F -150 Lightning Battery Pack Structure

[@Winterheart87]

Kevin Hardy is a really great host for the show. Clear, smart, and gives great feedback. The titanic bulkheads hit the nail right on the head. We all were thinking it and it was cool for Kevin to mention it. Also how he compares it to the Mach E... This video was really refreshing 💪😎 Great job guys

[@MunroLive]

Thanks David

[@laducksunl]

Agreed. Kevin is definitely one of the best communicators/presenters of the Munro videos.

[@AdamEarl2]

I worked on this in 2018, cool to see it come alive

[@refugiopoint]

Somehow Sandy keeps finding guys and gals that are way better presenters than he is, all super professional and intelligent, I really like these videos, way to go team!

[@danielstehura9657]

No they are not better! They just have different expertise than he has! Sandy forgot more than the Big 3 Auto manufacturers know! That’s why they are a Failure and traitors sending our jobs to Mexico when our workers can’t feed their families! FK FORD and the a$$Hole that runs FORD! TESLA is made an America by Americans with American materials. Tesla is the most American car made.

[@TdrSld]

The Lighting being a cab on chassis means the chassis is part of the suspension. This means there will be twisting put through the whole of the frame and the last thing those cells need is to be turned into a twizzler. This is most likely way the battery tray is not hard fixed to the frame as in the others which are uni-body and much much stiffer in the chassis than a body on frame.

[@wmf1595]

loved hearing the light-saber audio cue after Kevin mentioned his 'half black-eye'.

[@jamesengland7461]

I really appreciate your final thoughts about speaking about your work and greatly enjoy watching and listening.

[@MunroLive]

Thank you James!

[@MunroLive]

Thanks for listening

[@terrysullivan1992]

Excellent presentation Kevin. You and Jordan are the two best. Very easy going and relaxed style that makes watching a pleasure.

[@ramblerandy2397]

Crystal clear explanation from Kevin Harty. Always like his contributions.

[@MunroLive]

Thanks

[@Crunch_dGH]

@@MunroLive Because I want to hear more from Kevin: (0:20 Finally got the black eye thing listening at 0.5X).

[@SCWgreg]

The Force is strong with this one. Funny (subtle) reference to the Titanic too. Great study, considerations, and recap.

[@jamesengland7461]

This battery pack is basically a body- on- frame structure hung underneath the body- on- frame truck chassis.

[@4literv6]

Like an external bomb to big for a bombers bay vs internal weapons. Hurts ground&frame clearance and ad's weight. Bet the next one the ground up as an ev lightning from blue oval city in TN in 2025 or 2026. Has a module less structural pack instead. Maybe even designed by catl as Ford partnered with them to supply cells for the mach e next year and lightning from 2024. 🤔

[@rogerstarkey5390]

@@4literv6 *Dambusters* !!! (Hums the tune....)

[@heathwirt8919]

@@4literv6 The construction used allows the entire battery back to be removed for service without affecting the vehicle integrity. It's called serviceability, something you haven't learned about yet.

[@ronaldking1054]

The chassis is flat, and the battery pack is in the recessed area between the frame rails. The second story is towards the body, and it is probably still between the frame rails. All you need do is watch the hoist review to know what you think is going on isn't how it was assembled from the bottom, and the chassis review shows that the battery pack second story still fits between the frame rails. The ladder structure is still attached to the chassis frame.

[@jamesengland7461]

@@ronaldking1054 you didn't understand what I wrote. The battery pack itself is built akin to a body- on- frame, with its own frame below it, and then this, as a unit, is bolted to the body- on- frame truck frame. Too many redundant components.

[@rgeraldalexander4278]

Lol, I lost a similar dual with my son, providing great amusement for the emergency room staff. Looks like Ford did a reasonable job with the battery pack, pretty much in keeping with the frame construction. Thanks!

[@celeron55]

I would expect the pack to be soft mounted because the pack is much more rigid than the frame, but it's not strong enough to actually handle the loads that the frame is supposed to handle. Thus, if the pack was hard mounted, the pack or at least the mounting points would get damaged as the frame flexed like it's designed to.

[@heathwirt8919]

The design allows for the entire battery pack to be removed for service without compromising the integrity of the chassis. Many EV designs use the battery pack as a stressed member making servicing a nightmare.

[@ctuan13]

@@heathwirt8919 I think it's probably a bit of both. Bur yeah the easier drop down and back up replacement nature of the pack, gives me hope that long term repairs and or refurbishment will be a lot more economical so that eventually when the time comes and my battery finally kicks the bucket, if it's out of warranty, it'll be possible to find a reman replacement battery pack for a decent price.

[@patreekotime4578]

@@heathwirt8919 Go back and watch the lift review. There is a ton of complexity with that ladder frame and skid plates that likely makes it more difficult to drop than it seems.

[@heathwirt8919]

@@patreekotime4578 It's a significant task but it's designed be removed from the bottom of the frame as a unit. Weber Auto has performed the same task on the Mach-E several times, it requires a special fixture made by Ford for this purpose. The pack itself is serviceable as each module is removable as a separate entity. The modules/batteries are not potted as in the Tesla and other manufacturers that use the battery case as a stressed member of the chassis.

[@h8GW]

Still, I'd imagine it's practical to make the battery structural because vehicles under repair aren't moving fast or carrying much load and can survive with a much lighter base frame while the battery pack gets repaired/replaced.

[@fred993a]

Thank you Kevin - excellent engineering analysis!

[@MunroLive]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@ZachGrady]

@@MunroLive The information was very good, however Kevin should try to limit use of the words itself and themselves, he said it a LOT.

[@jeffbeasley8235]

@@ZachGrady this drove me insane. Clearly this was take 1 of 1...

[@paulcummings55]

Kudos to your video editor for adding in the Light Sabre sounds;-) And Kudos for being such a fun dad, Kevin!

[@arthurmoore9488]

Where's that Hogfather quote about swords? In this case, why even when playing, Eye Protection is important. Kevin's daughter learned a valuable lesson.

[@Pyk4es]

Who tf cares about poor video editing tactics

[@paulcummings55]

@@Pyk4es Because it was fun? Lighten up, dude...

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Ah! The old "lightsabre duel with my daughter" excuse! . 😁😉 Been there!

[@dustinhenderson7507]

Lol he must be an awesome dad.

[@TheBlairHouseProject]

Excellent video. Love getting the industry insight; where compromises were made for time and material availability etc. Keep up the good work Munro! I hope these vids are expanding your reach and business. The production quality has definitely gone up!

[@steveakin1103]

New drinking game: “essentially” means DRINK! If you replay the video and down a shot with each “essentially,” I can only hope that you dialed 911 first. Beyond that, this was essentially a solid nuts to bolts review - essentially.

[@mikeyc8139]

Yeah, it'd be nice if they added an "essentially counter" to make it easier but you may not be able to read the count after the first minute or so. Maybe a big loud BEEP to go with the count?

[@nuttyDesignAndFab]

the battery is isolated not for NVH but rather for electrical integrity; body on frame trucks flex a lot and if you flex the battery you can break the bonds to the cells, or even damage the cells themselves

[@heathwirt8919]

Do you think body on frame trucks flex more than unibody vehicles? They don't, the reason this battery can be isolated is that the frame has enough strength where as the battery case doesn't need to be a stressed member as in a unibody or semi unibody design.

[@miguellopez3392]

@@heathwirt8919 I would agree they do especially when you take them offroad with a load, on highway use no.

[@heathwirt8919]

@@miguellopez3392 Ever take a unibody vehicle off road? I wouldn't. Looking at the frame on this vehicle it resembles a 1 ton truck.

[@nuttyDesignAndFab]

@@heathwirt8919 you can literally find videos of the gap between the bed and the cab opening and closing as trucks offroad. it's a fundamental physics issue because of the geometry of a ladder frame; look up "second moment of area"

[@heathwirt8919]

@@nuttyDesignAndFab The body is mounted to the frame with mechanical isolators that flex. What you see are the isolators flexing, not the frame which is very stiff.

[@budgetaudiophilelife-long5461]

THANKS KEVIN ,YOU ARE DOING GREAT WITH YOUR LIMITATIONS 😁👍😎💚💚💚

[@Show-me-how-now]

Great video Kevin. Thanks for the laugh "You're stuck with me and a half-black eye from a light saber dual with my daughter". LOL

[@williamstachour4019]

Thanks for this. I love my Lightning but will never have this kind of access to what's underneath the covers and panels.

[@don.timeless4993]

hope to see QuantumScape batteries very soon in this amazing truck

[@Raylen_Fa-ield]

30 sec in and you already got my respect, dad to fellow dad.

[@daza8969]

Bring back Sandy for these videos, his thoughts and explanations are greatly superior

[@MunroLive]

Sandys busy! But he did just join Twitter.

[@Miata822]

Another good one, Kevin. I assumed the battery isolation was to damp vibrations from the uneven surfaces pickups often traverse. It will be interesting to see where Ford goes from here.

[@capslock9031]

The video itself is very informative itself. Greetings from Germany itself.

[@MunroLive]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@roryblake7311]

Could have not been done better by Ford, themselves! Thanks, Kevin!

[@ApparitionElectronic]

...I just can't

[@colingenge9999]

Kevin, good job. If you provided an over view; a simple graphic showing position in the truck so i could stop trying to assemble it in my head would help start with the right context. Is that the frame? Where over the double stack? Was that the frame on the table or subframe? And so on. Pack has crude almost homemake cobble together look of “let’s get it out the door now and optimize later”.

[@brianb-p6586]

I think that they assume that you have watched the earlier videos, which show the battery pack mounted in the truck's frame.

[@waynr]

I'm really excited for this treatment of the Ioniq 5 / e-gmp (assuming y'all haven't done it already and I just haven't come across it yet)

[@dougk5456]

Excellent review as always. When you mentioned 'sealing', it dawned on me that when these battery packs are assembled the relative humidity can vary from day to day or week to week. Is there any evidence that a desiccant is used to prevent condensation in cold climates?

[@davidfrankel9267]

Been waiting for this

[@andrewhalonen5241]

On that massive cover, would there be limited suppliers regardless if the cover was stamped steel or aluminum as well? Great job on this video, Kevin!

[@gmoncrieff]

Good video, off topic but I've seen reports saying it cost Rivian over $200k to build a truck, are you guys finding costing it anywhere near this?

[@setch35]

Essentially this was a great video.

[@ApparitionElectronic]

...Please kill me now 🤣

[@MunroLive]

Glad you think so!

[@brianb-p6586]

Essentially, this video _itself_ was _kinda_ great. And probably better than I would do.

[@cjbierle]

Love the analysis! Probably out of the scope of your tear down, but I'm curious how design of the SR and ER batteries compare.

[@terrya6486]

Very well done Kevin !

[@jamesdough6406]

A nice presentation. It probably will not be long before Sandy has the entire crew of Industrial Engineers "Camera trained and ready". My way of writing a: "Well done". A nice execution by Ford as an early example of a light duty truck frame. One thing I noticed about this "Ford by Example" was the lack of background considerations of the existing plant. Once upon a time, the purchase of plant and equipment was a 20-year funding, now it is more often a 50-year funding. Bad enough to have unused machinery sitting idle for the last 5 years of a 20-year note, now the same situation would be unused machinery sitting around for 35 years. All of planing for a new vehicle is most likely a case of: "Do the job with the plant and equipment we have". Ford has a lot of plant and equipment. You can't expect them to be putting 9,000 ton Giga-presses into storage until the lease runs out. 😂 Maybe find some work job shopping Locomotives, Submarines and Tanks? Oh, wait, GM already does that.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Not sure if you're critiquing Ford or "others"?

[@jamesdough6406]

@@rogerstarkey5390 No specific company.

[@74ventura11]

Farazad interview was great!

[@larrymeyer2917]

Yes, nice style and comments on the topic.

[@__--JY-Moe--__]

super breakdown! chevy has a possible competitor! the Silverado ev.....Ford's been a leading competitive force, for a long time! & it's nice to see a Rivian product, laid out as well!!

[@johnreese3762]

Well done, interesting, thanks!!

[@MunroLive]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@peterbland7227]

Any thoughts of a follow-up video on the Lightning’s battery pack reliability? I’ve seen some videos claiming battery failures with no replacement stock available at the dealers to get the vehicle back in the road.

[@charleshaggard4341]

Well done. I will be interested to see how the battery internals are assembled.

[@markplott4820]

they are shit, FUD still using inferior POUCH cells .....lol.

[@emlprimo]

Great video Kevin, thank you! Do you know how they sorted out EMI shielding with a SMC top cover?

[@korneliusthegrey4923]

Well done.

[@marshalllapenta7656]

Question? Reason for the isolated battery pack, Is it because of crashes? OR Is it because it's the 1st generation, could they possibly be testing the isolated battery pack?

[@MrFoxRobert]

Thank you!

[@MunroLive]

You bet!

[@MunroLive]

Welcome!

[@babyUFO.]

It just isn't Munro without Munro.

[@MunroLive]

You’re right, it’s Munro & Associates! 😉

[@pauldesi]

Quick update on demand (at least in eastern PA).. actual deliveries have fallen off a cliff. Many have cancelled / refusing to pay extortionist level mark ups. Local dealer has had a Lightening on the lot for almost 6 weeks now.. demand is unwinding fast.

[@heathwirt8919]

"Demand is unwinding fast" Dumbest statement ever.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

@@heathwirt8919 How about "Demand at the going rate is dwindling fast"? . (Demand at the MRP may be fine..... But it's still an issue?)

[@javelinadad]

@@rogerstarkey5390 agreed. And demand for trim/options not made available isn't necessarily being visible. The $45,000 Lightning is being stubbornly difficult to order. I understand Ford desiring to build the most profitable version first, but telling us it's the one we want implies we don't want the entry level Lightning. I will never believe that.

[@heathwirt8919]

@@rogerstarkey5390 Only in the mind of a Tesla fanboy like you and Paul.

[@chrisbraid2907]

Dealerships know how to screw themselves, over pricing is going to cost them. Hold back from purchase until they are prepared to offer a reasonable price or at least bundle a bunch of extras for their ridiculous mark ups. Exploiting an opportunity properly requires a measure of reasonable gain for both parties … supply however can price itself beyond demand and that’s what I see bad dealerships doing, reinforcing the notion of Stealerships …. The place you visit once and if they are the only option you buy then leave never to return …

[@WizardRench]

Maybe they isolated the battery to avoid twisting it when the frame undergoes torsional load?

[@urishaham2544]

Could be that the extremely stiff frame design of the cybertruck was in part driven by the goal of eliminating the need for an isolated battery pack, given that a pickup truck frame is subject to higher loads and bending than a road vehicle.

[@johnleeuw3022]

excellent job

[@michaelplotkin7383]

Great video, thank you.

[@MunroLive]

You are welcome!

[@enniol8043]

About 2 decades ago, Volvo was criticized about a wiring harness that ran from front to back and the effect the em field would have on the passengers. How safe is it driving on a battery pack? I am considering an EV but is this something that we will find out in the future was dangerous for us?

[@mikeyc8139]

Kevin is quickly becoming an essential part of the Munro team!

[@cjonesplay1]

Did magna make the battery pack?

[@abraxastulammo9940]

I just learned the battery costs about 36000 USD or 28500 USD for the smaller one. 😳

[@universeisundernoobligatio3283]

Like the Mach E the high voltage high current conductors look small maybe 6AWG. From my single conductor in free air table that shows temperature rise at different currents. At 350amps fast charging there will be a 150DegC temperature rise. With this large temperature cycling over time the fasteners will become loose. Causing high resistance raising the temperature even higher. Note power is I squared R. This problem even gets worse at higher current loads at rapid acceleration. At 1000amps the temp rise is over 400degC Time will tell when this becomes a problem.

[@jabroni6199]

My Bronco has a steel skid plate under the fuel tank. My F150 Raptor has the plastic one.

[@eddiegardner8232]

That's a lot of battery cells to buy and pay for, to make a legacy frame and body design work as an EV. I compare it in my head to the Tesla 4680 "structural" battery pack, and wonder how much weight they could offload with a cleaner design. Having an aluminum body in white and bed is a good start.

[@marsstarlink3235]

There's no looking back once you know the 4680 way. We're looking at old tech here on the Lightning truck, and it's being marked up at dealerships hardcore.

[@patreekotime4578]

You have to move to a completely rigid body to do structural pack. There are upsides and downsides to that approach, but remember that one of the big selling points for Ford is aftermarket assessories and even entire alternative beds. Ford cant dramatically change the construction of their trucks without in some way missing out on that market. So its not just about using legacy parts, its just as much about reverse compatibility, which limits what they are willing to do. Tesla can do whatever they want because they dont have those considerations. Which is one reason why Ford will still be competitive when the Cybertruck finally comes to market.

[@eddiegardner8232]

@@patreekotime4578 I think that Ford could incorporate a structural pack into the frame if they started with a new frame design from the ground up, and still use a body-on-frame design. That would be quite expensive and require heavy re-tooling for their new "skateboard" structure, but it might be desirable from the standpoint of maintaining high flexibility of alternate cab and bed configurations typical of the current truck platform market. If they try to go full structural monocoque, it would be a dead end for aftermarket options. Trucks are not a "one size fits all" kind of business.

[@ohhs7830]

You mention KW, but how many volts are we talking about ? How about the number of AMPS going through those cables. Also we see the orange connectors and cabling. Is orange some kind of standard or just a new BEV tradition ? You mention cooling. What is the temperature of the battery pack, High, Low, Ideal. One would expect a temperature gradient as the coolant worked it's through the battery pack. Does the battery pack automatically shutdown to prevent damage at a high temperature.

[@brianb-p6586]

The electrical details will follow in later video, as mentioned in the video. Other reports describe a battery with 96 cell groups in series, so it will have the same nominal voltage as most EVs, of roughly 360 V. That means hundreds of amps at high power. Orange for the battery voltage is an automotive industry practice, found in both BEVs and hybrids with higher voltage traction batteries (presumably not the 48 V stuff).

[@allen143]

@@brianb-p6586 Thank you.

[@jrockerstein]

Good job!

[@MunroLive]

Thanks!

[@barrybdm1]

Well done itself!😮

[@Crunch_dGH]

Re: Assumed Knowledge. 0:48 What is SMC (SNC)? 5:55 “Pickup” revisions (as in lesson learned improvements)? 6:36 You know (umm, then why watching?) 7:00 Bulkhead venting (so this has to do with containment of errant gases to deter fire potential, or something?) 8:00 NVH? (Oh right, who doesn’t know Noise, Vibration, Harshness) 10:43 conformability? comfort? familiarity? 11:15 Oh, got it. what does smc mean automotive: “Sheet molding compound (SMC) is one of the most widely used forms of composite material in the automotive industry, particularly in the US where output has grown from 65000 tons in 1990 to 125000 tons in the year 2000 (Automotive Composites Alliance, 1999).” Of course! (face slap). No worries, I thoroughly enjoyed all 11 relistens. You’re the best, Kevin!

[@MunroLive]

Thanks for watching!

[@Chas_Reno]

thank you

[@MunroLive]

You're welcome

[@LawpickingLocksmith]

Thanks Kevin, great engineering analyses. To me I feel like Ford has rushed it a bit. Tesla appears to be light years ahead compared to the Mach E.

[@h8GW]

Tesla certainly is far ahead, considering that the Cybertruck will always be available _in the future._

[@raaah]

To replace the 300 mile battery back on a Ford electric F150 cost $35,000 and I think the smaller one is 27,000 and change

[@ambush1242]

Many on the forums are already citing contactor failures. Would love to see the HVBJB module in greater detail and see how many components are shared with the MME. Seeming like Ford hasn't learned its lesson.

[@javelinadad]

Can you provide a hint where "many" are citing? I'm not exactly skeptical, but I'm surprised that I wouldn't have seen this in my personal research.

[@heathwirt8919]

Many are citing the your a Tesla fanboy that needs a life.

[@alanmay7929]

Stop lying lol….

[@44beebe]

According to the fordf150lightning forum a problem with the contactors has been reported a total of 2 times and both said they were able to get the part replaced very quickly under warranty.

[@ambush1242]

​@@44beebe There's certainly more than 2 if you actually search Powertrain Malfunction and read through the actual threads. And I'm not talking about faults attributed to a loose 12V connection. These are brand new trucks with hundreds of miles being stranded or hamstrung to 15 mph without warning. Does that not warrant a deeper investigation into the HVBJB? You EV shills are unreal.

[@MrDuncanBooth]

Thanks

[@RSV4JeffA]

How do you kinda come to the other side? 🤔

[@josephhobbs4754]

Pack probably isolated from the frame due to possible frame flex.

[@markplott4820]

Delete body on frame, add Gigacasting & structural battery.

[@brianb-p6586]

I agree, and the very stiff Rivian system (with the body rigidly fastened to the frame) is Rivian's alternative approach to this problem. GM seems to have gone for very high frame torsional stiffness (using large extrusions for side rails) to address the same issue.

[@koeniglicher]

You said for this *Extended Range Battery Pack* : the 1st module is 11.95 kWh plus 8 modules with 16.44 kWh each. Makes a total of 143.47 kWh. Is the following correct? 1st module is 32 cells => 8s4p, the other 8 modules are 44 cells each => 8s 11s4p. The whole pack is 96s4p then, 143.47 kWh gross capacity, 131 kWh net capacity. Small module plus 5 big ones in the 1st floor. Then 3 big modules on top in the second floor. Confirmed visually. Cells are SK Innovation pouch cells, Hi-Nickel (9 Nickel, 0.5 Manganese, 0.5 Cobalt), nominal cell voltage is 3.66 Volt, nominal cell capacity 102 Ah, nominal cell energy: 373.32 Wh. So the small module (8s4p) would be 29.28V nominal, 408 Ah, 11.95 kWh. The large modules (11s4p) would be 40.26V nominal, 408 Ah, 16.43 kWh each. What is battery pack weight? The "Ford F-150 Lightning Battery Removal Guide" demands a lift table capable of handling 746 kg. Is that the weight of the Extended Range Pack? That would be 192 Wh/kg at battery pack level which is quite good. What is the corresponding data of the *standard range pack* then? This would be a 3p pack then. Neither 32 cells nor 44 cells nicely divide by 3. So they would need different modules. Known: 98 kWh net capacity. Could be 9 modules, 30 cells each, each with a 10s3p configuration, 90s3p overall, 270 cells in total. Nice weight distribution, however this would still require 9 module housings with each of them only partially filled and requiring extra compression on the cells - or with smaller outside dimensions.

[@jbarvideo12]

Nice details you provide ... to expand what Kevin discussed.

[@koeniglicher]

@@jbarvideo12 Kevin said in the end, they split the content and Munro would provide a second video on the modules themselves. However, I am impatient to wait for it. I personally am not so interested in the fasteners, extrusions, molds, seals and stuff (classical Munro focus points), but the electrical properties of the pack. And I wanted to highlight, that they should publish weight once they have it on a scale and treat the standard range battery pack with some additional hints despite not having it on their workbench.

[@brianb-p6586]

Interesting analysis. To hit 98 kWh usable with the same cells, it would need 290 cells. Like the Mach E, it would make sense for the standard pack to avoid the top tier; that suggests something like 10S3P (30 cells for the small module instead of the extended's 32) plus 5 modules at 14S3P each (42 cells for the small module instead of the extended's 44), but that would provide only 240 cells in 80S3P, which is low in voltage to use the same motors and too low in capacity. Keeping a shorter top tier , noting that this would be a structurally easy variation, raises the possibility of something like one 10S3P plus six 14S3P. I'm assuming that the module construction only works properly with an even number of cells, regardless of how they are electrically connected.

[@southbendkid]

NVH? SMC?? Munro videos sound like internal company films, geared only to the cognoscente.

[@brianb-p6586]

While each acronym should be introduced, typical automotive technology enthusiasts are well aware of what NVH and SMC mean (which are Noise Vibration and Harshness, and Sheet Moulding Compound, in case these are new to you).

[@MADMAX7330]

131kwh usable out of 144 is an oddly large buffer 😐

[@TrogdorBurnin8or]

Lifespan goes down very rapidly as you push further on depth of discharge, and I'd imagine that they want to retain some power for non-motive upkeep.

[@MADMAX7330]

@@TrogdorBurnin8or Sure, but that buffer is usually

[@heathwirt8919]

@@MADMAX7330 That "dead weight" will still be part of a functional battery pack long after a less than 5 percent buffer battery dies.

[@scottgaree7667]

@@heathwirt8919 My 7 year old Model S battery has degraded less than 5%.

[@pablopicaro7649]

Thanks for the inside look at the Pack, but who actually engineered it? seems doubtful Ford has that sort of expertise (does not look anything like legacy vehicle design)

[@ohger1]

You might be surprised at what legacy automakers can do. When cars went to computerized engine management, Ford's early EEC computers were beautifully engineered and nearly bullet proof. I'm sure the legacy's have been hiring engineers for the transition.

[@lrod8692]

Is Ford a startup that’s can’t pay for expertise?

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Best described as "Belt and Braces" construction?

[@brunoheggli2888]

This is just amazing mindblowing!Ford is just the best!

[@03shigginbotham]

Reasonable analysis from Kevin, but excessive usage of "itself" distracts from the content.

[@martinyin]

glad to see you also get to spend time with your Jedi daughter, hahaha

[@nicholasinglis]

where are the batteries?

[@MrBadgas]

Nice job Kevin. Great to see a nice Pilot watch on wrist. I’m thinking you may be the leading watch guy at Munro. Garmin and Apple make very useful but soulless tools.

[@MunroLive]

Cory is going to be jealous

[@MrBadgas]

@@MunroLive as he should be. He needs some motivation.

[@RSV4JeffA]

How do you “kinda” see a difference? Dude loves the word “kinda”.

[@RB-pi3jl]

Your daughter's a Jedi, she is. - (Yoda)

[@4literv6]

144kwhs total capacity huh? Interesting fomoco maintains such a high kwh buffer, holding a full 13kwhs back. 🤔 Also makes me think that pack is large enough if it uses a module less design. To hold 180+kwhs. Which means the lfp catl supplied pack's next year are going to be pretty big. I really wish Ford would do a single motor smaller pack rwd only lighting standard cab.

[@heathwirt8919]

The system diagnosis can isolate a battery fault to a specific module making repair of the failed module possible. A module less design would give greater storage density at the expense of repairability. Pick your poison.

[@4literv6]

@@heathwirt8919 clearly your name should be John snow. Just because a manufacturer claims a module is serviceable? Doesn't mean in the real world it'll end up actually being serviceable. Ala the Chevy bolt recall is proof positive of this. And those who've tried unsuccessfully to repair/replace individual tesla modules for years now in less than sterile environments. had the serviced pack fail due to the bms not being able to balance the new/replaced module's. As elon said think of a pack as starting out with high grade ore instead. Grind it up and start over. 👍🏻

[@heathwirt8919]

@@4literv6 Tesla battery packs are not repairable by design. Ford's battery packs are by design. The entire battery is removable and serviceable. The battery structure is not a stressed member of the vehicle like the Tesla design so it can be removed without the body structure collapsing under its own weight if not braced. Ford's batteries are not potted and arranged in modules that are serviceable. A faulty module can be isolated using diagnostic software. Tesla designs for ease of assembly and low cost, a battery failure becomes the consumers problem when the vehicle is out of warranty. If you buy a Tesla sell it before the warranty runs out.

[@royh6526]

@@heathwirt8919 Yes, except that the Tesla batteries are designed for very long serviceable life. 4680 is intended to last 1M miles of vehicle use. You are right, the structural pack is not designed to be serviceable, but will be removed when the vehicle is scrapped and sold to Redwood Materials for re-cycling.

[@EnerGeezerSquirrel]

♪♫"Sandy to the left of me, Corey to the right....♫♪ ...♫HERE I AM...stuck in the middle with you.♪♫

[@josephdan2850]

You guys do realize that F-150 lighting and Mustang Mach E are two totally different vehicles. F-150 lighting is meant for durability and tow over 10,000 pounds while mustang Mach E is meant for fun driving and drive people to different places. Some of things you said doesn’t make sense for trucks.

[@brianb-p6586]

Most F-150's are also used for nothing but fun driving and taking people to different places.

[@andreandre1051]

👍👍

[@parthipannataraj7417]

Transmission video please

[@brianb-p6586]

Your wish is Munro's command. They did that one yesterday: "Ford Lightning EV Motor: Power and Performance Built In-House" Although the title says "Motor" it is mostly about the transaxles.

[@brianb-p6586]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z4iTZaBqhc6if7s

[@parthipannataraj7417]

@@brianb-p6586 thank you so much

[@stevelawrenz466]

"Itself!"

[@qingyuhu]

That is a HUGE battery pack, surprised the range is so low. Ford has a long way to go but good to see they actually made the Lightning but obviously it's rushed. Battery pack frame seems awfully redundant to the ladder frame, just isolate the battery modules. Being compared to titanic isn't exactly.....good? LOL!

[@db4z09]

The efficiency is very similar to the Rivian despite the Rivian being smaller and the Lightning is way more efficient than the Hummer. The cybertruck may have a more aerodynamic shape but by the time it comes to market, the Lightning will already be refreshed with an all new version coming out in 2025.

[@markplott4820]

Body on frame is too HEAVY. TESLA has 132 mpg vs FUD motors.

[@royh6526]

This battery pack design uses far too many welds, pieces, bolts and must be a nightmare to assemble and service. If Sandy had done the review, he would have ripped it apart, pointing out the dozens of ways it should have been built. This was a rush job to get to market.

[@brianb-p6586]

Why is it surprising? This is a huge vehicle, with huge tires and blunt shape. Although energy consumption per unit distance is almost double that of the most economical car, it's only 10% higher than typical SUVs, slightly lower than the worst of the SUVs, and about the same as the Rivian.

[@davidgrisco1939]

All these small passage coolant loops. So many seams and joints for failure. I can see a "coolant plate" failure inside the battery pack whereby the pack gets flooded with coolant. Not an easy repair to a $35k battery pack.

[@brianb-p6586]

That's typical of EV battery packs. I've never heard of a plumbing failure flooding the case, but of course it's possible and it may have happened.

[@rogerstarkey5390]

Very "Diplomatic" from 11:00 onwards.

[@shortaybrown]

You mean he lied and said the Ford has a good battery design. But if you’ve watched other battery teardowns, you know this battery is primitive and terrible.

[@abraxastulammo9940]

@@shortaybrown I think the VW battery is quite straightforward with either pouch or prismatic cell filled modules coming directly from three different manufacturers. Even better is the BYD blade battery.

[@jasongooden917]

I guess the force is strong with your daughter 🤣

[@suggesttwo]

144KWH battery. 131 usable KWH.

[@rule1capital]

Looking forward to Sandy's interview with Farzad and "The Limiting Factor" this afternoon...

[@NextGenEvs]

Years behind Tesla

[@WANDERER0070]

I dont see Tesla truck anywhere on sale Lol

[@ChitFromChinola]

The Titanic? Did you say the Titanic? 🤔

[@macros4129]

Please save Arcimoto.....

[@mhfs61]

👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼

[@gs9771]

SHOULD BE MUCH SIMPLER, LESS PARTS, THEY SHOULD MAKE IT SIMPLE RECTAGLE ALLUMINUM BOX.

[@shortaybrown]

You should say you’ve got your black eye in a bar fight. It will increase your street reputation. Always go with the excuse that helps your street rep.

[@MunroLive]

Kevin was a sergeant first class in the Army and is in the National Guard, he doesn't need the street cred.

[@patreekotime4578]

Nah. Only insecure little man babies who desperately crave attention and validation get into bar fights. Real men spend time with their daughters.

[@shortaybrown]

@@patreekotime4578 - don’t you have a sense of humor ? I think we know who the man baby is in this conversation and it’s not me. Work on your social skills honey.