtf is going on in your Game new Players these days are literally given a TV Series but instead of starting in Season 1 Episode 1 they start in Season 3 Episode 15.

[@LeeFox1337]

Weapon crafting just feeds into FOMO and locking new players out. You "can" get the pattern for an older weapon if you magic up weapon harmonizers. So the only people to feel or see the power creep are those that have been sitting around playing more. If the weapons didn't have 70% chance to have bad perk/part combo it wouldn't be so bad. Even in that last 30% it's mostly just settling with the 2 things you NEED. I like to actually use the weapons not sit there doing the same thing 100s of times to maybe get a usable one.

[@multimus1327]

Actually, the Crafting debate does not have a right and a wrong answer. Anyone who wants to spend 100 hours grinding one roll of a weapon is hopeless addicted to Destiny 2 and needs to do something else in their lives. I used to personally hunt for 5/5s being a hardcore PvE player and Raid sherpa, and hunting for my God Roll Heritage for PvP (Where exact weapon stats matters significantly) took over a year. Crafting saved me from hours of useless grinding when I had played the raid enough to get the raid title and multiple drops of the raid exotic. Anyone asking for the game to get less deterministic rewards when stats matter is ridiculous. Any differences should be purely cosmetic, such as limited time mementos or shaders.

[@maxhocks2006]

Sunsetting was why I left destiny 2. I like the guns I like. Not because of power, but because I like the feel, and utility they provide. I didn’t want to grind for stuff I liked just to have it taken away. Knowing bungie will take my stuff at any time just broke my enjoyment of destiny. I don’t think I’ll ever return.

[@scrawnyclownsnatch9656]

Sunsetting really was the biggest kick to D2. Not necessarily guns IMO as that has been recovered from. It was really just content and the story. Years later, we are still suffering from this as new players now have no way to know what's happening and get invested in the story. Low new player retention on a game this old I feel is practically a death sentence over a long period of time, which then means Bungie needs more microtransaction to make up for it with whoever sticks around.

[@Grand_Master_Skywalker]

I really miss the weekly heroic story missions rotation. And I miss IO. And I miss the side missions or “Adventures” across all the planets we had during the red war campaign. And I miss people being patient when helping people who haven’t done a raid or dungeon before because none of their irl friends play D2 anymore.

[@ImNotHereTBH]

I honestly think bungie should try implementing a system where you can choose what content is installed, so you could for instance have a red war pack with two parts, the campaign, and the raid. Then players can choose what packs they want and if they want both the campaigns and raids of a pack or both. Obviously weapons, Armour, currencies and so on would stay regardless as well as things like strikes and pvp maps but it would allow players to choose what they want to keep whilst allowing bungie to keep the game small for most players. Heck they could even have packs for things like dares of eternity and seasons. Before anyone says it, I know this is most likely impossible to implement for one reason or another I just believe it would be worth it

[@Kyubii01]

Bungie needs to let the customers make the choice of how committed they are to destiny . If they want to fill the pc with 300 gbs let us . If destiny is the only game that occupies our system how is that a bad thing lol

[@XmasReaper_4414]

Still won't be happy with bungie until all content from the dcv comes back. Raids, planets, stories..

[@RyanGaudet-og9tx]

They were selling the forsaken dlc for full price a day b4 it was vaulted. Disgusting and a absolutely embarrassing slap to the face to the consumer

[@Glitcher726]

With final Shape concluded, i pray they atleasy bring back the campaigns to Make the story whole

[@mrbungieiscool]

I lost my whole clan to sunsetting 85 good players gone forever RIP

[@JustinSimoneau]

To this date the storage excuse is still not valid just put the other area as dlc that you can choose to have installed or not. Put all the armor and weapons on the base game instal and the destination on dlc that you can always choose to keep or not

[@djrockfor8694]

I think the absolute worst thing bungie did though was take away the free storyline of red war just to make the new story behind a dlc paywall. They converted their free game into a paid game, because there was almost no reason to play for free anymore

[@kn1ne]

Sunsetting was always stupid and lazy on Bungie’s part, whether you’re talking items or content.

[@misfit1422]

I LOVEEE TERRARIA, love the Calamity and Vanilla music

[@T3chn0Panda]

"Sunsetting. a word that makes every destiny player clench their fists" ...man really building his own narrative. Didnt care that it happened. Dont care its coming back.

[@oxsila]

That's it. His videos are very rarely ever balanced. They always have a massive bias. It'd be nice if he stopped pushing an agenda and just told things from both sides instead of always leaning heavily on one side and downplaying the other side.

[@sadadbelbanes1]

Now, if Bungie would just unsunset all of the content they stole from us, yes even the seasonal content, then I would be compelled to come back. That's a lot of money that Bungie was able to make off and laugh in my face and the faces of its players.

[@n7coconut895]

crafting is one of the worst things in the game currently ive had more fun in onsaulght during the last few weeks than the last 2 years of destiny

[@DrSleeperAgent]

I feel sorry for Line in the Sand, a season of dawn linear fusion that was one season away from being one of the most meta weapons before being sunset. Now its coming back and linears are far from meta.

[@gharnit-1]

25:05 ULTRAKILL OST JUMPSCARE🗣‼️🔥🔥

[@mindofthemuseless]

Spire was nearly unplayable before sunset. The ship destruction mechanic was broken. ):

[@KaPzLok]

Fix the perks on the fucking mindbenders......

[@gaoexkaiser]

ngl the topic on sunseting in D2 by the players always sounds like a cope 😂

[@masondowling5967]

Is that a Destiny VIDEO WITH HOTLINE MIAMI MUSIC

[@MichaelHazell]

Just now started watching the video but I will go ahead and say this since I am a firm believer in it: sunsetting and the Destiny Convent Vault are the worst things to ever happen to this game, period. Sunsetting almost killed the game outright. Content vaulting continues to damage the game by having a terrible new player experience. This is why I do not like Luke Smith as a game director because both of these decisions were under his watch. Bungie has all but outright admitted that they were wrong with sunsetting with the complete reversal now. My sincere hope is that they put the vaulted content back in the game. Red War might have been a mediocre campaign by Witch Queen standards, but it does a substantially better job compared to New Light at giving people a reason to care about things happening right in front of them. Whatever the lifecycle of Destiny 2 is, I want it to end in a complete state. It sucks that parts of the game are straight-up lost to history. --- Edit: Now that I have watched the video, I full disagree on the negative stance of weapon crafting. There are two factions of players in this game. The players who enjoy RNG (gambling addicts come to mind), and those who want their time spent in the game to be respected. Crafting was badly needed as the RNG in this game is incredibly unforgiving no matter what Bungie does. More drops, more perks per columns, people begging to re-roll masterworks or perks, whatever. As long as there is no way to guarantee a roll over a fixed period of time or after a certain number of attempts, or no ability to trade, basic lever-pull RNG will eventually burn people out. You cannot have a game focused on build crafting where you cannot build craft the weapons. That is just silly. This new BRAVE arsenal stuff is a good example of it. Very nice weapons, but all RNG. Even with attunement, the RNG is still bad. Bungie keeps increasing the number of traits available in a column, which makes it harder and harder to get a roll. Guns used to have 6 traits max per column. Now it is 7, 8, sometimes even more. Increasing the number of drops does not move the needle. I would much better prefer a system where I can just get the roll I want after not getting it after X number of attempts. Another thing on RNG drops: imagine you finally get the traits you want. What is the rest of the gun is bad? A bad set of barrel and magazine perks can ruin the feel of a weapon. Imagine if weapon enhancement allowed customization of RNG drops. I think this could be a real middle ground between crafting and RNG. People still have to get lucky enough to get the trait combination to drop, but after that, they can tweak the gun.

[@TsullArcanum]

I honestly think a much better way to handle sunsetting would've been to create an activity/difficulty modifier for seasonal-only weapons. It would make creating builds for those endgame activities much more interesting, while still allowing you to freely use & keep your favorite weapons in normal play.

[@dravenoth421]

The idea of the DSV killed the game for me for a long time. I came back recently after seeing the final shape but the idea that the content and quests I have can just be removed still hurts

[@EtherealPhantom]

Haven’t listened to Outcast of the Sulphurous Sea (second song) in a long time. I like your usage of it here.

[@ryanbeatty3022]

It only took historically low pre sales & a near sony takeover for them to give in

[@Handlesaretrash]

All I want now… Is WRATH OF THE MACHINE, Istg if bungie just so happened to perfectly stop reprising raids right when the get to the best damn raid in D1 I’m pissed and it just reinforces my thought that bungie hates Rise of Iron and anything SIVA related

[@idokwatcher2062]

luke smith does hate it. because it was handed to that guy which is now making marathon. real game designer, not some washed out high school dropout that backstabbed his way from bungie forum moderator to destiny 2 lead.

[@Handlesaretrash]

@@idokwatcher2062 I need siva... I miss it

[@balengd5402]

I came back to the game in August after being away for 5 years, excited to replay Red War/Osiris/Warmind/Forsaken, only to find that it was ALL GONE. I hadnt kept up with the game, so I had no idea

[@THEELEMENTKING]

I finally did a vault cleaning about a week before bungie announced this. I deleted some of my favorite weapons because why would I need them anymore? :(

[@colddripgaming]

My biggest issue is them charging for old packs still where a lot of the content has been “sunset”. If you sunset it then the rest of the content should be free

[@colddripgaming]

I also hate that as a new player a large portion of the story is gone forcing me to go to youtube for the content to know what the hell is going on. The new player experience is abysmally bad even without that.

[@therockfan10001]

Ngl? I think they have done a pretty good job of handling loot without requiring sunsetting. New perks that are better than older ones or introduce a new way to achieve a type of damage (DM vs Sword Logic, Rampage vs Killing Tally) And power restricted content prevents power creep in the content that it matters most in.

[@ethanlatvala]

Maybe several months after The Final Shape comes out they'll bring back all the sunset expansions, destinations, and raids.

[@endar2401]

Probably too soon for that, but I hope they do a complete version of Destiny 2 next year, before Destiny 3 in another year or two after.

[@oxsila]

There's no need to bring back all the planets. Just bring back the best content of each. Whisper and Outbreak are back. Bring back Red War and Forsaken's campaign. Bring back the Mercury strikes... Bring back Savathun's Song and bring back Pyramidion.

[@naskosokurov1815]

I am (kind of) a dev, so I can say why the game was so unstable and buggy during the Shadowkeep year. The mechanics of the game are coded to behave in one way. When a new DLC launches, it introduces new ones that behave in a different way. They start to interfere with the older ones and the game slowly starts to break. For 1 or 2 DLC's, that's not a big problem. For more though, if you want to keep the game running you either need to rework the old content to behave the same way as newer content, or to remove older content completely. Before you ask, yes, the older content could've been kept in the game, but during 2020, that was something Bungie couldn't afford. The other option was to make Destiny 3 (I'd prefer that, to be honest). But that was just a really bad time to be a company like Bungie.

[@Grassdia]

Yeah I truly feel like SK was setting up D3 and that’s why it didn’t really answer any questions. It would also be year 7 of the franchise by then so D3 could fill the final 3 with a subclass from each release BL, WQ, LF(original). Covid and poor management are definitely the culprit for ye drastic shift.

[@naskosokurov1815]

@@Grassdia I guess that was the original plan, but the events from 2020 really messed things up. Though even if Shadowkeep was supposed to be the final DLC for D2, it still really sucks compared to Rise of Iron. And it's still in the game while the Red War and Forsaken are not.

[@Grassdia]

@@naskosokurov1815 yeah that’s definitely the true crime of the whole situation now to think of it 😕

[@The_Laser_Channel]

The Power level system in Destiny 2 is beyond BROKEN...ANYONE can log into Destiny 2 right now as a new player and INSTANTLY get to 1810....seasonal artifact levels can get you beyond 1810 but it's really useless because so many activities limit your power level. Trials is limited to 1810, Legendary campaign limits your power cap, Grandmaster Nightfall caps at 1815 and Contest Mode Raids are 20 over your power level....what is the real point of being at a high power level? In fact, anyone could create a new Destiny 2 account when Final Shape launches and 3 days later be capable of going into the Raid if they go in with a friend who is at the proper level because of the Fireteam Power leveling. You could go into the latest raid with the FIRST weapon you get in the game because of the Fireteam Leveling system...sure, you will get wrecked, but it will be due to lack of skill rather than firepower. Remember back in the day where if you played higher level enemies in games, you could go back to the earlier levels and grind for XP to level up and you could also grind to the point to where you were way over powered you could one hit kill enemies because you got so over powered? Levels mattered...in Destiny 2, they don't......I am not hating on Destiny 2, I have spent a LOT of time on it...hell, I am season rank 306 I think? Power level is 1834...but its really useless to be that high....According to Grandmaster Nightfall, I might as well be 1815. Destiny 2 should do away with power level completely and just label activities as "Easy", "Normal", "Hard", and "Very Hard" or something like that....

[@Olgod2004]

Evan using the terraria calamity mod desert scourge boss theme song!?!? That’s a throw back

[@x9x9x9x9x9]

I am honestly on the side of sunsetting of weapons was not as bad as we thought. I often think back to how we thought crafting was going to be a good thing. But it wasn't. I do think crafting could have been done right. But making the newest raid weapons craftable was a huge mistake. Sunsetting paid content though was just stupid. That is the biggest complaint I see from old players who quit and didn't come back. The weapons being sunset sucked but the content they paid for being removed hurt more. I am not sure what bungie could do to fix this and get those players back aside from making Destiny 3. But if they make Destiny 3 it can't be called Destiny 3. It has to have a new name or just be called "Destiny." Before I started D2 at the launch of beyond light. I saw D2 was free and thought "I didn't play the first one so no point in playing the second one and skipped it. It wasn't until my job hired a guy who told me I didn't need to play D1 to play D2. As for people upset about this whole unsunsetting weapons thing because they deleted their old weapons needs to take off the rose tinted glasses and step back. 99% of the old sunset gear has been powercrept by a mile. I get it, it sucks but its not a big deal. Hopefully players will calm down and realize this. I am excited for 21% delirium to be back though. New bungie has been scaring me. When skimmers came out I knew something was different. When they were announced I thought "oh cool a money grab" and that was it. Then we got them and it made me realize bungo is actually trying. Seriously they have been killing it lately and it gets me hyped for TFS but I am still keeping my expectations low. Just remember we were hype for Lightfall only to have our hopes crushed. But if TFS is even half as good as Witch Queen then I will be happy.

[@belinskiparadox7687]

Here's the problem with the Destiny Content Vault. Unlike the Disney Vault, where the people who paid for the physical media STILL most likely have access to it, the DCV in practice rips that content that you paid for right out of your hands, and there's no "physical release" to fall back on, so that's just gone now.

[@jsoc303]

one of the best videos of the last few months, if not years. I can only confirm everything and you are doing a good job, critical, constructively critical, but never toxic. So much has been packed into the DCV and we're all just coming to terms with it, but that's wrong. Bungie should find technical ways to give purchased content such as DLCs back to anyone who buys it. Seasons are temporary, but you can think about that too. And the worst thing was removing a main campaign in D2, the worst. The speaker dies and so there is deep lore that continues to this day but new players will never understand. That's why the player count will only increase with releases and then immediately decrease because the overall concept is absolute crap.💜

[@xinfr4z893]

Amazing video, as always!

[@MakutaOfficial]

millions of people quit over this one decision.

[@theunknowngamer2935]

Here is my money bungie poof its gone

[@SealFormulaMaster]

Know the truly baffling thing about removing content to "save space"? If you go Out of Bounds, you can find, either in whole or part, various activities. Did you know the Forges are, with the exception of one or two, still in the game and can be reached by going Out of Bounds? Or that there are, to this very day, locations Out of Bounds that have yet to be used, like Galaxy Pools or Iron Forest? And that content from Destiny 1 is for some reason Out of Bounds, like Caydes Stash and D1 Mars? As I told a friend at the time, the DCV wasn't done for the players, but for the Investors. Bungie didn't do it because of Cross, Datto, Evan, or anyone else, at least not directly. Boiled down, in American law it is illegal to make decisions that wouldn't make them money. Because the DCV and Sunsetting would force players to buy more and more content to replace what they lost each season, the DCV and Sunsetting were likely seen as a way to print money for the Investors. For Crafting, I think a good way to deal with it is by removing the ability to Enhance perks, and reserve that ability for Adept style weapons. It gives players weapons that are good enough, like Curated rolls were suppose to, that would allow them to go for better weapons. Targeted Redaction is a great starter weapon, but if you want something better you need to get an Igneous Hammer or Exalted Truth and Enhance their perks. Crafting should be a jumping off point to get you geared up for Trials, Raids, Grandmasters, Dungeons, whatever, so we can start farming those weapons. Other issue, some of the best weapons are craftable. The BXR is one of the best Pulses simply because it has a unique frame that no other weapon has. Same goes for the new Mountaintop. We really need more weapons with these frames that CAN'T be crafted, that way people can get their Curated Mountaintop and crafted BXR, have weapons that are "good enough" but want to get better weapons along the way. That's kind of why Bungie gave us Succession and Forbearance again. Give players that little taste of Raid weapons so they feel the need to farm.

[@Anoki_S1]

YOOOO?!?!!?! I hear Calamity Mod OST!!! Good shit Evan! 🤘

[@AntonioGutierrez-zu3rv]

I have friends who want to play but would love if all the content was playable back from Redwar but probably will never touch d2 now since its gone in the void forever

[@jakeelson6705]

another banger video evanf

[@SUMONiNJA]

All I want is the raids back man, worst thing they ever did. Sad part is as I found with whisper returning, although I wanted this for so long I kinda don't care anymore.

[@SUPERjohn64]

Datto see's unsunsetting Never made it as a wise man I couldn't cut it as a poor man stealing Tired of living like a blind man I'm sick of sight without a sense of feeling

[@KakamileRS]

It doesn't help that they NEVER ACTUALLY VAULTED. Maps that were the reason they "had" to vault remained in the game and accessible by oob'ing, so they ate data storage but we lacked the ability to play. And then "sunset" gear was either never sunset (raids) or perma-sunset (seasons) so there was no replayability.

[@geroffmilan3328]

Sunsetting content is the reason I left this game & my 6,000+ hours of play behind. And I can't imagine anything Bungie could do to bring me back. Also: Don't say sunsetting is gone when all significant content in the game - strikes, maps, etc - is ephemeral. They take your money, then they take back what you paid for. In 2 years' time I'm betting this game is as dead as Lawbreakers.

[@yankeesfan3637]

Anyone who has collected and played the new RECLUSE or MOUNTAINTOP now know that just having 34:37 returning guns fixes all. The Recluse we got sux. Best thing about the MT is that I can go really high. Sad state of affairs!

[@NebulaVXII]

D1 was almost worse. There were sunset exotics that you could never use in high end content as well. D2 is just on a larger scale because its like 4x the size of d1 (but somehow dosent feel like it)

[@EKT_Enthusiast]

Bungie: NO D*CK. NO BALLS. AND NO CONTENT THAT YOU PAID OVER 100 DOLLARS FOR, EVER AGAIN! Bungie years later: Okay, so...

[@Isthiaa]

Just dropping this into the Abyss. After how awful d2 launched, a lot of people stepped away from the game. The state of Crucible wasn't great (Particularly Trials of the Nine) - in D1, Trials was one of the 'big' activities. the shift for a lot of diehard players became Raiding, thus the birth of Raid Report. I and many others continued to play d2 despite it's not so great feeling drop. Sunsetting the content we'd all paid for devastated a few communities who helped keep the player count pretty high considering the satisfaction for the DLCs and content we were given. Raid farming/Speedrunning did a lot for the game. I myself, paid for my DLC's twice to play on PC after i was able to swap. I could've dealt with the loss of the weapons as - yeah that was fair. But the content i'd sunk thousands of hours into, taught hundreds of people, made more memories than I could ever count. That was what caused a few thousand of us to just quit all at once. It is only the upcoming DLC that's brought us back a little. D2 is in a pretty good state right now compared to when I left. I still find it sad that I can't show my kinderguardian partner these raids/planets etc that I have fond memories of. We may be making memories still but the loss of the story, the raids, all of that just broke my heart after around 9k hours in d1+d2 by the time sunsetting happened.

[@Ranthop]

I would've loved the ability to just download the desired version or expansion of Destiny 2 to play what I wanted. I did miss my missions and raids. Then again, I felt like I got my money's. I was done with the vaulted content. Weapon Crafting was the one of the worst things Bungie implemented. It certainly made the loot chase boring for me. If Crafting and Sunsetting released hand-in-hand I think I would've hated Sunsetting, back then I was okay with it. Although now that Sunsetting will be gone, it would've paid dividends today for those who grinded those hypothetical crafted weapons. It would be a very easy way grab everything from the past as a god roll in Final Shape.

[@brayden9129]

35:09 Whether we wanted it or not, we've stepped into a war with the Cabal on Mars. So let's get to taking out their command, one by one. Valus Ta'aurc. From what I can gather, he commands the Siege Dancers from an Imperial Land Tank just outside of Rubicon. He's well protected, but with the right team, we can punch through those defenses, take this beast out, and break their grip on Freehold.

[@hughmongus6959]

No. There is no valid reason for Bungie's version of "sunsetting." So many other options could've been chosen to deal with the issues of powercreep and/or storage. Options that didn't include retroactively deleting content that people paid real money for, especially when that possibility was not disclosed at the time of purchase. You saying there was "good reasons" for the model just goes to show why Bungie is paying you to defend them. It's always about money

[@marcosvasquesferreira7428]

Craft is a good think but the way it was rolled out missed the mark. It should have been about perfecting the roll of your gun you already owned and not rnjesus for red borders. Every gun becomes craftable, starting at lvl 0 and having the same model of exp to grind, but instead of having to chase five red borders, just play the shit of your own weapon. Imagine being like this, at lvl 10 you unlock every barrel to choose, at lvl 15 mags, lvl 30 one trait, lvl 40 the other trait and lvl 50 the masterwork. It would also value the god roll drop for helping the grind and that gun that you love but it's 3/5 of what you wanted it would be perfected for your gameplay. Just my two cents about it.

[@beny7160]

Crafting was a bigger mis-step than sunsetting. A looter shooter where you are grinding any old weapon with a red border so you can grind the weapon when crafted to get sick of the weapon and then vault it once you've got the you tube approved god roll. Just dumb. No one really asked for it but they roll it out and then realise they've decimated the chase and excitement of a drop in their LOOTER. SHOOTER.

[@NeUwUnWave]

First Song is M.O.O.N - Dust its really good

[@marthlink5015]

You're also forgetting sunsetting is also a direct assault against the community as consumers of a product,and I think it's important and sad it was missed that a company LIKE Ubisoft who does not want you to own anything, that you wouldn't mention that Bungie is also doing something similar. Similar to seasons bungie is basically saying you don't own even the guns, exotics or anything here--- one snap and it CAN be gone, that's not really how people build stable relationships with anything that they use. Imagine your house, car, friends, job or anything just decided to say well--- of no fault of your own we have to take your stuff, and no im not making a joke about taxes XD. But it would give people alot less incentive to get things that those things will happen to, Bungie basically did that and i know probably 80% of my friends so about 10, eight of them stopped playing cause of this or a grievance that was related to it. Bungie was not very kind in those days,the eververse continued to get more and more intrusive while we got less and less things to earn via gameplay, and it's taken years for old wounds to even slightly heal. My gf still refuses to participate in the final shape, though im coming back personally to see the games final chapter to see it to it's end.

[@zevinn6498]

As much as I'd say, yeah! Kick off PS4 from the next generation of Destiny, people might just never be able to play the game again. The PS5 had one of the worst rollouts of a console ever. Due to scalpers not many people were able to actually get the PS5 and not many still have much interest to because of the price tag.

[@cyberhawkgames]

Here's what I think: power creep Is just an abject term they apply any time they want to dispell any notion of buffing other weapons instead of nerfing the ones that are already good. The truth is, if nerfing weapons to make the game more playable and allow for more options is possible, then the inverse is just as true! If Bungie turned other weapons, doesn't have to be everything, just like 10-12 weapons and revitalized them, then those weapons could compete with the current status. I mean, look at Into The Light right now? It has done just that. There was an established meta, and everyone was using certain weapons, but now some revitalized weapons of the past with new roles and such have been brought back and have changed the meta and are competing, and competing WELL against the old formula. That is the truth. If bungie was simply bold enough to introduce some new weapons every season that could simply compete with the currently established meta. I thought the whole point of the artifact was to change the meta? Bungie is totally capable of pulling that off. When most people refer to "power creep" they are referring to Bungie running out of ideas to buff other weapons, for most if not all weapons. The truth is that Bungie has never been out of ideas or been incapable of creating a "brave arsenal" type situation every season, and it wouldn't have offset the balance. The only time Bungie should be nerfing any weapons from the chosen meta should be if they see a weapon get continued use even after adding newer and newer competing weapons. At which point, then it should get a nerf, but it should be allowed to live a life cycle as a powerful weapon.

[@GargantuanMetal]

Covid is really when i poured the most time into D2, Lots of us were really figuring out how to navigate how to treat each other properly during the confusion. I'll never forget being able to disconnect from the world for those 2 years. Work, Destiny 2, sleep. It almost felt like i WAS a guardian. As unfortunate that time was for humanity, being the isolationist I am, it created a world I felt comfortable to live in, when the real world wasn't. ps.. funny guns, made me feel like a god, and that was arguably the best weekend of my life.

[@magnus4001]

I've never played Destiny, but it had always been something I'd considered getting into... until the sunsetting announcement. Now I have literally no interest in ever playing. Bungie taking away so much content that people paid for and so many items people worked for for was unforgivable. I've seen enough videos to know that Destiny's story plays a huge part in the experience so losing so much of it is disheartening. But not just that, it introduces trust issues. If Bungie did it once, who's to stop them from doing it again with later story expansions, with other guns people grind for hours to earn? Why would I want to get invested when Bungie set that precedent? I'm certainly no game developer myself so obviously I know nothing of what the devs had to do to keep the game working with the various expansions being added. Maybe sunsetting was the best way. BUT I am a consumer, and as a consumer, sunsetting did literally nothing to entice me to ever spend time or money on their product.