FCC Kills CableCard & The HDHomerun Prime 6 is a Casualty

[@LonSeidman]

Just to clarify as I'm seeing a lot of comments from folks who haven't watched the whole way through: The FCC's move no longer requires cable operators to offer CableCards but it doesn't mean they are taking them all back immediately. Many cable boxes use CableCards to operate so it's unlikely we'll see support drop anytime soon. So if you have a Prime now you'll be fine until your operator drops QAM. But the order means CATV operators /can/ do it whenever they want.

[@riopato2009]

I can't even return my cable box now which I don't even use and their system won't even allow them to take it off my account!!! So I'm being charged for a box that's not even hooked up and it's so old they can't even tell if it is or not. I kept the box waiting for the Prime 6 to finally come out so I can retire my Prime 3 or at least have 9 active tuners using 2 cable cards. Or even 12 tuners if I can get 2 prime 6!!!. I don't even have a choice to not have a cable box now!!!!

[@lordgarth1]

Well. We are about to get a new FCC in a little over a month...

[@jaredanwyl3686]

Lon, I have a Prime and was using it to access cable via a Plex server. (Comcast/Xfinity in Sacramento) However I was blocked from accessing (I forget exactly/Assume DRM Issues) some premium channels, such as HBO, Showtime. This led me to lose interest in the technology. Did you have any issues with premium channels?

[@riopato2009]

@@jaredanwyl3686 Hope you have been updating your Plex software and your HDHomerun equipment. Pretty soon both systems will eventually be non functional entirely now that these cable companies are going to force equipment on their customers once they decide to "upgrade" their back end. Channels like HBO are no doubt the first to be blocked, then the smaller cable networks like AMC and eventually the rest of the channels that aren't OTA.

[@ryanschaefer4847]

@@jaredanwyl3686 yeah, premium channels have a kind of DRM. If you subscribe to premium channels, you should be able to access their apps and streaming sites by verifying your cable subscription with the provider

[@marcberm]

Here we are two years later and the CableCard still hasn't gasped its last breath. I'm a long time TiVo user getting increasingly frustrated with their having mostly checked-out of the consumer DVR market. All of my streaming apps run off of Android TV boxes because the TiVo DVRs certainly can't handle them anymore. I've been looking at the "in development" page for the Prime 6 for years it seems, not even realizing that stock of the last run of 3s was still out there. I've got one now to experiment with, along with another HDHomeRun for OTA, and a Plex DVR. I'm just disappointed that Plex doesn't handle DRM and so most of the channels are unwatchable unless outside the Plex experience on the HDHomeRun apps. I feel like we're wandering into the interstellar medium between CableCard and whatever comes next and it's going to be a long journey.

[@davea.9570]

Im sure with the new data caps in place they'd love people to stream more. It all counts towards your usage

[@riopato2009]

Or worse. All these streaming services then have to pay for bandwidth negotiations to be not counted against their subscribers which in turn that cost gets transferred to the consumers by the streaming services! This way Netflix gets more expensive but your internet stays crappy but cheap.

[@brodriguez11000]

Most likely. That's why more efficient codecs will help. Same quality in less space.

[@abeygeorge1588]

If the FCC doesn’t care about mandating cable providers to support cablecards, the alternative should have been to mandate cable providers to make streaming apps that work with Smart tv and tv streaming devices so can don’t need a cable box.

[@keco185]

HD Home Run also lets you watch remotely using a bit of trickery. It meant a group of people could share a single cable subscription from different houses.

[@urmassulg1534]

Used Comcast cable card years with Windows Media Center . Had 4 channel PCI-express tuner. Unlimited DVR :D

[@Jiggs224u]

I sure do miss media center. Sad it was removed in windows 10... I even bought the add-on for windows 8...

[@EvanWasHere]

One addition. The end of times for cable cards was announced when Microsoft killed Windows Media Center. At the time, I had no issue recording HBO to my Windows computer using my Ceton card. When they killed it, I was forced to move from Ceton to SiliconDust and Plex, but all the encrypted channels were now lost. It was the end of an era. I only use the cable card now to watch news and will move to an online version when Verizon FIOS kills support of it.

[@LonSeidman]

The DVR doesn't work but you can watched encrypted channels on HDHomerun using the Windows UAP app (which also works on Xbox) and some of the Android TV devices out there.

[@AG-bp3ll]

I really wish we could get some more consumer friendly people in the FCC.

[@lordgarth1]

Like next month? Lol

[@PoeLemic]

@@lordgarth1 Hopefully, Trump picked people that seem to screw the consumers. I thought new FCC guy would be awesome, but he might have been worse than priors.

[@andreamitchell4758]

it's a 100% revolving door with nearly all of them working for comcrap and slime warner for their next trick they are going to totally kill the internet by removing section 230 making everyone "publishers"therfore making ALL of the web liable for anything that is posted anywhere , so goodbye posting anything the internet is about to become cable TV now too nobody will be allowed to post anything anymore only a select handful of carefully vetted people will allowed to use the internet for anything but passive viewing or browsing

[@thescott7539]

@@andreamitchell4758 When you choose what can and can't be published on your site, especially when done for political purposes, you are indeed acting like a publisher and should be held to that standard. Twitter, Facebook, YT and all those other liberal companies brought it on themselves when they all decided to silence people they disagreed with.

[@andreamitchell4758]

@@thescott7539 it's a trick they should not be allowed to do that but removing section 230 will only make things even worse , then they will just say well we have to remove everything now because otherwise we will be sued

[@DanBellJr]

I'm running 4 TiVos with lifetime subscriptions in my house so this worries me 🤔

[@JoeCool102986]

Same here! Guess I’ll not invest in that TiVo Edge with lifetime.

[@Kamidake83]

Yeah this worries me to. I jumped onto TiVo when my attempt with setting up HDHomerun + Plex fell through

[@TheFaustianMan]

Jesus, I accidentally found your channel and your stuff is incredible. Especially the Comcast Cable stuff. Very insightful.

[@rronne7446]

Very sad to find out that HomeRun Prime 6 will not come out. I have been waiting for a couple years just waiting to get one. I may just have to pick up the Prime 3 just for the extra tuners, because with time shifting most of my program, often we have more shows to record and watch than I have tuners for. Not too sure what I will do if Comcast does phase out the cable cards in my area.

[@tonberryhunter]

You had the perfect late 80s cyborg haircut in 2013.

[@LonSeidman]

Yeah I had to change my haircut so that my true cyborg origins would be revel... oh shoot. Never mind.

[@davedumond9268]

When I heard the FCC news I knew it was the death knell for cablecard devices. I've had HDHOMERUN Prime for many years and still use daily on as many as three TVs around the house for my 400-channel Spectrum subscription. It is the review that brought me to your channel! It's been a great ride and I hope Spectrum doesn't recall the card and discontinue service anytime soon. I am worried about what if any support I'll get if I have issues - and there have been issues over the years, like huge numbers of channels just disappearing. The WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) makes it difficult to cut the cord. On top of that, the current Rate War between Charter (owner of Spectrum) and Roku now threatens the availability of the SpectrumTV app. Unsettling times indeed.

[@BlackDragonNationalPresident]

Man I loved my MOXI cable recorder box and used it for years and years. I remember that MOXI originally cost $9,000.00. Can you believe that!? I wound up getting one for $175.00 when I worked for ARRIS after they bought MOXI. This is when I learned about cable cards. They rented for $5.00 each from Comcast. It was much cheaper then renting a cable box, but you still had to rent them. Eventually Comcast raised the price to almost $11.00 per month so they wound up costing as much as a Comcast cable box. Eventually ARRIS dumped MOXI and only provided support for it for two years. After that it all died. I never moved to TiVO afterwards. But I loved the flexibility of those ultra huge hard drives MOXI had for storage of your favorite programs. Thanks for the video.

[@steveblixt9437]

I must be the exception. My local Comcast outlet gives me my cable card for free, although I've had it for about 12 years or so.

[@SuperBigDog2U]

Lon, not sure you'll get this seeing how this video is almost a year old....I too own the Prime 3, actually 2 of them. I use mine for watching TV but also with my Plex DVR to record tv shows and watch later/store for future viewing. One of my tuners has been acting up and dropping recordings after it shows they are recording. It would get through then entire recording time then just drop. Have you found a new way to DVR shows to Plex from Cable in your own use? My apartment doesn't have a good clear sight to use OTA so the cablecards were/are still very useful to me, but hoping some other options pop up to still be able to dvr to my Plex.

[@JonRowlison]

Our cable bill (we haven't 'cut' the cable channels at this point...) shows that Comcast/XFinity is charging me about $35/month for cable TV while they charge me $65/month for my Internet data plus another $35/month in random fees... over the years, my Internet portion has gone from $15/month to the current $65... since Comcast collects revenue from both my channels and Internet data... they aren't really losing any money. I think most cable companies are in the same boat. They're just slowly turning into Internet companies as the cable TV broadcast product dies a slow death.

[@StephenAtt797]

Lon I've been a big Slingbox user for years, as u know in November they plan on shutting down. If I get my hands on an HDHR Prime and a cable card from my provider (I've confirmed they still rent M-Cards), can I do almost the same thing for external access? I'm also a big Plex user, though I don't use it much for any Live TV and I have Cable DVR in the cloud. I have one cablebox with lousy reception and thought maybe a Prime connected to a FireTV might safe the cost of rewiring and monthly box rental. Any advice regarding the HDHomerun Prime? THX

[@MrKeepitmovin09]

I don't have a cable card and my cable provider isn't issuing them no more... am I stuck like Chuck without a cc or can I go directly to the hrp from my cable box and just use as a DVR or is there other options out there for using hrp without a cable card? Thanks!

[@johncasey5594]

That is why I have pirated for decades. Can't trust services offered legally to be there unaltered for any reasonable amount of time. No providers in Canada ever had cablecards. Netflix regularly removes content. Once I download it, it is mine forever, no restrictions, not data charges to access content, no stuttering content, even in a power outage, I still have complete access to my library.

[@PoeLemic]

Yeah, that is what I hate about Netflix. I want to watch a show, get distracted by life issues or world issues (e.g., pandemic), then come back & show is gone. So, I'd like to do what you do. If you don't mind me asking, how do you keep a backup-copy of what you want to watch? I'd like to find a good way to (easily) do home-recordings of content that I am paying for. I'm just curious -- if you have time, please explain. Thanks.

[@johncasey5594]

@@PoeLemic I would not go through that effort. Google torrents and file lockers. Torrent sites are being taken down, so older content may be harder to find. I can't say much more than that on here. If you want to record, there is HD Home run, but once again, they are making that a little harder.

[@johncasey5594]

There is also the Plex media server, that allows you to record streams quite easily as I understand it, but I don't use that service. Join a Facebook Plex group for more info.

[@WoodUCreate]

They caused their own demise. By trying to charge you for everything you do, back in the day around 2010, you could use the HDHR (HD Homerun) on all cable channels unencrypted. I would record upwards of 15-20 programs per day with these 2 HDHRs I had. What a wonderful time that was.

[@PoeLemic]

Dear Jesus, my friend, I do miss the days when Win 7, WMC, and Ceton InfiniTV 6 were the ultimate solution to watching & recording shows -- to watch when you wanted. Good days.

[@missyd0g2]

We had a TV that supported a cable card. Wide Open West, WOW could not get it to work after the did an upgrade in 2009 in my City. So they gave us a cable box for free. Turns out they only had 4 customers. The GM of the cable company tried but their software wouldn’t work. We moved 3 years ago and miss WOW.

[@joelkirzner]

As Charlton Heston once said, "From my cold dead hands!" Verizon is going to have to wrangle away the cablecards from my WMC HTPCs!!! I pay for two cablecards for my Verizon FIOS TV service and I've been a happy camper for years. Before Verizon, I was on Comcast, and it was a similar setup. I'm still using Windows 7 WMC HTPCs, so we'll see how long this charade will last. Windows 7 EOL came and went, along with the WMC guide, but there's EPG123. Fingers crossed the cable companies allow these cards to still function for years to come. As you mentioned, a lot of the existing DVR boxes have the same cablecards embedded inside. It will take years to transition from those older boxes to newer devices in everyone's homes.

[@PoeLemic]

@Joel ... Exact same setup for me on Comcast. I have WMC on old PC's and works perfect, most of time. I love it and also use EPG123. Been planning to virtualize it, but might not now.

[@dpt17]

Sad to hear this about Cablecard. In 2011 I discovered the Ceton InfiniTV 4 PCIe and Win7 WMC and built my first HTPC. Now, I have 2 HDHomerun Prime devices, Plex, and every device I own can watch TV. Cablecard has been a great thing. Hope Comcast doesn't drop it straight away. Guess I'll look into Silicondust's antennae products...

[@mae2759]

I have that Ceton InfiniTV 4 in my PC, but it really only works with Windows Media Center. When Windows forced the upgrade to Windows 10 (which doesn't run WMC), that basically rendered the Ceton useless. Is there another way to use it?

[@PoeLemic]

@@mae2759 Just keep using it on Win7 PC. That's what I do. Still works for me. Just don't upgrade on that machien to Win 10. That's all you have to do to keep using it.

[@mae2759]

@@PoeLemic Thanks. I've already upgraded that machine, so I'll probably get a cheap PC on craigslist and add it. Hopefully I can still download WMC from the Microsoft website, because I don't think it comes pre-installed on Win 7.

[@nrnoble]

Plex + Sonarr + Radarr = everything except live TV, such as sports. Sonarr can easily be set up to work similar to a DVR, schedule the DL of current shows which are magically available shortly after the show has completed its network broadcast (with commercials removed).

[@TomBabula]

Might be also due to phased out QAM in favor of iptv but it remains to be seen when they implement in their cable box. This would free up more channels for faster internet, would love to see increased bandwidth on upload side. Who knows how long it will take them to roll out midsplits or high-splits at cable nodes.

[@jjones2582]

It would have been nice if the FCC had mandated that cable companies had to provide an internet API recording method as an alternative to giving up the CableCard requirement.

[@PhillysOnTheHill]

They won’t they are not here for us the consumer

[@PoeLemic]

@@PhillysOnTheHill Agreed. They are there to maximize profits, not to provide us with content that we can legitimately store at our homes for future watching.

[@WilliamBurlingame]

I became a cord-cutter three years ago. I get 30 OTA channels with an antenna in the attic. I also have a Silicon Dust HD HomeRun for OTA that I use with Plex as a DVR device. I don't subscribe to paid live streams. I have discovered that there is life without cable TV. I already had an Amazon Prime and Hulu Plus account before I became a cord-cutter. I have three Roku devices. I have a library of more than 500 TCM videos that I recorded with a cable card before I dropped the cable service. I now have Google's Gigabit Fiber for the internet. It's $70/mo with no extra fees added on and no contract. You may be surprised how many OTA channels are available. I don't live in a large TV market.

[@PoeLemic]

Where do you live to get Google fiber so cheap? Lucky you. I live in Houston, and we pay OUT-THE-ASS for Comcast. You don't want to know what my monthly is.

[@WilliamBurlingame]

@@PoeLemic Huntsville, AL The city installed dark fiber for any provider to lease. Google accepted. Comcast, WOW, and ATT chose to use their own lines. Google just announced 2Gb for $100/mo here and in Nashville. The city decided to install the dark fiber after the success of Chatanooga had. We are about 100 miles from them and compete with them to attract business. I don't really need the Gb speed, but I have saved a lot of money since dropping Comcast. Three years ago Comcast wanted more than I'm paying now for just internet and charge extra for modem rental. The speed was not very high and asynchronous. Google's is 1 Gb down AND up, plus they include the modem at $70. I constantly get 900+ Mbs on speed tests. Users blame the cable companies for their monopolistic practices, but it's the local governments who grant the franchise terms.

[@lonster3000]

The Prime always intrigued me, but the issue of which channels had DRM held me back.

[@capkingy]

I love my HDhome run prime. It is awesome to have my tv on all my devices. It is fantastic with a lifetime subscription with Plex for the dvr features.

[@riopato2009]

@@capkingy The Prime was the only reason I kept Windows Media center running as a back up to record premium / pay per view channels and being a Kickstarter backer for the HDHomerun DVR engine. Pretty soon there will be no reason for any of this and just use regular OTA.

[@breadfan_85]

Same. Last I checked, they still hadn't gotten DRM figured out, so the Prime is only useful with a handful of channels that aren't even popular. I bet with this update, they stop trying to get the certification altogether, effectively killing the very prospect of the Prime. So sad. I was really looking forward to going legit so I didn't have to pirate anymore. But when the cable companies do stuff like this, it makes me feel completely justified, so whatever. Guess I'll just keep pirating and not feeling bad about it. 🤷‍♂️

[@mcoulter]

I know I'm picking a bad time to do this, but I'm switching from internet via phone company to cable company due to a low limit provided by my phone company. Until now I have used the HD Homerun Extend and OTA Antenna on top of the house because of our remote range. Switching to Cable Internet will greatly increase our speed drastically for a fraction of our phone bill (also dropping our landline finally). But rather than run a second coax through my house to support both the Antenna and the Cable at the same time, I'm considering just getting the basic local channels from Xfinity. My question is are the local channels still unencrypted where I could use the Extend box, or would I have to buy the Prime and get the CableCard just for locals?

[@LonSeidman]

It depends on the cable company but most likely you'll need the Prime and a CableCARD. Most cable companies are no longer providing clear QAM.

[@mcoulter]

@@LonSeidman Thanks for responding! I just wish someone would do an affordable local channel only package. All those service groups bundle it with so much, when I don't want to pay $50+/mo for "new cable". Xfinity offers those channels for $10/mo but then I need to switch inputs for their lease boxes... ugh. I have loved everything on my Android TV/NVidia boxes for years now. I guess I'm running a second coax line and keeping the antenna :(

[@LonSeidman]

@@mcoulter Locast.org is our best hope, they are slowly building out a locals only service using a loophole in copyright law.

[@mcoulter]

@@LonSeidman agreed

[@vltek]

Interesting timing for me. I went from cablecard/TiVo service (120 a month for just the service) to KZbin tv saving 60 bucks after taxes because I got tired of waiting for the prime 6 and the 3 was always 4-500 bucks. I did this over the summer. There are only 2 channels I miss now.

[@ohlmntt]

Switched from a triple play 150 down and 20 up plan for $150 a month with comcast.. to a gigabit fiber plan with AT&T for $60 per month, let go of the home phone, and got youtube tv for another $60 per month. Best decision of my life

[@PoeLemic]

Where do you live -- that you have fiber? We're in Houston and stuck with Comcast. They can do 1Gbit speed, but it does cost you here.

[@ohlmntt]

@@PoeLemic I'm in Georgia near Atlanta. Yeah cable just isn't it and it's just old tech at this point. Even if comcast has high speed in your area, you'll be paying quite a bit for it. I would think in a city like Houston you'd have some high speed options. I would check with Charter, At&t, and everyone else in your area just to get more info. The website was telling me At&t fiber wasn't available at my specific address but got it cleared up once we were on the phone.

[@techman210]

Xfinity Stream app on roku kinda helped kill the need for a cable card as well.

[@evilgmail]

And it doesn’t count against hour cap.

[@segaboy9894]

I have been thinking of adding a second HD Homerun Prime to my network. Am I able to buy a second-hand cable card from eBay and activate it with my cable provider?

[@mikeb6961]

Hey Lon - I have a HDHomerun prime with cablecard and cant get HBO or any FOX channels to decode - but they work fine on my one remaining cable box. I use plex as well to connect to the HDHomerun - is this typical?

[@LonSeidman]

HBO Is likely due to DRM - Plex doesn’t support drm channels but the HDHOMERUN app on certain platforms does.

[@MarcEricLaneGlobal]

I'm confused - if we have one of these already, will cable companies be required to support the cards that are out in the wild?

[@LonSeidman]

They are not required to any longer but unlikely they’ll end support right now

[@igeekone]

What will likely happen is new customers will no longer have the option for CableCard. Current users won't be affected, as long as they don't change service.

[@meandmyEV]

@@igeekone I hope you are right. I will probably not continue my Comcast TV service if I can’t use my hd home run prime. I’m hoping they know that a lot of us feel that way and will continue to support them. I’m willing to spend $20 for my cable on top of internet service for the occasional live sporting event or show and the couple of shows I record. I’m not going to pay any more than that to rent boxes.

[@riopato2009]

Are you kidding? They can't wait for your card to fail or start having issues. I'm already seeing certain channels periodically losing their signal feed to the card but the box isn't having the same problem and the box is much older than my card.

[@riopato2009]

@@meandmyEV I've been a subscriber to fiostv since it's beta program at least a decade ago and the moment they discontinue my cable card function, is the day that more than a decade subscription will be terminated including internet and phone. My answer to this isn't that I'm not cancelling, they are forcing me to cancel for not giving me any choice.

[@zaleski80]

Xfinity Stream BETA should be renamed to "BUGGY ALPHA", dreadful on LG WebOS. Thank you again for the great content (despite of the bad news) Lon.

[@nyc90]

I always laugh when people complain about beta software being buggy.

[@tim3172]

@@nyc90 While I agree with your comment in general... it's worth mentioning that Xfinity Stream "Beta" came out in 2018. It's now 2021 and they REALLY should have moved past the beta stage by now.

[@flashesbuck]

Hey what about tivo? Mine has a cable card.

[@leadfootfoot1474]

Lon, I noticed that your voice seems to be at exactly the same loudness/volume all the time, i.e. it doesn't rise or fall. Are you using some sort of automatic compression, or what? No offense intended, but the effect over several minutes of listening is kind of like TYPING EVERYTHING IN CAPS IF YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN. If that's your normal way of speaking then so be it, but some variation would be welcome. I thank you for an informative video. We've been using an HD Homerun Prime for over 8 years and it's been totally reliable. We record most of our favorite TV shows so that we can skip the commercials during playback. Our Windows 8.1 PC includes Windows Media Center which makes it easy to record, play back, or view live programs with the option to Pause while viewing live. The HD Homerun TV viewing app works perfectly on our 2 PCs and and 2 laptops in the house. All in all, the HD Homerun Prime is a very good product, and it has saved us a LOT of money over the last 8 or 9 years. Cheers!

[@moi01887]

Is anyone using the HDHomerun prime 3 with FiOS TV local-channel service and no CableCard? I struggled for years to get good reception with a rooftop antenna and finally gave up and signed up for the FiOS cheapo local-channels-only service. But my TV (a Panasonic plasma about 10 years old) and my Mediasonic TV tuner both won't receive the HD channels - apparently because they're encoded in MPEG4 and the devices don't support that. So I'm wondering if the HDHomerun device will work with my service.

[@daveb4028]

Well I guess that's the final nail in the coffin (at least some cord cutters). I've used Cable Card on and off for years with my HDHomeRun Prime - there are still some programs available on cable that aren't streamed and when I'd get frustrated not being able to get them I'd reconnect the HDHR Prime and add cable services to my Comcast subscription again. So now there'll be no going back and I can just wait for the channels to appear in a streaming service.

[@milostea]

One word: IPTV No more cable boxes, no more cable cards, no more tuners, no more TIVOs,....we've been on it for 7 months and we're not going back.

[@cubdukat]

I'm debating about whether to get the Prime 3. I have a Tivo Bolt right now, but I'm getting tired of dealing with almost every program I download from it to my PC being corrupted and TiVo not doing anything about it.

[@dane.dagreat]

I am a HD Homerun Prime user. I bought this because of your channel Lon. I really hope that the FCC does not stop this soon. I hope there is a grandfather clause #FCC #CABLECard

[@dsr0116]

I had a CableCard in my HDTV for quite a few years. Besides not having rental fees, I found the image quality was also better than a cable box (since all processing was from TV: card just gives it the channel tuning). Comcast in my area made them obsolete even before I upgraded my HDTV to OLED 4K, when they sent announcements that TV bands were being transitioned to a new video codec (that compatible CableCard HDTVs couldn't decode).

[@michaelamireh2800]

Just got my prime and cable card last week from xfinity, so get them while you can!

[@RFC1997]

So if the Prime becomes obsolete because of the cable card, will there be any alternatives to recording local stations on my Plex server?

[@gtbeakerman]

Yes, HD HomeRun Connect Duo and Quatro will tune OTA local signals.

[@SandTguy]

I us a cable card in my TiVo. But I do not us Comcast or Xfinty. But I do us Spectrum. So what happeneds to TiVo now. How would You us them.

[@David-ok9st]

So this device would work with my DirectTV?

[@jbdragon3295]

The cable company boxes using cable cards doesn't mean they can't just stop using your stand-alone cable card. They would want you on their own hardware faster then later as they can charge you their monthly fees.

[@jackcomputers-app]

Thanks for the shout-out:)

[@PoeLemic]

Yeah, noticed mine too. Feels good to finally give back to Lon.

[@michaelrousselle6080]

Had a optimum cablecard, all sorts of problems this year , plenty of FCC complaints. had to get rid of my cable card and Tivo, go streaming. Lost channels and they could not active the card. Said I need their cable box. Again the consumer loses. Optimum prices have skyrocked with all kinds of surcharges. No other cable company in my area. No channels in my area with a antenna, A good streaming service is Locast

[@CodeKiLLa26]

Been enjoying my HDHomerun Prime 3 for over a year. I have two nVidia Shield TV's, a FireStick 4K and an Xbox One S as my streaming devices. I also sometimes stream on my iPhone, iPad and MacBook Pro. This in my opinion is a better option than any of the streaming services out there. You don't save money from cutting the cord because you still have to pay for internet service and the streaming service which are expensive and don't offer all the channels as standard cable. And this does not count towards your bandwidth limit.

[@martinphillips4607]

I like many million of Americans wanted this prouduct like you have , so I could run this on my network, but as usual corruption at the fcc Dictate what me and you can have. The decision the FCC made had nothing to do with choice . Now there no need for me to get this product.

[@riopato2009]

but that leaves people the only choice to either have cable tv or no cable tv at all. How exactly does this help the cable companies?

[@onemanshow4116]

Can you make a video on the revenue breakdown of your business by platform? Not necessarily the actual numbers, but it would be interesting to know the percentage of revenue from KZbin, floatplane, etc and the breakdown of that revenue (percentage that is sponsors, affiliate links, revenue sharing)

[@ThomasHalways]

I did not even knew about the existence of these cards, I would have used it of course... But since we "cut the cord" several years before, its kind of a moot point to us. We never looked back. We are so happy with having internet only and a Roku. Never again cable channels.

[@plexnbrown760]

Every 3mo like clock work spectrum adds five bucks to the bill.

[@KameraShy]

The decline in cable TV subscribers will abate as the streamers keep jacking up their prices. Dumped KZbin TV after their latest increase.

[@riopato2009]

why do you think these services are increasing their prices? These services also are effected by cable companies not giving the best bandwidth for their product. That's if they aren't paying for the best bandwidth that offers the best experience for these product.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

Cable TV and Internet were more than my electric and gas bills every month and I live in the North East. No way will I ever again fund the very industry which ridicules 1/2 of America on a daily basis. Babs, Cher, the View, network fake news and all similar ilk can starve to death. Now I just stream what I want and use Tablo for free TV with no commercials. Millionaires in the entertainment industry telling us we are selfish should tell anyone these are not good people.

[@jayc2903]

So the xfinity stream app doesnt work with Nvida Shield?

[@LonSeidman]

Negative

[@andreamitchell4758]

you can get it to work you just need to find the right .apk just do some searching it's not that hard to find i have it running on all my 4k fire sticks and my fire HD 8 and fire HD 10 but why would you even want it ,it sucks it's almost as slow as their shitty cable boxes, i never use it and when i do there are issues , i used it a couple weeks ago on my fire tablet but only because my friend was going to be on a cooking show but i could count on one hand the amount of times i use it , it's slooooooooooow plus i have a fire TV recast and i only use that and apk's for everything anything else is just not worth it anymore

[@johnsmith-vz4sk]

In the uk the main satellite boxes have 11 tuners but you don’t own the boxes but you don’t pay for them either !

[@PoeLemic]

Lucky freaking you. I am Jelly -- from Poe in Houston, Texas

[@mae2759]

Question - can you buy your own cable card instead of renting it from the cable company? Obviously need to call them to activate.

[@PoeLemic]

No, you have to rent it monthly. They say they give you one for free, but Comcast charges $10 bucks for mine -- since I have another DVR outlet being used ... My mom & her DVR box.

[@abeygeorge1588]

They are on Amazon, but providers claim they are stolen and done accept their Mac Ids

[@johnfleming8229]

Yes you can buy them from ebay, I bought 2 and use both with ziply fiber so they no longer charge me a monthly fee.- - But if you have Comcast you can't. Comcast cable cards are serial # controlled in a national database. I tried using my own cable card with Comcast and after 3 days of troubleshooting with tech support's cable card team, they said only their serial # cards would work.

[@Analyzer52]

Imagine how things would have turned out if Ceton and HDHomwrun would have just merged. Things would have turned out better. There are plenty of Ceton 6 tuners in the wild but they won't work with the HDHomerun app so you have to stick with Windows 7.

[@steveblixt9437]

I'm using Windows 8.1, and Media Center, with my Ceton as it's still supported by Microsoft and Windows 7 no longer is. I've had my Cable Card for over ten years and it's still performing just fine.

[@Analyzer52]

@@steveblixt9437 Still using Windows 7 works better for extenders. Just have to use epg123 for the guide. Works great 6 years plus no problems. But with the way TV is delivered changing daily I'm always concerned.

[@mae2759]

@@steveblixt9437 Is it even possible to get a copy of Windows 8.1? Would love to find an old PC and put that and my ceton card in it.

[@theunboxer3964]

I remember that I had to have a wifi card. To use the internet on my old laptop. I've never used a cable card.

[@KRich408]

My last 2 cable companys said they didn't have to provide cable cards because they are exempt because they are going to a new system even though they haven't done this yet and some people still have cable cards they just refused to give out anymore! This was in 2018 the company is called Zito media.

[@craigm1562]

Snagged a second Prime 3 on eBay when I heard rumblings of this possibility a few months ago in fear prices and/or scarcity would go up, and the conclusion that the Prime 6 was dead. Bummer that it’s happening, I’ve only enjoyed Channels DVR for about a year so far and it’s saving a ton of money for me. Hopefully Comcast doesn’t kill them completely for a few more years!

[@BuddyPride87]

Hey Lon, great video, been watching you a long time. While I do not doubt the Comcast numbers for Q1, Q2 and Q3 are going down (and will continue to do so), some of that may be attributed to people to lost their jobs due to COVID, and could no longer afford cable TV. Notice that Q2 is the largest number.

[@xowishuwereherex]

Cable tv technology is 40 years old from the patent level to market level. The coax cable has a physical capacity limit of 75-300 ohm the Omega symbol. So it is highly likely to lose signal and connect with the weather. This is a big advantage of T-Mobile Home Internet , Skylink from Space X and Google Fiber if you can get it.- all 3 behaviour in extreme weather is use able not super fast but won’t go out completely if unobstructed.

[@andreamitchell4758]

Skylink from Space X will not go out in bad weather it will just explode into flames like everything else Musk does and burn down your house in the process

[@RayJacobsenJr]

I called comcast to get faster internet they said I would have to turn in my cards from my 2 TiVo 's making them worthless. Not a good way to treat customers.

[@rhrm1710]

wow. Thats messed up

[@riopato2009]

What does cable cards have anything to do with your internet?

[@gtbeakerman]

Call again and talk to someone with a brain.

[@andreamitchell4758]

you're lucky they even gave you any cards at all i argued with them man times anr they lied and lied and lied nd told me i could not have a card and they were not obligated to give me one

[@rustyshackleford457]

Was a great run, thanks to my cousin I was a early adopter when this started. I had two cards a dedicated media center pc as a dvr for years using windows media center extender with multiple Xbox 360s serving as the cable boxes for a fantastic setup. Unfortunately media center died with windows 8 and lost a lot of its support in the last few years. For now still I’m able to use the cards to watch live tv using my Alexa devices not sure my options for a dvr as this tech may have run its course which is unfortunate

[@steveblixt9437]

I'm using Media Center with Windows 8.1 and a cable card, and it works just fine.

[@estusflask982]

Was Ajit Pai behind this? Can't wait until he's gone January 20.

[@LonSeidman]

This time it was a bi-partisan vote - both parties went along with it.

[@PhillysOnTheHill]

He presented the findings to them

[@PoeLemic]

@@PhillysOnTheHill Yes, and they probably didn't understand what he was explaining. I thought he would open things up and give consumers more options, but that FCC Chair Guy did the consumers wrong. More lies, and the consumer pays on this one. Less freedom and more costs. But, damned, not the case. Cable-cards (IMHO) were quite an innovation.

[@andreamitchell4758]

you really think it will matter LOL FCC is a revolving door get rid of one poo and in comes another one they are going to completely kill the internet soon with the repeal of section 230 pretty soon nobody will be allowed to do anything but watch and be passive it will make the entire internet into "publishers" and assume all of the liability that entails, nobody is going to let you post anything anymore , only a select few vetted individuals will be allowed to post and their posts will be heavily filtered monitored and censored as well

[@estusflask982]

@@andreamitchell4758 Trump's gonna be gone in a few days. Section 230 stays.

[@alimaleki217]

The Prime 6 is the definition of vapor ware. I don’t think they ever had a real product.

[@JoeCool102986]

Wait what!? All I have are TiVo’s and cablecards!

[@somemovingpictures]

Yeah, same here.

[@PoeLemic]

@@somemovingpictures Yeah, SUCKS TO BE YOU TWO ... No, ha ha ha ... Sucks to be me too. I'm in SAME DAMN BOAT ...

[@aaronjohnson4681]

even if a hd home run prime 6 were to still happen, they would need to get certified and all of that stuff but if people do want that same multituner scenario, they could Just get more than 1 3 tuner, Yes it would involve more costs But it probably would be worth it involving the 3 tuner devices rather than waiting for the 6 tuner

[@riopato2009]

most Cable cards support 6 tuner signals on 1 card. Always had 6 tuners before HDHomerun when a company like Ceton was around. Unfortunately there won't be 6 tuners at all now.

[@PoeLemic]

@@riopato2009 Yeah, that's what I have ... a Ceton InfiniTV 6. It says it can record 6 channels at once, but I only figured out 4 with WMC. But, hey, 4 is better than none.

[@riopato2009]

@@PoeLemic It's still better than 3 tuners. It just irks me to be so close to getting my cable card to stream 6 tuners again and the device becomes vaporware over night. I'm simply disappointed and considering on resurrecting my InfiniTV 6 on a cheap itx build just to see if it still works.

[@poelemic3642]

@@riopato2009 Yes, it (InfinitTv 6) really does work well (enough) on Comcast. I had trouble with the DRM channels (like HBO). Yes, it can record it, but you can't watch it (other than on the PC that you recorded it on). So, that's kindof problematic -- sharing it around the house, is impossible. But, it works for normal unencrypted channels, which a good portion on Comcast are not encrypted. But, you have to use EPG23 or something like that to get channel guide. But, other than that and maintaining it some (like rebooting it -- because the encryption keys between PlayReady and the Ceton box will get screwed up ... or mine does, so a reboot will fix it ... yet, you lose some content because the signal was synced or something like that). Whatever, set-it-up and you'll learn quick -- just by doing. But, it's not for the "faint at heart", because you'll have to overcome a few obstactles that you just online forums for.

[@michaelcarbone6101]

Was that leather bearskin⁉

[@theannoyedmrfloyd3998]

I heard Sling TV was going to be discontinued.

[@jimt8022]

sling box is ending service Nov 2022. not sure about Sling tv. two different things. i have both tivo and sling box. looks like i am getting left behind.

[@richardsmith1161]

Time for SD to add TVE support like Channels

[@Alphahydro]

I patiently waited for the Prime 6 but when xTeVe came along, I threw in the towel.

[@daviddapy8714]

Spectrum cable does all that with no box and no card now, and if your at home you don't even have to log in

[@TomBabula]

I cut tv cord completely, maybe only subscribe for one month each year on December for holidays but that’s that’s it. Otherwise I play video games or watch rental movies for entertainment in front of TV screen.

[@johnnemesh5459]

CableCard's death SHOULD be big news...but it's completely irrelevant, because cable TV is completely irrelevant. If Xfinity, Cox, Charter etc. want to make it harder to access their programming on the devices we choose, then there are other alternatives, such as KZbin TV, Hulu Live, Sling, etc. that we can use instead. However, I, for one, refuse to actually PAY MONEY to a service that has advertising. You can offer your programing for FREE with ads, or charge a subscription fee. Not both.

[@saiga6360]

Meh. I was going to return mine anyway since I cancelled my FIOS TV. Now I don't know what to do with my HD Homerun Prime. Can I trade it for the Quatro? :)

[@billshugard7875]

There's a market for HD Homeruns on eBay.

[@tarzanbigcity]

We stream Xfinity TV thru our Roku using the Beta Application. No cable box required. Roku does it all

[@JamesSmith-sw3nk]

I don't believe that Canada ever had cable card.

[@solar3mpire]

What is a TV?

[@Mike.D.843]

I bet Comcast/Xfinity will start charging for the Cable Card now that they aren't required to provide them. I dumped cable a few years ago except for internet. I still have my HD Home Run Prime... need to sell that thing since I'll never subscribe to cable again.

[@PoeLemic]

@Mallan ... That day is already here. , Comcast used to give one free, but they changed the wording on contract to state that they give it away FREE if you don't have another digital outlet. But, I have my Mom (who don't understand PC's) who just SAFELY uses a Comcast DVR, so my cable card is $10 bucks and DVR is $20 bucks a month.

[@Mike.D.843]

@@PoeLemic Yeah last time I had CATV with Xfinity, I believe it was in 2017, if the cable card was the only device on your account it was no charge. I actually got a customer owned equipment credit, still do for my cable modem. However, if you had a Comcast set top box then the cable card or any other equipment was leased to you for a fee. My original comment was basically saying that I bet there won't be any free use of the cable card anymore now that they are not legally required to provide it. Whether its your only device or not, I anticipate they will make you pay for it. On another note, how stupid is it that they tell you you're paying to lease the equipment? Why not just include it in the monthly cost of the service and not mention it? Why draw attention to it?

[@loweg]

I've been waiting for Prime 6. I have Spectrum and use the app on multiple devices. Also I'm using playon software on PC and hdhomerun connect to record shows I want to watch before they become available on the app immediately after live broadcast.

[@Ben7seven7]

I use the Ceton infini TV 6 and Windows media center for TV

[@abeygeorge1588]

Did you ever to get it to work on Windows 10?

[@AaronJohnson-mo8rf]

maybe they could redo the prime 6 project, my idea is, based on what you said about pulling in programming from both tuner and streaming maybe the idea for prime 6 should be that they could take programming coming in from live tv services ppl subscribe to like youtube tv and other places, and that can be used as virtual tuners to mix with their over the air content and on demand content they get from on demand places

[@Xrusader]

Slingbox no longer an option either. Discontinued.

[@NewAgeDIY]

Cable company shot themselves in the foot by charging too much for their service’s. With over 10 streaming services in my area (Vancouver BC) and devices like AppleTV selecting the one’s that best fit your needs cost about $40 then adding $100 for hi speed fibre with unlimited data you end up paying less and getting much more entertainment and very fast internet.

[@joejoe6949]

Xfinity stream work with roku and some fire stick.

[@ricksiddiqui8354]

That's what we are doing for 4 tvs. I'm saving $40 and t0when I wired my cable, I also worked Ethernet.

[@JamesLeigh28]

I have a CableCard and HD homerun prime because of you! I'm going to be so upset if comcast eventually comes after me for it back.

[@PoeLemic]

Instead of armed insurgents trying to kidnap and torture the Wisconsin Governor, do we need to do that to the FCC Chairman???? I've got a mask and some rope around here.

[@poelemic3642]

@corey Babcock Well, yeah, this Lon Steidman video's got me a little rawled up. I like my WMC and unlimited recording. Comcast better keep it working. Wrong if they don't.

[@Wintersnowfall8]

Tivo is still selling tivo that use a cable card for $400 that wont work anymore.

[@xowishuwereherex]

Bus speed also has to match

[@richardsmith1161]

Spectrum doesn’t require cable boxes anymore

[@jasoncox5505]

Spectrum is separate markets and technologies.... nothing is universal in my experience. For example Ohio near Cincinnati uses Cisco CableCards and across the river in Kentucky, Motorola is used. Both Spectrum.

[@richardsmith1161]

@@jasoncox5505 Are you saying not everyone can use the apps?

[@jasoncox5505]

@@richardsmith1161 I was talking about cablecards.... The streaming app works I believe for everyone. Started as TWC service. Live tv and on demand. I thought they required on box though?

[@richardsmith1161]

@@jasoncox5505 Not where I live. You can use one of their Apple TV's for a full package or just the apps for their skinny packages. I have Choice which is 10 cable channels out of 65 plus locals for $30.

[@gudenau]

Too bad Spectrum never provisioned my cable card right and refused to fix it. The HD HomeRun was good for the couple channels it could tune.

[@jasoncox5505]

Charter merger messed it up on the TWC side. They used to have dedicated department.

[@riopato2009]

now they don't even have to fix the card at all and will eventually make you return in exchange for a box that you don't want.

[@riopato2009]

HDHomerun should crowd fund the Prime 6, like they did with the ATSC 3.0 box, to see if there is any interest. I've been waiting for them to release a 6 tuner box since my card has the ability to receive 6 streams but only 3 stream devices only exists when Ceton Corp killed their 6 tuner product! To blame consumers cutting the cord is the reason why cable cards is trending down isn't legitimate enough. The reason cable cards are trending down is because there isn't any content on cable worth watching anymore and those that are, are available online also. in most cases they are available before the actual broadcast! Also this hurts the consumers who record DRM channels only and it's because of DRM is why lots of consumers are cutting the cord. Because of this FCC ruling, all they did was gave torrent pirates more reason to steal more tv content and push more people to move over to streaming services. This will not only effect cable TV subscriptions, this will also place a burden on ISP demand which will eventually force these isps to cap consumers bandwidth usage and then create a domino effect of forcing these streaming service to pay for bandwidth licenses which will force them to raise subscription prices! This is a bad cycle that the FCC is creating and will not only hurt consumers but also hurt every business associated with distributing and creating content which will also effect even people like Lon.TV when users will need to decide whether to watch something on KZbin or TV show because of their bandwidth cap!!!!

[@jasoncox5505]

Exactly. I am in a Spectrum market and concerned the data cap limit will expire. Without cable card and WAH from the pandemic streaming has the potential to eat through data caps. The FCC should mandate unlimited data as an alternative to cable card. Or maybe mandate 50% capacity as unlimited. 100Mbps circuit, no limit on first 50 Mbps.

[@riopato2009]

@@jasoncox5505 That would be a better alternative as a replacement to cable cards but I still like the idea of recording DRM cable broadcasts since I'm already paying for the service and not tied to storage limits or expiration dates.

This is bad news for Tivo standalone

[@Wintersnowfall8]

Tivo is still selling tivo that require a cable card .Selling a $400 for product that's useless

[@davepark1085]

How do I get rid of cable. I want to make sure i can get my local channels?

[@breadfan_85]

Arrr. Ye know the answer, matey.

[@BruceFerrell]

"...Anything with a screen becomes a client" Uh.. No. If the screen has Windows it becomes a client. Linux isn't supported, nor is OS X. Premium channels (HBO, Showtime, Starz etc) aren't supported at all on ANY platform. The HDHomerun devices are an expensive rip off.

[@athews1976]

😫😣😖😩 *GOD DAMNIT!!!* I have 3 primes and I'm about to get a fourth. Michael Brehm's aka djp952 *zuki.pvr.hdhomerundvr* Kodi add-on FTW!!! Wont they consider us techies? I'm in the south(Georgia) and the internet is somewhat unreliable in my area. The internet isn't an absolute solid 24/7 connection here. So that's quite bad for streaming, especially if you DVR. I feel like TV should still be cordoned off from the internet, somehow. I say that because, sometimes whenever my ISP's internet is down, the cable TV is still going. They're on the same wire. 🤷‍♂️ With streaming, live TV over the internet is mixed in with all of that other data traffic and you just know that live TV streaming may not have as high a priority over the internet as VOIP and live gaming. Someone correct me if I'm wrong about ^that.