Freeing Bound Thiols In A Cold IPA | exBEERiment

There’s been a lot of talk in the brewing world about thiols - aromatic compounds that evoke intense citrus and tropical fruit notes. The problem lies in getting these thiols into beer. For this exBEERiment, I’m brewing two Cold IPAs side-by-side, similar recipes with each using thiolized yeast, but in one batch I’m going to employ various methods to free up bound thiols. Then, I’ll have participants attempt to distinguish the beers in a blind triangle test.
RECIPE & METHOD
brulosophy.com...
GREAT FERMENTATIONS GLACIAL ADVANCE RECIPE KIT
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EQUIPMENT USED
Clawhammer Supply 240v eBIAB System: www.clawhammer...
Spike Brewing FLEX+: spikebrewing.c...
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[@MispeledStalion]

Love Brulosophy, love that Martin is leading the video version, but as a social scientist, one thing that has always bothered me about Brulosophy is their sample size; not powerful enough to reliably detect results. If you can double the amount of tasters, that would make me so so happy.

[@Marshall_Brulosophy]

As soon as we cut the ribbon on our BrÜniversity, our standard for sample sizes will certainly increase. Until then, we're stuck doing what's most reasonable for a group of neurotic homebrewers trying to learn at least a little something new about brewing and beer. Cheers!

[@brotherjohn2002]

Their articles are all over the place. Some contributors pull 40+. I think it's really just depending on whatever is available to them.

[@TheBruSho]

Super pumped to see my favorite podcast come to life on KZbin! And looking forward to all the experiments to come, well done Martin

[@Marshall_Brulosophy]

♥♥♥

[@clubroot3383]

Why don’t Clawhammer install a 90 degree bend on that lid? It’s always irritated me looking at it.

[@ouzts12]

This is about to be the best brewing series online

[@Marshall_Brulosophy]

❤

[@FermentationAdventures]

Having done numerous phantasm beers, there is an obvious and huge overripe fruit difference in aroma during fermentation. Getting that to stay with the final beer is the conundrum.

[@scottsteenburg]

Martin Keen is a Brulosopher. Yay!!!

[@michaelmasin1996]

Yes! Perfect Host for this

[@ShortCircuitedBrewers]

Timely! I just got some of the magic dust myself and will be doing video on it soon. Not as in depth on the science as you Martin!! Cheers good to see you on screen! 👍🍻

[@adriangresores694]

This was great! The presenter is clear, succinct, and personable. The video, graphics, and audio quality was outstanding. Everything was clear and easy to follow, with no wasted time. Can't wait for more episodes.

[@NicholasDWilson]

This is awesome!

[@britishteapower]

A great first video and an interesting exbeeriment...!

[@EnglishLevy]

This is destined to become the best homebrewer show on the interwebs. No Pressure 🍻

[@bradleybarth9939]

This is very neat seeing Martin as part of Brulosophy. Hopefully we get to see some of the other contributors! Great job as always!

[@nsmith1388]

YES! Great video. Thanks for producing video content!

[@BoricuaBrewer]

Used the phantasm powder with the lunar crush and sazz , H-blanc to make an "italian pilsner," and it comes out with alot of guava in it. Such a freshing beer with some fruitty punch!

[@jeffreycoburn4979]

Once a week, right? Good Stuff! Thanks Martin and Marshall and your teams.

[@michaelbirmingham1854]

Thank you Martin! You need to do a brew with naturally gluten free grains for all the celiacs out there

[@ciclocidade8937]

wonderful exbeerment, congrats!

[@premiumbitter]

Great video design and tone, great to have Brülosopohy on KZbin! I'm not a fan of the experiment design for this one though. This seems more like it's testing the effects of mash hopping and phantasm powder on human perception since thiol-releasing yeast was used for both. Both are going to have lots of free thiols because of this. It would make more sense to test the exact same recipe where one uses the parent, non-thiolized Mexican Lager strain. I brewed a 10 gallon batch of cream ale, and split it into 2, 5 gallon fermenters. Both were mash, whirlpool, and dry hopped with cascade. One was fermented with the Chico strain, the other was fermented with the thiolized Chico strain (Star Party). The beers could not be more different, even non beer people I gave them to could easily tell them apart. The vanilla Chico one had that bitter grapefruit peel bite to it, the star party one version was much more mild, and had a tropical fruit flavor, almost like lychee and/or passion fruit. I was shocked, honestly! I have a pack of this strain (Lunar Crush) in the fridge right now, can’t wait to experiment! I still did find this experiment useful though. It suggests that mash hopping and phantasm powder might not be necessary to boost thiols if you’re using a thiolized strain that’s already throwing off a lot of thiols.

[@TheApartmentBrewer]

Excellent video, can't wait for more!

[@chamiboy1]

great work, cheers

[@Unsub-Me-Now]

This was like what my mind sees when reading one of y'alls articles. Super stoked to have y'all on KZbin

[@bigpopbrewing]

Nicely done, Martin! Very cool test.

[@qtiphead]

Nice to see you back.

[@TwoTerriersBrewery]

Great vid! Looking to experiment with thiols this year, so very interesting experiment. Keep 'em coming!

[@keithstarks6038]

I have been reluctant to free the thiols in my basement, I find them helpful during clean up (they have tiny hands). Seriously though thank you for doing this video. I love the learning familiarity it brings me with both Brulosophy & the homebrew challenge. Very well done.

[@tylerdebruler]

Looking forward to the new content! Thanks!

[@pmhartel]

Great to see Martin bringing his amazing video talents to Brulosophy! I'm personally on a kick of testing out these thiolized yeasts from Omega. My approach was to keep the beer recipe the same and then split to test head to head against a standard yeast. So far I've got two split batches done. First was a 3way to compare Juice, Cosmic Punch, and Helio Gazer. The only change to my standard NEIPA recipe was to mash hop with Cascade. The beers were drastically different. All in all Juice was my favorite. Currently on tap is a Centennial IPA to test Star Party vs Bell's house. This recipe also got a Cascade mash hop. While subtly different I don't think I'd be able to tell them apart in a triangle test.

[@charlesjohnson5811]

Love the KZbin adaptation of presenting the Brulosophy Exbeeriment results! Really interesting and topical stuff too

[@Les2point0]

Oh great my favorite podcast combined with my favorite KZbin channel? That’s great, just great. What’s next, chocolate in my peanut butter?!

[@obliter8r]

Great to see you still pushing boundaries Martin. Have really missed your videos. This is fantastic. Well done Brulosophy for getting Martin on, we need more!

[@Austographer]

Did you enjoy the beer(s) though, Martin? Anything you'd change? Thanks for the exbeerament!

[@MikeP350]

This was a great production 👏. A KZbin version of brulosophy was long overdue, and Martin was a great choice to bring it to video!

[@RJVEK]

Martin is amazing at presenting! He is a natural and is a great addition to the Brulosophy team

[@JohnL9013]

Stupendous! I can't wait to see more content like this!!

[@HOMEBREW4LIFE]

This is a fantastic video 🍻

[@jasperb6191]

Oh wow Ive been following your blog like the bible. Cant wait for more videos!

[@douglasjohnston4671]

Well done. Super professional, educational, entertaining, and just fun to watch.

[@seriomarkj]

I was wondering when we would get an episode...and I always love these because more often then not, just quality brewing processes and ingredients matter the most to the flavor . Can't wait for the next one CHEERS!

[@goodolarchie]

I tried Omega's two ale strains, they were both really impressive. Cascade in the whirlpool and mash is mostly what I used and got wild tropical, rhubarb, other fruity notes. Plus Phantasm in the whirlpool.

[@marklpaulick]

Well done! You had to put SO MUCH work into this video, much appreciated. I love that you combined variables, trying to emphasize a potential difference is very appropriate. Look forward to more of that… ( like multiple traditional lager methods compared to multiple short cut lager methods) I certainly will watch everything g you put out at this quality, hope there is lots to come.

[@ElementaryBrewingCo]

Alright episode #1, sweet!!! Great to see you back at it Martin, although I’m sure you’ve been hard at work the whole time 😂

[@jamesleehunter]

They're not blinded from the color of the cups, and as we know, color matters

[@Kaesekuchen002]

Hey Martin, great to see you teaming up with Brulosophy! Enjoyed the video and hope to see more soon.

[@Leo99929]

There's some research showing that the colour of the cup can affect flavour perception. I don't know if the effect would be statistically significant in a trial like this. I'm just saying that it's a variable.

[@GarySylvester]

I am so excited that this has come to fruition! I love both worlds, so the combination is pretty awesome. I have yet to hear a "wow" result on any thiol-freeing experiment, but hey, no harm in testing, eh? Keep up the good work!

[@Beerjunkieguy]

Love this! My new favorite youtube sub. Keep them coming Martin. I'm so glad you're behind this new Brulosophy production.

[@Marshall_Brulosophy]

So are we!

[@jimlewis7938]

Nice work! Looking forward to more great content from the Brulosophy team!! Only wish it was longer 🍻

[@1TheLord1]

Love to see this! Amalgamation of two of my favorite beer things, Brulosophy and The Home Bre Chalenge! You guys rock

[@adamfrantz1140]

The not statistically significant result means that you can add less hops to produce the same result. That conclusion is significant if you are brewing for scale or yield.

[@MurraySellsHomes]

Use star party yeast by omega if you want to smell that IPA out of the glass across the room!

[@cristofaropompermaier8717]

That was a great video. What a clarity and presentation. I just subscribed for the coming videos. Keep doing this please.

[@jeffroach3722]

This was great. Subbed ☮️

[@nickk2556]

Would really love to see just a standard cold ipa against one with all the stops pulled out (mash hopping, phantasm, Thiolized yeast) to see what the difference is there, if any.

[@PartyTimeBrewing]

I tried the Phantasm once (but didn't do a comparison). I found while it didn't really seem to add that much, the beer with the thiolized yeast really kept its aroma and flavour for a long time. I just kicked the keg recently after brewing it in late August. Looking forward to more vids!

[@troykase9472]

I have not tried phantasm. However, I will agree with the idea that thiolized yeast holds aroma and flavor for a longer time. I recently made a terrible mistake and fully exposed a kegged hazy to oxygen. While the beer predictably turned purplish -brown, it still retained great flavor. It was one that I stopped sharing with others and continued to enjoy (with a little guilt).

[@russflynn]

Love seeing The Homebrew Challenge and Brulosophy coming together! I would be curious about the shelf stability in the hop character of these two beers. While they may have been nearly indistinguishable initially I wonder if distinctions would have started to appear after a few weeks.

[@Bildo1986]

Try one where you brew an American pale, and make it an IPA by thiolizing.

[@DudesBrews]

Great video! Can't believe how much was packed in to just 10 mins, obviously I need to work on my editing a bit lol. It would be good to see this experiment done with the recipe the same but a thiolized and non-thiolized (ideally the parent yeast) strain as the variable

[@mrow7598]

Now I want to try to remake my orange IPA. Which the last time I attempted it came out horribly and I was talking to a professional brewer about brewing one and a month later he came out with his own and it was good, the jerk.

[@Leo99929]

Super interesting exbeeriment and results! I'd be interested in seeing if the dry hop does suppress thiols, or if that reduction in dry hop was what evened out their perception? Beyond that, given say a 100g hop limit, what utilisation delivers the most flavour? Mostly late dry hop? Bio transformation with yeast pitch? Whirlpool?... Does it make any difference?

[@TrollumDK]

I would much have preferred if the variable was the yeast? Does it actually do what it is supposed to? Here you assume it does.

[@suwirwong]

Where do you think the thiold compound is in?malt or hops? Why is it lock?

[@pdubb9754]

I''m not sure you answered the should it be brewed question

[@MrTrikai]

Great test. But more aroma or thiol taste wasn't being tested for being "better". Just that it was noticed. And the fact that most people couldn't tell the difference you must consider is thiolized (genetically modified) yeast worth the potential risks to get more of these characteristics when most can not tell? Should a consumer at least be notified that you are using GM ingredients? This goes for grains, hops, etc.

[@Baftekkel]

The experiment is inherently flawed. Saaz and phantasm powder should increase thiols, but Citra also contains free versions of thiols associated with tropical flavours (and as the name suggests, citrus flavours). You haven't provided what people tasted, but all the things you added could hypothetically make up for what you left out. If you want to test this, test mash hops vs no mash hops and leave out late hops. Repeat the same experiment with and without mash hops, but with or without thiol-releasing yeast. No mash hops and non-thiol-releasing yeast would function as a negative control in this case. Next you can use those four conditions (or choose one, because of time constraints) and do four batches (per condition) with the variables being thiol-releasing yeast and phantasm powder. Then you know whether phantasm powder adds flavour itself, or that you need a special yeast strain to release the thiols, or that yeast itself can do fine on its own without an expensive additive. If you want to continue the deep dive further once you've found out what variables actually matter, you can play around with dry hop timings and varieties. And if you find anything significant after these tests, then compare whether you actually perceive any difference when trying to free thiols together with the stupid amount of dry hops people add these days.

[@dack4545]

So this new yeast and thiol powder does pretty much nothing 🤣 and everyone is jumping at it LOL

[@GentleGiantFan]

My thoughts exactly. All the videos showcasing this had me wondering about trying it myself. Now after seeing this video, I'm like "meh". If this channel is going to be like a homebrewer's Mythbusters, it will quickly be my favorite.

[@dack4545]

@@GentleGiantFan, look up the homebrew network channel on here he knows his sfutt to 👍

[@GentleGiantFan]

@@dack4545 Is that the hombrewer from Australia? If so, yeah that guy's awesome.

[@premiumbitter]

That’s not the conclusion I took, this is a poorly designed experiment. It should be the non-thiolized Mexican lager strain versus the thiolized one while holding everything else constant. There are unbound thiols in both of these beers. Experiment does suggest that maybe phantasm doesn’t add enough additional bound thiols to make a perceptible difference though.

[@GentleGiantFan]

@@premiumbitter How would you do it different?