EXTREMELY low current draw on Adams Pulsed Electric Motor

[@craigpierce7996]

You can't really speculate on the motor's current draw until you place some kind of load across the accumulation capacitor. After all, a shaft turning and doing no work at all is really just a nice piece of art.

[@Waveguide]

You are absolutely correct. This was my very first attempt at building a motor of any kind, so I was still learning and may have drawn some incorrect conclusions.

[@chrislloyd1734]

Seems to me that you are wasting half the power from the electro magnets. North pole pushing against north pole permanent magnets. Why not have a horse shoe configuration that allows you to use the electromagnet's South pole's force to drive another layer south pole permanent magnets below the existing one. Thus doubling the power with no extra input.

[@Waveguide]

Hi Chris, you are absolutely correct! In a later version the inventor indeed used a horse shoe setup, as you can see in his patent here: patents.google.com/patent/GB2282708A/en

[@chrislloyd1734]

@@Waveguide Another point that you may be interested in, is that pulse motors like the ones that you are building, work virtually the same as brushless DC motors that can be found in many applications such as quiet PC fans. They even include a mini PCB board that controls the magnetic pulse timing. You may like to take a look at the PCB board spec and see if they can help you control the motor better. They can provide PWM (Pulse width modulation) for synchronized speed adjustments. See kzbin.info/www/bejne/mHSomoKkqrR3l8U

[@chrislloyd1734]

@@Waveguide Just one more small thing. Have you considered putting a smaller opposite pole permanent magnet just after the main pulse. This would be attracted to the electromagnetic pulse and give it an extra kick?

[@danutz0306]

speedy eris 1 second ago Thanks for the information. Can you help me with something please? I have neodymium magnets 5 x 2.5 cm. How I have to build the coils? Thanks

[@Waveguide]

Use ferrite magnets instead, else you'll need a much higher voltage to make it run.

[@John-Adams-Can]

Can this device be solid state? I am thinking the same way an electronic gyroscope works.

[@Waveguide]

Yes, the rotor turns out to be completely optional. Pulsing coils is all you need to get the effects, and it actually makes it much easier to control the pulse frequency and duty cycle.

[@GyörgynéZsíros]

What is the air gap between the coil and the rotor?

[@Waveguide]

Ultimately it was 1.2mm, but not entirely sure what it was on this earlier model

[@PerpetualMotor]

Well done! As annoying as winding a coil is, if you use multifilar winding, you could improve those performance numbers. Lower impedance with the same back EMF.

[@braaitongs]

What are you doing with the back emf?

[@Waveguide]

Not much. I experimented with using it to charge the run battery, charge a capacitor which then charged the run battery, and charging a second battery. Didn't find a winning setup yet, but I now have many things in mind to improve in my next 20x larger build, see: waveguide.blog/pulse-motor-generator-design-considerations/

[@santitapia8681]

So you have a 12.000 rpm motor with less than 10 watts input??? Wow

[@MasterIvo]

no load, no amps

[@Waveguide]

True, as with no load the motor will speed up until the counter EMF balances with input voltage. Still, my first drive coils drew 650 mA, and these just 50 mA. I need more power than that to turn on a small 12V computer fan! Of course because these windings have more resistance, but if I can extract power from the generator coils I will later add, I'd rather use as little power as possible to make the rotor spin! :-)

[@MasterIvo]

@@Waveguide thats right. each thing counts. keep in mind the generator coil will act as a load.

[@Waveguide]

​@@MasterIvo Indeed. However, I will try to create a "low drag" generator coil, in which the generator coil is disconnected from the circuit when the rotor magnet approaches. This way, no current can flow, and so no opposing magnetic field will be induced, giving the rotor magnet a free path to be attracted to the iron core of the generator coil. I'll then turn the coil "on" only for a few degrees, when magnetic field is maximum and tangential drag force minimal. When the coil is turned "off" again, the collapsing magnetic field will push the rotor along on its path, effectively circumventing most of the Lenz related drag. At least, that's the idea ;-)

[@TheJayLorenz]

@@Waveguide John Christie and Lu Brits has an improved build of this device , the lutec 1000 motor generator.

[@Waveguide]

@@TheJayLorenz I just read about the Lutec 1000, and it seems they used Robert Adams' technology, and never managed to scale up their device.

[@munishgupta4043]

10 Ohms for both drive coils ( 5 Ohms + 5Ohms) or (10 Ohms +10 Ohms)?

[@Waveguide]

10 Ohms + 10 Ohms

[@munishgupta4043]

@@Waveguide Thanks for your kind response. Appreciated.

[@superfliping]

Newman motor has 4 pickups and very heavy flywheel. Look up patient information to get guidance and more ideas. Great job on video.

[@Waveguide]

Thanks, CJ! The Adams Motor also has 4 generator coils, but I'm currently still trying to perfect the drive circuit, which is the hardest part. Then I'll add the generator coils.

[@larrycurtis2791]

Can it be tuned to 50-60 hz or is it for charging a battery bank. What’s the amperage it can put out under load? Or is it just an equilibrium device able to spin at x but charge at a times greater than x output?

[@Waveguide]

Hi Larry, at the moment it is quite a useless device, but with curious properties. My goal is to replicate the results claimed by the inventor. This motor could be configured to drive reasonable loads, but that's not the main goal. I'm still working on improving the drive circuit. Once that is done, I'll add generator coils and measure the current output.

[@tonyrebeiro]

How much torque does it have? Because a motor needs to drive a load. From the way it picked up, the available torque appears to be quite low.

[@Waveguide]

Hi Tony, the torque is currently very low indeed. I am able to spin a 20cm fan at 1200 RPM with it, but that's all the load testing I've been able to do so far. I am in the process of winding new drive coils with identical resistance, but thicker wire gauge, and so more Ampere-Turns, which should result in a bit more torque. While an Adams Motor can be designed to drive heavy loads, the design goal for this one is to have enough torque to power 4 generator coils.

[@str8up598]

But it doesn't preform any work.

[@Waveguide]

Apart from spinning the rotor around, no. But my current version is loaded with 4 generator coils, and I've also used it to power a 20 cm fan. But to power serious mechanical loads, you'd need a different setup that is more optimized for that particular task.

[@drrobotnik5376]

Use friction, instead of magnetivity and you can get rid of the magnets for the current generation.

[@Waveguide]

Hi, could you give some more details on how you I could construct something like that?

[@drrobotnik5376]

@@Waveguide en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triboelectric_effect you need two plates sliding together of two different materials. (carpet works good.) and everytime it passes over the other surface, it gains charge, and you collect from either side of the sliding surface, and you store it in a high voltage capacitor, but u have to watch out for overloads cause its not constant voltage.

[@Waveguide]

@@drrobotnik5376 thanks for your explanation. However, the magnets being attracted to the iron coil cores play a crucial role in this motor's efficiency, so I won't be able to get rid of them.

[@drrobotnik5376]

@@Waveguide i see, so the coil actually causes it spin more, interesting.

[@pt6478]

Hi - nice work - I was wondering how you're switching the drive coils on and off?

[@Waveguide]

Hi Pete, I currently use a MJL21194 NPN low-side switch setup, triggered by a Hall sensor connected to an Arduino. Am not too happy with the accuracy of the Arduino and the Hall sensor, so I'm about to start experimenting with an optical switch instead.

[@pt6478]

@@Waveguide Hi Nick - I saw the arduino/hall sensor setup in another of your vids and was wondering where you placed the hall sensor. In this setup above though are you using the back emf from the drive coils to flick a transistor off? Don't suppose you have a copy of the above circuit I can replicate do you?

[@Waveguide]

@@pt6478 you can find a schematic here if you scroll down: github.com/nickkraakman/arduino-pulsed-motor-driver

[@jvon3885]

Anyone here in a good forum or discord? I've got a few questions I'd like to ask on a broader scale and I'm looking for a few ppl who want to do some testing on a system to get a broader respect for what's going on. Not wanting to go open source just yet, not until the data is in. I've given myself 6 months from the date of this post, to complete at least three different tests but it's more than I can accomplish alone.....so if this is interesting to you.......

[@Waveguide]

Hi Jason, a popular forum for these kinds of subjects is energeticforum.com/renewable-energy

[@chrislloyd1734]

Seems to me that this configuration is wasting half the power from the electro magnets. North pole pushing against north pole permanent magnets. Why not have a horse shoe configuration that allows you to also use the electromagnet's south pole's force to drive another layer south pole permanent magnets below the existing one. Thus doubling the power with no extra input.

[@Waveguide]

@@chrislloyd1734 you are absolutely right about this, and in later designs the inventor did use a horse shoe setup, see his British patent here: patents.google.com/patent/GB2282708A/en

[@chrislloyd1734]

@@Waveguide Another point that you may be interested in, is that pulse motors like the ones that you are building, work exactly the same as brushless DC motors that can be found in many applications such as quiet PC fans. They even include a mini PCB board that controls the magnetic pulse timing. You may like to take a look at the PCB board spec and see if they can help you control the motor better. They can provide PWM (Pulse width modulation) for synchronized speed adjustments.

[@Waveguide]

​@@chrislloyd1734 They work in a somewhat similar manner, indeed, but the big difference is dat in a BLDC motor current is flowing 100% of the time, while in these pulsed motors only 25-50% of the time, without sacrificing (much) torque. But it is a good tip to look at the PCB of a BLDC motor for inspiration! Right now I am using an Arduino to control the pulse time and pulse width, see: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hXOwiXWklp6Spc0

[@donotwantahandle1111]

Did you use the Adams area rule when designing your drive coils?

[@Waveguide]

Hi, I tried to follow Adams' manual as closely as possible. Could you explain the "area rule" you are referring to in a bit more detail? My drive coil core is 1/2 the width of the rotor magnet, if that is what you mean.

[@donotwantahandle1111]

@@Waveguide The area rule is to make your drive coil core half the area of the magnets (pole face) you use. (watch kzbin.info/www/bejne/gGPFgXd6jNaGrK8)

[@Waveguide]

@@donotwantahandle1111 yes, that is the case here

[@donotwantahandle1111]

Also, try to replicate the original motor exactly and achieve the same results he did before trying any modifications. I speak from experience.

[@Waveguide]

@@donotwantahandle1111 You mean using a brush commutator as a switching device? Also, it is a bit hard to replicate the original, as Adams never mentions the exact dimensions of his coils and the wire thickness he used. So you replicated the Adams Motor, do you have a picture of your setup?

[@sas25135567]

What rating is your capacitor, this is the bit I'm trying to work out 👍

[@Waveguide]

I've used several, but am currently using a 100V 10.000uF high frequency capacitor

[@sas25135567]

Hi waveguide can you post the circuit diagram for the switching please saves me doing it manually 👍🏻

[@Waveguide]

@@sas25135567 I am currently using a simplified circuit based on the Bedini Glass Case Motor, which does not have a diode and capacitor to capture the flyback, but instead this is transmitted as a single wire longitudinal transmission back to the battery. At least, that is how Peter Lindemann described it, and with this super simple circuit it takes my batter 20X (!!) longer to lose 10 mV of charge compared to when I used a capacitor. Here it is: waveguide.blog/static/adams/circuit-24-02-2021.png

[@sas25135567]

Oh I get you nice one now I understand thank so much top man 👍

[@sas25135567]

Just curious when you done the circuit with a diode and capacitor what was the ratings for both of these.