Fiberglassing The Coosa Covers And Problems With The Armstrong Engine Bracket?

[@StonyRC]

Transom rebuild ... I wouldn't trust it if I didn't know FOR SURE. I think you already believe that in your heart of hearts!

[@moppegaard]

Andy, I think you already know the answer. If it were mine I would drop the engines and bracket. Redo the transom with Coosa and reinstall. I wouldn't like the way the interior transom was done in a patchwork manner. I know that it will add cost and time to your project but in the end you will trust it and not worry about it while your using the boat. On a side note, I love the videos and find the extremely informing. Capt Mike Oppegaard Native Son Guide Servie

[@wayphun72]

I am about to do this on my boat, so this is immensely interesting. Go Andy go!!!

[@dsmt8703]

Wire saw, Piano wire, or guitar string worked back and forth works well with getting through some adhesives in tight spaces. Although I have never tried it with 5200. I suspect that you may not sleep well until you completely go through the whole removal and rebuild it. I do enjoy the process though.

[@MajTom-wd2yt]

Andy Removing panels secured with 5200, where a few scratches aren't a problem I've used a hand wire saw. On our Airstream I've used 50lb test mono fishing line tied around two wooden dowels.

[@hankfletcher4768]

Brilliant move. We've all been trying so hard to keep the water OUT of the boat, we missed the opportunity to double our market reach into the swimming pool business. In all sincerity, I was watching this and thinking "Well, dang, just fill it up and see if it leaks..." I can definitely empathize with the conundrum of not wanting to mess with something that's "good enough" already, even if it's not ideal.

[@Rubbernecker]

I feel your pain Andy!! I've done this (I/O to bracket conversion) many times, but I've learned that the best way is to start from the foundation. Your intuition is correct: that transom has not been strengthened enough. The Armstrong is bullet proof, we know that. You correctly stated the min thickness, though I usually do 3x 3/4 Coosa for twins, unless the glass is unusually thick. The shape of the original transom is trapezoidal because the engines took the bulk of the forces and there was no need to spread the load over the entire surface of the transom. Not so with the outboards, which is why you need to rip out the transom (not the glass, of course) and thicken the entire thing. If you really wanted to avoid removing the Armstrong, you could support it with jacks/stands, remove all bolts and when the transom is brought up to par, re-install all bolts. I have never done it this way but know people that have. The hard part is knowing that you've supported the bracket/engines enough that they aren't distorting the transom, which is the exact reason I have always chosen to remove them. Can't wait to see what you decide, good luck!!!!

[@Jakeeddie32]

I used. 5200 fast cure on my haul/deck joint. Once cured I was able to pull it out with little effort. Not sure what the issue was. I cleaned the surface with acetone and let it dry before applying. Leaves me weary about trying it again. Thanks for the videos. My bet is that you'll pull the bracket just to make sure everything's done right.

[@navidave95]

Love your videos as their so informative. I have a totally different question; I have a 13’6” 86 Bayliner Capri force that I’ve gutted due to rot and previous owner(s) neglect. I want to either extend the stern 2’ and or add a bracket for the outboard. Can you tell me with your experience if I can and how do I do it?

[@DWAJarrett]

Hi Andy Please excuse my ignorance but......if the boat was designed for inboard motors thrust would have been transfered to the hull from the gearbox bearers or a thrust bearing. If the transom hasn't sagged from the weight of the motors would it be prudent to tie the transom in to the original bearers to transfer the load... and not worry about strengthening the transom? Thanks for your wonderful channel 👍

[@JeffErdmann]

Hey Andy, Is the bracket box open against the transom or is it a sealed box? On Armstrong's website, they show a diagram that says "The Positive flotation interior helps offset the weight of even the largest four-stroke engines." which looks like it is a watertight box. Armstrong’s Brackets include our patented Watertight Compression Deck Plate providing instant access for inspection. The Positive flotation interior helps offset the weight of even the largest four-stroke engines. Platform surfaces are coated with an integral nonskid surface. Marine-grade aluminum construction provides the strength and corrosion resistance needed for long product life.

[@PersuaderboatsGoFast]

I can see a transom rebuild coming.

[@Fiberglasser03]

Are you getting rid of the 130s? Our bertram 25 FB has twin 225's and cruises 33 kts.

[@8638260]

You can also air test the Armstrong bracket. If it holds pressure it could be good. Sometimes when I remove the drain plug or inspection cover from my bracket you can here a rush of air.

[@andrewzenn1719]

I love this guy.

[@simonlee8327]

i have been watching for a while now and love your work, is the gantry working yet? your OCD will haunt you for eva unless you do it right. even if it does not leak. I can see a full transom rebuild coming to the channel. and how sweet it will be to watch and learn how its done properly. Thanks Andy for your OCD.

[@davidallen26]

After seeing you set up/breakdown for glassing each coosa part you cut out, would it not have been more efficient to glass the whole sheets in one go and then cut out what you needed? Given the price of the sheet stock I would bet you will not leave much scrap at the end of the day.

[@ardcostcontracting9488]

Hey Andy, Would you consider running a bead of sealant around the inside and outside of the bracket rather than removing it? Also what brand of electric scissors do you recommend?

[@benjaminhighsmith453]

I removed gill bracket off back of 25' grady. Sanded it . primer and epoxy paint light blue. With nonskid. Looks great. A little tricky bolting back but nice and new . I have about 2 1/2 inch transom now. Worried it may be to thin for motors. 150 evinrudes. Stringers are higher up on transom floor supports are also connected to top of stringer. And floor will be connected to transom and floor supports .

[@spiritofziana7405]

Dominic is correct, outdrives do not transfer thrust or torque to the engines, but directly to the transom. The thrust is taken by a thrust bearing in the lower part of the leg. And to me it looks like the reinforcement on the transom for the outdrive is pretty strong enough. The only thing I would worry about is that the outboards are mounted on quite a lever, and this could exert quite some force on the transom if the boat falls off a wave. This is probably easiest countered with some (horizontal stringer) that transfers the forces to the hull. Reinforcing the whole transom seems overkill to me. But, in all likelihood, the transom is strong enough today, after you reinforced the corners. My 5 cents

[@WilliamJSSequeira]

How did you seal/glass the thin edges? If not glassed, how is the housing designed to not allow water intrusion and then delaminates?

[@OffGridOverLander]

Watching a video where the camera falls over brings a whole new meaning to “I’ve fallen and can’t get up!” 🤣

[@williambellamy7830]

Andy, MEK will turn 5200 to bubble gum. Just something nice to know when trying to remove things

[@jasonfrary]

It's true but not without a load of faffing around. Found a nice article looking at a few approaches, however, none seemed to be without the need to keep repeating the scoring and applying. I suspect this is where the damage Andy refers to will happen. www.boatingmag.com/marine-solvents-for-removing-5200/

[@bignus1]

Good Job Andy...I really felt your anxiety. Should have put some water dye in there to find any micro leaks.... we've also popped a can of smoke in there and sealed it up fast as a quick tell.... My guess is you'll need to order some more Coosa. BTW, where did you order it from - Boat Outfitters?

[@stanley.watson6406]

Mine leaked like crazy, good luck and hope it don't leak. I would fight the bear and remove it. Love your video's.

[@alexsmith7257]

Andy, Armstrong recommends at least a 2” thick transom for outboards up to 200HP and 2.5” transom with outboards above 200HP. I recommend calling Armstrong and speaking with Lawrence McNulty there. He is a wealth of information. I’m converting my Bertram 20 from a IO to a 200 HP Outboard + Bracket and went with Coosa that ended up being 2.75” where IO notch was and 2.25” everywhere else.

[@jim21804]

Andy, I have some questions about materials. I had my fiberglass pontoon redone by a boat builder. He used 4 x 8 sheets of fiberglass panels on the floor and glassed over top. On the sides he used a smooth 1/2 inch non wood panel trimmed with the white boards make out of the same material that cutting boards use. What is all this stuff called?

[@garciaij1]

for the transom area in order to close it in without hampering the access to the bolts, why dont you consider creating a "trap door" style enclosure so you have access to the bolts when you need it

[@yepyep340]

DUDE!!! This is getting gooooooooooood!

[@robertp7209]

Since the twin motors apply forces to the bracket, the bracket in turn apply push/pull/ and torque in two planes, to the transom. That force needs to spread out and transfer to the hull all around to the bottom and sides. The cantilever effect of the weight far back wants to bend the transom from the top out. My 92 Grady with twin 200s on a bracket has an original 2.5 inch plywood full transom, and an added stiffener about 1/2 way up horizontally as well as two vertically placed. No connection at all to the deck or main stringers. My motor bracket has a 2 ft setback, this project boat is further back adding that much more moment forces.

[@dominiccampbell8407]

Just a quick comment to alleviate your fears regarding the strength of the transom. Out-drives do not transfer any load to the engines. All loads are transferred to the transom. the engine mounts are only there to hold and locate/align the engines. Your transom should already be strong enough to handle the loads from the two outboards as long as it is still in good condition. The only new load would be from the weight of the outboards but this should be offset by the buoyancy of bracket, as long as it is watertight.

[@robertp7209]

Dominic Campbell - if the I/O engine mounts were not there, the engine would spin around its axis opposite direction of drive shaft. The outdrive applies a moment to the transom because the drive shaft is offset from the prop shaft. That’s it on the transom, except the same push/pull forces a regular outboard applies. I/O and outboards apply same side thrust forces on transom.

[@joehawaiian1078]

Whats your recommended transom thickness for those twins honda 135 on the bracket, my original transome is 2.5 inches, i was thinking of going 3-4 inches.

[@boatholic4458]

Great work Andy !!

[@rickchang8485]

Where can I find the mini roller covers you have been using? I dont' see them anymore in your amazon listing.

[@boatworkstoday]

www.amazon.com/dp/B01CZ2Y51K/?ref=exp_boatworkstoday_dp_vv_d

[@robertschulke1596]

Any time you have a metal part stuck to something with 5200, heat will take it off. Just warm the back of the metal part with a propane torch or heat gun, and the 5200 will turn to liquid.

[@brianmiddleton855]

This how i removed my stainless marine bracket. tension from an engine hoist and heat from 2 heat guns in the inspection ports the 5200 lets go from the hot metal an no damage to to fiber glass👍

[@backyardrebuilds4068]

Another gr8 video

[@karlsmith5935]

Hi Andy love the video but just a quick question is total boat resin quite cheap in the us because in uk if you were to use something like west system 2 gallon would cost you around £300 without the koosa

[@IOMFishing]

My first thought with every video, pretty sure I could have bought a new boat with just the money Andy would have to spend on resin at our prices!

[@brianmiddleton855]

Constant pressure from an engine hoist and heat from a heat gun in each inspection port it will pop off at about 140 to 150 degrees F takes about threee to four hours. Once rhe aluminum gets heated up. This how I removed the 5200ed bracket on my wellcraft 2600

[@peterihre9373]

Now that's a cliffhanger ☺️

[@NeverEnoughPyro40]

Possible issue with the bracket leaking! I had a 18' 1964 Thompson Chris Craft willed to me from my grandfather who was the original owner! The boat was used extensively by my family then me! In 1995 the boat was taking on more water than I would have liked to see! I was young so I figured I would fill the bilge with water while on the trailer, But to my surprise I could not find any real issues! So I spoke to the owner of the Boatyard ( where it was originally purchased) and the now owner was just a young helper at the boatyard when my grandfather purchased the boat! He said when the boat is in the water there is more pressure pushing water into the boat than there is pushing out when I filled the bilge with water! Not sure if that makes sense due to my lack of sleep but thought I would just share it! Love your channel and I can not wait to try out my new found fiberglass knowledge on my 1987 Renken Seamaster Cuddy Walkaround! Thank you for sharing your knowledge!

[@nedlindstrom2590]

When you are pouring material or thinner out of 1 gal or 5 gal containers make sure the cap your pouring from is at the highest point on the can. You will have better control of the pour your making and you won't get material all over the top of the can. When your pouring from a can like the gel-kote use a small finish nail or your awl to put a few holes in the groove for the lid. Keeps the crap from squirting all over when your replacing the lid. And when using a Caulk Gun try pushing the gun away from you rather then pulling it, with a little practice you'll wonder why you didn't these methods long ago.

[@glennconnon5321]

That’s one hell of a cliffhanger...

[@PristineTX]

Better to pull the bracket on a dry boat in Feb./March than to have to pull the bracket on a wet boat in May/June. Besides the peace of mind knowing you aren't wasting time/work, all the cosmetic work that will be easier.

[@samuelgalvez3602]

i tried buying alexseal paint here in canada but the supplier told me that it is only for expert and business, not for the public, and they want me to fill out a credit check, even thou i offer to pay with my visa before they ship it, so if you know any business here in canada where i can get it from, please let me know

[@boatworkstoday]

I would get ahold of the folks in Charleston, SC and see if they have a recommendation on where to buy. You don't need a license or anything like that; some retailers only works with commercial accounts while others will sell to the general public

[@AlfOfAllTrades]

Why polyester for the side panels instead of epoxy? As far as I can remember, you've not used poly for anything else?

[@boatworkstoday]

I use poly for a lot of things (actually use it more than epoxy). Given the amount of area that needed to be laid up it was more of a cost thing. There really would have been no advantage of using epoxy for something like this :-)

[@AlfOfAllTrades]

@@boatworkstoday I should have specified that I meant that I could not remember you using poly on this specific boat. But good answer nonetheless. Thanks!

[@johnmccliment3121]

After all the thoughts on the Transom I would have thought you would have started the leak testing quicker :) Giving it a bit more time to rear it's ugly head if there is a issue.

[@rebfel]

Why didn't you mention it earlier? Coulda, woulda, shoulda, Monday morning quarterbacking... ugh!

[@mwatkins2464]

Why does the transom bracket have to be water tight?? Doesn’t seem like it would have to be since it does have a drain hole.

[@benjaminhighsmith453]

Buoyancy for back of boat . and dont want extfa weight trying to get on plain

[@boatworkstoday]

The scuppers for the aft deck typically sit just above the waterline. With the added weight of the outboards hanging 3 feet aft I'm guessing that without added flotation (watertight chamber of the armstrong bracket) it would allow the scuppers to actually sit below the waterline and allow water to backflow into the boat. Seems like a quick way for the boat to go full turtle lol :-/

[@mwatkins2464]

BoatworksToday I see what you mean, thanks 👍👍

[@markkurtis8637]

@@boatworkstoday I'm pretty sure you can do some quick calculations, find some tables, and my guess is that bracket does not have enough buoyancy to counteract the massive outboards. Plus, as you pointed out, the leverage of where they sit... I know every bit helps but if you find a leak and it's a gallon a week. I would live with it and drain it every couple of weeks.

[@matthewsellers82]

@@markkurtis8637 Cigarette pack calculations, 40 Gal water (as displaced by a submerged bracket) = 500lb each Honda 150 = 500lb so you have a good point

[@donpetrey8007]

Left hanging omg good vid

[@pezpengy9308]

AUGH!!!!! THE SUSPENSE I CANT STAND IT!!!!!

[@richardkittle2346]

So I would remove the platform completely and rebuild the transom. Even if water does not leak into the interior it may be leaking into the transom core. You could try removing a couple bolts and see how they were bedded, seems like the rest of the coring on the boat has bean ply so.... long blades on your fien multi tool super slow speed, quit messing around get busy

[@davidcarr4464]

I think I would have jacked the front of the boat up and put water in the stern and see if water leaked out between the transom and the bracket.

[@daviddickmeyer5231]

A cliff hanger! I’m thinking it will leak. Any other guesses? 😆

[@benjaminhighsmith453]

I dont think it will leak

[@bignus1]

I bet he's just not comfortable with the thickness of the transom and whether it leaks or not becomes inconsequential...

[@brianhof7599]

I say you pull the motors, pull the bracket, pull the G10 and 5200, and build up the inner transom to at least 3.0” with Coosa. I would gusset the transom to the stringers with Coosa and 1708 to carry some of the load. Use plenty of 5200 on the bracket and bolts, and keep moving. I hear your little girl every week at the end of the vids. You don’t want to be on Lake Superior with her and have that old transom fail. You will NEVER trust it if you leave it as it is now. Lake Superior is not forgiving.

[@Paul_C]

I would build a complete new transom, and maybe save the piece of transom with the numbers and hang on a 'wall'.

[@byronlarson227]

Ok 21 of you liked this before you finished watching it. Lol I'm number 22

[@gomigman5936]

Quick question, Andy. Do you treat the Alexseal just like you would gelcoat when applying it as a finish paint on any surface of the hull? In other words, the blending and buffing and polishing etc.? Or do you do something or anything differently? I know it settles very nicely and doesn't leave brush or roller marks and streaks, but I'm assuming you need to buff it out to some extent, especially if you're blending it to a gelcoated surface? Thanks and sorry if it's a little bit off-topic. Loving the work you're doing and learning a lot!

[@boatworkstoday]

If the paint is applied correctly, hopefully there is no buffing needed until its time for a repair :-) Also if one particular spot is being painted, generally the entire area is painted so there isn't any blending into a gelcoated surface

[@gomigman5936]

Well, I'm actually talking about a repair on the side of the hull, but it's black gelcoat from the factory so it sounds like I should repair it and finish it with black gelcoat instead of using Alexseal? That's what I was getting at. I certainly don't need to paint the entire side of the hull since it doesn't need it, just a good size ding about 3" in diameter.

[@monster-pq7ln]

ROTFLMAO at 4:47

[@clacker54]

Lol from my perspective I would be willing to bet that bracket holds more like 75 to 100 gallons of water.

[@shixson957]

Cliffhanger lol

[@DMF351]

Why bother covering with a layer of chop? Isn’t the composite already fibreglass with a foam core? Also wouldn’t you question the integrity of that transom being a timber core that’s Swiss cheese at the age of that hull? Take a core sample of the transom.