"I don't think the average gamer will notice" I think the average gamer notices, but doesn't have the ability to communicate exactly what the issue is.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
Exactly, I know a few people like that.
@GeneralPretzle7 сағат бұрын
@@khatdubell I feel like it's also easy for people to assume the blame falls with their outdated hardware/console limitations.
@zainmalik96662 күн бұрын
It’s so crazy how people were recommending expensive 4k tvs with hdmi 2.1 bandwidth to take advantage of 4k120hz when the 9th gen consoles launched. Years later and your average unreal engine 5 title is running at 900p 30fps on these machines lmao.
@Rapunzel8792 күн бұрын
I've got a 4090 laptop (~ Desktop 4070 TI). There's no way I'm getting more than 60 FPS at 4K Ultra, RT off.
@Viilap2 күн бұрын
This generation of gaming is fuckd
@nBasterd2 күн бұрын
@@Rapunzel879 but you do get 4k120 in games older than 5years, right? So up until ps5 launch.
@stezarock2 күн бұрын
I thought Spider Man games had awesome graphics. I changed my mind
@tomthomas34992 күн бұрын
But but, muh fancy RT lightings 😂
@georgep.23522 күн бұрын
Studios should prioritize 60 FPS , no ghosting and no blur
@cxngo81242 күн бұрын
Yeah but they wont. Even Rockstar, with RDR2 had quite abit of blur and ghosting
@avelonzx2 күн бұрын
But then you get lower resolution textures and you golems will start posting "LOOKS LIKE PS3 LOLOLOL" in trailers of games, the developers can't win. You morons brought this on yourselves with your obsession with graphics.
@zainmalik96662 күн бұрын
@@cxngo8124rdr2 is the blurriest game ever made imo
@Drogoran2 күн бұрын
that would cost time and money so uh no
@TechnoMinarchist2 күн бұрын
Yes, and at native on the most common consumer hardware being purchased when the game is released.
@tanner58092 күн бұрын
I enjoyed playing Jedi Survivor and 100% it, but it did not need to be 135 gb when fallen order was 45 gb I think. I’m really not a fan of single player or even multiplayer games being over 100 gb.
@johnnyflannigan1362 күн бұрын
Great game ... I just played it on PS4 lol... They had to drop resolution to get it to run well but I enjoyed it .. though the ending wasn't that great
@fepethepenguin82872 күн бұрын
I was surprised how crisp that game looked . And that was just watching game play on U2b... Then we get mullet order recently, runs worse, and looks like PS3
@bjarnis2 күн бұрын
Every developer seem to go over to UE5, so doubt we will see below 100Gb in single player games for a long time.
@donkey_oaty2 күн бұрын
There should be a way to download the game at the resolution you want it. I imagine 4k textures are a big chunk of this.
@Billy-bc8pk2 күн бұрын
Unless it's a massive solar-system sized game, you're right, they do not need to be over 100gb. No Man's Sky puts a lot of these games to shame, looking a lot better (at least aesthetically) and being much larger. Even Star Citizen is only 125gb -- the fact Call of Duty games are twice or three times that size and nowhere near as big is just embarrassing.
@SamSpade9032 күн бұрын
The question people should be asking is why development costs have skyrocketed in recent years. Game quality and creativity hasn’t increased commensurate with increased costs. I would also caution anyone to argue that costs increased because of an increase in talent. “Talent” implies creativity, productivity, and/or innovation, qualities that aren’t readily apparent in general these days.
@georgep.23522 күн бұрын
100% this . Spiderman 2 costed 200$ million more than spiderman 1. Why?
@Khrist752 күн бұрын
@@georgep.2352 BS...200 millions is its whole budget...not the gap with the first episode.
@Gregoses2 күн бұрын
indeed, especially when 90% of natural game environments are made with free Quixel megascans assets
@carlschrappen97122 күн бұрын
Higher fidelity assets that take longer to create, and larger scopes, and bad management. Those are the major reasons.
@devinbonham30222 күн бұрын
@@Khrist75total budget of Spider-Man 2 = $315 million Spider-Man 1 = $100 million dollars. As far as I found in research these are the numbers. A roughly 215% increase from the original. Math wise it’s 3.15 * the original cost of production because they used 100% of the old budget.
@4589dude2 күн бұрын
The diminishing returns graph applies to graphics but not really to performance. I don't expect a big leap in visuals from the ps4 generation to the ps5, but I do expect a much larger leap in performance, especially in the CONSISTENCY of performance. Why are so many ps5 games still only "targeting" 60 fps but not always managing to hit it? And why do they need dynamic resolution scaling to be able to hit that fps target? This was understandably an issue for last gen, but we should be past this now.
@themightyant.2 күн бұрын
Last gen most games were 30fps and often a shaky 30fps. Thus gen most games hold a much more stable rate and all but a handful have 60fps options on console… that IS a big leap
@jace_albersКүн бұрын
@@themightyant. This is patently ridiculous the consoles arent twice as fast they are 6.5 times as fast try to game on a pc even a top of the line on from 2013 compared to a low end one from 2020 it will run those games at over 200 fps where the 2013 pc runs at 40
@4589dudeКүн бұрын
@@themightyant. the current Gen consoles run on hardware that's more than capable of running these games consistently at high frame rates. PC's with similar specs already do
@Kinslayu13 сағат бұрын
Unfortunately, there's plenty of room for devs to add more graphics (not much you'll notice but still costly in performance) so I don't think they'll start targeting 60 yet
@ayourmum852112 сағат бұрын
@@jace_albers I mean to be fair a low end pc is better than it’s ever been but no game that gets 200 fps on a 4060 doesn’t run well on ps5
@franciscobutte18 сағат бұрын
The more the technology grows the laziest the devs become. Technical limitation was a gift.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
This is exactly it. Seems like all they want nowadays is to offload everything to the hardware based automation like DLSS, AI and all that crap, which the end user has to end up paying for.
@nandoman47692 күн бұрын
I truly feel that devs are just going to keep doing this more and more until it becomes the norm. It’s so crazy how most modern triple A games genuinely look worse than games made 10 years ago because of all this fuzzy frame generation bs.
@bricaaron39782 күн бұрын
They will do whatever enough people throw Top Dollar at them to do. I don't want to hear people complaining about the very things they are funding with their own money.
@raheem-t8uКүн бұрын
@@nandoman4769 it's already the norm tho
@jkr9594Күн бұрын
Devs don't do this, or rather try not to. Executives do, and will do, as you said.
@proggz39Күн бұрын
It’s either this or basic graphics with frame pacing issues like Elden Ring. Most developers have completely forgotten or chose to forgo optimization
@matilozano96Күн бұрын
I don’t know if it’s even sustainable, honestly. The more insane hardware requirements get, the smaller the potential playerbase. Not everyone is gonna update hardware a the rate the requirements grow.
@brucepreston39272 күн бұрын
I never noticed all the issues with TAA until my buddy pointed them out to me while I was playing one day, and now I can't stop seeing them everywhere!
@jcdenton45922 күн бұрын
Games should be running on native resolution, upscalers are a plague.
@carontorliak27602 күн бұрын
Devs should be optimizing for native as well
@Krypto12112 күн бұрын
No, they really aren't. Most of the time, DLSS at 1440p is near indistinguishable from native resolution and uses less VRAM to do the same thing. That's a win for the gamer.
@Pårchmēntôs2 күн бұрын
@@Krypto1211 except you need an Nvidia card for DLSS. Not a win for the gamer when you’re forced to pay Nvidia prices. The gaming industry is using a proprietary feature as a crutch that not everyone has access to (console gamers for instance). FSR has abysmal ghosting, even XeSS looks better than that.
@Krypto12112 күн бұрын
@@Pårchmēntôs DLSS is built into RTX cards, so obviously you need one to use it. FSR and XESS are available to everyone.
@sithhunter9652 күн бұрын
Native res is too taxing for gamers to achieve 4k on their PC rigs. You would all have to buy expensive cards to be part of the pcmr.
@AsyntheticКүн бұрын
CDPR is moving to Unreal Engine because the entire team responsible for developing their in-house engine has left the studio.
@kruz3d5734 сағат бұрын
@@Asynthetic source?
@lopesmorrenofim2 сағат бұрын
@@kruz3d573 Source? Some random guy on twitter said so. I am deadass. Gamers thinking they know how games are done is still one of the funniest shit there is.
@digitaldream44772 күн бұрын
the order 1886 looked amazing on ps4, we got ps5 pro and still waiting for games like this
@PepicWalrus2 күн бұрын
don't make me sad reminding me what they took from us.. if any game of the PS4 era deserved a sequel it was 1886.
@jamesFX32 күн бұрын
it was, indeed. was kinda surprised they managed to make that game look that good while running on the ps4s hardware. The only thing I didn't like about that game was that they made it too on rails.
@chrisbrown1130962 күн бұрын
@@jamesFX3ironically I thought it being so linear would be a con. Replayed it recently and it was nice to have such a straight forward game with good atmosphere
@ggmgoodgamingmichael77062 күн бұрын
Add DRIVECLUB to the amazing list 😃
@FordHoard2 күн бұрын
@@chrisbrown113096 That's why I like Metro 2033 and Last Light better than Exodus. They're the perfect length.
@user-hc1oi2bq8u2 күн бұрын
I thought my eyes were just getting old when I started to notice some games were blurry.
@WayStedYouКүн бұрын
@@user-hc1oi2bq8u just go back and play an older game that was based around MSAA. FC4 vs FC6 for example
@vugololКүн бұрын
Going back and seeing games like Detroit Become Human running on base PS4 or Uncharted 4, hell they even unveiled and launched TLoU Part 2 on it first, it makes no sense that so many games are uglier and run terribly not just on "current gen" hardware but in some cases depending on the game, high end PCs that are much more powerful than said machines. Upscaling was sold as the savior of old hardware, instead it's being used as a crutch to make shit playable on new hardware. Another thing is shit like lumen being pushed much earlier than it should, when UE5 can't even handle streaming in worlds without stuttering, and the fact that studios are having to find a fix for it now instead of Epic themselves fixing is an absolute joke. EDIT: Also, I don't know if I'm wrong or not, but didn't we have a cost saving technology for geometry called Tesselation for nearly 2 decades now, yet devs seemingly forgot it existed? Instead you either get terrible pop-ins or in the case of UE5, nanite which is part of the stutter problem.
@charlestrudel830818 сағат бұрын
it would help if we had another engine beside unreal... problem is, its a huge expense that no one else want to help with.
@Dregomz0211 сағат бұрын
And now FF7R part 2 won't be able to run at all on my rx 5700 xt because it doesn't have RT cores despite game looking much much uglier than the part 1 or Crisis Core remake.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
Detroit become human is not a game, it's an interactive movie.
@Arms26 сағат бұрын
Nanite is literally just a fancy version of tessellation.
@yogiwp_2 күн бұрын
The following are non-negotiable: 1. 60fps min framerate, no exceptions. 2. Zero stutter. 3. Absolutely no ghosty/smeary/noisy upscaler. I refuse to believe we can't have these today. We HAD these 10 years ago!
@agusr32Күн бұрын
Play at low settings then if you want all of that. 10 years ago we didn't have the graphics we have today. 60 fps max at 1080p, baked lighting, lower res textures, etc.
@LtdJorgeКүн бұрын
@@agusr32 baked lighting looks better than RT, because RT is so expensive that it has to be downgraded so much to make it run online. Well, baked lighting is also RT, but offline, which means the quality can be much better due to no time budget constraints.
@agusr32Күн бұрын
@@LtdJorge Yeah, but you need to have static environments, and save a ton of files for the lighting. In open world games with day-night cycles + weather effects, baking lights is not ideal. Also, I don't think it is easy to maintain the lighting resolution for meshes of different scales. You might bake lighting with coarse resolution for buildings and terrain, and rely on cheap but nonrealistic methods to calculate lighting for smaller objects and moving meshes.
@ArchikuusКүн бұрын
@@agusr32 did you watch the video or just decide to post?
@agusr32Күн бұрын
@@Archikuus I watched the video and decided to post. Anything else? preferably on topic?
@SilverSpectre266Күн бұрын
The pure irony is that more tools were introduced to help assist and speed up the process of development, but at the same time all it did was actually hurt development instead. You have games from 10 years ago that hold up much better than games visually today because everything was working on organically, by hand, but now they have so many in-engine tools that were made to speed up the process, but just ended up costing them in the long run. Sure, doing this one thing with this one tool might help the product finish faster now, but it ends up breaking or causing so many issues down the line after release that its almost pointless because then you spend that post development time trying to fix it. Completely renders all those shortcuts pointless. All they are really doing with all these tools is bloating the file sizes of games.
@RageArtEnthusiastКүн бұрын
agreed. people keep glazing UE5 for its easy accessibility for devs. but overlook the clear problem with it just allowing laziness and over reliance on a game engine designed for a wide range of uses instead of dedicated engines that specialise in an area/genre.
@bb53072 күн бұрын
Epic has always put developers first and gamers last. Incentivizing developers to EGS with a lower cut when none of that matters to the regular gamer because it will be the same price anyway but now you have to use their store and can't use cool features like workshop, remote play, community controller presets etc. Same with the engine, they make it easier and less costly to make games for developers but gamers will just have to upgrade to the latest 5090ti super if you want playable framerates.
@imphonic2 күн бұрын
The options Unreal Engine gives us as developers are absolutely hard-shafted in one direction or the other: you either give players a decent experience and completely screw yourself as a developer, or you give yourself as a developer a great experience and completely screw half your potential playerbase (and the other half has to deal with horrible temporal smearing and/or upscaling from sub-1080p resolutions). There's no middle ground. It's infuriating because now with so many horrible AAA releases with horrible performance, quality matters more than ever, but with Unreal (which is what I've been using for the past few years) it's very difficult to deliver on the performance side. I'm experienced in programming so building a custom engine is probably within my reach, but still far from easy, not to mention having to rebuild all my tools from scratch, setting back my ship date by a few years, and crowdfund the ability to work on it full time and hire a graphics programmer for assistance (which I absolutely can't, I'd never be lucky enough to get the popularity needed to raise that much money).
@ramsaybolton91512 күн бұрын
This is a truly idiotic opinion.
@LardoAGКүн бұрын
It's ironic how Digital Foundry themselves never ever said that "UE5 and Epic are the problem", only highly regarded "investigative journalists" say that, citing DF.
@Extreme96PL6 сағат бұрын
@@LardoAG digital foundry run games in 4k on ultra on their high end PC with 4090 where these issues dont exist thanks to high res and love to comment how everything looks when they use high zoom so ofc they dont talk about these issues.
@PolnocneGranie2 күн бұрын
Year ago I got a gaming PC, been playing on 1440p monitor and resolution, and began seeing things that made me think my graphic card was acting up, but no, its just part of the experience now.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
Then you have me buying an NVidia graphics cared BECAUSE of DLSS... Never again u.u
@r.daneel.902 күн бұрын
Threat Interactive is tilting a lot of folks. And even the guys at DF are REFUSING to just talk about the subject, why. The amount of exposed people is incredible... Its true that publishers are largely to blame. But let's not ignore the fact that the lower echelons are also showing disproportionate indignation at the truth, this means something...
@Billy-bc8pk2 күн бұрын
Absolutely. Threat Interactive is the best KZbin channel on the platform related to gaming right now and it makes a lot of studios look like clowns.
@feelsDankMan_2 күн бұрын
Alex from DF is pretty open about his frustrations about UE5 stutter issues.
@Reverie_Blaze2 күн бұрын
Because he doesn't know what he is talking about. There were multiple actually professional developers debunking his claims. He has surface level understanding of Nanite, Lumen, LODs and other tech, and in many cases his conclusions are simply wrong.
@elk34072 күн бұрын
I'm gonna say right now, everything Threat Interactive says has truth to it.... but at the same time there's a lot of lies by omission and generally not telling the whole story. Lets talk about TAA, something Threat Interactive has talked about a lot because it makes games blurry and has artifacts compared to older AA methods. He has conveniently not mentioned the reason WHY we stopped using older methods. SMAA, MSAA, and SSAA are bloody expensive compared to TAA, and SMAA and MSAA don't necessarily have the bests= results with deferred rendering. FXAA was brought about to deal with the fact older techniques didn't play nice with deferred rendering but it had MORE ISSUES THEN TAA. We need a new solution better then TAA, yes. Game devs absolutely over rely and abuse the hell out of it. Older techniques are not the answer. I hope Threat Interactive helps push us into a better optimized era because its awful right now..... but take everything said there with a HEAVY dose of salt because its hella myopic
@DipJyotiDeka2 күн бұрын
@@Reverie_Blaze Haven't seen any "professional developer" with an actual product, that runs UE5 with Nanite, Lumen that runs 4k60 without upscaling.
@neerajvyas64622 күн бұрын
I played Mad max two days ago and let me tell you I was still in awe with how to graphics hold up and the visual style of the game I think that art style Matter more than photo realistic graphics.
@Blast13142 күн бұрын
The Upscalers have become crutches, look at UE5 games, they struggle on even High end rigs, you can barely get 60fps on all ultra with a 4090 in some games, but look at Indiana Jones, it’s beautifully optimized where you can run the game on a Laptop RX 6700 at 1440p low settings at 60-70fps
@thegreatimu2 күн бұрын
So if Indiana Jones team decides to make their game engine public/open sourced, you think NO ONE will make a single unoptimized game?
@valentinvas64542 күн бұрын
I've been playing Life is Strange Double Exposure lately and that title convinced me that UE5 is just a tool to make games with less effort more quickly. At least most of the time. Obviously it looks much better than earlier Life is Strange games but it still has very simple graphics by modern standards. And guess what? It still runs like absolute ass. I'm running it with an overlocked RX 6900 XT and it can't even maintain 50 FPS on high settings 1440p, let alone the highest "cinematic" settings. After SH2 remake this is the second game where performance is somehow even worse indoors than outdoors. How on God's green Earth can games like HFW, Last of Us Remake or Plague Tale Requiem and many more run miles better with way higher fidelity. Even an another UE5 title, Lords of The Fallen has much better performance.
@FordHoard2 күн бұрын
@@valentinvas6454 I hate most unreal engine 5 games. I was surprised though with how well Chivalry 2 is optimized on it though. And Codemasters seem to have improved the release of their WRC game. It's really not good for open world games though.
@DagobertX2Күн бұрын
When you use RT in that game it still drops down to 60fps and below with upscaled 4k with 4090.
@SuperLocrian2 күн бұрын
I recently played the original Alan Wake, and the baked-in lighting is amazing!!
@doanamo2 күн бұрын
Alan Wake runs and looks very poorly on PS5. It drops to pixalated 360p all the time during gameplay.
@SuperLocrian2 күн бұрын
@doanamo PC 😁
@cikame2 күн бұрын
I think it would help if he was a bit more matter of fact about presenting his findings, he gets progressively more worked up with every new video and it's not helping his case. Given the numerous UE5 games with weird issues and lack of shutdowns from other devs (that i've seen) i'm inclined to believe him, but i'm just the layman, i'm also on the side of reducing game budgets and having more reasonable hardware targets and it feels like UE5 is in the way of that. I first noticed what devs were doing with TAA in 2018 with The Crew 2, that was the first game i played that forced you to use TAA so naturally i wanted to fix the blurry image by turning it off, i did the config edit or whatever it was and parts of the graphics broke like shadows and reflections, they turned into a glitchy grainy mess, shortly after they released a patch which stopped you being able to remove TAA which while extreme is fine because the game looked horrible without it, but their insane and strong use of it caused the image to be blurry and in some cases warbly as the effects and some geometry like trees tried to reconstruct itself. I also noticed it in RE2 remake, except the option to turn off TAA was in the settings and caused Leon's hair to become a glitchy mess, the fact that this is STILL what it's being used for is ridiculous.
@mrxcs2 күн бұрын
I was a layman, and now I'm an indie dev. It's not just Epic fault, you would be amazed how many AAA don't do the basic of optimization, they just throw garbage mesh and think Nanite will solve it. Sometimes they don't use hardware lumen, just because is off by default, you just need to click a check button, it's beyond stupid.
@cikameКүн бұрын
@@mrxcs I remember when UE5 was first shown off and Nanite was presented as if you could stick original million polygon models in the game and it would just sort it out for you :|
@Arms25 сағат бұрын
@@mrxcs You're an indie dev and you believe AAA game dev studios don't do any mesh optimization? lol
@snagardev2 күн бұрын
I think the main problem is that "managers" that might not have "technical background" decide where to focus and what are the time lines, so I won't hold my breath that other studios will invest in what you shared in this video.
@nerdybrothers2 күн бұрын
Honestly, he’s a smart and talented kid, but I love how the “experts” out there have zero experience on how a development pipeline with 100s of people work.
@CrunchyBrownie52 күн бұрын
23:30 maybe they shouldn’t have fired their talent for disagreeing with them ideologically
@staxmcgee97602 күн бұрын
🎯💯
@GrimK77Күн бұрын
Epic is building UE not for Fortnite, but for Disney
@The-RejectКүн бұрын
It's one of those things that you notice it but you're not always sure what you're noticing.
@computron12 күн бұрын
I like how it all comes down to: "Give me money. Money me. Money now. Me a money needing a lot now." The best way to prove something is to just do it. Especially in the case of presenting one's theory as infinitely better. It's okay to be critical with the understanding that none of the software is as great as the marketing presents it to be.
@anonymousinfinido2540Күн бұрын
He did.
@LtdJorgeКүн бұрын
Where do you see him asking for money desperately?
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
Yeah dude the best way to prove something is to just do it, so he should up and make a AAA quality game without any funding, then he will have proven himself Mhmm! Why do people like you exist.
@Arms25 сағат бұрын
@@LtdJorge His other videos where he asks for money to develop a shitty version of a mesh triangle reduction tool which already exists.
@LS-tk7hpКүн бұрын
tbf epic is even bugging in fortnite, im on a 4090 and cant finish a second match on dx12 which is required for all of the max graphical settings like nanite and lumen lighting, without crashing, even then natively its really unoptimized and runs on 70-85 fps but can have heavy stutters, its also weird because all of this only happened with the last halloween update, eversince then i got crashes and worse performance, now im on dx11 and cant even use ray tracing, lumen and nanite
@johncrafton8319Күн бұрын
Sony and Microsoft: Our new console will handle 4K at 120fps for real next-gen graphics! Eight years later... Sony and Microsoft: Our new consoles will actually handle 4K at 120fps for REAL next-gen graphics! Eight years later... Sony and Microsoft: Real, native 4K at 120fps doesn't matter. It's all about our amazing AI processing for REAL next-gen graphics!
@Thedownliner20152 күн бұрын
This problem has now got developers creating games that will actually rely on upscalers as standard practice now rather than those being the tools of enhancement for the gamers systems. That's really bad.
@kebrus2 күн бұрын
Hey Luke, I don't know you, your video simply popped in my recommended. A bunch of what TI is saying is either not true or misleading, there are a LOT of inaccuracies in his research that many people tried to point out over his videos and he either ignores completely of brushes off as if it didn't matter anyway because "nanite bad", "epic bad". Let me know if you are interested in learning more, and I'll post some of stuff here.
@Arms25 сағат бұрын
Yup, TI is a walking example of the Dunning-Kruger effect. He knows just enough to convince regular gamers that he's an expert with more knowledge than render engine devs with decades of experience. His videos feed into the gamer outrage over TAA, and the fact that their gtx 1080s cant run games made in 2024-25.
@HeavyMetalSonicRM11 сағат бұрын
120fps should be the industry standard because persistence blur ruins everything and BFI is just a band-aid.
@cloverraven2 күн бұрын
Also. As far as Digital Foundry video on TAA, they spent 15 minutes highlighting what’s good about it. And 15 minutes highlighting its many flaws. So.
@NathanaelRouillard21 сағат бұрын
@@cloverraven yeah. When he started talking about the DF video as though it was sucking off TAA, I knew this kid likely wasn't worth listening to since he was incapable of presenting facts that I knew to be true, so wouldn't be able to trust that he's not misrepresenting anything else he says. No matter what else he says, whether or not it's accurate on an individual point, I can't trust his conclusions in the gestalt.
@maximusprime19949 сағат бұрын
There's a massive post on the UE5 subreddit responding to his most recent video (just look up threat interactive on UE5 subreddit if you're interested) Turns out the 'optimizations' he presented in the video are just standard practice when developing a game in UE5. He has no clue how to use Unreal Engine correctly so his results are inaccurate at best and deliberately misleading at worst. When I mentioned this response in the comments section of his video he removed my comment. Pretty much says all that needs to be said about this grifter. I'm surprised people are falling for this crap. He labelled Digital Foundry's TAA video as 'Ignorant' when Alex clearly pointed out there are benefits and issues with TAA and even said it should be an option to toggle off. He's clearly not arguing in good faith so DF shouldn't bother responding
@mikfhan14 сағат бұрын
"We use Unreal Engine" sounds to me like corpo speak for "our working conditions push experienced optimizers away, so we need new developers more than 60FPS". I wish AAA would just make shorter games with great pacing at higher base price, instead of microtransaction storefronts with filler content for +66% Steam discount.
@DoctorDeathFPS2 күн бұрын
Series x is a MASSIVE LEAP over one x it’s not even playable in most cases on new games! Go play any new COD on a last generation console. They shouldn’t even be allowed to sell it for last gen it’s that bad!
@Void-uj7jd12 сағат бұрын
I noticed lots of ghosting in Black Myth it was absolutely fucking horrific, everything just looks like it's fizzing. Refunded it.
@koob1413Күн бұрын
the game at 10:44 is DokeV by Pearl Abyss.
@Gregoses2 күн бұрын
its just funny how he always talks about Threat Interactive as a company while its clearly just him, or am i wrong?
@PaulSmith-nd7gd2 күн бұрын
Definitely just the one guy. He always says “his studio” but there’s no external funding and no other team members. And no game or preview of a game. I think he makes valid critiques of TAA and unreal but also misses some critical trade offs. It’s a very surface level and one-sided overview with lots of spin. The “our studio” spiel is the cherry on top 😂
@Chris-ik2jp2 күн бұрын
@@PaulSmith-nd7gd I agree with you. The Dunning Kruger effect is on display.
@SoulbentAnime2 күн бұрын
@@Chris-ik2jp not if he's right about TAA and unreal
@HenrichAchberger2 күн бұрын
@@SoulbentAnime no guy seriously has danning kruger effect. Thing is he hasnt made a thing, not a game or a tech demo, literally all he does he uses intel analysis tool on a game and complains. His optimization video was really shallow only showing insanely badly optimized scene and with few super simple very basic techniques he easily made it better. but that thing really works on people that really dont understand stuff, they just see 2x better fps. If he made different rendering engine or rendering plugin that would speed up rendering, I would have different opinion. yeah taa has its tradeoff, but if it was really that bad, not the whole game industry would use it. Different thing is that devs force lumen, nanite and raytraced shadows in games, just because its enabled in ue5 settings by default. Also heard his discord has cult-like following where he bans everyone who even tries to tell something different or ask questions.
@SoulbentAnime2 күн бұрын
@@HenrichAchberger that's not dunning kruger effect. The threat interactive guy is unlikeable, comes off as really know it all and whiny but he is right about several things. He's not completely full of crap. He's got some points like how TAA is terrible. I've been saying that way before he was probably born. Also you don't need to have made a game to critique. We wouldn't be able to criticize anything if we went by that metric. I don't need to have made a game to say that a game sucks, I just need to play it. If he's right about some things, (which he is) then your argument doesn't hold as much weight.
@FeelingPoyChina15 сағат бұрын
we all jumped from 1080p to 4K way too fast without waiting for hardware to catch up for some reason 1440p just didn't roll off the tongue for casual consumers and 4K was the MAGA of resolution names. we needed at least 10 years of peaceful 1440p gaming AND TV.. before even thinking about moving to 4K now everything is messed up and no one knows where to start fixing it all
@Gaming_Legend219 сағат бұрын
AC Unity has such an impressive looking lighting because they baked everything and set it to one specific time of the day to make it work becuase they couldn't figure out a way to make a day night cycle that looked as pretty, obviously the textures and models leave a lot to be desired, but in the interiors it still looks as good or better than current games with half of the hardware, i wish they had this type of non temporal bullshit for STATIC maps
@ScytheNoire2 күн бұрын
I started watching Linus when he was doing videos out of some back room at NCIX. Of course, I'm Canadian and middle aged, so I used to shop at NCIX.
@praisetheoak2 күн бұрын
It's like we went full circle, from using dithering to simulate blur and shade on old CRTs, to using dithering again to simulate blur and shade on modern TVs because of TAA 🤣
@puckettjoe232 күн бұрын
It would be amazing if we could unblurr the lines between advertising bs and blatant lying.
@abdelilahelharchi81732 күн бұрын
Dude had the time of his life making this video.
@AlyxSharkBite-200016 сағат бұрын
There is this big thing in Software Development called MVP (Minimum Viable Product) that is a business model for just get it out the door doesn't matter how good it is. This also plays into it imo
@toadintheh0le22 сағат бұрын
Luke uploads a video about graphics in 1080p. So those of us with large 4k monitors can't see shit anyway
@ragingmonk60802 күн бұрын
People miss the point. TAA is an Nvidia product that was adopted by the industry. Then Nvidia came up with DLSS to fix the TAA issue. But to use the DLSS you had to buy a new RTX card. I am not defending Epic with UE5, they took the bait. But so did CDPR when they teamed up with Nvidia on 2077. If you trust Nvidia with anything. Wear a motorcycle helmet when you go outside. One small bump to the head and you could be done.
@dariusrosso37832 күн бұрын
The best thing is that the 3000 series came with DLSS 2.3 but for DLSS 3.x you need the 4000 series and it's therefore much better. DLSS 4.x will be exclusive to the 5000 series and so on. So NVIDIA found a way to monetize patches.
@ragingmonk60802 күн бұрын
@@dariusrosso3783 "NVIDIA found a way to monetize patches." 👍🤣🤣
@DagobertX2Күн бұрын
Yeah, but somehow people missing the point. This guy is like musk and his kind. Being very sure about what he is talking about and for a lot of people that's enough who aren't in the field and don't know if it's true or BS/half BS. Now everyone parrots his talk. "Everything is Epic's fault because they invented TAA, Unreal bad."
@gruntaxeman3740Күн бұрын
I remember that TAA was Crytek algorithm found from Crysis 2. Funny thing was that Crysis 2 didn't have as sharp image as in first Crysis that used MSAA.
@LtdJorgeКүн бұрын
@@gruntaxeman3740 Crysis 2 had MSAA, tho. However, Crysis 1 let you choose crazy levels of MSAA.
@catriona_drummondКүн бұрын
A more stylized approach to graphics gives games more longevity is an old lesson from the MMORPG world. And these days as developers are all being pushed into live services that longevity is a design trent. We need more single player, non-live-service games to push the boundaries again.
@ferinzz2 күн бұрын
I'm starting to think this is why people are reporting feeling sick or getting headaches from games whne they used to be fine.
@themightyant.2 күн бұрын
Threat Interactive is knowledgable about theory, and young and idealistic, but SO MANY devs have called him out as someone who doesn’t have much real world experience and doesn’t understand the trade offs and sacrifices involved in shipping ACTUAL games. In a perfect world with unlimited budgets and timescales he might have a point. But it’s like being lectured by someone still in school with no real world knowledge. But his worst trait is he doesn’t take any criticism well, even from devs with decades of experience he assumes he is right. It’s a dangerous combination
@Arms25 сағат бұрын
Dunning-Kruger effect.
@CrashD6Күн бұрын
In an era where graphics have plateaued, why would anyone buy a new console or a new GPU? Oh right, it's because the games run worse while looking the same! Big companies can't make money selling hardware if what you already have can run every game out there.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
Because the games aree nowadays programmed with offloading all the optimization on the hardware's automated processes.
@kodaiyoungСағат бұрын
Threat Interactive is making a good job calling out all the BS that is going on in the industry, to the point that he is already hurting some devs egos.
@rudyv19722 күн бұрын
I'm now used to not owning games, game publishers are going to have get used to the fact that I'm not paying $70+ for a broken/unoptimized GAME RENTAL!!
@Steve-xh3byКүн бұрын
I've been gaming since the 1970's. I'm also a retired software engineer who worked part of my career in the gaming industry. "30 FPS is unacceptable" is the most laughable nonsense. Young gamers have their expectations way out of whack, and in a way that doesn't even matter. We'd been watching movies at 24 FPS for decades. It was completely fine at that rate. Anything over that is gravy. 45-60 FPS should be all that is ever necessary unless you are an elite competitive gamer. Even then, there has been scientific testing showing the elitist of the elite can't notice any difference between 90-100 FPS and 300 FPS. Most of us in most games should be fine with 30-60 FPS. If you are not, you are just making stuff up to get mad about. There is no noticeable difference to the eye in the 45-100 FPS range.
@ContrastCopy2 күн бұрын
I’m not going to act like I understand one fourth of what he’s saying. But, I get the gist.
@SwizNizzle2 күн бұрын
As an ordinary gamer who doesn't know anything about this stuff, I was appalled at the MHWilds PS5 visuals during the beta they ran. It genuinely looks and runs worse than MHW (6yo game btw). I'm not sure if it's due to things that this video illustrates or if its just because it isn't finished yet. I'm praying for the latter.
@shepard212 күн бұрын
@@SwizNizzle as a monster hunter fan. i just hope my 6700xt can run it atleast 60fps 1080p.
@QuintinHowellКүн бұрын
As a born PC player, on console I always go with 60fps performance mode to reduce risk of the controller physically entering the game via the display device
@SAGERUNE4 сағат бұрын
Im glad you said that about CDPR, because im often thinking about how much of a waste it is to abandon red engine when they put so much time into it and to my mind it seems fine? Maybe the speed of the UE5 tools are just too appealing as well as the familiarity for new hires, that and customer service...its pretty brutal knowing that UE really has cornered the market in such ways, and feels so far ahead. Almost makes me wish fortnite was never successful. Sigh...
@breezyillo21012 күн бұрын
Baby Linus jump scare made me feel each and every one of my decades
@smileydude12Күн бұрын
See this is why I have a problem with upscaling and frame generation in general. It becomes a selling point for hardware making that more expensive overall while at the same time, everything said in this video. They aren't optimizing for native resolutions which should be the first priority. I don't wanna use DLSS or FSR if I don't have to.
@CRISTODEAK2 күн бұрын
Dude's face looks HD. Uncanny.Optimized.
@shinichiizumi22422 күн бұрын
his face hasn't fully rendered yet
@Bassnova15 сағат бұрын
We are in the blurry generation
@kz3dart2 күн бұрын
When i watch that video i had deja vu from 'Normal Map Era' There are many types of normal maps Object space, Word space and Tangent space which is most consuming so You should use it only on "main/dynamic objects" but after a 3-4 years no one use different NM types, in all games, apps, we use only Tangent space because its easier and "future proof" but also kill performance .
@fishman21-f5b2 күн бұрын
can we remove blur and ghosting
@Umbra_TuSlayer2 күн бұрын
So how does Unity compare in this regard?
@moedelagarza91802 күн бұрын
Games must be a lot harder to optimize nowadays because a lot of studios aren’t doing it
@PashaAlex02 күн бұрын
Maybe this guy's way of pushing his message isn't great, but he does validate this growing frustrations some of console and PC gamers have with UE games and the insane system requirements new projects have now... sadly though, nothing gonna change, upscalers will be the key tool for making these games playable in the first place. I remember first time seeing the worst smeering of TAA in person in the game Biomutant, it was so ugly I just couldn't accept it.
@soldat88hun15 сағат бұрын
i don't know how much of an average gamer I am but I noticed these, I just didn't know what they were.
@AlessaBaker2 сағат бұрын
None of us accept Threat Interactive. Their posts have been constantly criticized and they're not listening.
@clsd8818 сағат бұрын
Graphics in my opinion are important in some games but not others. Whether you're for more photorealism or you really don't care. We should all agree that games need better optimization, not short cuts.
@cameronbrown92662 күн бұрын
I played resident evil 4 on a 1080p 27” monitor and was not happy with the TAA results. I then turned off the TAA and ran the game with no anti-aliasing at all and was shocked how good the game looked once off. Yes there were some jaggies, but the clarity was well worth the blurry mess of TAA
@dolan_plzКүн бұрын
But what does he suggest? 😂 DLSS is better than TAA almost all the time and it's getting better with each iteration. So what does he suggest instead of TAA? MSAA is expensive, FXAA is obsolete and ugly and shimmery, SMAA is still insufficient though better (even at 4K with SMAA there is shimmer and the more factors you apply, the more expensive it gets). Or no AA as some madmen suggest? TAA is used because it preserves creative intent. Devs hate when the image is unstable and shimmery. It ruins the art work. Also, it looks more filmic/cinematic. DLSS (or equivalent) is cheap and looks the best. That's where we are heading. The egregious examples of ghosting and smearing you showed are really the outliers of games with outdated DLSS dlls (or poorly implemented and tested implementations); or TAA with purposefully low frame rates. TAA looks better with better frame rate (more previous frames to work with to reconstruct the present frame). Yes, TAA can be that bad if the frame rate is low or if the devs want it to be blurrier rather than shimmery, like in case of RDR2 - they wanted it to look like that - check out the DF tech review of that game. Again - what does he suggest exactly? 🤔
@vault29aКүн бұрын
he is grifter, nothing more.
@dolan_plzКүн бұрын
@@vault29a he indeed seems like one... asking for support, money, subs, without any proposed alternative, and quite a lot of people gobble it up... again 😀"you convinced me" they write 😀 how did he convince them exactly? what did he suggest instead except for 'donate cuz we will TRY to do it better'. I bet 90% if them didn't even know what he was talking about most of the time
@MLWJ199313 сағат бұрын
There ARE ways to not use TAA & get relatively low shimmering, they however require lots of work, a forward rendering pipeline (forward+ nowadays), rely on super sampling to some degree (because indeed, SMAA isn't all that great) & careful material authoring that'll get exceedingly harder to do the larger the development team gets. In short: it's probably not feasible in lots of instances.
@N3G4T39 сағат бұрын
He has other videos that cover optimizations in practice.
@Arms25 сағат бұрын
@@N3G4T3 Yes, and the "optimization" he does is extremely surface level and is based off a false premise.
@af43962 күн бұрын
Aside from overreliance on upscalers and terrible hiring practicing and management, another big issue is that we went' from 1080p 30fps standard (with some impressive 60fps games) to jumping all the way to "4K" 60 this generation. That's just not going to happen. With modern technology cycles, you cannot increase the resolution 4x, increase the framerate 2x and expect to see something like a 2x graphical leap as well (especially when part of that "leap" is supposed to be RT). But here I am, playing Doom Eternal on high settings at 60fps and 1440p on a first gen 1500x Ryzen CPU and a RX 570 8gb card. With the same set up I am running CS2 at 1440p on low settings, BUT it looks great even on low and, aside from Astrobot, I have no seen physics (especially fluid dynamics) so good. Not in any UE5 game, not in any COD game, not in any Frostbite game. CS2 and Astrobot are the most impressive "next gen" games I have seen, and I can run them on way worse hardware than the current gen console. This is because of 3 reasons. 1) Passionate developers 2) quality engines 3) I'm not targeting 4K. Obviously Astrobot is only on my PS5, but it's running at almost native 4K just because it can. It's so well optimized. But I'm sure I could run it at 1440p on close to the same settings on my PC if it existed. It's stupid for games to be designed and targeted for 4K. Target 60fps first, graphics second, and put the resolution where it falls but try to render natively. This logic doesn't always work, since many UE5 games STILL run at sub 1080p on Series X and PS5, but that's not because the graphics are so good, it's because the engine is f***ed. UE gets so much credit, but it's always the worst performance to features ratio engine out there. Source 2 and ID Tech are MUCH more impressive engines.
@Arcangel2992Күн бұрын
Hate TAA, hate forced upscaler. Simple as.
@Lobos22220 сағат бұрын
Tod Do : 16x times the details. Tod Do Not : 32x bug fixes.
@Faceplay22 күн бұрын
One things for sure this guys never getting a project off the ground. He has less chemistry than an AI robot.
@geordiejones56182 күн бұрын
Yeah if it isn't the lack of self awareness, he just seems like he'd be annoying to work with if you have any creative differences whatsoever.
@MR3DDev2 күн бұрын
What you all need to understand is these things are done because whatever you believe it or not, people want more high fidelity graphics. It is how they sell games to the mainstream. We have reached a diminishing returns when it comes to graphics and that is why these techniques are implemented. Are the good? No. I actually rather have higher FPS than eye candy, but the only way they can sell a console to normies is through higher fidelity graphics.
@feelsDankMan_2 күн бұрын
DF video on TAA is much better, it explains better, provides historical context and better arguments for TAA and against TAA.
@718Hokage2 күн бұрын
Zoomers prefer concise, confirmation-biased content over factual information.
@kaloryfer999992 күн бұрын
And that's why they refuse to even mention Threat Interactive's arguments?
@feelsDankMan_2 күн бұрын
@@kaloryfer99999 They do mention issues with TAA ?
@KohdyMcintyreКүн бұрын
Optimizing shaders please wait.......
@sooz609216 сағат бұрын
So funny because the game ends running like crap anyways.
@florisbackx17442 сағат бұрын
31:47 there will never be 'hope' if the market choses to consolidate to one solution. The whole take away from this should be that there need to be alternatives making it possible for developers to use the solution which fits best with what their specific game needs. Or create their own solution/engine (fork). 36:24 No, the opposite is true. When everybody uses one product things will standardize to kind of fit the 'general needs' and will change the way people work instead of change the tools. That is exactly why the problems stated in this video exist.
@kamikaze000073 сағат бұрын
Let me make it easier to understand if the video was too complicated for some folks. The guy is exposing the fact that development studios are making bank by rushing out releases and saving time by throwing out game optimization and replacing it with garbage make-up for your game's "next-gen graphics". The one who has to shoulder the cost of it all is YOU, because you have to buy more and more expensive hardware just so it can run all that lathered on make-up on top of the game's graphics at a lower and lower framerate and resolution. He is showing here that the truth is that dev studios can actually just not rush out releases, properly design and optimize a game, and not replace it with garbage make-up, and your current hardware can still actually run "next-gen games" at decent fps and resolutions. The need to upgrade hardware was partly a huge lie.
@marukasudras174022 сағат бұрын
This sounds like my dad describing the two ways to upgrade a part or you car you can go through and meticulously upgrade and replace every part the is connected say the engine you go down to the drive train, diff, transmission, clutch and etc and you'll be all the better for it and it will run better than ever or you have it so it just runs just well enough that it runs either for better or worse and now you have a hand full of bolts left over so you just ignore that rattle while going down the highway
@mrteaggКүн бұрын
Game optimization is a crutch that was invented because of weak perfomance.
@CharlesVanNoland2 күн бұрын
I believe that multisampling would be way better for resolving the pixel-crawl on Nanite's tiny triangles, instead of TAA.
@Lauren_C16 сағат бұрын
Multisampling does’t work great on modern Deferred Shading engines (which is why it fell out of favor), and the high poly density of today’s games would make it extremely expensive, even if it worked correctly. MSAA is pretty much dead.
@CharlesVanNoland13 сағат бұрын
@@Lauren_C Deferred rendering doesn't work great with transparency either, so the problem to my mind isn't multisampling, it's deferred rendering. Forward+ is the way, just do a depth prepass first to prevent occluded geometry from wasting shader compute when rasterizing materials.
@Lauren_C13 сағат бұрын
@ Well, Deferred Shading is only one problem with using MSAA in modern games. The others, are the geometry density (which will make MSAA a lot more expensive than in past games), and that MSAA alone doesn’t touch shader aliasing, which is kind of a big deal nowadays.
@MyrmidonsКүн бұрын
This is pretty much what Ubisoft did with AC Syndicate. 60fps 4K whatever but you can hardly see any difference 😂. Luke didn't comment on that...
@nosult32202 күн бұрын
hold on video games for the next 2 years AI is here.
@timmygilbert41022 күн бұрын
Mom, I'm being quoted in a threat interactive video 😂
@MeCrazy5162 күн бұрын
is this why i need like 120+ fps for game to look nice now
@edisjdКүн бұрын
I don't mind 30fps depending on the game, if the game drops in res a lot to hit 60fps I will use 30fps mode for example on ff7 or Callisto protocol
@screaminjesus14 сағат бұрын
jedi survivor still runs like garbage, the patches improved it somewhat, but they didn't even come close to completely fixing the stuttering issues
@qadi7962 күн бұрын
I played the jedi gamesfor the first time, and suvivor was still quite buggy and looked off at times, fallen order was a smooth run all the way through
@viktortheslickster582418 сағат бұрын
It's also a question of talent. All very well saying games should run faster but it takes technical knowledge and experience to do this. Game devs don't all have PhDs and imagine often the organisational structure is an obstacle to creating highly optimised games
@pedroabreumaia4774Күн бұрын
Most people discussing the fall of graphics and the unreasonable increase for the quality and the performance of said graphics lack the understanding of the why it has happened and been happening. TAA is not at fault. It can worsen the situation, but it was a reasonable solution to aliasing on the 8th generation consoles(that had a lot of memory, but mediocre gpus and horrible cpus). It also could be used as denoiser in several processes in the pipeline, further saving computational time. The move for Unreal Engine is also at fault, but it didn't come from nowhere. The cost of developing a triple AAA game skyrocketed, many studios could not maintain their own tech, so their teams move to third party engines(Unreal, Cryengine, Unity, etc). Those engines aren't bad, but aren't made for what most of those studios want to use them for either. That's when the studios should use the acess to the engines source code(that they all pay for) to make it fit their needs. But here comes the catch, they left(if it even existed to begin with) their own tech because they could not maintain/upgrade it, so how could they change it to fit or fit better? There's still a lot of technically competent games being made, but the vast majority are now being made team that have the expertise and their own tech. There where always a gap between those teams, but now it feels like it is an abyss, and an insurmountable one.
@screaminjesus14 сағат бұрын
yeah I agree with some of what he says, but I can't get onboard with the argument that TAA is the cause of these problems. There are legitimate reasons why it's used. It's much better than FXAA, MSAA just isn't a viable option with modern lighting engines, and supersampling is way too performance intensive.
@Gatitasecsii11 сағат бұрын
If that was true, then they should manage their investments better. You have AAA games that cost hundreds of millions of dollars going the easy route, where is all that moneyy going to?
@pedroabreumaia477410 сағат бұрын
@screaminjesus To be fair, I never said it was the problem, just part of it. I even pointed out why(in my opinion at least) it became so used. MSAA is a possibility even today, but the cost on every type of denoiser for various effects, plus the extra time to integrate it all, made it hard to justify to most studios(I belive Forza Horizon still use it primarily and looks good).
@pedroabreumaia477410 сағат бұрын
@Gatitasecsii Of that front, I can not comment on, as I am not in the industry(video game), and everything I could possibly say about would be just an opinion based on some outside perspective. I, however, am a software developer (and had some interest in computer graphics in college). From that perspective, it is simply perplexing that most games aren't developed with agile software development methods, which means it is really hard to shift their directions once their development starts. Any heavy alterations can really impact the cost and schedule of the project. Capcom has started to try and do agile development with some success, so 🤞 the industry will catch up. As for the cost, it is to be expected. Games now are huge projects with thousand plus workers between programmers, artists, writers, etc. Any project that size, lasting form years would cost 10s of millions of dollars at the minimum. In a country like the US, that cost can easily reach for the 100s of millions.
@dking2436Күн бұрын
Todd also said “16 times the detail”
@danisaksson321422 сағат бұрын
Development costs of video games have sky rocketed? Maybe the marketing for Triple-A titles has...