Fan Design in The Rise of Skywalker? Hard to say.

[@nefariousgremlin7554]

I highly appreciate your maturity on this matter but I still prefer your design personally

[@bradhedgehog12]

nefarious gremlin I’m with you. And I hope they better Dang not Steal his design. I be real mad as f”ck

[@typhoonoftempest]

@@bradhedgehog12 would be nice if they did they would get in contact with him and post his name on the credits (and drop a chunk of change on his lap)

[@bradhedgehog12]

typhoonoftempest agree. And the y wings we saw? Too bad it was not Henry’s

[@toastedzen]

Agreed. EC's looks more balanced. I really don't like the TROS Tie. It's rather ugly... like, hey an ugly!

[@bradhedgehog12]

Timothy Dunlap Yeah

[@drewbryk]

Every time I see your tie variant, I imagine being an imperial ranger patrolling the outer Rim - cracking the atmosphere of a mossy, overgrown planet inbound for fuel and lodging. Something about it just gets me thinking about star wars in a very specific way. "I like to set down in the morning, local time. When you're a pilot, you have to make your own sunrise. Never got used to waking up in the dark."

[@Toon_Lucario]

Andrew Bryk what I imagine is “Bein a Vector Ranger’s a good job mate. It’s a tough job, out of doors, and I guarantee you might go angry, because at the end of the day until there are two people left in the galaxy some faction is gonna want another faction dead.” *cuts to the ranger on a mountain looking over a rebel base* “I think his mate saw me.” *blaster fire* “yes, yes he did” *shows him brutally murdering a Bothan spy* “Feelings! Mate the only people with feelings are the ones who bludgeon their wives to death with a Dejarik trophy. Vector rangers have standards. Be polite. Be efficient. Have a plan to kill everyone you meet.” *camera cuts*

[@inferno769]

@@Toon_Lucario No dad I'm a ranger, not a crazed gunman. One's a job and the other's a sickness. Dad, dad can you just put mom on the phone...

[@tragedyplustime8271]

"God I'm good at bein' a ranger. Beep, BEEP!"

[@SHDUStudios]

I think you need to write a book, dude. That was beautiful.

[@darkninjacorporation]

I love the concept of frontier outposts in Star Wars. All the galaxy spanning conflict tossed out, boiled down to these tiny little blips of influence in the middle of nowhere. No huge imperial fortresses, just a small bunker with a walled-courtyard and a handful of custom fighters like these. Maybe a speeder tank too. The imperials there might be very different from those in the greater Empire. Makes for a better story imo.

[@techticianlarsproductions6180]

Idc, the Vector looks and feels cooler

[@georgeofhamilton]

It's more industrial sounding.

[@techticianlarsproductions6180]

That and it actually had some thought put into the design to make it function better

[@georgeofhamilton]

@@techticianlarsproductions6180 We don't know that the canonical fighter doesn't have design as thorough.

[@techticianlarsproductions6180]

@@georgeofhamilton fair enough, though a lot of them haven't really had much more than something strapped on to make it different recently

[@georgeofhamilton]

@@techticianlarsproductions6180 Yeah, I agree.

[@boi905]

I love the cockpit design of the official one. reminds me of the TIE-D from Rogue Squadron.

[@goodmind4940]

Automated TIE Droid?

[@boi905]

Андрей Шурочка yes. It was like a tie interceptor but smaller and WAY more maneuverable. They were only on the final level of Rogue Squadron that took place after RotJ, facing off against the world devastators on Mon Cala.

[@jessehorn6180]

Are you going to make more fan made Tie Variants? That's my Tie Dagger, Thanks for mentioning my Tie Dagger, and mentioning me.

[@dbzdanman]

Way ahead of your time

[@crgkevin6542]

So, the on obvious question then is: What is your take on this whole thing?

[@jessehorn6180]

Kevin Norris it just came to me I guess

[@jessehorn6180]

@@senorspook6279 Thank you

[@teslashark]

You keep uo your work too!

[@KEVMAN7987]

It's not a ripoff, every shape of tie-fighter panels has been imagined by fans, from triangles to rhombuses. No matter what shape Lucasfilm chose, some fan would have already made the shape.

[@Necrometalfist]

True, and whatever some fan thinks they've originally come up with Lucasfilm has already seen it in multiple versions from their own designers.

[@Cleptro]

This is what I initially thought, and somewhat still do. However, their use of fan designs without proper credit in comics is undeniable and all but unforgivable. So I don't know anymore.

[@katraconnor8451]

@@Cleptro "their use of fan designs without proper credit in comics is undeniable and all but unforgivable" fanart to an existing IP has no IP copyright protection. By designing something based on someone's else's IP you are infact copyright infringing "yourself" and the owener of the IP retains all rights to appropriate your design for their IP. Its perfectly legit and an important aspect in protecting copyright. because nobody should be able to profit off the back of the original IP, and thats what youd kinda do by being credited for designing something in someone elses intellectual property.

[@xavi-kun]

Hm... what if... *C U B E*

[@bradhedgehog12]

And guys I may believe That Henry Did this Tie before the Dagger. I hope my belief is true.

[@SchneeflockeMonsoon]

Your honor is that of a true Klingon, and your mind that of a Chiss.

[@andrewtrenkel]

one hell of an analogy

[@techticianlarsproductions6180]

Damn wasn't expecting something like that today

[@geegee952]

perfectly said

[@typhoonoftempest]

Until the end of TIME ITSELF will they sing of EC Henry and the analytical maturity he righteously wrought onto the internet

[@CONSOLETRUTH2]

KA' PLAH

[@2bricks]

My feeling is that the concept artists at Lucasfilm must have so many cool images from fan designs floating around in their subconscious that probably dozens of fans inadvertently had huge impacts on things we see on screen. As someone who has worked for a big studio doing animation in the past, I know how artists get really jazzed up about cool new discoveries online, and we would constantly share tons of different little gems with one another, get excited and dissect them - there is no way that some of those things didn't wind up influencing my work as much as I tried on a conscious level to avoid it.

[@fuzzyhead878]

And honestly you have so many fanworks and art in his digital age that coincidences are bound to come up from time to time. Everyone these days has access to tools and tutorials to make their own art and creations. And, honestly, this day and age, its nearly impossible to have a 100% original idea. Even more to the point it can become very difficult and fuzzy to point out whether you made something on your own or inadvertently copied someone else but with your own spin on things. Your original idea may have actually been heavily influenced by something you saw in passing at some random moment, and you’d never realize it.

[@dramonmaster222]

Hm. I still like yours better though.

[@bradhedgehog12]

Kevin Jones personally I hope Henry doesn’t change the wing stands in this. I believe he got to that first. Did he?

[@MeisterSchwabbo]

Really? I like the cockpit section of ECs more but the rest? The rest goes to TROS versions...

[@cormoran2303]

@@MeisterSchwabbo For me every element of his version looks much better. I really dislike the extra triangles on the ROS version

[@Nugcon]

same

[@mada1241]

Yeah, his design has more detail, feels, in all honesty, more true to TIE design philosophy and also to star wars cannon, with the heavy use modified WW2 weapons platforms.

[@_KungFuBarbie_]

EC Henry: "I'm pretty sure Lucasfilm didn't steal my design." Random Internet People: "LUCASFILM STOLE IT!!!" EC Henry: ...

[@_KungFuBarbie_]

@James Coombs That's besides the point but yeah.

[@ximthedespot4673]

There has been cases of Lucasfilm stealing fanart for their comics. Eckhartsladder does a couple videos on this.

[@stormtrooperanimations3241]

Nope... disney not

[@Tbug20]

I like how you included the detail of having internet people blaming Disney instead of Lucasfilm. No, Disney did not "ruin" Star Wars, it was Lucasfilm, they made all the creative decisions.

[@_KungFuBarbie_]

@@Tbug20 what?

[@superjesse645]

Honestly, your design looks better. The Dagger's wings look weird.

[@Ostermond]

Jesse Isbell Absolutely agreed. The Dagger’s wings look too far forward.

[@schwarzerritter5724]

So does the cockpit.

[@devinoakley4063]

@@Ostermond I imagine a pilot would prefer the better field of view that comes with having the wings set further back, as well.

[@ChrisDouglass2141]

@@devinoakley4063 or the wings completely backwards like the point of the triangle at the back

[@Danjiano]

It also just looks more robust.

[@draege626]

It still amazes me that people assume a single concept or idea never occurs to anyone else "Simultaneously". Thoughts aren't always as unique they appear. Awesome design though EC

[@taylormakaiknightburleson]

Literally the Definition of the Phrase "Great mind think alike"

[@stephennelson4954]

Hey if Lucasfilm was going to seek inspiration they couldn't find much better than you.

[@jtomos]

Fractalsponge and EC Henry are the top notch of SW (visual) fan-art. They should have been contracted to recent SW products.

[@teslashark]

@@jtomos Disney claims all rights to fanworks, they have been legitimately lifting fanart to sell on merchandise for years - most widely known was a Chip & Del design taken from a Japanese artist.

[@imperialsecuritybureau6037]

I wish they’d steal designs from Fractalsponge... EC Henry and him are top-notch fan designers and really know how to make a cool _and_ functional looking ship, which is really severely lacking over at Disney in some cases. At the very least we should get to see some of Fractalsponge’s Imperial Death Wedges littered among the monotonous ISD fleet. Seriously why are they the only capital ship in the whole fleet when they’d only need to pay Fractal a few thousand dollars a piece for his other designs and it would make the fleet go from “oh it’s the Imperials I guess” to “DAMN THAT’S ASTOUNDING, THEY GOT SOME NEW TECH! Look at all the cool designs!” Fans would love it. And let me remind you that a few thousand dollars for some designs is nothing to these guys, and would improve the scene considerably to a point where the price would easily be justified. And it would show support for the fan base by Disney. I know they’re going for the ‘motley Rebel fleet vs. The homogenised forces of evil’ but it wouldn’t hurt to have some Allegiances, Bellators, Fulgors, Procursators, Secutors in there.

[@Krystalmyth]

"Lucasfilm"

[@TheHighlandSounds]

There are TIE with Triangular wings in concept art for TFA made in like 2014 so I'd say the inspiration is from there as JJ was the director there as well...

[@RedCaio]

This whole thing reminds me... Here are some Star Wars things my brother and I thought of _before_ George Lucas did: • double-bladed lightsabers (like Darth Maul's lightsaber) • R4 droid that's just n R2 head stuck to your ship (for our's, the droid head could scoot around to fix different parts of the ship) • folding tie fighter wings (like with Darth Maul's Sith Infiltrator) • circular wings with rockets on the sides (like the ones that attach to Jedi Starfighters)

[@swrpggm]

Those were all in the Star Wars Role Playing Game in the 1980s & 1990s.

[@liljdm5374]

@@swrpggm lol

[@Necrometalfist]

You mean things that you think you thought of first. Just because you didn't see those things yet doesn't mean you thought of them first.

[@jasonedwards155]

In my 42 years as a fan I have seen plenty of triangular wing designs of the fighters by fans. Even the part of this video that puts the cockpit in the back is just a reconceptualization of the tie interceptor. It's an inevitably reoccurring design idea that is not at all original in concept....just the individual details. I respect the issue but I also find it trivial and without serious merit from my experience.

[@gups4963]

I think people jumped on to this too fast because disney/LF have been caught using fan made ships

[@Muckytuja]

After a time, it's really hard to not design something, that haven't been visualized before.

[@CMOT101]

Exactly.

[@gups4963]

@@Muckytuja Disney has the ability to throw a few thousand $ at the person to keep it cordial, just running with a design clearly like someone else's is messed up. Regardless of the reason why

[@kubli365]

But Didney bad

[@sternencolonel7328]

"if the wings are rotating", and suddenly the sfx department start to scramble ;)

[@InspectorWhoReacts]

To be fair... How else would these TIES land?

[@russellharrell2747]

Why would it need to land? It just gets tractored into a rack. But if it must land then it could just, you know, pull up into a climb and come to rest with its engines pointed down. Like the Slave-1/Firespray.

[@TheHighlandSounds]

There is concept art for TFA from 2013 with TIE doing that...

[@fate3071]

@@InspectorWhoReacts to be fair, most starfighters in star wars use repulsorlift technology, meaning it would simply need to land on one of the flat edges and it would be fine to take off and land with ease

[@lenkagamine4145]

The TIE dagger isnt designed in a way that it could land like the vector. The wing flaps would get in the way.

[@Linkums]

If I had to compare the designs of both, I'd have to say it's a TIE. (Nahh, but seriously, I prefer yours. I don't like the extra triangles and tall wing flaps on the TIE Dagger design as much.)

[@ilikepigeons6101]

XD

[@Novasky2007]

Vader: I find your use of Puns disturbing...

[@AlexSDU]

You, sir, got my Like for that pun.

[@Alpha2307]

The official one looks like a low res version of yours

[@michaelswitzer2121]

IKR it's like a concept are on its way to his LOL

[@randydecker7015]

The official makes me think of an knock off toy, like Go-Bots vs Transformers.

[@liquidlethe]

Guys you really think this is the same model as in the movie? The one hes spinning around in renders the same way he does his ships? He most likely mocked up their design without the detail for easier comparison shots and time sake. edit: like for real how stupid do you have to be to think he has access to the actual models used in the movie

[@tTaseric]

I think it's pretty silly for thinking that you own a shape. You handled this very maturely and i applaud you.

[@tTaseric]

I think it's probably a coincidence, since triangles are clearly a common design for Star Wars ships. I think it's fine that the creators are pulling inspiration from fans, especially in a fandom that's been so hostile towards them about what they should and shouldn't do. It shows that they are in fact listening and know what the fans want. We've seen so many triangular wings on Tie Fighters and other Empire vessels, (Tie Interceptor, Tie Striker, Star Destroyers, Rogue Shadow, Cruisers and so forth) that it would be silly to say it's a copy just because they're continuing with the trend. Folding wings? Maybe, i'd say that'd be a bit too close for a coincidence, but like the triangle design, the whole folding / moving wings thing is pretty common in Star Wars too. As you stated in the initial Tie Redesign video, it seems like it'd be smart for the Tie Fighter to be able to land on it's own especially with a faction like the First Order.

[@cakeboss4194]

@@tTaseric Go read up about FractalSponge, and how one book 'artist' decided to use his 3d models for an official book, without their consent or giving them credit.

[@tTaseric]

@@cakeboss4194 I am familiar with that situation. That's incredibly shitty on the artist's behalf, but it's a different situation. That was his exact artwork and designs taken directly from, whereas this is just an incredibly common triangular wing design that the designers probably didn't even know that this guy exists.

[@Maphisto86]

@@cakeboss4194 Ansel Hsiao did work on the "Star Wars: The Essential Guide to Warfare" book years ago and was credited for it. I do remember though Hsiao saying his Imperial class ship model being used in official merchandise without crediting him.

[@flare9757]

That is the problem with being as good as Ansel. People get envious, and claim your work as their own.

[@swrpggm]

The TIE Dagger Design dates back to TIE variants in the West End Games RPG in the 80s & 90s, namely the variant of the TIE Interceptor that was also called the Dagger and was used by system patrol agencies.

[@FattyMcFox]

Lucasfilm should just have a knife fight with CBS and the survivor gets to hire you as a designer.

[@BlazeLeiton]

A Dagger fight?

[@AlexSDU]

Let have their CEOs fight to the death.

[@indo8236]

The position of the Dagger’s cockpit and the one from the 2017 Dagger is also very similar, both being all the way in the back. The colouring of the 2017 Dagger could have inspired the new First Order’s Tie’s colouring (black and silver), and the red glass could have inspired Kylo’s fighter.

[@undead_corsair]

Seeing as the wing struts on the Dagger conect at the back the rotating elelment probably wouldn't work for a landing support.

[@lolmeme69_]

Really? I thought that's exactly what they were...

[@Timberwolf69]

I think the bigger issue would be the potruding ion engines...

[@killian9314]

@@Timberwolf69 how so?

[@Timberwolf69]

@@killian9314 Well, I guess because I didn't think of the rotation of the wings to land the vessel... I was a little too tired when commenting, I guess... But, thinking about the original post, I think if we change the "as" to a "how", we might be getting a little closer to the root of the issue.

[@kummer45]

This is simply fascinating. I really enjoy watching this channel. Designers who knows their material can reach very similar conclusions. That says something about your design. Your quality can easily reach new movies for Star Wars. You truly understands the design theme behind the ships.

[@greenbean2222]

Y'know, you should try talking to some modders for Battlefront 2 2017. They could port in ANY ship you make.

[@xxxCrackerJack501xxx]

That's an awesome idea

[@greenbean2222]

@@xxxCrackerJack501xxx I know right?

[@xxxCrackerJack501xxx]

@@greenbean2222 Modding sure has come a long way in that game

[@greenbean2222]

@@xxxCrackerJack501xxx it sure has. I'm actively working towards getting Clone pilots and the V-19 Torrent Starfighter into the game.

[@xxxCrackerJack501xxx]

@@greenbean2222 ooh nice! I personally hope someone makes a Kenobi mod one day giving him his general appearance from the old 2D cartoon series, it was more armored and I like how the robe/cape looked.

[@colbyuetake130]

It's the TIE Dorito!!!

[@butterhat1938]

*Proposed challenge* you did an amazing job converting the nebulon b into a military warship in it's original state. What do you think the original mon calamari cruisers looked like when they were pleasure cruisers?

[@DrewLSsix]

They weren't pleasure cruisers, they were planet side buildings.

[@StuartLugsden]

@@DrewLSsix Not all of them. Some wear buildings at origin and some wear actual ships before being refitted for military purpose like _Home One_ .

[@JonBerry555]

in Legends most were pleasure cruisers, while in canon many seem to be convert buildings.

[@butterhat1938]

@@DrewLSsix my understanding is that the MC-75s were city buildings while the MC-80s were converted pleasure cruisers. Even in current canon, but I cant remember where I read that...

[@kimleechristensen2679]

I dont know where all this "Pleasure Cruiser" thing comes from, but my understanding from Star Wars Lore I've read was that some of the Mon Cal cruisers where modified Exploration Cruisers, meant for deep space exloration. Now that puts them in a completely different category than their claimed "Pleasure Craft" Origin. Because an Exploration Cruiser would have to be able to fend for itself in a possible hostile environment/area, that may have pirates or species of a less friendly kind. It must have a stronger and durable hull, that can take the rough and tumble of operating far from home for months if not years. And it must have extra redundant systems, that can take over, incase some primary system breaks down in the middle of nowhere. In other words an Exploration Cruiser in Star Wars terms is a much shorter step away from a true warship, than one might otherwise think.

[@isaacmallorn9137]

Well done. I remember seeing your video when it was first released. I really like how you handle such a sensitive subject by breaking down all the various points. I really enjoy seeing such logic and level-headedness.

[@somberdoc]

it would pretty cool if your tie vector was an inspiration for the dagger and prove that you can design incredible star wars ships

[@Muckytuja]

He already proved, that he can design cool ships!

[@batman6621]

Somberdoc I’m just going to say the tie vector is an empire experimental fighter and the first order just used old blueprints and made their own version of it

[@shulkrendemoneye1304]

I respect you all the more for the way you handled this. Also I like your landing, thruster, and solar panel connections, but I prefer their panels, and the heavy lazers.

[@BufftatJunkie]

Good to see another level headed fan. I like the way you handled this.

[@kubli365]

NO DISNEY NEEDS TO PAY HIM KATHLEEN KENNEDY STOLE THE DESIGN SHE MUST BE JAILED

[@thepaultato3243]

TheSly442 clearly dont have the same maturity as the guy in the video. I hate KK as much as the next guy but seriously... jailed for someone else making either a concept that’s similar or having inspiration from someone else? Yikes. That’s injustice.

[@skarloey2334]

@@thepaultato3243 at this point im pretty sure every possible tie design has been made by either fans or lucas films making it at best near impossible for anyone to actually have an original design.

[@AdvancePlays]

Can't say I'm with everyone else. Your design was cool and all but there's nothing uniquely genius about giving a Tie fighter triangle wings, as you readily accept, and the other elements are pretty much truisms. You can bet thousands and thousands of permutations were sketched out and left on the cutting room floor, and whichever one was chosen you could find a handful of similarities. The design is just too simple. All the comments bashing the Dagger just come off as a bit kiss-ass and juvenile too.

[@SayAhh]

It's Star Wars. Everyone here praising and bashing it can be considered juvenile, like that's a negative thing. Lucas said that it was for kids.

[@BlueTyphoon2017]

@@SayAhh not really, I mean based off the writer it can go from G to, maybe almost R rated, it’s mostly supposed to be for all ages. Even if this is the case, kids don’t deserve shitty stories or anything like that. (No I’m may bashing the sequels, it’s just that I’ve heard this justification used for explaining away bad shows or other media.)

[@MrNiceGuy214]

Will you try to finish renders on background ships in episode 5 and 6??? Also will you try background ships like in episode 7 for the new republic fleet and also the new ships in the new trailer for episode 9 and do your own renders of those ships.

[@InventorZahran]

Yes! Every time I see those ships in the background, I always wonder what are they, and why are they here?

[@MrNiceGuy214]

@@InventorZahran Yeah it would be a great idea

[@fontunetheteller410]

When you have wings that look pointy and short, the word dagger naturally follows. It’s not plagiarism

[@leonardocaicedo1273]

Yes exactly... As soon as I learned the name was TIE Dagger I automatically thought "wow not a very creative name"

[@SuperDeadzombeh]

@@leonardocaicedo1273 most tie variants arnt creatively named

[@heinrichmirgrautsvordir6613]

Well yes, but usually Ties are named Fighter, Defender, Interceptor, Bomber and not Dagger. Yes it isnt a very creative name, but its suspicious that they now break their naming tradition.

[@fontunetheteller410]

@@heinrichmirgrautsvordir6613 the "-er" suffix is kind of the only convention they've kept to, but I get what you mean

[@Duke_of_Petchington]

EChenry, the dagger look wider cause second, smaller set of panels.

[@spamviking]

That dark blue/cream white colour scheme you got going on your TIE Vector reminds me of old British naval aircraft.

[@Uchilsson]

Still Yours looks best. Especialy engine :)

[@t4rv0r60]

yes, i to like the engine part of EC's Tie

[@danieldean4486]

My first thought when I watch that trailer is of your TIE fighter design and honestly it's probably one of the best fan-made ships I've ever seen for the Star Wars genre.

[@Gwagia]

Yours looks way better, they should have just bought your design.

[@MousePotato]

This happened to me with Star Trek. In 1991 I came up with the idea of a hollomirror and sent the design and idea to the Star Trek studios. I got a letter back from Susan Sackett saying that I needed to write an episode for it to be used. Years later the hollomirror appeared in a book and years later after that it appeared in the first episode of Star Trek Discovery.

[@waynedesauniere4661]

yeah, it's a triangle-shaped wing. they had them back in legends, way before the sequel trilogy.....

[@Daark_Karma]

It should be noted that TFA concept art featured dagger shaped ties and they were drawn around 2014.

[@isaac3702]

I remember when I saw the leaked picture, and I immediately thought of what you designed. I am glad that you are not trying to raise any sort of controversy about it, though personally, I like your design more, and the other ships that you have designed as well. I would like to know if you could design some ships that I suggestions for?

[@TheHighlandSounds]

Looking at Concept Art for TFA, there are loads of TIE designs with triangular wings and these have been made pre 2016...

[@yodasdad]

The TIE Dagger name seems to have been dropped now. All merch and images refer to it as the Sith TIE Fighter.

[@Andrecio64]

Your Tie Vector deserves to be in a fan game of Star Wars, i would like to pilot it

[@cac_deadlyrang]

The TIE Vector could be seen being developed into the TIE Dagger.

[@Turiargov]

Hell no! Disney's Dagger looks like it was built 1200 years before the Vector by Space Vikings (but without the cool simplicity and symmetric balance of a round shield or longboat).

[@StuartLugsden]

There a shot in the film where we get a close up of a Xyston-class Star Destoyers superlazer (Which was dumb by the way) and in that same shot we also get a look at the hangers of that destroyer which has several Daggers in them and while it's a bit blurry you can clearly see that the wings are not facing upwards. I know this wont stop many from accusing "Disney" of stealing but thats enough proof that they don't rotate. Edit: Fixed selling mistake

[@KuraIthys]

When people argue about 'stolen' ideas, I inevitably have to point out that people absolutely CAN and DO think of basically the same idea independently, and it happens quite often. I personally can think of about 2 dozen ideas I had over the years that were 'stolen'. As in someone actually implemented them, usually a few years later. But I use 'stolen' in quotes because in my case it's blatantly obvious they couldn't possibly have gotten the ideas from me. I didn't steal it from them, they didn't steal it from me. We both had the same idea independently. And it frustrates me no end that people's first assumption when running into two similar things is to assume that one is 'stolen' from the other. Frequently judged entirely on publicly released information on the subject. For instance there's a moderately well known medieval weapons enthusiast on youtube who claims to have 'invented' a new kind of scabbard. Except I doubt that it's truly 'new', given it's a solution that should have been fairly obvious to anyone that's tried to deal with the problem it 'solves. And more significantly, I designed and built roughly the same thing (in very broad strokes) about 15 years ago. (the idea was literally the first solution I thought of, given the problem - hence why I considered it really obvious) Does that mean they 'stole' my idea/design? Certainly not. They don't know me. Have never met me. Haven't even communicated with me through youtube. Plus, the people I've talked to or shown this design to... Ever, can be counted on one hand! But, herein lies the second problem; if I DO show this design to someone now, after the fact, then I have no documented proof that I did it 15 years ago. And (rightfully) people are unlikely to take me at my word... Which, frustratingly, leads to the rather stupid situation that if I were to describe this design publicly, I'd probably be accused of stealing it from this youtuber, even though I came up with it years before they did! Why? Because they have publicly verifiable evidence of when they came up with it, and I do not. Even though that evidence is 15 years after I did it, they have evidence and I do not. But that aside, again, different people come up with the same idea all the time. It's not that rare. Some really prominent examples historically is that two people invented the telephone independently, and the same is true of Calculus. Now, sadly, generally only one of each gets 'credit' for having done so, yet it's nonetheless true that in both cases the 'invention' was devised fully independently by two different people. Neither 'stole' from the other.

[@pleasekillme2693]

That fan made design was one of mine as well. But I called it the Tie-Mandator, but I changed the back up into the same as the normal tie, and the wings had more solar panels than what you came up with. So I guess we ALL even

[@truiteteam3428]

I'm the 1000th comment, I think it's normal to get the same idea with a basic geographical structure, in the nature it's called "evolution convergency".

[@SayAhh]

You ready? "ROUND wings." Round side panels. You're welcome.

[@Milk_Toast]

I prefer the larger thruster on the vector, that’s something I want on a LEGO set

[@sjschauer4235]

A similar situation happened during the build up to Ep3. A fan created their own Star Destroyer design based on early concept, or poster art as speculation of what the Ep3 SD would look like. His design was not, in fact, correct, but later his design showed up on a novel cover, can't remember which, but it was around the same time. He contacted LF about it and was told since his design was derivative of existing SD designs that he did not own it and attempting to gain compensation would go nowhere. He then stopped doing any Star Wars models as a result. You might be in the same boat, but worse as you'd be taking on the house of mouse.

[@StuartLugsden]

I'm glad you finally addressed this in a mature and sensible way. Someone also accused Disney (Because it always Disney's fault apparently and never someone like Phil Szostak who's Lucasfilm's creative art manager) of stealing your FO Tie Fighter design despite the fact that there are major differences and it was bound to happen at some point either before or after you designed your variant since it's an obvious choice. Honestly, if people are going to say it's Disney's fault then they shouldn't be take seriously. Also, I really like your design, the Dagger and the Sith Dagger.

[@namolokaman2393]

Ya know, a '4-nodes' Tie Fighter, meaning with long rectangular wings ( like 1:6 ratio, maybe more, with the long axis aligned with the direction of travel ), might actually look really cool, in a kind of 'refined austerity' sort of way. Call it the Scandinavian / 'IKEA' / 'Flat Pack' Tie Fighter!

[@ChiliFrog]

Isn't the official one referred as Sith TIE fighter tho?

[@tylerbrown5526]

I've seen both. I have the same question. Red ones are Sith and normal ones are Daggers?

[@hbtdawgz1688]

Tyler Brown is there a normal one? All the ones ive seen have red trim.

[@lothean2099]

I use to scratch built models and experimented with this design tight after the tie interceptor came out. Basically, a lot of us artist do channel the same inspiration flow.

[@HueWave]

Dude how did you made this animated background? Premiere ??

[@MorgensternX]

I actually came looking for you directly after seeing TRoS to see if you'd squee'd as much as I did at seeing what at first glance in the crappy lighting of the movie was _your design_ on the big screen. After seeing detailed renders of the Tie Dagger for the first time in this video, I have to agree that they are appreciably different and likely a function of convergent evolution (or lego-plagiarism). But I gotta say, your Tie Vector is the superior design. Its more balanced, more functional (having an actual landing configuration) and with its aerodynamic struts, still "looks faster" than the more elongated triangles of the Dagger.

[@axebearer]

Your design is better. I don't like how the cockpit of the Dagger is mounted all the way back on the wings. Your more center-mounted design looks more traditional TIE and cooler overall.

[@Nemoticon]

I like your approach and conclusion to this whole subject. A very objective, down to earth break down you quite understand that there are some designs and concepts that people will always reach independantly even if the coincidental similarities suggest otherwise. Throughout history, there are many examples of similar designs being thought up of by individuals who have never met, if not on the otherside of the planet. Good design solutions are often inevitable conclusions for someone who has gone through many ideas in a formulaic way. As you prove here, the triangular wing design had already been played with previously. In saying that, I still like and prefer your TIE Vector. Huge respect, quality 'youtubing', new sub. Keep up the good work xD

[@jacobklein3837]

I love Lucasfilm and Star Wars, but I'm suspicious of them when it comes to this stuff. They have played fast and loose with using fan designs before.

[@Maphisto86]

Any good examples? It is not that I think you are dishonest, but I cannot think of any blatent examples off the top of my head.

[@jacobklein3837]

@@Maphisto86 kzbin.info/www/bejne/rWfLl6SZi6atpLc They put a fan design star destroyer on the cover of a comic is the example that came to my mind. I think there's more examples in Eck's video

[@jacobklein3837]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/eoW6app3irdggZI

[@jacobklein3837]

2nd link is the stolen SD

[@Maphisto86]

@@jacobklein3837 Thank you very much for replying so fast and giving good examples of the plagiarism cited. Perhaps I am naive or like to believe the best in people. The examples in Ekhartsladder's videos are quite egregious though . I like Joe Corroney's work in the past for example, but I am dismayed that such a established artist for the franchise has not bothered to weigh in on this subject (as far as I am aware of). That is particularly troubling.

[@TheMaghorn]

Personally, when I saw the TIE Dagger my first thought was that it was just a cut down TIE Interceptor, which I'm surprised was not mentioned at any point in the video.

[@yugene-lee]

Can we also talk about how the tie dagger's cockpit windshield thingy looks sort of like your logo

[@BruceWayne92955]

your channel is amazing, you take series ships and make them real . And we present versions of the fan ships, and solve mysteries. Simply incredible.

[@georgeofhamilton]

If they didn't steal it, then what an unfortunate coincidence this is.

[@skarloey2334]

it's likely several people made a similar tie fighter design before jesse did.

[@fakshen1973]

The TIE design is probably one of the most built spaceships that fans build out of LEGO. "Dagger" is also a popular sci-fi name for spaceships. The likelihood of three similar designs, names, or both really muddy the waters.

[@JonarusDraconius]

I hate to be 'that guy'... but... "Umm Actually" - In expanded Star-Wars Lore, a very important feature of the TIE-LN starfighter, was that it had exactly the same width as it did hieght - Meaning, no matter how it rotated, it was still a 10m by 10m 'square' from the front. Basically, the shooting models from the original movies are slightly off, and how the fighter is depicted in REBELS is the "True canon" appearance of the design. And to go into 'legends' Lore - I remember a scene in one of the X-wing Novels where this very specific factoid was used by a pilot to get a TIE of his tail: He flew his X-wing along a canyon like formation to a point where it became extremely narrow, and rotated his X-wing 90 degrees, he was just able to slip through the gap with mere centimeters to sparre, but the TIE pilot, thinking to do the same, forgot that the amount of space he needed didn't change, and thus sheared off both his wings. ~JD

[@VegetaLF7]

Yeah, I'm going to disagree on this one. That X-Wing's maneuver was taking advantage of the fact that when the s-foils were closed, the X-Wing was shorter than the standard TIE Fighter and thus could squeeze through that gap. The TIE couldn't change the shape of it's wings like the X-Wing could and the pilot made the mistake of following the X-Wing in with no way out. Nothing I see supports the "it's a square from the front" at all. The art style for Rebels was taken heavily from the Ralph McQuarrie designs, which is why the ISD-I's have such elevated necks and the lightsaber blades are so thin. The art style changes made for Rebels does not change the "true canon" of the TIE Fighter's appearance, as it is very clearly not as wide as it is tall in the films.

[@JonarusDraconius]

@@VegetaLF7 "agree to disagree" - I (personally) distinctly recall that while yes, the X-wing could only do that 'wings closed', the pilot in question actually 'commented' about how the REASON the tie couldn't copy the maneuver was specifically because "It was as wide as it was tall and thus couldn't change its profile regardless of how the pilot rotated the craft" (paraphrased to be sure, but I'm certain the words were to that effect). Is there some *official* canon document that says otherwise though? (wanders off to check wookieepedia) UPDATE: The TIE fighters dimensions are some of the most up-in-the-air numbers in the setting... ^^; I mean, check this image I found (one of the few with 'length/width/height' ALL listed): www.rebelscale.com/wp-content/uploads/incredibuilds-tie-fighter.jpg Going by this, it's actually even WIDER than it is tall, despite not appearing to be such in the slightest.

[@Timberwolf69]

@@JonarusDraconius Well, regarding these measurements, the TIE pilot's best bet to get through there would have been sideways... ;)

[@JonarusDraconius]

@@Timberwolf69 Well... The point I was going for was more along the lines of there being multiple sources both legends and Canon that refer to the standard TIE Fighter as being "As tall as it is wide". But even I will acknowledge that that statement doesn't mean that those two measurements have to be 100% identical - just relatively close.

[@catfish552]

I have a spot like this right here (Iron Fist, chapter 2), and no, it neither calls the TIE fighter "as tall as it is wide", nor does it mention ten metres. Matter of fact, it says "no matter how it was turned, the TIE fighter needed more than six meters of clearance in any direction. " It then gets its wings sliced off by flying through a four-metre gap.

[@maximevigneron560]

I've seen a fan art by Sina Pahlevani, a reimagination of Sidious. He is on a robot chair with legs, and I can't wait to see if thats what we see at 2:00 in the trailer

[@dragoonthegamer5289]

It’s a ball and two triangles connected by two sticks. I feel like you’re giving yourself a little too much credit here.

[@dryboneskirby]

And a car is a box with four circles, a plane is a cylinder with three triangles and a few circles

[@mariobadia4553]

The design isn't even that creative. I mean he just put triangles instead of octagons.

[@mikahraptor8849]

Mario Badia *hexagons

[@Andrecio64]

Honestly, your tie fighter Roasts up That one.

[@andyrihn1]

“Do not attribute to malice that which is explained by stupidity”- Henlon’s Razor

[@jm-sh6qr]

i wouldn't call it stupidity, but i see what you're getting at.

[@joshuafogg6600]

Given the track record, I believe malice is in order right now.

[@mechwar31]

Being somewhat of a casual fan I initially heard of a tie vector via this controversy. Prior to this video I was unaware of the VTOL design feature, however immediately upon see the shape of the wings I imagined them being able to rotate in the same manner shown later in the video. So even in that regard two people can have the same idea independent of each other.

[@Restilia_ch]

Someone needs to poke that Lego fan-designer and let him know. He has a case with that one.

[@EvanG529]

I kinda doubt it, coincidences are bound to happen.

[@Restilia_ch]

@@EvanG529 They are, but the triangular wing mounted at the far back and the exact name are a bit much to be a pure coincidence.

[@EvanG529]

@@Restilia_ch You would be surprised

[@2bricks]

Does it seem likely to anyone else that those secondary smaller wings on the TIE dagger will either fold out or rotate back to create a sort of diamond shape? Perhaps the Empire's equivalent of locking S-foils in attack position?

[@DRKTROOPER15]

If anything this is just further proof that your designs are so mind boggling good that they SHOULD be in main canon Star Wars!

[@SanguineRoku]

Honestly with something as simplistic as a TIE fighter design, it's hard to really break new ground. Any configuration you come up with is going to be something someone else thought of, especially things like triangular wings, given that the Imperial ship is essentially a big (diamond) Triangle.

[@SuperCookieGaming_]

if they land the same way yours does then i would be suspicious.

[@TheHighlandSounds]

There is concept art for TFA from 2013 with TIE doing that...

[@SuperCookieGaming_]

@@TheHighlandSounds can you send me a link?

[@headcreeps5738]

Your incredibly humble my friend...shows your character...that’s why I dig your channel. And the amazing ship designs you come up with. Lucas Films should give you a job.

[@richie0099]

KZbin fans: makes new tie fighter design Disney: It’s free real estate

[@aTADtoofar]

Cobra in GI JOE had a weird Tie looking vehicle, the cockpit was a red skull, and the wings rotated from landing mode to flight mode as well. It is - of course - not a tie fighter, but it looks like it was inspired by the Tie design. Given how this design may have evolved, the rotating wings might also be a coincidence..?

[@carsonharrington1079]

I still love your Tie Vector so much more than Disney’s tie

[@xuttuh5260]

The evolution of the tie fighter during the original trilogy was perfect, as Ralph McQuarrie was an engineering sketcher and knew his stuff. Introducing the opening in the panels of the Tie Interceptor made perfectly sense from an engineering and tactical point of view, as it increases the range of sight for the pilot, left and right. Important for fast dogfighting. Less important for standard fighters and bombers. The Disney Tie Dagger closes exactly the area, that the Tie Interceptor openend for better performance. Also the viewport is an absolute mess design wise.

[@R3LOADlikesgames]

I say that there is a 25% they took PARTS of your design....and that dude's Lego Tie dagger....... But who knows

[@DimoB8]

There are so many Tie fighter fan and official designs that similarities are bound to happen.

[@TheHighlandSounds]

There is concept art for TFA from 2013 with TIEs having triangular wings. JJ is just using one of the old concepts

[@mariobadia4553]

You do realize that there's zero chance that they saw that right? I mean the post only had 2000 views.

[@jimmyjazz4605]

Mate, I also made my own Tie Fighter design with triangle wings back in early 2016 for my art project. It's an easy design that anybody could do and at the end of the day, Disney owns the Tie Fighter design so it really doesn't matter haha!

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

I don't like the 'front heavy' look of the tie dagger. that, and the ww2 elements in the vector make me prefure your design. the TIE vector also has both magnitude and direction

[@user-Jay178]

I like your tie vector. It looks better then the tie dagger. Great video

[@MythicalPhoebe]

i'm pretty sure you're not the first one to put triangles on a tie fighter.

[@Spar10Leonidas]

The concept art for _The Force Awakens_ that you mentioned? Was a name given to that? I'll assume it wasn't "TIE Dagger," as I suspect you would have mentioned that if it was, but I'm curious. In any case, I would imagine that the Dagger would have to have rotating wings. Otherwise, it'd be way too front-heavy to land anywhere other than designated landing docks.

[@cadeellsworth140]

Nah it's still the TIE Dorito to me

[@stonks6616]

Cade Ellsworth lel

[@SHADOSTRYKR]

I uploaded a conceptual redesign for the Batmobile. Featuring a low slung profile. Exposed wheels and a graphite finish. When I saw the design for the Batman VS Superman Batmobile I was shocked because it was strikingly similar time my concept art. So when someone raises a eyebrow at the similarities for official concept art and fan art, I think there might be something to it.

[@FuddlyDud]

When a fan-made ship is superior to that of the official ship...

[@CatraValentine]

Looking at your designs and having a design, as well as a SciFi background I have to say: damn, what an awesome design your TIE Vector is! (have missed it before) And honestly, why you aren't on the design team for SW is beyond my comprehension. If I were the lead on one of their hard surface teams, you'd be in in no time. :)

[@AuntySocialQueen]

In recent years Star Wars hasn't exactly been a stranger to directly stealing people's fan designs. But that it more related to Marvel and the comics, still something to consider.

[@skookathing]

The main reason the the tie dagger doesn't have a lot of detail compared to the tie vector is because the tie dagger is gonna be way in the background of a lot of the fight scenes, and to conserve memory, the make it less detailed. Not to mention it's also gonna be really fast and blurry when its zipping across the screen The tie vector isn't gonna be in a situation like that, as it's meant to be close and still. (P.s I still like the vector more)

[@GulaschKanister187]

TIE Twin Ion Engines So your design can't be a Tie

[@andyjacobs7010]

Lmfao you're right!

[@barrywreap5122]

Years ago a Star Wars game magazine had a contest to "design a boss". So I submitted a Mechanized Stormtrooper and never heard anything back. Then one day ,a friend called me because a article in a Lucas game preview said a new shooter was coming out with a Mechanized Stormtrooper boss .Latter it became the Dark Force Trooper from Dark Forces. The final design was a little different but their "concept art" was pretty dead on. I got a good laugh off of this.

[@slimsuits3231]

I thought this design was a reused concept from TFA?? And they started that in 2013.

[@ECHenry]

Yeah, that’s definitely one very plausible explanation that I explore in the video.

[@slimsuits3231]

@@ECHenry Good grief you did, haha, sorry

[@lukedeer2579]

Honestly bro, yours is way better from a design standpoint, I always thought the Lucas film tie dagger looked incredibly stupid