Was Charlemagne French or German?

in this video, we ask: Was Charlemagne, and therefore were the Franks, French or Germans, and if either, why?

[@yourethatmantis5178]

"These lands would never be reunited except briefly twice about a thousand years later" Napoleon and Hitler: Allow us to introduce ourselves.

[@cedricl.marquard6273]

What's the time stamp?

[@OAlemaozinho]

@@cedricl.marquard6273 4:05

[@cedricl.marquard6273]

@@OAlemaozinho thank you very much

[@xenotypos]

Funny that the two that repeated Charlemagne's feat were french and german, emphasizing again how just they both take after the frankish empire.

[@gustaf3811]

They weren't united under Hitler though, the French were invaded.

[@kwek2798]

Romans: *He's a barbarian*

[@DimitrisGenn]

@Sam A3 Eastern Romans: We're right here!

[@pwao]

Like Conan

[@sturlamolden]

No, the Barbarians came from Bavaria, hence the similarity in name.

[@e.hanker193]

@@sturlamolden You do know Barbarians have got nothing to do with the word Bavaria, do you?

[@arx3516]

The Pope sayd he wasn't, and the Pope controlled the roman senate.

[@tlotpwist3417]

How to know if someone who is both French and German? He goes on strikes but only during his holidays

[@zombies4evadude24]

And is peaceful on Christmas Day

[@fluffypancakes7626]

So Swiss ;)

[@basedkaiser5352]

@@fluffypancakes7626 or Belgian, but he gets bullied by his bigger brothers.

[@yusuf3005]

French is frank, mean german 😅

[@rfij3268]

The true question is... *Who was the first Holy Roman Emperor? This guy or Otto the First?*

[@Rocinante2300]

el agente de medianoche what do you think?

[@pilgrim4954]

This man

[@Samm815]

Well according to Charlemagne, his grandad.

[@garabic8688]

Charlemagne was the first, but the Holy Roman Empire didn't come into existence until Otto the Great

[@riograndedosulball248]

He was like Caesar, not the first emperor, but the major piece to bring them into existence

[@paul1x1]

His real name was O Charlemagne he was irish

[@patrickmcshane7658]

Of course

[@Saint_nobody]

Close. kzbin.info/www/bejne/maeug5WfZ9Spers

[@youcefferah8756]

this cracked me up

[@pwao]

He was Harlemagne from Harlem.

[@paul1x1]

@@pwao I didn't know all the people in Harlem were Irish like obama his family are from county wicklow

[@dankfatboi]

Well no he's actually American and was the first US president

[@Viguier89]

Ah yes indeed, the US got their independence when they defeated the Egyptians lead by Napoleon at the battle of Tokyo. Charlemagne was a great president, too bad he was actually communist like Milton Friedman.

[@jerricklittle3306]

@@Viguier89 you could write a novel with that.

[@Viguier89]

@@jerricklittle3306 Charlemagne, the mummy's slayer.

[@arx3516]

@@Viguier89 Netflix has given green light to a movie about the battle of Tokyo. I hope they represent accuratley the final duel, where Charlemaigne wielding Joyeuse faced Napoleon who was armed with Hame no Murakumo that he stole from the imperial palace.

[@JackoBanon1]

@@fonfon575 People are shocked already that the world is flat. How should they be able to comprehend facts like that?

[@sumpfkreatur]

Was Charlemagne French or German? Yes.

[@LookBackHistory]

lol

[@sumpfkreatur]

@@Reichsritter yes

[@DaveTheVader]

Was Charlemagne French or German? No.

[@sumpfkreatur]

@@DaveTheVader perhaps?

[@RhadaGhast100]

Well, not quite. Hes Frankish which was a germanic ethnic group that later lead to ethnic groups like French or German, I could be wrong in my wording though.

[@roelantverhoeven371]

fun fact: both germany and france had a battleship named after him at the same time in the 1890's... charlemagne and kaiser karl der grosse

[@olavtryggvason1194]

The Franks (I am one myself) were a large Germanic tribe from the beginning. Those who later settled in what now is France (Neustria) began to use the local language of Roman origin, which developed to modern French. Those who settled in the East (Austrasia) continued with their Germanic language, whiche developed modern German. Neustria became France, Austrasia became Germany. Charlemagne (Carolus Magnus) was much aware of the lingual division in his empire. He initiated the concile of Tours in 813, where it was decided that the preeches (homilies) in the catholic services should be held in the languages of the common people: "in linguam rusticam aut romanam, aut theodiscam". Which means: In the rural language, either Roman(French) or Dutch (German). The word "theodiscam" is the origin of the word "Dutch", which originally meant the German language, not Netherlands. Charlemagne knew that he was the ruler of an empire where at least three - probably more - languages were spoken: proto-French, proto-Italian and proto-German. The nationalities "French" or "German" in modern meaning did not exist in his time.

[@rumbigaming]

Source? I'd like to read more about it. Also it probably was "deutsch" and not "dutch". This gets mixed up pretty often

[@wolfgangpagel6989]

"Dutch" as a language is a Variety of dialects known as lower German spoken in all the Northern states. In the German unification process it was replaced by the standardiced "Hochdeutsch" (translating as high German) which is a mix of the german dialects that Luther used for his Translation of the bible. In Germany there was also the slavic tongue and there are Flamish and frisian people. Other Germanic languages are more different from the German language (svedish, Danish, Norvegian). The Roman language served as a lingua franca meaning the language for understanding. The word frank means also 'free' as in places like Frankfurt, not related to the Frankish people.

[@wolfgangpagel6989]

@@rumbigaming In German the dialects are called "Niederdeutsch" or "Plattdeutsch" referring that they are spoken in the flat lands close to the coast. The Nederlands are only a small part of these. So dutch is the nether German version of deutsch. In Germany (and what is the lost lands in the East) the lower german dialects were almost erased as a spoken language when the school teached in Standard German (Hochdeutsch), especially in Prussia, the largest German state.

[@louisf2654]

Didn't Austrasia evolve into Burgundy? Don't you mean the eastern realm rather than the central one?

[@wolfgangpagel6989]

@@louisf2654 wtf? Don't you know the word AUSTRIA? Burgundy already existed as that, the land of the Burgundian tribe that was resettled by the Romans from their kingdom at the river Rhine to the region that is now known as Burgundy. It is Germanic but not the Franks. The realm of the Franks was divided into Austria and Neustria, meaning East and West, and there was no "central" in this. The important part is the time stamp.

[@admiralsquatbar127]

Noble man: "Can I be frank with you?" Charlemagne: "Okay, as long as I can still be Charlemagne."

[@IiPertI]

In your sentence frank means free, oh wait ! free-hench :)

[@thelastprussian6491]

*Karl der Große

[@peterg.8941]

@@thelastprussian6491 🤦‍♂️

[@Ditka-89]

@ blank stares from the Saxons and Lombards sitting in the room

[@olavtryggvason1194]

May I be frank with all of you ? My first name is Frank. My mom gave me the name of my tribe. The name Olav Tryggvason I took after a Viking king from Norway. It is not my real name.

[@derekstevens96]

Wasn't he from North Carolina

[@DinnersForOne]

Yes, i belive so.. i think he was arrested in Texas for fishing from the back of a giraffe in one of their lakes!

[@biliminsrlar5752]

He was Mexican

[@roseblossom2023]

No, as a matter of fact, he's from Florida!

[@rocknroll909]

Carolinian Empire

[@roisbelhernandez1430]

"His brother who died of natural causes soon after" *Me, a CK2 Scholar: DOUBT

[@mrschloop686]

The big papa of Europe

[@Cyprian96]

Western europe

[@riograndedosulball248]

As if there is an important part of Europe that isn't the West

[@nattygsbord]

Venice, the Teutonic order, The Polish-Lituanian commonwealth, The Swedish empire, Moscowy were all non-western important states of Europe, so no, I don't feel any ties with this man. Nor do I see how he would be relevant for Britain, Spain, Portugal or Genoa.

[@lewistaylor2858]

@@nattygsbord how us Venice non-western?

[@nattygsbord]

@@lewistaylor2858 it is not western, but rather central european. Its empire was on the balkan coast around the adriatic sea - which people consider to be eastern europe today. Yugoslavia is eastern Europe, so by that logic should Venice also be called eastern europe.

[@Tintin824]

He was Sudanese

[@thegigadykid1]

Lmmfao

[@bosbanon3452]

Eus

[@amirhoseinaghajani7811]

He was a trans woman of color

[@HaroldHivart]

Charlemagne was a hipster, muslim & gay...

[@pipthegooner]

idk why this made me laugh 🤣🤣

[@0.0-c5o]

He wasn't french or germans, he just was Franc

[@obvioustroll3899]

Frank is a typical jewish surname so...

[@0.0-c5o]

@@obvioustroll3899 haha my bad, i wanted to say Franc, The Germanic Group

[@darthplagueis13]

@@obvioustroll3899 Not technically. It's a typical german/germanic surname. If you recognize this name mostly from jews the reason might be that they or their families fled from germany during the 3rd Reich (many names that are considered jewish in the US are actually just german).

[@abeedhal6519]

Who are Germans. Franks are spelled with a k in english btw.

[@obvioustroll3899]

@casey Family name.

[@gabrielaponte6403]

He was actually Mexican

[@evzenvarga9707]

So a he was a spaniard.

[@climberly]

VIVA LA MEXICO!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@connorbrennan501]

he was serbian

[@Kuriko777]

He's actually Chinese

[@Saint_nobody]

Nah kzbin.info/www/bejne/maeug5WfZ9Spers

[@maxis2k]

"When his son Louis died..." Well, I found the start of France's problems.

[@kylemohs8728]

Too many Louis's?

[@Raisonnance.]

Naaaah it's fine. We like that.

[@deadchannel1943]

@@kylemohs8728 only 18, not much

[@basedkaiser5352]

@@deadchannel1943 Louis is actually a condensed version of the name Clovis, so that means there are 20 Louis

[@impressions9558]

People back then belonged to tribes, clans, family lineages. The diversity of languages and dialects from village to village was incredible. There was no notion of nation as we know it today.

[@Thomas-xd4cx]

Nah, this is nonsense. Ofcourse there are large differences - nothing changed with regards to that. I can drive 10 minutes east and they talk a completely different dialect than 10 minutes west. Same with north and south. The only thing different with Germanics is that our loyalty goes outwards instead of inwards. Family>community>region>province>country. It is also well known how averse Germanics were to outsiders. They intermarried with other Germanics but seldom outside. This can be seen most pronounced in the nordic countries where they have very little non-Germanic dna. These are the facts - not that globalist idealism.

[@migamaos3953]

@@Thomas-xd4cxno use trying to inform these people, they can only interpret history according to their weird politics and beliefs 😂

[@FugueSt4te]

@@Thomas-xd4cx You're delusional

[@Thomas-xd4cx]

@@FugueSt4te cope and seethe lowlife

[@sethvelazquez8143]

@@Thomas-xd4cx 🤓☝️ “axthually” like history was the same for the entirety of it there was definitely times where culture was very diverse from village to village.

[@beambooi6431]

I’d say he was more German. Franks where a Germanic people and he was king of the Franks, a Germanic confederation/nation. The French inherited the demonym “French” from the Franks and France from the Frankish realm but at the end of the day i feel like the soul of the French is not Germanic. The French are Latinized Celts with some Germanic influence. But I’ve always felt that the French aligned more with the Latins and their Celtic roots than with their Germanic influence from the Franks. Charlemagne wasn’t either Celtic or Latin. He as Germanic. The French don’t speak a Germanic language and have only some Germanic influence. Charlemagne would have had closer affinity to the Dutch/Flemish (who speak a language descended from the Franks) or the Germans who are Germanic speaking

[@talmik8938]

At the end of the day you would struggle to scientifically explain what soul mean. You call Germany from Cesar Germania, an approximate geographic definition. You, englishmen, we frenchmen, and germans both call us franks, in their respective language. We call german Allemand from alémans or alamans wich means all mann, the way a germanic tribe call themselves located at the east of the Franks during Clovis time. Nowadays germans call themselves deutsch : the people.

[@chingizzhylkybayev8575]

@doczg88 genetically they're mostly Gauls. It makes sense anyways, since Gaul has always been a wealthy urbanized region, not some tribes in the forest. Foreign conquerors could impose their culture but never really displaced the native Gauls physically.

[@KarlMartell732]

The French are gallo-romance despite the name, just like the Turks aren´t really central asian ethno-culturally, but levantine, middle eastern. Both got their names from invading ruler tribes.

[@ОлегВоло-с2н]

The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic origin

[@ОлегВоло-с2н]

The famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:

[@Shockprowl]

THAT..... was an excellent video, sir. I've never heard that question answer in such a brilliantly concise yet informative way. A lot of stuff has made sense in my head now, because of that video. Thank you.

[@serathaevistille995]

This video was remarkably well done, and came to the same conclusion I thought it would upon starting. He was neither. I wish more people would come to realise that modern terms, morals, and other such things, largely, can't be applied to our ancestors in the same way. Thank you for this video, much like the rest, they're flawless and objective.

[@skiteufr]

I am French and I totally agree that Charlemagne was neither French or German but Frank, so an ancestor for both of us on whom you can't apply modern nationalist definitions. He was politically and historically equally important for both countries. The Franks are ancestors of many people accross Europe but for non-French people, here is the reason why they are important for the French : they founded the country, we start speaking of "France" after their arrival. They mixed with the Gallo Romans to form the foundation of modern French people on which other people have added up since then. They (Clovis) created the state and chose Paris as capital. And more importantly the 3 royal dynasties that ruled France or its ancient form are all Frankish.

[@WTFisDrifting]

skiteufr the Franks are German so he’s German

[@glx4909]

@@WTFisDrifting German is one thing, Germanic is another. ..as explained in the video.

[@jumperwilli7770]

Religious candy bar and french

[@davidandremelchorzavala2100]

So if then the counting of the kings Louis’ wrong? You’d have to substract the Louis’ prior to 843 or Hugues Capet, no? I mean, then when was France founded if Charlemagne doesn’t count as French?

[@jumperwilli7770]

David André Melchor Zavala they consider clovis to be the first king,but if I remember correctly,he was frrankish

[@abacaxi.maldoso]

Before watching let me guess; he was neighter there was no France nor Germany at that time so he was Frank.

[@abacaxi.maldoso]

Yeah that was it.

[@aid-ngaming625]

Abacaxi Satânico did you just reply to your own comment?

[@milckop2972]

Que porra em

[@reschi56]

The concept of German and Germany existed long before the country of Germany itself. This video gives a weak answer to please the most amount of people.

[@majan6267]

@@reschi56 du überschätzt das Alter dieses Konzeptes allerdings deutlich. Die Nationen so wie wir sie heute verstehen sind im ausgehenden 18./ frühen 19. Jhd. entstanden, vorher gab es die Idee der ähnlichen Sprache, "deutsch" bedeutet wörtlich "des Volkes" und ist auf die Sprache bezogen, nichts anderes, aber auch eher erst seit Luther. Hättest du einen Münchener in der Vormoderne gefragt, ob er sich einem Hamburger, einem Amsterdamer, einem Brüsseler oder einem Pariser näher verbunden fühlt, hätte er vermutlich geantwortet, das er mit all diesen Herren nichts am Hut hat, die Frage ob er sich als "deutsch" sehe würde eher wohl kaum verstehen. Zur Zeit Karls des Großen sind diese Konzepte von deutsch oder französisch völliger Quatsch, da hat das Video nicht die einfache, sondern die einzig korrekte Lösung präsentiert.

[@bosh5501]

He was actually Cambodian many reports and scholars have proven this

[@eddiesid1149]

Legend has it he is still travelling back to Aachen.

[@vaastdovahkiin635]

He probably, accordings to the experts, was commander-in-chief of the aztek empire

[@JackoBanon1]

Rumours say that he's still out there.

[@iqbalbarokah5860]

Yall are dumb Charlemagne is Arab

[@olavtryggvason1194]

@@iqbalbarokah5860 So why did he fight the Arabs in Spain ?

[@iagosevatar4865]

Just wanted to add this : in North west Germany, Charlemagne is seen as a bloodthirsty invader who slaughtered their ancestor for 30 years and converted them by force to christianity. Which is historically .. pretty accurate.

[@Sturminfantrist]

Yep, iam born in lower saxony which is the old Saxon tribes land, we know all what he (Karl) did here and yes he was a bloodthirsty invader, he and his troops destroyed holy sites, Villages, killed, raped, converted with the sword and relocated parts of the Population, even minor violation like not visiting the Sunday mess were punished with the death by Karl and his Men. It was a time of sheer terror! Remember the bloody day at verden/Massacre at Verden. Near my home town in an old forrest with very old oak tree there was once a Saxon Fortress named "Duniburg" destroyed by Karls Troops during their 30 years war against the Saxon tribe

[@iagosevatar4865]

@@Siegbert85 i guess at some period it might have been politically convinient for them to do so ^^.

[@stfclm]

Yeah I can only imagine all these ancestral memories running back 12 centuries. Gimme an effing break dude. This is neopagan bs dating back to the Nazi propaganda.

[@Sturminfantrist]

@@stfclm Facepalm!!!! Your Post is simply useless , another example only for you every Brits Kid knows that their country was invaded by Vikings and what they did in Lindisfarne. Thats not Propaganda Its History ( of your Region or Country) and you can learn it in the Schoo, it has nothing to do with memoriesl.

[@noel_21]

@@Sturminfantrist Then again, did the saxons do any different? Nah. Every tribe was the same. Bloodthirsty.

[@meh2972]

He was born in Belgium and they spoke Low Franconian, which is Old Dutch. It was once spoken up to Paris. The fact that Flanders still speaks Dutch testifies to the fact this was the language the Franks proliferated.

[@markb1170]

00:04 me when i finish building a lego set, which i‘m proud of

[@sevoo1579]

this should have 100+ likes

[@Eisenarsch]

Charlemagne's throne is located in Aachen situated in Germany right next to the Belgian-Dutch border.

[@erik5374]

Born in Herstal (Belgium). Crowned, died and buried in Aachen (Germany). That’s cyclable in one afternoon, through southern Limburg (the Netherlands). Charlemagne most likely spoke a southern Low Franconian dialect, similar to Limburghian. Karel de Grote was een Limburger.

[@popkhorne5372]

Crowned in Reims,in france, just like clovis, the first king of the francs. In french history, charlemagne isnt even the beginning, he is simply the first of the second big dynasty of kings we had. Now we can share, as he is also a very important figure for germans. Edit: my bad, he wasnt crowned in reims like most french kings including clovis. The rest stands tho.

[@erik5374]

Pop Khorne: Some French think Vincent van Gogh was French too. No.

[@popkhorne5372]

@@erik5374 he isnt. But every french learns the history from the sacralisation of clovis as first king of the franks to today. Charlemagne is the founder of the holy roman emperor but to us french he is simply the most eminent of the second dynasty of kings we had, the carolingiens. Since his empire was divided in 3, the remains became over time france and germany. Saying he was born in an area that belongs to you nowadays is insufficient to claim him over france as a part of your history. But since we shared that empire, or kingdom for that matter, it belongs to both. And also belgium ect

[@franckhokusai289]

@@erik5374 The French generally have a good artistic culture. No French says Vincent van Gogh is French (not really French as a name). There are many documentaries on art on French TV, and all have seen at least one of these documentaries (There are also a lot of books, magazines, movies). No French claims that, Picasso, Soutine, Chagall, Modigliani, Dali, Van Gogh, etc., are French. They know that they are foreigners who have lived in France. There are enough French painters. No need to appropriate those of other countries...;) The French know that Vincent van Gogh was not French. And they know that he is part of the French artistic life.

[@dennisengelen2517]

If you're talking about present borders, he was Belgian from the province of Liège. Though the area around the borders of BE/NL/DE share much history together and have been part of many nations in the past.

[@phlm9038]

He was born in Herstal.

[@dennisengelen2517]

@@phlm9038 And in which province, my dear friend, is Herstal located? 😂

[@phlm9038]

@@dennisengelen2517 Province of Liège, just as you said. My maternal grand-father was born in Herstal.

[@MMadesen]

Quick sidenote. While the Franks migrated into Gaull, parts of the tribe also stayed in Germany. There is in fact still a large region in the centre of germany called Franken (Franconia, Francia) and all the dialects spoken in this area, as well as the western german areas along the upper rhine are classified as frankish dialects, including luxemburgish and the dialect spoken in Lothringen (Lotharingia) and also Flanders and parts of the Netherlands. So roughly from Nürnberg to Duinkerke (Dunkirk) the people still speak a form of frankish. So to say, that the Franks were germanic but became the ancestors of the French is only half the truth. Many germans are also descendents of the Franks and partly consider themselves Franks to this day. The Franks also ruled both the western and the Eastern Frankish empire for a time, but in the east, the frankish rulers were replaced by ones from the saxon tribe. Therefore the eastern frankish empire dropped the frankish name and the western frankish empire was the only state left to keep the name, and is today known as France for this reason.

[@danieltoet7447]

Low Franconian, i.e., Dutch, is not a dialect of the Frankish spoken in Germany, which is a form of High German. It is a separate language that in particular has not undergone the consonant shift.

[@MMadesen]

@@danieltoet7447 True, but its still a form of frankish.

[@olavtryggvason1194]

And this gives me the right to call myself a Frank. Born in Fürth beside Nürnberg in the frankish region in today northern Bavaria. We were "given" to the Bavarians in 1806 AD by Napoleon. We are no Bavarians and will never be.

[@olavtryggvason1194]

@@Siegbert85 Really funny since the historic teutons were a tribe from the northwest part of Jutland, the landscape Thy, povince capital Thisted.

[@MMadesen]

@@olavtryggvason1194 I am a Bavarian, but I agree. The Franks arent Bavarian and I would even support a very own Bundesland Franken.

[@julianelbers5229]

so the "fater unser" in luxenbourgisch at 7:16? We germans can totally read it the french not

[@thomashering1482]

Ich bezweifel, das der Text authentisch ist. Das ist ja fast modernes Hochdeutsch. Hätte das Vergnügen an der Uni mittelhoch und Niederdeutsch (ca. 12 JH) zu lernen. Schon Niederdeutsch ohne hochdeutsche Lautverschiebung ist kaum zu entziffern. Ein Text aus dem 9 JH sollte eigentlich für den Laien kaum zu entziffern sein...

[@julianelbers5229]

@@thomashering1482 Ja schon klar Text aus der Zeit des Buchdrucks ist ja für mich schon unlesbar. Und Hochdeutsch als Sprache ist ebenfalls recht jung. Er hat ja gesagt das es ein Beispiel ist und Karl der Große kommt ja aus dem Jahr 800. Das der Text nicht autentisch ist schon klar. Sprachen ändern sich über 1200 Jahren sehr stark.

[@thomashering1482]

@@FlyFishingChronicles was ne Erklärung. Kann ja sein, dass es luxemburgisch ist, aber nicht aus dem 9. Jh - es sei denn, die waren da dem deutschen Sprachraum Jahrhunderte voraus

[@thomashering1482]

@@FlyFishingChronicles ja, weil es dank des Herzogtums eine Mitteldeutsche Variante ist, die es heute zur Amtssprache geschafft hat. Der Vergleich ist aber so sinnig, wie das Foto eines Huhns als dem T-REX ähnlichsten Tier

[@RippleMks]

@@julianelbers5229 er war ja klar aus Germanischen Vorfahren und hätte als Muttersprache "Luxemburgembisch" gesprochen. Die Franken waren aber seit ca. 300 Jahren in heutigen Frankreich, er war voll doppel-sprachig und gewöhnt die ganze Zeit Latein zu benutzen.

[@hurrdurr3615]

I'm German and I can perfectly well understand the text at 7:13. IF that was supposed to be what Charlemange spoke, yes that IS German.

[@roodborstkalf9664]

He sproke Ripuarian Frankish, very similar to the old "Kölsch" dialect.

[@patricks.4491]

Nja eher holländisch aber man kanns lesen Ist das Vater unser^^

[@arthurhagen3826]

Ik dacht al, het lijkt wel Limburgs :)

[@qgqsrg1]

you would also better understand old French than a modern French person. Old French holds more resemblance to German than to modern French. And the language is poor indication of ancestry, ie: one tribe moves from region A to region B, adapting to the local language with time. Then the tribe separates in 2 over the different sides of a river, one of which is home to culture B and the other a mix of B, C and D (a mix of 3 cultures but mainly still B, so they still speak B) Then the branch on the side with mixed cultures proceeds to conquer a whole lot of land on their side, moving its capital and aristocracy to region C where the culture is mainly C with D influence. Then proceed to conquer the other side of the river, the side where culture/language group B is dominating and once again moving the capital near the river. Then the kingdom divides in 3, one part mainly culture C with D influence, one part B, and the last one being the middle part where the culture is mainly B but has C&D influence. Heirs raised on the east and middle parts speaking B and west part speaking C&D even while unified. Which culture does that tribe/kingdom belongs to? and which of the 3 divided parts or, in later times, 2 parts (both side parts having shared the middle between them) is able to claim it history. Answer is a mess, but to me it's its own culture or a foreign one ruling over both B&C cultures and the language spoken by the current ruler is irrelevant as that just depends in which region the royal family has resided for a while not to mention they all actually speak language D. And all 3, later on 2 can claim its history as they both are branches of that kingdom. However the western part kept a clear line of succession from the man who turned the tribe into a kingdom, throughout it's whole feudal/autocratic era whereas the eastern part kept getting more decentralised until the monarchy was elective and any powerful noble could become monarch. Thus the people of the western part claim to feel closer. Language follow Kingdoms/Empires through colonization type conquests not the kind where the whole aristocracy follows, at least long term, just like the Norman Dukes who adapted to French, spread French in England when they treated it like a colony and later adapted to English when they really moved to England or rather when the nobility in France lost power when France reconquered France. As you can guess that's an oversimplified version of the Frankish tribe/kingdom and yes they are not native to the Germanic area but to Pannonia. They are invaders who settled along the rhine.

[@FrançoisdeMontespan]

No he is french

[@jellosapiens7261]

Another living language closely to Old Frankish in terms of linguistic phylogeny is Modern Dutch, a descendant of old low Franconian (albeit with substantial Frisian and Saxon substrates)

[@Valandix]

Old East-Walloon are kinda of a bastard between a langue-d-oc language and platte and limburgian and thereso a bastard grandson of frankish

[@ROBERTOCARLOSVEN]

The French are Germanic-Celts who speak a Romance language. I have an Italian friend who always tells me the same thing, my cousins are the Spaniards, NOT the French, they are "germans" jajajaja XD

[@flashdamingo]

Yah but there's lots of Mediterranean endotypes there as well...

[@boahkeinbockmehr]

Funny, as modern italians are probably more germanic than the French. Goths, vandals, Langobards, franks, normans, plus later vast immigrations of e.g. german miners. Coupled with rome inviting countless of germanic tribes and mercenaries into its territory before its fall...

[@ROBERTOCARLOSVEN]

@@boahkeinbockmehr You are crazy the Italians have the same phenotype as the Spaniards. The Germanic tribes that invaded Italy or Spain were small groups. The Germans and Dutch have a very different look to the Mediterranean.

[@boahkeinbockmehr]

@@ROBERTOCARLOSVEN well, spain was also settled by numerous germanic tribes (suebi, alans, vandals, goths). In fact the muslims defeated a germanic kingdom (wesi goths) when they conquered the Iberian peninsula. Haven't you ever heard of the migration period? The huns pushed the east germanics and some west germanics (to which the dutch and most germans belong) from eastern and central europe all the way into the Mediterranean and partially even as far as northern Africa. Also note, i didn't say all italians were predominantly germanic, just probably more than the french, as galia had already strong defensive bulwarks before the migration period, was more stable and even survived the fall of rome for some years. When the franks were finished conquering gaul they bordered already established germanic kingdoms in hispania (goths) and northern italy/ po delta (langobards -> Lombards)

[@flashdamingo]

Burgundians .....from Burgundaholm ....Goths from Gottland .....Franks...named after the francisca axe saxons named after the Saeax knife ....Allemani .....meaning All men .......Lombard...long beards... etcetcetc

[@doenjangstew4438]

I adore Charlemagne the great's quote, "To have another language is to possess a second soul."

[@mcmarkmarkson7115]

And since I have a second soul it's ok to lose one so we can bloody a river red and kill all those heathens.

[@davidbaillie7376]

They were Germanic tribes. That’s how the Romans saw them and that’s what they spoke. Anglo-Saxons were also German tribes which is why you have to wonder why the British referred to the Germans as the hon during world war two. We are the same people who have the same God and that should be enough.

[@silversurfer8212]

David Baillie. The Germans and the English are as close as close can be.

[@davidbaillie7376]

Same people, no question. The English betrayed their own kind and have reaped their reward. Goodbye London. The rest of England soon to follow. I pray for Scotland. Jacob’s Pillow, the Stone of Scone is in our hands again!

[@abeedhal6519]

Mostly due to the so called "Hunnenrede". All the weird ways they actually tried to portray the Germans as hunnic looking on the propaganda posters, i never understood either. It's so far from reality that i belive the Germans back then didn't really get the reference either. On top of that, the huns were some truly bad ass people so using that as an insult is bizarre in itself.

[@MrRaki72]

Germans definitely identify themselves with Charlemagne (or Karl der Grosse) and see him as part of the shared heritage with the French, Dutch and Belgian people. The Saxons (Widukind) are seen as rebels and pagans and were finally overthrown by Charlemagne. So it's not correct to say, that today's or 20th century Germans identified more with Widukind than with Charlemagne. Let's not forget that Charlemagne's tomb is located in Aachen in Germany.

[@adrienrabiot3624]

The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic originThe famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:

[@kathom67]

Charlemagne is an integral part of German history as well. The throne of Charlemagne is standing until today in the German city of Aachen since 790, and some 30 German kings were crowned on this throne. Also, the "First German Reich" with its proclaimed rule of 1000 years (on which Hitler based his idea of a Third Reich on) began by its definition with the coronation of Charlemagne in 800 as Emperor and ended with Napoleon dissolving the Holy Roman Empire in 1803.

[@olavtryggvason1194]

@@Siegbert85 Restitutio Imperii Romani.

[@olavtryggvason1194]

@@Siegbert85 Charlemagne wanted to re-build the western Roman empire which had ceased in AD 476. Under his government and under the leadership of the tribe of the Franks.

[@olavtryggvason1194]

@@Siegbert85 Today the EU claims him for her cause. He is claimed to have been the "first European".

[@e.l.b6435]

I always thought the HRRDN was founded by Otto der Große

[@deyzacvincent3091]

Un empereurs qui a envahie l'Allemagne et massacré le dernier bastion germanique et vous j'adulez comme l'un des votre 🤣🤣🤣

[@eneko5ori]

Charlemagne is more french than german, as France is the result of the frankish kingdom, whereas the parts of the empire in germany were not kept with frankish rule. French are a mixture between pre-indoeuropean people, celts, romans and germanics, and the origin of their kingdom elite tribes is germanic who were very influenced by the roman empire.

[@eneko5ori]

@@Siegbert85 You are right, both were created from frankish elites. The truth is that I am still very confused about how the french language was formed, as franks were german. However, the franks created their empire from northern france, netherlands and belgium, and there it remained, more cohesionated than the holy (roman) empire and the frankish cultural legacy remained there more than in the west.

[@0mega7000]

Since Salian Franks are from the modern day Netherlands, Ripuarian Franks are from the modern day Netherlands and Germany, and other tribes that confederated with the aforementioned Franks during their conquest of Europe were also from the modern day Netherlands, Germany and Belgium, it can be said that when compared to modern day ethnicities Charlemagne would be closest related to people in the eastern and southerm Netherlands by blood. The Dutch language spoken in these parts is similarly the closest language we have to old Frankish since the two were one and the same before the Franks moved into modern day France.

[@deyzacvincent3091]

Les Francs ont créé la France donc sont les ancêtres des français 🤷‍♂️

[@deyzacvincent3091]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Je suis mort de rire charlemagne et francs née d'un père née en Belgique ou France et mère du palais de neustrie et d'une Mère née en France samoussi la dinastie carolingienne et la fusion de la dinastie de l' évêque de Metz francaise et belge rien avoir les pays Bas Allemagne etc..... Tous enterré en france dont les sépulture sont toute en France pas ailleurs 🤣🤣🤣 seul charlemagne et enterré dans la ville qu'il a créé malgré qui est fait ses vœux d'être enterré en france près des siens chose qui a pas était respecté c tout il a fait son pouvoir la bas pour mieux contrôler son empire et par ce qu'il a passé 30ans à faire la guerre au Germain qu'il a soumis et qu'il y avais une source thermal et c tout même le nom Aix la chapelle et un hommage à l'histoire de France le St Remis évêque de tour 🤣🤣🤣 Vous les allemands et Pays Bas vous avez tendance à oublier que sont frères et née à soisson et à été couronné à soisson et que charlemagne et couronné à noyon roi des francs et probablement né ou il a été sacré à noyon voir soisson ou querzy voir Paris ou il a passé toute son enfance 🤣🤣🤣

[@StewieG46]

i was looking for this comment

[@qgqsrg1]

The Franks, at a time when their leaders were Gennobavd, Markomir and Sunnon, rushed to Germany (here we mean the Roman province of Germany on the left bank of the Rhine) and, crossing the border, killed many residents, devastated the most fertile areas, and also brought fear to the inhabitants of Cologne. When this became known in the city of Trier, the military leaders Nannin and Quintin, to whom Maximus entrusted his young son and the protection of Gaul, having recruited an army, came to Cologne. Many historians report that the same Franks came from Pannonia and first of all settled the banks of the RhineThe conclusion to be drawn from this comparison is this: the Franks acquired their Celtic-like general physical form in the Rhineland or in the southwestern part of Germany before the Saxons forced them into France and the lower countries. Here, whatever the mixture between them and the preceding Celtic population, their type has changed little or remained the same. This conclusion is confirmed by the evidence from Baden that the Alemanni were mixed with the Celts in the same way from the very beginning of their joint journey in southwestern Germany. With the exception of the area along the English Channel coast, the German conquests of France and southeastern Belgium brought nothing new to the original racial composition of these countries. On the other hand, the Celtic conquests, reinforced by the Merovingians, had some significance. Conclusions from the information we have about the racial origin and dispersion of the ancient Germanic peoples can be stated briefly and clearly. At the beginning of the local Iron Age in North-west GermanyIn the Frankish state Latin was the main languageThe term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic origin

[@bobborggreve6803]

If anything, Charlemagne was some kind of proto-Limburger/Ripuarian from the triangle Aachen (Germany)-Liège(French-speaking Belgium)-Maastricht (The Netherlands)

[@ManuR-l4m]

Greetings from Germany to my french brothers. Feels great that after centuries of behaving like dumb siblings we grew up to become friends forever. The circle is complete. ♥

[@TheWhiteFaction]

Imagine if Charlemagne's Empire would have stayed united all along. Would have been the best country ever

[@kakab66]

This is why European Union integration into a proper federation is so important.

[@kakab66]

@Atheistrix unless you really really want your country to remain a submissive protectorate of the USA, then so called Europe of the nations is the perfect answer.

[@rogink]

So an empire stretching from Paris to Berlin, Bordeaux to Brussel. How does that compare to an Empire from London to Cape Town, Vancouver to Sydney?

[@nattygsbord]

I rather be 5% ruled by USA, than 100% ruled by EU.

[@nourbendali2206]

@@kakab66 the European Union is a fraud, a massive fraud that vassalize European countries to the American economical and political interests.

[@lysoutrighter8260]

Romans, Celts and Germanics mixed to become the french. But in the case of England, the Anglo-Saxons were predominantly over the rest, the culture, language and genetics were as Germanic as Germany.

[@lysoutrighter8260]

@s1 Normans/Vikings were Germanic peoples as well. They were important, but the people and culture were still fundamentally Anglo-Saxon after William I.

[@adamthetired9319]

Genetically, the English are Germano-Celtic, I believe. But their identity is Germanic, that's for sure.

[@lysoutrighter8260]

@@adamthetired9319 Yeah but thr Celtic party is less than 40% in average. The austrians are Germanic and are only 35-40% Germanic. Southern Germans are only 40% Germanic. The average German is 60% Germanic, the same for the English. Eastern Anglos and Northern Germans are the same of Frisians, Dutch and Danes. If Austrians and Germans are Germanic the English are too.

[@Lukas-xb7cx]

@@lysoutrighter8260 no the average german is only about 30-40% germanic. Celtic and slavic are mixed into the ancestry to an almost equally big part. and trace elements t of baltic,magyar and italic are also mixed into it

[@lysoutrighter8260]

@@Lukas-xb7cx The average austrian and southern germans are around 40% Germanic, central Germany is around 60%, northern Germany is obviously even higher, just give a look at the haplogroups or DNA tests.

[@darrenehhhhhhtill8051]

I love what you do. You answer so many questions I have that is not explained anywhere else besides amongst the highest levels of historians. Thank you for being you.

[@diebesgrab]

“Was Charlemagne French or German?” Yes.

[@bannermanigans]

when you steal comments like they're the bounties of constantinople

[@aid-ngaming625]

“ Disptach! We found the comment stealer. He recently stole one about a day ago! 104.”

[@Kiros37100]

No*

[@Saint_nobody]

No. kzbin.info/www/bejne/maeug5WfZ9Spers

[@Aquila476]

I'd say he's ethnically much closer to Germans than the French, due to him being of Frankish origin, rather than being a Gallo-Roman (which is who most French people decend from).

[@adrienrabiot3624]

The famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic origin

[@Aquila476]

@@adrienrabiot3624 who? I searched this "Carlton Kuhn" up and, well, nothing!

[@adrienrabiot3624]

@@Aquila476 The history of the Franks is also closely intertwined with the Meotian swamp and Pannonia. They came together with Francion to the Sycambria near the Tanais River, near the Meotian marshes, and lived there for many years and grew into a large tribe. they passed through the marshes of the Meotids in whose vicinity they finally arrived in Pannonia and built a city, which they gave, in memory of their ancestors, the name Sicambria, where they lived for many years and became a great people ("THE BOOK OF THE HISTORY OF THE FRANKS"). Pay attention to the mentions of Sycambria (near the Tanais River) and the city of Sycambria (in Pannonia). The Franks will one day split into two branches. One will remain on the Rhine, the other will enter Belgium and acquire the name "Salic Franks".

[@ruwiki]

US studies show that he was a vegan yoga teacher from San Francisco

[@texdiddyable]

and BLM supporter

[@SirBojo4]

@@texdiddyable And a transgender pygmy lesbian.

[@prankster1590]

Aaahhh. San Franciscans. Germanic colonizers that went the furthest to the west. Like greedy for the leftovers. Mostly descendant from Germans. Now are Tofu eating bearded hippies with titties and a dress on flip flops. Taking a shit on the sidewalk.

[@Delta2414]

As a German that is enthusiastic about history, I have never ever heard of this Saxon leader, but I did grow up with hearing stories about Charlemagne.

[@roodborstkalf9664]

Strange that you never heard about Widukind. He was a very major player in the second half of the 8th century.

[@Delta2414]

@@roodborstkalf9664 Maybe he is big in other parts of Germany, but definitely not in the Rhineland

[@معرفةوترفيه-ت2ظ]

@@Delta2414 I know people from Lower Saxony and they know about him, I guess the Rhineland might look more favorably on Charlemagne considering he was literally from there.

[@anonymousalias.5059]

He was a Serb

[@blakeluccason9971]

This comment wins

[@d4n4nable]

Lmao. I'm sure there are "historians" saying that.

[@irgendwer3610]

he was a turk, armenians bad

[@mathewvanostin7118]

Blacks be like " charlemagne was black. Its the white lying about history to control us" 😂

[@TheWazzoGames]

@@mathewvanostin7118 I've never understood the people who say that 😂😂😂

[@Smurez]

Since noone mentioned it before... The text at 7:13 is the lords prayer. The text is actually pretty similar to modern german and (if you speak german) you can understand ~90% of the words

[@klausroxin4437]

People from the left side of the lower Rhine, speaking in their low German dialect, talk exactly like that. Op der Äerd is something you could hear in Cologne just today. But I don't think the text is old frankish, but from today Luxemburg.

[@X1GenKaneShiroX]

Charlemagne was neither French or German but was a Frank as there was no France and Germany back then in the 800s AD to put it short.

France existed since Clovis 1, under the old French name ''Francia''.

[@dreisaum9916]

@ but the francs were a germanic people sooo

[@LookBackHistory]

An apt summary

[@gringologie9302]

@@dreisaum9916 no. Frank's were gaulish tribes defeated by rome regrouped around rhein river. Frank salian west side, Frank rheinan east side. Only rheinan Frank's partially mix with Germanic. That's why when allamany (Germanic) attack the west, they loose against Frank's at battle of tolbiac. Allamany vs Frank's wasn't German vs German.

[@dreisaum9916]

@@gringologie9302 but it was germanic vs germanic. You can't deny that Karl was germanic... That would be ignorant

[@marygebbie6611]

"Well, FRANKLY..."

[@SubaruImprezaWRXSti-fv8ng]

Mary Gebbie 🗿

[@bernarddebleser1749]

One of the five famous Belgians

[@TheMoviePlanet]

Who are the other 4? JCVD, Hergé, Brel and Hallyday?

[@duncandl910]

@@TheMoviePlanet leo II

[@dirremoire]

There are famous Belgians?

[@Zeeko76]

7:16 seeing this as a German, I can understand most of this. However, if this was spoken I would probably have a harder time but still understand it. Our local dialect in Cologne belongs to the Ripuarian sub branch of Germanic to which - to my knowledge - the Luxembourgish belong as well. However, Vlaams (Belgians), Luxembourgish and Dutch people and would probably understand it even more better. 8:00 It is true that the Frankish part of Germany has mostly lost the identity of being Frankish - except for the region - Franconia. Franconia is today a northern part of Bavaria and they hate being called Bavarians. 8:52 However, it is oversimplified that all Germans rather took the Widukind (Saxon, Germanic) identity over the Frankish one. Napoleon and the revolution had many adherers in West Germany for a time, it later culminates into the Rhineland separatist movement. The intellectuals even talked French and read French newspapers. It is a bit forgotten chapter in history, although e.g. Konrad Adenauer, the first federal chancellor of Germany was a separatist in his youth.

[@derikjbrandt]

Öcher auch.

[@charlemagne5931]

what Germanic tribe's language what we know today as standard German comes from?

[@Zeeko76]

@@charlemagne5931 Very influential was Martin Luther's translation of the Bible into German, and that was Saxon German. So it's fair to say it is Saxon. It is funny because you would think this makes Saxon a straight forward or sober sounding dialect of German, but instead it sounds really funny to most Germans

[@e.l.b6435]

Genial wie einige Wörter seit knapp 1300 Jahren noch heute verwendet werden, wie Himmel oder Versuchung

[@Aperson65323]

Actually they spoke dutch, but I believe that they we’re united kinda even if the capital was paris

[@Ari33sa]

I agree, although something I think you might have missed pointing out is franconian dialects and regions in germany today. You mention luxembourgish, of course. But I just thought it was worth pointint out when you said that the french identify more with the 'franks' as the country i also called 'land of the franks' and so on. this is of course not true for germany... or at least not all of germany. But in parts of germany, people call themselves 'Franken' or speak franconian dialects. How comparable those are to franconian is a different matter I guess, but it's just something I wanted to point out. In the part of your video where you talked about 'Frankish' influences or heritage today in those countries, it was odd, that you didn't even mention that.

[@akpolska]

And his great grandfather was from Herstal (modern days Belgium)

[@ryandeveau6738]

This puts Frankenstein's monster in a whole new light.

[@jb5813]

I think an interesting reference would have been the Oaths of Strasbourg in 842 , where two grandsons of Charlemagne seem to have had already two different mother tongues, indicating that Charlemagne and his son were indeed still heads of a united Frankish kingdom but that a western and an eastern identities seem to have originated right after them.

[@CharlesvanDijk-ir6bl]

France in German is Frankreich it means the Nation of the Franks. The French are partially descended from Germans who learned Latin. Charlemagne was a German the Franks got their name from the francisca the weapon which was used as a modern day hand-grenade. The Franks were a federation of Christian Germans.

[@CharlesvanDijk-ir6bl]

@@Siegbert85 Francisca and the Franca were their weapons and their tools of the trade. As they were the robber barons of the day they were free of taxes. The debate is ongoing and not conclusive. Their treatment of the Saxons triggered of the Viking age as the Scandinavians were boycotted after the Christening of Western Europe.

[@herrwagnerianer1739]

It's way more complicated, and one has to understand that a French and German national identity already existed in the Middle Ages. They developed out of the differences between East and West Francia. During the 12th and 13th century, both peoples already had distinct identites and were aware of these differences. Pierre Videil, f.ex., a medieval troubadour, wrote songs claiming the Germans were uncultured barbarians to which Walther von der Vogelweide, a Minnesänger, replied that German culture was supreme ("tiutsche zuht gaht vor in allen"). And both peoples fought about Charlemagne's nationality from the start. I'm not an expert on the French side, but Fire of Learning highlighted their ideas. The earliest record about claiming Charlemagne for Germany stems from Norbert von Isenburg in the 13th century who retrospectively ascribed to Charlemagne the intention to unify all German(ic) lands. To stress it: this wasn't a historian of the 19th, but of the 13th century who did that. And in the world famous painting of Charlemagne by Albrecht Dürer, which Fire of Learning also used in this video, there's a little poem on the frame reading in English: "This is by stature and in painting / Emperor Charles [Charlemagne], who made the Roman Empire, / subservient to the Germans", thus alluding to the concept of translatio imperii which was the idea that the Roman Empire was wandering from one people to the other: from the Italians to the Greeks and finally to the Germans (or the French or the Russians :-) ). To keep it short and simple: the message of the video is true. Charlemagne was neither. But the concepts of being French and German didn't develop that long after his death, and both peoples claimed him.

[@aysseralwan]

I mean 13th century is already around half a millenia after his death so the "not so long after his death" is kinda relative

[@ea635]

Herr Wagnerianer national identities didn’t exist until the modern age. There was not such a thing back then, especially in the Middle Ages. Countries were pretty much private properties at that time. His death was a clear example of it.

[@lukasstilp4028]

@@ea635 He just gave a very clear example for national identities existing in the middle ages. They did exist in ancient times, in medieval times and in modern times, no matter what some people want you to believe.

[@ea635]

Lukas Stilp it’s not about what “some people want us to believe”, it’s about the shift of perception that we had about nations that came during the late 18th century. The thing is we are discussing a different time with a modern view. Franks were the de facto ruling minority at the time, same as happened in many places before and after, but they were not the “main population”, this politics had little in common with the current affairs of normal people. Look at the aftermath of Karloman’s death. National political autonomy as we know it won’t be around until the 18th century, and that’s what I was referring to.

[@herrwagnerianer1739]

@@ea635 German, French, English, Polish identities have existed since the Middle Ages, long before the advent of nation states in the late 18th century. Call these identities and groups however you like: national, ethnic, or something else. But they existed. And they already mattered. That's why the discussion about Charlemagne's nationality (or, if you prefer, ethnicity) did not start in the 18th or 19th, but rather in the 12th/13th century.

[@ceasarandrepont5331]

I am learning more about my French Heritage than ever before.

[@alexandreippoliti6898]

France birthday is 496 with the baptem of Clovis, king of franc and birth of catholic religion. the Franc salique tribes who was located in actually Belgium, by GAULES TRIBES in left of Rhin. Who protect the Roman Empire against German ? The Franc Charlemagne fight against Alamans tribes who are still in French the name of actual German’s (Allemands). So please germans who think is German because him capital are Aix-la-Chapelle and not Paris.

[@josephrichter2104]

Germans, especially the majority of nationalists, have always considered him a German. He was Frankish, and Franks are one of the main Germanic tribes which make up Germans. Also, without him, there would be no Germany as we know it.The majority of French people, however, are descended mostly from Gauls, and Franks were always a minority in what is now France. Also, the grandson Charlemagne had 'German' in his title, Ludwig der Deutsche.

[@zoushuu]

I was under the impression that the Franks were one of, if not the largest group in what is now France.

[@abeedhal6519]

@@zoushuu That's a false impression. They were a small ruling elite, ruling over gallo romans. Gallo romans are the ancestors of the french. Franks were and are Germans. This might also help you see why the french lie about their history so much.

[@atlas-b8h]

The majority of Germans are descended from other tribes, such as Alemannians and Saxons. The two ancestor states to Germany, the "H""R""E" and Prussia, were created by Saxons; the former by the Saxon Ottonian dynasty, and the latter by Saxon crusaders who mingled with Slavic tribes. Also, modern Standard German is not a genetic descendant of Frankish, and is based on the Hochdeutsch dialect spoken around Hanover in Saxony. Considering that Charlemagne tried to exterminate the Saxons, I'd argue that German nationalists like Heindrich Himmler were pretty much on point when they decided to identify with Widukind instead of Charlemagne. How humiliating it must have been for the non-Rhenish Germanic tribes, whose legacy led to the genesis of the German nation and people, to submit to the Roman influence brought by Charlemagne. I'd argue that the French are the real Franks here; the Frankish province of Neustria in modern-day Northwestern France saw much larger Frankish settlement than places like Brandenburg that were Slavic land at the time, and probably still are.

[@abeedhal6519]

@@atlas-b8h lol nah Franks are Germans, always have been. Nice try tho.

[@atlas-b8h]

@@abeedhal6519 I disagree with the artificial notion that all continental Germanic speakers are German. Not only is it wrong in practice(Netherlands and Austria are independent and enjoy their separate identities, for example), when applied retroactively like in the case of the Franks it essentially amounts to claiming, by analogy; that all medieval West Slavic speakers were Poles. This fake notion arose as the basis of the German nation as a result of 19th and 20th century German nationalism. You'd do well to accept the likes of Widukind as your forefather, as German nationalists from that period did. Or perhaps you love the Roman influence that caused the death of thousands of Germans at Verden so much that you feel entitled to claim it. Stockholm's syndrome at its best.

[@KaiHenningsen]

Let me point out that not only do we Germans call France "Frankreich" - "the Frank's empire" - but also our state Bavaria has a region whose people call themselves, and their region, "Franken" - "Franks" - and are emphatic that they aren't Bavarians, and the German dialect they speak is different from Bavarian. (So, in that sense, the Franks are living in an area that is different from the Frank's empire 😲)

[@roodborstkalf9664]

That is because they are Ripuarian Franks, not Bavarians. Most modern Germans have a very poor grasp of their own history. It would help if all children would learn in school that Germany came into existence in the 9th century as a federation of five major tribes : The Saxons, Thuringians, Franks, Alemans and Bavarians.

[@elyisusking3603]

@@roodborstkalf9664 you're exactly right, i found a guy from Luxemburg that argued their language was super different from the German language and had nothing to do with it, needless to say, he thought German was only a single centralized language when in reality, German is a mix of many different dialects that differs from many regions and Austrians also thinks the same way a lot

[@wtz_under]

@@roodborstkalf9664ohh allemagne

[@Iskander67]

The legacy of Franks and Charlemagne are still present. For example the city of FRANKfurt, another city called KARLSruhe (Karl is in German for Charlemagne). Many places with "Franken" and all thoses places are In Germany/Belgium/Luxembourg/France

[@peterhendriks1602]

Charlemagne was born in the region that is now Flanders and the southern part of the Netherland. He spoke the dialect of the region and Dutch (including Flemish) is still a language based on Frankish. Charlemagne was without a doubt proto-Flemish. Germany has more of Saxon identity and France was ruled by a Frankish speaking elite. So if I were French or German I would be weary of identifying with someone who conquered your country.

[@beaumontjean6418]

In any case, there is no France or Germany at the time of Charlemagne, France was born from the split of the Carolingian Empire in 843 which will become West Francia for France and Eastern Francia for Germany and it is from this moment that the Carolingian kings of West Francia will abandon frankish for rustic romance language as mother tongue ...

[@nightwish1000]

nobody knows where he was born and no he did not speak a low franconian dialect (which evolved into dutch) but a middle franconian dialect after all we know (which evolved into german dialects, also limburgish in NL). he was nothing like a proto-vlaam lol. germany does not have a "saxon identity" its the product of 5 main stems.

[@ze29rose]

It's not the good question because France and Germany didn't exist at that moment. However you talk about franks as if it was the origin of Germany, so why even Germans say Frankreich about France? In fact you are not totally wrong because Germany is a mix from different Germanic cultures (Alamans, saxons, Rhine franks...) But you need to separate the two kinds of franks : - the salians franks who had cooperated with Rome since the 4th century and who had lived among the gallo romans - the rhine Franks who were at the east of the Rhine and who wanted to stay separated from the romans From the salians franks, you have the Merovingian dynasty with Clovis. They get used to the gallo roman culture, they had been dressed like them... You don't talk about the origins of Charlemagne's family. The Pepins came from Landen at the early 7th century, which is in the gallo roman side. When they were Mayor of the Palace of Austrasia, they used to live in Metz, the Austrasia's capital, still in the gallo roman side. So Charlemagne is a "gallo roman frank", that's why he thought about the roman emperor title. Then after his son's death, the empire was divided because there were too much culture differences between the gallo roman part (west) and the germanic part (east). And then the gallo roman franks were unified to be France. Whereas the rhine franks, the bavarians, the saxons, the alamans... were unified to be Germany. Charlemagne is a gallo roman frank.

[@nickyliu8762]

Alsace-Lorraine, or rather Elsaß-Lothringen, should be an independent duchy, lead by Habsburg-Lothringen!

[@lenormand7659]

It's Lorraine not Lothringen in lorrain language... The lorrain are ethnically french !!!

[@augth]

Wtf Alsace is French, never was German except 1871-1918 ; part of France since the 17th century L’Alsace est essentielle à l’identité française.

[@pontiuspilatus7900]

@@augth Yes, France is a great nation, and Alsace is part of it. But what about the time prior to 1648...? And the Germanic dialect "Alsacian"? Yes, Alsace is French, but the Alsacian dialect belongs to the Alemannic dialects, spoken in the north west of Switzerland, and south west of Germany. The Alemannic culture contains some elements of French, and German origins, like in other border areas. Even the German Alemannic contains French components, some words, some expressions, which no other Germans understand. After WWII, the French government made great efforts to promote the French language in Alsace (with the slogan "C'est chic, parler Francais"), and tried to suppress the Alsacian dialect, because it is closely related to German. Nowadays Alsacian is on the brink of dying out, like many other languages in France (and in many other countries of the world). Yes, there is something like a French culture, but Alsacian, Occitanian, Bretonian, Burgundian, Provencal, Catalan, have particular elements which are not ncessarily shared by all other French. Their languages vanished as well, more, or less, in favor of standard French. Similar to what happens in many other countries. Sooner, or later, I'm afraid, we will all speak a kind of English (Frenglish, in France, Denglish, in Germany, etc.), and become (hopefully not!) closer of the American type of culture. I guess in about 100 years Alsacian will be forgotten by all, but a small group of language enthusiasts, and scientists. I hope, noboy will care to whom it belongs then, because it belongs to a peaceful Europe, where people, from Malaga can live in Munich, or people from Prague can live in Paris, or vice versa. Theoretically possible today. My ancestors come from an area which used to be Germany, but now belongs to Poland. I was there last year, and I met friendly people which spoke Polish. If I want, I can move, and live there, and frankly, I don't care, if this land of my ancestry belongs now to Poland, or to Germany, or to France, or to Luxemburg, or Italy, because it is Europe, and within its borders I can move wherever I want to, and live there. In France, in Germany, and many other countries, young people prefer the standard languages of their respective countries, or English, the lingua franca of the world. Of course, Alsace belongs to France, nobody should try to revise borders - or deny facts about languages, dialects, and cultures. Vive l'Europe! Es lebe Europa!

[@greglemieux9809]

Awsome vid man. Thankyou for this.

[@v0idthrashtilldeath127]

He was Germanic and lets leave it at that, He is a great leader and the Father of both Germany and Frence since he laid the foundation of those countries and people.

[@v0idthrashtilldeath127]

Though I doubt he called himself "German". Though this video and Fire of Learning explains a lot of things about history. But a lot of historical facts and events are still unkown to us.

[@sevoo1579]

Looks like french and germans have some common origins

[@sylvainb2366]

That's what DNA tests say.

[@gchelem]

But I would say the whole of Europe more or less. It depend how far back you go.

[@solwen]

All of the Europeans (barring true European natives like the Basques and the Etruscan descents) have common origins

[@anothervinnie7413]

@@sylvainb2366yes but the interpretation is bad: our common DNA ancestors are first Gauls, then a bit Germanic. It happened that the Germanic tribes who conquered Germany changed the language as well as the Roman changed the language in french part, and also a part of Germanic blood was brought to France and more in Germany but at the end of the day, the main DNA substrate comes from Gaulish times.

[@bugler75]

Ha! I live in Lorraine and my wife is Lorraine. To this day people people will say they’re Alsacian or from Lorraine and then say they’re French. The rest of France thinks we’re German anyway. It’s a very specific accent and we still use various platoon which is based on the original language of Charlemagne. We can speak with Germans just over the border who have a similar dialect. Vive Lorraine! Very well constructed video Sir. Ian, en Moselle

[@Sturminfantrist]

We have a Region in todays Germany called Franken

[@rogink]

When you say 'region' you mean 'not a region - or laender'.

[@Krjstofur]

What about the Franconian Germans which exist is modern day northern Bavaria?

[@partlycurrent]

@@rogink it's a region, because it is part of the Bundesland Bavaria

[@Sturminfantrist]

@@partlycurrent yep, and they have its own dialect not the Bavarian one. I met many Men from Franken during my Service time in the armed Forces and this folks was really angry when you called them Bavarians

[@Sturminfantrist]

@@rogink its part of todays Bavaria but the frankian folks are wider spread, when i vistited my Sister near Sonneberg Thuringia (Thüringen) i was astonished that the old people in the villages living there were also speaking with a frankonian Dialect, and my sister lives deep in Thuringa ca. 90Km away from the Bavarian Border

[@flaviusbelisarius7517]

4:21 it does. He had a culture and a language that he considered his own. Germans existed even if a nation of Germans did not. The French existed in his time also though not as a unified group and not by that name. This question makes sence as much as are 9th century Anglo Saxons English.

[@adamfidelio1213]

When you have to hurry home to make a baguette but you have to abide by the traffic laws.

[@smuu1996]

The problem with "Luxembourgish" is that it's just the local Rhenish dialect of German spoken in Luxemburg. Somebody from the Saarland speaks both as the same tongue.

[@charlyf9521]

SMN WGLT nope

[@smuu1996]

@@charlyf9521 doch

[@srr9982]

During many centuries, the Roman Empire made 2 sorts of franks. The Riparians Franks (East Rhin river) The Salians Franks (romanized Gaulish franks from Belgica in the West Rhin River). After Rome, in front of the germanics invasions (vandales, saxons, angles, wisigoths…) , the Saliens Franks succeeded to become the new aristocracy in the old gaulish Belgica (Belgium, Lorraine, Alsace, Champagne, Flandre…) with the Merovingians, Clovis the First. It's Important to remember the Merovingian aristocracy in the old Gaulish Belgica to understand who was the Carolingians dinasty.

[@N0Time]

People on the internet arguing that Clovis isn't the founding father of France due to his germanic origins. Meanwhile, historians be like : -Alfred The Great (Saxon founding father of England) -Riurik (Scandinavian founding father of Russia) -Pelagius (Wisigoth founding father of Spain)

[@N0Time]

«The date on which France began as a kingdom and a constituted political entity is the subject of controversy (by whom?). The earliest accepted date is that of the accession of Clovis in 481, which broadly corresponds to the emergence and consolidation of the Regnum Francorum. His conversion to Christianity enabled him to unite with the kingdom of the Franks the kingdom of the Visigoths, the kingdom of the Burgundians, the kingdom of Soissons and the remnants of imperial power exercised by the bishops in the various Gallo-Roman cities. The territory continued to be known as Gaul for several centuries, but since that date we have records from the Chancellery of France that attest to the existence and continuity of a Frankish, and later French, state. Geographically, the kingdom of the Franks largely merged with Gaul. Intermarriage between Franks and Gallo-Romans, particularly within the aristocracy, the enlistment of non-Franks in the army and the adoption of a common language led to a gradual merging of the two populations, with the result that from the 6th century onwards, the term "Frank" lost its ethnic value and came to designate any free man who was a subject of a Merovingian king, regardless of his origin2». "For me, the history of France begins with Clovis, chosen as King of France by the tribe of Franks, who gave their name to France. Before Clovis, we have Gallo-Roman and Gaulish prehistory. The decisive factor for me is that Clovis was the first king to be baptised a Christian. My country is a Christian country and I start counting the history of France from the accession of a Christian king who bears the name of the Franks". -Charles de Gaulle -source: fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royaumes_francs fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_monarques_de_France

[@leonrambach1216]

While obviously closely related, the German term for France, "Frankreich", does not describe the realm of the Franks and of Charlemagne. This purpose is fullfilled by the term "Frankenreich" (notice the "en").

[@jipeh]

What about the Frankenstein? Sorry bad joke...

[@maxx1014]

Frankreich comes from the region of Francia, which is today around Paris, those people spoke French which was then just a type of dialect in the Gallo Roman dialect continuum. Due to the fact that the Kings beginning from Hugo Carpet on resided in Paris (today Ile de France) and from this place created an realm (Reich) ruling over the Gallo Roman regions and thus spoke French (again derives from Francia region), today France (also obviously developed from this Francia region) is called Frankreich in German in contrast to the Frankenreich of Charlemagne.

[@2adamast]

The French became French when they were beaten by the Franks at Soissons. Under Louis 14 France was extended to the North to include a part of the old Frankish realms

[@abalada]

@@jipeh There are several Frankensteins in Germany. Somehow an English woman liked the sound of the name. There are also to Frankfurts in Germany. Fords where Franks crossed the rivers Oder and Main. Most Franks settled already there. Keeping their Germanic language. While it was mainly the ruling Frankish elite which made it into modern France. And took over the language already spoken there. Very few Germanic words made it into French at this time. While rather Latin words made it into German. Latin: fenestra French: fenetre German: Fenster English: window (they kept the Germanic word meaning a whole the wind comes through)

[@Razzor012YT]

Charglemagne was actually Lotharingian in terms of where he came from, Luxembourg was once part of Lotharingia until it was absorbed into the HRE.

[@erikheddergott5514]

He was a Fränkisch German who spoke Fränkisch Theodisc and early Hallo Romanic French as well as Latin.

[@oldbordergeek]

In holland we call him karel de grote. He did not call himself " chatlemagne" he is only being called that because french people will have seizures if we say karel wich was his REAL name.

[@adrienrabiot3624]

The famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic origin

[@oldbordergeek]

@@adrienrabiot3624 a we have a french man in the room. Celts? Celts are not a people but rather a culture spread across most of europe. Of course french ppl (and wales lmao) kinda revamp history from a nationalist view point to etno mystisim of their perceived celtiic roots.

[@adrienrabiot3624]

@@oldbordergeek The history of the Franks is also closely intertwined with the Meotian swamp and Pannonia. They came together with Francion to the Sycambria near the Tanais River, near the Meotian marshes, and lived there for many years and grew into a large tribe. they passed through the marshes of the Meotids in whose vicinity they finally arrived in Pannonia and built a city, which they gave, in memory of their ancestors, the name Sicambria, where they lived for many years and became a great people ("THE BOOK OF THE HISTORY OF THE FRANKS"). Pay attention to the mentions of Sycambria (near the Tanais River) and the city of Sycambria (in Pannonia). The Franks will one day split into two branches. One will remain on the Rhine, the other will enter Belgium and acquire the name "Salic Franks".

[@Michael-wn4jj]

Yet there was no country called France or Germany but languages based on latin or germanic. Karl der Grosse spoke a germanic language. Charlemagne made plans to re educate Europe and if his empire had last we would probably all write and talk vulgar latin in public while speaking at home whatever dialect.

[@romain6275]

there was a country called Francia which is the latin name of France.

[@romain6275]

And the Franks were a germanic tribe member of the Roman Gaul.

[@melissavidic2895]

Great explanation, thanks!

[@onurbschrednei4569]

You left out the fact that the capital of Charlemagnes empire was Aachen (also where his tomb is), a city in Germany.

[@boss180888]

but he wanted to be buried in Paris besides his father, the only reason that never happened is because he died during the winter and nobody wanted to carry him there. and aachen wasn't his capital, there was no capital! aachen was just his favorite palace out of DOZENS he had.

[@onurbschrednei4569]

​@@boss180888 I think its very fair to call Aachen his capital city, as he resided there for his last twenty years in winter. There are also numerous writers of that time that called Aachen "the second Rome". Even the wikipedia article on Charlemagne refers to Aachen as his imperial capital city.

[@boss180888]

@@onurbschrednei4569 1- never quote wikipedia as a historical source. having cleared that out, there is no such a thing as "fair" to consider aachen his capital, it either was or wasn't, and i'm sorry to say but the PALACE of aachen was just his favourite home. why not say it's "fair" that noyon was his capital since he was crowned king there or paris since his father was buried there and he himself wanted to be buried there? or ROME were he was crowned emperor. there was no court it was itinerant so much so that that is why we do not know where charlemagne was born(or when for that matter). to top it all up the reason why he liked aachen so much in his old age was because of the hot waters there and the fact he wanted to keep a close eye on his nemesis the saxons sending his various sons to his other palaces to govern for him the empire. sorry for the long reply though

[@onurbschrednei4569]

@@boss180888 i didn't want to get into a debate, but i want to make some points clear: when someone says that a certain statement is "fair", it means that there are many arguments for it and therefore one can be inclined to find the statement to be true. However, it also implies that one could come to another conclusion. For me, there are enough arguments for why Aachen could be seen as his capital: he stayed there most of the time, even when he travelled to other places, these were mostly in the general vicinity of Aachen, other contemporaries described the city as his capital, he died there and was most likely born in that region. it of course all depends on how you define a capital. for me it means the place in which the ruler and his court resides and rules.

[@unterdessen8822]

Luxembourgish (or Lëtzebuergesch) is nowadays the national language closest to Frankish, but it contains quite a bit of French. If you're looking for the original, Germanic Frankish, move a little bit to east onto German territory. In the mountain ranges between Aachen (Charlemagne's old capital) and the river Saar, people still speak the original Frankish language, which is now seen as a cluster of dialects. Moselfränkisch (on which Luxembourgish is based) comes closest to the old Frankish, although all German dialects have gone through several shifts since Charlemagne (aka Karl) was crowned emperor on Christmas Eve in 800, so it's difficult to compare the modern counterparts to their origins. Karl was born in the small Eifel village of Mürlenbach, where you can still find his mother's castle, Bertradaburg. In the Eifel mountains two Germanic tribes mixed: The Franks (north) and the Treverians (south). The Treverians had been colonised early by Rome. Caesar established a military camp next to one of their five biggest cities (now Trier, back then known as Augusta Treverorum Treveris, after its resident tribe) in the 50s BC. This part of the Roman Empire became known as Germania Inferiora and was seen as distinctly Germanic by the Romans, but nevertheless they made Trier an administrative capital of Gaul for a while and used it as their ''peace capital'' in the north, where their legionnaires' families lived, while the men were fighting Germanic tribes in the east from their ''war capital'' Mogontiacum (now Mainz). From 293-395 AD it was the main residence of Roman Emperors, among them the first Christian emperor, Constantine the Great. The Imperial Hall (now a church) and many other Roman buildings are still there; among them the Roman Bridge, that is 2.000 years old and still used for everyday traffic. Treverians were described by Caesar as potters and horse breeders and the Romans developed very close relations with them. Treverians became their cavalry and were used as auxiliary troops by Rome in a handful of wars far away from their homeland. They took a liking to Rome, because they were huge fans of Roman culture: Wine, mortar, bathing in warm water... and they really enjoyed being part of a giant, successful empire. They later attached themselves to the Franks, who were their direct neighbours, and probably bugged them endlessly with stories about the great Roman Empire and law and order and bath water, because... the Franks themselves were not that much involved with Rome and it has been a subject of debate, why of all German tribes THEY came up with a new Roman Empire. It's likely, that this was a result of constant Treverian nagging (for the short period of about 324 years), because the Treverians were the ones, who had actually been very close to the Romans and missed their civilisation... but were at the same time not motivated to found their own empire. They saw, that the Franks were doing something right (i.e. expanding, but never leaving their homeland, which was the demise of many other Germanic tribes at that time) and hoped, that they could somehow resurrect Rome. Even Charles Martel's campaign against the Islamic invasion of France makes more sense, when you know, that the Treverians had served as Roman cavalry for centuries: He took about 300 armoured knights on tall, heavy horses with him (i.e. Frankish cavalry), but the bulk of his horsemen rode on small mountain horses from the Eifel and Hunsrück area, that were Treverian. So, maybe visit Trier to pick up some Frankish. Or look up Moselfränkisch (''Moselle Franconian language'', named after the Franks and the river Moselle, that goes through Trier) on wikipedia.

[@romain6275]

Treveris were celtics, not germanics.

[@romain6275]

The Carolingians came from Metz, capital of Austrasia.

[@unterdessen8822]

@@romain6275 Sorry, but in this case, Wikipedia isn't right. I prefer to trust the Roman sources. Tacitus stated clearly, that the Treverians claimed to have descended from Germanic people, so ACCORDING TO THEIR OWN WORDS, this tribe had Germanic roots, but at some point they left their homeland on the eastern shores of the river Rhine and moved to the Moselle/Saar area. There's even an ethnic origin myth about why they did this: Apparently, way back in the past the Germanic tribes had asked the dwarfs (aka dark elves of Germanic mythology) to share their secrets with them, because they wanted to learn how to make better weapons. The dwarfs pointed out, that they could only teach their own relatives. So an Allthing (general congress) of the Germanic tribes decided, that a small Germanic tribe should cross the Rhine and try to establish family relations (i.e. mix with) the dwarfs over there. They sent two tribes (one of them allegedly the Belgians), that didn't complete the mission, but moved on towards the Atlantic coast. The Treverians were the third tribe and just like in a good fairytale, this proved to be the magical number: They mixed with the dwarfs and passed their blacksmithing secrets on to their Germanic relatives on the other side of the river. This is backed up by a few things: Superficially, the Roman name for the Treverians, "Treviri", could be translated as "three men", or more precisely, "third men" in this case. The "third men" theory would be consistent with the origin story of the Treverians on the western shores of the Rhine: They were the third small tribe sent to mix with the dwarfs. But that is, of course, not the real source of their name. The general assumption nowadays is, that their name means "those who crossed the river" - which, again, is consistent with the story of the three small tribes, that were sent across the river. The "dwarfs" and their smithing business could actually be found in the Moselle/Saar area, that had some very old, pre-Roman mines. Later on it became one of the top two industrial regions in Germany for steelworkers. So there is iron ore. There was as smithing tradition - and, yes, it's possible, that those "dwarfs" were Celts, but we don't know that for sure. A couple of Treverian traits confirm, that they weren't complete isolationists like the Germanic tribes on the eastern shores of the river: They worshipped some Celtic gods (like Epona, the horse goddess), they were in contact with and traded with Gaul, even took on Gaulish names and served as sort of a middleman in the amber trade. Amber was brought to areas controlled by the Romans from its source on the Baltic Sea coast. It had to be transported through the Germanic tribeslands, was then picked up by the Treverians and sold to non-Germanic people. The thing is, that all Greek and Roman sources of antiquity were adamant, that the Germanic tribes hated dealing with non-Germanic people - but they would deal with Treverians. Why? Because they were related. The Treverians' unique position as a link between Germanic and Celtic tribes was the reason, why multiple Romans sources 1. thought it was possible, that they were of Germanic decent, 2. named their tribesland "Germania Inferiora", but 3. made Augusta Treverorum the capital of Gaul for a while. They acknowledged, that there was a Germanic history, but also an affinity for Celtic culture among the Treverians. And as we know, it didn't stop there. The Treverians also took on many facettes of Roman culture - but you wouldn't seriously argue, that therefore they must be a Roman tribe, would you? So, at best we can speak of a Germanic tribe, that partly accepted Celtic culture and is therefore wrongfully listed as Celtic on Wikipedia nowadays.

[@unterdessen8822]

@@romain6275 Metz was the capital of the Duchy of Lorraine and as such Frankish (i.e. Germanic) territory. And before the Franks officially took it during their expansion, it was inhabited by Treverians. It was far longer under Germanic rule than under French rule, although France constantly tried to conquer it and as of now has succeeded to do so. St. Arnulf, the Carolingian progenitor and patron saint, was born near Nancy, and I never denied that. But it's a fact, that the first Carolingian on the throne - Charlemagne - was born in Mürlenbach in the Eifel mountains and mainly resided in Aachen. Both places are in today's Germany and have been on German territory literally since before the First German Empire (aka Holy Roman Empire of German Nations) started, i.e. since before December 24th of 800 AD. The Franks' original tribesland was the area north of the Eifel mountains, but they did of course have a network of relatives in the surrounding area, that was a bit wider than just the next 5 villages in a 10 km radius. Important and influential families like the stewards of the Merovingians were well-connected with their peers and travelled over much longer distances than the average Frankish or Treverian farmer. So it doesn't really puzzle me, that the family wasn't just concentrated in Aachen alone. It's normal for noblemen to have international marriages. The fact, that the progenitor of the Carolingian clan spent time in Metz doesn't negate in any way, that Karl was born in the Eifel mountains. If you're nearby, go for a visit. Bertradaburg does still exist. It's by far one of the oldest castles in Germany. The foundation is Roman (even older wooden constructs did not survive); the original Frankish castle was built on top of the ruins of a Roman castellum. The main buildings, that can still be visited, date back to the 13th century AD. They replaced the earlier and much simpler structure at a time, when it became fashionable to build large stone castles.

[@clement7652]

@@unterdessen8822 Completely false. The tribe of trevires were indeed Celts, treves is a Celtic toponym not Germanic. It was the mediomatrices who occupied Metz, not the trevires, another Celtic tribe

[@Luxerlunder]

Charlemagne was born in a city that belongs to Belgium today, so, we can say he's been a belgian.

[@kolerick]

the Franks were a Germanic people that established themselves along the Rhine and in the low countries before moving in northern Gaul were they intermixed with the Gallo Romans civilization. Before that, few is known about the Franks and where they come from. The one explanation I've seen was they were in fact the different Germanic tribes at the frontier of the Roman empire, those that resisted the Roman invasions and that they latter formed a confederation. They were called called Franks by Romans and Greeks, either coming from the words free or braves...

[@abeedhal6519]

It's very well known where they came from you actually wrote it in your comment.

[@kolerick]

@@abeedhal6519 I actually only have learned it in ONE youtube video that even stated it was supposition... a few other research didn't get me results... very few is know about it

[@abeedhal6519]

@@kolerick KZbin videos made by pseudo hostorians are never a good source for accurate information on a topic, this video for example is bizarre to say the least. What i meant is there has been a lot of research done on this and basically it's obvious that pretty much all of the later bigger German tribal groups (Franks,Saxons,Thuringians,Allemannics and so on) formed out of smaller germanic groups. The Franks are no exception to this. They don't just appear out of thin air, there are graves and cultural artifacts that show settlement history.

[@kolerick]

@@abeedhal6519 what is well known is their emergence on the banks of the Rhine and in the low countries... but before that, who were they? As stated in my original comment, the one explanation I've seen (in another YT video) was they were the Germans tribes bordering the Roman empire (such as the chatti) that resisted them and then, made a confederation. As you said, YT is hardly the most reliable source for verified knowledge. That's why I'm looking for more information... but it's certainly interesting that some historic tribes more or less vanish then are replaced by others? it almost look like an "historian" of those times decided to change the names and regroup tribes in larger ensembles...

[@abeedhal6519]

@@kolerick Tribes at that time period regrouped and established themselves constantly. The Franks were first recorded coming from east of the rhine sometimes coming over to raid in roman gaul. We also have to keep in mind, that there were basically no bigger cities in Germania back then. People lived on farms and in small villiages which often were quite far apart. The tribal identities often were changing simply due to new people moving in, splitting up and most importantly forming stronger groups to defend themselves(against the romans for example).

[@pensatoreseneca]

He was German , then Franks were a Germanic tribe from the area of the Rhin River ...but then it’s like saying.. Napoleone was French or Italian ??.. he was French , but ethnically speaking he was Italian 100 percent, although Italy did not exist as a nation .

[@KAvanAlten]

Yes, but now you mixing nations with ethnicities, and those are two seperate things indeed.

[@pensatoreseneca]

Krijn van Alten I think both are related .. and that’s the argument here with the video about Charlemagne being either French or German

[@pensatoreseneca]

Clear Kim oh yes it is ! Ethnicity is linked with cultural expression and identification . Race is associated with biology and linked with physical characteristics such as skin color or hair texture . ( I assume that’s what you meant ) ..” Italians are a Romace ethnic group and nation native to the Italian geographical region”.

[@adrienrabiot3624]

The famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic origin

[@RackerPaS]

The Franks were a Germanic tribe and today we know that Charlemagne also wore Germanic clothing. The legends that arose at this time also spread throughout the Germanic world, including the Franconian song of Roland (Olifant).

[@RackerPaS]

@@ValentinMausespeck Yes, the Franks gave France their name, but the upper class at the time was Germanic. He was not a Romanized Celt. German means "speaking the language of the people" or "belonging to the people" meaning all speakers of a Germanic idom. Whatever he made himself into is irrelevant.

[@gregkerna7410]

​​@@RackerPaS your point being ? Thé only descendant of his kingdom is France. No one spoke thé same language but most ''french people'' were Franks, spoke latinized frankish. We still do.

[@RackerPaS]

@@gregkerna7410 Charlemagne was born in the Rhine region and his mother tongue was therefore Franconian. It was spoken in East Francia. Frankish was a Germanic language. Old Franconian is different from Old French. While there are similarities between the two languages, Old French is a Romance language.

[@phlm9038]

@@RackerPaS Charlemagne was born in Herstal (Belgium of today).

[@RackerPaS]

@@phlm9038 His place of birth is not exactly known, it may be Aachen or Prüm.

[@hiddenwoodsben]

i, a german, can read the lords prayer you posted without much difficulty. the reason being, that letzebuergsch isn't really a distinct language, but just a german dialect, like we have so many. high alemannian or platt, while both being considered german dialects, are far more removed from standard-high-german than letzebuergsch. Karl was german, not in terms of a modern nation states, but in terms of his people belonging to the german tribes, which today make up germany. also, "the franks" didn't become french. part of their ruling class did, true, but "the franks" still live in germany to this day, making up half of bavaria.

[@adrienrabiot3624]

Franconia appeared in the 9th century wahahah

[@adrienrabiot3624]

The famous anthropologist Carlton Kuhn attributed most of the Franks and Alemanni to the Celtic type, which is a Nordic subtype containing a Dinaric and Alpine admixture, and is characterized by mesocephaly, a low arch, a protruding nose and darker pigmentation:The term "Franks" still causes discussions among historians and philologists. It is first found in the form of Lat. francus. Diefenbach believed that the root was of Celtic originThe Franks, at a time when their leaders were Gennobavd, Markomir and Sunnon, rushed to Germany (here we mean the Roman province of Germany on the left bank of the Rhine) and, crossing the border, killed many residents, devastated the most fertile areas, and also brought fear to the inhabitants of Cologne. When this became known in the city of Trier, the military leaders Nannin and Quintin, to whom Maximus entrusted his young son and the protection of Gaul, having recruited an army, came to Cologne [5]. Many historians report that the same Franks came from Pannonia and first of all settled the banks of the RhineIn the Frankish state Latin was the main language

[@thomasp3428]

Germany is a country, not a race. Therefore your whole point doesn't make sens. Charlemagne was a germanic french, as his ancestor until clovis. France is a nation, not a language, not a race, it has been made in 496 as the unity of various people under the christ and sealing destiny of those different people under common destiny.

[@hiddenwoodsben]

@@thomasp3428 you either didn't read my comment or are a lot less smart thn you think.

[@alphaundpinsel2431]

Would you consider Dutch a dialect of German? Why was the Netherlands left out during the initial German formation?

[@Aristocles22]

He was Germanic, not Romance. France and Germany as such didn't quite exist yet, so I have to use different terms. He would have been of Frankish descent, and the Franks are a Germanic people who gave their name to France, a Romance country by virtue of their long rule over it, not because they replaced the Romance-speaking Gallo-Romans. Still, if I had to choose one or the other, Charlemagne was German on the basis on the homeland of his ancestors, his language, and his Germanic name.

[@2adamast]

You mean Belgian

[@Aristocles22]

@@2adamast "If I had to choose one or the other" and the only choices were German or French.

[@patrickhauser588]

@@2adamast there is no Belgian. Belgium is only a modern creation. And the Franks came from modern-day Germany.

[@2adamast]

@@patrickhauser588 He's from Herstal, and Herstal is not even included in the Deutschlandlied _Von der Maas bis an die Memel_ As for _Belgae were a large confederation of tribes living in northern Gaul, between the English Channel, the west bank of the Rhine, and northern bank of the river Seine, from at least the third century BC_ The first Reich did take Germany, the second and third did take Belgium for only a few miserable years.

[@patrickhauser588]

@@2adamast we don't need to talk about modern nation states. We don't know where Charlemagne was born, but he was Frankish. Which means he was Germanic. Germanic is much more than just modern Germany, but also Austria, Switzerland, Netherlands, Denmark, Belgium, Poland..and Germanic tribes also influenced France, Spain and England a lot😃

[@MikerBikerB]

He was Dutch/Flemish, of course. The key word is "Frank".

[@aliarif4113]

Were Franks Greek? Sources say that they originated in troy. Priam was their first king who led 12000 trojans into roman empire and fought with them. So Romans gave them name "Franks" meaning "fierce". Source: Gesta regum Franconum by bruno krusch in 1888.

[@gregkerna7410]

Uh, Franks were in Benelux

[@Garret141076]

Well his writing is more close to German. I'm Dutch and can understand his writing. So in conclusion you are right, there was no French or German identity because he was a Frank or at least Germanic

[@protestantsfailurend7890]

He was born in Herstal, not Germany or Netherlands. Which makes him Celtic Belgian. He did command Flemish which is a germanic dialect with a lot of French loanwords.

[@lorrieborder]

My Grandfather arrived with both of his parents, from Lens, Nord Pas de Calais, France, in 1904. I can remember them talking about what language our grandparents spoke. Grandpa called it “low french.” He said it was a mixture between French & German. Now, the Alsace/Lorraine and Franco conflicts took on a whole new familial conflict between my rivaling mother’s and father’s sides. My mom’s side reminded me often about “how my family was from the Alsace Lorraine region. Well…Maybe a drop or two came from the Alsace region, but dang, I’m 76% French!

[@seventies5193]

What a strange question. Knowing that "French" comes from "Franks" which means a German tribe out of the region of Belgium/Netherlands. The original language of the "Franks" was Frankisch, which is now called "French". The Original French spoke 'old Dutch'. It were the habitants of the Gallo-Roman population, who were not massacred by the German Franks, who spoke Roman-Celtic. The French will not like it but : "French" means "Dutch". LOL

[@nightwish1000]

eh and "dutch" means "deutsch" which means "german"...the dutch won't like it ^^

[@lecram59]

as a german i can read the text at 7:14

[@killerkraut9179]

Bisst du Katholisch ?

[@willg4802]

Friedrich der Große As an American who knows some German, so can I. It’s the Lord’s Prayer. If it was spoken to me I don’t think I could understand it though. When it os written I have longer to recognize the words.

[@lecram59]

@@killerkraut9179 nein

[@killerkraut9179]

@@lecram59 wen Du dass Verstanden Hast ohne Katholisch zu sein dann Hat Deutschland Definitiv verdient Elsass Lorraine (Lothringen) zu rück zu bekommen .

[@abeedhal6519]

@@killerkraut9179 Es ist Deutsch, halt nur besetzt.

[@peterbaan9671]

"Merci or Danke or Merda..." :D You made my day... :D

[@IljaHordist]

He was Franconian. End of the story. Neither France nor Germany existed to this time. I can tell that without having seen the video. To say he was French or German is like saying Julius Caesar was Italian.