Film Theory DIDN’T Understand The Book of Bill AT ALL

[@BAM_Jammy]

Hey guys! I was not expecting this video to get so much attention, so thank you all so much for the support so far! And I’m trying to reply to as many comments as possible but like I said, WAAY more attention than I had expected! Couple things I wanna add/clarify since I wasn’t following a script for this, just some notes. Before that though I wanna say this is a completely open space where you are more than welcome to share your opinions! Especially if you disagree with me (expect me to respond though!) I love hearing from you guys and I think this is a large topic with a lot to talk about both in the way of Gravity Falls and queer erasure. First things first, the oracle being Bill’s ex theory was first made by MatPat’s 6 year old son Ollie, as revealed by a livestream on GTlive where MatPat and Lee cover The Book of Bill. I had this fact in my notes and originally intended to touch on it, but somehow I just completely forgot while I was recording 🤦‍♂yeah I feel like a total idiot about it :P I still disagree with the theory’s presence in the video however. I don’t blame the kid at all as he is very young and was being given censored summaries of the book from Mat, it makes sense he might come to that conclusion. The problem I have is that this theory was a major part of the video with minimal evidence, and all of Bill and Ford’s relationship was completely ignored, as well as the other stuff I brought up. Second of all, as said everything in this video is entirely my opinion and my OPINION alone. I personally believe it is highly likely that Billford is canon based on the evidence we have been given. To me it’s the same as any straight couple constantly implied to be in love but never techincally soldified (although I don’t know what much you want than them being directly called exes haha). If you disagree or you don’t like Billford or anything like that, that’s perfectly fine! I have no problem with you and even though I might respond to your comment disagreeing, it’s nothing against you or where you stand, I just naturally like to respond to things haha. Though if you are rude to me it’s more than likely that I will be rude back. Just keep that in mind. Finally I just wanna thank you all again for all the support and a quick reminder than I am in fact working on another Gravity Falls/Book of Bill animatic adapting a scene from the book! And I plan to make more GF content after that too (maybe Billford stuff? We’ll see) so thank you all again and stay weird!

[@CR1MSONACE]

That Triangle *does* like men and a... shocking... Amount of people are willing to die for it. They're right though.

[@BillCipherisCRINGE]

Btw it's pretty awful u don't seem to get too much attention, good luck on it ^_^

[@shuichiswifey]

I felt like my eye twitched lowkey when they said "HIS GIRLFRIEND!" Like....girl.....? Alex hirsch WANTED to write queer characters, He barely got away with Blubs and Durland, so obviously he would probably like to write his extra content a bit queer-coded. Bill and Ford were queer coded from the beginning too. Also they didn't mention his whole conversation with ford about his home dimension, the way he keeps the last speck of his dimension, he even calls himself a monster for doing it. They honestly miss a lot of important things he mentions about his dimension. (As you said)

[@MewGamer-bj9in]

Ikr there’s no way this guys straight ToT

[@vjxfjcjgfkhgougjlvhfyty6382]

its also so easy just to use gender neutral terms like

[@MewGamer-bj9in]

@@vjxfjcjgfkhgougjlvhfyty6382 yeh

[@Zacromaniac]

Ngl I thought he was bi or something

[@KirboBoy]

Mable literally said that “Bill seems to me like a super-needy ex” in her page in the book.

[@Foofle]

8:20

[@DogBat]

69 likes, nice

[@Frozen.Cedar_x]

​@@DogBat sorry, I ruined it

[@DogBat]

@@Frozen.Cedar_x YOU MONSTER

[@Frozen.Cedar_x]

@@DogBat I'm sorry I didnt realize until after I looked at your reply and I cant undo it 😔

[@Quackervoltz]

I think them getting Bill's origin completely wrong is more offensive personally

[@BAM_Jammy]

Yeah the whole video was very disappointing tbh :(

[@Hannah-w1p]

@@BAM_Jammy would’ve been better if we didn’t have those supposedly ‘good theories’ matpat is cooked tho ngl

[@rat5802]

STREBER PFP HOLY FREAK

[@azzytheidiot]

​@@rat5802HOLY SHIT

[@Thesockghost]

Bill: **hoping ford draws him pretty, getting jealous when ford spends time with Mcgucket, getting extremely drunk when ford says that he doesn’t want to work with him anymore, LITERALLY DOING THE EXACT THINGS TO FORD THAT HE SAYS HE CONSIDERS **_F L I R T I N G*_* Film theory: “ah yes, what a completely -para- -normal platonic relationship!”

[@CocoViolet106]

Fr thoo

[@TG-vt7ue]

Drawing Billford while talking about this is iconic lol

[@BAM_Jammy]

Thank you 😎

[@Taro_Yanada]

Film Theory are like historians: "They must be very good friends :D"

[@Ravebow21]

"The feeling was friendship, but neither have ever experienced it. :D"

[@BAM_Jammy]

LOL

[@Virus-Download]

"The friendliest friends that have ever friended, and they friended all the way to friendsville, in their friend-mobile" -Starwars, i think

[@CR1MSONACE]

​@@Virus-Download I know Battleblock Theater opens like that

[@The.Percy.Ever.]

@@Virus-DownloadBSHEVDHSGSGS REAL

[@Captain_Save]

They should've read the whole book and then formed theories. If you read a book for class and you only finished half of it and have to write an essay about it, it's going to be glaringly obvious that you didn't finish it.

[@v1rzen]

Alex Hirsch did not fight Disney censorships for Film Theory to misinterpret the Book of Bill 🗣️‼️ Great video!!

[@depressionpie4859]

Omg hi Virzen lmao,,,

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@v1rzen that's what I'm sayin!!!

[@miadmahshidi8101]

Not only misinterpreted,I saw a lot of comments on the film theory video and it was obvious that they took many,and I mean MANY,theories from both the gt reddit and gravity falls discord/reddit without giving proper credit to the people who figured what the codes were even supposed to *be* .but yeah,it's obvious this was a rushed theory and not thought out fully.

[@KattinIsBrocken]

One of my friends is a huge fan of Gravity Falls, and even he agrees that Bill and Ford were/are dating (I'm not sure right now). He even HAS The Book of Bill

[@S1LLY.cLOwvn]

REALREALREALREAL

[@moss-so4eq]

as someone who has been saying that bill and ford are divorced since the last mabelcorn, it does kinda make me upset that they didnt get it. I feel like this might also be a case of bi erasure because bill does mention having exes that used she/her pronouns. And as a bi person, yeah if a bi dude likes a woman, people assume he’s straight. also the way he talks about the oracle implies less of a romantic vibe and more platonic/familial. bill’s bi or pan or something and it feels pretty bad that film theory erased his bisexuality in a way

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@moss-so4eq so true bestie

[@moss-so4eq]

@@BAM_Jammy thank you for fighting for toxic old man yaoi 🫡 we always need more toxic old man yaoi warriors. also i love your human bill’s red and blue earrings i might steal that for mine

[@reallyradrabbit]

me when I support abusive relationships 😍😍😍 god I hate billford shippers

[@EXORClSTS]

​@@reallyradrabbit atleast billford is better then billdip on every level. you can think its toxic and thats totaly okay but you gotta keep in mind billdip was SO popular despite all the issues it was. Billford may be bad but atleast its better then billdip.

[@jellsies]

​@@reallyradrabbit No one's supporting abusive relationships by shipping Billford

[@seesawseesaw]

I feel like it’s WAYY more likely for bill to have crossed out the oracle because they were friends at a point but she would’ve known and alluded to his plans never succeeding and pissed him off bc she could never be wrong

[@QT3.14-w2p]

Also genuinely surprised they didn't try to decipher the scribbled out text next to her photo.. You can even make out a few words and letters

[@QT3.14-w2p]

IIRC Remgames deciphered the text in one of their videos and it reads "The smartest one. Figured out [unreadable] dimensional portals. Got too smart. Who needs her? Too many eyes anyway!

[@EscapeReality123]

Fun Fact: If a character doesn't have a canon orientation, then them being straight is also a Headcanon! :D But seriously, I couldn't even finish Film Theory video, which never happened to me before. It felt like they didn't want to make this analiz at all, maybe the only reason why they did was because of people begging them to cover it. But, it seems that it's exactly like MatPat himself said on the website... this time we are on our own

[@warriorcatkitty]

THIS 100%

[@MynameisnotGraey]

If you watch the GTLive with the book of bill you’ll find out that that theory, oracle x bill. Was Olly’s idea. The five year old. Who looked at two things that were crossed out and said they must be the same. And the theorist crew. THE hub for theorizing in most fandoms. Used it. A theory. Made up by a five year old. Going against the evidence. Somewhat erasing a queer relationship. And equates things just because they’re both people that have been crossed out (not even in the same color. That’s where the bar’s at for them.

[@the-prince-of-silly]

oh my lord... come on we know they can do so much better than this whyyy 😭

[@callmebrody]

Ok but for a five year old it was a good theory

[@MynameisnotGraey]

@@callmebrody eh.. for a five year old I guess… but it’s really weak.

[@callmebrody]

@@MynameisnotGraey better then something me or you would come up with when we were 5

[@MynameisnotGraey]

@@callmebrody eh. Agree to disagree.

[@wherefancytakesme]

My thoughts as a queer person: Bill and Ford were 100% intended to reflect a romantic relationship-- keyword being reflect though. As a partner (of any kind) Bill was super abusive, like some of the stuff he says to Ford is directly quoting real abusers and it's DARK. But when the book provides some levity afterwards, they add in the subtext about dating and breakups. So do I think Bill & Ford were supposed to be coded as a romance? Absolutely. Do I think they literally kissed and went out on dates like an actual romantic couple in-universe? Personally, not really. (Though it's funny to picture.) *Now FIDDLEFORD on the other hand...* -Bro do not even get me started please-

[@sleepyhollowo]

i 100% agree, another commenter said Ford and Bill both have aro/ace vibes and i feel the same way. but their relationship is definitely supposed to feel like a toxic/codependent relationship and at the very least romance-coded! like they were ‘attracted’ to each other, but more in an emotional and intellectual way i guess? that’s how i interpret it anyway lol

[@wherefancytakesme]

@@sleepyhollowo Definitely, and I'm also pretty sure Ford is actually aspec, based on Bill's "plansexual" comment in the book.

[@arsonzartz]

i mean, its hinted at that they banged eachother once.

[@pasteluluu4089]

i agree with this wholeheartedly

[@bigjok3929]

Ford survived situationship

[@wafflesthearttoad6916]

If the page about bill drinking and basically sobbing over Ford DOESN’T scream breakup I dunno what does.

[@SkeletalSpyro]

Fighting the good fight in the name of Old Man Yaoi

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@SkeletalSpyro 🫡

[@S1LLY.cLOwvn]

WORD.

[@Simon_Dunkaccino]

YES BOSS!

[@author_of_the_year]

I’m a silly bi who’s weird about fictional characters!! (You’d never guess who from my pfp, noooo) I’m glad this was brought up. I feel like the purpose of the book was misinterpreted by the team. To me, TBoB was about telling Bill’s story. Ig to them it was a new way to dump lore and mystery. I think they were so zoomed in, they missed what was right in front of them.

[@BAM_Jammy]

I think you're probably right about that!

[@MynameisnotGraey]

I mean it’s both, and team theorist did neither justice

[@cactusbuds2979]

Alex Hirsch during a presentation said he researched different relationships to develop Ford and Bill. One of the relationships he used as a reference was “toxic exes”

[@nerdydragonfan]

Another thing that kinda bothered me is... Film Theory is a big channel. There Theory Video already has over 2 Million views and it's the FIRST thing to pop up when you type in "Book of Bill Theory". A lot of casual Gravity Falls fans, might only get exposed (or their first exposure) to Book of Bill though that video. And frankly, the video wasn't very good. (With how widespread and mainstream there channel(s) have become, they miss A LOT of the little details that I feel like MatPat would have obsessed over back in the day.) Not to mention, Tumblr and Tiktok have been breaking this stuff down for the past month. So not only did Film Theory join late in the game AND hardly cover the book, but they never even gave a shout out (at least not until the comments berated them). They seem to be getting some push back and a lot of fans have absorbed this lore through sheer cultural osmosis; but it is kinda bothersome that they didn't do very indepth research, and then proceed to release this big theory video that claims to have "SOLVED" Book of Bill. 😮‍💨

[@sumsumplays]

Respectfully matpat literally was doing it with lee on gtlive…

[@projectmoonsleeperagent]

I notice this pattern a lot with game/film theory. A lot of “mainstream” theories they do really miss the mark and feel rushed while most of their normal stuff (basically fnaf/horror) is fine for the most part.

[@mallk238]

@@projectmoonsleeperagent tbf it's because they're essentially the ones WRITING fnaf lore at this point. Back when the games were first coming out, most people that I saw in the fandom got their knowledge from the game theory videos and I get the feeling that as time went on that all just kinda became part of the lore itself. With other games like Subnautica and Hollow Knight, they can't just make up whatever theory they want because those games have very clear lore that is *intended* to be understood by the general audience. Something like gravity falls was meant to have answers that you could actually find in the text itself, so yeah if they miss details? Then they completely miss a huge piece of the puzzle and it *will* piss fans off. They're so used to ~lore~ that is only told through looking at single pixels on a screen and counting toes that when a story has an answer waving directly in front of them they don't even stop to think. It's why Matpat missed the goddamn shoutout to his retirement in poppy playtime. They had to make him GO BACK to see it and even then it took so much guidance because he was so sure he didn't miss anything that he was dragging his feet until he finally saw what they were trying to show him!!!

[@kalkxx]

ikr, so far the best channel ive found thats covered the book of bill is remgames. their vids and theories are really good but even they never really touched on much of billfords relationship from what i can remember. why are these channels just completely ignoring the fact that bill and ford are huge parts of each others lore?? its so annoying especially considering most of the fandom is already aware of their relationship and how important it is but for some reason all these bigger channels still just gloss over it😭

[@nerdydragonfan]

@@kalkxx I've watched all of RemGames Gravity Falls Theory videos, there really good (though it takes him awhile to put things together; idk, maybe he doesn't want to jump to conclusions). I actually used his video's as an example of better work in comparison to Flim Theories video; cause his video's came out first, go over more lore in more detail, and he never leps to conclusions. As for covering Bill and Ford's relationship. RemGames seems to hyper forces on Bill's backstory, and with how through his research is, I'm not surprised he hasn't covered it.

[@the-REAL-Bill-Cipher]

i personally hc bill and ford as being queerplatonic, cause they both read very aro/ace spec to me. like the tired "stop before you start telling me about your polycule" line and the " i am attracted to logic and preperation" one, i cannot deny the toxic yaoi tho.

[@arsonzartz]

i honestly love all flavors of billford lol toxic? yummers healthy? yummers queerplatonic? yummers one-sided? yummers two-sided? yummers not official but definetly more then friends? yummers

[@the-REAL-Bill-Cipher]

@@arsonzartz yishhhh!! billford is very silly and its funny alex revived the whole fandom

[@arsonzartz]

@@the-REAL-Bill-Cipher lolz de

[@nova-witchwood]

I love that version too! What I really hate is those who completely deny it and stick to 100% base platonic Billford. :(

[@nova-witchwood]

oh, and whenever I write billford I still put them as aro-spec and ace-spec! they’re compatible still! :)

[@KaylieghHereford]

Hi! I also want to complain about this video, if you don't mind! First off, we have no idea what Bill's relationship with The Oracle is like. But to me it seems more likely she acted as a motherly figure to him, just based off the way he describes her if you can read through the scribbled out, calling her the "Smartest one", which is high praise from a ego/megalomaniac. But again we have no idea. Also it's WEIRD he would DATE one of his henchmaniacs, since it seems like he's using all of them as stand-ins for HIS FAMILY. And just as much as it annoyed me they didn't touch on the Silly Straws page, it annoyed me DOUBLY they didn't touch on The Early Years page! Or even hardly anything about Bill's early life!! What about the HEAVY implying that little Billy was bullied constantly?? What about the HEAVY implying that Bill destroyed his dimension on accident??? Or the fact it sems Bill used to be a Mama's boy? Or, like you said, that his parents DRUGGED HIM with meds!! How about the fact that we still don't know HOW bill destroyed his dimension. I was REALLY looking forward to there conclusion on Bill's past, on Euclydia, on what happened on that fateful day, but we didn't get any of that!!!! In fact, we hardly got ANY THEORIES AT ALL! I was just sitting there waiting and waiting for the actual theory, but in a twenty five long minute video, we got like a two minute long section for a half baked theory. :(

[@BAM_Jammy]

@user-wt1fn5gb1v OMG u are so correct!! Can't believe I didn't touch this (cant believe they didn't either!) Wild all the stuff they left out

[@nerdydragonfan]

Same. I remember, getting towards the end of the video, listening to them go on about the Oracle, looking at the timestamp and then thinking, 'WAIT. Is this it? Where's the rest of it!'.

[@KaylieghHereford]

@@nerdydragonfan SAME!!

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@nerdydragonfan omg exactly!

[@cawareyoudoin7379]

I mean, I guess it's meant to be a kind of a recap for the people who haven't read the book? Maybe they'll get into the actual theories in part 2? Eh, I've given up hope for the Theorist channels.

[@painterguy6469]

Finally! Someone brings this up! The billford erasure went crazier than weirdmageddon itself. Even more weird is how filmtheory has the knack of analyzing even the most miniscule piece of evidence, yet, they just straight up ignored the entirety of Sixer, almost as if it was intentional.

[@arsonzartz]

this video exposed more lore to me about bill then film theory ever did. its crazy.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@arsonzartz if you're looking for a deeper dive into TBOB, I would give ColeyDoesThings a watch! She recently came out with a video about TBOB and covers way more than me a lot more coherently. She said she's gonna come out with a deeper dive on Billford soon too!

[@arsonzartz]

@@BAM_Jammy YIPPEEEEEEE!

[@nerdydragonfan]

So true. Another thing that kinda bothered me is... Film Theory is a big channel. A lot of casual Gravity Falls fans, might only get exposed (or these first exposure) to Book of Bill though them. And frankly, there video wasn't very good. With how widespread and mainstream they've become, they missed A LOT of the little details that I feel like MatPat would have obsessed over back in the day. Not to mention, Tumblr and Tiktok have been breaking this stuff down for the past month. So not only did Film Theory join late in the game AND hardly cover the book, but they never even gave a shout out (at least not until the comments berated them). They seem to be getting some push back and a lot of fans has absorbed stuff through sheer cultural osmosis; but it is kinda bothered some that they didn't do very indepth research, and then proceed to release this big theory video that claims to have it all figured out.

[@F3rn_th3_silly413]

I know u >:)

[@nerdydragonfan]

@@F3rn_th3_silly413 From where? 😨

[@nevaehdumetz6256]

The pages about Bill Cipher and Ford's relationship were my favorite and I haven't watched the film theories video on the book yet. Still, I can imagine that would have annoyed me too because I think that's the most interesting part of the book. Love the art btw

[@The_Ministry_Of_Defense]

For real the theory crew has too little experience especially film theory a lot of topics were skipped over and in the end it didn’t even feel like a theory just some codes and a summary of the book

[@S1LLY.cLOwvn]

yah :(

[@aliciamarrow7062]

"is that a billford art?" i wondered and was fed wonderfully. Thank you kind person. Your human Bill design is an eye candy

[@sixfingered_dude]

"history hates lovers" ahh film theory

[@doodlebloom_]

i think there's also a fear of people portraying toxic queer couples, like i think the thought process could also be "well we dont want to portray gay people in a bad light because we dont want to be seen as homophobic" which comes from good intentions but also accidentally or purposely ignores the fact that people can be in unhealthy relationships no matter the genders

[@ComfySocksBoi]

the theorists over there don't typically have the best track record when it comes to queer topics. I mean they misgendered Frisk, Chara, and kris a lot from toby fox's games. they've misgendered other confirmed nb characters. those are the examples off the top of my head. also, it's not only bad handling of queer topics. they also don't really tackle neurodivergence topics well either. I think a lot of their decisions on what they view as important to tackle in their theories come from a place of ignorance. That's actually why I didn't have high hopes for their welcome home theories because clown specified that the project would tackle themes about disability and queerness. To say i was disappointed by their most recent gravity falls theory would be accurate unfortunately.

[@Parasolhyena]

Kris is non-binary but Frisk and Chara are canonically (word of god) whatever gender the player is or wants them to be unless that's been changed by Toby at some point, but he said that was his intent for them when he created them. Most have adopted that they are also Non-binary too so now everyone says they are and everyone's chill with that but technically you wouldn't be wrong for saying they are a different gender it would just be going against popular opinion. I think the fact that Toby said in the past the frisk and Chara can be any gender did confused some people when Kris who is explicitly non binary was the protagonist now, especially when Deltarune initially came out. In all there newer deltarune videos it looks like Gametheory does seems to make the conscious effort to refer to Kris as They/them. I mean people even still think that Kris is just Chara. So i can understand the slight confusion when the game came out.

[@sillygoofyguyy]

it also felt like some of the jokes they did not get, like the part where "oh we know what bill thinks of heaven cuz the how to get to heaven page is blank" when in actuality it is bill calling us a freak. anyway i completely agree with this video, also as a side note can i please get the code mentioned here: 9:09 cuz im absolutely flabbergasted if this is true LOL

[@BAM_Jammy]

It’s true! 😂

[@lynnboartsdye1943]

It’s definitely odd that they don’t bring up how obvious the queer subtext is here, especially considering what they covered in older theories (I swear I remember some kind of queer based episode of game theory but I could be misremembering). I’m holding my judgement for part two of the theory, it could very well be that they want to wait till then to bring it up if at all. A comment near the bottom brought up a good point about them acting like a business which could be why there’s all this lack of cohesion.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@lynnboartsdye1943 yeah, like I said in the video the problem seems to be mostly unconscious, but I still feel it necessary to point out because if it's never made conscious things will never change, yknow? Also holding out hope for the 2nd video lol

[@lynnboartsdye1943]

@@BAM_Jammy oh absolutely! It wouldn’t make sense to not bring it up and if they don’t I can’t help but imagine it has something to do with the company that owns theorist now. I don’t know much about them but I know Disney censored so much queerness surrounding Gravity Falls when it first came out and that Alex Hirsch would’ve included more open rep if he could.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@lynnboartsdye1943 I think the theorist channels are still technically independently owned but can't be 100% sure about that

[@octonine6212]

Hiya, girl mildly obsessed with the Theorists channels here, yes there was an old Game Theory video (I think it was around 2013-2014?) in which the video was gonna be about the Final Fantasy 7 bath scene (the one where Cloud does crossdressing) and that would lead into the history of Drag Queens but when he was making that video he ended up seeing how much queer characters were villainized in games so he made the video about that. I think the title was "Game Theory: Why Video Games Hate LGBT?" or something like that.

[@octonine6212]

correction: the title is "Game Theory: Are Video Games Anti-LGBT?" and it has Cloud with a flag and a bow on his hair in the thumbnail.

[@tombenshalommoshe]

I think both the Oracle and Ford are exs of Bill

[@abigailbishop8267]

Yeah both can be true, I personally believe that too! 👍

[@СемёнЮгов-в7ю]

Relationships with Bill are so toxic, that his exes conspire against him🤣

[@sasishere5121]

Then ford ends up with the oracle peak.

[@matti.8465]

Yeah, it could still be true. It doesn't affect anything though.

[@Solar-oo9dm]

I also like to lump the Axolotl into Bill’s exes too. I have exactly 0 evidence for this tho

[@switchthedragon1668]

I was SO excited for their theory video on the topic, only to be disappointed not only by all the stuff mentioned in this video, but also the theory that Bill will come back because a bird sat on the hand of his statue??? Like I can’t be the only one tho thinks that makes zero sense.

[@kannraorhara]

Love your art and completely agree with what you said here! Sure, I picked up that the Oracle MIGHT'VE been one of Bill's exes, but was severely disappointed that no mention was made of the at least one-sided romance involving Bill and Ford. They had a deep friendship and bickered like a married couple over how both of them spent their time. Bill told Ford about his dimension and showed him the scrap he kept hidden under his hat for crying out loud! You wouldn't do that if you didn't trust someone completely. Also love your Bill and Ford designs. Love seeing the explosion in the fandom that has happened thanks to this book.

[@BAM_Jammy]

Thank you!

[@Lexx_luvs_bredd]

You're so right I was thinking about that too, my straight brother was like "I don't like the idea of Bill having a love interest it humanizes him" well, I feel like the reason he got like ten times crazier and less relatable was because of that "breakup" Ford and Bill had.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@Lexx_luvs_bredd ur brother's take is lame haha something I love about Bill's character and analyzing is that he acts more human than he likes to admit. Yeah, it humanizes him, that's part of the fun, and actually what a large part of the book is dedicated to even outside their relationship!

[@sploo0ky]

No but the way they COMPLETELY glossed over the pages bothered me sm. Atleast 1/3 of the book was the journal pages. Also the bill x jessie thing made no sense? Theyre entire thing is to read between the lines. To see the things implied. If the most basic, surface level fans can see how heavily implied billford was and they didnt try to solve what was under the red marker. It was fairly easy to solve (I figured it out almost entire in less than an hour) and it clearly says that she got too smart, figured out something about dimensional portals and he had to get rid of her.

[@EcoMeeco2]

"I wonder what they're drawing" *sees six fingers* "YEEWSSHSHAHAH-"

[@somebodykares1]

When they gloss over stuff its not that they don't think it's relevant its more likely that they are not sure how it fits quite yet, that or they are still trying to solve the puzzle themselves and have not figure it out yet..

[@haloo_haybay]

I was baffled by how intensely heteronormative the theory was.

[@cardboardcutout]

Bill is NOT STRAIGHT, i can tell you that much.

[@HealthGage0336]

B-but he a triangle...

[@cardboardcutout]

@@HealthGage0336 triange

[@seal8092]

⁠@@HealthGage0336 Physically. He’s a triangle, sexuality wise. B*tch is a circle-

[@Spinelsofficalwife]

He’s a Fruity triangle, I can’t believe people actually believed he was in the first place-

[@arsonzartz]

he is the most transgender outside of the binary neurodivergent fruity triangle i can think of.

[@c0l3d.s0n]

Film Theory be like “and they were the best of friends”

[@carimeslockdownedtree2654]

I haven't watched Film Theory's vid because my book HASNT YET ARRIVEEED. But. But. Did. Did they fucking IGNORE ALL THE QUEERNESS IN IT??? ALL THE EXPLICIT MESSAGES ABOUT THEM BEING EXES???? YOOOOO I haven't yet watched your vid but I'm starting it rn

[@kattesaks]

god, i love your billford art speedpaint.

[@thenightsearcher]

i watched the film theory and i don’t own the book but i really want to but i’m glad you made this video and it’s really sad they didn’t talk about it i hope they do in the future

[@bonnieplushtuber5517]

I hope you remember that the oracle theory was made by matpat’s six year old son. Cut them some slack.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@bonnieplushtuber5517 oh my god I totally forgot to mention that! Yeah I did know. I don't blame the kid at all, he was being given censored summaries and he's six. It's just strange to me they put it in without much of a second thought as well

[@nerdydragonfan]

I don't think that invalidates the argument. The kid is six, so yeah, makes sense he'd leap to a conclusion like that (it's good that he'sbeing creative). The criticism lies with the adults who not only agreed to put a child's idea in there big theory video, but dedicated 1/5 of said 20 minutes video to this idea! I would understand if they had a comment or made a short, 'Hey, here's a mini theory Olie (I think that's how you spell the kids name) came up with and here's a little bit of evidence'. Instead, they present that idea as major part of THEIR theory; if perfectly understandable why someone would assume it's their theory.

[@44Hd22]

And 6 was an important number in Gravity Falls. Didn't Blendin Blandin have 6 hairs?

[@candicraveingcloude2822]

@@nerdydragonfan I would say if they're going to put a child's idea into one of their film theory videos, a, have a theory from the adult as well and b. acknowledge that the idea from the child is from the child

[@nulltergeist]

also they broke up anyways, maybe they dated before bill realized "oh hey i like men"

[@randomstuff7933]

I can’t believe film theory, pull the historian card on us

[@arsonzartz]

"bill cipher and his platonic muse" aah video

[@sonicxkids]

I hope Film Thoery gets enough flack from people for the blinding case of straight goggles they applied to the book that they address this glaring oversight in their next video.

[@DeathBySpooks]

Okay so this is. Completely and utterly true in my opinion. I think it's mostly on the fact that film theory didnt read it all as one but also on the whole well. History hates lovers trope. This is what we see in most media and the historian will call them friends. Roommates. Buddies. This is blatantly gay tbh as a trans bi guy- but you can't Completely fault film theory. Thought they. Should. Have read it together as a whole. (And that divorce fact was new to me!! That's even MORE evidence. Plus think about the fact alex hirche has tried to involve gay stuff in gravity falls and Disney in 2015 said no. AND BILL CALLS FORD PLANSEXUAL. LITERALLY. PANSEXUAL WITH AN L. You can't tell me this isn't gay.)

[@BikiniDoge]

Yeah, I mean how in the world did they think BILL CIPHER of all people, was hetero? It's more likely that a hamster comes to every house in the world to nibble on everyones eyelids than for Bill to not be a gay lil demon :D

[@Sora__Z]

Gah I love your art and the way you draw ford and bill is so nyom nyom :3 I love your bills human design

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@Sora__Z tysm!

[@Sora__Z]

@@BAM_Jammy no problem!😊

[@soumpy8951]

honestly it feels like with every passing year FT/GTs videos as a whole are more surface level analysis rather than wild theories.

[@Pancakes-n-Waffles168]

Obvious signs that bill and ford are exes: Film theory: "They were roomates"

[@Im_not_creative]

I get that the Oracle theory was originally by Matpats six year old son. And thats great good for them supporting a six years old theory, but seriously? His Ex girlfriend seems like a big jump just because bill was trying to avoid the topic of Exes and crossed off the Oracle in the henchmaniacs page isn't solid prove that those two things are related, andd not to discredit Ollie but the version he was read was watered down to be better to be read to a 6 year old and important details could have been left out I personally think the reason the Oracle was crossed off was not because they dated or anything but more because of her ties to the Axolotl and how bill might had seen that as a betrayal being as egotistical as he is Also for anyone like me who tried when the theory came out just to see if you tried in the website pto type in 'Oracle', 'The Oracle', etc on what shes called and none of it will bring up if she was really as important as they tried to make her seem, wouldn't there be more about her? Not even mentioning how theu pretty much ignored most of Bill's backstory for this half baked theory was really disappointing to see and i have a feeling there just gonna somehow try to expand on it the next theory about the website

[@alicecovers19]

I agree so heavily with this, I actually couldn't believe they barely touched on the missing journal 3 pages because I was under the impression that was the most important part and definitely the most lore heavy other than maybe early life, It felt like they kinda brought up the oracle out of nowhere as a way to cover up talking about ford.. I also would've loved to see them go more into detail about his childhood and the way bill would talk about it in particular. ALSO (sorry i'm just now realizing how strong my options are on this) it wasn't really a theory video, they spent like twenty-five minutes explaining (and skipping over all the important parts) as if the person watching had never even heard of gravity falls, and then 3 minutes on a kinda terrible theory. I'm a huge game/film theory fan but I was really disappointed by this one.

[@MewGamer-bj9in]

I love how you drew Bill I see so much of a tumblr sexy man Verizons of him it’s so fun seeing a different interpretation of him

[@EmoJiraiBoyKuromi]

Film theory has honestly not been the same since Mat left. Now dont get me wrong Im glad hes able to focus on his family and plus he never really got into the queer stuff a heck of a lot but still I miss his presence in the theories and say what you will abt him but he never glossed over that much lore in his vids (also no hate to the other theorists involved in film theory either they just haven’t been doing it as long as him so it will take time to catch up)

[@BAM_Jammy]

@EmoJiraiBoyKuromi yeah I miss MatPat too. I think my general problems with the oracle and Bill theory would've been the same with him, just based on the livestream he was in covering it, but it does feel he mightve tried to go more in depth overall. Whatever he needs though, he's just some guy after all

[@eloise2319]

You've put a lot of my scrambled thoughts into a very cohesive video! Really well done. I think it's very important to always talk about this kinds of things as a community when we come across them!

[@ebeetl]

this is why i HATED their hollowknight analysis, they just gloss over IMPORTANT LORE and completely ignore queer characters

[@mydogghost]

The hollow knight theory was about the knight why would they mentioned the queer relationships

[@sharkylady]

I do want to mention that the theory video is a FIRST PART of a MULTI-PARTER, Lee (main guy on Film Theory) said that it is not possible to cover every single thing in the Book of Bill in a single video. They might bring it up in the future. And they did mention Bill going to a bar after his and Ford's "falling out". I also think we should keep in mind that giving a literary analysis is not what their content is about. The Theorists prioritize what they are known for above most other things, which is about piecing things together and making an idea out of it. Therefore- the first video they make on the Book is about the codes and general narrative so it's easier to follow. They are not here to give a queer reading on the text, there are so many other youtubers who will do that. I am saying that as someone who is queer themselves- I feel like expecting Film Theory to cover the queer subtext (well... it is pretty straightforward to be fair-) is misplaced expectations, considering what their job is, what their audience expects, and what they have historically done. To add on top of that, the Theorists' goal is to be a little educational, while encouraging others to do theory crafting of their own, to think about things outside the box. They are not claiming Bill and Ford's relationship wasn't romantic, but they are tackling it as factually as they can, which is their transactional partnership. They would always encourage people to go and read the source media themselves, and by doing so, come up with their own conclusions. Including reading into the queer narrative of the story. I understand how hearing the Oracle theory on top of that would be frustrating though- I understand how it would leave the impression that they are erasing Bill's queer side. However, I do think the theory has legs to stand on. While Bill's avoidance to romantic questions could be read as avoidance to only Ford or only the Oracle- I think it's both. He could have easily been involved in both of them at some point. I understand how they reached that conclusion, and with the theory it does add extra layers to both Bill and the Oracle, which I'm all about. But I do agree, Ford and Bill's relationship is also plain to see, there's just less secret codes about it, and more subtle, so I do think that is why the Theorists didn't mention it. Overall- I don't think they did this with any ill will- hell they have a few queer folk on their team- and in generally they are not the type to delve too deep into romantic subplots in the first place (unless it's horror related/j). While I do hope they acknowledge it to some level in the next theories, I understand if they don't (at least not in a queer understanding of the story), but I also understand your frustration.

[@BAM_Jammy]

Yeah I don't believe this was ever malicious on their part, I was just severely disappointed by how surface level the whole video was and that the only actual theory was something with very little evidence behind it. It was also sort of a way for me to talk about the issue of queer erasure in the modern day as a whole just happened to be through this lens

[@twideslauriers7875]

the theory channels have a history of ignoring queerness in media. they never did get Frisk or Chara Undertale’s pronouns right :/

[@BAM_Jammy]

Unfortunate but true :(

[@sumsumplays]

Dude ash is she/they, it was probably an accident and i didn’t even know that?

[@jaayfall211]

​@@sumsumplays That doesn't excuse it, it's like saying "I'm not homophobic I have gay friends" Because no, the sole fact that they ignore queerness is bad, even if they have queer staff because that is still erasing it, probably because they don't want to piss off people who hate queers

[@missyvespersvicepresident4462]

But like chara and frisk are ALWAYS referred to as they/them? Not saying its impossible to make a mistake, just confused howd you miss it ​@@sumsumplays

[@Yami-mugoni613]

@@missyvespersvicepresident4462even the fandom misgenders them or gives them a gender

[@cawareyoudoin7379]

I think some things they will cover later, like the silly straws and the whole Euclydia thing, because they have said they're planning another theory, but... Yeah the Ford erasure is so weird and not in a good way XD

[@cheese7119]

When it got to that part of the video with the crossed out lovers i was like yesss nows the ford part but then they pulled this girl out-of their- and im not saying shes not ANOTHER ex of bill because it could be but i don't think she's the most important here

[@BAM_Jammy]

👏👏👏

[@airobo6781]

MatPat is possibly the world’s most heterosexual theater kid. Second only to middle school boys taking the class because they think it’s the easy elective

[@ragcat3732]

The way you draw hands is absolutely magnificent

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@ragcat3732 thank you!

[@ArrangedNerd]

I was so mad when I was watching that GTlive vid Thank you for the rant, I needed to hear someone else talk about this

[@sorrel_leaf_vespers]

Gender studies major here! Your analysis of queer erasure is spot on. I've done a lot of analysis of it throughout history, and it's definitely a problem. Same goes for whitewashing and treatment of mental health. While we're making progress, it's still hard to change mindsets. Even with all the clues pointing to Bill and Ford, sometimes heteronormativity takes over. I'm glad there are people who are aware of it and aren't afraid to call it out. And I am also an annoying gay who is weird about fictional characters. You're fine XD. I really enjoyed the rant! My friend is currently trying to induct me into the Bill Cipher fandom so it's great to get more context.

[@BAM_Jammy]

Tysm! It’s good to know someone understands what I was going for.

[@MonitorMuse]

I mean I'm not a gay/or bi guy by any stretch but even I can tell they were leaning into Bill and Ford having romantic/deeper feelings for each other outside of just Bill manipulating Ford. Like ill fated soulmates even.

[@anothername2557]

even the website. like "EVEN HIS LIES ARE LIES" code where he writes about never feeling ANYTHING for Ford and just lying to him. like it's in the the NAME OF THE CODE!!

[@Daydream_Demon]

I remember watching the video and being SO CONFUSED about them not mentioning the whole BillFord aspect of it. As even I who has trouble interpreting/noticing very obvious things (like me not noticing that the Journal 3 had 6 fingers on the cover and that that was because Ford had 6 fingers). I still managed to catch that they have been in some sort of intimate relationship (whether queerplatonic, romantic, or something else) and I was waiting so hard for them to touch on it. Though as you said that may be because a lot of queer representation is kind of wiped out by assumptions on heterosexuality being the default until proven otherwise. And as a non-cishet individual who is involved in the community, it was easier for me to see the plain text of it and how it related to the show and the book. As the "put your partner in a love cage pyramid and sing a song to them" and "bring rats to them as a present" which way too obviously relates to what happened in the show and later in the book along with the infamous "One sixer, please." While the ideas at the end about Bill Cipher being reincarnated are solid, some of the middle parts were lacking.

[@lotus3241]

it gave me psychic damage how ignorant they were about the book of bill, like it genuinely feels like some sort of clickbait baby food type of content. it puts me in such awe. i'm not usually the type of person to say 'i miss the old this or that' but if matpat was still the game theorist he would have at the very least made the video mediocre. it is not that hard to read a book before you talk about it, like a little bit of effort could have gone a long way.

[@Eliot-is-Dead]

This is so true, when I was watching the film theory episode I was just like… it’s very obvious that they’re exes. It reads like a toxic old man yaoi, like, come on.

[@merissaburleson4738]

I'm very glad you were being respectful to the theory team in the video, and in the comments. I've seen so many videos about the theory team in the past that have been just them hating on the actual people and not the theories their complaining about, so thank you for that! (To be honest, that was all I wanted to say, Lol)

[@princembat]

(noting that i havent see the film theory video lol) bill and ford have ALWAYS seemed like exes to me, even before i really _realized_ that that was the dynamic i was picking up on, but this book literally solidified it and more... like, idk man, being in another mans body is kinda gay /j but seriously, talking about the book of bill and not even talking about their relationship is just... what. like its kinda the most important part, at least to me. not saying that the other parts arent important, but getting more clarification that recontextualizes the show as much as the journal pages do... oh my gosh. it makes moments like stan and fords reunion back in the 80s so much darker, and honestly just makes _a lot_ of stuff much darker. i guess maybe it doesnt lend much to making theories, but it definitely does a lot otherwise. also just... come on. theyre exes.

[@ilyfinn.]

another thing to add, going based off of memory lol. they did not buy the barns and noble exclusive book which has the missing pages from journal 3, and i remember them saying they did not buy it, which could be why they didn't talk about that stuff. because i'm 100% sure the missing journal 3 pages were in the extra 16 pages for the exclusive books, i could i be wrong tho... just a theory.. A FLIM THEORYYY

[@BAM_Jammy]

@ilyfinn. I actually saw a tumblr post showing off which pages were in the exclusive version and as far as I can tell all the missing journal pages are in both versions! I'd be kinda surprised if they weren't seeing how important to the plot they are lol

[@ilyfinn.]

@@BAM_Jammy oh!! That makes so much more sense now lol, then yes they really just didn't care for those pages. I also remember they said that they were gonna make more videos about bill and stuff because they couldn't fit it in the first one so that could be one of the reasons but I see his lore and the missing pages as the most important parts but that's my opinion lolol

[@babybillblanchn]

THANK YOU I WAS SO EXCITED THAN I WATCHED IT AND WAS LIKE WHAT.

[@Weremsye1]

We need matpat on the BoB😭😭 I agree with everything you said so much! Thank you for making this, we need more doomed old man yaoi💔💔

[@BAM_Jammy]

More doomed old man yaoi!!!

[@Whatisthisgremlin]

So Film Theory didn’t acknowledge Bill’s backstory?… YOU’VE DISAPPOINTED ME FILM THEORY

[@BAM_Jammy]

Well they did acknowledge it, but on a very basic surface level

[@annayaexe]

YESSS this is what i was trying to say in my video!! love this explanation!!

[@garlicbreadpog]

I think a big problem is at its core, the theorist channels are a business, and are run like a business. There is, from what we see into it, a lot of rushed things to get things done because of that, which is why a lot of this happened. Its really where a lot of the problems with the worse theories on the channel come from Also, the queer thing is just... ugh like they aren't homophobic or anything obviously their brand is very clearly not that, but its just so frustrating that straight is so often, in this case unconsciously but also sometimes consciously, see cis-het as the default. That institutionalized homophobia is clearly a big factor, but I also just think they haven't spent enough time in the media around it or its fandom. Great video!

[@arsonzartz]

i feel like matpat would totally analyze the old man yaoi if he still was on film theory. nowadays it just feels too scripted and like their just trying to get ANY unexpected theory on it.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@garlicbreadpog so true!!

[@BAM_Jammy]

@arsonzartz unfortunately I have to disagree. Love the guy but he was in a livestream where they covered The Book of Bill and the problem was similarly palpable there :( but I agree that things on the channels overall definitely feels less personal now that he's no longer at the forefront

[@arsonzartz]

@@BAM_Jammy dang, i never watched the live-

[@QueenLillyputt]

I love the theory channels so much, and matpat is probably my favorite KZbinr - but I completely agree. For the last couple years (since matpat has slowly moved away from the channels, before retiring) it has felt increasingly more like a business, and people doing their jobs, rather than people making fun theories about stuff they love. (yes, I know it IS their jobs, but it feels like the channels have lost a lot of the passion they used to have.) The new video was incredibly disappointing, and honestly, a pretty bad analysis of the text. And even though Olly’s theory was adorable-and correct to some extent- (the oracle being the scribbled out portrait), not talking about Ford and Bill is actually insane from an analytical standpoint, like it is so so so obvious, as well as interesting, and a great starting pad for a theory! And while I definitely don’t think they’re homophobic, they seem to just not always see the queer relationships in some of the media they cover. It’s sad, but I’m still holding on to the hope that they’ll become better after the new hosts get more used to it :(

[@CupcakePlushProductions]

to be fair, a lot of what not just film theory, but all the theorist channels just kinda give the cliff notes version of pretty much all the subjects they cover, and kinda just wait for other people to figure out everything for them then just give a summary of that info. Then what they do come up with themselves is usually just flat out wrong and comes out of nowhere-

[@Ginger_The_Bread978]

Hey there! I want to preface this by saying I'm not trying to be all "erm, actually" when I see this. The idea that the Oracle dated Bill actually came from Mat's son, Ollie. He states as much in the gtlive where they react to the Book of Bill, but it's near the end, and I know most people don't have the attention span to watch over an hour of content, so I don't blame you for missing this. I'm not saying that there isn't a problem with people seeing queer subtext over at the theory channels, but there is also the possibility that they wanted to include Ollie in things :)

[@i_wuz_h3re]

I remember this part of the video and while yes wholesome, when's the last time any of the theory channels have had chunks of important lore and information of a show, game, etc. skipped over because of Ollie? It feels like an odd excuse because I've loved the channels for years and I felt hurt seeing that one on my safe places I retreat, skim over queer coded/ representation in a show I have loved for years. I was very enthusiastic about the Book of Bill because I couldn't wait to scan through every single page and was surprised over the entire Billford pop up. I watched the show young and never picked up any romantic subtexts and now that I've rewatched the shows I loved when I was young, I've come to love them even more, seeing that they have queer coding within them or any other representation. Queer erasure is something that I want to forget when I go to a safe place, and i rewatched that video hoping I missed something, only for there to be no mention of Bill and Ford's romantic implications. Even a quick few sentences or sentence obviously mentioning its existence would've made my day. Because one sentence of queer representation for me is still better than nothing. I had my standards set low and have always had them low because of my life circumstances and I'm just sad. That they still couldn't be met, by people I look up to.

[@BAM_Jammy]

@Ginger_The_Bread978 I know!! I actually watched this VOD and even had it written in my notes but somehow forgot to mention it 😫 said this in a different comment but I don't blame the kid at all. He was being given censored summaries. I mainly have a problem with the theory crews lack of research and the fact they left it in while glossing over so much of the other WAAY more important stuff. Ugh I feel totally dumb that I just forgot to bring it up lol

[@i_wuz_h3re]

Sorry for how long that comment was, I just wanted to rant, I'm aroace and I have dealt with queer erasure my entire life, but do feel that aroace erasure is more intense, so whenever I see any queer representation erased, skipped over, etc. i feel hurt and offended on that behalf of such erasure. (In both negatively or neutral stances) To make it clear I don't spread hate and would never condone it, I just wanted to rant about my thoughts of the video I've kept in my head for the past few days. And just be able to talk about how I felt. Dealing with erasure everyday for it to also spread into places I feel comfortable.

[@BAM_Jammy]

​@i_wuz_h3re you are 100% valid and welcome here ❤ I think we're all pretty frustrated by the constant queer erasure we seem to see

[@i_wuz_h3re]

@@BAM_Jammy I'm happy I found your video because I don't know where else I could have ranted about my thoughts about this topic without seeming like I have an 'agenda' to push. Agenda? I don't have a genda! Ha, this is how I cope.

[@starcupcake]

I didn't watch the film theory video, but when i first heard from someone that they say Bill was in relationship with oracle and didn't mention Ford and Bill relationship at all i knew I won't even bother with watching it since it was SO IMPORTANT in the book, even if you don't read it as romantic (but like come on...) it was even brought up slightly on the page Ford explains what the book is. I hope they will do some kind of follow up video for that reason alone. Also not having one person read the whole book is insane?? Some chapters directly correlate to each other and not having at least one person who would know all content of book and make theory's on top of that is really wild and honestly stupid, especially with how book of Bill is not a long read, the longest part of my read-through was probably solving all the codes. After hearing all that I'm just so disappointed, game and film theory were some part of my childhood and what got me into theorizing about my favorite media, and i can't believe they treated arguably one of most theories oriented media this way. I hope they'll learn from what they did and that they will do better in future.

[@laurarowland7294]

I'll say for Film Theory's part, BillFord wasn't meant to be ignored, but BillFord has /been/ part of the GF community's headcanon for a while now. Film Theory focused on newer lore and facts given to us, such as (another) possible ex of Bill, the Oracle, but also some explanation for Bill's origin- his home, the destruction, and his motives, and then a look into Bill post-Season 2. Also, while some of the Theory Crew are cis-het, some aren't! A more well known ~rainbow~ member being Ash, new host of GT-Live, who has most likey knows about the queer subtext in Gravity Falls. (let's not participate in bi/pan erasure! Bill could definitely have felt for both Oracle AND Ford, it's just the Oracle has specifically been called out in actual text to be an ex of Bill's)

[@doctor.spencer]

thank god someone else felt off about this. I have said several times that film theory consistently ignores the theming of a story in favor of making a theory. to ignore bill and ford's relationship is to ignore the themes of recovery and abuse that MAKE this book. anyways imma work on my billford video essay xoxo

[@t0jil_art]

The only thing I dislike about this video is the whole comment section saying "bill is queer ! he would never have a girlfriends" like bisexuality is not an option 💀Obviously I agree that the fact they didn't mention Ford when half of the book is about him and his relationship with Bill and the other characters is stupid. But stating one character could've been an ex girlfriend to a potential queer character is erasure is... disingenuous IMO. Loved your video tho it helped to summon up more info about the book that Film theory didn't touch on at all :]

[@BAM_Jammy]

Yeah I totally hear that. I agree because Bill’s species doesn’t really have a concept of gender so I can’t imagine that coming up in a romantic context. I only really wanted to use it as a jumping off point and was frustrated they didn’t talk about it at all, not necessarily that they thought the Oracle and Bill could’ve been exes if ykwim

[@CrispedBaconBits]

I might recreate this video (theres A LOT of stuff that you missed)

[@BAM_Jammy]

Please feel free to add to the conversation! This was more so an impulsive rant about what specifically upset me and not a thorough coverage or anything, pretty much entirely unscripted

[@Eris1987]

I think it's the way the team was taught to go about theory crafting. They are primarily focused on creating a narrative while brushing aside any evidence that would contradict the story they are trying to tell. Btw I say this for a reason.

[@floralstorms]

THANK YOU!! That video annoyed me so much. Love the Billford art by the way! Very pretty.

[@M4t_P4tGT]

Man I didn’t watch the theory so this appearing in my recommended made me stop for a second and go “huh???”

[@holyheckinheckohheck]

The Oracle thing is interesting because I actually thought it was slightly implied that Bill and the Oracle had a thing? (Edit: To clarify I am a queer non-binary person) Bill doesn't really have a sexual orientation imo because his relationships all exist to serve his own ego, I think it seemed a little implied that Bill has definitely had other relationships and the Oracle could have very easily been one, also I think "we have the same shitty ex??" is a funny angle to look at the interactions of Ford and the Oracle in Journal 3 from lol. Oh and another thing, Bill is explicitly non-binary/genderqueer and a lot of people are overlooking that and its importance as a queer theme.

[@The-one-and-only-Fruitcake]

Also like Are we just collectively forgetting that bisexuality exists?

[@holyheckinheckohheck]

@@The-one-and-only-Fruitcake I know right it's kind of wild like personally I think Bill transcends human sexuality, but if you had were to describe him by it he would probably be pan (and then Ford is pretty explicitly ace). That is all very queer in whatever direction but Bill x Oracle does not erase or negate Bill x Ford both can be a thing lol (Game Theory not mentioning Billford is a different situation obviously)

[@The-one-and-only-Fruitcake]

@@holyheckinheckohheck honestly, I just can’t believe that the internet is mad about the possible relationships of a sentient triangle from a Disney show

[@Raccoonboi634]

Ong off topic but I’m in love with your art style :00

[@BAM_Jammy]

@@Raccoonboi634 tysm!

[@Artificer_]

I KNEW my choice to refuse that video was a good one. It already pissed me off because there was literally a bit of Matpat SAYING “Sorry Theorists, you’re on your own” IN THE WEBSITE!!!! Why make the video anyway?! And given this video’s existence (i haven’t read the full thing yet) it tells me they not only went against what Mathew Pathew said, but made a BAD statement. What the fuck.

[@YellowCounters9666]

Ever since matpat quit from game theory everything is a disaster

[@seesawseesaw]

matpat was part of the stream where they talked about all of this live

[@Quackervoltz]

Nah it was always shit

[@YellowCounters9666]

@@Quackervoltz holy shit it's streber

[@DEADBOYWALKING555]

tbh not really, i think the issue is mostly with film and game theory since food theory and style theory are both still doing very well and maybe even better than before, especially with amy disproving matpat's "sunscreen doesnt matter" bs

[@luckyduckyfluffy9674]

Honestly they should've stuck with fnaf theories I'm pretty sure Ford and Bill represent a toxic relationship (i mean just look how they act around each other) I never really liked game theories recent theories especially after welcome home

[@dalma0861]

Tysm for this video, I thought I was going crazy, but I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way! Honestly imo it wouldn't have really bothered me if they didn't mention Bill and Ford having a romantic relationship, as I personally don't really care if they really were together or not, but it did really bother me that they didn't mention their bond. Like, if they didn't want it to be queer, they could've still interpreted it as platonic, but they could've at least talked about how deep their friendship was. It's so obvious that they were so important to eachother, to me, it felt like they were purposefully trying to erase their realitionship. Like c'mon, it's so obvious, how can you not notice it?

[@kaylaHat]

Film theory is just bad at media literacy, like, they can't pick up on explicit informations. Im surprised they know which twin is called Stanford! Remember the Lorax video? They couldn't be bothered to lisent to the lyrics of a 3 minute song! You think they can READ??? And im saying that as a fan of the other channels!

[@Scrromy]

MatPat even talks about the theory about the oracle on gtlive and how Ollie was the one who came up with it

[@microwavedasphalt]

I KNEW I WASNT THE ONLY ONE THAT GOT SO FRUSTRATED WITH IT 😭🙏 this is why i asked my mom to get me the book lmao

[@kiaratoo]

I don't usually watch Game theory/film theory/theory theory ect - but when I saw they had made a vid on the Book of Bill I immediately clicked on it, of course. Barely ten minutes in and I clicked off. I could just tell the vibes were off. And when my friend, who had watched the vid, texted me all 'omg did you see that the Oracle and Bill were exs!?' I was even more glad I hadnt watched it. So, thank you for making this video so I can actually have reasons for why I didn’t like their video other than 'vibes felt off' 🙏

[@cheese7119]

BILLFORD FOREVER WOOOO