HOW ABOUT THAT DOUBLE INTRO!!!! It got me the first time when I saw it, I thought the youtubes was glitching. I'm GIVING AWAY A CAMERA VALUED UP TO $4,999!!! Enter the SUper HUGER Camera Giveaway right here bit.ly/megafro2020 NEW FroPack 2 Lightroom Presets froknowsphoto.com/fropack2/ (40% off)
@herbalgiles94684 жыл бұрын
Jared Polin the intro repeats
@SergioGVasco4 жыл бұрын
That's great. It's just a shame i'm not eligible because i live in France. But, hey, it's great you'll be making someone happy. Take care.
@agatorade1244 жыл бұрын
It is a KZbin glitch. I was watching a completely different video and he also repeated his intro.
@grandetaco44164 жыл бұрын
Whew! I thought I was having a stroke.
@RD-dd6ff4 жыл бұрын
Use the Iris Tool in Lightroom and brighten up around the darks of the eyes. Helps make it pop... Comedy thumbnail and possing demonstration with Many. LOL
@amusementhunter4 жыл бұрын
"Boobal area" is going into my vocabulary
@sturek4 жыл бұрын
it's been awhile since I've seen Jared that distracted! LOL
@leroywilliams71264 жыл бұрын
blur the face ..the boobal area is the subject ...hahaha😍
@mrMacMilli20004 жыл бұрын
@@leroywilliams7126 boobal area squared
@joshuareveles4 жыл бұрын
"the boobs distract, I'm distracted" LMAO A true man of culture
@maxbenson9982 Жыл бұрын
"the boobal area"
@eightyeightfm74624 жыл бұрын
Years and years ago when I first started getting serious about making an effort with photography, I found you abrasive. Over time I've learned to appreciate where you come from and I've learned more from your critiques than any other singular resource. I'm revisiting a lot of your critiques since one of my goals this year is to expand on my studio and profile toolset and it's objectively good advice - when I submitted my portfolio for a commercial photography course, they focused on complimenting my framing and wedding shots, and a lot of what I learned to get better at that came from your critiques.
@robert.16744 жыл бұрын
I'm with you there I also found him abrasive at first I think people find him like that at first is because he doesn't hold your hand he tells you the truth
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Lol I knew he would be a bit harsh with my images but I did it because I needed some honest critique so I can improve
@Linealo4 жыл бұрын
Tbh, negative examples are the better examples because humans tend to remember bad things more than good. Instead of showing something with emotions and say 'like this!' and therewith limiting the artist or giving a direction, saying 'not like this' still leaves the interpretation and way open. A negative example makes you think about how to change it, while a positive can motivate you to trying to copy it. I personally therefore think it's good to have exactly those pictures - not because they're bad, but because the improvable aspects of them are not about right or wrong, but about what to do better.
@michaelfuller89404 жыл бұрын
Thanks for being brave enough to submit. You’ll improve because you’re open and want to learn. You’ve helped us all.
@jacobedsell88504 жыл бұрын
@4:53 - Is this Tom Ellis? If so, how did you manage to do a photoshoot of him?
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Jacob Edsell nah, that’s another Tom. He does look like a bit like Tom Ellis tho
@jacobedsell88504 жыл бұрын
@@RodolphosTechchannel They look identical. Funny they have the same name.
@nikolagajic47294 жыл бұрын
Double intro= double smile
@theallimoo4 жыл бұрын
Omg thought I lost my mind for a second when it looped back. Anyways, I tell people this all the time. People get annoyed if I do a model call and they're not selected even though they're '''pretty'''. Pretty does not mean connection, good images, good posing, or anything striking.
@dlovisuals4 жыл бұрын
Jared dropping truth bombs in this video and calling out every “aesthetic” photographer on IG. Make more videos like this Fro 🙌🏻
@handyadrien4 жыл бұрын
Critique of the critique . Entertainment value 7/10 . Value of critique given 4/10. Having a large platform like yours goes with responsibilities especially when giving critique or advice. One must be careful not to mix personal preferences with absolute truths . Photography is an art and it will be a very sad day when everyone's images all look the same because of shaming on channels like this . I agree that Peter Hurley is a great photographer and he has his style , and we can all learn from him. However no one should be copying him but rather developing their own style. To take 4 or 5 pictures out of context and then rabbit on about making eye contact is neither responsible nor valuable as a critique. If you are going to critique someones work rather look at what the photographer was intending to portray and offer assistance with the technical side and maybe the composition . Your video reminded me of why a vast majority of local camera clubs do little more than destroy creativity by enforcing rules , rather than adding value . Your preference for "eye contact" is not an absolute and it is what it is, a personal preference. There is no written rule anywhere that says all portraits should have eye contact. There are many great advertising campaigns where the models are looking away from the camera and maybe this was the influence in the car photo . There were many technical issues with that photo, but eye contact was not one of them. It was , once again, just your preference. I could go through most of the photos you critiqued and justify why the eye contact was not a valid criticism , and it boils down to you not taking the time to interpret the photographers vision. Critiquing someones work , when you have 1.22m subscribers should not be taken lightly and it certainly should not be addressed as entertainment value .It is a serious business . You need to impart sound advice and not attempt to impose your personal preferences on others using the power of your following. BTW, I had a quick flip through your Instagram page and guess what ? There was a good smattering of portraits without eye contact. I guess the old adage of what is good for the goose is good for the gander doesn't apply to you.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Yeah the car photo I wanted to try and portray something like those men’s fashion brands...those ads for magazines or stuff like that...
@chrismellides4 жыл бұрын
Thank you very much for doing this video, Jared. It answered a lot of my questions and alleviated my concerns, no matter how hollow they seemed in the grander scheme of things. Been following your content for several years now and trust that I'll be returning to it regularly as I always have. I appreciate you, man. Keep doing it.
@MrChip12174 жыл бұрын
Flat expression, bra and pants in a bathtub. Wires in the background are distracting
@spider8534 жыл бұрын
biggest contrast is on her bra vs boob shadow
@benoloughlin15574 жыл бұрын
“You’ve got bokeh. Yep-dee, whoop-dee, freakin’-do!” That just made my day!!
@And1Mixtape94 жыл бұрын
Never heard that one before - loved it !!
@rhondamoore98424 жыл бұрын
Gawd! Thank you! Finally someone calling out the boring, dead eyed, slack mouthed look! I call it the “sex doll” look - no personality, flat eyes, mouth open. Real people have personalities! And why do so many photographers feel they have to shoot wide open aperatures ALL THE TIME! Great video and critiques Jared! Always the truth, even when it’s tough.
@jeffr77522 жыл бұрын
"The sex doll look" LOL! That is awesome! I'm going to use that forever!
@ChristopherCabello4 жыл бұрын
I thought I was going crazy. That intro though.
@bradwilson20144 жыл бұрын
Definitely do that rant video. Love the critical critique from a professional and the references from other professionals. Can’t get that anywhere else. Masterful.
@BoostLeekdMedia4 жыл бұрын
Great critique on the images! I do agree that photographers DO need to DIRECT the models too because the models can only do so much for your images too.
@michaelfuller89404 жыл бұрын
I studied posing after being at a Jason Lanier workshop with pro models. Lots of great shots but I got burned later shooting a beautiful non-pro friend. I didn’t know how to direct. Technically OK but blah results.
@ZadieBear4 жыл бұрын
@@michaelfuller8940 I try really hard to not shoot friends. Sometimes the poses are fine, it is getting them relaxed in the face. And my normal "raporte" with models doesn't work on friends.....
@origal20174 жыл бұрын
No one: Jared: I LOVE naked photos
@andrewmontague96824 жыл бұрын
The "dead" look is so true. I actually found a lot of these photos just so cold because they lacked emotions of any sort.
@brujahmalloy4 жыл бұрын
there was an error in the matrix
@lifesbeautiful30244 жыл бұрын
Jared, THANKS SO MUCH for this rapid fire critique!!! As you know, I’ve been asking for one of these for a while and I’m thrilled that you brought it back! Thank you!!!! Regarding the critique itself, I thought you were, as usual, spot on, not too harsh, but just honest. Last pic of guy/car looked almost on an angle.
@Birdisthename4 жыл бұрын
The f1 means hes using a adapted lens that the camera doesn't recognize
@ripostethis43744 жыл бұрын
It also means he didn't properly setup his camera with the custom lens option haha.
@malakachino4 жыл бұрын
Bird is the Name 12:19 he realises
@Imjustamusicfan4 жыл бұрын
That's a great on-point critique and a nice little rant for those insta "models".
@heffelumpphotoco4 жыл бұрын
I honestly really like that first photo. I think it's a great portrait. Her eyes not engaging with you adds an air or mystery. Just my take, though. I agree that the overall blank expression trend really sucks the soul out of most of those photos.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Before I started doing fashion, I did a lot of street and documentary style photos, like I find myself inspired by photojournalists...so I try to bring some of that into my fashion shoots so when I shoot I try to make it like natural, like they are not aware of being photographed but now I am trying to follow some of his tips...to bring emotion
@greysuit174 жыл бұрын
Natural light Instagram photographers imitating other bad photographers.
@BryanVahey4 жыл бұрын
"I'M NOT BEING HARSH JUST BECAUSE IT'S A FUJI SHOOTER." laughed out loud. 😂😂
@Copainbig4 жыл бұрын
THANK YOU! I see so many photographs that are just pictures of pretty girls... Photography is about beautiful pictures, not about pictures of beautiful things. THIS IS THE DIFFERENCE.
@kennethpreston37984 жыл бұрын
Jared, all valid points on this critique. I have a feeling this guy is a natural light photographer. Perhaps he doesn’t feel it’s necessary to carry a reflector or any other form of lighting. To me, all the images were dead except for the guy getting into the car and you’re correct there, we need to see the feet.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
True, I used to carry reflectors but most of the time I didn’t have an assistant to help to hold the reflectors, so I only carry flash guns sometimes. But now I’ll try and do better
@davect014 жыл бұрын
I'm a natural light photographer myself, but a good bounce light or reflector can be a lifesaver
@ZadieBear4 жыл бұрын
I know a number of "natural light photographers" who despise reflectors and bounce lighting. They dodge & burn to create the same effect (but it doesn't work).
@Bill.Pearson4 жыл бұрын
I thought the guy getting in to the car was the worst lighting--the sharp-edge shadows indicate direct sunlight, yet there's no contrast.
@JakeBroe4 жыл бұрын
This was awesome. I'm going to go through your previous videos and binge them. I appreciate the criticism!
@jonyq044 жыл бұрын
That picture for the video was so hilarious!!!! Good one!!
@philipgowdy4 жыл бұрын
So Glad Fro you tell it as it is...
@waranparkpictures4 жыл бұрын
Your channel is the only source of my photographic lessons... Keep going!
@jeffr77522 жыл бұрын
I almost shot sesame chicken out of my nose from laughing at your poses. So from now on whenever I'm on location, I'm going to shoot some "Jared poses".... when no one is looking... of course.
@ksc60004 жыл бұрын
Sure these aren't pro photos, but clearly there's learning and technique being formed. It's possible he or she's just at the stage where they're getting composition and settings down comfortably - getting the model to do stuff is a next level. I know I'm not there yet myself. Also I don't see why the model always has to be looking at the camera? Hell while you're saying that you showed a capture from Hurley where the model isn't looking at the camera. I def agree on the emoting though, looking at the camera or away - makes for a much more interesting photo. I think another thing is that a lot of us see magazine photos of famous people and they all do the "dead look", and we learn that it's "sexy" - so it's natural to want to emulate what you see. I'm not saying it's good, just pointing out how it can happen.
@matthewjeffres12894 жыл бұрын
Jared you are being more than fair in you response to these photos.
@SteveHasACamera4 жыл бұрын
Great video Jared! I’m in total agreement. Instagram model shoots have made me lose my appetite a bit.
@M1R2S4 жыл бұрын
I'm new to this channel so I don't know if this is what you do here but I thoroughly enjoyed the critiques and I learnt a lot 👍
@dolwolfianphotography4 жыл бұрын
Taught my comp or/and me went crazy with this double intro 😜
@DruMUSIC064 жыл бұрын
I feel like i'm learning years worth of knowledge from you man. More power!
@willmannering4 жыл бұрын
I like your critiques but personally, your taste in overdoing contrast is distracting. The 'flat' looking image is technically pleasing to me more than way too much contrast.
@tracyleepitre60794 жыл бұрын
I agree with everything you are saying ...I like photos where I can really see and admire a person's eye color. With the face well lit combined with an interesting expression, a photo has a universal appeal regardless of the fact that the subject is unknown. Pet photos as well have much more impact when the subject is looking at the camera.
@TriWaZe4 жыл бұрын
She's coming across as dead. HAHAH I don't think this video is supposed to be this funny but I'm dying watching this.
@opfan4ever4 жыл бұрын
Jared brings a new meaning to: `dead inside` in his critic here :D
@FOBulous9764 жыл бұрын
I think the not looking at the camera is a personal taste thing. But almost all of these photos lack a catch light or eye light. There's more to it when bringing out "life" from the subject but this is a good place to start for these photographers.
@aaronbigfishpreston93004 жыл бұрын
I appreciate your critiques and knowledge
@powerlurker4 жыл бұрын
spot on so tired of people‘s face with nothing there
@mohammadkaaki29413 жыл бұрын
I love your content man and your honesty!!
@chrisrussellca4 жыл бұрын
I like your critique but i have to disagree with some of them. As a beauty/fashion photographer I feel that some of those images were meant to be fashion. Portrait photography i find is very different than fashion. Eye contact isn't required in fashion or having the feet in the shoot, as long as you don't crop at the joints.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Yes it’s fashion, well I tried to
@RociGarcia724 жыл бұрын
“Habló por mil años”, loved it this video ❤️
@TheWizdry3 жыл бұрын
ROFL!!! Typical Social Media poses. Great critiques!
@urmumsgstring82544 жыл бұрын
never hire a model hire a starving actor they have many more tricks in their bag.
@powerlurker4 жыл бұрын
tricks learned
@annerichard7884 жыл бұрын
A lot of portrait photographers have looked at too many fashion magazines featuring those models with deadpan expressions rather than studying the masters.
@markangelomedia4 жыл бұрын
As a newbie, you’re videos help a lot
@lenzielenski32764 жыл бұрын
There is nothing wrong with NOT looking directly at the camera. In fact, really close shots like that often look creepy. Looking off to the side gives you more white to the eye, which people interpret as more friendly, open and sexy. That's why makeup tutorials show Asian models using WHITE on their lids, to make their eyes appear larger. Further, don't blame the model categorically if YOU can't pose them. Its great to work with a professional (Anyone who's an "Instagram" model is automatically excluded). But even professionals start somewhere. I remember shooting one young black girl, so young we had to have her mother on set, for one of if not her first paying job. You take the time, give some feedback, ask for what you want, get them to laugh at you naturally and it works. If you want to see her, I don't recall the name, but she's the final girl in Michael Jackson's Black and White video. As I said, everyone starts somewhere.
@NicholasLeicht4 жыл бұрын
The intro had me going for a loop XD Thanks for another entertaining/informative video. I hope you are doing well.
@MichaelIzner4 жыл бұрын
Brutally entertaining and informative
@MrMcburnij4 жыл бұрын
Hey Jared! aperture at 1 on Flickr will likely be down to not using a lens that is incompatible with the camera, I have used a lot of M42 screw fit lenses adapted to my camera and they all show up at f/1.0 the camera can't see where its set so defaults to one! hope that helps :) submitted my photos to you for review even if you don't hope you have chance to look and enjoy them!! keep up the content better than ever :)
@crazymankelly4 жыл бұрын
Great video & advice Jared your critique was very fair and straight to the point. I guess its up to the photographer who is shooting portraits should encourage the models to express themselves when shooting portrait images
@patrickdavis69544 жыл бұрын
Watches video...goes back to look at my Instagram.....slowly slinks away to the corner 😂
@rzl12344 жыл бұрын
You rant like Rick from Rick and Morty, even the sttuter... and that's funny
@KimoonTsong4 жыл бұрын
I love that you're harsh! I need to submit my images.
@UrbaneHobbit4 жыл бұрын
Lots of people are modeling purely on youth and looks, which are time-limited. Developing facial expressions, body language, and other communication skills extends a modeling career beyond what youth and looks can carry. To put it another way: an audience wants to identify with what it sees. A lack of expression reduces the chance of resonance with an audience. This is a challenge for younger models, who have usually just lived less of life and have fewer experiences to draw from. Precocious models can emote beyond their years and experience. Talented photographers can pull expressions out of less-practiced models. It’s all people skills that, if successfully executed as a team by photographer and subject, then radiates in the finished product and engages an audience of more people.
@stevenqirkle4 жыл бұрын
This is your best thumbnail ever.
@subbassline12474 жыл бұрын
Best thumbnail EVER !!!
@bambamhakkai4 жыл бұрын
Let other people put you on their box. Shoot what makes you happy -Sean tucker
@lukemears46264 жыл бұрын
"She's coming across as dead" has got to be my favourite criticism of a photo ;)
@TriWaZe4 жыл бұрын
F1?!?! HAHA I died. Shits hilarious.
@gabithemagyar4 жыл бұрын
Mostly good points but I disagree about the photo at 11 minute mark. In this case more facial brightness would destroy the impact of the picture. In my mind, the darkness is what gives it the emotion and that special mysterious feel. Who is she ? Why is she revealing her face to you with its natural seductive appearance, unencumbered by model makeup ? Where is it taken ? etc. Bright is not always better. Neither is mechanically focusing on and brightening the eyes in all cases. The exception is where the eyes have a special, meaningful, appearance as in the National Geographic "Afghan girl" picture. I guess though, different strokes for different folks ...
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
That’s exactly what I was trying to portray, the Afghan girl...my inspiration
@volman50334 жыл бұрын
Froknows is the only guy ive ever seen who creats his own click bait headlines
@chrisb27514 жыл бұрын
So many people don’t bring a simple reflector to a shoot to get that catch light in the eyes
@brian_db4 жыл бұрын
Definitely fair, plus this could've been titled, "Look at ME!" need the eyes
@lizaking254 жыл бұрын
Okay, but low-key, your insta model parody shots were fire... borderline smut.
@Robelkinsphotography4 жыл бұрын
For once I agree with you. The worst thing ever is seeing a photo of a hot chick in a fb photography group and it’s just her. The background is blurred to shit and it’s just her standing there. And that photo gets 500+ reactions. And the comment section is “wow she’s perfect” “beautiful”. Like come on.
@tribe74304 жыл бұрын
Thanks to everyone that submits their photos for a critique. It gives those of us that do not an opportunity to learn.
@Erik619954 жыл бұрын
Jared, I always look forward to your videos. They are great
@dilu394 жыл бұрын
For a fuji camera, the smallest aperture number the camera recognizes is F1. if you have a vintage lense without any communication with the camera, the F-number will be 1 too.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
Yeah I was using the 50mm f1.4
@Halcyonedgar14 жыл бұрын
Oh, I don't know. I'm thinking of the pics of you, especially that photo shoot with Manny Ortiz - I licked all the dust off my computer screen! Stay well.
@somedude49684 жыл бұрын
I nitpick as well. But having said that: *KUDOS* to the people who sent in images to be 'judged' by Jared and the savages in the comment section. You have more balls than I do.
@Juannic4 жыл бұрын
Hey Jared I have a video idea for you. How about having viewers submit photos to you and you make a critique/rate video?? Kinda like this one but a weekly video.
@pedroguzman55904 жыл бұрын
After watching this videos for a while I listen to Jared in my head saying: "Give me the eyes!!!" when I'm shooting a portrait! :D
@manolomiguelvalenzuela48774 жыл бұрын
that girl in the tub is a very distracting photo.... i have to download/screenshot the image to critique it myself....
@Aygross4 жыл бұрын
Double intro ayyyyy
@adrianlewis79773 жыл бұрын
Time for a rank amateur to take the accomplished professional to task! lol. Below is my take on some of the images you critiqued. I do think that this is very subjective as we all see things differently and take something different away from each image we see. I'd be interested to know your thoughts on this. First image the model's face is questioning. Somebody off camera said something unexpected and probably not appreciated. Light in the eyes, yes. More life there would be good but overall it still works for me. Girl in the tub. Why is she in the tub? That makes no sense to me and the blue bottles to the side are distracting. More light in her eyes would be good but the pose and expression I like. Its a subtle come get me look. Chest may be a little overstated. Maybe wider aperture. Focus on eyes and face and let the sharpness fall off more away from her face. You're still aware of whats there but it doesn't distract so much from the model's face. Guy with his back to the fence. Lighting is a bit flat and pose too direct. Maybe turn his head away slightly and look back with his eyes. Now you have a challenging thing going on. "You talking to me?" kind of thing if that makes sense. Yours truly. A Fuji shooter! PMSL
@JokingJay4 жыл бұрын
Not defending the trend towards the "dead inside" motif that's taken hold the last couple of years, but I think it does constitute its own aesthetic at this point. You can dislike an aesthetic (for instance, I think Jackson Pollock and that brand of Modernism is pretty useless both aesthetically and as a discourse), but that doesn't necessarily mean someone isn't executing the photo well. I agree with some of the criticism levied, but a decent portion of it has to do with the aesthetic rather than the specific photo. I don't really care for it either, but it clearly does appeal and/or communicate something to some people (aloofness? too-cool-for-school-ness?) or else it wouldn't be popular.
@archer41eh4 жыл бұрын
Solid critique!
@simplymad824 жыл бұрын
Hell yeah! You could be a German, cause you are definitely not "around the bush". This is so refreshing! And it is helpful. :-)
@PhilThach4 жыл бұрын
Fujifilm cameras will put 50mm F/1 in the EXIF if using an adapted lens when you have not told the camera what you are actually shooting with. It's a lot like not adjusting your Non-CPU lens data on a Nikon but the Fuji just puts 50mm f/1 in there.
@rictor1334 жыл бұрын
Great vid, entertaining, keep these informative and funny vids coming good job!!!
@leah53184 жыл бұрын
I haven't take any portraits because it seems so hard to but this was very usual information. Also the pretty models of IG part had be laughing so hard! 😂 Thanks for sharing! 😊
@etoobrute4 жыл бұрын
7:10 "She's coming across as dead". I dont know why that had me laughing.
@Mushroom7992 жыл бұрын
Each time you switch images and just sigh...😂
@marklarson39344 жыл бұрын
I ❤ these photo critiques 👍
@herbalgiles94684 жыл бұрын
Bruh the intro repeats jered
@_LightLeak_4 жыл бұрын
It's a glitch in the Matrix
@kadaberkz4 жыл бұрын
Happened to Peter McKinnon too. I wonder if it's an inside joke
@herbalgiles94684 жыл бұрын
kadaberkz2014 can u link it?
@GustavoHuck4 жыл бұрын
OMG YOU ROCK!
@davect014 жыл бұрын
One of the reasons I don't do paid model shoots is that I suck at posing others
@Bill.Pearson4 жыл бұрын
Besides the problems Jared noted, two things: 1. The girl in the tub...Why didn't the photographer move the bottle of mouthwash in the background??? The plumbing bits are okay since it's a bathtub; they give a sense of the space. But that stray bottle is just lazy. 2. The guy standing by the car...There are strong, sharply defined shadows from: his jaw onto his neck, his jacket onto the front of his pants, and his left leg going down his right leg. So the photo is clearly taken in direct sun, but there is no contrast in the photo; it's lifeless. He lowered the contrast on the subject, but the shadows give it away (and whatever is going on above his hair). Bad processing. I like your critiquersons.
@bevans77724 жыл бұрын
T&A sells and it's a cheap way to get Instagram likes. Oh, can we get some prints from your posing video? My wall of art needs some Fro-Nips.
@oldmanhare4 жыл бұрын
Many of the models are looking off in the frame and that side of the frame is the short side of the frame. Makes them look like they are leaving the photo. I think he is using the center AF point only and not recomposing. My niece's wedding photographer did that and cut everyone's feet and ankles off. Centered on one persons eyes and took the shot.. Ruined 90% of the shots.
@RodolphosTechchannel4 жыл бұрын
I mostly use eye af for fuji lenses and non fuji lenses only use manual focus
@karstenrosendal74094 жыл бұрын
The intro from the last video played before the intro of this video.
@TonyWang Жыл бұрын
Love the poses 💗
@tomowens74994 жыл бұрын
Your making fun of idiotic poses is hilarious... my niece often posts pictures of herself with these silly expressions and i am SO tempted to respond with a pic of myself doing the same thing. You are SO right about non model wannabe poses. They’re awful, and at the same time self absorbed! Yuck...