For Honor - Warden's Fall from Grace - From Top Duelist to ?

[@MarcoYolo]

Warden still top tier in fashion though

[@thaddeusgigachaddeus2954]

It's Marco Yolo from Fortnite!!1!

[@krabbecorkorn]

​@@thaddeusgigachaddeus2954 are you drunk? Is marco yolo from among us

[@Zero-tk1hb]

That one i can only agree with some sets of armor. Only recently the deve have been adding something other than those scraped from the batlefield armor.

[@fkkfreeze]

not mine though

[@MarcoYolo]

@@fkkfreeze freeze fashion tier list when

[@1070Lancer]

I feel like despite his plain Jane moveset it would be generally okay if his Stam matched everyone else's stamina. He's punished heavily for being aggressive if you really get his offense going.

[@amekwee]

He and every other charge bash hero. Their stam consumption is crazy

[@copyrightstrike4666]

There's a growing sentiment that the stamina cost of hard-feints should be removed, and warden is an excellent example where it would make him so much better

[@VVizardGizzard]

@@copyrightstrike4666 I don't believe it should be removed entirely but i do believe a rather big reduction in stamina cost is needed.

[@kaschey6145]

Wtf is this comment branch. JJ is still strong as heck and extremely viable with all his massive unblockable swings - the stamina consumption is the only thing that keeps him somewhat at bay and adds a significant level of complexity and uniqueness to his moveset + it perfectly fits the image of an old but skillful fighter. If you remove the stamina consumption, he'll be bland as tofu.

[@Sam_Hyde_Apologist]

@@copyrightstrike4666 maybe not removed but heavily reduced, its kind of stupid that a neutral heavy that can be blocked for a measly 5 chip damage when feinted costs more stam than a conq bash

[@thelouster5815]

Warden is only good if you as a player are exceptionally good. His moveset is very interruptible and his stamina is reflective of his aging kit, pun intended. I found out that his unblockables are interruptible if you put any amount of delay into the input. Let’s not mention his near non-viability in 4v4s either. Ultimately his biggest drawback is he demands more effort and skill to get the same rewards compared to other heroes with up-to-date kits.

[@Sam_Hyde_Apologist]

100% agree, his bash also is always in the opponents favor, and outside his bash he has essentially nothing good aside, just meh

[@thelouster5815]

@@Sam_Hyde_Apologist I think I'll also add Warmonger in the mix. She's better in 4s because of her feats, but her problems are the same.

[@zeetch4575]

Warden is so painfully simple that it's charming. I mean theres a reason people play Ryu and Ken in street fighter. He's still fun to play and honestly imo has some of the most satisfying heavies to land in general.

[@copyrightstrike4666]

The issue with the street fighter analogy is that FH is already extremely shallow by the standards of most other fighting games. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it means that 2-hit chain heroes stand out like a sore thumb. He could absolutely do with some added complexity, but it doesn't have to be anything fancy. In-chain zone to make teamfights better, omnidirectional crushing counters, lowered stamina costs, something along those lines for a buff.

[@zeetch4575]

@@copyrightstrike4666 For sure, he could use some added tools to help him, but his overall image is still akin to Ryu in the sense that he is a newbie freindly character. Its why every fighting game usually has some form of a Shoto even if the implication is a lot more loose than others. Sol badguy from Guilty Gear, Terry Bogard from KOF, etc. While these games are leagues more complex than FH ever will be, the design is across the board: Sol and Terry are really easy to pick up and play, and they also teach the fundamentals of their respective games. I think Ubisoft, no matter what the gamestate is, will try to keep Warden with the image of the easy beginner friendly character.

[@Lazypackmule]

Ryu and each of his iconic moves are way more complex than Warden to begin with lmao, and capcom isn't afraid of giving him new moves either

[@VidyeoGamerer]

Warden is a great example of power creeping

[@jimmypints]

Not really, he is still perfectly serviceable in duels. Even in his prime he was never any good in 4v4. He IS a good example of heroes being well balanced for one part of the game, but horribly balanced for another, however.

[@tristenatorplaysgames6833]

@@jimmypints I can’t think of anyone having it worse tho he’s the most extreme of good in one’s horrible in 4s. He’s need a role in 4s even bad hero’s in four have a role it’s just as good as others could be in a role. Hito warmonger and cent all do his job but better. Maybe he needs to be a set up ganker too.

[@phlumpers]

Highlander too imo :( with all the dodge changes, dodge attack changes, ccu updates, he just feels so weak and slow compared any of the newer/reworked chars

[@ZeroNeedsCoffee]

Warden is my favorite character in the game. he has the best executions imo and the best fashion but he has like literally 3 or 4 moves. Fighting people like Shaolin and Medjay feels unfair because its like there's nothing you can really do because you don't really have any options to work with and the second you get the upper hand and get a combo going you have to stop or else you will run out of stamina. While they can just bounce around the arena and have like a million different openers and mixups and punishes and undodgeables and unblockables and can spam them as much as they want and have stamina for days lol. I,ve found out the hard way that his unblockable heavy is literally the easiest to parry attack in the entire game. So EVERYONE will parry it, meaning that it turns into a game of fainting it over and over again and it just feels so lame to do. I'm only rep 6 with him though so it could be I'm just not that good but all I know is playing him feels terrible against alot of the newer faster characters like Medjay, Shaolin and Tiandi. It sucks because Warden is literally the main character, people who never even played for honor before can see him and know who he is. So it sucks that playing him just feels so bad alot of the time.

[@ChampionAnalysis]

The Poster Boy of For Honor feels more like the neglected child. But I can't deny, Warden requires you to really rely on the universal fundamentals of the game and I appreciate that. It feels so much more fulfilling taking other enemies down with Warden. You feel like a veteran showing the newbies how to get the job done without compensating through gimmicks. They still got the best drip in the game too imo.

[@dave7474]

hes not even the face of the knights on the cover of the game, thats conq

[@randomhaloplayer918]

Nowadays there are only 3 types of wardens, the rare noob who is rep 0 lv1, the ones who use him for fashion and can do decent enough, and the absolute sweatlords who lightparry 4 out of 5 lights you throw at them.

[@kharlostique270]

Can confirm this, I was all these descriptions at various points of time as an old guard Warden main. Nowadays Im more of fashion lord cause the dueling department is severely lacking. Also, you forgot the Honor Till Death type of wardens. Deus, I'm glad Im done with that phase. 😆

[@joshuasmith3962]

​@@kharlostique270 what's the Honor Till Death phase?

[@kharlostique270]

@Joshua Smith Ever watch a player just let a teammate die out of the "Honor" of the 1v1? Then they get fucking ganked to oblivion. That is the Honor Till Death Phase.

[@joshuasmith3962]

@@kharlostique270 oh I definitely seen that before, not a good phase to be in. Glad to see you're out at least

[@kharlostique270]

@Joshua Smith Thank You! Common Sense for the Win!

[@zomgneedarandomname]

FINALLY this is being acknowledged, been waiting for years for everyone else to catch up with how plain and boring he is compared to the rest

[@wolvenedvard3049]

Always was.

[@deusvult6938]

Everyone knows that.. He is the most plain and easiest to learn heroes (thats why he is recommended for new players)

[@unoriginalhazard]

Everyone knew..don’t know why you thought people didn’t know 😂

[@Narko_Marko]

I find it so funny how he flies with his bash when you are far from away. When i played the campaign it was so strange to see an actually realistic animation.

[@br2nd]

not to mention warden uses so much stamina other heros can 100-0 other player in 1 stam bar if all mixups hit warden at most will only have them at half

[@thatoneguypaul6873]

now warden mains know not to spam and work on mix ups. its like their mad they have to get good like the rest of the player base. stop crying about your over powered mix up being made into a descent one you one move meta slaves.

[@FHGryphonIRL]

@@thatoneguypaul6873 dude chill out wardens stamina consumption makes no sense at all. Especially his zone attack. Like it’s so outdated

[@invadersanonymous1727]

Not the way i play warden

[@ThelcarusWing]

There's a difference between not spamming like a berserker who just soft feinted to light for the ninth time in a row, and running out of stamina after throwing 4 heavies and feinting to GB once. Warden consumes stamina like the CCU changes never got released and he deals 40 damage per heavy. Warden also does not have any moves to spam, as bash is punishable by GB, and he only has a two hit light chain. He's lacking in literally every category

[@luzy7959]

An easy change that would make warden 100% better is giving more stamina, it's so annoying to light light, unblockable, faint, gb just to lose third of my stamina

[@Zero-tk1hb]

What warden needs is a complete overhaul in how he plays. Basicaly what ubi did with Jorm, pick a concept that gives a character pesonality and lean into it. When in ask warden mains what they would like to change on warden the most comon answer i hear is actualy to remove the shoulder bash. The ideia is to remove that so the character can focus on his swordplay. Longwords have a variety of moves that are not as powerful as other weapons but when put togheter make for a deadly weapon. You can stab,cut, use the guard to defend and atack at the same time, use the guard as a improvised hammer, grapple with your oponnent, use the sword more like a Spear with both hands and so on. For me if warden was to get a complete rework this should be the way. Focus on the versatility of his sword skills. The hero that could cover every category, but not like other heroes. I'm not saying he should have every move and property, i'm saying he could cover most scenarios. A bit of hyper armor on second or ender heavies(Maybe just on top), his side heavies ould have good hit boxes( not like medjay or JJ), he could have a slow grapple move or throw to help on ganks or disable oponnents(something like his third feat). This are just ideas, testing grounds exist for a reason. But i think the path is this, focus on an aspect or especific trait or individuality of the character.

[@brendansh6942]

i like this concept

[@kharlostique270]

I agree. We should not be able to describe a hero with a boring word. Which is "Shoulder." Maining him should make a user focused on the word 'Sword.' Specifically longsword specialist, or better yet duelist specialist. Seriously, with Warden's boring movesets, it'd be more accurate to say he fights like a minion.

[@izrealtruefelicis3309]

I like this idea

[@smuludgn]

This. Those are the words of a real warden player.

[@liqaKnight]

Toxic player: STOP SPAMING MIXUPS me a warden: what do you want me to do? Get every heavy parried and lose? No thanks

[@HavokYT]

😭

[@zorro8027]

I know you’ve been noticing it too Havok; unfortunately Warden is just being forgotten rn😂😂

[@temdrik3920]

i have a couple of friends who always bark about warden needing to live up to the title of "master of the longsword" from that one trailer way back when. They themselves wish for animation changes and buffs and whatnot (have the shoulder charge be a pummel strike instead etc.) One thing i feel that is definitely awkward on warden is his single sided crushing counter, with a lot of characters having crushing counters from all sides, warden feels like he doesn't have anything special for him. I would wish for him to stand out with something again but i literally do not know what that could possibly be outside of fashion

[@xClownpiece]

now that all dodge attacks are light parries it’s probably alright for him to all 3 sided ccs

[@fearlessretaliator4997]

thank you for making this video Freeze, it encapsulates all of my thoughts exactly, and in my opinion Ubi should get a completely different aproach with warden.

[@redfinite27]

whenever I see a Warden I think of two things. Either the player is going to be really bad at the hero, or they are absolute sweat lord of them all. I never see middleground anymore

[@deadmacabro]

i see the same case with lawbro, either the guy is horrible or he is the god of reaction.

[@alexandersheil906]

This video is spot on. Warden was always good in 1v1. I think Warden is still good in 1v1. The best part of his move-set is the his ability to force reactions with his bash or his unblockable finishers. The big weakness for him is his chain lights. The additional attack is guaranteed, which is the reward for landing it, but it costs him 6 more stamina (15 total) to only do an extra three damage. Compare that to most other characters who initial light attack does 12 damage but only costs 9 stamina. Also the chain light presents a problem. The second attack hitting is guaranteed. In terms of balancing stamina cost and reward; comparing to the rest of the roster, it would seem unfair that Warden would be allowed to inflict even one more damage. Maybe having the second light require a little less stamina would be better? It's existence makes it hard to balance in the context of what the other heroes can do. It may be better for Warden to have light and heavy chain mix ups, similar to what most other characters have instead. Another big problem for was what happened to him offensively he lost his back-dodge into shoulder bash. Warden's move set was designed to include that ability so that the player wouldn't have to rely so heavily on defense, like parrying, in order to start a safe offensive. They simply "deleted" the move, and it feels like it. It wasn't replaced with anything. The recovery on his back dodge feels like an eternity in a fight, and leaves you wide open. Where a lot of the characters now have recovery cancels, maybe Warden needs one too. I wrote this with the intent to bring more attention to why Warden has fallen behind this much as a character. My examples of a fix, I hope, aren't read as suggestions. I think people who can come up with better ways to help make Warden more enjoyable.

[@zaddydaddy162]

I’m subbed now I haven’t even watched this vid but I was tryin to find ur channel for a min after the map update vid

[@victornguyen1175]

His top duelist stat was just because he was one of the characters who had the unreactable bash, which really should belong to everyone who relies on bashes. He's a basic character who never moved on and seriously needs a touch of versatility. He's not struggling where he specializes but he's almost useless everywhere else.

[@TamperSwitch]

I think most heroes at this stage in the game can be described as feature rich… except warden. Almost like he was purposefully designed as a one trick pony.

[@davidepanceri8192]

For sure he needs a stamina buff u faint 2 sb and ure nearly out of juice, after that maybe earlier hyper armor on the charged version to avoid being interrupted on every orange or enhanced light attacks to make it easier to start the mix-up

[@Richard-sq1ml]

My biggest problem with warden in 4v4s is his feat selection and how much revenge he generates.

[@Jazz117able]

Warden main since the beta. Still love the hero, but he's definitely showing his age. A few nicer feats would help him out in 4s, especially the 1 and 2 slot. Soft cancel GB on finishers would help, and maybe they could try a unique property on crushing counter so it works on UB attacks. Charged bash can also be interrupted on reaction by lights before the armour kicks in...that needs to be looked at.

[@davidemagliocco9119]

Also, we should be able to initiate our charge without dodging (just for the sides), just using GB and behind. Nowdays, anyone will see u moving forward will light u like no tomorrow

[@DreyfusLagoon]

They should give his zone the same treatment as Jorm at let warden do it in chain and it would make him feel so much better to play

[@benniebees]

I'm surprised you didn't mention wardens lack of an option select dodge attack. (Ok, you get another option select for it in return i guess. Top feints and guardbreaks get countered by your crushing counter) Also 6:42 The power of the armored guardbreak =D

[@gabrielbilling3638]

Well I mean once you fight so many wardens you learn how to counter him eventually

[@frogaroach]

Making his shoulderbash 100ms into a forward dodge would go a long way for the character I feel, and wouldn't be so game changing as to require a TG. As it stands currently, a shoulderbash takes a total of 1000ms to connect from neutral, and reducing it down to 100ms on forward dodge would put it at 800ms, inline with many legion kicks.

[@Sam_Hyde_Apologist]

that's a good place to start!

[@dirtyhenry917]

thank you for covering this. Warden has sufferd alot over the last year. for being a "poster boy" he lacks for sure

[@bar3924]

I think he should get a undodgeable zone attack and maybe hyper amour on all three levels of his charged bash also make all his heavy attacks 30 damage except from zone.

[@blastronaut1]

I thought this was a havok video at first glance of the thumbnail since he usually talks about this subject a lot.

[@invadersanonymous1727]

GIVE BACK BACKSTEP BASH!!!!

[@vextay7199]

I played the hero for 2 years and I still don't know what I want as far as reworks/buffs go

[@mcchillin7580]

Well, wardens supposed to be a sword specialist. I would say dodge lights, stamina buff, crushing counters on all sides and another combo or 2 would do him greatly.

[@mcchillin7580]

As well as some sort of forward thrusting attack

[@zorro8027]

Warden has served as the perfect example as to how safe and BS heroes are nowadays. If you main a character like Warden you genuinely have to be several times better than your opponent if they pull out an S tier to win. Another thing that’s been bothering me; they are seemingly becoming addicted to “Bashes that guarantee a drop+attack” considering most of these past reworks have one; and it’s starting to make ganking impossible. If there is an Jorm; shaolin; or Tiandi you can genuinely be 100-0 ganked and never rage consistently if they know what they’re doing while ganking. I’ve even seen it happen to Jon and other KZbinrs where they simply get stagger/stun locked and die. Then the fact that these moves aren’t anywhere as punishable as the older bash into heavies like Hito and Gryphon whom are guardbreak vulnerable on a missed bash. Then there is the fact the devs go back on their def of “overpowered” and contradict themselves. For the Jorm rework they said they got rid of his undodgeable chain finisher because he would be too strong to have that as part of his kit (even though it isn’t even a true 50/50 at 800ms bash) yet here we have Tiandi with an unreact-able bash that cannot be punished; and a dodge forward undodgeable/bash true 50/50 mixup. They claimed they got rid of neutral bash for Jorm with the excuse that it was too slow to be used by Jorm; and if they speed it up it would be too strong. Which made sense to me. Then comes Afeera with a neutral bash that guarantees a heavy after landing; that could also wall splat for more damage. And it’s feintable. Their sense of balancing the game has absolutely gone out the window. And they clearly are just making newer character and reworks more OP without even thinking about all the other character that haven’t been touched in a while that are unusable today. Prime example being Warden.

[@theblackphoenix7410]

Well tbh Afeera's neutral bash is a feintable 800ms bash. That is different then jorms. Jorm bash was 600ms. You couldnt speed up his neutral bash without it reaching a point that no one could react to it in time. Also as for ganking, ganking itself just needs looking into. Even if you fixed Tiandi, Jorm, and Shaolin, there are still way too many characters who just 100-0 you whether its two of the same character or just two different characters.

[@zorro8027]

@@theblackphoenix7410 The point is that Afeera’s bash is hardly slower; but had the benefit of a full damage heavy+being feintable. Even if Jorm’s was faster (500ms) with a confirmed light it still wouldn’t be as good as Afeera neutral; which is still a contradiction to what the game devs said about aiming to balance the game. While there are other 100-0 ganks out there they are still generally the S tier characters that do so, with a few lower tiers being capable of 100-0 ganks. Aside from that you have to measure how punishable the characters are. A Hito bash kick is still gb vulnerable and has longer recoveries, same for the heavies; while tiandi’s kick has instant recoveries and cannot be punished at all. It is much harder to survive a gank if a Tiandi is present than if a Hito were to be present; I’m not saying your point is wrong: but there are some characters that need to be addressed much more urgently than others is what I’m saying.

[@theblackphoenix7410]

@@zorro8027 That is true. I know a lot of people are frustrated some characters bashes like Tiandi isn't punishable enough. So I can understand that. As for Jorm vs Aferra's bashes, there are some differences. Jorm neutral bash was removed because it was useless to people who could react to it while at the same time, low level was completely bullied by it. Not to mention, if it was sped up, it would just give no time to dodge whether you was high level or not. Aferra bash gives you time to make a decision since it's slower. That's why her bash works the way it does.

[@badguy8604]

LMAO you dont even know the bash recovery combo! 😂

[@Mugetsu_FH]

I have made similar remarks for quite awhile and it’s always surprised me to hear other people who I consider credible players say that he’s fine. Even other warden mains. While I agree he isn’t unusable in 1v1, ubi is undoubtedly partial to dom considering the last few years of character releases. This paired with the fact that he’s slowly lost appeal in duels over time in my mind means they must do something. He can’t be terrible in 4’s AND bottom half or third of 1’s out of the reasoning that he’s “specially balanced”. I also question those with very high fundamental skill that claim he’s okay because people of this caliber can make any character work. For example I hit top 15 GM with warden only, that doesn’t mean he’s a good character nor that it wasn’t a complete pain in the ass and would have been a significantly easier ride if I had just picked a character with safe offense instead. So I feel many of these people whom you regard as credible opinion even warden mains should reflect more on the variability in effort between using different characters rather then just if they feel they can accomplish wins on the character or that he “can work”. The game is coming to a point of balance where much of the cast is so relatively close that tier lists these days are beginning to feel more subjective in nature with a few exceptions in the upper S tiers that clearly set themselves apart. Overall, as a warden main the sheer passiveness required to use him viably at high level 1’s feels extremely disadvantageous and only becomes worse as offensive meta becomes more and more the priority. And finally His average (imo below average) rank in duels is not an excuse to leave him out to dry in 4’s because he’s “meant for 1’s anyways”

[@NamelessWarden_1]

I do appreciate that the community still loves Warden even tho we re and old lot lol... 😅 will forever love him but he's not keeping up with other players he's needs a buff in stamina and possibly imo he needs that half guard style we see real Templars use kinda like how highlander and anubis has 2 styles ..Warden just needs to be refreshed he's not bad qhen in a the hands of a good player but he's seriously lacking in 4v4 and his stamina kills you ...literally...not to mention it takes way more skill to get skills with Warden since he has no dodge attacks to start his chains like cent and BP etc....he needs just a little bit of love and I've maind him 8 years but this is literally the lowest I've seen of Papa Warden I need him as the OG again ❤

[@tosin8580]

Giving him crushing counter on all side and not just top might be a good place to start. Just saying

[@Anonymoose862]

I know it doesn't work great from the perspective of wanting to keep vanguards as simple characters, but I think it would be cool if warden had 2 stances similar to medjay, but with actual variation in the moveset that wasn't just a change in slow-strong-big/quick-weak-small. In the story mode there were a lot of animation of wardens using half swording, so i think it would be interesting if he had a slightly expanded moveset that was better suited for a more brawly situation, while still keeping the dueling he has. And for the love of God give the dude a cardio regimen Edit: maybe a second moveset would work better if it were more like highlander than medjay

[@leed9548]

I have 1000 hrs on warden , and indeed i need to work very hard to beat every top tier heros, all he needs is reducing his stamnia consumption on his moves , make his zone chains with everything, and for god sake give his crushing counter hyper armor ....these are not enough tho but it will help him alot

[@samfish2550]

Him and pk are probably going to be on the bottom when the nux rework eventually solidifies into something.

[@DenBed]

My Dear boi got power crept so hard! Curse you Ubisoft!!!

[@henrylao6699]

Female Warden has the most elegant running animation

[@beryllegos2424]

I love the warden I think he is the coolest-looking character in the game aesthetic-wise. However, it is the expanse of him being the most underpowered character in all for Honor thanks to Ubisoft adding new characters with such great counters and external attacks you'd be lucky to get one takedown with Warden. I main the Warden more than any other hero he is my favourite, but Ubisoft is attached to making new heroes so much that they would rather add pointless buffs, then fix old ones. I do not care at all about the Warden as a fighter he is susceptible to everything he doesn't even deal enough damage for it to be worth it to play him.

[@antthelionheart1132]

for the pricey zone it should be undodgeable and i think that would bring him up without changing the way he plays

[@nightplayer1994.]

I was a warden main until raider got his infinite chain

[@menalgharbwalsharq648]

Understandable.

[@gabzsy4924]

If it's not at the top of the pack than it's not viable...change my mind. Players will tend to play the stronger and most meta viable options, always, meaning that warden will always feel bottom of the barrel against the majority of encounters. Also...a bit more effort? Try going against one of the top tier champions and tell me if you need "a bit" more effort. It's just an exercise in futility and frustration, while you try to learn and read, they just dodge attack with huge s, large swipes that catch rolls and cancel your every move and are immune to grabs...or perhaps spam you with unreactable light chains or trade with braindead hyperarmor....yeah a bit more effort...

[@zachariz1490]

it has nothing to do with warden in particular but warden is a character that benefits from people overthinking and waiting for things. With all the changes, i feel like less good players got worse overall, so they just throw whatever they can in reaction to any movement, which works pretty well against characters that need a start up since they don't have neutral offensive. Don't get me wrong, i didn't like the turtle meta even if i was pretty good at just reacting to stuff since i played mostly shugoki and aramusha, two notably bad characters before all their changes, so turtling was never a problem to me, but it was just boring. My problem with it is that i rarely get the exciting feeling of dueling someone and thinking damn he's pretty good. I know duels are made for that, but it's not the same feeling as dueling someone in dominion. Nowadays i mostly meet people with 2000+ hours into the game that can't parry for shit or predict anything. People either don't know what they're doing at all, or they're fucking ganking machines, which is not even the worst to me. That was my old man rant, thanks freeze for all these videos you (and barak and faraam) have helped me get way better at the game. I hope you continue for a long time

[@conquest4211]

think some simple thing might help is Crushing counter on all sides(maybe does less the top to keep main one) and combo zone is undodgable. nothing to insane

[@acid1787]

Warden is in centurions bracket now

[@verrat3219]

i feel like he needs all side crushing counter and more sword movesets in general and less shoulder bash stuff. i dont know why warden uses his shoulder more than his sword.

[@kharlostique270]

Truueee.

[@77Zenin77]

I personally think that even giving him hyper armor on his unblockable finisher, would be enough to put him at least one tier up, since people would no longer be able to just interrupt Wanted's finishers and have to actually read his moves. I believe that this is one of the biggest problems i usually run into. People just interrupting him at every step. We have unblockable attacks with HA in the game already and most of the characters have some sort of HA so why not give some of it to warden

[@KoleTheSilent]

Hyper armor for Warden would be a band-aid fix; not actually addressing the real issue.

[@danestambaugh255]

HA UB's would for sure help his target swap ability in teamfights and give him some variety as the main target in a teamfight ala raider/medjay but he wouldn't have the same relentless attacking nature they both have. Meaning he'd just be a worse version of them the kicker being he has a HA orange move (something the two aforementioned heroes don't have) but it wouldn't be enough for someone to justify picking him over other heroes that flourish at that. And in 1v1 itd be a non change bc you can't interrupt wardens side finishers after any move as is. He really needs a top down rework in the same vein as Jorm that focuses on him being the jack of all trades swordsman rather then the best charge bash duelist

[@solodolo9450]

The end of the video 😂

[@doormat9999]

Now I don’t play too much warden at all, my warden is only rep 5, BUT(I feel like this is the answer to most things in for honor) give him some hyper armor. Now I know hyper armor feels pretty overused in most characters but I feel as though warden deserves it. He’s a knight in heavy armor with a two handed sword. I’m not saying every move he has in his kit should have hyper armor but maybe one or two wouldn’t hurt. As I was saying I don’t play too much warden so I don’t know exactly how this could help. If someone else wants to leave ideas I’d like to hear them :)

[@Lefty217]

I think a good place to put warden is that if he’s decidedly basic and relies a lot on fundamental skills to for honor to be viable(reads, conditioning opponents, parry/dodge timing and frame advantage understanding, etc.), lean into that. If his current schtickis “nothing fancy”, make him at least better at that than most.

[@BLUESTEELBOY1]

I'll love to know your opinion on cent

[@almghit_ja5100]

Maybe they should bring the back Dodge shoulder bash and the soft feint like in the story mode, and more hitbox and stamina maybe?

[@Sam_Hyde_Apologist]

the problem warden faces is his offense is truly unreactable but to the majority of the player base so is most characters, so you take warden who has a slower bash that is easily interrupted and heavily punished and put him against say conq who has a "better" bash (since its faster and equally unreactable to most players) that rewards 13 damage AND is safe from GB unless dodged early enough. Plus so many characters have better chains, undodgeables, better zones useful crushing counters a GB immune dodge attack the list goes on. Plus his feats are ass his perks are meh and hes generally weak if not useless in 4s. Idk I just hope they change the whole shoulder only offense and give him some more tools

[@SketchOfMind]

Any video about the scripting going on recently? I've been running into scripters left and right

[@GentAboutTown]

I don't think he need a rework, just a little love

[@bulwark7840]

I always loved the idea of warden being a good duelist but mid teamfighter, but always hated the boring chargebash feinting playstyle, I wish they made him more dynamic, maybe gave him some new moves on the inputs he doesnt use, like back+GB and others

[@bagginbrooks6573]

Warden couldn't do jack shit to og Nobushi. Being able to cgb during hidden stance was probably the most op thing this game has ever seen.

[@davidemagliocco9119]

MY BOY ! Reduce his stamina bash cost, at least make 0 the feint-to-neutral and give him a Crushing counterstrike on all sides like BP.

[@spegwettie9053]

After watching Slanderous' new vid, I need a cleanser like this. Thank you Freeze.

[@chipslight738]

The argument regarding believability was so funny. Imagine prioritizing sense of disbelief over gameplay, lmao.

[@spegwettie9053]

@@chipslight738 because Shugoki being able to light more than once in a row is unbelievable. I can't imagine a man who can one hand front shoulder press a 7 foot tall man in full plate armour can swing around a club. No way 🤣

[@chipslight738]

@@spegwettie9053 Pirate has infinite bullets ? Fucking ruined. Anyway magic poison crystals are fine.

[@spegwettie9053]

​@@chipslight738 bjt you don't understand. I cannot believe that for gameplay reason that she doesn't reload, but in cannon she does. Heros pulling out weapons out of their ass, or pointing to summon a volley of arrows from the sky is okay. I am, a consistant gamer. I don't have any weird irrational takes at all. 😅

[@chipslight738]

@@spegwettie9053 You clearly don't understand. How come I cannot block PK's unblockable attack when I'm bleeding ? Clearly by just putting my sword in the arc of the swing, I can block it but for some reason because she gave me a paper cut I can't anymore ? For Honor is wholely unrealistic and breaking my immersion. Next time you're going to tell me thise game is technically post-apocalyptic and set after a grand earthquake that destroyed multitudes of lands instead of just being random mediaval wars.

[@miltonalexander8576]

Gryphon kick has no charge and gives a heavy afeera kick has no charge and gives a heavy warmonger slap is literally just a better warden bash warden needs an even playing field he needs a dodge attack an undodgeable and an easier way to get a heavy in fights and he needs a stamina fix. He is archaic compared to these broken power creep stacked kits he needs more options

[@MercenaryJames]

I'm of the mind that Warden needs an overhaul. Not just to animations but to remove his reliance on SB in lieu of a more diverse and "swordsman-like" kit. I could write paragraphs but simply put, old boy needs a new coat of paint.

[@trufu9678]

Armor on heavy finishers should help him out

[@vaper8824]

What if he could cancel his shoulder bash and unblockable heavy into a dodge and give him crushing counters from all sides not just top

[@manrommav9240]

We don't need Warden as he is, because Warmonger exists

[@Samsterd45]

I feel like he should have old warmonger hyper armor on his heavy finishers and guard dodge on his dog's i reallly hope they give warmonger dodge recovers but suuuuper late so she can content her offense or get into her undogable unblockable easier maybe like 600ms after finisher lights and heavys

[@nickmiller6375]

My opinion: He's not as good as I feel he should be to be "balanced" BUT I still would like to see Warden as a hero that requires thoughtful plays and mixups. However, with our luck, Ubi will either not do anything OR will buff him to the point where he's just a brainless pick

[@oldre21]

How about better feats or perks for a start.

[@cobaltundead]

Personally I think it would be nice if he was just given better stamina, a couple of hyper armour moves and / or a proper dodge attack. I don’t know.

[@craziun4292]

If they wanted to be lazy they could fix him by adding 3 to all attacks. No one would complain then.

[@HumBug_05]

How do i get the pattern on the cape

[@cpt.obvious2520]

warden could do with some better stamina, and maybe an inchain zone like jorm

[@prosketch95]

Rip back dash shoulder bash

[@nicholas._.james._.]

I've always felt really disappointed that Warden is a master swordsman of a knight but only uses the blade. He never used the hilt in combos and such. Maybe give him some better parry options and new animations? That's asking too much I know but still. Maybe tone down how much stamina his bash and feints drain because damn his age is showing 😭

[@Piklandiusz]

he can do shit and like you said read out well and somewhat adjust but he's mid at everything has shit stamina max and no management, barerly allowing for already risky and outdated offensive tools he has and most of all playing him and winning takes just so much more effort than playing any other new character. He just suffered a major power creep that was only mitigated in marching fire rework. He is not even evenly matched against other vanguards anymore. Power creep applies to several more heroes but warden never had any gimmick to even go off of in the first place.

[@cashydude3285]

Ubi gonna quick fix with a dodge heby and call it a day

[@Xengard]

im just a noob, but either make some of his moves cost less stamina or make his zone attack homing (blue) tbh i dont know why ubi doesnt balance more around health and stamina

[@izrealtruefelicis3309]

Make Zone attack undodge-able and buff overall damage. Easy.

[@mad0517]

FINALLY you talked a little about him! Yes my boy needs something, like Hyperarmour on finishers would do him good

[@iffyfox9749]

Freeze admitting a knight hero needs work?!

[@timpoling8634]

How does he have a smaller sword than warmonger and still is sluggish as hell and if he’s a warden he should be a master at fighting with a blade but he just is way too simple

[@DowaHawkiin]

FemDaubeny.

[@kharlostique270]

Your goals are beyond casual understanding. And I'm down for that.

[@nyceplayz8051]

We need a REAVER character based on Robert E Howard's CONAN, fast, vicious, maybe a clutch specialist?

[@doomfishmain5154]

I hope you don’t mean clutch specialist by being able to 1vX

[@nyceplayz8051]

@@doomfishmain5154 I haven't crystallized a dev vision or anything, but there are plenty of mechanics for the bots in arcade mode I think could be used to craft hero "personality", like doing more damage the closer they are to death, or gaining revenge slightly faster. Those would probably work best as feats, and the normal fight mechanics would need to back that up. Whatever the case, I'd love to play a hero that's designed to feel like Robert E Howard's CONAN. If you've read the books, you'll know.

[@doomfishmain5154]

@@nyceplayz8051 I unfortunately haven’t read it. However I do want them to add a character with a whip flail(like Flagellant from darkest dungeon) And he does more damage and gets faster MS(movement speed)while reaching critical health.

[@gordonthompson6749]

Yes

[@abualborz]

HAVOK enter the chat.

[@sickmindedjack6196]

Sky's has alot to say on the current state of warden when he does play for honor lol it is a shame to see a good looking character not have a good looking moveset tho

[@BoltYT_]

Warden op tho wait what who said that. Gosh cmon ubi do something for our main poster man :(

[@Doublejho]

as a warden main (also an OTP for most of my time playing), i'm honestly pretty happy with how warden is currently - could things be better? sure, i'd love to see some hard feint stamina cost reduction for shoulder (and i think an overall damage reduction across the cast would benefit warden's train-and-read-based playstyle), but i like shoulder's versatility and like that warden's kit isn't overloaded like a lot of the newer characters i don't want to see some meme hyper armour outside of fully charged bash which already exists, i don't want to see everything be an undodgeable finisher, nor do i want unblockable dodge attacks or omnidirectional superior guard on their attacks, because i feel like it'd just ruin an already-nice kit, all warden needs is the time to train opponents and the stamina to do it if you REALLY want to force something new onto warden for 4s, a mordhau attack to either the knee or head with a back+grab/bash input that staggers akin to medjay's and guarantees minimal damage for the warden themselves would be an acceptable compromise, imo

[@shannonsparkman619]

Make wardens side light starters crushing counters

[@tmerklabona4146]

Say whatever you liked about warden in 4’s or duels, but you gotta admit his feats desperately need a tune up.

[@lastor9148]

Personally i would really like new things for him, he's been the simplest character in the game for so long, let him have more tools in his belt. Someone else should take the role of best character for new players.

[@maniacalgrunt1822]

Hitokiri boom one of the easiest characters to play

[@Darkstar198]

It's called power creep. That's what has been happening here. Warmonger does everything Warden does, but has much greater flexibility. Shugoki used to be decent, but is now overshadowed by Hitokiri and Jorm. Maybe one day we'll learn that the combat system was never designed to be "competitive" like other fighting games. Now half the cast has been homogenized and anything deemed remotely "annoying" removed. And despite all that, game's still not that well balanced.

[@The-Black-Death]

Warden's movement feels far far too limited for like years now, especially when his "main thing" is the shoulder bash. :/

[@mintyg6467]

The only thing I could suggest is allowing his zone to be in the middle of chains? Like Zhanny. But this is something they should try and do for all hero’s. It adds alittle more to their combos. So he would have light, light, zone, unblockable as a combo 🤙