EXPERIMENTING WITH TWISTED DAMASCUS PATTERNS!!!

[@TristanDare]

You have to grind about halfway into the pattern in order to reveal the Ws.... It'll be plain on the outside, but when you get into the inside it's almost like an explosion.... I hope you see this, it'll definitely help you out!

[@palustris6800]

He could try and cut the pieces lengthwise that will save a lot of material

[@byronstudley5091]

He could cut his pieces down the centre but then he would be loosing the most intricate patterns by the time he has finish ground whatever he makes. He would also have twist pattern one side and star/explosion like pattern the other. To get even pattern both sides he just needs to grind his way through and accept the loss of material

[@piraterubberduck6056]

Would cutting it in half, forge welding it back to back and then forging the bevels, instead of grinding, work?

[@benjolyoon]

Would twisting less also help? I may be completely off track but I feel like the more twists he does the less defined the pattern would become.

[@piraterubberduck6056]

On the edges the material moves more than at the centre so the pattern in the centre should be different. I think he needs to get deeper into the material and see what is in there.

[@Biohazarus]

Could you be over twisting it? twisting so much that all "w" are stretch in lines?

[@Krommandant]

That's exactly what I tought. 4-5 twists per bar would be better.

[@Dunbras]

yep 5 would of been plenty

[@JJJ-do6sw]

I thought so too.

[@chrisosh9574]

Yep! Rewatching the video, I would say six twists max but I think less would be better.

[@Johndouglasphillips]

Biohazarus my thoughts exactly. Would like to see bolder patterns. Needs less turns

[@mrastleysghost]

reiterating for visibility: twist the bars like 5 times, not 10. I think you are making the explosions too fine to see easily. Also grind further into the billet.

[@markourosevic1987]

just wanted to say the same thing

[@EPgeek]

I'd say only two or three times

[@ironlungthe3rd]

Exactly, way too many turns.. the whole point of Damascus is to layer the steel, if you twist it too many times the pattern will just become indistinguishable.

[@matthewanderson9461]

Agree like 3-5 times would probably be good

[@jessetheunending9357]

Also, what do the ENDS look like? You know, where you could see the c/w pattern.

[@swimseven77]

Something I find consistently impressive about your videos is the music-montage integration. I'm sure it takes a lot of work, but it makes the quality of the videos absolutely next-level. I've never seen anyone that does this as well as you, Alec! Keep it up, and your editors too!

[@notahotshot]

Joe Nicholls He hammers to the rhythm of the music. It makes the editing easier.

[@AGlimpseInside]

Thumbs up to see Alec Steele smash fruit with all his creations while the slow Mo guys film it!!!

[@levidaniels585]

A Glimpse Inside that would be intense

[@ClimptonDiddlehopper]

Builds a grinding room to keep the shop clean...... asked Her fruit and sodas spraying all over equipment.

[@AGlimpseInside]

Levi Daniels totally epic

[@AGlimpseInside]

Billy Beane no fruit juice in the Grinding room. Honestly I actually wonder how much fruit does get all over his shop after one of those smash sessions

[@PDXVoiceTeacher]

Smash on the power hammer

[@HendersonDesign]

I love that I enjoy watching Alec’s upbeat enthusiasm in experiencing new learning challenges while I learn a ton of really useful information from his skilled viewers.

[@MakeBrooklyn]

Nice, I think a few others may be right .... perhaps less twisting would have left more of the pattern intact at the edges. It's still way cooler than anything I've made today!

[@bigdaddykyky5333]

Make Brooklyn EXACTLY what I was thinking

[@Macabri_2k10]

yeah i was thinking the same, the amount of twisting depends on the "mother pattern layers" if you have already a fine pattern in the blank you will just smooth it out with too many twists

[@conceptionrabe2797]

Its so ridiculously obvious that Alec is putting in too many twists. Obvious!

[@kiyoshilife9748]

My favorite parts of the series: The forging, the work, the creations, and no idea how many people notice this, but the way the music integrates with the work. They use the noise from the videos on time with the music so that it flows awesomely. In other words, the hammering is in rhythm with the songs.

[@mikkohernborg5291]

Having fewer twists probably would have helped. You had quite an intricate pattern in the bar you started with, but with so many twists, it just gets stretched and smashed out into lines and one can't make out any details. Sometimes less is more.

[@ChrisMoewesBystrom]

Only part way through but I had the same thought. Maybe too many twists starts to homogenize the steel too much??

[@bradpippolo8543]

That’s my thoughts, I’ve never forged anything in my life but if you start with a tight pattern already then twist it 10 times you are creating 10x more layers in the pattern refining the pattern down by a factor of ten

[@greywuuf]

As a guess I would imagine you would get bolder more aggressive patterns with much less twisting. You have gone way to fine with the pattern in my opinion. I would be interested in seeing what happens with 1/2 the twist or less (1 or 2 twists maybe)

[@pickelsvonbrine]

greywuuf I was thinking the same thibg

[@jeredphillips8744]

greywuuf exactly

[@jeffmorris7586]

I’ve said this about 1000 times but I think a Damascus pocket comb would be awesome.

[@masteroftheuniverse149]

Alec just wanted to say thank you for putting out the daily content. Your channel is so much fun to watch and you have gotten me to get off my ass and make something fun. Always had an interest in blacksmithing and now I can say that I have made several knives and have been learning a new craft. Thanks for the awesomeness!

[@weezerfan999]

25% OFF MERCH!! THAT’S A STEELE!!

[@neoneu5702]

Your improvement in editing, forging and everything else is just insane, i really wish you would do livestreams again, it was just so much fun watching you in realtime and being able to talk to you in chat

[@chyrt]

Grind in a slot on the 'light stripes' where the billets meet, then flatten the peace with heat. That will make the pattern very different where the billets meet.

[@ctk5044]

You know, for someone who is between 18-20, Alec Steele has the ability to describe and explain his steps in a way that many cannot. I find these videos both interesting, and a bit soothing. Thanks for the vids man!

[@Luiz_Alberto.P.K]

Forge thick and grind thin. The twisted pattern shows more details in the center of the billet

[@xaytana]

If the pattern is best in the center, why not cut it in half and weld the top to the bottom, and have what was the center be on the outside of the billet. It'd save material but it involves a lot more work.

[@Luiz_Alberto.P.K]

Xander Zoolander , That's actually a good idea. A long time ago I saw a video here on KZbin where the bladesmith forged the blade with around 10mm thick and milled it down to the right thickness. The final result was amazing. The video's tittle is "Damascus steel: Making a special twisted multibar blade"

[@burkea29]

I love watching you fail and learn through trial and error. It's incredibly refreshing to follow the journey you're on. It's also great to all the commenters here helping to identify and solve the issues. As others have said, I reckon fewer twists would show the pattern you're looking for, 6 max I'd say.

[@josephd.harris6954]

Not only is the star pattern beautiful, but from the view of physics, it can be used to make an incredibly strong blade. If your core is two twisted bars welded together, so that the spirals rise up to meet each other, one twists left and the other right, in the center, like a series of upside down "v"s, then on a thrust, forces that would cause the blade to bend, instead sheer down the length of the blade and reinforce the thrust upon reflection. I have often thought the best estocs would be made with a welded twist and a hard steel outer jacket. I really hope you try that.

[@Scorpio-ms9vk]

Joseph D Harris ok thanks i vice it a test myself any ideas on how one would do it

[@byronstudley5091]

The best Saxon and Viking blades were made with twisted cores, often iron also for added flexibility. And some spears, look up the wolf tooth spear

[@josephd.harris6954]

OK.. I'm a physicist by trade. I love smithing and swords, but I am not actually a blacksmith. Please take what I am about to say with a big grain of salt. When I've seen it done by others, they first make the two twist bars of relatively soft steels. Then they forge and grind them into a rectangular cross section before welding them together. A long thin bar of hard steel is then welded to the two sides of the blade, and a fish mouth is cut out before the blade tip is closed to a point. I've also seen the point of the core forged and the hard steel bar simply wrapped around the tip and forged into one piece. That said, the physics of it is awesome when you have that construction. From a materials and impact analysis view (and I do know something about this) you get a very good piercing point mounted on a soft cushion that deflects forces in an advantageous way.

[@jonasholtwick5542]

Joseph D Harris Well I am neither a engenier nor a blacksmith but aren't the steels today just as well as the forged damascus? Is there any reason apart from the look to still make swords and knifes from it?

[@Scorpio-ms9vk]

Joseph D Harris as a guy who has a intrest in chem it cool how it structure works chemicly

[@BernieFromTheInternet]

i like the change of pace on your channel recently, definitally the way to make sure the channel doesn't go stale

[@evalenoyer]

Yep! Got the reference! Saw you twist that thing! So beautiful... I think it looks pretty cool! Bisous de France 🇫🇷 😘

[@cosmiceclipse1240]

?

[@JackboMack]

You could different amounts of twists to test different patterns. I’m excited to see you try new patterns and techniques!

[@ChristCenteredIronworks]

Got to love experimenting :-) great work Jamie and Alec on the editing! God bless

[@badent94]

You should do a piece of Damascus where you use all/most of the strategies that you know how to do. Ex. Start by making a mosaic, then jelly roll it, then twist it, then grind out the notches like a ladder pattern and show a cross section at the end.

[@IPostSwords]

Ohhh man please do a pala. I'm terrified to test my antique but I wanna see one slice and dice some unsuspecting fruit.

[@mcdadeluke]

Herringbone damascus looks really cool as the center of a spearhead or tapered blade. Wrap the good steel around the cutting edge and leave the damascus in the center. Looks very cool.

[@kiradin5664]

hi Alec i love ur videos they are so epic. i have a cool idea for a future project: a halberd

[@bigdaddykyky5333]

dead pool that would be so fucking dope!

[@sim0ndutch42]

Hell yeah

[@thejordans6824]

Yaaaaaasssssss!!!¡!!!!!!¡!!!!!!!¡!!!!!!

[@richsmout550]

That looks so therapeutic, I know it wasn't how you wanted it but it looks awesome. I wish more and more I had followed my passion at school in metalwork. I loved grinding welding and shaping.

[@OS-bv2li]

please make armor it would be so super cool

[@bigdaddykyky5333]

OS190 190 damn that would be so fucking dope!

[@ShikamaruXT]

It is very satisfying to see you living the art of forging. I hope it will never die out, like it did here in germany(we only have very few blacksmiths, because it's difficult to live from it)

[@Xraller]

Too many twists. Stop at 5

[@maxprophet2401]

The best advice would come before the experiment, which is a bit complicated I know. It's nice to see how many are learning from you and with you. Good stuff Alex!

[@TinCanRocketMan01]

My Guy! Too Many Twists!!

[@TheForeverRanger]

When you forge weld multiple pieces together, try using a coal forge. From what I have read it helps reduce the chance of scale forming in the welds.

[@JF_Projects]

If you don't like it Alec, send it to me LOL

[@LashanR]

That twisting montage was probably the most beautiful sequence you've ever made. I have two screens and was doing some photo work on one while casually watching this video on the other, but that part was so good I completely stopped what I was doing just to be in awe.

[@youareclapped8070]

Yo Alec, ik that u probably won't see this but oh well I have time to waste, anyways, I've had a really bad day today, so much so that me and my mum had a giant argument, and i ended up tanning away with a bunch of my clothes and and my card. I'm am currently crashing at my mates house but I am verry upset about what's happened. All in all my day has just been crap. But I've just gone on my phone and seen that u have just posted a new video. Your videos fill me with joy and I mean so much from your channel. I love the vids, keep up the good work and thanks for making my day that little bit better. - Joe :)

[@NineWorldsWorkshop]

If you have a copy of Swords of the Viking Age, there's a fantastic diagram in the back that shows how twists change with depth in the bar. It's a gem of a book if you don't already have it in the library!

[@byronstudley5091]

Nine Worlds Workshop I've got that book and the Anglo Saxon book in my wishlist, just waiting until pay day to buy them!

[@jamwheeler]

too many twists

[@beergnomedc]

Seriously, the editor on your videos is top notch. Some of the best on KZbin.

[@Haze33E]

That twist pattern looks like feathers to me.

[@chucktaylorii]

Haze33E I was thinking the same thing! It really reminded me of a peacock feather! New front Alec Steele peacock demascus!

[@jdrains16]

Dare I suggest .. Fairy flip and then twist?Also, one I've thought would be amazing, would be to run a weld bead or a few down the length, make a couple of twists, forge square again, then add a couple more weld beads the full length and twist again. Repeat however many times, and you'll end up with multiple twist rates, the first weld beads being twisted many times, the last very few. Just a thought, and I hope you see this and give it some consideration. Big fan of the channel, I've even gotten my 7 year old into watching!

[@GosportGaming]

To many twist I believe if you wanted a very define eye popping pattern.

[@KrautSpaceMagic]

Make sure to clean up your band saw from all shavings and scraps, and you should do a video on you fixing/repairing/rebuilding your power hammers

[@meneermankepoot]

I like your t-shirt ;)

[@cosmiceclipse1240]

Daan Sentjens ?

[@meneermankepoot]

I won one of his giveaways and chose that shirt c:

[@metalrott324]

@12:06 the left side looks like a knot from a tree and wood grain and that is FREAKING AWESOME LOOKING! You need to figure out what happened there a re-create that thru-out the entire billet!

[@gerbil.]

Cheese 🧀 Kaas 🧀 Käse 🧀 Fromage 🧀

[@nuibit8868]

I always love seeing Damascus patterns, and even though I don't have a forge or any experience, what if you tried a canister with simply needles or "needles" of different steels in it, or a sort of hybrid canister thing with hexagonal nuts and maybe bolts screwed in (and chopped off so that there's no bits sticking out) welded together and fluxed, and canistered if need be. And I've always wondered if it was possible to forge your name into a Damascus pattern itself too!

[@Schenkel101]

I've found something more satisfying than watching scale pop off incandescent steel in the hidraulic press: watching scale pop off incandescent steel that's being twisted

[@therandomproject]

hey alec you should make a knights armor

[@grimnebuolin]

That would be straight months of work

[@therandomproject]

grimnebuolin oke maby not all at once but maby every few weeks a part. or maby only a helmet and shield

[@Mishkiniskalvis]

FUN FACT! These twist-pattern lines are often found in historical sword finds of viking age Baltic area. Even the Lithuanian name for sword "kalavijas" means "hammered lines".

[@franktellier8784]

Is there something more satisfying than the scale busting out during the twist??🤤🤤

[@balogh89]

I bet that the bar's cross section would look amazing. Restacking it with the ferry flip may give an awesome-looking result, even if not this is what Alec aims now. Anyway: great video, thanks for showing us your experimenting!

[@Murzington]

Alec has it looks like many others have said less twists. But I also think if you want more twists you need drastically less layers. The big bold patterns are usually seen when layer count is lower so there is greater contrast between layers.

[@amrepheldemente8819]

If you remember from your million layer damascus video you mention that the layers couldn't be seen very well because of how small the layers were, the twists have the same effect. The more twists the smaller the layers become. I'd recommend only doing about 3-6 twists in total for a nice pattern.

[@SamTownsBladesmith]

As far as I understand for twist damascus, the real "star" patterns are close to in a third of the depth of the billet, most multibar constructions I have seen involve removing a third of the material from each side to display the pattern. Manuel Quiroga did a series of videos on making a turkish multibar hunter, well worth a watch!

[@syrti01]

I'm interested in the pattern on the ends. Have you considered doing a ferry-flip? Twisted explosions might look pretty damn awesome!

[@erikvoigt4600]

If you check out “man at arms: reforged” they used the twist method on a pair of Ulaks. First they stacked the steel alternating types, forge welded, and drew out in to a long bar which they cut in to 6 pieces. Then they twisted those 6 bars 10 time individually, tied the twisted bars together, forge wielded, drew out to a thick bar and then twisted the whole bar one last time about 17 times. I think your patten didn’t come out as expected because you started off with a formed Damascus pattern before you twisted which actually just stretched the striations in to straight lines.

[@XainesWorld]

have you considered twisting and then squaring like you did but then grind the length corners, this could even add a dimension from the untwisted top and tails to

[@lauraweiss7875]

Experimentation always worth the time, material and effort.

[@daniel06gt]

Great camera work on this video. It was a treat watching it!

[@knarf67frank]

Hello Alec, I am an avid viewer of your videos. I'm from Germany. I hope you understand my bad English. I've heard that you like to set yourself tasks, one more difficult than the other. I had a suggestion from the section "Back to the roots." You could build yourself a small blast furnace from clay and melt yourself from ore iron. From the raw material you could then make things. For example, a riveted iron kettle for an open hearth would be a change from daggers or swords, and certainly an equally challenging one

[@SytheZN]

Try a 60° Ferry/Fellicietti flip on the test piece - you should end up with matching rotations if you cut it closer to lengthwise

[@mouija1450]

How about taking the five welded pieces, hammering them into a rod and twisting the whole thing? The lighter bits in between might look pretty interesting as a swirled pattern.

[@monster56100]

Alec you should try doing the polished aluminium ball craze that's all over Facebook but using Damascus that would look crazy!

[@whitewelder8060]

Leaving it twisted might make a really cool handle for a future project..

[@MMASulu]

He *Lunns* something new every day! Just a bunch of fantastic *Lunning* experiences

[@crowsandbones]

I would like to see a kind of double-helix / DNA looking Damascus patterned steel. Like a twisted ladder or something... Nice work as always!

[@davidwfisher]

With the billets of W's that you had pre made I suggest cutting the twist down to 5 then square it up in the forge and then mill the corners off making them into octagons revealing the explosion then forge it back to square on the explosions.

[@Mucidamascusblades]

I have done a fair share of twist both plain and Ws. It does not matter the number of twists. It matters the depth of grind. On the outside it will always look like a normal twist but the deeper you go the more activity comes out. Therefore, I suggest a deep hollow grind to make it pop out after you forge it thinner and to shape. I also do not suggest to forge bevels otherwise you lose the depth effect that the hollow grind will do on the pattern. Awesome job so far. I can't wait ro see it finished

[@krolls5805]

Hey Alex, where’d the casting experiments go? I loved that stuff. Hopefully you do more

[@Magnymbus]

God, the editing on that timelapse was SOOOOO GOOOOD

[@konnorkinser8932]

Alec when can we see you make a canister Damascus blade. It’s always such a difficult challenge on forged in fire it would be great to see how you handle the task plus it makes beautiful metal

[@mrnoz303]

Amazing doing most things in Damascus and avoiding camp knives etc. The pattern on the seax is stunning. Anyone know where you can do courses in blade making? I'd love to learn eventually how to make a Japanese Tamahagane Banboo Kyoto hammered Damascus knife set. Setting the bar pretty high I know.

[@chaz65]

Too funny! I literally just went back happened to watch the episode you made the twisting wrench (bolt rounder) lol

[@brandonhancock110]

I would love to see a demascus sword breaker in the future sometime. I think it would come out bad ass

[@rileyhill3277]

Yes Alec, if you dont already have a plan for the material, try Joseph D Harris' suggestion for an estoc!

[@Jiminycroquet]

you should release a mix tape of all the cool tracks you use in your videos

[@HankMöh]

Good evening, thank you so incredible much for your daily awesome and inspiring videos of your work, truly thrilling and motivating! Nice seeing you experimenting around with some new stuff. With some V-grove grinding where the twisted bars meet and then flattening again under heat that will probably bring up more of the wanted pattern. Maybe some ideas for future projects: - polearm (e.g. bardiche, guisarme, halbred) - a spear (e.g. boar spear, viking spear like the landbreen ice patch) - double headed axe - a falchion (there are some awesome and interesting styles, visit "shadiversity" on this he uses a well depicted classification) - a (mechanical) padlock keep on hammering! greetings out of my forge in germany

[@shadowstorm79mc]

Alec I heard somewhere that neutralizing the acid in baking soda actually makes the details of the etch more blurry and I think where you went wrong if you wanted to see more detail near the seam is because of how much you twisted it doing fewer twists would allow for larger details but that's just my thoughts on it I always greatly enjoy watching you work and learn as you go

[@byronstudley5091]

I'm sure you've worked it out by now, but when twisting Damascus you're actually twisting the outer layers around the outside of the bar. The further toward the centre you grind the more intricate the pattern becomes. I actually nearly made this pattern at an Owen bush Damascus class the other day but decided to accordion cut half the bar instead. I might twist the other half of the bar after seeing this.

[@blhfood]

Very cool makes me wonder what the pattern would look like after you twisted it like you did. Press the ends into each other square it then twist it for a second time

[@PerfectDeath4]

0:40 that's some long trouser Damascus you got there!

[@catherineasselin7986]

Amasing job like usual. I Have A Project Request. A FORGE A MUSQUET!!!! I know this sound impossible but is just a tube weld and a couple of spring.... Sound easy. If they can do this in 1800 I'm sure you can. 😆😆😆

[@praugie4530]

The musical effect at 7:47 was hella cool lol

[@Wilder941]

Alec! The proper British term for "anticlockwise" is widdershins!! Much more fun to say.

[@kevinwatson5833]

It would be cool to see a blade made from a bunch of off cuts from the different damascus projects a hodge podge of different damascus styles

[@lannperry2442]

Surely the inner explosion pattern comes from the deformed external spiral, as you make your spiral square again. Pushing the flat edge in onto itself? Maybe less twists would have left the W's more noticable and bold at these edges as well? Definately worth another go!!

[@oligoldschmidt]

Alec on all twisted patterns you have to grind down in to the material to reveal the pattern, forge a blade from that nice billet leaving some axcess material, once you hav ground the bevels you will finde what you ar loking for. It is there it is hiding from you ;)

[@Timf1964]

Have you tried experimenting with layers or coloured PlayDoh or similar to work out new Damascus patterns? might be worth a look! And a Vid.

[@Regalya]

@Alec Steele What you doing is *turkish twist* damascus check it out on google you'd be astonished to great degree.

[@Tsum1923]

I could see fewer twists achieving a greater level of activity in the edge.

[@hamidalikiani8543]

I do agree with "M Astley" is like a Million layer Damascus too many layers does not show the pattern, 10 times twist is too much, think of it this like a screw if the twist is too many you are squeezing the pattern and it becomes to compact so what you are looking for "the pocket of activity" will be gone but give it like max 5 twist and let it show the pattern. Also I believe that start pressing at the beginning instead of going power hammer, as you mentioned in this video as well you need to keep the gaps closed and pressing will give you that much better after pressing it go for power hammer. I think that you need to keep on this idea and make a second part because what you are aiming at is an amazing pattern and I love to see that in a broad blade (like a chef knife), that you can enjoy the patterns every single time that you look at it. awesome job and love what you do.

[@nturner2176]

Your camera guy/editor is quite good! Please tell him that his work is appreciated. Excellent content too!

[@BryanDBraddy]

Thumbs up for the grinding montage alone!

[@BorealCryptid]

I completely forgot I was wearing a "Where's my hammer?" shirt today, until you mentioned the shirts at the end. :D Love this shirt. Along with "Fantastic". So many complements on it.

[@Brandon-so9fp]

Cross bow build would utilize most of the equipment you have and would be a challenge for ya if you make a geared one.

[@СтепанФедотов-к9ы]

Recently i watched good russian weapon master explaining everything about twisted damascus, and he says that a point is in grinding about half of metal to get to the needed pattern

[@LordJamison]

can you please make something out of that twisted steal, even though its not what you were looking for it still looks really cool.

[@willthedingo]

Still a very nifty looking pattern! I think if you drew out a piece from the visible sides, and made those markings wider and more pronounced, there may be quite a bit of potential for beauty there. It also looks like it forged welded together very cleanly!