Evidence Thrown Out After Police Extend Traffic Stop

From a court in Michigan, a friend of mine is the defense attorney.
His website: centralmichiganlawyer.com/

[@timberwoof]

Why is it okay for cops not to know the law, but for people they arrest, ignorance is no excuse?

[@BlackJesus8463]

Why are people proud of things they had no say in?

[@davetindell4110]

Qualified immunity.

[@sarajuanaict]

ACAB

[@bindingcurve]

Cops who know the law are even more dangerous. If they come after you, you are f@$%ed.

[@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine]

@@davetindell4110 QI only applies when the law does *NOT* say that something is illegal.

[@waterbottle4782]

A 19 year old cannot legally own a vape pen but can both vote and join the army, USA laws are weird.

[@branch7628]

To the government, old enough to sign up to die in a foreign war but not old enough to decide to inhale fog juice

[@threatassessment606]

It's for their own safety

[@branch7628]

@@threatassessment606 and thats why we let them get blown to peices by child soldiers right? Because that's for their safety

[@kenyattaclay7666]

@@threatassessment606 but buying cigarettes at that age is perfectly fine though.

[@listenerobserver7160]

@@threatassessment606 so is not joining the military

[@daniels.3062]

The fact they didn't issue a traffic ticket, tells you it was likely a pretextual stop.

[@frankdoss6313]

I find it unfortunate that pretextual stops are legitimate

[@mrm5701]

Totally. They "had a reason" for stopping him, when that didn't work out, now it's a fishing trip to make up "criminality".

[@satekeeper]

Was going to say. It's not ironic. It's that he may have had dashcam running that would prove they were lying.

[@justinkaufman495]

That or upon finding evidence of a larger crime they decided to avoid the additional paperwork that comes with a ticket for a minor traffic infraction.

[@adamg2031]

You hear about these kinds of unconstitutional searches when it makes it to court, and sometimes people say "well, the person still committed a crime, so they're still the bad guys." But for every person who gets arrested based on a bad search, how many innocent people are wrongly searched who you never hear about, because it never goes to court?

[@gomahklawm4446]

Do you REALLY think the average American is smart enough/can look beyond their hatred of "others" enough to realize their rights are at stake as well??? I don't.....

[@thedirtprincess3293]

Yes.

[@Bob-ub4gl]

Too MANY... Next question? lol

[@scotthewitt258]

If they will collect bad evidence, what keeps them from PLANTING fake "evidence" on an innocent person?

[@ronniebuchanan6575]

​@@scotthewitt258exactly

[@terryjwood]

A judge who understands and supports the Constitution and sides with the defendant? It's a miracle!

[@kittybrowneye3163]

No he knows the probation officers is going to do a drug test on him and his probation will be revoked and then he's going to prison for 10 years for the gun charge, just a smart judge the kids going to jail which is right where he should be. How do you know this channel isn't worth watching because this guy didn't even catch what is obviously going on

[@mikealvord55]

Nah. If it was a miracle, you wouldn’t be hearing the stories.

[@Bronte866]

Happens all the time.

[@MyCabinLife]

Especially in Michigan!

[@prsplayer210]

​@@Bronte866all the time? Not at all,this kind of thing is extremely rare

[@roy19491]

my late mother-in-law was stopped by a rookie cop, who ticketed her for doing 36 MPH in a 35 mile zone....then, he cited her for "no license of person", based of the fact that her driver's license was in her purse, lying on the back seat.....magistrate lectured the officer for 25 minutes for "stupidity", and dismissed both tickets......cop was eventually released from the department for unsatisfactory performance during his probationary period

[@jilbertb]

And, unfortunately, he was hired by the next town over....

[@johnpublic6582]

@@jilbertb And the next town, and the next town until he took his pension which was probably worth more than most people make during their entire working career.

[@dragons_red]

Unfortunately positions of power attract the type who love to tell others what to do.

[@copcuffs9973]

Same thing, cop tried to write me a ticket for a school zone violation, 🚸but it wasn't a school day (teacher workshop) when I notified him of his error he flipped out, "You mean to tell me I can't write school zone violations for the rest of the week!?" Suddenly my speed jump from the regular limit (in a 🚸) to one over the regular limit. 😡 Judge ordered, "pay it and 🛑stop wasting MY ⚖️ TIME!" SMH- 🙄

[@rafaeltorre1643]

In my town of roughly 20,000, none of the police are from here anymore. I don’t trust any of them. They have no incentive to help their community because they know no-one and were already fired or didn’t qualify somewhere else.

[@belindadolan9711]

My foster son was stopped in the summer where it was close to 100 degrees outside. The cops ran his license then told him to get out and handcuffed him to the grill of the Police car. They proceeded to throw all his tools on the ground and ransacked his truck. After half an hour, there was a voice over the radio to let him go and put all his stuff back. When he asked for the videos to file a complaint, the body cans had malfunctioned on all the officers and the car videos disappeared.

[@prsplayer210]

Cops literally destroyed the interior on my 3 week old car in 2008 because they "smelled marijuana" they cut open all of the seats, ripped parts of the dash off,cut open spare tire. I was in the USCG at the time and was in dress uniform. They of course found nothing,but arrested me after all of that for "reckless driving" when the original stop was because I had paper plates from the dealership. It was the only brand new car I ever had and they ruined it and I had zero recourse to get it fixed, I took a bunch of pictures of what they did and showed the judge, the judge laughed and said it was completely justified even though I never consented to search,they found nothing. I was never able to afford getting the interior repaired. Judges by and large are just as complicit and thuggish as pigs

[@robertmohler9131]

Did you sue the cops and judge?

[@robertmohler9131]

​@@prsplayer210Dod you sue the judge and the cops?

[@evos469]

​@@robertmohler9131he didn't have the money

[@archmage7813]

​@@prsplayer210You don't show a judge. You show a lawyer. The lawyer would absolutely have happily taken that case

[@ianbattles7290]

Apparently unaware that I didn't smoke and could/would pass a drug test, a cop once claimed that my car "reeked of weed so strongly that he could smell it from behind me in traffic". After spending 20 minutes searching my car and finding nothing (because there was nothing to find) he let me drive away without even giving me a ticket (to ensure that I had no legal avenue to challenge the legitimacy of the stop, other than an expensive & time-consuming lawsuit).

[@elmerslick8700]

Should tell the cop, "Yeah, and I'm catching a whiff of BS..."

[@dixieinstrumental805]

I would recommend calling the state troopers and reporting this behavior. In some states but not all, such as the State of Texas police license and training is under the direct scrutiny of the state and not local municipalities. Often state troopers are the point of first contact to report this type of thing and they do NOT put up with this shit. Troopers are much more educated and held to a higher standard and their department often houses the state investigative Bueno whose job is to investigate this stuff. While you may not be able to take them in court, the people at the very top don't like their officers behaving in this conduct if for no other reason that it can escalate in more aggressive and public conflictions. They don't want to look bad so they have an incentive to investigate these matters. Sadly this is not well known by most citizens which can leave them frustrated that their is nothing they can do. I hope this helps you if not now then at least in the future.

[@evos469]

Should have told him you smell the weed on him

[@mnhorsewoman]

This is why it's getting harder and harder to back the blue. "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" should also apply to law enforcement.

[@bobdittloff5966]

I think what happens to alot of officers is big head syndrome. They put that uniform on and think they can do or say anything. Look at all of them that get upset if the window isn't rolled down or if you won't step out of your car.

[@michaelomondi-gq5yh]

It was never easy to back them - theyve been doing this your whole life

[@KriusAerion]

@@michaelomondi-gq5yh exactly, the only thing that’s changed is the accessibility of cameras.

[@alexfrederick9019]

Yes, not to mention the thousands of people they've murdered over the last 150 years.

[@alexfrederick9019]

​@@bobdittloff5966100% agree, their egos are fragile and they have the authority to ruin your life in one fell swoop. Especially if you aren't financially successful. I'm right on the edge of having enough money to fuck them up and losing in civil court, but in going for it since the last time I interacted with a cop it cost me my job due to an unlawful arrest with no actual crime having been committed. They charged me with child endangerment because I own guns, I have custody of my kids, and I got drunk after my kids went to bed. I had my guns locked in my bedroom, but the cop went and grabbed one after asking me where they were, and he entered it into evidence as a "prohibited weapon" which it isn't. I beat the criminal charges on day one in court, and now have to decide if I want to drop $16k on a civil suit or not.

[@Myxril]

"Ignorance of the law is no excuse for breaking it." "But I was arrested by someone who doesn't know the law." "LISTEN HERE YOU LITTLE SHIT"

[@Orelswut-nd3gp]

❤

[@muskiet8687]

I understand how they can ask the driver for identification, but how the heck can they require identification from the occupants?

[@annelarrybrunelle3570]

Need more judges like this. Not only good opinion, but teaches readers thereof. Dunno why people enforcing law don't trouble to learn it.

[@stephengreen3566]

They don't learn it because they have qualified immunity and are rarely punished for their evil ways and they know it.

[@delresearch5416]

6 months to become a cop, 2 years for a barber¿??????????¿

[@B_Bodziak]

I don't understand why the DA thought he could show the search was valid.

[@Bronte866]

People who drive should learn it as well. There’s a reason they’re cops and decided against law school.

[@MyHighHorse]

A “field training officer” losing a case in court due to constitutionality says a lot about the officers that work there. Next we will see someone being choked out or jumped by the police in that town.

[@davemi00]

Lol, IKR Seems that throws Suspicion onto the Officers.

[@scottrmc59]

Lack of training

[@98f5]

only if they manage not to sweep it under the rug first! i'm sure it's already happened plenty of times.

[@mf--]

Lawsuit against city for lack of training of officers seems possible.

[@rhinoreselling414]

This

[@patrickurquidez4693]

I was stopped by a cop and I didn't have my license on me. The two cops used that excuse to search my vehicle. Then they found the paper bags my pain medication came in from the pharmacy. So they tried to use that as the reason to claim that I had trafficked/sold my meds since the empty bags are there, but not the meds. They eventually wrote me a few tickets,and me go. When I disputed the tickets, all were dismissed with prejudice, along with reprimanded for an illegal search and detention. Then the sheriff's department contacted my attorney with a settlement offer even though I had not filed a harassment lawsuit. I just wanted the tickets dismissed and they were. Still, I accepted their offer with the stipulation that the officers be retrained. What happened was that one resigned, and the other was fired for numerous offenses for violating peoples constitutional rights.

[@Broken_Yugo]

@@Gnomezonbacon probably a bot.

[@robertsteinbach7325]

Believe it or not it can happen. Just don't expect it to happen in your town.

[@bobdittloff5966]

Are the police departments private businesses? They are paid by tax dollars but so are bridge builders. They can have laws that differ from state to state so that makes me think they are state run or are they city run?? If they are city run they must be private businesses hired by the city. How does a private business have any authority to control sovereign citizens?

[@robertsteinbach7325]

@@bobdittloff5966 All are publicly funded, but each department is different. There are state troopers, county sheriff departments, county police departments, and city police departments. There are few federal standards and some state standards for these departments to follow leading up to high variability in police departments as far as enforcement and accountability

[@PyleZAP97]

Please cite the case(name and date,) so we can look it up. (ie. Ohio vs. John Doe)

[@sheepdog1102]

The worst part is that there was a training officer involved, so neither one of them knew the laws that they were trying to enforce!

[@lloydtroyer2102]

That's what I'm talking about A judge who goes by the Constitution. Happy days

[@DrFunkman]

Driver: “I don’t think that was a legal stop” Cop: “My god… what kind of criminal enterprise is this man running?”

[@bootmii98]

Driver: "None, and it's never RICO anyway"

[@joshuarasmussen5679]

Hes a maryjewana king pin... my god... he has two glass pipes... TWO OF THEM... the sick bastard...

[@simonmultiverse6349]

This happens because each police officer has a *QUOTA* for tickets, citations, arrests, etc. Pay, benefits and promotion depend on making their quota. Therefore, the cops try desperately to find ANY EXCUSE WHATSOEVER to find a reason to arrest, fine, ticket, etc. This quota system is burdensome and oppressive.

[@lannyseals2084]

It's not funny what some have to go through with law enforcement but this comment had me laughing lol great comment and sounds like what goes on all over the place

[@bluephreakr]

Knowledge of the law is more fearful to a police officer than a firearm. At least with a gun, officers have an excuse to engage, But valid and provable knowledge? It might be best to feign ignorance of that around certain people until your day in court.

[@opuscat999]

Suspicion is not a crime.

[@loginregional]

Doesn't stop a control freak with a gun.

[@Name-zo3fm]

Every cop in the country is taught that it is. Infact, suspicion is grounds for assassination if the cop thinks for a second thier life is in danger. And since they are taught their lives are always in danger at the academy, they have a license to kill in the name of their saftey.

[@pmpkmc]

you seem suspicious...

[@atticstattic]

_being suspicious_ is not a crime

[@ceesno9955]

Yes it is! It's a hidden law. Which is why, it's always used to catch all and find a reason. Which I think, is what it means. Suspicious means to find a reason.

[@jukeboxfandango]

I've been told that something like 90% of the cases that get thrown out is because the officer failed to follow procedure. I've had officers attempt to search my car 4 times, pot head that I was in my 20's, and I managed to avoid the search every time be remaining calm and polite and simply saying "No, I have somewhere I have to be". Most of they time they just move on, but in Round Lake,IL they really wanted to search my car. Clocked me for speeding, almost immediately attempted to initiate a search, pulled me out of the car when I refused, held me there for nearly 2 hours threatening to bring a third car with a dog out to seek justification for a search. I wasn't about to relent, but at that point I figured 'this is round lake, they have 2 cars on me already, and it's Thanksgiving. what are the chances they have people to send here with a dog over a dime bag?'. They were pissed when they drove away.

[@JerryEricsson]

You know I worked as a street cop for 24 years, 12 of them as a working Chief of Police. I always studied the City Ordinances and kept up with State laws by attending yearly updates of changes made by state congress. I also studied the State laws pertaining to traffic (most of my work) and criminal laws as needed. After an accident put me out of the business, Workers Comp sent me to college to be a Legal Assistant, I did well in college, maintained a 4.0 GPA and graduated in 1996. Thinking back, I wish I had known the law that I learned in college when I was a street cop, it would have helped my decisions tremendously. I guess there is some reason for the new requirements of a degree to pin on the badge now days. When I began a GED worked (Which is what I had - needed it in the Army to make Sergeant!)

[@Trish.Norman]

❤ Thank you for your service!

[@SwampOperator]

Just another tyrant.

[@glintinggold]

You guess. I guess. Gee whiz.

[@thedirtprincess3293]

It sounds like you did a good job. Thank you for your military service, and for serving your community when you got back home. Most of us know that even if half the bushell is rotten, you can still find some good apples if you look a little. 😊 ETA: dont mind the haters. It goes with youtube.

[@farmer8102]

You know how to prove that no cops are good cops? Because when they show up as backup to a scene, and the initial cop is violating the "suspects" rights, that backup officer doesn't say, hey, we don't violate anyone, or hey, we don't operate this way, or , we need to do "this" and "that". Every single cop has been back-up on an incident where someone is being violated or mistreated and they do absolutely nothing to help... So this is proof, no cops are good.

[@Sight-Beyond-Sight]

I was arrested on a Friday and no one would tell me what it was for. I was stuck in jail through the weekend until Monday where it was revealed that I had a warrant for a probation violation from back when I was a kid (it was due to us moving and my mother forgetting to inform the PO). Judge tossed it and everyone could tell he was upset about it. So when he says that they can arrest you and not tell you why; Yeah, I have seen this firsthand.

[@llibressal]

Yep, I've been arrested in St. Louis without being told why. All the cop said was "I don't know, the computer says you have a warrant". I just rolled with it and after spending the weekend in jail I went before a judge who laughed when I told him I had no idea why I was there. (It was just unpaid parking tickets). (Result= Time Served and just pay court costs).

[@PaulArtman]

This is because they wish to make the process the punishment. Cause the public to fear them enough to do surrender their rights!

[@jasonwilliams3967]

​@@llibressal, they should pay you for your time in jail...

[@toowiseforyou]

Many times!

[@Bronte866]

Just plain scary.

[@elysamoulding7690]

Question: When we first moved to a different State and did not have new plates, we kept getting pulled over (always stupid reasons like driving too close to the roadside). Then when they saw a couple of old people in the car with everything in order, they tried to act all friendly and chitchat. My feeling is they target out-of-state license plates.

[@pault151]

Yup. I've lived in this town for longer than the officer who pulled over my rental truck has been alive. He had some bogus number he claimed I had been speeding. The rental of course had out of State license. But when he saw I was a local he decided to let me go with a warning.

[@thomasschulz2167]

Of course they do there's no consequences for doing so. They write a BS ticket for an out of state vehicle, the driver has to either pay the fine or take his day in court and incur court fees (which are probably more expensive than just paying the fine) regardless of whether the ticket gets tossed or upheld. And that's not even accounting for the travel back to what ever podunk court the ticket was given to. Given the cost of gas here recently a $50 dollar BS speeding ticket (now $200 after court fees are tacked on) a state or 2 over is gonna be upwards of 200-300 in gas just to get there. And that's assuming you're case gets called that day. If it doesn't congratulations you've got additional gas and mileage or a hotel room to be paying for. Now your out a pay check or two. Potentially lost your job and or your apartment since fighting the ticket drained the little you had to spare. The Officer doesn't face consequences, the Court doesn't give a damn, and your stuck holding the bill any way you turn it. Isn't our justice system just GRAND! Personal opinion, out of state vehicles should be exempt from law enforcement action unless they're doing something egregious enough to warrant criminal charges. For example 10 or 20 over the speed limit on the interstate meh. But doing 100 in a 55 that's an issue. Or, if a ticket gets issued to an out of state vehicle, then the ticket must be given to the local court in the county the vehicle is registered in. And it must be done so free of charge!! The court system should not place the financial burden of fighting a government issued fine on the person who is being fined until they are found guilty by the local court. That would also go a long way towards getting rid of these BS tickets where window tint that is perfectly legal where the vehicle is registered gets a ticket for illegal tint the next state over.

[@chrisflach5911]

They do.

[@mro2352]

My sister is a sheriffs deputy. She pulled over someone who had an unmarked case and they admitted that it had hypodermic needles. This person was a frequent flyer and had been charged for drugs. She realized that as there are legal reasons for the needles such as diabetes she had no probable cause even though everyone knew what it was used for. As such she let them go.

[@raylinden3622]

It refreshing to see there's atleast 1 judge out there who honors the oath they have taken to defend our constitution and our rights it guarantees.

[@SayAhh]

Police didn't even know (nor bothered to look up) whether a vape pen was illegal or, if it was, whether it's a infraction, misdemeanor or a felony.

[@glennbeadshaw727]

Absolutely Ray I was quite surprised to see this because most of them are quite happy to watch the defendant go to prison

[@fs127]

@@SayAhh Because SCOTUS wrote police a blank check to be ignorant of the laws as long as they believe they're following them correctly. Heien v. North Carolina

[@ctom4932]

I said something similar. Wouldn't be so many bad cops if there were more good judges.

[@glennbeadshaw727]

Police fishing expeditions rarely get questioned by the judge I'm surprised to see this outcome

[@119Agent]

I love that you have address the misconception of "reasonable articulable suspicion" and how law enforcement is required to tell you at the time of the investigation. The "articulable" part means that the facts used to create the suspicion are able to be articulated, not a specific crime they are suspected of. Many defendants get a rude awakening when their attorney tells them their arrest was valid despite not them being told of a specific crime by law enforcement when asked.

[@armannstraughter3296]

Hm.

[@oviedoc5454]

Wow, I am an attorney (retired; former Special Assistant United States Attorney, Assistant Attorney General (Texas), United States Treasury General Litigation Counsel (Collection of Ovedue and Owing Tax)); and, this guy is DAMNED GOOD. Must be an experienced criminal lawyer. Excellent video. Clea, concise and to the point: NO FLUFF. I attended Law School in Michigan, Lansing, Thomas M. Cooley Law School, Lansing, MI.

[@whiskers78753]

End qualified immunity.

[@patrickdurham8393]

Maybe not end it but rather limit it.

[@TheDarkalkymist]

@@patrickdurham8393 nope end it flat out, let teh cops face the legal repercussions of their actions without being able to pass the costs to the taxpayers. Qualified Immunity did not exist prior to 1974 and with good reason

[@africacarey]

Let's face it and this has always been a fact.. when you hit people in their pockets it matters until then. they're not going to change s***. They're not going to be discipline no money is coming out of their pocket they're still going home at night to their family nothing changes in their life because you sued and a taxpayer's have to pay.. I bet the cops even laugh at it and say that's not my problem

[@tomperkins6389]

I once heard a lawyer say "If the law isn't on your side, argue the facts. If the facts aren't on your side, argue the law."

[@barrybrideaux2919]

the quote is from Carl sandberg, the rest of the quote imcludes"If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell”

[@rpc717]

Every American has the right to get away with their crimes.

[@johnkauchis8384]

@@rpc717 criminals will always commit crime you can't prevent people from doing wrong, but you can protect the innocent and serve freedom.

[@PaulArtman]

Oh, that is a great quote. I am stealing it!

[@petergaskin1811]

@@rpc717 Edit: between "right" and "to" insert the words "to try".

[@snarkback]

i dont know if i have ever seen a video of yours i did not love. Your demeanor, information, and commentary are truly top tier. Thank you for your effort and all the work of those on your team.

[@powerplantfit5220]

How are they claiming governmental misconduct when they’re not government?

[@aigtrader2984]

I love how Steve is able to explain things without coming off as condescending. It's really an art form.

[@davidh9638]

He has to talk to judges.

[@jamessimms415]

Sign of a great lawyer, doesn’t belittle people

[@ATAdude666]

@@davidh9638 and potentially juries right?

[@iecasper]

I unfortunately have a problem with this. It is really hard.

@@iecasper It's the "not suffering fools gladly" disease. I have it too.

[@Thoringer]

I am most concerned for what the police learns from this. Is it: "Man, that one got away!" or is it "We have to change our approach and stop treating everyone like a criminal suspect!"

[@grantwilcox330]

Yeah the one that got away becomes some departments public enemy number one.

[@YouveBeenMiddled]

What they will do in the future is: "Here's your ticket for failure to produce a driver's license. *You're free to go.* _Just got a quick question for you..._ "

[@boldCactuslad]

They likely learned that they need more narcotics sniffing dogs from this.

[@thejohnbeck]

That's outside anyone's control (except for that cop)

[@ostlandr]

As a buddy of mine put it, "Cops are trainable, but not educatable."

[@johnanderson591]

Not all lawyers are bad, thank you for your work.

[@theincredibleshrunkenbeegu7084]

Steve I really enjoy your videos, especially the goofy ones. But vids like this one are the most valuable to protect ALL of us from over reach. THANK YOU, thank you, thank you for doing this service and providing this information.

[@terrancecoard388]

LackLuster and Audit the Audit channels will send you down a very deep rabbit hole on traffic stops and citizens challenging police knowledge. Addictive as hell.

[@jaybefaulky4902]

"I haven't done anything wrong so go to hell" .. 'OK so based on your attitude I perceive you of being suspicious and are trying to hide something./.now GET out of the vehicle so I can investigate your possible hiding of criminal activity!" lol

[@katiekane5247]

Criminal Rights Lawyer too

[@darreng745]

ATA is known to bend the facts at times which is why I stopped watching after the case of the black cownboy in Chicago, when you dug deeper online you found out that the Police had very real fears over the health of the horse he rode on the highway which were later confirmed by a vetenarian.

[@terrancecoard388]

@@darreng745 That may be so but it is not what the police officer said when he pulled him over. Nothing about the health of the horse was mentioned other than the police car impeding the movement which could have caused it to injure itself. The supervising officer also said nothing about the horse other than dude had a right and went on to add you could move a herd of cows or something down the street.

[@cvr527]

@@katiekane5247 "The Civil Rights Lawyer", not Criminal. :-)

[@foxtayle683]

This is a great precedent that was set! There are countless instances of law enforcement extending stops with no evidence to continue the stop.

[@GplusGains]

It's not a precedent.

[@tybrady4598]

Right, not a precedent, just your constitutional rights.

[@B_Bodziak]

I had a stop last 85 minutes. No ticket. And I refused the search, twice. There's was nothing in my car, but it was the principle and I had a classic, antique car that I didn't want them to damage. Why did the officers, including one supervisor, want to search? I had what was deemed a "drug dealer's car". I'm a retired, 50-something mother of two daughters in their 20s and definitely don't fit the profile of someone involved with drugs. I sat there from 9pm until almost 10:30pm with 4 patrol cars with lights and 6 officers surrounding me as I was parked in front of my nest friend's house in a cul-de-sac in a suburban subdivision waiting for her to arrive home from vacation.. It was crazy.

[@danielreeve3973]

I have been a police (officer, detective sergeant, now Lieutenant) for 25 years. The judge got this right! Never would I support such a fishing expedition! and U.S. Coast Guard? Semper Paratus!

[@paullough4946]

Needs to be changed from Reasinable ARTICULABLE Suspicion to Reasonable ARTICULATED Suspicion.

[@ostlandr]

This judge is a hero. He/she better watch their tailfeathers though. Cops do NOT like being corrected, and are generally vengeful AF. And I love the finding that disagreeing with an officer is NOT sufficient to establish probable cause for a search. Great job Michigan!

[@africacarey]

Yeah because I'm fine without them more judges are corrupt than we think

[@marlock6573]

Judges are safe. It's prosecutors who get screwed over by cops because the union will tell them to stop showing up to testify if they think that a prosecutor isn't on their side.

[@Kevin-jb2pv]

In the legal pecking order, judges > cops, usually. If anything, it's the officer who should be careful not to piss off a judge too much.

[@patriotlightning4699]

Seen a video similar to this on another legal/law channel.....once the interaction for the original traffic stop is complete, LE can't make up reasons/excuses to keep you "detained" at the point of the stop. I was quoting a statement from Steve the other day in a conversation with a friend and he stated that I sounded like a lawyer; I told him, "no, but I DO watch Steve Lehto videos every day!"....lol

[@BlackJesus8463]

yup

[@jamessimms415]

I may sound like a lawyer & not be one, but I listen to Steve Lehto every day.

[@jilbertb]

Nope, not a lawyer, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night.

[@patriotlightning4699]

@@jilbertb I was going to say that, but since I'm 59 y/o I didn't think anyone under 45 would get the joke...LOL!!

[@africacarey]

We all become somewhat lawyers to ourselves watching these law channels we no more than other citizens that don't keep up on LA. My girlfriend thinks I sound like a lawyer because I know the basic laws now and I know what goes on with law-enforcement nowadays

[@user-ro3hn2xp6p]

I hope the lawyer for the defendant told him, your first problem was you couldn't keep your mouth shut.

[@jtjano1]

Due process is good for all. I had an extended stop by a county sheriff in Oklahoma. He indicated I had wandered in my lane as justification for the stop. Provided license, insurance and current registration. I would not respond to his questions and he accused me of being evasive. Got me out of the car and asked to search, I said no sir, I do not consent to a search. He cuffed me and called a K-9 . While we were waiting a Statey stopped and was questioning the stop. After 20 minutes no K-9, the Statey said turn him loose and the officer uncuffed me and said I was lucky. Got his name and information and the State Patrolman’s info and filed a complaint with the Sheriff’s office and gave kudos to the State Patrol officer.

[@livinginthepast7085]

Went to my niece's wedding in the state I had lived all my life, and recently moved out of after retirement. It was a holiday weekend. We stayed overnight and drove home the next morning. On the highway, a state trooper speeds up behind me in the middle lane. I put my blinker on, ( I knew the trick, they had tried it on me serveral times during my 50 plus years of driving), and pulled over. Of course he says I didn't use my blinker. It was obviously because of my out of state plates on a holiday weekend. I asked to see the dashcam footage, which he denied. So I said no problem, I'll get it through a FOIA, and since my license is squeaky clean, and I've been through this before, we will just go to court and show the dashcam. I wasn't being anything but matter of fact, and calm. He decided a warning was sufficient to save face. Road pirates.

[@rebeccamartin2399]

Wow, thx. 😊👍

[@ctom4932]

Good for you. But does nothing to help the next guy. Remember that saying starts with "all it takes for evil to prosper"?

[@wlonsdale1]

@C Tom what do you want him to do?

[@stephengreen3566]

I would have gotten his dash cam footage anyway and filed a complaint with internal affairs to add a black mark to his record.

[@catdaddy7582]

@@stephengreen3566 Would you really? Most people have better things to do- I know I do.

[@additudeobx]

In a general sense, this is a very common occurrence and tactic by the police. It's a practice taught in the police academy. Few people complain about extended stops by the police and the police just get away with it, time after time.

[@kurtwetzel154]

Depends on what the cops end up charging you with if anything. A serious charge like this stop is worth challenging. Another ticket or nothing people don't have time and money and challenge it.

[@ddegn]

As one cop said after a felony stop and my spending a few hours in the back of a police car. We make the mistake but you apologize.

[@claudiuspulcher2440]

" It's a practice taught in the police academy." I'm sure you can provide a citation for this.

[@joelspaulding5964]

@@claudiuspulcher2440 It is incredibly common and would suspect this to be true on general observation.

[@johnpublic6582]

@@claudiuspulcher2440 Not really a citation, but literally every cop I've ever talked to about how to do the job. They are proud of it and love to brag about getting people "off the street".

[@andrewforte]

Question: Why did the officers ask for ID of all the car's occupants? Is that even allowed? I can understand the driver, but not the passengers.

[@Cody_Handsome]

They have no legal right to the identity of the passengers

[@jabba0975]

They can ask. They can ask you to stand on your head. Just say 'no'.

[@finris1]

If you are a passenger in a car, and the car is stopped for a traffic violation, you are not obligated to hand over ID based on that stop alone. An officer would require additional observations to suspect you of a crime or that you are carrying a firearm.

[@agord7591]

@Cody Hansen No. They think they can, but only the driver legally need to identify themselves by giving ID. Passengers could give there name but that's it, no id nor date of birth needed.

[@Chris-ug7qq]

The main reason is to check for warrants and to harrass you. My old coworker was in training to be a cop in NJ, his excuse was so Incase anything happens they know who was involved. I think that's bullshit

[@JosePerez1973]

It's a lack of Accountability. If we start holding police financially and legally accountable this nonsense would stop.

[@westmassdave7354]

Stop paying taxes.

[@wjf0ne]

What surprises and dismays me is that the prosecutor, either didn't know that the case was on very shaky ground, or that they presumed the Judge wasn't smart enough to catch the problem, or perhaps they thought the Judge would be so pro police and prosecution that they would just drop the gavel and say guilty anyway. I wouldn't want to be that prosecutor or even those cops in front of that judge again.

[@dragons_red]

Most judges wouldn't do this, that is, the right thing.

[@lamwen03]

It's actually better this way. A court has ruled on this, now, and the police department is aware. Some cases really should go to trial to make the point.

[@davidjones8942]

I've actually had a prosecutor tell me, "Well, if you were not guilty the officer wouldn't have issued you the ticket!" AND SHE WAS SERIOUS!!! Incompetence is the new normal!

[@justyntyme114]

When 99% of DA's and judges go along with the police regardless of the evidence, Why wouldn't all DA's and cops think a judge would just go along with the game they play.

[@ctom4932]

That prosecutor and those cops should instead face a different judge, one who lets them get away with this shit?

[@katiekane5247]

I'm glad Frost prevailed, it was an unlawful delay. That said, get meth out of your life, you've been given a pass, this time. Great lawyering Todd!

[@elizabethquinn1156]

ROGUES DO HAVE SUCH NASTY HABITS OF OVERREACHING !!!

[@Mewse1203]

I just got to the part where the officer is saying why he pulled everyone out. I'm gonna make a prediction that the court says something to the effect of, "those things do not meet the standards for reasonable articuable suspicion that a crime was or is about about to be committed."

[@thegenxgamerr]

Always record the police. If you can live stream it so if they take your phone away, it’s still out there.

[@jboz1435]

This happens all the time, cops say they had some extra suspicion, smell pot, how do you pin them down to say they are making up the extra suspicion?

[@darreng745]

Ask them what pot smells like and whether they have had any training to distinguish the smell because you can bet that when pushed most LEO's wouldn't be able to tell Shit from Shinola which is why you have forensic labs to do drug tests. And those crappy bags they use to do crush tests with drugs where they turn a certain color to say what the drug is are worthless as evidental court submissions, there are over 80 substances that affect them including some household cleaning agents.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

cop: "I smell pot" - "Maybe you shouldn't use pot at work, officer."

[@garygemmell3488]

Why is why some states are now disallowing the "smell test" as evidence that a crime is afoot.

[@wlonsdale1]

Don't roll down your window. You don't have to.

[@geefhotmail6311]

I heard on another lawyer video if they start talking about bringing dogs you say "I do not agree to be detained longer than is reasonably necessary for the issuance of the traffic ticket."

[@hateca1]

I always told my trainees there are two things to always remember, officer safety and don’t violate someone’s constitutional rights. This was a classic case of trying to manufacture a crime after finding nothing. Sometimes you just got to let them go and catch them another day.

[@nojuanatall3281]

Or they could not target those people because they didn't get them last time. That behavior of trying to make someone a criminal next time because you couldn't this time is disgusting.

[@robertsaget67]

"officer safety" gets innocent people killed

[@YouveBeenMiddled]

"I mean that I have general suspicion of general criminal activity. This suspect exercised his rights so my suspicion was confirmed and gave me probable cause to search the vehicle. That was why I extended the traffic stop that I did not write a ticket for. This is the manner in which I have been trained, and the manner in which I train others."

[@timkaldahl]

Ignorance of the law is no excuse. I wish that applied to police too.

[@jennifer9528]

We wouldn't need cops if everyone obeyed the law. Cops are little more than a reflection of the society from where they came. If you think you can do better, step up.

[@timkaldahl]

@@jennifer9528 Or we could have high enough expectations of the police that they have to pass the decent human being test. And since traffic stops are one of the more common interactions I would expect the police to be well versed in such policies.

[@davidwillis5016]

That's a bunch of good information, thank you very much

[@longbeachrick4680]

You have taught me a lot about the law. Thanks

[@HILLBILLY_HARD]

I’m currently attending police academy on week 4 and this is exactly what we are learning about currently, I’m going to try to get the instructor to show this to the class tomorrow!

[@snidelywhiplash1888]

FORCE them to teach you the amendments to the Constitution. All departments seems to either forget or don’t care.

[@MalikEmmanuel]

Can you tell us any more about your training on the rights of people and the limits of your authority?

[@HILLBILLY_HARD]

@@MalikEmmanuel I can tell you that as law enforcement the power we have is limited to arrest. We are not the judge, jury, or executioner… sometimes police have to make split second decisions that are critiqued by a panel of jurers that have months or even years to decide if police did what’s right but we only have split seconds to make the decisions..

[@RickyLafleur10]

Quit now

[@HILLBILLY_HARD]

@@RickyLafleur10 quitters never win

[@hi-if7lj]

Cameras really changed everything

[@Wall2000x]

Thank you...

[@sirxanthor]

Years ago, when I was in my late teens, I was pulled over after leaving the laundry mat, because other people in that laundrymat, had past criminal history, so they some how assumed I did as well, just because I dried my laundry there? My home dryer was broken, and landlord took his time repairing it. Anyways, I was told to exit my vehicle, and made to sit in the back of the police cruiser, while they ran my ID and kept asking me questions I had no clue about in regards to other people there doing their laundry. When they made me get in back, they had a younger teenager that they let exit their cruiser. While the cops were questioning me, neither they or myself notice that the kid they let out, enter my car and drive off. They let an actual suspect out of their cruiser, to question me, and in the process, they let the kid drive off with my car, which he crashed into someone's car, not even a full block away!!

[@Thumper255]

This is why you film police and never consent to searches

[@brucek.hoffman5868]

i hav a nu fone, i need 2 learn how 2 use vidio...

[@mikejones-ss7rt]

Luckily they had the ability to get a lawyer who was willing to stand up to local L.E.Os.

[@ajcongdon1772]

Thanks for catching up with the case.

[@williamwallace9826]

YES!!! A judge who knows and who applies the law.

[@STI2000]

This judge is like Big Foot or The Loch Ness Monster, rarely encountered!

[@domfer2540]

What gives them the right to ask for id’s of the passengers. They committed no crime. These officers need more training or fired.

[@listenhere1623]

I've only ever heard criminals complain

[@katiekane5247]

@@listenhere1623 not so. If only a passenger, one need not ID. Guess you missed the old "right to be secure shall not be infringed" part?

[@listenhere1623]

@@katiekane5247 yes I know that I DONT CARE only criminals complain about it. Law abiding citizens know this isn't nazi Germany so it's ok to show a little ID nothing bad will happen for showing it unless you have a warrant. Quit protecting meth heads

[@UpnorthHere]

No law says the police cannot ASK for ID or anything else.

[@RationalGaze216]

You generally have the right to resist an unlawful arrest, but if the police don't have to tell you why you're being arrested, how can you possibly know whether the arrest is lawful?

[@BD-cu4cq]

Thank you judje!!!

[@JohnDoe-qz1ql]

It's amazing the information police try to use against you

[@grantwilcox330]

Yep and they are allowed to lie to you as well.

[@BlackJesus8463]

Anybody really.

[@unbreakable7633]

Read James Duane's THE RIGHT TO REMAIN INNOCENT. Don't talk to cops, period.

[@grantwilcox330]

@@unbreakable7633 100%

[@gabagool2064]

More like astounding, but yeah.

[@JoeHTX]

They should have thrown it out.

[@garrettyankton5411]

I love this channel and listen to it almost every day, keep it real!

[@THECompressorGuru]

Thank you .this is the more in depth stuff that interest me.

[@deez128]

I've watched on other channels where they also explain that the police don't have to tell you why you were stopped but it doesn't hurt to ask. Sometimes they give you pure gold on the body cam you can use in court.

[@ralfie8801]

@@Bone89 Once you’re arrested, your vehicle is getting tossed. Maybe you don’t know, but they can arrest you and hold you for up to 48 hours without ever telling you why or reading you your rights. They are only required to do that before doing any questioning.

[@tomnisen3358]

Audit the Audit is excellent.

[@Omniseed]

Has a nasty habit of rating officers well even when they're flagrantly in the wrong, and another habit of criticizing the people who had to deal with said cops to the point of nagging them about their phrasing.

[@jeremyduke2396]

This was most helpful. Thank you. I was recently pulled over . The officer ended up saying I made a wide turn but at any rate. As they pulled me over. The lazy officers screamed at me to get out of my vehicle and bring my paper work to him. He didn't even approach my car. As. Soon as I said that's not true he spun me around and put cuffs on me and then called a k-9. When I asked him what he was doing. He said, u wanna argue we'll play hard ball. At this point he hadn't even ran any of my information. Once the dog arrived. They pulled my daughter out of the car and put her in handcuffs. All this over me simply saying that's not true to his supposed reason for pulling me over

[@gwalker1652]

Very educational. Thank you.

[@davemi00]

Acting Suspicious is not a crime. : )

[@patrickdurham8393]

If it was I'd be under the jail!

[@davemi00]

@@patrickdurham8393 My anger at traffic cops would put me there. I got my driver’s lic during the hippie movement and they pulled us over 2,3 or 4x a day.

[@jilbertb]

@@davemi00 I was a "rich kid" in the 70's (grew up one town west of Steve actually). Cops knew better than to mess with us. They hung out on the Northside of town, pulling over "suspicious" ppl coming out of Pontiac, our cops were...racists.

[@davemi00]

@@jilbertb We were middle class and knew to stay out of Huntington Wds, Birm’ham and B’Fld Hills. They were voracious ticketers. Cheers.

[@africacarey]

To them acting suspicious is a crime

[@hearmeout9138]

In the weirdness of my life, I recall being pulled over by a state trooper back in the 80’s for speeding and it was just beginning to rain. He didn’t get out of his patrol car but told me over his PA to come back to his car and get in the passenger seat. I did, with my license. I don’t recall having to show proof of insurance or registration or anything else. As I sat in his car, it started raining heavily so he wrote the ticket and said I could just sit there until the rain slacked up. We talked about hunting, fishing, sports cars (I drove a 1969 Chevelle SS 396 back then), and football. After about 10 to 15 minutes, the rain let up and I went back to my car. I drove away being careful to not spin my tires too much (very hard to do with a big-block engine on a wet road) and he gave me a quick wave before he returned to the road. It was such a better world back then. 🙂

[@desotosky1372]

Yes it was a better world. I was attending school out of state and truly did forget about a ticket I received while home on recess (small town where the resume speed limit is past edge of town) When I remembered after returning to school I immediately mailed it but it was overdue. The JP had contacted my mom about why I had not paid the ticket and she paid it. My payment was returned with a note saying I owed my mom. I think it was $15 and the year 1975.

[@wlonsdale1]

What a lazy cop. It's HIS job to approach you. Hiw dis he know you didn't have a firearm?

[@hearmeout9138]

@@wlonsdale1 Because this was in the 80s in a rural area where people respected law enforcement and law enforcement respected the people. Even today in that area, he probably wouldn’t actually be in any danger if he was pulling over a local. However, he has to deal with the dregs of society from less civilized areas too so we lose. People in that area often had shotguns or rifles in their vehicles. Cops had nothing to fear from them and they knew it. My cousin was a deputy there for 25+ years and he only pulled his pistol on another person 3 or 4 times during that entire time. He used it far more often putting an animal that had been injured out of its misery.

[@xenawolf]

You friend is one great lawyer and the judges made a brilliant ruling.

[@smyers820gm]

Why did the occupants give up information? No obligation to do that 🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️

[@daqq]

This kid knows his rights... and he almost aced that stop. But lawyer hit a homerun in court! And officers violating rights is nothing new 🙃

[@claudiuspulcher2440]

Smart to refuse the search, not smart to argue the stop and pull out a vape pen. Could have probably saved himself a lot of aggravation...

[@TheDarkalkymist]

@@claudiuspulcher2440 he can argue the stop all he wanted, arguing with the cop does not establish reasonable articulable suspicion, the cop got caught on a bullshit fishing expedition and he knew it, this is why dash cams are the best weapons against cops in the sad state of world affairs, the cop can't argue against an impartial witness

[@jennifer9528]

@TheDarkalkymist: you missed the point there, grasshopper.

[@johnericksoniii7806]

I love your videos they are really educational and you explain everything thank you Steve

[@jocktulloch3499]

Good post. After seeing so many 'sov cit' stops for no plate, registration, driver's license or insurance, it's nice to see this one.

[@mjmeans7983]

The frequent use of the statement "a juvenile" without any other details.... To that cop, it's apparently very suspicious and not normal at all for a 19 Y.O. to have 17 Y.O. friends.

[@BlackJesus8463]

imagine

[@denisenilsson1366]

The horror!

[@claudiuspulcher2440]

The use of "a juvenile" is a reporting contrivance because they cannot be named and are not defendants. Based on this video, at least, we don't know how old the person was or what was their relation (or lack thereof)

[@arinerm1331]

As the officer approaches the car, read his nametag and exclaim, "Officer Smith! We've been trying to contact you about your vehicle warranty." If he doesn't just turn around and leave, you deserved the ticket.

[@pootthatbak2578]

The phrase " criminal activity" would require the officer be able to throw all 150 volumes of the law books at the suspect..lol😅

[@DKBlair]

Steve, you bring up a good point at the end of this. In order to detain someone the police should have reasonable articulable suspicion of a crime, but as you said they don’t necessarily have to articulate it at the time. If a cop was to ask me for ID, I’d like to know if they have RAS before responding to their request. If they don’t have RAS & Im not required to ID, I’d rather remain anonymous. If we get to a stalemate where the cop refuses to articulate their RAS but continues to request/demand ID, how would you respond?

[@FaultyWirestv]

This happened in a college town. I was pulled over and not ticketed several times when I attended in the mid 2000s for reasons like "rolling stop at a blinking red with no traffic at 2 am". Because it's a college town, they look for minor infractions to check for drunk/impaired drivers in this town far too often.

[@jennifer9528]

I don't have a problem with that.

[@cashstore1]

A 19 year old can possess a gun, but not a vape pipe. They can join the military and get killed, but can't vape. Something is wrong here. I thought pot was legal in Michigan. Is it for people over 21? How is a 19 year old adult a Juvenile?

[@TurdJesus]

Bill passed in 2019. You can thank trump for that one, because freedom or some crap

[@BlackJesus8463]

And what about 16 year old girls?

[@SayAhh]

Pot was made illegal since the 1930 thanks to millionaires and lobbyists. Yet ppl keep voting for candidates who promise to give the top 1% of earners more tax cuts and refuse to close loopholes.

[@gmamagillmore4812]

In Tennessee you are a juvenile un till age twenty two. When I was living with my adoptive parents I told my mother I was going to move out. She told me " I checked with my attorney, he told me I can make you live here and do what I tell you until you are twenty one, then I can throw you out." One of the reasons I hate the law.

[@patrickdurham8393]

@@gmamagillmore4812 pretty sure Mama lied to you. Unless you've been declared mentally unfit you can leave at 18.

[@jeffveldhuizen9952]

An honest judge with common sense. Your a rare gem sir, We appreciate you.

[@johnallen6945]

Great ruling! I started volunteering with NORML in the 70s to legalize cannabis. 50+ years later people are still being arrested and imprisoned for cannabis possession.

[@IntelestateNetwork]

Hi Steve, Former Cop and Deputy US Marshal here. Please tell Todd, Good Job>

[@chrisbudesa9355]

IDs of passengers is B.S.

[@RbgBennett]

I probably saw you as Island Lake. Used to run there for years. Thanks for the great content.

[@fred6308]

How many times has that officer told a Karen that the side of the road is not the place to argue about a traffic stop. That is what Court is for.

[@jimjackson5544]

You have to love a Lawyer who goes to bat for his client!!!

[@greenrangerx]

That's what they lawyer is supposed to do.

[@tomnisen3358]

Police need to be educated on the Constitution. And REASONABLE ARTICULATE SUSPICION!

[@branch7628]

We need a constitutional court where oath breakers are tried. Anyone found guilty is sentenced to death. Tree of liberty is mighty thirsty

[@Omniseed]

They need to suffer appropriately serious punishment, including criminal prosecution, every single time that they choose to engage in an unlawful exercise of their authority. Every single time. If they aren't smart enough to learn what the limits on their authority is, they should not be empowered to act as law enforcement officials under any circumstances. Armed security with no arrest powers and specialized professionals that actually have training and expertise relevant to ALL of the duties their office is empowered to execute would be a much better situation. We have way too many stuffed shirts with guns on the dole, most of them need to get real jobs and the remainder need to unfvvk themselves