F. Sherman - Fighting A Super CV

Nothing like watching a ship advertised as an AA destroyer fight against the monstrosities WG refer to as super carriers.
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[@Flamuu]

This experience just about sums up playing surface ships in 2022 and running into one of these things. Twitter: twitter.com/flamuchz Discord: discord.gg/Flamu Stream: www.twitch.tv/flamuu Insta: instagram.com/flamugram/

[@jonathanstone4878]

I figured out the alternate way to interact with CV's and Subs.... you call them names in chat and -1 them karma. That will teach them!

[@victorngobi]

Potato Quality had the same thing. Snapshot, swivel turrets on the same ship in his video a couple of days ago. Yet another issue it seems. Its kind of sad that you guys are not surprised.

[@johnweir9447]

If carriers weren't overpowered, the US wouldn't spend all of it's education and healthcare money on them....

[@johnweir9447]

There should be a mechanic that *guarantees* a fire after X number of hits depending on your supposed fire percentage chance.

[@MustYouHaveAUsername]

The Math: Top hull T10 has a 0.5005 fire "suppression" coefficient. So with Fire Prevention and DCM1 an 11% fire chance turns out to be only about 4.68%. Assuming each shell hit a part of the GK that is not already on fire we would expect an average of 5.382 fires with those 115 shells that hit in that sequence. Doing some Fourier transformations we can calculate that that Flamu got approximately 5.382 less fires than expected. 🤓

[@nordlawt8242]

Wow. Even as a FDG main, that is really scummy.

[@nlb137]

Using that same 4.68% chance, the chance to *not* get a fire after 115 shell hits is (1-.0468)^115, which comes out to a 0.4% chance to not get a fire.

[@tomsmithie3917]

Now add the jank programming and Plot Armor into the game and you get 1 fire, maybe. I had a game with my Worcester shooting battleships nonstop, 223 shell hits, 1 fire.

[@samusaran11]

There has to be some hidden mechanic or bug that WG doesnt wanna talk about.

[@MustYouHaveAUsername]

@@samusaran11 It's mostly RNG, he gets 4 fires in less than 50 hits vs the Kremlin later on (that includes hits on the ship with active DCP and sections that are already on fire, thus immune to fires). Realistically that's probably less than 30 hits on components that aren't on fire or immune... For 30 hits we would expect 1.404 fires, even if we count 50 hits we would only expect 2.340 fires on average.

[@alexlukas2817]

It´s so sad that the Game is in such a bad state that i have more fun watching Flamu suffer than suffering myself....

[@Metroidf4n]

Thank you Flamu for suffering for us, so we don't have to 😞

[@AJC88]

Thats whats happening to me lol

[@lickkittysplit3871]

Sadly, this is the state that I've been in for about a year now. I rarely play Randoms. Operations, Brawls 1v1, COOP, are the only ones I play now.

[@alexdavila1356]

that's me the past 3 years! I quit 3 years ago with a 57% (and increasing) WR mostly playing DDs. The game just became too frustrating with the direction WG was taking. Power creeping ships, OP CVs, constant change to game mechanics and addition of new gimmicks. Thank god i left before subs. Watching flamu play (and rage) is far more enjoyable

[@120420]

@@alexdavila1356 I'll be stuck at 55%. Sucks too, as I was really starting to pull my own in the game!

[@tomhollins5303]

Dont worry Flamu, your AA may not have stopped you from receiving damage from the planes, but the "damage to planes" number kept ticking up. And that has got to be good right?

[@yuenin5318]

i pressed W in 2022, classic mistake i will make sure i don't do this again

[@Macintoshiba]

I remember a time where CVs had the longest Fire duration by default...*and* limited planes...and people were still monsters in those, even though they were unable to dodge flak!

[@tomhollins5303]

So the natural counter to a CV is another CV. Strangely enough, the natural counter to a sub is a CV. Which kind of makes sense cause the natural counter to a DD is a CV too!

[@Rob.DB.]

And natural counter to Cruisers,& everything else!

[@professionalantichristhate528]

Graf Zeppelin best sub hunter

[@Susanoo449]

and funny enough, the counter to artillery baded ships, which caused their extinction, is a CV too!

[@aesirgaming1014]

I'm glad that at the end you admit that carriers are a balanced class and you clearly greatly enjoyed the experience of playing against this fair and balanced super carrier. How do we know it's fair and balanced? Why, because the spreadsheet says so of course.

[@snavsmatiq]

I love how WG thought of every possible way someone could fuck up playing a CV and built the class around being as brain dead as possible. Also love the "historical accuracy" of the okhotnik not receiving ASW, yet CVs that are jam packed with torps, rockets, and bombs, yet cannot be detonated.

[@sleepygryph]

CVs used to have a high skill lvl attached to them to the point that if the skill lvl between them was was too different one team was just screwed. Then the rework came and they dropped the skill lvl through the floor and when window licking CV players still managed to fail at the class they went ahead and dropped it through the basement. I routinely run into CVs, mostly Maltas, FDRs, and Super CVs that manage to get their entire flight zeroed by Def AA on a Halland or Elbing and even deplane themselves against a Smaland. The sad thing is that WG will continue to drop the skill lvl needed for CVs as they continue roll their face over the keyboard. It's only getting worse because subs are getting the same treatment, surface ships even have their favorites with BBs and DDs trading their protected spot and Cruisers being routinely at the bottom of the pile.

[@walker787878]

he was whining about them from day one, no chance to get a balanced opinion about CVs here and there is no way to implement them without him saying that CV players are inferior or whatever, I just come for the selfrighteousness and the grumpy old man entertainment .... he was good at that from day one, too ;-)!

[@Sporting1210]

I mostly agree, specially that subs were designed for the same group of palyers (you know-the "plain bad" category), but the skillgap bewteen the CVs still plays a significant role. One might argue even a bigger one then pre-rework, because now i sometimes get 100% of my matches with CVs compared to 1 out of 30-50 before the rework. But if your team gets the sub 50% winrate CV with 60k average dmg or less, while the enemy team gets the 60% winrate Cv with 120k+ average dmg - you are just as fucked as you were before the rework. that said, what buggs me the most is the spotting! Checked the stats of a Cv player, who gave the impression, that he would hurt himself when trying to use a doorknob, and the dude had 412 games in the United States, barely 40% winrate, 43k average dmg but spotted a tad over 4000 thousands enemy ships in these games. "even a blind hen can find a corn" REALLY comes to mind, when talking about bad cv palyers. Beside the fact, that i do not understand what players like that take away from playing a PvP mode (and it doesnt matter which class they play in that regard), when they clearly are SO bad, don't achieve anything, get flamed at by teammates all the time and - most importantly - seem to be unable to reflect on their mistakes to get any better, how is it good for the game, when a dude, who would be dead withinh the first 3 minutes of the match, if he was playing a dd, can spott more or less every single ship on the enemy team in every match he plays, when in a cv? probably not even by intention, just by flying all over the map with these magically super-sonic planes.

[@alexdavila1356]

They must have found some hidden metric somewhere, while mining and analyzing their data, that shows that people who play CVs are more willing to make in-game purchases. That's the only reason I can think that they needed to push CVs to near vegetable level of game play. You could play a cv in a coma and still manage a 50% WR from sinking subs

[@zolomanbg]

Still was a shitty design why does it have to be-either u are the better player or you screw everyone...like for example there can be 2 same DDs and if one of them is potato other is good it still wont fck his team....before and now CV is not balanced on 100% before too hard now too easy Wargaming should make it 50/50 like all other ships

[@Gearshoot]

@@alexdavila1356 ... yknow, that's just crazy enough that it makes sense.

[@craigalexander966]

I watched a Dalarna vs a Malta yesterday it’s AP couldn’t pen, even it’s side or bum, and the HE was almost useless,he got it with torps on the 3rd try, then died to its last planes as they have some much HP they were almost immune to his AA and r infinite in number. (He got 48 kills, the team almost 100 all up)

[@kuhluhOG]

At this point I am just waiting for a CV with a 12km hydro which can detect subs too and GK levels of secondaries. And the hydro has a 5s cooldown and always gets activated while spotted. PS: Oh, I forgot, it should also have an unlimited number of hydro uses available.

[@Kvomii]

Don't give these _ssholes ideas....

[@kuhluhOG]

@@Kvomii at this point I just want to see how far they will go

[@Kvomii]

@@kuhluhOGWe were laughting at supercarriers that have jetplanes at tier 11 just 2 years ago so you kind of have a point.... Better not think about that for too long.

[@carterrecoy1877]

no, so flamu, i believe you were reading the fire chance percentage wrong. I think for you it was 1.1%, not 11%

[@UmbraFaux]

SATAN IS HERE! Best line ever.

[@Pliskkenn]

I weirdly feel like with the introduction of Dutch cruisers and Tromp, you could do away with CVs as anti camping tools.

[@devorlast]

I definitely noticed with Sherman that the HE has some hidden fire chance nerf. You can farm sap damage and get some ok damage with the HE alpha but fire change seems to be broken for sure.

[@Yukon.72]

13.20 that stalin you tried to help calling you names, and saying that if not you, they would we won, ungrateful people..

[@Rob.DB.]

Imma Rebel with aan idea... What if, everyone ,like 90% of player-base learns to CV & then we all play on a particular weekend where we all agree to only attack enemy CV till death & then focus all enemy subs down, (or Subs first) ,then go hide in a corner & leave the game early & allow the surface ships to finish the games???...I would buy a couple T4 &T6 CV's do it !! Would that send a message WG would understand or even care about?? I am willing to "turn pink"or take the day, or multi days play-ban because after 6years of mistreatment spending only about $40 total, I rarely play anymore, & only fear total account termination. Comment :Thoughts or other ideas are appreciated.

[@jaywerner8415]

Probably not. But hay it would give me a reason to play cv for a while.

[@rugby86]

They might use the stats of, “The CV-Class rose up to its highest point as the most popular ship class to play on these dates”. WG will use it to their advantage against the player base. Although your idea is a good one.

[@oddimus]

The core concept is - We, as in I - or you, did not design the game - People Just play it - Kinda like yelling at a cop for arresting you, The officer did not wright the laws - They were just enforced.

[@Stormidze]

i like that chat its like a " if our sherman use to be no so dumb...."

[@pendragooon]

Yesterday it took me 220 hits at 8% chance to set one fire. I suspect there is a fire RNG bug around. I did the.math: The chance for this to happen is 0.000001017%

[@annoyance.2583]

Are you counting the internal resistance of the ship you were firing at?

[@alexanderarclight2559]

That Kremlin Turret Traverse. Experimental built in Laser Focused Aiming Systems yep.

[@getsune3473]

Nice turret desync on the Kremlin at 13:28. Quality code at work here.

[@we7034]

With Ushakov they don't even render with low graphics settings untill you reach 2km distance or something

[@jedpratte]

Last night was so bad. My team never moved up all night. I even in a holland killed both DDs at the cap and turned the enemy away. My side still turned and ran… had another game a Kaga in tier x match. My team shot down 108 of his planes and he still had full flights at end of match. He killed me in halland because AA is useless.

[@user-yt5xc2sn3d]

This ship not only suck at Aerial, while also suck hard on anti-sub due to its speed and maneuverability. Wg should fucking give some range for dds to drop dc, like 2-3 km radius around the ship.

[@habitualoffender4957]

The first 25 seconds is why I watch flamuu.

[@TheTazzer777]

This is the answer to that’s guys comments that he put on Reddit regarding def AA, thankyou flamu and manisfestation

[@pauloakwood9208]

Carrier design: never wiser words.

[@TheAddanz]

Patch notes I want to see : 1. Reduced all CV Deck armor by 90% to prevent them from bouncing long range Battleship shells. 2. Reversed the Rocket plane immunity during attack run. 3. CVS will not replenish aircraft.

[@annoyance.2583]

Leave the armor for Implacable though, with such a nerfs it would be only thing it has left

[@gstormcz]

Flamuu Sherman fully AA build vs Super CV: CV player: Whoever you are, Ahhahha Flamu in little DeeDee, my dear, I am hidden ship hidden stats player, you are no real chance, I just take quick glance, your buffed AA is still bad, you already 100percent dead, I make your day full of stress, you shooting just my reserves. WG: Super CVs getting its intended player base possibly working on premium Admiral Kuznetsov and Gerald R. Ford

[@marcuswaterson]

Pretty weird choice on WG's part to give the Sherman both the yellow SAP and the red SAP.

[@OnlyAfcc]

btw. interesting comment in chat at 6:29. „Sherman, are you idiot?”

[@mikestevens4950]

"The numbers": 6:24 ; 63 pens 56 shatters=119 hits. calculated fire chance per shell 5,23% (assumed dcm1 on GK), chance for NOT burning is therefore 94,77% per shell. 0,9477^119= 0,167%. Roughly 2 against 1000. There you go.

[@MrBreakdownBoy]

My russian premium CV was behind an island and killed a sub while I was not even aware there was sub near my CV. Only played it because I got it in the BF container.

[@Klaus_Klavier]

The mistake was using HE on a target that SAP would’ve eaten in seconds. Forget the fires SAP would have DELETED that carrier

[@stalwartteakettlepotato9879]

You should just play a ship that can doge and has good AA.

[@M5YUILL]

Numbers are (x) fire chance - (x) (fire resistance) - (x) the Flamu constant which is (0.98)

[@Pandemic1313]

You know I see you play ships designed for human beings and think "maybe I should come back" Then I see games like this against ape brain ships and think "nah I'm good actually"

[@crispy1691]

as a cv main i do enjoy having my way with a "kitten"

[@KaguyasBeat]

That GK is on to something... Yes Fire prevention ensures Yes fires. No = No therefore No Fire Prevention = No Fires.

[@nip3004]

If that's the core of carrier design they failed at it. Playing as or against CVs is just infuriating because the person coming out on top is heavily dependant on rng at nearly every stage.

[@steeljawX]

Just remember this one simple factoid, Flamu. The USSR and Russia have never in the history of either nation ever once deployed an actual aircraft carrier in actual warfare. They've "had" them, but they've never successfully used them. This is probably the original dev's idea of how carriers probably functioned on the battlefronts. Durping around and never suffering any consequences and being able to just "admin/kill" any and all opposition without any effort put into it. Instead of going for some actual accuracy and fairness, they're putting both Russian bias and Russian naivety into play. The don't know how carriers work because they've never used one correctly. So historical accuracy and player skill be damned, this is how Russia imagines how CV's CV instead of researching the capitalistic western CV's and how they were used.

[@cerneysmallengines]

I am dreading the t11 Russian cv that's bound to come around at some point. t10 CVs are already t11, the Russian is t12, so am actual t11 would be like t13 or 14

[@Zolta1983]

It's funny how the carriers counter a DD 1v1 in close range. And this shit is in the game for years now. The planes on the deck sould be shot to pieces under heavy HE fire.

[@sirtogii5216]

The fact that a CV charges(!) a DD just to ensure the strikes are more frequent, and doesn't have a care in the world doing it... Considering the tier 10 CV's already were superships, what the fk is this?!?

[@milospostic5401]

And you are spot on about what the CV gamepla is about. Balans

[@romandolgiy4351]

Stalin player accused you of being the reason your team lost:)

[@g6g401]

He wanted Flamu to push a hydro dd and a Venezia....

[@little_player3596]

I miss the old rts cv where your need highly skilled base to perform good and have limited plane so you didn't always broken all times, unlike now

[@quirkyMakes]

In regards to the kremlin turret desync. Wargaming just like most other mmo's today are relying on udp for there sync signals. while this may be faster and it does cut down on lag, any data center's inbetween that get a hiccup will cause packets loss. unfortunate but unavoidable.

[@tomhollins5303]

Its actually the second turret desybc that I have seen in 2 days. PotatoQuality had one as well. Probably co-incidence but might be worth keeping eyes open for more.

[@MucH-tw7wj]

flamu i know you love cvs a lot, why dont you try 2 kearsarge 1 lex div. to show how much you love them. i know you will like this, i did when i tried it.

[@benb6417]

I remember back when CVs could burn and it prevented them from launching planes 🥲

[@Hydra360ci]

It's so weird when those torps actually hit something... and it's seems like they hit crap at the same rate as a normal torp boat, most times.

[@jagdson2701]

After years of being told "WoWs is an arcade game" there is a resurgence of the term historical. 'Strange how little complaining was tolerated over the ridiculous durability and gunpower of destroyers, the ships called "tin cans" for a reason. WG has always gotten things crazily wrong, it's their corporate brand.

[@auxityne]

I wonder if these design decisions are meant to push players down to mid-tiers much harder, to give new players the illusion of a healthy population.

[@zolomanbg]

Can confirm in tier1,2,3,4,5,6 ppl are 80% less toxic...any higher than that everyone plays like their life depends on it(not even on ranked) and when they get killed by someone they wish the killer death irl its just ...WOW thats why i never want to play anything higher than t6 again

[@stewenw4120]

Thanks for my weekly dose of "Ah thats why i don't play anymore"

[@muzallisam5068]

I bloody hate driving my f sherman nowadays. Asian server if filled with "dd go cap". Yes I'm a dd but I'm bigger then some cruisers and when I do spot they don't fire at the spotted targets.

[@eze8970]

t.y Flamu 🙏🙏- your Eagle didn't even go for one of the other caps.

[@cshan2313]

I always seem to have a poor game in a CV whereas if I play any other class (that isn’t a sub), I do pretty decently. Would be better to keep it that way?

[@Adesterr]

The thing with the fire chance... That Kurfürst is either a returning player or he spent money recently. That is the whole point of rng in freemium games: To reward you for comming back or for spending money. Not only WoWs, but almost any fremium game does this.

[@ShoGuygames]

Did anyone see the guns on the kremlin when flamu got him in his hydro... WTF... They were not even looking at him and then snapped to him instantly..

[@Y0urricane]

Haters will always hate... Tier 10 vs tier 11 isn't strong enough? U f..ed all defAA except last one. U got a lot of HE into your boat at start, so we can't see how much of AA left alive. The enemy carrier is 57+%. But yes, let's blame only the balance. By the way, if venezia hit u 6 times (full shots), could u survive? I think u'd have enough from 3-4 of them The only thing I agree with you, is that carriers have too much survivability. They must have detonation and less DCP

[@TyLockton]

The AA in AA destroyer stands for anally abused...

[@davidb3352]

Yes, carriers are designed for people that drown kittens as well as those people that are soooooooo bad that they're looking for ANY way to feel like they're not super terrible

[@butterflyeffect7851]

WG when give ship " full AA defences". It just gimmick we dont care your opinion

[@Pliskkenn]

I miss when DefAA caused the reticle to expand.

[@butterstulle1238]

It’s 2024 and nothing has changed…

[@mariuszsobieraj1208]

Flamu's motto should be: "I play WoWs so you don't have to".

[@wazdalos]

Could you pen his 25 mm with SAP? Not that it would have changed anything

[@jaywerner8415]

Pretty sure all sap has 32mm pen so yes.

[@leisureshoot]

all you needed to do was simple maneuvers, treat CV's like a sub.

[@florianbielawa2919]

Is sherman best coal ship right now? Since Marceau has those catapult shell arcs i dont feel as interested in it.

[@matthiasdarrington3271]

depends for what. In normals Sherman is pretty good, but it's probably the single worst ship apart from Khaba to get into CW.

[@jefff4848]

I have Marceau and can confirm. Shell arcs and long torpedo reload are off-putting. Thinking I may get neustrashimy next.

[@ExiledGundam]

wait for tromp?

[@ME262MKI]

Well gotta admit it, WG portrayed CVs inside their game as the most powerful naval unit, really well, like in real life

[@cookiecola5852]

really love the part where CV will build new aircrafts

[@MrBreakdownBoy]

That bit about CV's at the beginning was really rude...please do it again.

[@Hugzzi]

I find Sherman fire chance to be a myth also.

[@NimaShariatzadeh]

Hey Flamu, can you give the Udaloi a go? Just asking.

[@dislikecounter5191]

I had 250 shell hits with groningen no fires.

[@ottovonbismarck2443]

I wonder why you wonder ...

[@tomsmithie3917]

Yep. Just uninstalled the game again after days of getting smashed for 20k per drop by super carriers. In my frustration I got out my Worcester and re-speced it into AA, and it doesn't even stop the destruction. Games is over. Until a mode that doesn't involve submarines and carriers exists I will be out.

[@BasJon]

Nice game, a hard fought battle, as for full AA captain wise yes but also module 6 which is stupid too use on a gun boat but that also boosts the AA

[@jaywerner8415]

Yeah in total I think you can boost your AA by like 50%? 20% from captain skill, 20% from the module in slot 6 and 10% Def AA active. I might be off with math. But it does make a difference, at vs WEAK planes like Japan, Germany, and Russia.

[@crackaassedcracka]

CITADEL

[@VerrueckterKerl85]

the only ships with „good“ AA these days are Austin and the superMino.

[@tomagrezy1640]

They schould just buff AA and ad airstikes on every ship.

[@soldiert0144]

i used to be a DD main. but now i hardly ever play the class. now ive been playing CV's more and more. managed to grind to tier 10 on the US CV line and am at tier 8 on the JAP, GER, SOV, CV lines its just so much more fun to play. yea you still get bad games where the enemy CV will snipe you the entire game and there is nothing you can do to stop him (also when it comes to CV vs CV usually the first CV to get his attack off will win that fight as your now always going to be 1 attack behind and so he will most likely kill you before you kill him) but other than that so long as you avoid AA ships your unstoppable. so its safe to say ive now become a sort of CV main. if you cant beat them. join them i guess. its a sad thing to admit but if i didnt switch to CVs i would have stopped playing a while ago

[@senzubean27]

CVs are still the most broken part of the game, at least I can kill a sub mid game

[@snakeoo7ca]

CV is actually fun... dont hate bc you get killed 🤣

[@sagetaylor3546]

Thank you Flamu for reminding me why I uninstalled this game...

[@klegolas4088]

painful to watch AA DD vs CV

[@manoffire786]

i never have good fire rng in this ship

[@FancyaBevMate]

And again until WG re does the CV I won't spend a single penny on this title let alone play any random games...the company is broken just like it's game...Cheers

[@soldierxgaming8753]

AA dd cant fight what it was meant to fight? Lol

[@foxredwings]

Yes

[@windofchance2781]

I hate carriers and subs! who is me? like...

[@alphagale7981]

Carrier is a hit or miss either they are shit or their good there is no in between after getting midway and playing her for a few games I realise just how one sided it is when there is a good carrier player

[@Pepega_Ch]

Should've dodged better instead smh my head 😔😔😔

[@Rob.DB.]

Wow! to see "The " Flamu , struggle while try harding so much, really makes everything quite clear. Also providing evidence that he is actually human!!!

[@miked815]

I despise so much Cv and more so the people who choose to play that class. People who play cv have issues they need to seek help for.

[@ashleyphotog]

so sick of the game, sick of WG selfish arrogant profiteering at the expense of the game and the community

[@the_rainbow_one]

What's the best first coal ship to take? F.Sherman seems to be a funny gimmicky ship

[@maxgern9186]

Ey

[@kaalen24]

I bet if WG required a 50% winrate to use a CV 70% of them would magically vanish from servers. Think of how nice and refreshing it would be for their to be 70% less CV players...

[@ne0fenris]

i wish they would at least bring back the panic effect of df aa