Why Does Yamamuros work feel stiff?

Tadayoshi Yamaruo brought fans some of the most beloved moments in the Dragon Ball franchise, his clean approach with the way he both drew and colored characters provided a gorgeous take on dragonball, posters designed for classic such as Wrath of the Dragon happen to be among my favourite pieces of Dragon Ball artwork of all time!
However over the years the vibrancy his characters once had died down and things were simply not quite the same, I have seen many artists and non artists try to explain the reason why his artwork looks so stiff and even with myself I thought it was that his style didn't transfer well over to digital but overtime I have realized the main reasons that plague his work.
Thus the reason for this video.

[@mechajay3358]

I kinda feel for Yamamuro. He use to out out quality art back in the day. The stuff he puts out now is just not the same. Excellent video as always.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

I feel the same way, I was rewatching dbz the other day and took more notice of how good his cut of the majin vegeta vs goku fight was, the quality was amazing. Makes me miss his classic art style. And thanks for your continued support!

[@GeteMachine]

Its weird how he used to do everything he's criticized on today more naturally and a lot better with anatomy back in Z but in modern Z from mid 2000s onward his art just gotten so generic, and poorly proportioned.

[@zenitsuthunder3946]

Bro his drawings, art, and character design in z was so badass.

[@FoxeroVA]

When you change studios or genres in general, you have to learn the style of the spesific anime. If I'd choose to animate a show where I have to draw them round and soft, overtime that's what I'd get familiar with. But then I'd get hired to another show where the art style uses angular shapes, that I used to work on YEARS ago, of course my drawings wouldn't look as good as it used to.

[@jasonone8726]

@@GeteMachineWhat about the Yo Son Goku & Friends Special?

[@kilochampion787]

You ever just think he’s just tired of drawing the same shit almost every time and he just keeps getting more and more lazy with it?

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Yeah that's my guess

[@gianflavio_]

Yup I'm guessing it's soul crushing work for him now

[@edishasora5200]

It was all about motivation in the 90s. They are young and still trying to prove them self. At the end, the only 1 got rich is Torriyama and TOEI. The rest employess just back at sucked it, after giving ideas and designs. Thats why DBS are struggle to get new arc and design and cannot move on from OG DBZ. No one wants to improvise anymore. There is nothing to gain as employees

[@Duothimir]

​@@edishasora5200 "rich" I mean, 50 million USD net worth could be considered rich I guess. Not really for how Dragon Ball is one of the biggest international franchises on the planet, but...

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

@@Duothimir 50 million a year is rich no matter how you slice it, unless you’re that garbage at handling money. Could he have been paid more? Absolutely. However, that doesn’t change that 50 Million a year is rich. Not everything is relative dude. Sometimes a spade is just a spade.

[@bocodamondo]

i 100% agree on the colors point, the more pink-ish skin shading of old DBZ always looked alot better and more appealing than the curent "just a darker grey tone of the current skin color" shading color used in basically any modern anime, it always looks soo bland and boring

[@casualvanilla]

The thing that's so weird is that it's not like it takes much effort to change things like the colours. They're working in a digital environment where they can utilise layers. It wouldn't take much effort.

[@dustmasterflex1541]

@Nobody comments are not funny you troglodyte What?

[@gnomasome4698]

It's probably hard to say anything colouring wise as Dragonball, Dragonball z and gt's animation was captured with 16mm film which is known to have a pretty big colour shift with age, usually the highlights are tilted to a magenta colour and the shadows are tilted slightly to an orange colour and the saturation changes too. So it's hard to judge colouring unless people have the OG broadcast of the show since that's partly why the remasters colouring is so different. for example if you look at the og drawings in 8:34 and 8:41 the skin tone is shifted further to pink and the sky has a slightly purply tone to it too, and the saturation for the colours is different

[@sidneyalonde6371]

agree, i still prefer the old dbz look and color.

[@kazi1]

Agreed

[@marcovi2806]

2:47 Before he used perspective, making the forehead bigger and the rest of the face smaller, because it is facing down, therefore it being further away from our eyes. In the other one, everything is the same size, making it look stiff.

[@fatpurp4041]

In the new one the shading looks like shit too

[@GabiN64]

He was doing class-A work back then. That's a hard look to draw

[@rdu239]

Basically the artstyle today is just "too clean" its like vector heavy with very little color fades or blending

[@pascalsimioli6777]

Also they look like they're made of plastic...the lighting doesn't make sense.

[@RtistiqSkubie]

THANK YOU! People keep saying I'm a hater & I don't know fantastic art because I *HATE* the art of Kai & Super. There's no shading to scene lighting & there virtually no fucking DETAILS! Not enough detail when emotion, movements or battle damage... even when the characters have a close up. Everything is fucking clean & vibrant. 90's artwork of DBZ to me was the pinnacle of the franchise...& big projects from the 80's were the best. Brighter colors does not equal better art no matter which anime, it makes it childish when the show has gritty,serious tones.

[@pmxanimations]

@@RtistiqSkubie kai was just dbz tho??

[@nexusaudios8]

Pinguu difference in artstyle and coloring

[@drasconboy6349]

@@nexusaudios8 No, only the promotional art was different, the show was the same

[@danieldickinson5853]

There’s a documentary about the brutal lives of shonen animators. I can totally understand why he dropped in quality over the years. Definitely worth a watch.

[@dokkanvids0182]

Link?

[@michaelnewton7755]

Pls link

[@Fishlipsandbabyhands]

Gimme dat link I wanna see

[@GruelingFive8]

Y'all need Google

[@therealsteezy891]

BluAirsoft 😹😹😹

[@MindfulAttraction2.0]

THIS IS BEAUTIFUL ARTISTIC BREAKDOWN AS AN ARTIST. GREAT STUFF MY MAN

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it😃👍

[@RedVelvetUnderground333]

Maybe he doesn’t care anymore, but it def misses the spirit, not as lively

[@ZonicZ]

Nah I wouldn’t say that, I think it’s because hes limiting himself to only drawing dragon ball for these past years, maybe one or two anime on a rare occasion but he’s basically been drawing only dragon ball in his entire career here

[@rawpowergroudon1]

@@ZonicZ he's getting old.

[@hortinus]

@@ZonicZ That doesn't explain it. According to him, his new style is much more animation friendly and easier to draw.

[@nevermissahit2559]

Yes

[@grandtheftmonkey77]

luckily the recent movie was absolutely gorgeous

[@JM-fx2cc]

Yeah, liked it better than that plastic looking shit. But I must say there were some scenes in the ToP that looked clean asf

[@christophervibe7430]

Jag M cuz they weren’t done by him they were done by yuya takahashi and naotoshi shida

[@JM-fx2cc]

Christopher Vibe I know that

[@Besaofficial12]

Especially the hair It actually moves and doesnt feel like barbie doll hair

[@ZanzibarWizard]

coffeeandtea the broly movie?

[@OGStarlightKY]

It's simple, he's not using perspective to give the art more character.

[@kermitthefrog3490]

StarlightKY yes true, but his art is so bad tho

[@ezeola6348]

@@kermitthefrog3490 he's done this for years he's probably bored

[@kermitthefrog3490]

Eze Ola nah, he has just bevare Worse to draw dragon ball

[@ashketchup.01]

To this day I still don't know how he keeps on using this style and sees it as a good thing

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Yep haha I have no idea either

[@exceldamage1861]

doing anything for too long, its easy to lose the passion for it, and even become depressed through lack of variety with what you do, which makes it all too easy to turn off, go on autopilot, and not really pay attention anymore

[@mycompaqlaptop8773]

honestly he's like a big fish in a small pole

[@mjangelvortex]

@@exceldamage1861 Part of me wonders if the style was done for another reason. Like it being quicker to animate. The anime industry has been infamous for crunch and overworking artists, so if something is quicker to make, it might benefit the artists.

[@fridaynightnicktoons6885]

Maybe he sold out and is evil? Or he's senile? It's like someone saying evolution is better then z....a opinion I just can't take seriously. I respect opinions but I just can't with some

[@TitusKingdom]

what happened to SSJ2 electric? God it looks terrible in super. always been my favorite form. now they never use it and when they do it just looks odd like they added it in as an after thought

[@royal.1359]

DBS is pure trash

[@TheIronSaiyan]

I think the God forms looked pretty good compared to the Shintani style. I actually like his ssjb a little better idk it's just my opinion

[@sontho6995]

@@royal.1359 Yamamuro was responsible for a 1/3 of the problems found in DBS.

[@zanioxl3663]

@@royal.1359 is it really?

[@babyjiren9676]

@Shir Khan Utube is shit, how dare they censor my comment when I said you’re a ©️unt? Because you are, you’re absolutely shit and a gigantic asshat for hopping on a 2 year old bandwagon.

[@kurseng]

Before, they value quality than quantity. Now, they need to rush things up to be able to meet with the deadlines.

[@KingofL85]

Also they are more dependent on computer now.

[@ji9347]

Leon Thunder I don’t think that’s really a big deal as some great things can be done on computer but I guess it comes down to the artists preference

[@Underground3]

@@ji9347 Yep. Genndy Tartakovsky manage to improve his art style with amazing way with digital.

[@koumusic2600]

Kelvinator X With Toei Animation’s modern guidelines and production management. You can actually say that the drop of quality from the their shows can also be concluded from several studio assets. Workload, pre production, production schedule, outsourcing. Toei Animation is one of the most profitable studios out there but is one of the studios that suffers more from inconsistency and bad production management. They really do depend on quantity over quality. After all, OP and Dragonball are their shounen money machine. People are always going watch the shows, spend money on their marketing values or promotional assets. Toei the real winner in the end.

[@foyo5497]

It was the same in the past, thats why we got lower quality episodes in DB and DBZ juxtaposed with high quality eps. Its always been quantity of quality, especially for long running anime. Its just that Toei and other anime studios choose when to put more money into an episode. And most animators get paid dirt, outside of the top animators.

[@browneye010]

Akira and Yamamuro's work on Z is what inspired me to draw.

[@xeno4693]

Dragon ball super is stiff and looks cheap. The characters also look extremely shiny. Also everything is outlined with dark black.

[@HipsteryDibstery]

Expect TOP... That was far better.... But still not quite Z

[@ashuea2]

@@HipsteryDibstery some of it, but the rest are sucks

[@tundrazzr3659]

Yep, just look at Bulma's nerfed Thighs over the years

[@edanegron8806]

Like z, i think it has high and low points. I love dbz as much as anyone but z was not perfect by any means, some of the art and animation was janky at best, bad at worst.

[@kidkid146]

The entire Broly movie did make me feel like I was watching Z again though.

[@Rujewitblood]

Honestly, looking at these drawings I don't believe same person drew them, deadlines etc don't just make you forget fundamentals of drawing, the examples on the left are amazing craftsmanship, while the ones on the right literally look like a student drawing, even with less time a draftsman on that level wouldn't just throw all his fundamentals out the window, not trying to shit on the video or anything, I just don't believe the same man made these drawings, how accurate is that info/where is it from, i don't know if you could even draw that bad if you tried if you already have such strong fundamentals, things are definitely not adding up here

[@theazureknight9399]

It's the same guy, he's credited with all the artworks and character designs shown in the video, you can look it up fairily easily. The problem seems to be that Yamamuro didn't adapt very well to the switch to digital that he went through back at the mid 00s. I'm not saying that drawing digitally is worse than traditionally, just that it made Yamamuro lazy and allowed him to overuse a number of shortcuts, vectors for example, that ultimately hurt the final quality of the art. Either that or he just stopped caring and stated drawing carelessly. The final proof of that is that Yamamuro got left out of working in the latest Dragon Ball movie and the company put him in charge of drawing artwork for the card game instead of the cartoon. Shows that not even the higher ups are happy with his current work. The guy is a legend alright, but that dosen't give him a free pass to screw up in the job and get by.

[@HipsteryDibstery]

The same person... Different tools.

[@MGrey-qb5xz]

i mean they would have had an amazing animation team backing everything up,it's not just yamamuro doing his part. Just compare the picture quality too,dbz remastered's majin buu saga has some amazing shading while the one in db super broly makes you wanna puke.

[@christophervibe7430]

M.Grey wait but dbs broly has some amazing animation and art

[@MGrey-qb5xz]

@@christophervibe7430 but the really bold shading looks awful,it's not actual shading there is a different word for it but whatever the term only animation is movie tier

[@MrSupedoSpade]

5:06 perfect side to side comparison of why the new Super artstyle (not Broly's) was just so jarring to look at. Characters felt so much more real before because of the detailed linework, deep shading, and the anatomy/perspective felt "real" in the old style. The new style throws that out for a brighter visual pop, but sacrifices in all other aspects. Like you said it isn't necessarily bad but if we're comparing it to the old style then it objectively is. Characters feel so flat in Super. Hits in Super don't have any oomph to them. Characters moving around seems more like them flailing than actual high speed movement. The best animation that is glued to my memory is the UI fights and the Rosé ones. When Super is good, it was on point. But majority of the time they were so off I couldn't help but notice. Ball/Z wasn't perfect but even their worst animations seemed a couple steps above Supers worst

[@BRsPedro]

that's not Yamamuro's work on the right...

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Even if it isn't yam's work his point is still 100% valid that the modern art style is a decrease in quality.

[@BRsPedro]

@@forgottenrelics1197 Agreed.

[@UnifiedEntity]

Im just going to point out the "Ball/z wasnt perfect" line. That is a late 80s early 90s animated series compared to now with better tech and resources to create, animate and fix mistakes. Regardless it set a standard. It had real highs and some lows that it SHOULDNT hit again but today it does and worse so. Pointing out it wasnt perfect, will not help Supers case. Not coming at you or any hostility but I just want people to understand that its not helping Super just bad damage controlling.

[@prabalkamra7763]

Old one doesn't look good either his hand is just way to big drawn in old one also his muscles are not drawn properly dragon looks better in new in old it looks Retarded

[@mfnormality3691]

Still one of the best up and coming dragon ball tubers can’t way to see more out of you my dude

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks man I've got more good content on the way👍

[@xhale671]

Good thing we have Yuya Takahashi His art style really resambles the majin buu saga style, and his animation is satisfying to watch

[@ssj4rit]

Super lacks the grit of the original series.

[@phoenixj1299]

Not including T.O.P and broly

[@crimson-rose486veil]

@@phoenixj1299 Not the T.O.P. but DBS Broly.

[@jasonone8726]

Read the manga.

[@granzedora]

@@jasonone8726 that sigh can't Stop us because we're too stupid to read

[@granzedora]

@@crimson-rose486veil Uh? Cap?

[@pero02review47]

For me, the only thing I dont like about modern DB color was the white shine parts (highlight) on the skin. It just look like a rubber skin. I prefer they just use 2 tone of color or at least not that pure white color.

[@justaspectre2717]

This was a pretty good video but I did notice a couple of issues with it that go against your argument unintentionally. The SSJ3 Goku Dragonfist and Dual SSB Vegeta and Goku drawings that were used as “Modern Yamamuro” examples were not actually made by him. It’s made by a promo artist who’s worked on the series for a very long time, but the problems with his work are similar to Yamamuro’s and it could be said it’s worse than modern Yamamuro. I think talking about the inaccurate muscle structure and the overuse of line by Yamamuro would’ve helped strengthen the video, but I assume most people know about that is. Other than that, it was pretty good and informative to those who wouldn’t know why people don’t like modern Yam.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

yeah someone else pointed that out, my mistake. And thanks!

[@iamtheonetheonlyone2674]

5:06 I also noticed in the right side is the hair doesn't go down naturally. Like if you observe it properly it just looks like a supersaiyan 2 hair then the hair just go downwards unnaturally to become ssj3. The pose also looks less dynamic and the colors looks more shinier and lighter which gives the illustration less expressivity.

[@greattrecko]

I think another problem with his current work is the way he draws hair. 8:34 shows what I mean. The hair on the left is curved and the hair strands point in different directions to make it flow while the hair in the right is basically just straight lines that don't look like it's soft and would flow with the wind or their auras. Even when it does flow, the shape of the hair makes it look weird. Interesting vid to see an analysis of why the artwork looks so different

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Yep that is another reason for sure, you can notice this style change in regards to the hair around Gt

[@flamywolfie]

Yeah dbz hair looked like actual hair. Dbs.... it feels plastic,sharp, and out of place.

[@koumusic2600]

greattrecko Lego vs organic shapes

[@Barkarott]

tbh if db fans complain about yamamuro, i kinda understand it...at least if it's not totally disrespectful. But i think as artists we can still learn from his work. I often find it so confusing when twitter kids who can't even draw yet call him straight trash while they could improve a lot by studying his work.

[@NireFuster]

Nicely explained and analyzed. I don't know much about artists and animators in the industry but I agreed with every single point The change to digital made the artwork feel much more stiffer and less tridimensional, it is a real shame.

[@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக்]

11:50 Goku's left arm is drawn to be slightly bigger than the right arm.

[@Z0RD.]

Thats what happened to my arm after quarantine

[@zanioxl3663]

Thats his left...

[@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக்]

@@zanioxl3663 Oh thanks, i'll fix it.

[@Alexousy]

As an artist, this video is my worst nightmare. I am always very fearful that my art is getting worse over the years despite trying my best to continue to improve. Stuff like this scares me, I hope I don't ever run into this sort of issue with my work as I continue to try and improve.

[@thedarkwolf5637]

any advice for improving art I can draw pretty solid on pencil paper but I never understood shadows line work and colors so when I then draw over ot with a pen it comes out ten times worse

[@starblaststudios]

This was really smart and educational! I've always wondered what exactly made the difference between yamamuro when he's bad and when he's good. It's such a shame that he made a huge fall from Grace but at least with heroes, he seems to be getting better. Also, I'm really digging your channel man. The way you do the videos are really well made and it feels like you should have more subs. You edit like the pros.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks a lot! Hope you enjoy what is to come

[@paintbrush3554]

even tho this is a small channel, its my favorite channel for dragon ball discussion/info. i really appreciate your videos and how you go into the technicalities of db art. lots of ♡♡♡☆

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks man for your feedback, the support is what keeps me motivated!

[@Imsleepeebruh]

Yoooo your pfp looks like it could be totally not marks stoner brother xD good video, fam. You've got yourself a subscriber!

[@FrenchToastMan585]

It's alright we still have Yuya Takahashi. The way he does the characters is Super similar.

[@loganwilliams6594]

Imagine the quality we'd get if Takahashi was placed in full control of the animation...

[@JM-fx2cc]

Logan The Beastly Shogun he be going off🔥

[@autsiydoyso4071]

@@loganwilliams6594 💀

[@supersaiyanfox9190]

Hey well now we have Shintani, so we don’t have to worry about Yamamuro and his shitty, modern art style.

[@Hitomihubby]

shintani's style looks so flawless. it looks like a modern style with 90's style combined lol

[@Hitomihubby]

shintani's style looks so flawless. it looks like a modern style with 90's style combined lol

[@supersaiyanfox9190]

@Haruko Anims II Here's my rank of all the "main" (because there's too many to count) art styles in Dragon Ball: 5. New Yamamuro Style (Super) 4. Nakatsuru Style (GT) 3. Maeda Style (Original to Early Z) 2. Old Yamamuro Style (Rest of Z) 1. Shintani Style (Super Broly) The Shintani Style is my favorite because of what you just said, plus it looks like the manga, and it has that sense of fluidity that we have never seen in Dragon Ball before, and I don't think any of the previous art styles could pull off that same fluidity that Shintani brought. The 40-minute battle of Broly vs. Vegeta, Goku, Frieza, and Gogeta is my favorite in the whole series because of its animation, and it takes a piss on all of the previous Dragon Ball fights. Of course my opinion on the Shintani Style could change if they go back to weekly schedules when Super comes back, which I pray they don't, and they choose to do a seasonal thing instead. But just going by the Broly movie alone, Shintani is unrivaled, and it's marvelous. Can you imagine Dragon Ball's most memorable fights like Goku vs. Piccolo Jr., Goku vs. Vegeta, Goku vs. Frieza, Gohan vs. Cell, and Goku vs. Majin Vegeta with Super Broly's animation? I would pay to see those fights remade.

[@supersaiyanfox9190]

M Billa The Gogeta battle was animated by Shida, but it does look like the Shintani Style is influenced in the art itself to me.

[@supersaiyanfox9190]

@M Billa Yeah I can see that, and you clearly know more about art and animation than I do, but I know that animation is how things move and art is how things look/are drawn. That's why I know that the Gogeta fight was animated by Shida. However, compare the art of the Gogeta fight to the art in Trunks and Goku vs. Goku Black and Zamasu. Those two fights are animated by Shida, but the art in both battles are incredibly different. With the Zamasu battle, I can tell that Yamamuro's crappy art style is still there, despite it being animated well. But with the Gogeta battle, maybe Shintani didn't draw over Shida's animation, but it does look like it's Shida's animation mixed with Shintani's art style.

[@0kdevv_]

great video! also did minoru maeda leave after the frieza arc? he’s one of my favorite db animators/artists. i really like how he draws faces and heads and the line quality and variation is really nice.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks! And yes I quite like him for the same reasons :). However I believe the last thing he worked on in db was the trunks special

[@metalspalace]

So happy to see you explain what I've been feeling for the longest about the art but don't know enough to explain it

[@vinceamaro1382]

Classic Yam is still my favorite artist.

[@CeeJay____]

Three things: Color, texture and shape. Yamamuro's drawing style in Super relies on thicker lines than the styling in Z did. This is shown both in the actual thickness of the lines alone as well as the texture of said lines. In the Broly movie, you notice that the frames look jittery, almost like they're falling over each-other on a microscopic level. This, while being a very small intentional design flaw, gives life to each frame to make the animations seem more natural and authentic. We almost NEVER sit completely still, so it makes sense. Along with this, the coloring in Super, while very fluorescent and noticeable, looks a bit inorganic compared to the darker, more dulled-out shading from Z. This plays well into the fact that Z was generally a much more serious series, while Super is...well. Yamamuro is a good artist. But I don't feel like his art style compliments the characters in DB very well, at least not this version. It looks kind of...American-ized. Like how every American cartoon is made from a set of different animations. And honestly, it works there, but it looks pretty bad compared to some anime that's out there. Also, can we PLEASE, for the love of God, bring back cuts and scrapes? I get it. TV is more censored now than it was back in the 90's. But for crying out loud, would it kill them to make a character that just got slammed through FIVE BUILDINGS look like they suffered a little more than a slight carpet burn?! Also ALSO, I'm sorry, but the transition animations look SO BAD in 90% of Super. There are no angles being challenged in fights, it feels like you're watching from a gas station security camera. Again using the Broly movie for reference - there are COUNTLESS angles used to make the fight scenes more impactful to the mind. For example, when SSGSS Gogeta was fighting Broly and Broly used his massive AoE attack, or when Gogeta flew into the air and started raining down Ki blasts. Or, most of all, when the fight was coming to a close and Gogeta was launching the Final Kamehameha at Broly. They ZOOMED IN on Broly's eyes, and it showed genuine fear. THAT is good animation, and it's honestly kind of sad that the only examples of this that can be noted from Super are that one cloud fight scene from the BoG movie, the ToP at the tail-end of it and the Broly movie.

[@ajtheman999]

This is why Shintani should take over ngl. Yamauro had his time back in the 90's its time to put up the gloves.

[@JEBEDIAH8D]

There isn't enough blood this days I always remember the first time I saw Gohan taking on cell with one arm blood dripping from the other it made gohans pain believable

[@jasonone8726]

There is in the manga, more than the anime at least.

[@gokushkameha-ha-ha9344]

People used to hand draw these panels, it is art, its beautiful, it holds up better than today's digital renderings. Always will. Old school disney was the sauce with their fluid animation style at high frame rates. What we have today is a bunch of uninspired lazy workers making anime instead of artists.

[@autsiydoyso4071]

💀

[@SpectreStatus]

Nakatsuru has done my favorite work. Very good with movements, motion, and being literally a doppelganger of Toriyama.

[@sydneyowusu3750]

Agreed, honestly sucks that he worked on just one episode of dbs

[@jasonone8726]

​@@sydneyowusu3750He's back now.

[@HipsteryDibstery]

TOP looked like there was a *DRAMATIC* Filter on all the time.

[@Soniman001]

And it looked better so yeah

[@stupidchild7716]

I'd almost say he's tired. It feels like he's cutting corners to be done with his work as quickly as possible: now things like clenched fists and neck muscles have been reduced to straight lines, hair is nothing but directionless spikes, foreshortening, shading and expressions in general feel like the basic idea put into a sketch carried out to be a final piece without any corrections done to it, more complex poses become a rough connection of body parts (5:06 is a great example, look at the lines Goku's sides draw in each one) and all in all I think the man is tired of dragon ball.

[@SlapstickGenius23]

Does Tadayoshi Yamamuro need to move out of Toei entirely? I don’t know yet, but it stands strongly towards a ‘yes’ answer. Unfortunately, the truth is that he’s had been exploited to a pretty visible extent by the company since he was twenty six. For the lighter side. What I can tell you is that when you look at an image of him and either one of his pets, I think you can see that the pets are house cats. Adorkable.

[@AccelSternritter]

I got this on my recommendations today, i'm glad i found your channel.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thats awesome! Hope you enjoy the content😃

[@thaidaym]

That's the issue with computer art. Shows these days just don't feel the same.

[@JustAsh001]

True

[@myusername3689]

Curvature and angularity

[@itsyaboy490]

The main problem with all the new DB content in the anime is that the hair does not move or sway around anymore. After Z everything became super stiff overall as well.

[@sydneyowusu3750]

Agreed

[@gregorygrice5795]

Thank you for teaching me the proper way to color, shade and define shape. I have learned a lot. 🌟❤️

[@diezgp]

He must be tired. Let's respect Yamamuro, he made those epic designs that defined the series for the years to come. I really hope the new type of animation they will use now can recapture his essence.

[@SlapstickGenius23]

He’s been exploited by Toei since December 1986.

[@sydneyowusu3750]

​@@SlapstickGenius23agreed

[@M53614]

Gohan's eyes look so much better on the left. Wtf were they thinking

[@Diego-ur8ku]

Great video, I’m always wondering about these questions and the videos you make are good

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thanks! Im glad it was useful!

[@naughtyadventuresofmcbrouh5410]

The plasticy feel is SINPLY because it lacks RED. Shadows are just a shader darker, nowadays. But it SHOULD be reddish because BLOOD flows underneath the skin.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

exactly right

[@kursedmilk]

Totally unrelated to the topic of the video but I love your choice of music for the first song that's like my favorite track from dragon ball

[@toalesovikk7168]

Maybe the guy is getting old.

[@latchylore6507]

Yup 25+ years of working for Dragon Ball can be pretty tiring

[@mechajay3358]

But then again, there are other DB Animators that are in his age group that gotten better with their art

[@bloodfinity]

If he blends the lighting with the base tone it won,t look much plastic

[@jasonone8726]

Yuya Takahashi is the 90's Yamamuro.

[@AfroZander5360]

Love these art analysis vids 😁 keep it up man👍

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Glad you did!

[@MurakumoMFF]

Tbh, it’s not only a yamamuro “problem”. It’s basically 90% of anime of ~2010+ (idk when specifically the old standards changed in anime industry)

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Oh for sure I even made a video on it not to long after this one but yeah this trend of dull and plastic tones seemed to be almost an industry standard especially in the 2000's, although now it does seem to be changing

[@ragemutt5372]

Im working on a fan project in the dragon ball verse, and these videos are helping me alot 😂 I was having trouble pinpointing all the differences between the DBZ and DBS styles and i really want that OG look.

[@HipsteryDibstery]

He wanted to start making plastic figurines but no one let him, he protested by drawing plastic figurines.

[@monkeylove2620]

Lmao

[@thickboi7988]

hilights from "yo son goku and his friends return"looked pretty good from what i remember

[@PokeyMeansBusiness]

Thank you so much for this video! It puts to words some of the things I intuited by watching Super but didn't have the artistic experience or knowledge to communicate.

[@NinjaGuyDan_]

Thank you for articulating this so well.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

No problem👍

[@doubleoof7907]

Currently trying to get better at drawing, this video is actually giving me some pointers! Even though that's not really the intention of this video, thanks!

[@rexarthurramos1642]

This is a good analysis. I really miss the old at work.

[@itzjustkris7964]

When I first watched dragon ball for the first time about a year ago I decided to watch the original stuff not Kai and I’m glad it has its charm 🤷‍♂️

[@jasonone8726]

Kai is the same art style as Z, only the intro's were reanimated.

[@autsiydoyso4071]

It's still the same show 🤷🏿‍♂️

[@iamtheonetheonlyone2674]

The thing is the old ones has a natural color,where as the newer ones looks bright, making it look cartoony

[@TheDanubeDepleter]

This channel is just.. *so* underrated

[@verbage432]

I dont even know who this video is about but this is such a good video on color theory that I put it in my favorites reguardless holy crap

[@IsanSamaa]

near the TOP it started looking 10x better

[@NitinVermaTheAnimator]

Great breakdown

[@RonPaul42069]

I learned more about art from this video than... well, anything.

[@Cutzerella03]

Good video. I'm very mixed, I'm a fan of his work but the new talent sort of has a more fresh feel, if he ever animates the return of super, hopefully it has improvements

[@MaxIronsThird]

Tadayoshi Yamamuro is the Frank Miller of Dragon Ball. They don't give a fuck anymore.

[@gywii]

Well explained. I don't always agree but I think this can help some people understand some things that are important about artstyles.

[@MegaUMU]

Is it maybe bc yamamura is just old and cant keep up with modern digital drawing? (Like when pointed out starting from 7:00, his celluoid drawings transition over more naturally)

[@uxnosidda]

Thank you for putting out this very important video! No, not being sarcastic lol. Bad animation needs to be criticized and I'm glad you articulated very well why this newer work is just worse. You brought up so many points that I've been thinking about: how handpainting the cels allows for naturally blended edges (which you don't get with sharp digital edges between values), value contrasts being too high which leads to a plastic look, lack of variation in shape design, straightness all the way through when creating forms and their constituent lines, with no thought for variety in their design and detail, no attention to line weight...I've never even bothered to watch Super due to how downright amateurish the animation looks. THANK you for going into such specific detail in addressing the formal aspects of art to criticize this work. I'm guessing you have a background in art? It really shows through! Great video.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Thank you! Looking back there are lots of small details I would've like to have expounded upon or perhaps presented better but I'm glad the general message was easy to understand :)

[@TrvisXXIII]

I love artistic breakdown videos on KZbin

[@RandomVids0987]

So what you're saying is digital art is a major step behind due to either it always being used wrong or is just flat out bad. Thanks for the info.

[@dustmasterflex1541]

Looks like it was drawn by two different people.

[@lordbeerus3383]

I'm cool with it being stiff as long as they don't bring back strong chin goku😂

[@Mardanzo]

he also worked on Toriko, I guess that's why the backgrounds are an eyesore on the anime adaptation while they are completely stunning on the manga

[@kylegregory46]

I used to have that post of base ssj and ssj3 goku up in my room didn’t know it was his work

[@Merjedmedia]

One different shape can make the picture seem off and effect the rest of the picture's basic shape pattern formation

[@JoeFanik]

Yamamoro's art and animation style is bad at times, but when it looks good, it looks DAMN good. Examples: Goku vs Cell, Janemba, Majin Vegeta vs Goku, and many more.

[@forgottenrelics1197]

Oh for sure, I loved the work he did as an animation supervisor in Z as well as his style in general, it's amongst my favorites. It's around Gt however where the drop off begins

[@jackko21]

Im fine with him doing key animation for dragonball but shintani needs to stay as character desinger

[@jedd1099]

That is a pretty good break down. I doubt he forgot all these principles though. He knew them and used them well before. It's probably more a mental thing. Maybe it's just that he is old and has just gotten burned out over the years.

[@stormintheshell5130]

best constructive dragon ball content

[@DoreThan_Draws]

Yamamuro is pretty much the man at drawing, his art is so good

[@attemptatlife25]

great video man, make more !! i find this stuff so interesting. i fell in love with his older work crazy to think hes part of super , maybe he got bored of drawing dragon ball

[@RancidKari]

Yamamuro: I am inevitable Fans: lol what no u aint your art style sucks now Yamamuro: what can you do? Fans: Bring him in. *shintani steps out* Yamamuro: HOLY SH-

[@ssjgotenks2009]

dude shnttani si not as godo you thinke hs he made goku hand look like 5 year old draw ha ahdn when he show vegeta the 30 min hand sign for fusion and vegeta look mad about fusion vegeta face look like 5 year old draw it you clal that good drawing iv seen way better

[@zackrose6261]

@@ssjgotenks2009 I see you still don't know how to type correctly. :p

[@RtistiqSkubie]

@@zackrose6261 doesn't take away from his very understandable point. Shintani's art is actually JUST as bad.

[@phoenixj1299]

@@RtistiqSkubie Not at all...Shintani style made the characters express more emotions,looks more fluid with more dynamic movements.With more impact animation.His tyle is way better

[@onetwo5975]

It's great You share those videos and create a space where all of the people that actually see the PAINFUL difference in his arstyle can find a little bit of peace:) When people capable of doing amazing stuff decide to sell a bad product that they don't really put an effort into, it says for itself...........It would be understandable at the beginning, but now? Thousands of figures are sold, games are produced, and the artworks are still low quality, even in a cinematic movie like Broly, while for example : Fusion Reborn or Hildegarn were perfect from the head to the toe, and it was done without any modern technology....

[@wor575]

also what's the thing about him giving Goku scoliosis where Goku from the chest and up is off center?

[@forgottenrelics1197]

no idea man

[@kevincmejia]

I think he doesnt flip his work, as an artist, when you draw a character you flip the canvas to see if something is off center, and I think his problem is really apparent

[@MGrey-qb5xz]

when you look at any thing dragon ball or dbz it looks so high quality and filled with life like there is an actual world beyond the frame we are seeing(mostly due to collaboration of the whole team). But whenever you look at anything db super you get this cheap plastic shit feeling which only looks slightly good cause of modern tech,coupled with the theme being more childish it's just not worth seeing now.

[@hardfugoo1]

Short answer... Gohan just looks surly instead of downright furious.

[@keepmovingforward261]

Yamamuro is a legend of dragon ball. He did his best on dragon ball dbz,GT,dbz battle of gods, dbz resurrection of f. I love highlights

[@Tokmurok]

Yamamuro's art is like goku's personality from Z to Super. I reckon he either don't care, is old and just can't produce the same work, or somewhere inbetween.

[@Shizilol]

Theory. Yamamuro might’ve forgot how to draw his style. I mean after the years after Z ends and begins GT. His style is different than he was in Z maybe it was due to time. And then after gt he came back to draw Budokai artwork which was years since Yamamuro draw dragonball in the instructions book and it looks terrible. And he keeps doing this style for almost 2 decades which was why he never improves and also he said that he never watches any other anime besides his own (it wasn’t offical but it seems believable because other anime like MHA, Demon slayer, One punch man, etc. They seem to have better art styles, but I guess that’s Toei terrible schedule. Maybe you should also make a video why Toei’s Schedule is terrible because the bland style isn’t in just Super it was also on one piece.

[@jasonone8726]

But he worked on Yo Son and Goku and Friends Return, years after Z, the style in that special looked great, his designs have gone downhill since DBZ Kai in 2009, when you look at those reanimated scenes in the intro, that was only a year after that special.

[@frozenbubbles4887]

I like him. You can’t hate on him because you can’t draw for shit compared to him and he is an old man. This is to the haters

[@moonfreak-5983]

Is this a joke?

[@frozenbubbles4887]

Captaincarrot 25 idk is it

[@rikybj0276]

The Ssj had almost white hair, only yellow with some lightning it their aura, and when Ssj3 the orange gi of Goku was almost yellow too, not its only yellow, the Ssj3 back then had yellow hair and now is orange