Everything Wrong With Numbers 32 in the Bible

[@shriggs55]

You can see why Christians try to disconnect themselves from the old testament and say they are under the "new covenant,"or "new testament". But that doesn't stop them from picking and choosing verses from the old testament to make themselves feel good or to put in their devotionals." They also go to the old testament to "prove" that Jesus is the messiah. Believers" don't want to admit that the one Jesus called "Father" was the Yahweh of the old test.,and that Jesus said that if you have seen him you have seen the Father.This same Jesus said that the Law and the Prophets would be in force until "heaven and earth pass away."

[@roberta4989]

Fake information.

[@tomschmidt381]

So as a non-believer here is my understanding. According to the bible god created humans in his image (whatever that means for a perfect nonmaterial being) and wants to have a personal relationship with each of us. An yet in the bible he constantly pits humans against each other and commands the Israelites to commit geocide against their neighbors. Didn't seem like a good idea when the Nazis tried it 80 years ago so why is it okay for god to do it? If the others weren't the good guys blame god not them. After all god created them that way. It is beyond reason how anyone is able to call this "the good book" and take it seriously. The only saving grace is that none this actually happened.

[@sdlorah6450]

God is our Creator, and he holds men accountable for their sin against him. God warned the first man, Adam, that to break his law would bring death. Death, and hell after death, are the wages for sin. All mankind faces the judgment of God because of sin; none can escape it or thwart it (see Genesis 1-3, Romans 3:23, Romans 5:12). But because of God's love for mankind, he has provided his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, as the Savior of men (1 John 4:14). He bore our sins in his own body upon the tree so that we could be forgiven our sins (1 Peter 2:24). Because Jesus suffered according to the scriptures in his death, burial, and resurrection, there is a way to escape the penalty for sin by trusting in the Lord Jesus Christ as Savior (1 Corinthians 15:3-4). God promises the gift of eternal life through Christ to all who believe on him (see Romans 6:23, John 6:47). God desires that every man be saved (see 2 Peter 3:9). The Bible tells us of how God worked in history to make this possible. Every man is in need of salvation as can only be found by humbly trusting in Christ (Mark 16:15, Acts 4:12). Nothing is more important than the welfare of a person's soul, both in this life and in the next.

[@anonemouse3768]

@@sdlorah6450 Sorry, my creators were my parents. It was not a mythical superman.

[@tomschmidt381]

@@sdlorah6450 Thanks for providing all the bible quotes. But for me the bible still justifies the genocide along with a lot of evils civil society no longer permits.

[@angieng71]

Maybe there are a few "Gods" , and in the absence of Gods for other tribes(their Gods went back to Nibiru?), the God of Moses take the opportunity to attack! Same story when the God for the Egyptians/Pharoah was not on planet Earth (maybe went back to Nibiru), the God for Israel asked Moses to act! (After waited patiently for 400 years of slavery, wow! the God of Moses is a patient one!!!)

[@sdlorah6450]

@@tomschmidt381 God shows us how seriously he takes sin in the Bible. He brought judgment on the people living in the land of Canaan after allowing them another 400+ years (see Genesis 15:16); their sins are detailed in verses in the Old Testament. Sometimes he used Israelites to execute that judgment. But God is not a respecter of persons. He warned the Israelites about disobedience and was clear about its consequences (see Deuteronomy 28:15-68). If we keep reading through the Old Testament, we see that Israel was judged by God for their sin through Assyrian and Babylonian oppression, conquer, and captivity. Israel suffered grievously for their sin against God. Sometimes, God brought judgment for sin through acts like the worldwide flood (see Genesis 6:13) or the raining of brimstone and fire on the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah (see Genesis 19:24). All of this is to say that we are wise to learn from these things that God has the power to bring judgment, that he will certainly judge, and to go to the only one who can save us from that judgment, the Lord Jesus Christ.

[@d.o.m.494]

Bible god is nothing more than a local war god with anger issues.

[@markstyles1246]

The difference between a minor, local god and an omni-God is really just the amount of real world success of the tribe that came up with them. Curious that...

[@fordprefect5304]

@@markstyles1246 The only recorded battle the Israelites ever won was when they were part of a coalition that beat the Assyrians at the battle of Qarqur in 853BCE The Egyptians routed them in 1207 and 925 BCE Amun Ra wins Aram Damascus one of their allies at Qargur routed them in 853 BCE Hadad wins Assyria obliterated Israel in 723 and vassalized Judah Ashur Wins Babylon conquered Judah in 604 and obliterated Jerusalem in 586 Marduk wins Syria ruled them for 200 years Ahura Mazda wins Greece ruled them for 200 years Zeus wins Rome ruled them until obliterating them in 70CE Jupiter wins So which god are we talking about?

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

D.O.M. Sure, pretty much every god in the Bible are basically war guys.

[@brunozeigerts6379]

@@fordprefect5304 Ah, but when other nations defeated them, it was because god was punishing them. At least, that's probably what the priests told them.

[@markstyles1246]

@@fordprefect5304 True enough. I suppose it might be more accurate to say, "the amount of real world success of the mythology they came from." The Abrahamic mythology has has enough success to make the claim of a minor local god into the claim of an omni-God.

[@oliefan3722]

Assuming I got the math right. No one who was alive when they left Egypt gets to see the promise land. The cut off age was 20 so it’s been at least 20 years since they left Egypt. The wander through the desert for 40 years before said promise land. Meaning, the life expectancy of the humans are below 60 years old. Not the hundreds of years. I’m starting to think when someone came up with Person X lived for hundreds of years, it was probably mistaken for moon cycles. And in later copies it was mistaken or purposely inflating time. So that would put Noah being just under 80 year when he died.

[@stevewebber707]

I think it's more often blamed on mistranslated numbers, due to a lack of understanding or knowledge of differing based number systems. I'm open to the possibility of exaggeration, or simply being wrong, as the bible so often is. I'm not overly concerned with how long they claim Noah lived, as I'm unconvinced he ever existed.

[@oliefan3722]

I have family members that like to make it know that humans used to live X amount of years because of their devotion to god at almost every family gathering. Just something I noticed.

[@alguno1010101]

look if any of the writers of this book knew math they wouldn't have written it in first place

[@kellydalstok8900]

It didn’t happen. The Israelites were never slaves in Egypt, at least not in large numbers. The Moses story is a fairytale, a made up origin story for a mixed group of people that were set free from Babylon and were given Jerusalem and its surroundings to settle in.

[@lisablacker3102]

@@oliefan3722, I feel for you. It's a similar situation with my husband's (and to a lesser degree my) family.

[@philleprechaun6240]

"It's the bible, the good guys have to win" - UNLESS the bad guys have chariots of iron, then god can't defeat them. Judges 1: 19. So, to beat this all powerful, almighty god all you have to do is have superior technology weapons.

[@kellydalstok8900]

That’s why god is missing in action these days; nearly every family (in the West) owns at least one car.

[@bladerunner3314]

Thou shalt not kill, except for everybody else ... this gawd is soooooo moral.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Blade Runner Really, what makes this gawd soooooo moral?

[@bladerunner3314]

@@Daniel-cz7kd I see you lack the intelligence to recognize sarcasm.

[@incelexunknown]

This guy is very knowledgeable, always spitting pure facts, you got my respect brother.

[@raywood8187]

Every time I think of the Israelites going on another murder spree, the "One Tin Soldier" sung by Coven comes to mind: Listen, children, to a story That was written long ago 'Bout a kingdom on a mountain And the valley-folk below On the mountain was a treasure Buried deep beneath the stone And the valley-people swore They'd have it for their very own So the people of the valley Sent a message up the hill Asking for the buried treasure Tons of gold for which they'd kill Came an answer from the mountain With our brothers we will share All the secrets of our mountain All the riches buried there Now the valley cried with anger "Mount your horses! Draw your sword!" And they killed the mountain-people So they won their just reward Now they stood beside the treasure On the mountain, dark and red Turned the stone and looked beneath it "Peace on Earth" was all it said. Go ahead and hate your neighbor Go ahead and cheat a friend Do it in the name of heaven You can justify it in the end There won't be any trumpets blowing Come the judgment day On the bloody morning after One tin soldier rides away

[@lizlanman47]

I love that song! It was an influence on my developing social conscience as a child. There was an animated version that I think was on the Sonny and Cher Show

[@lizlanman47]

You missed a bit right after " with our brothers we will share.... Now the valley cried with anger: Mount your horses, Draw your sword! So they killed the Mountain People So they won their just reward! Now stood beside the treasure On the Mountain dark and dread Turned the stone and looked beneath it "Peace on Earth " was all it said.... Chorus

[@lizlanman47]

Final line: On the bloody morning after One Tin Soldier rides away

[@kellydalstok8900]

Who would make up such a horrible imaginary history for themselves anyway, in which the ancient Israelites portray themselves as the bad guys. Especially since it never happened.

[@lisablacker3102]

These lyrics haunted me when I was a child. A bit of trivia for you: the Coven version was a cover. The original was Canadian band, The Original Caste.

[@dave9242]

They approached Moses all wrong. They should've said "Hey Moses, people are saying we can't make our homes on this land that you got for us. What are you going to do about it?"

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Dave Why should‘ve they said that?

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@johnmertus4423 Except, Moses is not a child, also he can ask “who’re the people, bring them forward.” Or even approve of what those people say.

[@MaryAnnNytowl]

Thanks for wading through this for us. It's appreciated! ❤️❤️

[@HannahHäggAutisticTransWoman]

I expect Moses death to be extremely underwhelming when ever it comes. This is the bible after all.

[@dwaneanderson8039]

*Spoiler alert* Moses isn't going to die until the end of the next book! At the rate we're going, we won't get there till next October.

[@kellydalstok8900]

@MrWesdotcom it’s the bible, not an opera.

[@KeriRautenkranz]

Wow! The Hebrew War God (Moses' Imaginary Friend) accept a counterproposal, rather than you know, causing 40 years of grief or killing everyone. Except the Canaanites, that is...

[@AmityvilleFan]

This Special Military Operation is going fine, I think.

[@puirYorick]

To be clear, Yahweh is a legendary tribal war god that got very effective PR and subsequent cultural makeovers and reboots into three main Abrahamic groups which are each further broken into several sects today and all carry out murderous wars in the name of what is still the same original war god.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

puirYorick Not even close

[@puirYorick]

@@Daniel-cz7kd Saying " Not even close" is the equivalent of a child's rebuttal "Uh-uh!" so I'll just put your sparkling intellect on MUTE for KZbin.

[@Malidictus]

Wait, is THAT why the Israelites wandered in the desert for 40 years? I thought the events that Moses recalls happened after they arrived near the promised land and started slaughtering innocent people. Did I miss something important in Exodus?

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Malidictus You missed something very important in Numbers

[@Malidictus]

@@Daniel-cz7kd No, I recall Khorra and the others defying God, then being eaten by the ground. However, I didn't realise that was 40 years prior to the events described here. I thought this was referring to the 40 years of wandering prior to the 10 Commandments and the Arc way back in Exodus.

[@grapeshot]

Yeah obviously this is their form of manifest destiny.

[@elainejohnson6955]

So much for a peace loving god.

[@smochygrice465]

Best selling, or most printed book? Going with the later.

[@lh1673]

NT God: Don’t forget “All scriptures are beneficial for teaching and 。。。2Tim 3:16. Me: Mom, thanks for reading this book everyday, we’re on Numbers. By the way what are beneficial?

[@someonerandom256]

Moses comes across as such a cult leader in this chapter.

[@terryriley8963]

Please Moses tell our God we are tired of all the fighting and slaughter, we just want to settle down and live in peace. Sorry guys that’s not going to work at all as our peaceful loving God has got a lot more killing and slaughtering he wants us to do.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Terry Riley Where do they say that?

[@terryriley8963]

@@Daniel-cz7kd It is said in my bible which I have translated and interpreted from the non original texts written in ancient languages that nobody fully understands any more so my bible is my made up version just like all the other numerous bible versions lots of people use which they all believe their bible is the one and only true ‘original’ version that has been written from copied texts with no original manuscripts and has been translated and interpreted by ‘their’ special people who God has chosen to interpret ‘their’ special bible for them and God doesn’t care how many rubbish bible versions there are telling his holy word.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@terryriley8963 Well pointed out and agreed, except for the last part.

[@lh1673]

@@terryriley8963 Excellent point on your Bible, thanks for perfect explanation. And just reading of the verses that God started to USE humans to kill each other for His glory should had been the biggest red flag, that something is extremely wrong with this God and his stories!

[@terryriley8963]

@@lh1673 It really is a major red flag as once God gives the authority to any human to kill so that person can then command people to slaughter men, woman, children and babies in God’s name that, as history has proven, gives anyone the right to use that example to command any genocide or slaughter to be righteously done in God’s name and as we know the Abrahamic God is not bothered about who claims to be doing anything in his name such as killing, writing his many holy inerrant differing bibles or making up any old crap in his rightous name. One thing that really gets me about people justifying these bible slaughters is that God is killing these people because they are evil and so deserve it and for arguments sake I would say, okay if God decides he wants anyone killed for any reason let him do it himself but for him to ask someone to kill for him, such as children and babies, is sickening and beyond my comprehension and just imagine the punishment we would get from God when we refused to do his slaughtering?

[@ragevsraid7703]

noooooooo how did i miss this live again :( edit: excuse me youtube but WHY after i posted this comment did you choose to notify me instead of before???

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Rage What’s the big deal? I share and watch my friend live on KZbin, and sometimes miss the live

[@ragevsraid7703]

@@Daniel-cz7kd i like to be there live

[@MetallicAAlabamA]

With God's anger becoming aroused, and his anger is burning. Does that mean that God has angry sex and his aroused anger is burning with an STD (Sexually Transmitted Deity)? I'm sorry! That was extremely childish. I was kinda hoping that DarkMatter2525's version is more accurate to the story w/ Moses gettn' a shovel to the head! Watching his bible cartoons, then actually hearing the story as read in the bible by Hemant. It's kind hard not to picture God hanging out with Jeffrey and his cannabis leaf underwear lol. Anyway! The bible stories are great if your into contradictory murder comedy.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

MetallicA AlabamA Don’t you know?

[@MetallicAAlabamA]

@@Daniel-cz7kd I swear either I'm trying to flip through every God and Jeffrey episode in my head so that I can answer the question "Don't you know?" Or maybe that I do know that I'm not omniscient, so I don't know everything. Or maybe it's that God is not Omnipotent, but Impotent? Maybe that question was just a simple question that I can't answer. Oh well! Wave at my Racoon avatar! 👋 🦝...🤘😬🤘

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@MetallicAAlabamA Well actually, I meant DarkMatter2525’s version of the bible cartoons is quite inaccurate, even with sometimes quoting biblical texts.

[@MetallicAAlabamA]

@@Daniel-cz7kd Oh, of course. They are all meant for comedic purposes. I don't take them as seriously as when I listen to Hemant read, or listen to AronRa's blasphemers bible. But DM2525 does have alot of though lt provoking messages.

[@elainejohnson6955]

So, God renigged on giving a bunch of his people the land he promised to them.

[@laurajarrell6187]

They sure had imagination! And I loved the image of Moses as the typical old complaining man. 👍💖🥰✌

[@MrKit9]

You're doing a great job. Keep breaking down the fallacies and replacing them with facts. Very proud of you!

[@zecuse]

2:40 ... so Moses is saying that he's the only one older than 20 that's come out of Egypt at this time? And when Exodus said he was 80 when he left... that means he's the oldest Israelite right now by some 60+ years at the age of 120?

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

zecuse Remember, Joshua and Caleb, are the only two of the original exodus who are allowed to enter the promised land, as Moses is also halted

[@alguno1010101]

I think that Joshua also ends up entering the Promised Land with 80 years, they liked their heroes old

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@alguno1010101 Hardly, they simply grow old as events and circumstances come about, as every other human

[@alguno1010101]

@@Daniel-cz7kd In Exodus, Moses is said to be 80 years old at the time God speaks to him in the burning bush. Joshua crosses the Jordan at 80 years old. Both are surprisingly old when their main part of the story starts. 80 is objectively a long time on Earth for a human being.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@alguno1010101 How do you know Joshua was 80 at the Jordan crossing, besides that was his second entrance to the Promised Land. Anyway, what does the age objectivity have to do with the age they like their heroes?

[@Bethelaine1]

These verses were used as property transactions, just as some parts of the Old Testament were genealogy, others were poetry and others were word of mouth about history. The information gets lost and changed as in a game of telephone. We also have to remember that we have no real frame of reference for much of what they are talking about. People and places are compressed together and lost. Some events are blown out of proportion while others are forgotten. Thousands of years have passed, who knows what stories there will be about us in the distant future, should mankind survive.

[@MatthewCaunsfield]

These guys are better at bargaining than their ancestors 40 years ago, or maybe Moses just can't be bothered any more?

[@rcblazer]

The Israelites continue their endless wandering to the "promised" land, one conquest at a time. Then they have the conquer the people already living there.

[@mitchellminer9597]

Just a reminder that the River Jordan wasn't very big even back then. The lands on both sides of it are pretty much the same. I really can't tell what side they are approaching it from. Wait a minute - they were on the EAST side - they must have wandered around a lot. Seriously, though, they should take the entire Jordan Valley and watershed. Having enemies on the other bank of the river isn't good.

[@kingsolomon7553]

Is Moses the picture of a good messiah?

[@smochygrice465]

No idea brother, you are better off asking a christian or just read the Bible books yourself to find out. Hope you are well brother.

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

King Solomon How do you understand ‘good messiah’?

[@TBomb39]

Why did the VOC lie about answering my question "Who killed the 24,000 Israelites in Numbers 25?"

[@kingsolomon7553]

@@Daniel-cz7kd Loving

[@smochygrice465]

Don't forget to tune into AXP live brother.

[@garryferrington811]

I wonder if they would have done better with one of the gods from Genesis.

[@DruncanUK]

Throughout the Old Testament the names all sound like someone threw a bag of Scrabble tiles in the air and just used what fell.

[@mitchellminer9597]

I'm looking for a way to get Christians to let me pick their Biblical names.

[@DruncanUK]

@@mitchellminer9597 🤣🤣

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Artful Bodger Wouldn’t they all have fallen?

[@DruncanUK]

@@Daniel-cz7kd The Bible can't get anything right, they wouldn't worry about a piddling little detail like vanishing Scrabble tiles!

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

@@DruncanUK What makes you think or say that?

[@gren8te319]

christianity kinda sounds like the john wick continental: there's a way to quit, but it's really damn tough to pull it off.

[@realrealwarpet]

“The good guys have to win” I mean, id argue everyones an asshole

[@JohnDavies-cn3ro]

Just out of curiosity |I went and re-read Numbers 32. Rather puzzled as to what you're getting at, and also why the chapter went on so long, but the basic message is pretty simple.

[@darrylbatchem8985]

You sit in that chair and cut the scene almost every single sentence that just causes flicker which is as annoying as a strobe light to an epileptic. When I can watch people talk for 20 minutes without a single cut. Maybe this isn't what you are cut out for?

[@Daniel-cz7kd]

Hemant or friendly atheist Interesting Hemant, in the previous chapters you’re against a tribe being massacred and now you’re saying, “By the end of this chapter, you’re gonna be wishing another tribe was being massacred.” And then “We also hear from a couple of Israelite tribes that are so done with the Bible that they’re ready to call it a day.” Is this some of the stupid things you say? “What’s Moses gonna do? Give it to them? Or complain?” Well, Moses basically gives it to them, of course. “More specifically, the two tribes are saying “We defeated the Amorites and Moabites and Midianites. Isn’t that enough?” And Moses says, “No! What about Canaan?” And he’s not done complaining!” Right, like you Hemant, plenty of complaining and accusing, no truth, facts or other “Oh, calm down Moses. You cannot call anyone else a brood of sinners when you instigated a massacre in the previous chapter.” Right Hemant, you can call out Moses on what he says and yet you don’t have to worry about what you say. “Just say, “Cool, I accept your offer.”” Why does he have to say that? “Just say, “Cool, we’re good. Let’s go.”” And why do they have to say that? “Very exciting to learn they took over new lands and renamed them. Just riveting stuff.” I suppose I can agree with you, after all a family’s history is exciting to a family and/or a historian. “It’s the Bible. The good guys eventually have to win.” Interesting, where do you get that idea?

[@brunozeigerts6379]

Evidentially, you don't recognize satire. 'You're going to wish another tribe was being massacred.' As a break from all the names being endlessly repeated. Or like the line from Conan the Destroyer, 'Enough talk!' And I don't have time to answer the stupid points you raised.

[@Onganana]

Local myth. Local ignorance. Countless false facts and contradictions. …does NOT qualify as the word of god, period.

[@KeriRautenkranz]

Well, if you define "god" as someone's Imaginary Friend, this could be the words of a god. it would be a pretty nasty "god" though, reflecting badly on the person(s) with that particular Imagination...

[@markjapan4062]

NO SIGNS JUST ROCK MARKERS