Farmall Starter/Generator ID Tag Restoration, Brush Installation, & Final Assembly - "Prep H" Ep #34

Join this channel to get access to perks:
/ @squatch253

[@geneard639]

During my time in military aviation I saw engineering examples and prototypes. Most had part and serial numbers that the in-house numbers associated to a project number, not the final part or serial number format. This is to safeguard the company from IP theft, and clearly identify parts not intended for the final customer use. Only occasionally did I see an engineering example or prototype go from being 'X-009' to 'S/N 0001', and they put the new product identiplate abutting the engineering example identiplate. I asked about it, because it can be confusing... I think it took close to two years to move the engineering example identiplate from the exterior where you could see it, to the underside of the panel it had been in so the plate remained with the unit but couldn't cause confusion. It was a bit of a head banger, the unit was meant to support the SH-60B/F/H and MH-60R/S aircraft but the SH platforms were retiring....

[@76RSLT]

Yay for some prototype MM content! So, when does X231 get to come back to the front burner?

[@tater_relocater]

After a quick preparation H freshen up

[@76RSLT]

@@tater_relocater LOL! 😂

[@billhartl6601]

Loved "save the broken end plat for your core returns, dontbgive them your good, heavy ones"!!

[@ralphorr8138]

Both starter and generator back plate have small holes to put picks or welding wire through to hold brushes back for easy assembly. This method was drummed into me by my tech when he was training me, so have never forgotten lol.

[@adamsmith3931]

Excellent instruction. Thank you!

[@davidkimmel4216]

Thanks again. I always appreciate your input and advice. 😊

[@JDTECH22]

Thats pretty cool delco from anderson IN, I grew up like 5 min from where that plant was.

[@danielbutler578]

The prototype starters reminded me of my 69 AMC Ambassador. When the starter failed on it, I couldn't find a replacement anywhere. I could tell that it was basically a modified Ford starter so I checked my spare parts stash and found a rebuild that had come from some scrap I had picked up when some friends were cleaning up a small junkyard. Everything fit except the nose and the armature. I needed the starter drive gear too but had to turn a piece of it backward so that it would push out far enough to get into the flywheel ring gear. Fortunately the armature was even though the brush plate and field windings on the old starter were shorted out. That's why I hate to let go of anything that has good parts on it. The old saying is that the average time between throwing something away and needing it is 3 days.

[@squatch253]

Yep, like the old Boy Scouts motto of “Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.” 👍

[@karlfischer1011]

many places will refuse a core return if there is physical damage. sometimes they'll take it, so always worth a try :)

[@abraxasracing]

I'd watch them no matter how long they are.

[@deweydodo6691]

Never knew about the color coding of Delco Remy i.d. tags. 👍

[@codyvought8923]

I wish you would've posted these videos in the summer, lol. I had a hard time with starters this year.

[@tractordan933]

Thanks , Great informative video.

[@neilshep50]

You can tell the new serial tag is a Squatch product, it's too perfectly aligned!

[@geneguenther4325]

Thanks for the video Toby! Was neat to see how they both work and how they go together. Also a pretty neat piece of history at the end as well! Thanks for the video and can’t wait to see what comes next!

[@MrDwrench1]

I love the prototype content. It pleases me that you and Sr. were able to save those little pieces of history. Thanks for a great video.

[@johnd7288]

Another great video !

[@jamesburns8247]

I really like the "Story Time Takes"

[@bamadave6324]

This series on starter/generators is excellent. Great videos. Inspired me to ditch the alternator.

[@ap1687]

What a treat of an episode! Thank you for sharing it! One trick that worked for me for starter brushes is to spread each brush out with a zip tie around its peg. The backplate goes on easy and you can cut the ties through the side holes.

[@rickbrandt9559]

yup

[@johnmckee7937]

I used string, but same principle.

[@bombardier3qtrlbpsi]

Excellent neat job and rebuild. 👍 Thanks for sharing the testing process.

[@clydeschwartz]

Excellent video the prototype delco Remy starters are really neat one of a kind pieces. I am thinking the guy that worked at Minneapolis Moline must have brought the starters to the farm when engineering was done with them or else they had that many prototype tractors and machines there. The newer Minneapolis Moline tractor all pretty much used the 3 bolt flange type of starters after the Z and U models the 5 star diesel had a 3 bolt flange and GVI had a 3 bolt flange. Keep up the great videos

[@stephenstrohacker7863]

I appreciate the details on all this Delco-Remy data. I never knew you could differentiate the units by color coded tags. That makes life much easier. Now I'll be always looking for green tags...lol.

[@squatch253]

Thanks, and one thing I neglected to mention is that the even larger 24 volt units have a yellow/orange background tag on them too.

[@rickyjessome4359]

Thanks for another great video Toby. Those prototype starts are something else especially since the books you have don't have anything on them. Pretty cool pieces of history. Cheers

[@Denis-tu1pd]

My 1956 Chevy pickup 265 v8 had a 3 bolt flange. The stater bolted directly to the bellhousing . Denis from Santa Rosa CA.

[@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch]

Nice work on the starter and generator. Happy to see X231 make a quick reappearance! 😊

[@johnnymorrow63]

Very cool info on the green tags!

[@stevew270]

I think this is my favorite episode of the series, a lot of really cool info on the prototype equipment.

[@santerresongarage7486]

Good info! Just to add to the color tags, orange means 24 volts. J. F.

[@markhelseth253]

Great series. Not often we get to see the internal workings with a great explanation! Thanks. BTW - I passed the link to a coupe mechanics. I'm sure neither had seen good educational 6V stuff. Hopefully they become members,

[@Greg_Gatsby]

Good content. 👍

[@davidsmith-ee8cb]

Love to watch your videos, I always learn new tricks to make the job easier. Keep on doing what you love and share the experience!!!

[@stevea6722]

Really love the details in these vids! Information is money.

[@ericcorse]

Interesting info about the green tags, thanks.

[@raymondhorvatin1050]

very enjoyable

[@jason0870]

I like your longer vids. Thanks for sharing your knowledge on the equipment, It is appreciated.

[@thirzapeevey2395]

The universe is not sentient. It is neither with you nor against you.

[@ivoryjohnson4662]

Thanks for the history lesson and seeing the prototype stuff

[@dans_Learning_Curve]

Watched the whole thing! LoL I hope more people start rebuilding starters and generators.

[@DonHuntrods-ue3xv]

Excellent series on starters and generators. I’ve had an armature lathe for about 20 years I use occasionally. Where is the best place to get consumables for the lathe such as mica cutter blades, cutters, belts, and etc. I live hear in Iowa. Thanks for your videos.

[@bcbloc02]

My LA Case has a starter looks almost identical to that x231 prototype

[@bosse1033]

Thanks for a very educational video on starter motor and alternator. Love it!

[@edkeniston4786]

Educational as always! I actually saw a armature lathe and under cutter on marketplace today, I don’t need anymore tools, but you’ve got me thinking I ought to have it. Thanks again.

[@daohnstad]

Great series.

[@jefflee1467]

Another great video. You are a wealth of information. I really appreciate it when you share these little bits of uncommon information.

[@karlfischer1011]

cover joint on the bottom also lets inadvertent water intrusion drip out😊 When I worked in a parts store, I'd collected a few generator cores from customer alternator conversions. It was a great deal all around: the customer got their core value for the alternator and i got a generator for the cost of a 10si core. those generators ended up being just fine! (rebuild wouldn't have hurt one but it still charged when i tested it)

[@michaelwest4325]

Another masterclass on 6v generator and starter! Great sruff!

[@paulpowell9579]

I think it turned out great Toby

[@charlescastle5566]

Toby, you know I've been here with you since the start but I was just going to say I've rebuilt both the starters and generators for some IH stuff but as I've told you feels like a million times I'm an old Massey mechanic and I had a couple more steps when it came to rebuilding a generator for a Massy than a IH because I had to normally had a gear drive rear brush plate because the shaft on the generator ran the tach but that was the only difference from them. You just had to really clean the gear drive good and grease them good before completly putting them back together but to good old delco-remy was on about ever tractor I ever worked on. It's because General motors always built the very best stuff well and like their vehicles LOL I couldn't resist that gouge I'm a GM guy myself and you being a former Ford guy I had to atleast poke at you. Great video, keep up the good work you know I'll always be here watching.

[@AndrewHCann]

Excellent video Squatch 359 :) very interesting and informative to know to that to ! Also nice Starter & Generator went together so easy and fun put together plus labels too!

[@shaneharrison4775]

Nice segment on the DelcoRemy starters and generators and the tagging 6v. Black 12v. Red and the Green tag experimental models like M/M used I do recall a few blue tags in my wonders round grand dad's farm and grandpa Bowens machine shop on various pieces of equipment. Great video really very informative. I got most my education on starters and generators on my dad's 60 CJ5,and my 61 IH Scout all wheel drive with the 4cyl. Comanche engine. The jeep was 6v. And my Scout was 12v. With blue tags. Wasn't sure why they were both blue dad converted his jeep in 75 to 12v red tags.

[@lordcaptainvonthrust3rd]

Nice history lesson, Squatch 👍

[@mikewednesday8541]

Thanks for the video , great information !

[@jimamundsen7029]

Interesting stuff, Toby, thanks! I wish I had your skill putting the springs on the studs. Mine usually end up across the room...

[@johna7661]

A caution when seating the brushes is don’t let the spring bridge snap on the brush or the brush could crack or break.

[@patricktetreault4870]

When I was younger you could pickup brushes at the local parts store nowadays with all the chain store outlets not many counter people and i use that term lightly would even know what they were

[@ronaldfairhurst2914]

you should look at the armatures and see if they have a common delco number or if they are experimental also I think the guts might be standard and the housing built to fit a particular mounting flange.

[@RobertBrothersJr-dc7nr]

Another great video Toby. You have much more dexterity than I do. I usually struggle with those brushes and end caps.

[@jefferystrange7476]

Hey Toby. Nice video. ! Love all those details. Im a stickler for details in about everything I do. Your soft jaws on the vice really caught my eye. never saw any quite like that. And I have made a few. Those handmade? Very interesting historical facts on the ID tags. I replaced mine and got them done at Brillman. That was an innovative little stamping jig you made. Interesting thing about the generator on my Super A is that the tag was installed on the inboard side so you can't see it very well. Maybe on another model tractor the generator was located on the RH side. Looking forward to next one 👍

[@squatch253]

Thanks! Those are older Wilton soft jaws, factory made 👍

[@bmw1894]

I wonder if you contacted Delco Remy with the model and serial numbers, if they could shed some light on what they're off.

[@michaelscriffiano9267]

Thank you

[@GrantJohnston-dr9rt]

Glad to see ya back on the H!Have a happy and healthy New Year, Greetings from Montreal!

[@jankotze1959]

Full watch Tobie

[@ThisOldFarm]

Another great and informative video! I wish I had known all this when I went through starters on a couple of my dad's tractors.

[@mikehughes3533]

Hey I learned something, I didn’t know about the label colors. Will have to check the generator on my D4. Thanks

[@haydnstevens3108]

Excellent series In valuable information and how to do thanks Squatch

[@Catman701]

Another great video.

[@aserta]

Boy... do i hate potmetal. Whenever i get something new, machinery or vehicle, to replace the potmetal off it, is my no1 goal as repairs go. The first of the Bernard London implementations to cheapen out products, akin to me buying a Bosch grinder, thinking "it's still a good brand" and discovering they ... changed the bearing plate for reinforced glass plastic. The most trafficked and most vital component on an angle grinder... and they made it out of plastic. Don't get me wrong, it still works, but i know it will break eventually. Same with pot metal. Only i prefer ditching it as soon as possible. That stuff cracks and warps just sitting on your shelf. I had 4 or 5 counter plates for briggs and stratton engines. New items, never used. All warped. I chucked them all to the bin the same day going through each with increased aggravation. Just a rant about potmetal, i guess.

[@andrewalexander9492]

It's good that they stapled some holes through the gasket, so the rain whcih was excluded by the gasket could find a way in.

[@1crazynordlander]

Thanks for sharing!

[@paulwomack5866]

I love the 3 digit (and more) accuracy of a modern digital meter, but for simple tests like this, I prefer to use an analogue meter. You don't just get a reading, the dynamic behaviour of the needle gives a really intuitive reading of the connection (or lack thereof). Seeing a needle twitch, or slam to the end, or goto the end, but fall back intermittently are such good indicators of dodgy connections, far more than a steady reading, no matter how accurate. Analogue meters are cheap, and really nice vintage, premium professional grade in their day, models are also cheap 🙂

[@seniorelectrician6831]

well, I am still catching up on videos, I hope it helps you out in you logarithms, As Ralphorr8138 stated, there are small holes in the back plate which are about the size of a small paper clip wire. This is especially true were you do not have access to the brushes during assembly. Is it true on the real old generators, alternators and starters that I can not tell you. But in tech school back in the early 80s that was drummed into my head as well

[@sailinwrench]

Back in the day I remember having to polarize the charging system. Which basically tells the system which way to charge. I would love to see a how and why on this if time allows. Dan

[@charlesward8196]

Great video, thanks!

[@dougkubash8673]

Enjoyed the video!

[@LNC4P]

In regards to starters of similar tractors like my Case IH. When you service the brushes, some starters are reversable with their rotation. The brush cap may be installed and clocked onto the starter housing at a 90° offset as there will be 2 to 4 bolts. Reason for the 90° offset is to align the brushes with the commutator to allow the rotor polarity to be switched to allow the rotation as either clockwise or counter-clockwise. Also, these starters do not care weather the tractor is a positive ground or negative ground, the different grounds will NOT change the direction of rotation as the ground polarity will affect both the stator and rotor fields equally. The cap will have an identifying notch on it and the housing will have a "L" and "R" on it for the direction of rotation allignment, or vice versa as I cant remember that specifically at the moment. If the starter is not rotating in the correct direct, the bendix will not extend and engage the fly wheel as this is a safety feature to not allow damage to the engine by the inadvertent reverse rotation. If this happens, you probably have made a mistake in the alignment of the cap and housing. As such, an adjustment would have to be made and the cap rotated by 90°.

[@squatch253]

Thanks for this info! I have seen starter end caps with two sets of bolt holes in them before, but did not know why they were made that way. Now I do! 👍

[@bobuk5722]

Another masterclass!

[@tinygriffy]

A function test would be nice ;) .. and if it reaches specified torque maybe.. Maybe there is a reason to leave that out, but I would say this is part of such a rebuild. Anyhow.. Thanks for this episode !

[@squatch253]

My function tests only happen once the units are bolted to an engine, because just spinning them in a no load state on the bench doesn’t necessarily prove that they’re strong enough to do anything 👍

[@josephpetito9718]

incredible Geekness; Thanks a bunch!

[@johngibson3837]

Good video mate but you didn't mention how you would replace those pegs and how the insulation works on them

[@squatch253]

Those pegs don’t get disassembled, if one tests bad the end plate just gets swapped out for another one due to not being able to save the insulating sleeves.

[@pthomson9736]

Prep H. I love it!

[@TJAkin]

Curious that the old generators have no provision for air cooling as do most modern alternators. Fascinating about the green tags. I’ll keep an eye out for those as I go through my horde. Great series, thank you.

[@woodhonky3890]

I believe most of the cooling on an alternator is for the diodes.

[@rickbrandt9559]

Could have been a shop teacher , oops that would been 60's no shop in high school allowed today stamp guide 👍

[@AB-nu5we]

I didn't ask, but I was wondering which electrical grease you were using too. Glad the student (or students) that isn't/aren't afraid to ask questions asked. Because i chickened out. Ha ha.

[@paulsilva3346]

4:45, REMIND THEM, J.B. Weld works wonders on repairing Core return Parts... And Di-electric grease>?? 11:15 QUESTION Answered.! THANKS... Do I remember correctly that A SUPER M has Delco-Remey Oil cups.?? Or a TD 6, but I was impressed, back in 1961-2, that my father allowed me to top-off those oil cups. LOL>

[@ironman3406]

Learned something new about the colored tags, but what color would signify 24 volts?

[@squatch253]

Yellow is Delco-Remy 24 volt 👍

[@Thomasgarrick113]

If my memory is correct delco also used a red tag marked 24 volt with a 3 brush generator with one brush ajustable also i think prestolite used green tags on their electrical components the 24 volt gen and starters were used on early jd 4000 series tractors

[@jaybailey3518]

Fascinating !

[@SuperMAZ007]

What a great episode. The X231 and other prototype starters are a oddity on it's own. The big guy is probably 24V if I would have to guess? Really appreciate you covered this topic.

[@squatch253]

Thanks, the big starter does have 12 Volt on the tag 👍

[@SuperMAZ007]

@@squatch253 That is very interesting info. Usually something this big indicates a upgraded voltage system. However the only thing I can think of is a big engine that needed lot of cranking amps, where it was designed to operate.

[@andrewklahold2880]

They had 12 volt generators before alternator could you find a 12 volt generator and do a rebuild on that in an episode

[@sixtoes2313]

👍

[@dennissitter6574]

ds1945 Great videos. When installing brushes on a starter we were told to push down on the brushes to make sure they were properly seated on the commutator. I really enjoy seeing these old machines being restored. Are you going to put he old cab on?

[@squatch253]

Yes, but after I’m satisfied that the diesel engine is fully broken in because once the cab is on, having to get back in and work on anything will be difficult. The D2 was supposed to get ran and worked hard for a couple days straight at plow day weekend last fall, but my eye surgery and ensuing recovery period put a halt to that.

[@mrtswan1821]

Great, informative video Toby, thanks. My only criticism is that the closeups were a little bit blurry.

[@squatch253]

Unfortunately that’s the limitations of the GoPro camera, it doesn’t have zoom or close-up capability at all.

[@dans_Learning_Curve]

​@@squatch253 but still could make out what was going on.

[@Rezqewr]

Looking at the brush installation, it appears that the tension spring wraps around the metal post on the "insulated" brushes. Wouldn't that earth the brush to the case?

[@squatch253]

Those posts have insulation around their bases, keeping them isolated from the case.

[@Rezqewr]

@@squatch253 Ahh, got it. Thank you.

[@libsrdum]

I believe "X" may be code for "Experimental".

[@squatch253]

It is.

[@wemedeeres4105]

My guess is that unknown starter was taken off the prototype UDLX at some point. 😲🤯

[@squatch253]

Yeah - that still hurts a little bit lol 😂

[@robertmason6233]

Do you bed the brushes to the curvature of the commutator? I understand these ones didn't need it due to recent reconditioning.

[@robertwinton2649]

🤗❤️👍

[@davidtrollope6644]

So intersting 27:39

[@jenniferwhitewolf3784]

If the bushing in the end cap was worn to oversize and needed replacing, how do you suggest pulling out the worn bush from the blind hole? It looks like a small 'freeze plug' insert closes off the hole.. Would you just first knock that out, then replace it after bushing swap, or can the bush be changed without removing that closure cap?

[@squatch253]

Yep you’d remove the plug first, then drive the old bushing out - or just let the old bushing push the plug out instead. New bushing goes in, followed by a new plug to seal the outside of the bore again 👍