EVERY Paul Components Rim Brake....Which Is BEST?

[@PaulComponentEngineering]

Thanks for explaining this much more eloquently than we are usually able to!

[@christiantheimprovguy1769]

I love everything you guys do! I really love upgrading my bikes with your stuff. Thank you.

[@DefaultUsername156]

Thank you for your content. Biking always seems like a chore but these videos remind me of the fun part. Cool parts, laid back vibe, and a Riv. Thank you for stopping me from buying insanely priced carbon parts. Coming back to "steel" is like being a kid again. Ty

[@veriest1]

Didn't help at all because the Mini Motos still look the coolest and looking cool is what really matters. 😎

[@splashpit]

If you going to police tape around a bike it’s gotta look good !

[@alejandroaranda5254]

They also make you 27.89% more aero

[@blaughblahh]

I am a bike commuter in Denver. Part of my ride involves putting my bike on a rack on the front of the bus. I found out oil ruins disc brakes so my commuter bike remains on rim brakes. On snowy days I bring a cloth(old sock) to wipe the rim after highway splash back covers the bike in grime. Rim brakes are not impacted by the oil and grime from the highway. Waxing the chain changed my life.

[@breth8159]

she she elite breaks I can't afford ! They're great quality but the extra price doesn't make any sense to me it's just a status thing 🤑

[@hippiebits2071]

@@breth8159 Eh...it wouldn't really make sense to go out of the way to invest in a quality frame only to cheap out on the mechanicals. I'd want that bike looking as nice as possible for no one's enjoyment other than my own. Just sayin"

[@breth8159]

@@hippiebits2071 that's true and they make a great product however unless you're talking about a specialty old vintage European where the measurements are not supported anymore ok. what's wrong with a beautiful set of high-end v brakes that will stop you as quick for a third the price or less ?

[@clearlyabot]

one day... one day im gonna build a bike finally. Thanks for the endless source of ideas, tips, tricks, and tools to customize cycles further than the norm.,

[@kimoarmstrong3519]

Thank you for mentioning hanger cable angle when setting up cantilever brakes. This is the most common reason people don't feel enough braking power on this type of brake.

[@johnherzel718]

I've had a pair of Moto lites since the mid to late 90's. They were great then and still look and work great today. I also had a pair of their cam link brakes, which are probably out of production. They were super cool but the Moto lites replaced them. Great to see Paul's still relevant today 😀

[@andytlr]

Great vid.I found the mini motos difficult to setup but once they’re dialled in, they stay that way and have fantastic stopping power compared to other rim brakes I’ve tried and even fairly comparable to the klampers. Actually prefer the modulation and “feel” of the motos more than klampers.

[@michaelrutchik9906]

I installed the neo retro brakes on my Merlin Mountain fixed gear conversion. I have SRAM carbon short pull brake levers. They work great. There is plenty of stopping power. But then I also have the ability to slow things down through backpedal resistance. Anyhow, Paul components are works of art.

[@michaelrutchik9906]

@rollinrat4850 amazing info. Agree on all points. I first converted my 1989 Merlin road bike to fixed gear and after about 4000 miles in the first year (pandemic activity) I got on my Merlin Mountain for the first time in a year and hated riding it. So I converted it too. I used White Industries ENO eccentric hubs and they have been great. They are both set up as flip flop hubs but I’ve never even been tempted to use the freewheel side. My mountain also has the Rene Herse tires which I love. But like you, I baby them. Conti 5000 28s on the road bike have performed flat-free for years now.

[@ianralph9737]

Just found this -- it's exactly the info I've been looking for, thank you!!

[@TimCupery]

Thanks for this. I've been interested in getting Paul brakes. On explaining short vs long pull, I think it's way easier to distinguish based on rim brake history: full-length v-brakes are long-pull, everything else is short-pull. Why there are few long-pull road levers comes from there (whereas all flat-bar levers from the cantis, pre-v-brake era are short pull).

[@bobqzzi]

I have a set of moto-lites on my 26" Softride gravel bike and love them. Paul's stuff is really nicely made.

[@escgoogle3865]

Loving the way back machine.

[@SteveFullerBikes]

Have touring cantis on my Pre-Q Salsa La Cruz. Honestly, one of the best rim brakes I've used. Modulation is really nice on gravel and the stopping power is really, really good. Could I have saved money using TRPs? Probably. But, with a US made, hand built frame, the Paul's seemed like a worthwhile splurge, and the polished ones look damn nice.

[@artandscience3863]

Thanks so much for this video, and the other one showing the 90 degree set-up. I have struggled with the power of my Tektros and considered upgrading to Pauls, so this kind of content is really helpful.

[@charlesblithfield6182]

Thought I’d add a quick comment about cable housing with these types of brakes. I just installed compression-less housing on one bike and it made a considerable difference to the stopping power and modulation. Way less mushy feeling and I feel safer. I am putting it on all my bikes even mech disc ones which I gather it helps with also.

[@taonflorian2]

yes housing makes a huge difference I agree. Any reference for the ones you used?

[@charlesblithfield6182]

@@taonflorian2 It was the Jagwire Mountain Pro Kit.

[@nathankensley8183]

cable housing makes all the difference. i found mini moto with paul canti levers with compassionless housing was too much power. instant front wheel lock up. put shimano m-system (designed for rim brake mountain bikes) housing felt like goldilocks of housing i have used. Road brake housing feels mushy with canti studded brakes as the housing is designed to flex with super stiff brake calibers.

[@herethere2518]

Now for a rim vs. disc video! I grew up on rim brakes but haven't really looked back since going disc. Not a fan of hydraulic lines due to past experiences so my bikes all have mechanical disc, though a bit intrigued by the TRP cable-operated hydraulic calipers... Probably should look into all of the different pad compounds also, rim & disc, since this makes such a huge overall difference!!! (damn, even the simple bikes have to be complicated!)

[@mgbroncos]

I love these candid reviews and comparison videos. Can you give the Grand Cru brakes a shot too?

[@Pablo-sr5bx]

You can also run Travel Agents for short to long pull configurations.

[@stefhirsch6922]

I’ve used a few different types of V-adapters and have been disappointed in all of them. The power is there but the lever feel and modulation are nowhere to be found. Old school cantilever brakes work fine - if they’re set up properly (one of the biggest factors regarding poor canti braking performance is straddle wire height). Some bikes don’t get along with cantilever brakes such as suspension mountain bikes which typically lack cable stops or allow decent cable routing. Long pull brakes want long pull levers. Short pull brakes want short pull brakes. Adapters are often a cheesy way of doing a job which result in subpar performance and more hassle to work on. Given how cheaply short and long pull brake levers are (that aren’t super duper bling) just get some new levers or get some used ones.

[@mytwocoins]

Cane Creek "V brake" drop bar levers work great with the Moto-lites. I guess they are technically long pull.

[@timtaylor9590]

Yeah no index shifting.

[@alexandergilmour8451]

I find longpull Road levers work well with short pull brakes and it means they can be left further away from rim. My current set up uses Tektro longpull Road levers with BB7 Road disc brakes, all my bikes have friction gears.

[@Llamabanger]

There are so many brands and price point comparisons out there, definitely linear Vbrakes that are Super strong, and look beautiful, need A video for that, the masses, form & function. Me? I'm A decades old shimano Vs parallel push because... They're the best.

[@Llamabanger]

Also conversion cable pull devices such as Travel Agents can work w Vbrakes, part of the mechanics of the subject here to be fair. You can't keep China out of this realm ultimately. Doubt anybody can claim nothing Sino on their bike. Beautiful stuff out there.

[@WoodyBarrelson]

You would post this after I installed my Motolite set this afternoon 😂 so dang crisp

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Motolites are great.

[@ericwetteland8542]

Thanks party pace guy. That’s very helpful. I’m looking for brakes for my Miyata 1000 that I’m building up. Hats off from the mid west.

[@loganenator]

Great review and super helpful! Thanks! 😀👍

[@justdude8115]

There are Tektro and Cane Creek road levers that work with long pull brakes. Also there are so called travel agents that basically transforms long pull vbrakes into shortpull

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Travel agents work but also sort of suck.

[@senorfunball]

I swapped out crappy cantis on a bianchi volpe with v brake and travel agent. Works great

[@AntonvonGütwrench]

Rim Brakes...forever!

[@ap150cerritoscc7]

Anyone have an experience with the Paul Racers and how they might compare to the cantilevers?

[@miatomi]

Great video. Shame they got rid of the long reach centerpull Racer.

[@PaulComponentEngineering]

It may return at some point ;)

[@miatomi]

@@PaulComponentEngineering 👀

[@DiegoCamarero]

Grrrreat vid! Super-useful! Thanks

[@walktxrn]

As a bigger guy, I'd never go back to these, plus disc working better in water (huge issue here) (if that is/still true?) But glad others still like these

[@GT-sc5sk]

I am big too, 115kg..trp cx 8.4 stoping me on downhills, in the rain ..even stronger and more reactive as my hydra on canyon mtb

[@anthonidanowski9404]

i thought my rim brakes were fine, until i got really into winter adventure riding in the columbia river gorge area. not only do they suck in the wet and mud but the pads wear out every couple rides and my new rims are already showing lots of wear. like it or not disc brakes are better for stopping and will make you a faster more confident rider.

[@MelvinHughesatp]

I am a dinosaur! I run Paul Racer's (now discontinued) on my A. Homer Hilsen and Paul Racer Mediums on my Roadini... For centerpull mounted brakes, there aren't many out there that come close to these two!

[@vincentapa1376]

Did you try to take that front wheel out with the moto lite?

[@elliott959]

My partner and I run mini-motos on our 1980s Santana tandem and we've been very happy with them. You don't want to skimp on brakes on a tandem.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

RidewithGPS.com

[@CarsandBikes]

I installed the brakes and Koolstop triple color pads and almost flew over the handlebar.

[@Korina42]

Which brakes?

[@CarsandBikes]

@@Korina42 monolite.

[@thatdeafguyuk]

I'm running Motolites with Shimano 105 brake levers and absolutely no issues at all.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Doesn’t mean it will work with every road lever. Highly dependent on pull of the lever (they vary) and placement of the pads on the post which is determined by wheel size and canti stud placement which also varies.

[@davidide1525]

Thanks for the video , good info. How about Paul center pull brakes ? I have been looking at a Soma Pescadero and they set it up for those brakes as an option .

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

I don't have a bike that will take centerpulls. The current Pescadero doesn't look like it will take the Paul Racer Mediums that are currently in production. You would have to find an older pair of Paul Racers.

[@derekwycoff7768]

Great video. I’m using motolites w/ sram force brifters. Removed the paul noodle and replaced with travel agent. A little bit awkward, kind of hackish, and a pain to setup but braking is solid and all I had to buy was travel agent.

[@squeekywheel]

Some of your videos feature riding in nature with the most beautiful scenery I can imagine. Seems like a lot of dirt roads, rather than mountain biking. Do you know of a way to research rides like these around the country I can do? Just started watching a lot of your videos, and enjoying your content quite a bit! Thanks

[@frankteneralli3149]

There are a lot of navigation apps out there - we use RideWithGPS. Toggle on the heat map option and you'll see where people near you are riding. That's no guarantee of good scenery, but it's a start. I hope this helps. Also, you can't go wrong in a National Forest or on any of our public lands.

[@squeekywheel]

@@frankteneralli3149 Thanks!

[@stefhirsch6922]

On days that you have time have some long rides. Bring an extra layer, food, water…. Spend some time exploring your area. Some of the routes will turn out to be deer trails, roads to access power lines which aren’t interesting and don’t seem to be worth riding and some will be gold. Make notes (mentally, paper, google notes on your phone…) and keep exploring. After several years you’ll know your local rides. It requires time on your bike. If you’re on a gravel bike fatter tires with a little more aggressive tread pattern and easier climbing gears are recommended for this approach.

[@90041hood]

Agree! Paul Touring Cantis #1 !!!

[@GT-sc5sk]

Would always go with mini-v brakes instead

[@90041hood]

@@GT-sc5sk pretty sure tire clearance is only 40mm with minimotos unfortunately

[@GT-sc5sk]

@@90041hood do you need really more as 38mm?

[@90041hood]

@@GT-sc5sk of course! :)

[@GT-sc5sk]

@@90041hood on mtb or cx/gravel bike? Running for years 33mm, since last year 38, once they are done, will go to 33

[@johnsmithers284]

Just in time for my VO brakeset to show up at my door

[@HondoTrailside]

Neo retros have plenty of stopping power, but you got the geometry wrong. Well... With a narrow, almost racing bike like fork set, you can't set the brakes up correctly. If one has a wider fork, which makes sense generally, and in particular since the tire sizes have taken a jump, or as you point out, with mud, fenders, and so forth, then there is no problem. A very narrow fork is probably more sanitary on a racing bike, but since we have all kinds of drag already with panniers, racks and fenders, the crown is probably drafting already.

[@charlesblithfield6182]

Is there a quick way to tell if a mountain bike stle lever is short or long pull? I imagine it’s the length that the end of the attachment point of the cable moves, but how much distance for each type?

[@timshelhamer7374]

I have the same question. Many levers don’t specify long or short pull. They say linear pull, or compatible with cantilever brakes, or something that doesn’t give me confidence that it will work well. Paul does specifically say their love levers or canti levers are compatible with which brake, but a full set of Paul brakes and levers costs like $500+ so I will go cheap for now and maybe upgrade later, one piece at a time.

[@resisomaaji5887]

it is 40mm from the lever pivot to the end of the cable attachment on the long pull lever. About 20mm from the lever pivot to the cable attachment point for the short pull.

[@charlesblithfield6182]

@@resisomaaji5887 thanks!

[@charlietannert-lerner4769]

any thoughts on avid shorty ultimates or rene herse brakes?

[@ductrung3993]

Hi Russ! Compatiblities aside, does the Touring Canti that significantly ahead compared to the Mini Moto in terms of stopping power and modulation? I only run 700x45c max with fenders so clearance shouldnt be an issue on either right? Thank you!

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Yes. The touring canti is the noticeably stronger brake and has better modulation IMO. The mini moto excels in ease of setup and lack of straddle cable and stops better than the Neo Retros but not as good as the touring cantis when setup well.

[@ductrung3993]

@@PathLessPedaledTV thank you! I also love the way the Motolite works but not sure if i want to deal with converting pull ratio… Have you tried Rene Herse and Velo Orange canti? It would be great if there would be the video comparing the top tiers and cantis from different brands together for us non disc people!

[@nickporter3531]

What about Paul’s Racer centre pull brakes? I have them on my Pescadero and they are better than anything else I have tried.

[@splashpit]

He runs bar bags so anything that interferes isn’t in his peripheral.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

I don't have the appropriately spaced braze ons for center pulls. Also their tire clearances aren't great.

[@nickporter3531]

@@PathLessPedaledTV shame. I have used them with. 42mm Rene Herse knobbly tire and they had clearance for that. Regular tire is 34mm jack brown (an ex riv tire) I noticed they don’t have the larger option on their site at the moment.

[@antoniocorigliano68]

Amazing brake 💪🏻💪🏻

[@jimbrittain402]

Gevenalle makes a long-pull lever; I have 'em on my monstercross.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

That is what is on the Riv.

[@RyanStanis]

@@PathLessPedaledTV Bit of bad news on this one: Gevenalle has stopped producing long pull shifter/lever combos as Tektro has discontinued production of their long pull drop bar lever. Until they can source an alternative, those long pull ones you got there are now "RARE HARD TO FIND OOP"

[@mumenrider677]

For someone who doesn’t care between short pull or long pull, where do the moto lites sit in terms of braking power and modulation compared to the rest of the line-up?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Prob some of the best braking and ok modulation.

[@cjones7854]

Yo bring back the hats!

[@thecommonwheel]

Curious what pads you have on the mini-motos? I have the stock salmon kool stops and the squeal is horrendous...

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Short road pads from Riv. I believe they are kool stops.

[@brianmaldonado3723]

Ty.

[@glennpettersson9002]

With light weight frames the rear V or Canti effectiveness can suffer with frame flex.

[@Llamabanger]

And the brake Booster comes out of retirement ! They never left most my rimbrake bikes, always feels better to have them especially long arm Vbrakes

[@PaulComponentEngineering]

Agree. We've seen the rear brake bosses flex away from each other quite a bit with the power of something like the Mini Moto on super light seatstays.

[@notpablo8369]

What rims are you using on this bike?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Pacenti Brevet

[@thorn6809]

Can't the mini v-brakes be modified with some sort of wheel to keep the cable more away from the wheel of the bike?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

No.

[@thorn6809]

@@PathLessPedaledTV I guess you have tried it and saw that the brake is not working properly anymore, right? Normal v-brakes annoy me sometimes by limiting the clearance for the wheel or the fenders but I have not tried anything to work around it.

[@thorn6809]

There are these things that convert short pull brakes to have more cable pull. I think it might be useful for giving older frictionshifters more cable pull in order to shift cassettes with more than 9 cogs properly, I guess. It might also help with the cable routing on the rear derailleur. So that the cable dosen't need to have a bow. I like the idea of the shifters changing their positions for more ergonomical shifting etc.

[@thorn6809]

@RollinRat that is true but smaller tires are often not an option to me, thanks. It is also a problem of narrow rims that let the tires gain height.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

@@thorn6809 there are and they sort of suck. I’ve used them. If you can avoid using them and use an appropriate lever that is better.

[@danielpwagner]

What would you say the clearance of the Touring Cantilever is with 700c wheels? Would it take a 40c with good stopping power?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

The width isn't an issue. It depends on where the canti studs are mounted in relation to the wheel.

[@stefhirsch6922]

My experience with regular (non Pauls) cantilever brakes tire clearance wasn’t an issue. I used to run 2.5” tires with low profile cantis and had lots of room to spare. The original surly fat bikes used cantilever brakes for a reason.

[@danielpwagner]

@@stefhirsch6922 I never knew there were fat bikes with cantilever breaks 😄- very interesting. Thanks for this.

[@stefhirsch6922]

@@danielpwagner Hayes had a good disc brake on the market in 1996 but discs hadn’t taken over mountain bikes yet. In 1996 most downhill racing was done on rim brakes and many pros were still downhilling on rim brakes until about 1998. Surly also wanted to keep their bikes at a price point that back then meant either junk quality disc brakes or sticking with rim brakes. Rim brakes have a lot of history in mountain biking - it’s just that they’ve been forgotten about because discs took over 20 years ago.

[@NeilHodges]

What about the Paul Racers?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Paul Racers require very specific mounts. Hardly any new bikes have them. Mine certainly doesn't.

[@NeilHodges]

They have models of Racers that mount to normal caliper brake mounts now, too. Seen them both online and in person.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

@@NeilHodges still wouldn't work for me since they have such narrow tire clearance.

[@GT-sc5sk]

trp cx 8.4..but tbh all of them even cheaper doing the job

[@nthonyholden]

Excellent info as always! Are you running Soma Cazaderos on your Hillborne in two different sizes (42 in the rear, 50 up front)? Or are you clearing the 50mm in the rear also?

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

50 front and rear.

[@billtidey]

@@PathLessPedaledTV How tight are the clearances? I have an older Hillborne with the side pull brakes and the 48mm (49mm measured) Gravelkings were real tight. Wondering if the geometry changed a bit along with the brake type.

[@brendonoid6133]

@@billtidey I have 50mm Cazaderos on a 2012 side pull Sam Hillborne and the tyre clearance is tight but it works. Running narrow rims, ~19mm internal and the tyres measure 47mm actual. Russ's Sam has longer chainstays and slightly more tyre clearance than the older versions.

[@yenneved]

wait wait wait. Racers. Brazed on Racers.

[@bennettturk3206]

They all have one thing in common... they are very expensive.

[@michaelviglianco6121]

Moto lite and it's not close :)

[@3wbasie]

Moto lite is super ugly there I said it!! :-(

[@anthonidanowski9404]

@rollinrat4850 anybody who spends the money on paul rim brakes is not putting function over form. they work ok in dry condition. pretty useless once you get into the muddy/rainy rides.

[@markfletcher4605]

Soon any bike with rim brakes will be as common as the dodo bird.

[@escgoogle3865]

Moto lites are bonkers for adjustability. I have a set a thier 90s ancestors sitting in my nostalgia parts bin.

[@JacobWilson]

So far I've been so disappointed with every Paul part I've tried. Handlebars moved in the stem no matter how hard tightened, the clampers were just underwhelming barely better than my spyre.

[@SteveFullerBikes]

Interesting. I have a set of Klampers and they are light years beyond the Spyres I have had on other bikes.

[@JacobWilson]

I don't know, I had my mecahnic make sure they were set up correctly and while yes it was better than the spire, not better enough for me to stick with them.

[@JacobWilson]

@@amitkumar-wj8gn I mean I just got growtac equals from work... That are by far the best mechanical brakes I've ever used. But yeah my spyrs served me well and will probably find their way on a bike in the future

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Here's your review: I've had TRP Spyres and they suck with road levers. Mediocre at best. Get them if thats all you can afford but they are the most over rated medoicre brake.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

@@amitkumar-wj8gn because TRP Spyres are crap.

[@nanadenmark]

Very Nice my friend 👍🌺🌹

[@cypriano8763]

magura hydraulic rim brakes are the strongest. avid v brakes are secong

[@addvurtbikes]

Gotta be first!!!

[@Mikey2tt]

I think the price for these is rather steep.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Did say it was for splashing out.

[@TheFloridaBikeVlogger]

i do not even own any disc brake bikes lol

[@singletona082]

'Easier than the shemano v brakes. FUCKING. SOLD!

[@VinceJohnson-yd3vv]

you know, this propaganda that states that you must have hydraulics but properly adjusted cable-mechanical disk brakes are lighter and modulate just as well (if you have any finesse at all).

[@ZippyLikesZippers]

No racer or racer medium........ok

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Ok

[@romanengelbrecht6717]

rim brakes are rim brakes its just about your adjustment doesnt matter how good or bad brakes claim to be